# Fuel Price



## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

I dont know what your take is on the fuel price, but I think its out of hand. 
Now my method of rebelling is this.

Buy only from the indipendent garage, Ignoring BP & Esso Garages ETC.

Now if every member of this forum did that what a hole would that make in the refineries pocket.

Come on, whats your oppinion?

Don


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## snowgoose (Jan 17, 2008)

*fuel prices*

coincedently had an E/M from a friend this morning saying the same,it was done in a chain letter style suggesting each recipient send it on to as many as possible. This is one of the VERY rare chains I would consider passing on as I think it is a brilliant idea,I realise a lot of our country members may have a bit of trouble finding independants but the rest of us should not find it to difficult.So why not give it a try.
snowgoose


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## Geoff.W (Jan 17, 2008)

Don said:


> I dont know what your take is on the fuel price, but I think its out of hand.
> Now my method of rebelling is this.
> 
> Buy only from the indipendent garage, Ignoring BP & Esso Garages ETC.
> ...



Nice idea but it won't work. Where do the independents get thier fuel from?

 Answer BP Esso etc.

Unfortunatly, as I have been lead to believe anyway, there are only something like 3 refineries in the country that produce fuel, therefore depending on where you live it all comes from the same place anyway, each refinery distributing fuel to all garages in that area.

I will add that I don't have independent proof that the above is correct, but it is the situation that I believe to exist.


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

Hi Geoff,
With due respect, that is true to a degree. Except that the independants get it at a lot less cost to allow for proffit. So if the Asda's and the like were making all the profit an Esso etc was only making on the refinaries with there Forecoarts standing empty, do you not think they would rethink the proffit margins.
Thats my thought anyway.

Don


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## sundown (Jan 17, 2008)

there's an organisation called pipeline, 500,000 members
I dont know if you are aware of it 
the main aim is to get the price of fuel down 
its free to join and they are looking for more members
its maybe worth a look
http://www.pipelinecard.org/

sundown


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

The other reason that I posted this, Go back to the "Pub Fliers" Thread , 849 read that thread, If a similar number read this and maybe 2/300 think "why not" then its working.
But then again every one may just think B++++++s.

Never mind. Signed up on pipeline, any thing is worth a try.

Don


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## sundown (Jan 17, 2008)

personaly, north of the border, I find tesco 
is normaly 4 or 5p per litre cheaper than most
then with card points another 1p off
and sometimes they give double points
thats why I always fill to the gunnels before I head even farther north
  sundown


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## teachertrish (Jan 17, 2008)

*fuel*

well fellow drivers,I agree with sundown but we are running our new transit mh on a fuel mix about 50 pence per litre,the mix is tried and tested and have been using it for the last two years..


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## cipro (Jan 17, 2008)

Lorry drivers do a slow drive on motorways to cause havoc could you imagine 20 white M H down the m6  we would certainly make the news

Especially with the CROMFORD 7 leading


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## Boppintone (Jan 17, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> well fellow drivers,I agree with sundown but we are running our new transit mh on a fuel mix about 50 pence per litre,the mix is tried and tested and have been using it for the last two years..



What is the mix and where do you get it from, more info please.
Thanks Tone


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

What agood idea Cipro. When are you all available. Tally Ho.

Actually I use 50 / 50 Veg Oil, which lowers the average Ltr price to about 90p a litre. The only thing is Veg Oil producers have cottened on and that is also going through the roof.

I just love a good campaign.

Don


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## Deleted member 775 (Jan 17, 2008)

cipro said:


> Lorry drivers do a slow drive on motorways to cause havoc could you imagine 20 white M H down the m6  we would certainly make the news
> 
> Especially with the CROMFORD 7 leading


  my beddy is always on a slow drive on the m/ways


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## teachertrish (Jan 17, 2008)

te mix we use is 50/50 thats new cooking oil from makro at 70p a litre and kerosene(heating oil) at 40 pence a litre-working out at 55p total.


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

Nice one teachertrish. Thats even cheaper than my mix, will have to get the Kerosine.
Does she not smoke with the Kerosine?

Any way will find out for myself, any thing for cheaper motorhoming.

I need to make it cheaper as I called of at my daughters tonight, left the Sat Nav in the window. Guesse what?  Wasn't there when I came out, nor was the side window. But the alarm didn't go off, strange.

