# Delica  -  the next challenge  - help please me re weight issues



## delicagirl

Hi one and all.  I got the van back, a new slave cylinder having been fitted -  luvely jubbly - she's running like a dream again.   So  since the van was fairly empty,  no water, clothes, books, food, no "stuff"  - and only half a tank of diesel  I thought I would get it weighed as I haven't done this before.

There are no weights AT ALL on my logbook and it's body type is described as a "MPV", and taxation class as a "Private/light goods(PLG)"
Cylinder capacity is 2500 cc, fuel is heavy oil, number of seats incl driver  = 8  (!!!!), and a 2 axle rigid body but no revenue weight. 

The van weighed in at  2490  gross weight.    The really helpful guy there looked my van up on the internet and then physically searched the usual places in the van for a weight plate and could  not find one.  (I have looked before and also failed to find one.)

He informed me that I have only 10 kgs spare for fuel, food, water etc etc.   and suggested I contact DVLA and have a conversation.  He did tell me that he had once weighed a horse carrying vehicle  which only had enough spare capacity to carry a cat but not a horse !!!! That owner had to have the vehicle upweighted. 

So if I do have to ring DVLA   (or can I do this by internet/post?) what should I ask them and how do I go about getting this number of 2500kgs  up to 3500kgs.?

I have never felt unsafe or unstable when driving this van  except in exceptionally high winds on Shap one winter's day  - but then all high sided vehicles are subjected to this.   But if I were to be stopped, how would the police know my "legal weight" if it is not on my log book nor, presumably, on DVLA database ?  

Another aspect to this weight issue is my water tank  -   you folks kindly gave me a lot to think about re my water capacity on an earlier thread, and it has been on my mind since then.   So I measured the main tank  -  it's  27" across,  19.5" deep, and  10" high -  can anyone work out its capacity and weight  in kilos for me please ?   Thank you very much. 
Many thanks people


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## Nesting Zombie

Hi ya,
Try 'S V Tech'
Very helpful guys, I've just done the up rate from 4000kg to 4500kg, Very quick, Very easy.


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## Canalsman

The tank is about 90 litres, or 90kg weight when full.

The operating weights for the vehicle would normally be contained within the handbook. As far as I'm aware only commercial vehicles carry a plate.


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## delicagirl

POI Admin said:


> The tank is about 90 litres, or 90kg weight when full.
> 
> The operating weights for the vehicle would normally be contained within the handbook. As far as I'm aware only commercial vehicles carry a plate.





Thank you -  that's a lot less water than I was told I carried, so that's another thing I now know.  I have never been able to find a handbook on-line.   The van was made in Japan 1993 and is based on a Mitsubishi 2.5 diesel flat bed truck  and was imported to UK for the first time in 2014.


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## Nesting Zombie

Pop the Bonnet, You should have one of these 
Dropbox - IMAG1236.jpg
From that the Conversation people should then fit one of these
Dropbox - IMAG1235.jpg
And then when you 'Up Rate' you should get yet another one to stick on


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## colinm

All vehicles have a plate afaik.
Sounds to me " you've been tango'ed", it may well be why the tyre burst.
Svtech are probably the most knowledgeable company that can advise on up lifting max weight.


