# C&MC site at Culloden Moor



## Fisherman (Aug 7, 2020)

On Sunday we arrived for three nights at Culloden Moor. Went for a shower on Tuesday to find the attached sign on the toilet door. This sign was also on the ladies toilet. Being unhappy I went the reception to find out what was going on. I was abruptly told the explanation was on the doors. I said I wanted more information the reply was “are you serious” We only use the toilets for showers. One couple turned up in a camper with no toilet paid their dues and only found out when they went to use the toilet. There were a few camper vans and the tent section had 6 tents. This was a punishment exercise, and possibly the culprits had already left. I have emailed them to complain requesting compensation.


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## antiquesam (Aug 7, 2020)

I can see your point, they are charging for facilities and not providing them. I would have thought you should get a refund.


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## peter palance (Aug 7, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I can see your point, they are charging for facilities and not providing them. I would have thought you should get a refund.


and showed 2 finger, and downed yours, we no longer use them, throw at-it tued, no likey no thanky, keep on running, that is use. ok pj  p,s. still with the 3 C. ok


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## Val54 (Aug 7, 2020)

Another reason to ditch CMC next time round ........


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## fiona68 (Aug 7, 2020)

Was  at Culloden, before they opened facilities, when opened on 15th there was only 3 allowed in block at one time. Noticed that people with their own facilities still insisted on using the block, we preferred to use our own. Found that people on Holiday forget that COVID is still a real threat.  Will put on my hard hat now xx


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## izwozral (Aug 7, 2020)

fiona68 said:


> Was  at Culloden, before they opened facilities, when opened on 15th there was only 3 allowed in block at one time. Noticed that people with their own facilities still insisted on using the block, we preferred to use our own. *Found that people on Holiday forget that COVID is still a real threat.*  Will put on my hard hat now xx



So very true.


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## mickymost (Aug 7, 2020)

Fisherman before I start this post is not aimed at you 
Its a weird one but personally If I owned a £60000.00 Motorhome with a shower and toilet onboard then I would be using my own personal Shower and toilet.Especially with the Pandemic hanging over us.We only have a £20000 La Strada Campervan but will still use our own facilities.Same when you go on a site and folks with Brand new or up to date massive motorhomes (and caravans) are using the washing up sinks attached to the toilets.Are they frightened to get their sink dirty? I get one is paying for these facilities but its personal choice whether to spend £35.00 a night (would still use own own facilities) or one could pay £10 for a basic pitch on grass with only one basic toilet and maybe a shower in a Portacabin.) Would still use our own facilities.Including using our Kitchen sink to wash up after we cooked.Yes another one is these guys with these posh Motorhomes but go to restaurants and buy takeaways and wont dirty their cookers.


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## Fisherman (Aug 7, 2020)

fiona68 said:


> Was  at Culloden, before they opened facilities, when opened on 15th there was only 3 allowed in block at one time. Noticed that people with their own facilities still insisted on using the block, we preferred to use our own. Found that people on Holiday forget that COVID is still a real threat.  Will put on my hard hat now xx



Fiona if you wish to use your facilities fair play to you. But if others chose to use facilities that they are paying for then fair play to them also. We decided only to shower and use our facilities for everything else. I only intended taking two showers in the 3 day visit I only managed one. If the C&MC wish to encourage folk not to use facilities they should consider offering deals. Also I find it hard to believe that what they claim happened  applied to both ladies and gents at the one time. And taking payment from someone in a camper without warning them was well out of order.


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## mickymost (Aug 7, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> Fiona if you wish to use your facilities fair play to you. But if others chose to use facilities that they are paying for then fair play to them also. We decided only two shower and use our facilities for everything else. I only intended taking two showers in the 3 day visit I only managed one. If the C&MC wish to encourage folk not to use facilities they should consider offering deals. Also I find it hard to believe that what they claim happened  applied to both ladies and gents at the one time. And taking payment from someone in a camper without warning them was well out of order.




Fisherman Bill go down the compensation route.I definately would.You have been misled so in effect they have broke the contract.I feel a full refund should be in order here. Good Luck.


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## antiquesam (Aug 7, 2020)

We were in the Moreton in Marsh site last month and the ablutions seemed very well organised. At the entrance was a tub of Milton's with wrist bands in it. If you wanted to go in you took a band, no band no entry. The site was full but I saw no one cheating.


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## SquirrellCook (Aug 7, 2020)

A little off topic but the point was raised.  Even though you have everything in your camper to live, isn’t it nice to do your washing up in public?  So many of us are antisocial, let’s not let this virus be an excuse for be even worse. Though it does mean that late night sex parties are best forgotten about.


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## Fisherman (Aug 7, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Fisherman before I start this post is not aimed at you
> Its a weird one but personally If I owned a £60000.00 Motorhome with a shower and toilet onboard then I would be using my own personal Shower and toilet.Especially with the Pandemic hanging over us.We only have a £20000 La Strada Campervan but will still use our own facilities.Same when you go on a site and folks with Brand new or up to date massive motorhomes (and caravans) are using the washing up sinks attached to the toilets.Are they frightened to get their sink dirty? I get one is paying for these facilities but its personal choice whether to spend £35.00 a night (would still use own own facilities) or one could pay £10 for a basic pitch on grass with only one basic toilet and maybe a shower in a Portacabin.) Would still use our own facilities.Including using our Kitchen sink to wash up after we cooked.Yes another one is these guys with these posh Motorhomes but go to restaurants and buy takeaways and wont dirty their cookers.


We used our toilet, washed our dishes, shaved, brushed our teeth in our van. On average you use 30 litres of water having a shower, you can’t do that in a motorhome unless you want to empty your grey water every day and top up your water tank. The fact is you get a much better shower in their showers than in a motorhome. But they had no right to punnish everyone on the site who had paid for these facilities. But that has got nothing to do with paying for something then being denied it what you had paid for.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 7, 2020)

I hear from a very reliable inside source that the CMC are having trouble recruiting wardens, and that many existing wardens are choosing to quit.