Don


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## avandriver (Jan 17, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> te mix we use is 50/50 thats new cooking oil from makro at 70p a litre and kerosene(heating oil) at 40 pence a litre-working out at 55p total.




Just a little warning 

If you were to be stopped by the VOSA people and they dipped you fuel tank you will have no motorhome .

Using vegetable oil is legal 

Using Kerosene is not .

If you are caught it is treated as tax evasion and you will end up with a criminal record and will possibly face imprisonment .

Allmost certainly they will impound your pride and joy untill the courts have handed out your sentence 


Having said all that I wish mine was diesel  because I would do the same 


Steve


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

Here we go again. The government allows 2500 litres a year before paying tax. It is Classed as Bio Diesel.  I have spoken to revenue and no problem as long as I keep reciepts to show how much I use. Sorry Steve, you need to bring yourself up to speed with legislation.

Don


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## walkers (Jan 17, 2008)

Don said:


> Here we go again. The government allows 2500 litres a year before paying tax. It is Classed as Bio Diesel. I have spoken to revenue and no problem as long as I keep reciepts to show how much I use. Sorry Steve, you need to bring yourself up to speed with legislation.
> 
> Don


i thought it was only biodiesel if it didn't have mineral oil based additives, would be interested in how it works if i am wrong as any saving is a saving.


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## walkers (Jan 17, 2008)

Don said:


> Nice one teachertrish. Thats even cheaper than my mix, will have to get the Kerosine.
> Does she not smoke with the Kerosine?
> 
> Any way will find out for myself, any thing for cheaper motorhoming.
> ...


sorry to hear about your satnav, allways take mine out but you can bet if i forgot..............................


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

Bio-diesel is only used veg oil filtered upteen times until pure. My local producer sells at 95p per litre so I use unused Veg oil mixed equelly with Diesel. Runs a treat, smells sweet.

Yep the first time i forgot, and a little toe rag took advantage.


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## Deleted member 775 (Jan 17, 2008)

Don said:


> Bio-diesel is only used veg oil filtered upteen times until pure. My local producer sells at 95p per litre so I use unused Veg oil mixed equelly with Diesel. Runs a treat, smells sweet.
> 
> Yep the first time i forgot, and a little toe rag took advantage.



i understand that veg oil and diesel is legal to use and if mine was diesel i would use it too but to me your local producer sounds as bad as the petrol producers and the government a rip off merchant i wonder if he declares his profit to the tax man seems to me like he makes nearly 100% profit


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## avandriver (Jan 17, 2008)

Veg oil and diesel mixed is ok and legal 
The illegal fuel in question is the kerosene 


Steve


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## Don (Jan 17, 2008)

My Appologies Steve, I missread your post. Its an age thing Sorry Mate

Don


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## avandriver (Jan 17, 2008)

No worries Don 


Steve


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## sundown (Jan 17, 2008)

hi, I have a mechanic who is also a friend, who services my van and car.
he is A1 as mechanics go. 
I asked him about running the van on a mix and he was horrified. 
he advised me strongly against it. he says, with proper servicing 
he'll give me 300k from my engine, but if I start using mixtures he could guarentee nothing. 
he told me a long story about detereoration
over a period of time.
does using a fuel mix harm the engine eventualy?

sundown


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## lenny (Jan 17, 2008)

I can see where he's coming from Nick, maybe if , like myself, you have an old van and you're not worried about the resale value , you could take this risk and run it till it drops but if I was to push the boat out and go for a half decent van, I would be a little more cautious about taking the risk.

Hope this makes sense.


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## Geoff.W (Jan 18, 2008)

As this thread has moved onto the topic of "alternative" fuels, I hope no one minds if I post this regarding some of the terminology used. Unfortunatly I often find that use of the wrong terms can lead to confusion and create difficulties when trying to understand someones point. Can I also add that this is a genuine attempt to make this subject easier to understand and is certainly not a dig at anyone who may have used the terms differently.

Here are what I believe to be the generally accepted usages.

*Biofuel*:- A generic term that includes all non mineral derived fuels.

