# LPG :- refilling



## charnock (Jan 26, 2018)

Hi, Can someone teii me were you can fill LPG bottles up, as just bought filling adapter and been to local garage and told that it's not allowed to fill LPG bottles at a garage.

Cheers Kev


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## colinm (Jan 26, 2018)

Have you got a system off the likes of Gaslow, or an eBay cheapy?


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## charnock (Jan 26, 2018)

Hi, it's from gaslow.


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## colinm (Jan 26, 2018)

charnock said:


> Hi, it's from gaslow.



Is that the complete system with their bottle and is it fixed in the van?


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## rugbyken (Jan 26, 2018)

as colin said if you have a properly fitted system shouldn’t be a problem but does depend where you are , eg can’t fill it in an italian garage different tax rates and some garages won’t let you fill if you have to open a locker ie portugal and untrained ops in france,


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## Minisorella (Jan 26, 2018)

From what I've read on threads in the past, there's general disapproval of refilling a bottle with an adapter directly on the bottle... perceived safety issue AFAIK.  If you have a refillable system with an external filler point, you'll be fine at most lpg/autogas pumps.

When my system was fitted, I was told to be sure to have the filler point on the outside of the van and not fitted inside the gas bottle door because, even though it's legit, if a garage sees you open a door to get at the fill, they'll assume you're using an adapter.


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## jagmanx (Jan 26, 2018)

*We have a gas-it "Proper system"*

Gaslow or others the same
Our filling point is inside the locker.
I have the 3 adapters
ONCE only in Romania it was queried but accepted.
Mostly its a DIY fill anyway.
But I am  careful not to do diesel at the same time !
I have filled up in many countries but as yet not Switzerland Italy Spain Portugal


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## RoaminRog (Jan 26, 2018)

charnock said:


> Hi, Can someone teii me were you can fill LPG bottles up, as just bought filling adapter and been to local garage and told that it's not allowed to fill LPG bottles at a garage.
> 
> Cheers Kev



Possibly a stupid question BUT have you got refillable bottles or are you trying to refill an EXCHANGABLE bottle?


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## Tezza33 (Jan 26, 2018)

RoaminRog said:


> Possibly a stupid question BUT have you got refillable bottles or are you trying to refill an EXCHANGABLE bottle?


It cannot be a stupid question because I was going to ask it as well Rog


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## Wooie1958 (Jan 26, 2018)

If you say whereabouts you are in the UK someone will come on and tell you where it can be done.

If you are anywhere near Leyland / Preston in Lancashire Morrisons allows it.

*Morrisons,  Olympian Way,  Leyland.  PR25 3UR.  01772 426387*


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## RoaminRog (Jan 26, 2018)

The OP is offline now.
So many people trying to help.


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## Wooie1958 (Jan 26, 2018)

Gaslow actually sell Direct Fill Cylinders   http://www.gaslowdirect.com/Gaslow-11kg-Direct-Fill-Cylinder-Kit

The majority of garages *will not* allow you to fill those.


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## Canalsman (Jan 26, 2018)

Correct.

Direct connection to a bottle is not permitted. It must have a remote filling point which may be inside the locker or fitted to the exterior of the vehicle.


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## colinm (Jan 26, 2018)

***** said:


> The opening poster did say in post 4 that it is from Gaslow!



Never assume anything, I've tried getting a definitive answer as to if it is a complete Gaslow system fitted in the van, the OP hasn't given an answer that confirms this.


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## Tezza33 (Jan 26, 2018)

***** said:


> The opening poster did say in post 4 that it is from Gaslow!


The way I read it he said he bought a 'filling adaptor' in his opening post, when someone asked him where from he said Gaslow, he didn't make it clear but it could still be just the adaptor he bought



> Hi, Can someone teii me were you can fill LPG bottles up, *as just bought filling adapter* and been to local garage and told that it's not allowed to fill LPG bottles at a garage.





> Have you got a system off the likes of Gaslow, or an eBay cheapy?





> Hi, it's from gaslow


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## maingate (Jan 26, 2018)

POI Admin said:


> Correct.
> 
> Direct connection to a bottle is not permitted. It must have a remote filling point which may be inside the locker or fitted to the exterior of the vehicle.