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## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> Hi one and all.  I got the van back, a new slave cylinder having been fitted -  luvely jubbly - she's running like a dream again.   So  since the van was fairly empty,  no water, clothes, books, food, no "stuff"  - and only half a tank of diesel  I thought I would get it weighed as I haven't done this before.
> 
> There are no weights AT ALL on my logbook and it's body type is described as a "MPV", and taxation class as a "Private/light goods(PLG)"
> Cylinder capacity is 2500 cc, fuel is heavy oil, number of seats incl driver  = 8  (!!!!), and a 2 axle rigid body but no revenue weight.
> 
> The van weighed in at  2490  gross weight.    The really helpful guy there looked my van up on the internet and then physically searched the usual places in the van for a weight plate and could  not find one.  (I have looked before and also failed to find one.)
> 
> He informed me that I have only 10 kgs spare for fuel, food, water etc etc.   and suggested I contact DVLA and have a conversation.  He did tell me that he had once weighed a horse carrying vehicle  which only had enough spare capacity to carry a cat but not a horse !!!! That owner had to have the vehicle upweighted.
> 
> So if I do have to ring DVLA   (or can I do this by internet/post?) what should I ask them and how do I go about getting this number of 2500kgs  up to 3500kgs.?
> 
> I have never felt unsafe or unstable when driving this van  except in exceptionally high winds on Shap one winter's day  - but then all high sided vehicles are subjected to this.   But if I were to be stopped, how would the police know my "legal weight" if it is not on my log book nor, presumably, on DVLA database ?
> 
> Another aspect to this weight issue is my water tank  -   you folks kindly gave me a lot to think about re my water capacity on an earlier thread, and it has been on my mind since then.   So I measured the main tank  -  it's  27" across,  19.5" deep, and  10" high -  can anyone work out its capacity and weight  in kilos for me please ?   Thank you very much.
> Many thanks people



What I am not understanding is if there is no plate on the van, and there is no revenue weight on the V5C, where does the "2500kg" number originate from?
It sounds like he has made an assumption that it is 2500 and said you have 10kg spare, but on what basis?

You can go to specialist companies and get a vehicle replated, but I don't know what tests are needed that they do.
The DVLA will want a certificate from that company to record it, but if it is an MPV, I don't think a GVW is recorded on the V5C.  
I don't have one on my V5C, but interestingly I do have a plate on the vehicle itself giving the GVW and train weight. I think that is a consequence of my "MPV" being a commercial base (VW T5)

ps. The water tank... Think the calcualtion is w x d x l in mm equals capacity in ml, so convert inches to mm, do the sums, then divide by 1,000 and that is the capacity in Litres, and one litre of water = 1kg

HTH.


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## sak

I just googled Mitsubishi Delica gross weight hoping for you the guy was wrong but unfortunately it says 2505kgs as the gross weight, 2050kgs as the kerb/unladen weight so as the vehicle would be weighed with a driver you are always overloaded, sorry for the bad news.


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## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> All vehicles have a plate afaik.
> Sounds to me " you've been tango'ed", *it may well be why the tyre burst.*
> Svtech are probably the most knowledgeable company that can advise on up lifting max weight.



Hi Coli - do you mean the tyre could have burst because I may have been over-weight (albeit without realising it)  ?


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## harrow

delicagirl said:


> Hi one and all.  I got the van back, a new slave cylinder having been fitted -  luvely jubbly - she's running like a dream again.   So  since the van was fairly empty,  no water, clothes, books, food, no "stuff"  - and only half a tank of diesel  I thought I would get it weighed as I haven't done this before.
> 
> There are no weights AT ALL on my logbook and it's body type is described as a "MPV", and taxation class as a "Private/light goods(PLG)"
> Cylinder capacity is 2500 cc, fuel is heavy oil, number of seats incl driver  = 8  (!!!!), and a 2 axle rigid body but no revenue weight.
> 
> The van weighed in at  2490  gross weight.    The really helpful guy there looked my van up on the internet and then physically searched the usual places in the van for a weight plate and could  not find one.  (I have looked before and also failed to find one.)
> 
> He informed me that I have only 10 kgs spare for fuel, food, water etc etc.   and suggested I contact DVLA and have a conversation.  He did tell me that he had once weighed a horse carrying vehicle  which only had enough spare capacity to carry a cat but not a horse !!!! That owner had to have the vehicle upweighted.
> 
> So if I do have to ring DVLA   (or can I do this by internet/post?) what should I ask them and how do I go about getting this number of 2500kgs  up to 3500kgs.?
> 
> I have never felt unsafe or unstable when driving this van  except in exceptionally high winds on Shap one winter's day  - but then all high sided vehicles are subjected to this.   But if I were to be stopped, how would the police know my "legal weight" if it is not on my log book nor, presumably, on DVLA database ?
> 
> Another aspect to this weight issue is my water tank  -   you folks kindly gave me a lot to think about re my water capacity on an earlier thread, and it has been on my mind since then.   So I measured the main tank  -  it's  27" across,  19.5" deep, and  10" high -  can anyone work out its capacity and weight  in kilos for me please ?   Thank you very much.
> Many thanks people



On the mot database Details of the vehicle being checked - GOV.UK does it have a Revenue weight ? You need to put in your registration and vehicle maker.