*Biodiesel*:- A specific type of Biofuel refered to as a F.A.M.E. Fatty Acid  Methyl Ester. see here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatty_acid_methyl_ester

Although usualy derived from vegtable oil can actualy also be made from animal fats and even algie, by using a process known as transesterification. Pump diesel now contains between 2 & 5% biodiesel as the need to reduce sulpher content, the lubricant in mineral diesel, means that an alternative lubricant was required, a function Biodiesel performs very well. 

This I believe is the most missused term, often used when refering to Biofuels or Vegtable oils.

*Vegtable oil*:- This can be split into 2 catagories S.V.O. Straight Vegtable oil, the stuff you buy from Tesco Asda etc. and W.V.O. Waste Vegtable Oil, ex chip shop oil filtered and cleaned.

The main difference between V.O. and Biodiesel is that a component part of V.O. is Glycerin. It is this that causes the oil to become "sticky" when cold and generally causes the problems, W.V.O. is worse in this respect.

It is this that the transesterification process removes in order to make Biodiesel. This is why I believe that using the correct terminology is important as many of the so called problems caused by Biodiesel are actualy caused by using Vegtable Oil.

Having said that however many diesel engines will run quite happily on V.O. providing they are at opporating temperature and the oil is heated to around 80'c.

 For anyone who has got this far without being bored silly here are a couple of sites you may find of interest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biodiesel

http://www.dieselveg.com/

http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel_...rofRapeOil.pdf


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## sundown (Jan 18, 2008)

hi geoff,
    before I read your post I was a little confused about alternative fuels
now i am totally confused 
no offence but im afraid, your terminology is away above my head
like the proffesor says to his students "talk in laymens terms"
words like "transesterification" really blow my mental fuses
I would love to understand your explanations
but I'm even more confused after ive read them
dont get me wrong
 the fault is not with you 
but more with my inability to understand
 "short sentances geoff"


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## sagart (Jan 18, 2008)

Tayside? North of the Border?
Try the Highlands and Islands for high pricing and up here its only the multi-nationals who provide decent coverage and my "independent" still gets his tanks filled by Bp.


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## tresrikay (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> te mix we use is 50/50 thats new cooking oil from makro at 70p a litre and kerosene(heating oil) at 40 pence a litre-working out at 55p total.



I think we have to careful about this advice as the modern common rail engines can be damaged by fuel mixes and you would certainly invalidate any warranties should any damage be done, these new engines cost a fortune to repair. Also............ and I think I may Be expelled from the site for this. Apart from the arab cartels pushing up the price of fuel and the enormous profits made by the oil Barron's B.P. Shell, Esso etc. Most people blame the Tax element. Now.....................the reasons for this are to dissuade unnecessary journeys and to combat climate change. This is a fact like it or lump it, there is not a snowballs chance in hell of that changing. All governments are committed even Dubya.Plus things will only get worse i.e more expensive as the years move forward, remember we are only minding this planet for our children and grandchildren and it is up to us to hand it on with a reasonable amount of livability left. Now I believe our hobby/passion is one of the greenest there is involving any kind of vehicle. I personally will not fly again unless it is absolutely a life or death situation. My holidays will be taken in the van or in a cottage or similar. I know we are all individuals and I would not preach to anyone BUT there are so many little things we can do whilst off in our vans that can help bring our footprint down. 55/60 on the motorway increases your mileage by up to 20% driving smoothly in towns keeping revs light and avoiding erratic stop start driving all helps, using public transport once at your chosen spot, taking your bikes etc all help and if you do a bit more of that whilst at home your fuel bills begin to plummet. I am always looking for the cheapest place to fill up as well as anyone but i wont drive miles to do it, if I am passing and I see cheaper derv then I top up I am also registered with  www.petrolprices.com who update by e-mail. Hope I haven't upset anyone but I stand by my beliefs always.........hope I am still here tomorrow.   Regards, Rick.


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## Don (Jan 18, 2008)

sagart said:


> Tayside? North of the Border?
> Try the Highlands and Islands for high pricing and up here its only the multi-nationals who provide decent coverage and my "independent" still gets his tanks filled by Bp.



Sorry Bud, But you are missing the point.
BP/ESSO sell bulk to the Indipendant garage at a much reduced price, much less than BP/ESSO sell on there forecoart. (Keeping up with me ?).