Strictly speaking, Shell garages usually have a big sign near the LPG pump to state that no bottle can be filled. It makes no distinction whether it is a refillable or not. If it is bottle shaped, it cannot be filled. My local Shell garage has one and I was refused a fill several years ago. The old chap who was the Forecourt Assistant stopped me but he is long gone and I have had no problem since. I would go to the effort of taking a photo of the sign but at the moment the garage is closed for a major refurbishment, so you will just have to take my word for it until it opens again.


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## Deleted member 58274 (Jan 26, 2018)

*Gasit*

...me confused....if I buy a "gasit" refillable bottle.....can I just open locker door and refill....or do I have to drag the thing out to convince someone it's not an exchangeable....  ????  Maja


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## Canalsman (Jan 26, 2018)

In four years with the fill connection inside the locker door I have been questioned once.

When the cashier looked at the installation she was satisfied and allowed me to fill.

It really isn't an issue. I would prefer to have the connection clean, dry and safe inside the locker, and not to have to cut holes in the bodywork.


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## Canalsman (Jan 26, 2018)

maingate said:


> Strictly speaking, Shell garages usually have a big sign near the LPG pump to state that no bottle can be filled. It makes no distinction whether it is a refillable or not. If it is bottle shaped, it cannot be filled. My local Shell garage has one and I was refused a fill several years ago. The old chap who was the Forecourt Assistant stopped me but he is long gone and I have had no problem since. I would go to the effort of taking a photo of the sign but at the moment the garage is closed for a major refurbishment, so you will just have to take my word for it until it opens again.



Individual suppliers can set their own policies. I regularly fill at Shell and I've never seen a prohibition notice or been challenged.


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## Canalsman (Jan 26, 2018)

UKLPG issued a User Information Sheet in 2011 which can be found here:

www.uklpg.org/uploads/DOC4E7749E87E660.pdf


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## MykCamper (Jan 26, 2018)

Minisorella said:


> From what I've read on threads in the past, there's general disapproval of refilling a bottle with an adapter directly on the bottle... perceived safety issue AFAIK.  If you have a refillable system with an external filler point, you'll be fine at most lpg/autogas pumps.
> 
> When my system was fitted, I was told to be sure to have the filler point on the outside of the van and not fitted inside the gas bottle door because, even though it's legit, if a garage sees you open a door to get at the fill, they'll assume you're using an adapter.



Yep, had aggro in France with a locker fill!
Fitted an outside fill last summer, no more hassle, no where!:scared:


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## Canalsman (Jan 26, 2018)

Chainsaw Charlie said:


> Again advice from those with a vested interest



Maybe so but these are the guidelines followed by suppliers in the UK so do have some authority. The guidelines have been drawn up in conjunction with the HSE so I suggest are not biased.


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## RoaminRog (Jan 26, 2018)

The OP keeps logging in without answering any questions. Charnock, please answer post No 12.We are all trying to help you!


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## TJBi (Jan 27, 2018)

POI Admin said:


> In four years with the fill connection inside the locker door I have been questioned once.
> 
> When the cashier looked at the installation she was satisfied and allowed me to fill.
> 
> It really isn't an issue. I would prefer to have the connection clean, dry and safe inside the locker, and not to have to cut holes in the bodywork.



How about your diesel filler Chris?


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## Deleted member 58274 (Jan 27, 2018)

Wooie1958 said:


> If you say whereabouts you are in the UK someone will come on and tell you where it can be done.
> 
> If you are anywhere near Leyland / Preston in Lancashire Morrisons allows it.
> 
> *Morrisons,  Olympian Way,  Leyland.  PR25 3UR.  01772 426387*



Hi Wooie, does that Morrisons allow filling of the bottle in the locker....as in without connector on outside of van ? Cheers Mark


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## Deleted member 62288 (Jan 27, 2018)

As I understand this issue, I believe that it relates to the fact that there is a maximum fill level allowed for portable gas bottles - I think that the max is somewhere around 80% of the max capacity. 

This 80% gives a safety margin for external influences like temperature and atmospheric pressures.
There is a difference between the atmospheric pressure at sea level against a few thousand metres up a mountain. 