A lot of wardens have traditionally been retirees who want to keep on keeping busy and are usually caravan or campervan owners themselves.
They don't necessarily need the income so can afford to leave if not happy with the job.

C-19 has made everyone's job more difficult, but when it comes to cleaning public loos and showers with this virus about, folk are probably saying thanks, but no thanks - I'd be a bit wary myself!

Does this mean the CMC are still charging full price, even without the use of showers and toilets? I was under the impression that all their main sites were opening shower and toilet blocks, but usage was limited with a wrist band system like Sam mentioned above. I've also heard that a max of 3 people are allowed into the shower blocks/loos at any one time. Guess that also depends on the size of the facilities at individual sites.

If some aren't opening the facilities and are still charging full price then they wouldn't be getting my custom any time soon! Don't mind paying the money, but I would expect the use of all toilet facilities if that's the case, whether I choose to use them or not. 

If they are short of willing staff then this could be a problem that will crop up more frequently. CMC wardens seem to have had a bit of a reputation for the odd ones acting like little Hitlers. Staff shortages could make the 'type' even worse under current circumstances.

Maybe you should write a letter of complaint, Bill, and see if it gets published in their monthly magazine? Somehow I doubt it... !


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## Wooie1958 (Aug 8, 2020)

We know a couple have been CC which is now CAMC ( for the pedantic ) wardens for 15 years and thoroughly enjoyed every minute of it until now.

They didn`t have to do it or actually need the income but they wanted to do it after selling their business.

A great time was had by them especially on a few occasions when they were asked to go to other sites and cover for sickness etc. etc.

The abuse they`ve took since the sites re-opened has been off the scale and they have now handed their notice in.

The majority of abuse has come from caravanners but there has been plenty from motorhomers as well having been spat at and threatened with violence.


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## jagmanx (Aug 8, 2020)

The threat of covid is affecting people brains
The abuse mentioned in post 14 being just one example.
The trouble is when people feel/are threatened they become more selfish/defensive/aggresive etc
NO EXCUSES


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## antiquesam (Aug 8, 2020)

I believe many of the old school wardens were ex servicemen, police and fire service bringing with them the regime they were used to, but they have recently been recruiting, as Marie and Wooie say, more normal people looking to keep active after early retirement. Someone pointed out to me recently that the C&MC have done very little for its members during this whereas the other mob extended the membership for three months, and have for the last couple of years provided free WiFi as opposed to charging silly sums of money for it.


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## Fisherman (Aug 8, 2020)

I never witnessed any abuse to anyone, but many were angry being treated like children. What I found astounding was we were told this happened in both the ladies and gents, I don’t believe this. I only used the toilets once for a shower in the previous afternoon and I was alone. We used the showers at this time as they were used less in the middle of the day. The toilets were clean. They left one disabled toilet open for everyone to use, surely this would have increased the chance of COVID being spread. When we were leaving next morning folk were queuing for the toilets after they were reopened with signs warning that they were being monitored. Surely this queuing would also have increased the chance of COVID being spread.  There was every chance that the person responsible for this had left, and those remaining were being denied what we had paid for. I will insist that everyone staying there is compensated, not just myself. This is not about money, it’s about a simple principle that they seem to have forgotten.


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## jagmanx (Aug 8, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I believe many of the old school wardens were ex servicemen, police and fire service bringing with them the regime they were used to, but they have recently been recruiting, as Marie and Wooie say, more normal people looking to keep active after early retirement. Someone pointed out to me recently that the C&MC have done very little for its members during this whereas the other mob extended the membership for three months, and have for the last couple of years provided free WiFi as opposed to charging silly sums of money for it.


When Mr Mackay retired from "Slade Open Prison" he applied to be a site warden but failed as he was "too soft" !


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 8, 2020)

My friends on the 'inside' said the site they had spent lockdown on (they were the only ones on that particular site right the way through lockdown, apart from the full time wardens who were living in the warden's chalet and completely separate) re-opened with a max 3-at-a-time for showers & loos ruling and wristbands issued. 

You were supposed to hang your wrist band on the hooks outside the shower block main door. When it got to 3 wrist bands you were supposed to wait until someone came out of the shower block before going in.

Apparently site visitors were taking very little notice of this 'rule' and were just wandering into the showers and loos as per normal.

Personally I think all these rules are slightly insane and vey difficult to enforce or police with the general public, unless you want to employ full time bouncers everywhere!


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## 2cv (Aug 8, 2020)

I find that one of the great advantages of having a motorhome after many years tenting is being able to use its facilities. With a little practice a shower can be had using very little water. It also means very little need to meet grumpy warders at club sites. In the present situation it is certainly much safer to use on board facilities.


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## peter palance (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I never witnessed any abuse to anyone, but many were angry being treated like children. What I found astounding was we were told this happened in both the ladies and gents, I don’t believe this. I only used the toilets once for a shower in the previous afternoon and I was alone. We used the showers at this time as they were used less in the middle of the day. The toilets were clean. They left one disabled toilet open for everyone to use, surely this would have increased the chance of COVID being spread. When we were leaving next morning folk were queuing for the toilets after they were reopened with signs warning that they were being monitored. Surely this queuing would also have increased the chance of COVID being spread.  There was every chance that the person responsible for this had left, and those remaining were being denied what we had paid for. I will insist that everyone staying there is compensated, not just myself. This is not about money, it’s about a simple principle that they seem to have forgotten.


thats why we left a few years a go , oh and no going back, stick with it and keep safe, ok.pj.


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## Wooie1958 (Aug 8, 2020)

The couple i mentioned in the earlier post are probably 2 of the nicest people i know and will do almost anything they can to help other people.