If Said Independant garage is selling his stock at a profit and *BP/ESSO forecoarts *are empty, then surely BP/ESSO are losing the EXTRA profit that they would be making from US the punter. Surely the cost to the independant is less than the cost to "Joe Bloggs"..

Am I missing something out or what.
Don


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## Yogihughes (Jan 18, 2008)

Don, I may be wrong here but what I think Sagart is getting at is the fact that there are very few Independents in the Highlands and he has no choice but to go to BP or Esso. A drive to an Independent would probably cost him a LOT more in the "long run".
I had my FIRST tour around Skye last October and I found out that there wasn't a lot of choice.


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## sundown (Jan 18, 2008)

hi, I think that sagart would agree, that the further north you go, 
the higher the price, be it shell, esso, or independant
the first time I paid over £1 per litre was around Kinlochewe
and that was from an independant
 tesco on the other hand (way down south sagart  )  in tayside
was around 95p at the time.


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## Geoff.W (Jan 18, 2008)

I think there may be some confusion here about independants.

Just because a filling station has a sign outside with "ESSO BP SHELL etc." doesn't mean they are owned by that company, they are independents just the same as all the others, but have contract with the supplier which included supply of pumps, signs etc. Boycotting these will not have any greater effect on Esso & BP than boycotting anywhere else.

One reason this idea will not work is that there are so few "owned" stations that even if these closed it would have minimal overall effect on the oil companies in question.


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

*fuel mix*

we have used our mix for four years now,first it was in a td escort then we had two 300tdi discos and for the last 18months our 56 plate transit and 02plate TD5 disco all have run on the mix,I would say the discos ran better on the mix,I would say that we only run the fuel when we go on long journeys coz when its used locally its embarrasing as the smell is stinking.apparently used doesnt smell as bad but thats hassel cleaning it although I can get it for free.our M/H is new and its on the fuel too.
ps. I havent seen a customs and exise van for years.


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## Geoff.W (Jan 18, 2008)

sundown said:


> hi geoff,
> before I read your post I was a little confused about alternative fuels
> now i am totally confused
> no offence but im afraid, your terminology is away above my head
> ...



Hi Nick. 

Sorry you feel confused but I think the problem is that you are looking for complication and confusion where non exists and thereby miss the simplicity of it all.

It's the terms "Bio" & Vegetable that I believe cause the confusion, so lets remove them. 

Biofuel = Fuel. Usual a liquid that's used to power an engine 
          + Bio. Made from plants

Therefore Biofuel = Liquid used to power an engine made from plants.

Likewise Biodiesel = Diesel. A specific type of fuel used to power diesel engines. When described like this everyone seems to understand what it is, and that it is different to Petrol, Av gas or other fuels.

Add Bio = specific type of fuel to power diesel engines made from plants.

For Vegetable oil (V.O.) delete vegetable and add Crude.

Crude oil. The raw product that Diesel and other fuels can be made from.

Therefore Vegtable oil. The raw product Biodiesel can be made from.

Diesel is made from Crude oil in a Refinery by a process called Defraction.

Biodiesel is made from vegetable oil in a garden shed, if required, by a process called Transesterification.

I imagine that when talking about (mineral) Diesel you have no problem understanding what I mean, even though you don't understand the technical process, as you can see moving from mineral to Bio changes nothing exept some of the terms used.

It is not nessessery to understand the process just accept that the name given to it is "Transesterification", in the same way we accept that to change a soggy lump of dough into a loaf of bread is called "Baking".

The real point of the post was to point out that whilst people do not have a problem understanding what Diesel is and would not refer to Petrol, Kerosene or even Crude oil as diesel.

 When Bio is put in front of it people somehow jump to the conclusion that it can refer to other things as well e.g. Vegetable oils, Diesel/veg. oil mixes or enything else which is not straight mineral Diesel. It is this misuse of the term "Biodiesel" that can lead to a great deal of confusion.

The rest of the post is additional information to help create a better understanding of this subject.

I hope this clarifies the situation, but if there are any particular bits You or anyone else requires further explanation of I will do my best.