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## delicagirl

sak said:


> I just googled Mitsubishi Delica gross weight hoping for you the guy was wrong but unfortunately it says 2505kgs as the gross weight, 2050kgs as the kerb/unladen weight so as the vehicle would be weighed with a driver you are always overloaded, sorry for the bad news.




Thank you Sak  - my delica is not the usual delica  -  If you google photos of it - you wont find it, because only a few hundred of these were made.   There is a photo in my profile here on WC.   I believe it is an L300 on  a  J500 base.  This wee van has been a challenge since I owned it !!!

But  I am already chasing up leads from here....   but all further suggestions are really welcome


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## harrow

delicagirl said:


> it's body type is described as a "MPV", and taxation class as a "Private/light goods(PLG)"
> Cylinder capacity is 2500 cc, fuel is heavy oil, number of seats incl driver  = 8  (!!!!), and a 2 axle rigid body but no revenue weight.
> The van weighed in at  2490  gross weight.



Number of seats = 8, I guess there is some past history about that.

The only real way to calculate the carrying capacity will be according to what chassis, suspension, tyres etc that it currently has fitted.

I know that will be very difficult to answer, sorry.


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## delicagirl

harrow said:


> On the mot database Details of the vehicle being checked - GOV.UK does it have a Revenue weight ? You need to put in your registration and vehicle maker.



No -  the  revenue weight is not available  -  presumably this is why it is not on my log book V5


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## Nesting Zombie

Just a thought reference Tyre bursting.
Tyres on our type of vehicles, that are 'Fully Laden' ALL of the time only realisticly have a working life of say 4 / 5 years irrespective of miles traveld. Yes ofcourse there will be exceptions, but it's a rule of thumb type thing.
Just replaced ALL 7  of my tyres after having two blow outs in 3 months !


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## izwozral

Give these guys a ring, Google, they do the weight up-rating. It can be done by post but if you were ever travelling up to the dark satanic hills, I would pop into Leyland where they are based.


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## mark61

sak said:


> I just googled Mitsubishi Delica gross weight hoping for you the guy was wrong but unfortunately it says 2505kgs as the gross weight, 2050kgs as the kerb/unladen weight so as the vehicle would be weighed with a driver you are always overloaded, sorry for the bad news.




Unfortunately not as easy as that. The model "Delicia" covers such a huge range of vehicles over a long time span. 

Can we have a picture please, or link to a picture. I know I saw a pic of it recently.

I'm sure it's based on a L300, could also be called an Express in NZ & Australia.

Looking in the various places where a chassis plate would normally be found, does it look like one has been removed?


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## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Hi Coli - do you mean the tyre could have burst because I have clearly been over-weight (albeit without realising it)  ?



If you where overloaded and the tyres where not inflated enough and/or never had the capacity, it's quite possible for them to burst.
What you need to ask yourself, where they new or old, if old what condition where they in, what size and load index did they have and what pressure was in then.


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## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> What I am not understanding is if there is no plate on the van, and there is no revenue weight on the V5C, where does the "2500kg" number originate from?
> *It sounds like he has made an assumption that it is 2500 and said you have 10kg spare, but on what basis*?
> 
> You can go to specialist companies and get a vehicle replated, but I don't know what tests are needed that they do.
> The DVLA will want a certificate from that company to record it, but if it is an MPV, I don't think a GVW is recorded on the V5C.
> I don't have one on my V5C, but interestingly I do have a plate on the vehicle itself giving the GVW and train weight. I think that is a consequence of my "MPV" being a commercial base (VW T5)
> 
> ps. The water tank... Think the calcualtion is w x d x l in mm equals capacity in ml, so convert inches to mm, do the sums, then divide by 1,000 and that is the capacity in Litres, and one litre of water = 1kg
> 
> HTH.