I`ve seen them go above and beyond to help other members and non members, nothing no matter what time of day or night is too much trouble for them.

It really is the CAMC`s loss and maybe if they`d received more back up from their employers they wouldn`t be resigning.


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## number14 (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman's experience was not good and he should definitely pursue a complaint. 
We are not fans of the club sites but during lockdown we decided to book a couple to be sure of having somewhere to stay after release. We also bought a batch of club vouchers using their 20% boost offer. So far stayed at exmoor and now st David's. Have to say everyone has been very good using the rubber band system for facilities, although we only use them for the odd shower. Wardens fine also.
Even so we are looking forward to getting back to quieter places and a bit of 'off grid' once the virus panic has abated.


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## mickymost (Aug 8, 2020)

2cv said:


> I find that one of the great advantages of having a motorhome after many years tenting is being able to use its facilities. With a little practice a shower can be had using very little water. It also means very little need to meet grumpy warders at club sites. In the present situation it is certainly much safer to use on board facilities.




I feel with the situation we are in and this "invisible"killer lurking one would be crazy to even consider entering a Toilet Block used by all.How do you know someone isnt carrying the virus just because they are in a Caravan or Motorhome.You dont. These temporary wardens how do you know they would give their all to clean a toilet block properly putting themselves (in my opinion) in a very dangerous position as probably (not always )they are  older retired people.I for one wouldnt want to be going in cleaning behind some possibly #covid19 infected oik. Too risky lifes too short and I agree with Mariesnowgoose that many of these wardens who have had a job for many of their early retirement years enjoying being a Site Warden are now saying No Thankyou im off heres my notice.


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## Biggarmac (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> On average you use 30 litres of water having a shower, you can’t do that in a motorhome unless you want to empty your grey water every day and top up your water tank.


This remark made me wonder how much I used for a shower.  As I am on a THS and using a bucket to collect the waste water I checked how much this mornings shower had used.  Only just over half a 15L bucket. Its not as if I skimp; so I'm not sure how you use 4 times as much.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 8, 2020)

Biggarmac said:


> This remark made me wonder how much I used for a shower.  As I am on a THS and using a bucket to collect the waste water I checked how much this mornings shower had used.  Only just over half a 15L bucket. Its not as if I skimp; so I'm not sure how you use 4 times as much.View attachment 85141



Maybe Bill has a bigger body mass to clean, Meg? 

Not that I'm suggesting he looks like an elephant or anything...!!!


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## antiquesam (Aug 8, 2020)

Biggarmac said:


> This remark made me wonder how much I used for a shower.  As I am on a THS and using a bucket to collect the waste water I checked how much this mornings shower had used.  Only just over half a 15L bucket. Its not as if I skimp; so I'm not sure how you use 4 times as much.View attachment 85141


Perhaps some have more to wash than you.


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## Fisherman (Aug 8, 2020)

Biggarmac said:


> This remark made me wonder how much I used for a shower.  As I am on a THS and using a bucket to collect the waste water I checked how much this mornings shower had used.  Only just over half a 15L bucket. Its not as if I skimp; so I'm not sure how you use 4 times as much.View attachment 85141



I was talking about at home or in a campsite not the Motorhome. I probably use 5-6 litres in the van. That was my point, you can’t get as good a shower in a Motorhome.


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## SquirrellCook (Aug 8, 2020)

As I am on many subjects I am at odds with the common view.  Public toilets never should have been shut, let alone the ones on camp sites.  It's not difficult to clean hard surfaces.  You don't need to lick them.  Anyone defecating out in the open should serve a month of community service cleaning up the mess.  Even with the litter problem, more bins.  Make the unemployed look after them.  If they don't like it they can get another job.
And as for antisocial behaviour on club camp sites.  Just ban them!


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## mickymost (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I was talking about at home or in a campsite not the Motorhome. I probably use 5-6 litres in the van. That was my point, you can’t get as good a shower in a Motorhome.




Surely any shower providing one soaps up gets clean and rinses off even if only say 7 litres of water used is better than any wet wipe wash down? No camper or motorhome shower will ever be like a good 15 minute blast like at home.


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## mickymost (Aug 8, 2020)

SquirrellCook said:


> As I am on many subjects I am at odds with the common view.  Public toilets never should have been shut, let alone the ones on camp sites.  It's not difficult to clean hard surfaces.  You don't need to lick them.  Anyone defecating out in the open should serve and month of community service cleaning up the mess.  Even with the litter problem, more bins.  Make the unemployed look after them.  If they don't like it they can get another job.
> And as for antisocial behaviour of club camp sites.  Just ban them!



These points you make are only going to happen in an ideal world.If unemployed as you say are made to look after Public Toilets and are not getting paid then they sure are not going to view it as a paid job so why the comment  " if they dont like they can get another job"  Those on Community service could be given this role but I still wouldnt trust their commitment to the standard of cleanliness needed unless someone stood over them with a whip.And I wouldnt ban the club campsites I wouldnt join and waste my money in the first place.


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## Biggarmac (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I was talking about at home or in a campsite not the Motorhome. I probably use 5-6 litres in the van. That was my point, you can’t get as good a shower in a Motorhome.


Try a new showerhead.  The one in my van now is great.  Got it at a show, but can't remember what its called.  Meg


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## peter palance (Aug 8, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I was talking about at home or in a campsite not the Motorhome. I probably use 5-6 litres in the van. That was my point, you can’t get as good a shower in a Motorhome.


i can and behind the ears, oh yes im clean.if been top and tailed, water wise, lets not get sauce. im off can you smell me. ok.pj.