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

s again-try this one..www.jusave.com.
If anybody has purchased let me know,thanks


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## Don (Jan 18, 2008)

Healthy Debate!!!!!
I agree with a lot of what you say TRESRIKAY, Untill  you get to global warning, No I wont even start on my views on that. Yes I Too use  www.petrolprices.com  but around here it points to either ASDA or Tesco's so thats where I go. Yes I also Drive at the prescribed speeds, not that the old boxer would go much faster any way. 
I do understand the problems north of the Border, My sister and Hubs lives down South In the country, the local bus service runs once a week. and they haveone garage, but he will drive to the town to do there weekly shop at the supermarket and always tops up with the cheaper fuel.

I only want people to think of ways of making our oppinions known. and encourage debate. with out falling out

I think i have succeeded in that.


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## Yogihughes (Jan 18, 2008)

Just put £50 of diesel in MH from Asda in Glasgow at 106.9p per litre.
Local garage next to me is 109.9p per litre today.


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

New Rover said:


> Just put £50 of diesel in MH from Asda in Glasgow at 106.9p per litre.
> Local garage next to me is 109.9p per litre today.



Put in 350 Ltr in my truck today


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## Don (Jan 18, 2008)

Was that a mortgage Mate. 

Don


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

Don said:


> Was that a mortgage Mate.
> 
> Don



Company fuel card


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

Fuel bill for my truck was £3000 last month


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## lenny (Jan 18, 2008)

The mobile crane that I drive runs on red diesel, 50 pence a litre,

and it's on the road more than on site.


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## Boppintone (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> te mix we use is 50/50 thats new cooking oil from makro at 70p a litre and kerosene(heating oil) at 40 pence a litre-working out at 55p total.



Correct me if I am wrong but I have always been under the impression that Kerosene is the American name for Parrafin, and that kerosene is also the fuel that is used in Jet Engines, I have also always been led to believe that Heating oil is Diesel without the additives used in Derv, and as such could be used neat if you dared to.
Tone


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## sundown (Jan 18, 2008)

to get back to the origional reason for this thread 
"how can we beat fuel price increases"
the truthful answer is "we cant"
so the answer may be 
"be an ostrich" 
bury your head in the sand
and when buying fuel, always buy 40 quids worth
then whether fuel is cheap or expensive
it still costs 40 quid
dont think about how far you can travel on it
if it worries you, then dont travel so far.

fuel prices can only continue to rise, until tesco and asda
buy some oilfields, a fleet of tankers, and an oil refinery
and believe me that day will come

then the oil giants will have something to worry about!


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## Don (Jan 18, 2008)

lenny said:


> The mobile crane that I drive runs on red diesel, 50 pence a litre,
> 
> and it's on the road more than on site.



Use to have a canal boat ran on red diesel but deregation expires, not sure if it is this year! There will be a few boat owners on the rampage when they have been used to paying 50/60p suddenly paying 1.07 +.

Don

PS never been one to bury my head in the sand.


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## Gess (Jan 19, 2008)

*Kerosene*



Boppintone said:


> Correct me if I am wrong but I have always been under the impression that Kerosene is the American name for Parrafin, and that kerosene is also the fuel that is used in Jet Engines, I have also always been led to believe that Heating oil is Diesel without the additives used in Derv, and as such could be used neat if you dared to.
> Tone



Jet engines use Avtur (i.e. turbines) as opposed to petrol powered aeroplanes which use Avgas (gasoline). You can certainly use Avtur in your oil central heating boiler, and this and heating oil in any other paraffin type appliance although it isn't quite as clean burning as paraffin. My heating oil delivery driver tells me he has used heating oil in his Range Rover? for years although he has used a small amount of additive ( can't remember what?)

Of interest, Avgas is like the old leaded fuel but of a much higher octane, used by the aviation industry and classis motorcycle road racers ( providing you can get an airfield to sell you some.

I'm all for saving a few bob,this bio mix really as reliable and easy as this and will my  10,000mile 1.9tdi suffer no long term effects!!!


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## sundown (Jan 19, 2008)

HI, GESS 
            quick answer to your question is "I dont no"
but welcome to the site 
hope you enjoy the wealth of information 
you can gather here


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## Gess (Jan 19, 2008)

*bedtime stories*



sundown said:


> HI, GESS
> quick answer to your question is "I dont no"
> but welcome to the site
> hope you enjoy the wealth of information
> you can gather here



What's your reason for being up this late? I've got to pick friends up from Gatwick at about 0130!