When he said "it should be 2500 kgs max  - I asked if  the max weight on a vehicle was the same as the cc of the engine and he said 'yes'....  - now that  I think about that...   it makes no sense.  Maybe I should take it to another public weighbridge and see what their observations are. 
But in the meantime I am contacting SV Tech and asking them for advice.   I am up in lancashire in a few weeks so could call in to see them as my van is a real oddball -  bit like me really !!


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## Nesting Zombie

I don't know what the fudge is going on ere, but I've posted about 7 or 8 posts today and similar yesterday not blinking one has appeared, so sorry,,,,but I give up.

Hope you get it sorted anyway.


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## izwozral

You may find this useful too: http://www.wildcamping.co.uk/forums.../45707-sv-tech-weight-change-word-advice.html


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## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Unfortunately not as easy as that. The model "Delicia" covers such a huge range of vehicles over a long time span.
> 
> Can we have a picture please, or link to a picture. I know I saw a pic of it recently.
> 
> I'm sure it's based on a L300, could also be called an Express in NZ & Australia.
> 
> Looking in the various places where a chassis plate would normally be found, does it look like one has been removed?



I am not 100% sure if it is an L300 ....


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## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> If you where overloaded and the tyres where not inflated enough and/or never had the capacity, it's quite possible for them to burst.
> What you need to ask yourself, where they new or old, if old what condition where they in, what size and load index did they have and what pressure was in then.




The heavy duty, deep-tread tyres were on this 4WD vehicle when I bought it , in 2014. They have been frequently inspected, and the van was fairly recently MOTd, and my garage checked then again before I left on my 5000 mile trip this summer. All of them are the same size, although I established yesterday not all  made by the same manufacturers, and all at the same pressure  - which my local tyre depot established for me.  I admit I did not check them while I was away.  The spare which is now on the rear passenger side is a brand new £84 tyre.


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## Canalsman

The chassis number or VIN should identify precisely what the model is ...

You could email Mitsubishi in Japan providing that information and ask them to confirm the model and full specifications.


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## Tbear

Surely if you increase the weight limit by 40%, you have to change the tyres, suspension and brakes. Not just a paperwork exercise.

Richard


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## mark61

Still sure it's on a L300 cab & chassis, but finding any useful info is hard.

There are a few very similar models on MH classifieds in South Africa, New Zealand and Australia, haven't come across any weights yet.

Not much help, but it appears a very similar version is still available in the Philippines. Not that the tech info is of much use to you. 

L300 - Mitsubishi Motors Philippines Corporation


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## izwozral

SvTech also advise on this too Richard but they do need the correct vehicle model and specifications in the first instance. When I enquired about up-rating my MH, I needed no work to the suspension or brakes as they were still within the parameters. Some vehicles do need changes though as you suggest.


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## Nesting Zombie

Tbear said:


> Surely if you increase the weight limit by 40%, you have to change the tyres, suspension and brakes. Not just a paperwork exercise.
> 
> Richard



It depends on the Axel, Suspension, Breaks & Tyers. But YES, it honestly CAN be just a paper exercise, mine was !.


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## Nesting Zombie

Does anyone know if I've been Banned, Blocked or something, Bone of my posts are being posted until the Threads I answer are over or Finnishd !.
Waste of time


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## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> Does anyone know if I've been Banned, Blocked or something, Bone of my posts are being posted until the Threads I answer are over or Finnishd !.
> Waste of time




some forums are for paid up members only - I don't know if that is anything to do with anything ....


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## Nesting Zombie

Thanks for the replies guys.
Oh,,Ok,,I talk a load of rubbish anyway, So will just 'Hover on the side' lol lol.


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## r4dent

wildebus said:


> Think the calcualtion [sic] is w x d x l in mm equals capacity in ml, so convert inches to mm, do the sums, then divide by 1,000 and that is the capacity in Litres, and one litre of water = 1kg HTH.