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## korky (Aug 8, 2020)

SquirrellCook said:


> As I am on many subjects I am at odds with the common view.  Public toilets never should have been shut, let alone the ones on camp sites.  It's not difficult to clean hard surfaces.  You don't need to lick them.  Anyone defecating out in the open should serve a month of community service cleaning up the mess.  Even with the litter problem, more bins.  Make the unemployed look after them.  If they don't like it they can get another job.
> And as for antisocial behaviour on club camp sites.  Just ban them!


You obviously have a problem with the unemployed.Don't worry millions more will be joining them soon.Your toilets and bins should be spotless.


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## peter palance (Aug 9, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I was talking about at home or in a campsite not the Motorhome. I probably use 5-6 litres in the van. That was my point, you can’t get as good a shower in a Motorhome.


per- haps your washing your u-tensils, to much,or not enough, get your hands to them, make them shine, try happy times, ok.pj.


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## peter palance (Aug 9, 2020)

Biggarmac said:


> Try a new showerhead.  The one in my van now is great.  Got it at a show, but can't remember what its called.  Meg


try shower- head, ok ,great, ok.pj. dont get your hair wet,


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## trevskoda (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Surely any shower providing one soaps up gets clean and rinses off even if only say 7 litres of water used is better than any wet wipe wash down? No camper or motorhome shower will ever be like a good 15 minute blast like at home.


15 mins under a shower of water eek,and more than once a year.


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## trevskoda (Aug 9, 2020)

I dont have a shower in my van but only a wash station which works well,we also have a open bath house all around our coast,bring you own soap.


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## peter palance (Aug 9, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> 15 mins under a shower of water eek,and more than once a year.


sorry but your only a salty dog, dip your head in as well. ok.pj.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Surely any shower providing one soaps up gets clean and rinses off even if only say 7 litres of water used is better than any wet wipe wash down? No camper or motorhome shower will ever be like *a good 15 minute blast like at home*.



15 minutes?! Jaysus! You must be either mega-mucky or the size of at least 3 elephants... !!


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

I've been wondering...

All this talk of hygiene and washing your hands with soap and water and how it kills the virus....

Surely hot showers, communal/public or not, with plenty of soap and water will also kill the virus, no....?  ... and if not, why not?!


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## Val54 (Aug 9, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> I've been wondering...
> 
> All this talk of hygiene and washing your hands with soap and water and how it kills the virus....
> 
> Surely hot showers, communal/public or not, with plenty of soap and water will also kill the virus, no....?  ... and if not, why not?!


In theory, yes it should Marie, but its the less than fastidious person who doesn't hand sanitise going in ...... door handles, taps etc etc. As an aside we've been looking at whether we should reopen our village hall to all users, but the pages of government advice make sobering reading and rely totally on Joe Public being sensible, including now wearing masks inside. As a result we are keeping the hall closed to all users except the daily pre-school who still have key worker children etc.


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## mickymost (Aug 9, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> I've been wondering...
> 
> All this talk of hygiene and washing your hands with soap and water and how it kills the virus....
> 
> Surely hot showers, communal/public or not, with plenty of soap and water will also kill the virus, no....?  ... and if not, why not?!




Yes Marie good point but they also said when one sneezes the particles of the virus sit in the air for several days (probably rubbish)there are even videos on this showing the cloud in the air of the virus germ.So who wants to be in a shower cubicle or a toilet cubicle on a site any site (or even in general public toilets)when someone before you may be infected and sneezes releasing this so called cloud which is then trapped in the air in this cubicle for several days.If the Scientists are to be believed then you are going to breath it in whether you have washed with soap or not.One cannot it theory wash the air all around you.I know this sounds like rubbish BUT its what this Government and information Videos have put out there.Also what about the door handle for the cubicle the button for the shower the shower seat?The toilet door handle the flush handle the tap in the sinks.UNLESS someone comes behind you every time to disinfect these things how do you know you are not picking up the virus then touching your mouth.Face etc?Its all very scary(If the Government is to be believed)We for one havent been away yet since last October I realise many others now have been away and are fine but there are many still many like us who havent been away in their motorhome or Campervan since the Pandemic started.When we do pluck the courage(its her indoors who I have to convince Im straining at the leash to get away)We wont be visiting any site toilet or shower anytime soon.


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## Deleted member 77519 (Aug 9, 2020)

Anyone remember farm campsites before shower blocks?
One outside tap and one Loo. Families stayed for 2 weeks. How the hell did we cope?
True we didn't have a Pandemic to cope with, but everyone made the most of things, and I can't ever recall, anyone telling another person they stink.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

... and the 2 metre/1 metre distancing rule?

Is that sufficient to protect you if someone sneezes, based on the so-called 'safety information'? 

All the guidelines seem to be based on, well... tbh I'm not entirely sure what...

Where is the unequivocal scientific research/testing/proof that backs up the distancing rules specifically?
Have I missed the public information broadcast that told us all why?
If I have missed it then that means not just me, but a huge swathe of Joe Public has missed this vital information as well.

I hate blindly following 'rules' when I haven't been given a good, solid, proven reason why I need to.
The washing hands and hygiene I can fully comprehend and agree with, even the masks.
The 'social distancing' I find it very hard to get my head round.
Why did it start out at 2 metres and then get reduced to 1 metre? Where's the evidence that proves it works?


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## mickymost (Aug 9, 2020)

Hallmut said:


> Anyone remember farm campsites before shower blocks?
> One outside tap and one Loo. Families stayed for 2 weeks. How the hell did we cope?
> True we didn't have a Pandemic to cope with, but everyone made the most of things, and I can't ever recall, anyone telling another person they stink.




Agreed but Pandemics dont come around very often.I dont remember living through one in my 58 years on Earth.So things are different and we are going to have to adjust to this like it or not.Keeping safe will be down to the individual and whats in their head.People depressed or suffering will make more of this than it is.Each day im trying to convince my wife to get out and about in the big wide world.We do go shopping every two weeks but we get around the supermarket (only one)quick and  she is glad to return home.Im just trying to convince her we need to go somewhere different in the Camper. Shes not  convinced yet.