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## sundown (Jan 19, 2008)

my reason for being up this late   
  "i'm retired, time is irrelivent"
freedom is not working


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## sagart (Jan 19, 2008)

tresrikay said:


> if I am passing and I see cheaper derv then I top up I am also registered with  www.petrolprices.com who update by e-mail. Hope I haven't upset anyone but I stand by my beliefs always.........hope I am still here tomorrow.   Regards, Rick.



Try this then, a quote from this site, "Your search for Tarbert found 2 petrol stations within 10 miles.
Including your 2 closest stations: Harris Garage Co Ltd (National), and Ardhasaig Filling Station (Gleaner).
 Unleaded Diesel LRP Super LPG see the cheapest stations 
The Highest price in this area: 112.8p 118.6p n/a n/a n/a 
The Average price in this area: 112.8p 118.6p n/a n/a n/a 
The Lowest price in this area: 112.8p 118.6p n/a n/a n/a "

This is what we are charged in an area where a car is essential and where people starting work may have to drive a round trip of 60 miles a day on wages much lower than down south. 
Some of us live here to maintain vital services, I had an urgent call last week which involved a round trip of 124 miles - do I say to them, "well you chose to work here, but it's too expensive to come to you"? Fine for the cycle and minimum use of car lobby, but what do they expect when they come here on holiday? 
Obviously hotels, guesthouses, shops, garages,ferries and all the things they need and people living here to provide those services.


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## Jayen4 (Jan 19, 2008)

Excuse me for butting in here,but this thread has gone from protesting at the price of fuel,to bio diesel mixes.....  

  On the original subject...it's not the fuel producers / suppliers that have caused the price to go through the roof,but the damned government,with all their *taxes*  cough..splutter !!  Aaaarghhh!!

  If you wanna protest,it should be against the government !!

 Oh and hello everyone !  ( I'm new here)


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## Deleted member 775 (Jan 19, 2008)

Jayen4 said:


> Excuse me for butting in here,but this thread has gone from protesting at the price of fuel,to bio diesel mixes.....
> 
> On the original subject...it's not the fuel producers / suppliers that have caused the price to go through the roof,but the damned government,with all their *taxes*  cough..splutter !!  Aaaarghhh!!
> 
> ...


  HELLO ENJOY THIS SITE ITS GOOD  seems like you will fit in here a treat as you like a good ole debate


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## Don (Jan 19, 2008)

Jayen4 said:


> Excuse me for butting in here,but this thread has gone from protesting at the price of fuel,to bio diesel mixes.....
> 
> On the original subject...it's not the fuel producers / suppliers that have caused the price to go through the roof,but the damned government,with all their *taxes*  cough..splutter !!  Aaaarghhh!!
> 
> ...



Hi and welcome. Yes you are spot on, But if we preasure the the big producers, (in any manner that you can think of) then the producers will put preasure on Government ?

At least thats the way an old Fxxt like me sees it.

any way, WELCOME.

Don


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## Guest (Jan 19, 2008)

Don said:


> Hi and welcome. Yes you are spot on, But if we preasure the the big producers, (in any manner that you can think of) then the producers will put preasure on Government ?
> 
> At least thats the way an old Fxxt like me sees it.
> 
> ...



If all the haulage companies can't be bothered to stick together and bring the roads to a halt and no goods in the shops, what chance have we got????
None,  so I for one won't be bothering as not worth the hassle and my time
So now I supose everyone will say I am wrong, but that is my opinion


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## Yogihughes (Jan 19, 2008)

I agree with you Graham, the ordinary punter has no chance of changing things.
I previously posted about buying £50 worth of diesel and then someone posted about paying £3000 for fuel that month. So I reckon those lads (and lassies) who pay that amount have a lot more clout than I have.

Look at the last time there was a "backlash" against fuel prices, it was the "truckers" who made a difference.


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## Guest (Jan 19, 2008)

New Rover said:


> I agree with you Graham, the ordinary punter has no chance of changing things.
> I previously posted about buying £50 worth of diesel and then someone posted about paying £3000 for fuel that month. So I reckon those lads (and lassies) who pay that amount have a lot more clout than I have.
> 
> Look at the last time there was a "backlash" against fuel prices, it was the "truckers" who made a difference.