I think it is convert inches to* cm* , 
then multiply w x d x l to give cc                                       n.b. a cc (cubic centimeter) is the same as a ml (millilitre). 

That makes the tank just over 80 litres.

Your method makes it 80,000 litres. 80 tonnes of water now that would cause a tyre to burst.


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## runnach

Total assumption on my part, but here is my thoughts looking at the van too

L300 equates to a 3000 kgs Gross weight ?

If that is the case you have 500 kgs load. 

If it is a J500 as you believe, is the 500 related to its carrying capacity which seems to be 500 kgs.

The van doesn't seem that much smaller than a "normal" coachbuilt that are normally plated at 3500 kgs gross. Pro rata my mad little theory works ?

Channa


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## mark61

Came across this old eBay ad.

May be worth trying to contact him. 


MITSUBISHI L300 4X4 CAMPERVAN EXPEDITION MOTORHOME MONSTER TRUCK WINCH, ETC | eBay


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## delicagirl

r4dent said:


> I think it is convert inches to* cm* ,
> then multiply w x d x l to give cc                                       n.b. a cc (cubic centimeter) is the same as a ml (millilitre).
> 
> That makes the tank just over 80 litres.
> 
> Your method makes it 80,000 litres. 80 tonnes of water now that would cause a tyre to burst.




You caught me out  guys - I hadn't got round to doing the math as yet...   (I'm chronically awful at math !!)  -  and kindly you have done so for me.

Update  - I got back to the Public Weighbridge man and asked him on what basis he thought I was a 2.5 ton truck...  he was judging it on his own previous experience and not on any factual evidence.   So we agreed we weren't sure.

So I then contacted Mitsubishi in Bristol and a guy in their part dept  said they only made 3.5ton and 7ton trucks  - but he has taken my VIN number and will continue researching for me next week.    So if I am a 3.5 tonner  I am ok to fill my boots  !!!!   -   well fill my water tanks anyway. 

Every new minor thing is a major challenge with this van !!!      Hey ho..   that's the joy of vanning and problem solving with the aid of WCers....

have a good weekend one and all


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## mark61

Thats good, VIN number should tell all.

He is probably talking about the Canter range, being between 3.5 and 7 Tonnes.


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## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Came across this old eBay ad.
> 
> May be worth trying to contact him.
> 
> 
> MITSUBISHI L300 4X4 CAMPERVAN EXPEDITION MOTORHOME MONSTER TRUCK WINCH, ETC | eBay




I know this van and the guy who owned it.  It appears identical to mine, and it used to be. But he then raised the suspension several inches at the back and cut part of  the rear habitation box out, to enable bigger tyres to be used, and add all sorts of fancy off-road heavy duty stuff to it.

But I wouldn't trust him - he charged me £750 to fit a solar panel and inverter !!

I don't know if he knows the exact model number either.


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## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Thats good, VIN number should tell all.
> 
> He is probably talking about the Canter range, being between 3.5 and 7 Tonnes.



Thanks Mark - he also gave me a classification code -   "yond"    -  but he didn't know what that meant and neither do I !! 

Its two steps forward with this van, and one and 7/8ths back again !!


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## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> I know this van and the guy who owned it.  It appears identical to mine, and it used to be. But he then raised the suspension several inches at the back and cut part of  the rear habitation box out, to enable bigger tyres to be used, and add all sorts of fancy off-road heavy duty stuff to it.
> 
> But I wouldn't trust him - he charged me £750 to fit a solar panel and inverter !!
> 
> I don't know if he knows the exact model number either.



you could try mitsubishi in milton keynes . i have spoken a couple of times to a michael ambrosia i think his name was  on 01908 24500 he was in technical side . 
it was a few years ago but he was ok. and helpful.


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## Haaamster

Nesting Zombie said:


> Thanks for the replies guys.
> Oh,,Ok,,I talk a load of rubbish anyway, So will just 'Hover on the side' lol lol.