I have a Gaslow system fitted that has guages and is configured to only fill to the maximum allowed capacity leaving room inside the bottle for the contents to be able to expand and contract safely.

I've seen a few adaptors that allow a standard bottle to be refilled by connecting the pump directly to the gas bottle tap. This will allow the bottle to be filled 100% leaving a bottle full of liquid gas with no expansion room. I suppose that you can guess the fill-level but that is not an option that I would personally choose.

I personally would not want that level of risk.

I've had plenty of incidences where the forecourt staff have held up the pump activation until they have walked over to the vehicle and checked the gas installation is acceptable (permanent installation inside the vehicle) and not a loose bottle being refilled.

I'm sure that we have someone who is actually qualified in LPG matters that could clarify, I would welcome a definitive answer.


james


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## runnach (Jan 27, 2018)

wobblyjim said:


> As I understand this issue, I believe that it relates to the fact that there is a maximum fill level allowed for portable gas bottles - I think that the max is somewhere around 80% of the max capacity.
> 
> This 80% gives a safety margin for external influences like temperature and atmospheric pressures.
> There is a difference between the atmospheric pressure at sea level against a few thousand metres up a mountain.
> ...


You pretty much sum up the situation , Industry watchdogs could be seen to be offered self regulation through codes of practice in lieu of legislation, Alternative view point to "protecting industry" which some are convinced is the reason

On a Caravan forum I am part of, this question often gets asked the answers are atrocious bordering on misunderstanding and madness. On that basis alone I can see legislation introduced.

Channa


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## Minisorella (Jan 27, 2018)

wobblyjim said:


> *snip*
> 
> I personally would not want that level of risk.
> 
> ...



I would never risk it either... I'm a poor judge of how much is left in my bottles at the best of times! I know a few people who've somehow always managed to get away with directly filling a gas bottle via an adapter but it doesn't make it sensible. Both your points above are cast-iron reasons why a fixed system with an external fill point is the best solution... both for safety and to avoid hassle. 
LPG can be tricky to find sometimes, so being turned away from the only supply for miles is just one throw of the dice too many for me :wacko:


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## vwalan (Jan 27, 2018)

wobblyjim said:


> As I understand this issue, I believe that it relates to the fact that there is a maximum fill level allowed for portable gas bottles - I think that the max is somewhere around 80% of the max capacity.
> 
> This 80% gives a safety margin for external influences like temperature and atmospheric pressures.
> There is a difference between the atmospheric pressure at sea level against a few thousand metres up a mountain.
> ...



the pumps you use for filling should or normally have a pressure sensor that cuts the pump off at 90% so you should never be able to 100% fill. 
the weight of the empty bottle should be stamped on the bottle tare weight . convert 1kg is about 2 litres so its not difficult to get it right. alweays start from empty bottle if you cant do tyhe rithmatic . carry scales to weigh a part full bottle . reimo etc sell nice spring balance gas bottle weighing scales . 
but even then in some countries there is no lpg at garages etc . 
depends where you might want to travel. over the years in spain exchanging a bottle is cheaper than lpg. at the pumps . also how long you are going for . all make life different for all. 
even some garages wont let you fill anything if you are in a m,home .


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## Deleted member 58274 (Jan 27, 2018)

*So much to consider !!*

Gosh...I thought this would be simple ! Having ruled out an eBay adapter for exchangeable bottles (much too dangerous!!) I thought Ahh, a refillable gasit was the answer. Then I read this thread LOL   What's the point of a refillable bottle that you are not allowed to refill ? Well, when I say that I mean, as Jenny says "not guaranteed to be allowed to refill and miles to next station" ...fully understand that !! Yet others say no worries if connector mounted separate from bottle. However, then there's the issue of wether the connector is inside the locker door or mounted on the outside of van as many say is the only way to go.
Right, how about I get a refillable bottle and see how stations are when I try to use there facility ? I can always move onto the separate connector if no joy...Maja


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## Deleted member 9849 (Jan 27, 2018)

maja07 said:


> Gosh...I thought this would be simple ! Having ruled out an eBay adapter for exchangeable bottles (much too dangerous!!) I thought Ahh, a refillable gasit was the answer. Then I read this thread LOL   What's the point of a refillable bottle that you are not allowed to refill ? Well, when I say that I mean, as Jenny says "not guaranteed to be allowed to refill and miles to next station" ...fully understand that !! Yet others say no worries if connector mounted separate from bottle. However, then there's the issue of wether the connector is inside the locker door or mounted on the outside of van as many say is the only way to go.
> Right, how about I get a refillable bottle and see how stations are when I try to use there facility ? I can always move onto the separate connector if no joy...Maja



I'm pleased you have ruled out the e bay adapter,that is definitely not the way to go.Refillable bottles with the auto cut off at 80% full is.

The vast majority of garages will allow you to fill a proprietary refillable bottle whether it has an external filler or not in my personal experience.I have a 60 litre refillable lpg tank which is fitted inside a storage locker with no external fill point.I have to open the locker door and put it on the latch to fill it up with lpg.In practise it means I have to place the filler gun onto the tank filler point and fill it up with the locker door latched open.It's quite obvious to anyone watching that I'm filling the tank without an external fill point.I have never been stopped or had a problem with filling the tank all over the UK and Europe in the last 6 years.


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## Caz (Jan 27, 2018)

maingate said:


> Strictly speaking, Shell garages usually have a big sign near the LPG pump to state that no bottle can be filled. It makes no distinction whether it is a refillable or not. If it is bottle shaped, it cannot be filled. My local Shell garage has one and I was refused a fill several years ago. The old chap who was the Forecourt Assistant stopped me but he is long gone and I have had no problem since. I would go to the effort of taking a photo of the sign but at the moment the garage is closed for a major refurbishment, so you will just have to take my word for it until it opens again.



When it opens again, you will probably find it doesn't do LPG anymore. That's what has happened to all the service stations in this area when they have been refurbished.


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## vwalan (Jan 27, 2018)

Caz said:


> When it opens again, you will probably find it doesn't do LPG anymore. That's what has happened to all the service stations in this area when they have been refurbished.



it does seem like fuel garages are doing away with lpg pumps . its a way of making it hard to get rid of petrol and diesel powered vehicles . its a sort of fingers up to the gvt.


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## Canalsman (Jan 27, 2018)

TJBi said:


> How about your diesel filler Chris?



Qué?


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## rugbyken (Jan 28, 2018)

one of the many positives of a refillable system whether it be gaslo gasit or autogas is there is no need to wait till the bottle is empty to top up , i have 2x11kg gaslo the first bottle ran out 3 day’s ago after 18days use so within a fortnight prob only 5 day’s as i cross into portugal i will refill both bottles just like topping up a fuel tank,


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## 2cv (Jan 28, 2018)

I use FillLPG.co.uk - Your LPG Filling station map as it is kept very up to date, with prices. Never had a problem finding somewhere to fill and installation cost has now been recouped. Also, never been questioned when refilling.


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## charnock (Jan 28, 2018)

RoaminRog said:


> Possibly a stupid question BUT have you got refillable bottles or are you trying to refill an EXCHANGABLE bottle?



Hi, Sorry for late reply!!! I was trying to refill a refilable bottle, after reading replies I have now decided to get a on board lpg tank kit.
Cheers Kev


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## RoaminRog (Jan 28, 2018)

charnock said:


> Hi, Sorry for late reply!!! I was trying to refill a refilable bottle, after reading replies I have now decided to get a on board lpg tank kit.
> Cheers Kev



Overall, that’s a very good idea Kev, and one that you wont regret. Expensive initially, but you’ll soon start to see savings and convenience.


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## charnock (Jan 28, 2018)

Thanks for all your helpful replies!!!!
Cheers Kev


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## johnmac185 (Jan 28, 2018)

Caz said:


> When it opens again, you will probably find it doesn't do LPG anymore. That's what has happened to all the service stations in this area when they have been refurbished.



Which area would that be Caz!!!!


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## molly 2 (Jan 29, 2018)

The gaslow on bottle filler should be filled at suppliers like country wide,  not petrol stations  a list of suppliers are on there websites.


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