It was me that posted that I used £3000 of fuel last month and the company couldn't give a damn


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## Don (Jan 19, 2008)

New Rover said:


> I agree with you Graham, the ordinary punter has no chance of changing things.
> I previously posted about buying £50 worth of diesel and then someone posted about paying £3000 for fuel that month. So I reckon those lads (and lassies) who pay that amount have a lot more clout than I have.
> 
> Look at the last time there was a "backlash" against fuel prices, it was the "truckers" who made a difference.



So as you see New Rover we agree with your last sentence including *****.
As someone said to me, Set an amount you can afford and stick to it, and as the price goes up, so you do less milage.
i ask you where is the sense in that.
As I have said on many occasions, thier will always be those who sit back and let the few do the dirty work, then sit back and reap the benefits.

Such as life

Don


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## Yogihughes (Jan 19, 2008)

And that is EXACTLY what I am trying to say.

Nobody takes a blind bit of notice what the average driver says or does.

I don't want to sit back and let others do the dirty work for me so that I can reap any benefits.

I will gladly join ANY protest if I am asked.


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2008)

*Just imagine*

Just imagine the fuel bill for M & S or Tesco or similar.
Lets be consevative and say 10 distribution depots with say 40 trucks in each, usually double shifted (day & night)
That will be 10 x40 x2 x£3000 =£240,000.00 fuel bill per month. Now that is some clout so why don,t they do something about it?
And that is just for one company


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## Don (Jan 20, 2008)

Hi *****
I suppose the answer to that one is US the punter, the mug, the bottom of the food chain. They just pass on the increase to the customer.

Anyone want to start a new thread on how we put the squeeze on the big retailers?

But, yes ***** you are right they are the boys to put the squeeze on the Government instead of wineing about the fall in proffit cause the public arent spending.

Don


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## cipro (Jan 20, 2008)

Geoff.W said:


> As this thread has moved onto the topic of "alternative" fuels, I hope no one minds if I post this regarding some of the terminology used. Unfortunatly I often find that use of the wrong terms can lead to confusion and create difficulties when trying to understand someones point. Can I also add that this is a genuine attempt to make this subject easier to understand and is certainly not a dig at anyone who may have used the terms differently.
> 
> Here are what I believe to be the generally accepted usages.
> 
> ...



Hi Geoff well that sorted that out nice post and is clear annough.

Iwas told the older diesel engines struggle with alternative fuel type but modern deisel engines are ok for *boi-veg-duel *and maney more but who would take a chance unless it is at the pump


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## t&s (Jan 20, 2008)

sundown said:


> there's an organisation called pipeline, 500,000 members
> I dont know if you are aware of it
> the main aim is to get the price of fuel down
> its free to join and they are looking for more members
> ...


i have been in it since it started they still seem no further  ahead than the first day i think its been going nearly 2 years
i think the dutch idea of a privatly run fuel card works well over there but untill we ALL get more militant thats ALL comercial users including ourselves we will not get anywhere close to fighting the price rises  
the french seem to do it right i remember being stuck in allencon during the time the french were going to hipe the price of fuel we were stuck for one whole day  all the truck drivers and farmers blocked all the roundabouts in france at the same time by the end of the day the government gave in 
it did delay us for the ferry but we still gained the price of fuel stayed down


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2008)

terry&sue said:


> i have been in it since it started they still seem no further  ahead than the first day i think its been going nearly 2 years
> i think the dutch idea of a privatly fuel card works well over there but untill we ALL get more militant thats ALL comercial users including ourselves we will not get anywhere close to fighting the price rises
> the french seem to do it right i remember being stuck in allencon during the time the french werr going to hipe the price of fuel we were stuck for one whole day  all the truck drivers and farmers blocked all the roundabouts in france at the same time by the end of the day the government gave in
> it did delay us for the ferry but we still gained the price of fuel stayed down



You have to admire the French as they will stick together!
Did you know that the Gendarme are in the same union and that is why they never break up the blockades, but the CRS are a different kettle of fish as they will wade in heavy handed


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## Don (Jan 21, 2008)

A letter to Chancellor Alistair Darling, signed by 400 businessmen and women, warned that British hauliers are finding it increasingly difficult to compete with their European rivals because of the level of fuel taxes in this country.