We all talk rubbish on here, its both expected and appreciated. No need to hover, join in.


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## delicagirl

Haaamster said:


> *We all talk rubbish on here*, its both expected and appreciated. No need to hover, join in.



some of its quite interesting  !!   and some is crackingly funny


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## Haaamster

Nesting Zombie said:


> Does anyone know if I've been Banned, Blocked or something, Bone of my posts are being posted until the Threads I answer are over or Finnishd !.
> Waste of time



Seen this mentioned before, send a message to Admin he will sort it.


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## runnach

mark61 said:


> Thats good, VIN number should tell all.
> 
> He is probably talking about the Canter range, being between 3.5 and 7 Tonnes.


 That could be another twist to this little conundrum for the canter range for a longtime in the UK were outsourced through Volvo truck and bus.

Good logic behind it all actually, Mitsubishi wanted a dealer network that thought like commercial people eg overnight servicing is the norm not the retail offering which is at odds for commercial users.

Volvo don't produce smaller commercials so the marriage worked (to an extent) 

Channa


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## yeoblade

delicagirl said:


> When he said "it should be 2500 kgs max  - I asked if  the max weight on a vehicle was the same as the cc of the engine and he said 'yes'....  - now that  I think about that...   it makes no sense.  Maybe I should take it to another public weighbridge and see what their observations are.
> But in the meantime I am contacting sv and asking them for advice.   I am up in lancashire in a few weeks so could call in to see them as m van is a real oddball -  bit like me really !!



Really, that makes my 2 seater sports car have a carrying capacity of 3.2 Tonnes. I think not. Biggest load of BS going



harrow said:


> Number of seats = 8, I guess there is some past history about that.
> 
> The only real way to calculate the carrying capacity will be according to what chassis, suspension, tyres etc that it currently has fitted.
> 
> I know that will be very difficult to answer, sorry.




Maybe a crew cab truck, with this original data being carried over from the importer.

As there is no official data on your conversion no one can tell you you're over weight. Don't dig a hole for yourself


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## delicagirl

stop  digging  -   good advice  -  that's why I've not contacted DVLA till I establish what's what.   

 I simply don't want to overload the van, that's all.    

The fact that my water tank holds half of what I believe it did, is a good thing to know, as I could possibly  take more books  - once we have established a safe load for me. 

The 8 seats include the 6 seats in the habitation area  - allowing it to be "marketed as a 6 berth"    -  NOT   -  unless we are talking 6 x 4 year olds.


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## Haaamster

Might be 6 normal sized Japanese people, they are very small.


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## delicagirl

Haaamster said:


> Might be 6 normal sized Japanese people, they are very small.



if that comment is an    ....ist"   of some sort, its still jolly funny !!!

Trying to imagine 6 sleeping bodies in my van and one needing a mid-night pee - would make a Mr Bean sketch any day !!!


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## vwalan

canters were first made in 1963 . although mitsubishi fuso have been around since1931 . 
forget the volvo bit they were only handlers . most canters in the eu are made in portugal at tramagal. 
although even more have been made in casablanca and they make the coaches there as well.


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## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> canters were first made in 1963 . although mitsubishi fuso have been around since1931 .
> forget the volvo bit they were only handlers . most canters in the eu are made in portugal at tramagal.
> although even more have been made in casablanca and they make the coaches there as well.



mitsubishi fuso is a choice of model on DVLA wegsite when searching for a vehicle  -  delica is not there.


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## Haaamster

delicagirl said:


> if that comment is an    ....ist"   of some sort, its still jolly funny !!!
> 
> Trying to imagine 6 sleeping bodies in my van and one needing a mid-night pee - would make a Mr Bean sketch any day !!!



Well it certainly wasn't meant as an ist and it's true they are very small, well all the one's I've met have been. I actually really like the Japanese and how different their culture is, well except the one's that kill all the whales of course I don't really like them.


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## izwozral

Can you identify your MH from the contained Mitsubishi Delica - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lots of reading but you should get your payload from it.