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## Deleted member 77519 (Aug 9, 2020)

Baffles me also. Here in Leeds the guidance is still 2m, but 1m, iff you can't stick to 2m. My own personal thoughts on shower blocks are they could be the ideal transmission areas. Lots of atomised water vapour hanging about, someone carrying the virus coughs or sneezes into that?
The only safe way to clean an environment like that, would be to use foggers, after each use of the facilities. Maybe staff are doing this already.?


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## mickymost (Aug 9, 2020)

Hallmut said:


> Baffles me also. Here in Leeds the guidance is still 2m, but 1m, iff you can't stick to 2m. My own personal thoughts on shower blocks are they could be the ideal transmission areas. Lots of atomised water vapour hanging about, someone carrying the virus coughs or sneezes into that?
> The only safe way to clean an environment like that, would be to use foggers, after each use of the facilities. Maybe staff are doing this already.?




Cant see that any campsite warden is going in behind someone after each shower to disinfect it sorry cant believe that is happening.Or a toilet cubicle cleaned completely after each use.No not happening!


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Agreed but Pandemics dont come around very often.I dont remember living through one in my 58 years on Earth.So things are different and we are going to have to adjust to this like it or not.Keeping safe will be down to the individual and whats in their head.People depressed or suffering will make more of this than it is.Each day im trying to convince my wife to get out and about in the big wide world.We do go shopping every two weeks but we get around the supermarket (only one)quick and  she is glad to return home.Im just trying to convince her we need to go somewhere different in the Camper. Shes not  convinced yet.



Tell her about me? 

I'm on the most vulnerable list, still got 2 'adjuvent treatments' for cancer to go (last one 2nd September - roll on, can't wait!).

Hasn't stopped me getting out and about - with caution and shedloads of common sense.

Everyone is different and some folk have had the pants scared off them by this pandemic, so much so they will never venture out of their houses until a vaccine is developed. All I can say to that is they might well be dead before that happens, so if you want to live like a prisoner in your own home until that happy day - which may never arrive - then fair enough, but I am of the mindset to take my own chances.

Life is short enough as it is. Once you've been diagnosed with the 'emperor of all maladies' your viewpoint - or at least mine - is changed forever.

Lockdown? Pah! I already did my own lockdown last year. It was just a trial run for this year's lockdown, which, granted, is on a bigger scale, but no real difference in my head. Apart from that fact that millions of other people are also now worried they might die... but they haven't got cancer, the silly sausages, they are running scared at the thought they *might* catch something that *might* kill them. All very sad and depressing.

Not me. Onwards and upwards. Something gets us all in the end, no one is immortal.
In the meantime I'm going to try and live the best I can, virus or no bloody virus!


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## antiquesam (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Yes Marie good point but they also said when one sneezes the particles of the virus sit in the air for several days (probably rubbish)there are even videos on this showing the cloud in the air of the virus germ.So who wants to be in a shower cubicle or a toilet cubicle on a site any site (or even in general public toilets)when someone before you may be infected and sneezes releasing this so called cloud which is then trapped in the air in this cubicle for several days.If the Scientists are to be believed then you are going to breath it in whether you have washed with soap or not.One cannot it theory wash the air all around you.I know this sounds like rubbish BUT its what this Government and information Videos have put out there.Also what about the door handle for the cubicle the button for the shower the shower seat?The toilet door handle the flush handle the tap in the sinks.UNLESS someone comes behind you every time to disinfect these things how do you know you are not picking up the virus then touching your mouth.Face etc?Its all very scary(If the Government is to be believed)We for one havent been away yet since last October I realise many others now have been away and are fine but there are many still many like us who havent been away in their motorhome or Campervan since the Pandemic started.When we do pluck the courage(its her indoors who I have to convince Im straining at the leash to get away)We wont be visiting any site toilet or shower anytime soon.


I can't help thinking that the only safe place is in a hermetically sealed room where the virus won't get you but you'll still die from lack of oxygen or starvation.


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## Deleted member 77519 (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Agreed but Pandemics dont come around very often.I dont remember living through one in my 58 years on Earth.So things are different and we are going to have to adjust to this like it or not.Keeping safe will be down to the individual and whats in their head.People depressed or suffering will make more of this than it is.Each day im trying to convince my wife to get out and about in the big wide world.We do go shopping every two weeks but we get around the supermarket (only one)quick and  she is glad to return home.Im just trying to convince her we need to go somewhere different in the Camper. Shes not  convinced yet.


I really feel for people who are vulnerable or just worried. I've worked constantly, in sometimes very close environments. The only reasons, I can give, for remaining healthy are just being aware of what's going on around you. Lots of hand washing, in between using gell. I even gell after getting in my own vehicle  just in case some scrote has tried the door. I wish your wife well and hope she can overcome her fears. Everyday I go to work, I'm nervous too.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I can't help thinking that the only safe place is in a hermetically sealed room where the virus won't get you but you'll still die from lack of oxygen or starvation.



'Zactly. So I say quit worrying, get your head around the fact that this virus is here to stay and start getting on with life as best as you can


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## colinm (Aug 9, 2020)

We have just got back from a few days at a C&CC site, we knew before going it was one that had the toilets/showers closed, and was only open to units with own facilities. Having watched the 'antics' of some people I would not blame any warden saying "f.u. I'm off". Whilst the majority of people where quite sensible, there where some complete arseholes.


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## antiquesam (Aug 9, 2020)

Hallmut said:


> Anyone remember farm campsites before shower blocks?
> One outside tap and one Loo. Families stayed for 2 weeks. How the hell did we cope?
> True we didn't have a Pandemic to cope with, but everyone made the most of things, and I can't ever recall, anyone telling another person they stink.