So thats another 2p per litre due in April.

Its a revolution that we need.

Don


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## robert b (Jan 21, 2008)

*fuel prices*



sundown said:


> there's an organisation called pipeline, 500,000 members
> I dont know if you are aware of it
> the main aim is to get the price of fuel down
> its free to join and they are looking for more members
> ...


been a  member of pipelinecard since it started its a good idea but it dosnt seem to be getting any where fast. at the end of the day this goverment does what it wants and allows other companies do the same with prices ie gas . electricity. theyve all gone up but we still pay as they no we need these things and we will still buy it .


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## tresrikay (Jan 22, 2008)

sagart said:


> Try this then, a quote from this site, "Your search for Tarbert found 2 petrol stations within 10 miles.
> Including your 2 closest stations: Harris Garage Co Ltd (National), and Ardhasaig Filling Station (Gleaner).
> Unleaded Diesel LRP Super LPG see the cheapest stations
> The Highest price in this area: 112.8p 118.6p n/a n/a n/a
> ...



Is'nt it a fact of life wherever there is a custom and no competition the price will rise as high as can be bourne. Thats free market capitalism, I don't see the Scotland government rushing to subsidise its rural and far flung citizens. Much more publicity in abolishing prescription charges. I lived for 18 years in North Devon, it was the same there in the winter even the choice of shops halved and you had to pay way over the odds just to keep them in business. Just to keep a shop near at hand.


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## lenny (Jan 22, 2008)

In my opinion, it's time for the hauliers union,tanker drivers and farmers to get together again and challenge this government on fuel tax duties.
The last time this happened the government nearly S**T itself after the country nearly ground to a halt after only 2 weeks.
This was shortly after the government had succeeded in bringing down the miners union after several months of strike action.
Thing is ,the hauliers took some stick from the misguided public and the despute was shortlived. We need to support them, otherwise we will be hammered with more fuel tax.

The yanks would'nt have it


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## Guest (Jan 22, 2008)

lenny said:


> In my opinion, it's time for the hauliers union,tanker drivers and farmers to get together again and challenge this government on fuel tax duties.
> The last time this happened the government nearly S**T itself after the country nearly ground to a halt after only 2 weeks.
> This was shortly after the government had succeeded in bringing down the miners union after several months of strike action.
> Thing is ,the hauliers took some stick from the misguided public and the despute was shortlived. We need to support them, otherwise we will be hammered with more fuel tax.
> ...



Sorry Lenny, but as a Truck Driver I can assure you that the majority of the public will never back the truckers!
As soon as they couldn't buy their favourite goods from the supermarket, they would turn on us
They can't even give us the time of day on the roads.
I am generalizing of course


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## lenny (Jan 22, 2008)

The roads are jam packed with an unnecassary volume of traffic,the school run is an escalating joke, (I've seen a car follow the icecream man cos he missed him and he'd moved around the corner) Joe public is addicted to his car and life without it would'nt be worth living.
So they cue up in the Tax collection points(Garages) and pay whatever it costs.

Oh and my biggest bugbear are the drivers that pull up outside a house with music blairing and fog lights blinding then blast their horn to let everyone know they are there. 
I can't find a smilie to show how I feel


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## Geoff.W (Jan 22, 2008)

Now you've got me started.

The last few posts all point to the same fundamental problem:-
*
GREED & SELFISHNESS.*

Unfortunatly for much too long now this country has encouraged and promoted greed and selfishness over honesty fairplay & intelegence, and now we have a country run by the greedy and selfish, kept there by the will of those who aspire to even greater greed.

All I can say is 

BRING FORTH THE REVOLUTION.

(Rant over).


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## lenny (Jan 22, 2008)

Geoff.W said:


> Now you've got me started.
> 
> The last few posts all point to the same fundamental problem:-
> *
> ...


You're so right ,Geoff, you're so right


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## Don (Jan 23, 2008)

Geoff.W said:


> Now you've got me started.
> 
> The last few posts all point to the same fundamental problem:-
> *
> ...



Here Here that man. My own sentiments exactly.


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