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## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> Can you identify your MH from the contained Mitsubishi Delica - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> Lots of reading but you should get your payload from it.



No Izzy  its not there.    The front of my truck is not similar to any of the photos on this site  -  even going back to the 1970's, so I can only surmise that it was customised by a previous owner.  In between my two main headlights is a full width grill, and also another 2/3rds width grill under that.   My front bumper is different to all those in the pictures, and I have now spotted  2 bilateral orange lights on the front  (one above the number plate) that I  never knew I had !!!!!  I'll  have a play with those tomorrow.


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## pughed2

*weight issues*

hello delica,...........have I missed something?..........cannot understand why you are getting bogged down in such issues. If it was my van, I would have to bang it in for trade in and get something where its all sorted, even if it meant a mortgage

Is it a misubishi delica?..........it might well have been customised, but it must have been something original originally. One thing I would not do is pester the DVLA about it, knowing this country, you might find you got something which should not see daylight on the road...........get back on the road and enjoy..........steve bristol


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## delicagirl

pughed2 said:


> hello delica,...........have I missed something?..........cannot understand why you are getting bogged down in such issues. If it was my van, I would have to bang it in for trade in and get something where its all sorted, even if it meant a mortgage
> 
> Is it a misubishi delica?..........it might well have been customised, but it must have been something original originally.* One thing I would not do is pester the DVLA about it,* knowing this country, you might find you got something which should not see daylight on the road...........get back on the road and enjoy..........steve bristol




After reading everyone's contribution to this thread, there is no way I will talk to DVLA unless absolutely necessary.

I guess you think I am a bit of a worry-box Steve - I guess I am -  probably because I travel alone to isolated places, and I need to feel my vehicle is as safe as it can be.  I have spent a lot on this van, and I love it, because its 4WD, is just the right size for me, and fully self contained, and I plan to keep it for a long time.  My local garage assure me it is in good condition and capable of another 100,000 miles.

Yes it is a Mitsubishi as far as I know - that's what it says in the log book.

Steve -  thanks for your concern   -  but i don't want any more debt and yes  - I cant wait to get back on the road  - I have used it a great deal and will do so again twice before the end of this month !!!   

Being the non tecchie that I am -  I'm sure no one here would want me to start all over again asking  the same questions about a different van next month -  there would be mass demands for the return of the GROAN button !!!!


----------



## sak

*Mitsubishi L300 Motorhome*


 Does this look like yours ?


----------



## delicagirl

sak said:


> View attachment 46346 Does this look like yours ?




it is quite similar but not identical !!!   That one looks longer than mine  (its roof comes down at the point where mine probably ends.)  Mine has a front window in the above-cab bed,  my hab door is  nearer the front of the van - but the headlights are the same.

My hab box was built in Germany and so its different to this one.  

Thanks for looking.   My van piccie is in this thread, and also some more on my profile.


----------



## mark61

Getting there. The J500 you refer to, is actually JB500 and refers to the model of MH. So, a JB500 motorhome on a L300 4x4 cab & chassis.

Have you come across this thread?

Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 with JB500 body


----------



## vwalan

this one looks like yours . .you might have to scroll up or down ,but theres one looks like yours .
camper | JPN CAR NAME +FOR+SALE+JAPAN IS GOGLE BEST RESULT
scroll down several campers .


----------



## wildman

quote from another site may locate the makers plate.

_*look in front of the drivers seat there will be a flap in the carpet that is behind your knees when sat in the seat, lift that, your 'data plate' should be underneath*__*
*_


----------



## Polar Bear

A 100mm x 100mm x 100mm cube is 1 litre or 1 kilograme of fluid.

Have you tried going to your MOT station and asking them to put your details into the test computer? 

That should show all the details that are known about your motor.

The tester is encouraged to change some of this information on test to keep the database up to date.

If you ask him nicely he might put your van weight in as 3500kg.

Make sure your tyres can support that weight.

PS;
The MOT lads should have changed your seating number on the last test?