I used to go to one in the Lakes with a very communal toilet with two seats over a pit. I wasn't that intimate with anyone I camped with for that setup.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

Hallmut said:


> I really feel for people who are vulnerable or just worried. I've worked constantly, in sometimes very close environments. The only reasons, I can give, for remaining healthy are just being aware of what's going on around you. Lots of hand washing, in between using gell. I even gell after getting in my own vehicle  just in case some scrote has tried the door. I wish your wife well and hope she can overcome her fears. Everyday I go to work, I'm nervous too.



I think the secret is keeping yourself as healthy as possible. I know the media keep banging on about the odd person here and there who was 'healthy' and still got really felled by it, or even worse died, and that is the scariest part.

But I still think we all need to try and find the courage to face it and learn to live with it.


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## Deleted member 77519 (Aug 9, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I used to go to one in the Lakes with a very communal toilet with two seats over a pit. I wasn't that intimate with anyone I camped with for that setup.


There used to be a Farm site at Keld, near the bridge going up to Tan Hill. That had a corrugated Barrel, in a Barn, with a plank across it. That was in the mid nineties. You shoved your 2 quid under the farm door.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 9, 2020)

Multi-seater communal "lime" toilets with wooden seats used to be commonplace up here 

But the Romans were doing it long before we were...


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## antiquesam (Aug 9, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Multi-seater communal "lime" toilets with wooden seats used to be commonplace up here
> 
> But the Romans were doing it long before we were...


I remember the school trips to Housesteads and the story of the shared sponge on a stick.


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## r4dent (Aug 9, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Same when you go on a site and folks with Brand new or up to date massive motorhomes (and caravans) are using the washing up sinks attached to the toilets.Are they frightened to get their sink dirty?
> 
> Yes another one is these guys with these posh Motorhomes but go to restaurants and buy takeaways and wont dirty their cookers.



Chill out man.  I use washing up sinks when they are available.  I go out to do the washing up and SWMBO tidies the MoHo while I'm out of the way. 

We go to restaurants or get a take away if that is what we fancy.  I use a BBQ if that is what we are in the mode for.  We use the cooker if we want to.

My decisions about using facilities are, therefore, different to yours. Not better, not wrong,  just different.

I thought freedom was on of the good things about MoHos, please don't criticise those who don't do things your way.


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## Deleted member 77519 (Aug 9, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I remember the school trips to Housesteads and the story of the shared sponge on a stick.


So the moral here is, there were lots of diseases we could have succumbed to, without a Pandemic.


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## antiquesam (Aug 9, 2020)

I do think we worry too much about the odd germ nowadays and consequently don't build any resistance. I'm sure I wasn't the only child to grub around all morning and eat my picnic with dirty hands. Pick up dropped sweets, get a suck of someone else's gobstopper and get sent to play with someone with mumps or measles and only had a bath once a week. I should stress I'm not saying this would stop covid.


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## runnach (Aug 9, 2020)

Experts , government advice seems to change like the wind , so take control of your own fate. To me at least human interaction has to be the root of viral transmission, I can’t really avoid hospital 3 times a week so approach the excercise with caution , other things I can influence like shopping at quiet times, I frankly don’t need nor want Boris Johnson telling me that. I will decide myself ,I am a big boy allegedly...I take a view and manage risk the best I can, some situations that sensibility could be compromised. Like a child I can’t wrap in cotton wool.

Lots of people here like Marie Annie Nigel Trev Christ the list goes on are vulnerable we all need to follow the same path. anticipate and manage situations the best we can and get on with it


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## mickymost (Aug 9, 2020)

r4dent said:


> Chill out man.  I use washing up sinks when they are available.  I go out to do the washing up and SWMBO tidies the MoHo while I'm out of the way.
> 
> We go to restaurants or get a take away if that is what we fancy.  I use a BBQ if that is what we are in the mode for.  We use the cooker if we want to.
> 
> ...




Mate good luck with them washing up sinks in this Pandemic And on one site last year I observed a toilet cleaner washing her mop after cleaning the toilet floor in the washing up sinks so by all means go for it.

"My Decisions about using facilities are therefore,  different to yours Not better not wrong" your words as you are saying each can have their own opinion on things 

So please dont accuse me of criticising others I have my opinion you have yours


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## Biggarmac (Aug 9, 2020)

On the CCC popup campsite (formerly known as THS) there are over 80 vans.  No toilets, no showers.  No problems.  Drinking water and an Elsan point.  £7.50 a night.  What more do you need?


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## colinm (Aug 9, 2020)

Biggarmac said:


> On the CCC popup campsite (formerly known as THS) there are over 80 vans.  No toilets, no showers.  No problems.  Drinking water and an Elsan point.  £7.50 a night.  What more do you need?


It wasn't until we had gone away that I realised they had restarted otherwise would have looked at what was available, as it turned out was very pleased to be under a lot of shade.


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## Pandaman2020 (Aug 11, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Tell her about me?
> 
> I'm on the most vulnerable list, still got 2 'adjuvent treatments' for cancer to go (last one 2nd September - roll on, can't wait!).
> 
> ...


Me too with a heart condition, I’ve never worn a mask and just use common sense when near anyone else!


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

Wooie1958 said:


> The couple i mentioned in the earlier post are probably 2 of the nicest people i know and will do almost anything they can to help other people.


In that case, they were totally unsuitable. That club seems to select warders for wardens. Seriously, the only unpleasant staff I've ever found at sites have been CC* wardens. 
Every other type of site the people have been lovely.
*Changed the name since then, but I bet they haven't changed the attitude.


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 12, 2020)

in h said:


> In that case, they were totally unsuitable. That club seems to select warders for wardens. Seriously, the only unpleasant staff I've ever found at sites have been CC* wardens.
> Every other type of site the people have been lovely.
> *Changed the name since then, but I bet they haven't changed the attitude.



I would agree with that, speaking from experience


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## Hellfire (Aug 16, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> We used our toilet, washed our dishes, shaved, brushed our teeth in our van. On average you use 30 litres of water having a shower, you can’t do that in a motorhome unless you want to empty your grey water every day and top up your water tank. The fact is you get a much better shower in their showers than in a motorhome. But they had no right to punnsh everyone on the site who had paid for these facilities. But that has got nothing to do with paying for something then being denied it what you had paid for.



If you use 30 litres of water for a shower you are doing it all wrong


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## Fisherman (Aug 16, 2020)

Hellfire said:


> If you use 30 litres of water for a shower you are doing it all wrong



Ok then tell me what I am doing wrong, I am dying to know.


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## Hellfire (Aug 16, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> Ok then tell me what I am doing wrong, I am dying to know.


Stand under shower. Turn on water for 30 seconds. Turn off water. Apply soap all over. Turn on water to rinse off for 30 seconds. 

We have wilded all over Europe. 120 litre water tank lasts five days for everything. 





Fisherman said:


> We used our toilet, washed our dishes, shaved, brushed our teeth in our van. On average you use 30 litres of water having a shower, you can’t do that in a motorhome unless you want to empty your grey water every day and top up your water tank. The fact is you get a much better shower in their showers than in a motorhome. But they had no right to punnsh everyone on the site who had paid for these facilities. But that has got nothing to do with paying for something then being denied it what you had paid for.



If you use 30 litres of water for a shower you are doing it all wrong


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## mark61 (Aug 16, 2020)

Hellfire said:


> Stand under shower. Turn on water for 30 seconds. Turn off water. Apply soap all over. Turn on water to rinse off for 30 seconds.
> 
> We have wilded all over Europe. 120 litre water tank lasts five days for everything.
> 
> ...



I think you missed the "you can’t do that in a motorhome" bit.


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## Fisherman (Aug 16, 2020)

Hellfire said:


> Stand under shower. Turn on water for 30 seconds. Turn off water. Apply soap all over. Turn on water to rinse off for 30 seconds.
> 
> We have wilded all over Europe. 120 litre water tank lasts five days for everything.
> 
> ...



Hellfire read my post I stated you can’t use 30 litres of water in a Motorhome.
You would be emptying your grey water tank every day and refilling your water tank. I was comparing a shower at home were the average use is 30 litres and a shower in a van were you only use 5-7 litres.

But thanks for the advice .


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## Hellfire (Aug 16, 2020)

mark61 said:


> I think you missed the "you can’t do that in a motorhome" bit.


Do I did


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## Sailorpedal (Aug 16, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> I hear from a very reliable inside source that the CMC are having trouble recruiting wardens, and that many existing wardens are choosing to quit.
> 
> A lot of wardens have traditionally been retirees who want to keep on keeping busy and are usually caravan or campervan owners themselves.
> They don't necessarily need the income so can afford to leave if not happy with the job.
> ...


THIS is a true story! Many of you will remember when about 5 years ago, there was a feature on TV about the Caravan Clubs manoeuvres on site. You will recall a lot of ridiculous things happening,  such as the judges measuring the length of the rubber awning tensioning straps, to check they were all equal, then there was the inspection of inside storage to make sure one's knickers were all neatly stowed away! There were other such prize events such as getting an 80 year old granny to reverse a caravan round an obstacle course,(when she had never even towed before!)
But the prize happening for me, was when the President of the Club,(YES, YOU READ ME RIGHT, the President), drove his caravan at breakneck speed around the course, went down into a dip, bottomed out on the way back up, and RIPPED the back of his van almost right off. He then complained that he had smashed his Wedgewood China set!!
As if this true story is not unbelievable enough, get this - I emailed the Club magazine, stating that I thought this whole deplorable escapade showed us all up in a bad light, as the public thought little enough of caravanners and motorhomers as it was!
Here at last is the punchline - the club SUSPENDED my membership! 
Unbelievable but true.
So good luck with reporting your item to them!


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## Red Dwarf (Aug 16, 2020)

I’ve just joined this forum, it was the name that did it for me, wildcamping.
I’ve had terrible experiences on club sites in the past and gave up using them, isn’t that why we’re all here? Just a bit confused as to why this is a topic on a wild camping forum... just sayin


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## mjvw (Aug 16, 2020)

I think some people myself included are look small CL as an alternative to area's not wild camping friendly at this time, it's also good to have a spread of possible location to empty waste and charge batteries and if some cost so be it.
My heart is with wildcamping and that's why i joined this forum the CL's are not listed on the app location app, but i do appreciate getting information on other topic's among the varied post. Variety is the spice of life so they say


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 16, 2020)

Red Dwarf said:


> I’ve just joined this forum, it was the name that did it for me, wildcamping.
> I’ve had terrible experiences on club sites in the past and gave up using them, isn’t that why we’re all here? Just a bit confused as to why this is a topic on a wild camping forum... just sayin



Unless you've been on another planet the last few months, I only need to use a couple of words to explain why - 'Covid-19' and 'pandemic'.

Campsites are only under more regular discussion here (as are many other 'alternatives' to wilding at the moment) because the pandemic has caused a variety of problems for wild campers across the board. Some of the problems are merely a perception - bad press & hysterical media - but this has been sufficient to put some people off wilding this year. But it's also worth noting that others have been wilding throughout the virus with no problems whatsoever.

However, some members are definitely wary of going off 'wilding' under present circumstances, again for a variety of virus-related reasons.

Hence the 2020 compromise of staying on campsites, as some feel it's the only safe way to get out and about in their vans - for now!

Does that explanation help?


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## peter palance (Aug 16, 2020)

mickymost said:


> Surely any shower providing one soaps up gets clean and rinses off even if only say 7 litres of water used is better than any wet wipe wash down? No camper or motorhome shower will ever be like a good 15 minute blast like at home.


sorry but you must be , using your balls to much, ar soap, to many bubbles, use less soap,well ive tried it, p.s. keep clean. ok pj.


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## Red Dwarf (Aug 16, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Unless you've been on another planet the last few months, I only need to use a couple of words to explain why - 'Covid-19' and 'pandemic'.
> 
> Campsites are only under more regular discussion here (as are many other 'alternatives' to wilding at the moment) because the pandemic has caused a variety of problems for wild campers across the board. Some of the problems are merely a perception - bad press & hysterical media - but this has been sufficient to put some people off wilding this year. But it's also worth noting that others have been wilding throughout the virus with no problems whatsoever.
> 
> ...



You’re more right than you might think! I live in the far north Highlands and haven’t ventured far since March. I did notice the site at Altnaharra hasn’t opened this year, perhaps because it doesn’t have facilities? Yes, your explanation helped!

There was certainly some animosity towards MHs in the neck of the woods during lockdown. Mostly because there were virtually no cases of covid in the far north and because of the potential threat to meagre public health infrastructure.
Since the easing of restrictions, it now looks like any other summer on the NC500!

The real threat to wilding in the north is coming not from the communities, rather from a Danish billionaire who doesn’t want MHs to have the freedom to wild camp, but that’s a whole other story... (one of this man’s businesses now owns the NC500 franchise).


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## mickymost (Aug 16, 2020)

Red Dwarf said:


> You’re more right than you might think! I live in the far north Highlands and haven’t ventured far since March. I did notice the site at Altnaharra hasn’t opened this year, perhaps because it doesn’t have facilities? Yes, your explanation helped!
> 
> There was certainly some animosity towards MHs in the neck of the woods during lockdown. Mostly because there were virtually no cases of covid in the far north and because of the potential threat to meagre public health infrastructure.
> Since the easing of restrictions, it now looks like any other summer on the NC500!
> ...




Tell the story about the Danish Businessman you got us curious and we have ears to listen


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## 2cv (Aug 16, 2020)

Red Dwarf said:


> You’re more right than you might think! I live in the far north Highlands and haven’t ventured far since March. I did notice the site at Altnaharra hasn’t opened this year, perhaps because it doesn’t have facilities? Yes, your explanation helped!
> 
> There was certainly some animosity towards MHs in the neck of the woods during lockdown. Mostly because there were virtually no cases of covid in the far north and because of the potential threat to meagre public health infrastructure.
> Since the easing of restrictions, it now looks like any other summer on the NC500!
> ...



It would appear from Here that the franchise owner should be creating “ reinvestment in the development and audience reach of the route.” So maybe in fact he should be the one setting up facilities for motorhome users from the profits of franchise fees.


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## Red Dwarf (Aug 16, 2020)

Anders Povlsen is the man, he owns the ASOS fashion brand among other things. Some of those things are a number of sporting estates in the Highlands. He’s now the second biggest land owner in Scotland.

His company that runs the estates is called Wildland. He’s into re-wilding the Highlands, turning it back to wilderness. His estate businesses are basically trying to turn the far north into a Disneyland for the very wealthy.
In the village of Tongue for example. He bought both the local shops, shut one of them. The one he shut had the only fuel pump. After a long period of not being able to buy fuel in the village, he replaced the old pump with an expensive to use card operated pump. He has already tried putting some no parking/camping signs up on land at one end of the causeway at the Kyle of Tongue, he’d love to be able to ban camping on the council car parks on the causeway.

He has pressurised local crofters to move livestock and thrown money around to buy his way forward with his plans. Don’t get me wrong, on the surface he’s done some good things, bought the school a new minibus etc. More worryingly he’s about to build a new old folks home as a replacement for an aging nhs/council unit. A building he’ll own and rent to the nhs. With the shortage of public money, the authorities are buying into all this. Short term-ism rules!

He’s also made it clear he doesn’t want folk wild camping. One thorn in his side is the township of Melness and village of Talmine. The land in that area is in a trust for the community and it annoys him. He buys property that comes up for sale, driving up prices and in so makes it difficult for locals to purchase. 

His cleverest and most divisive ploy is to split the community, oh how a few quid can buy a bit of support... some folk in the area think he’s just what the area needed, a larger group think otherwise.

He’s put people out of business and tried to obstruct the building of new commercial buildings as they spoil the view. No consideration for the people that live here, he just wants to own everything.

In the midst of all his heavy handed planning, this man has endured a personal tragedy. If you recall the hotel bombing in Sri Lanka, three of his four children were killed, an unimaginable event for anyone. Many here thought that this event might temper his plans, not a bit of it.

I’ve attended meetings connected to various Wildland proposals, it’s all veiled threats and money.

His purchase of the NC500 franchise got people here wondering. The franchise had been running at a loss for the previous operators, he’s seen a way to make it pay. That way is to make sure no one wild camps and that anyone that wants to camp will have to use his campsites.

I’m sure someone else from this area could write a glowing and very positive summary of Wildland’s plans. The truth is he wants total control. Only time will tell, though I fear his great wealth will buy him his desires. Lastly, it’s a great shame the Scottish government and their Scottish Land Commission (brought into being to keep an eye on such things) appear to be turning a blind eye, rather like the Trump golf course fiasco in Aberdeenshire.


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## in h (Aug 16, 2020)

Hellfire said:


> We have wilded all over Europe. 120 litre water tank lasts five days for everything.


Our fresh water tank is a bit more than that. 160 litres, I think. 
I used to reckon that it lasts two of us ten days, but on a trip last year, we were nearly home and didn't want to top up with hard water, so we left it. We were home a few hours short of two weeks, and the water hadn't run out.


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