----------



## Byronic

I think the Delica model range was a model brought in as direct competition with the VW T25. Even looks a little like it.
The Mitzy 4X4 version was pitched against the T25 4x4 Synchro version.

The VW T25 range was the so called 1 tonne payload van, nominally 1 tonne because there was a bit of variation due to whether diesel or petrol versions etc. The van left the factory at around 1.5 tonnes so it was a 2.5 tonnes MAM designated van.

Karmann used to make a coachbuilt Ghia T25 version, but I'm almost certain they never upped the load capacity. It had a dismal load capacity I am sure of that. 

Alan may be able to confirm the above?


----------



## vwalan

Byronic said:


> I think the Delica model range was a model brought in as direct competition with the VW T25. Even looks a little like it.
> The Mitzy 4X4 version was pitched against the T25 4x4 Synchro version.
> 
> The VW T25 range was the so called 1 tonne payload van, nominally 1 tonne because there was a bit of variation due to whether diesel or petrol versions etc. The van left the factory at around 1.5 tonnes so it was a 2.5 tonnes MAM designated van.
> 
> Karmann used to make a coachbuilt Ghia T25 version, but I'm almost certain they never upped the load capacity. It had a dismal load capacity I am sure of that.
> 
> Alan may be able to confirm the above?



yes one ton with the van from empty . when converted not alot of payload . my brown one ran over weight all the time . 
the coach builds were hopeless for pay loads .


----------



## colinm

The L300 is a 2.5t van, looking at those photos (I know sometimes they can deceive) the rear axle appears to be heavily laden, if not overloaded.
On such a van you would expect to run 107 load index tyres, I'll take a wild guess at the load on back axle and say they should have been at 60psi.


----------



## Byronic

FWIW it looks to me like someone has taken a professional built body of some other donor van and grafted it on to the L300.They probably thought the combination would come in at about the max. plated weight allowed of 2.5 tonnes and conveniently chose to ignore any allowance for payload. Perhaps threw the plate away and hoped for no awkward questions at selling time, but this is all conjecture and perhaps doing as Post #59 turns up a better result.


----------



## trevskoda

Well my girl if nout in log book and cant find plate etc and no one knows then i would leave well alone as even the cops and doe w/bridge will never cotton on ,just use good h/duty tyres and drive till your we hart thumps like mad and have fun.:camper:


----------



## Canalsman

Is this like yours?

Mitsubishi Delica L300 4x4 Expedition Campervan Bugout Motorhome Monster Truck - YouTube


----------



## wildebus

colinmd said:


> The L300 is a 2.5t van, looking at those photos (I know sometimes they can deceive) the rear axle appears to be heavily laden, if not overloaded.
> On such a van you would expect to run 107 load index tyres, I'll take a wild guess at the load on back axle and say they should have been at 60psi.



Why would you need 107 tyres on a 2.5t van? Or are you saying this because of a probably overloaded axle?
Curious as the required tyres for my 3.0t vehicle is much lower then 107 at 103 for example. Something like a 98 would be easily adequate for 2.5t assuming the front-rear balance not massively unbalanced


----------



## andyjanet

Delicious,  it's a Mitsubishi l300 jb 500 there is a lot of photos on Internet I will do more research for you tomorrow is there not a weight plate near the passenger door shut? Andy


----------



## colinm

wildebus said:


> Why would you need 107 tyres on a 2.5t van? Or are you saying this because of a probably overloaded axle?
> Curious as the required tyres for my 3.0t vehicle is much lower then 107 at 103 for example. Something like a 98 would be easily adequate for 2.5t assuming the front-rear balance not massively unbalanced



You don't 'need' 107 tyres on a 2.5t van, but they are commonly specified by manufacturers, they easily accommodate up to 1.5t on an axle, 98 would need close to perfect balance which would be difficult to achieve on this vehicle.


----------



## FULL TIMER

it certainly looks as if it is based on the L300 all be it with a few panel mods such as the doors, bumper and grill maybe ,I would guess it started life as a people carrier hence the 8 seat  MPV designation, Yours won't be the first to have no weight plates quite a few American imports don't have them either.


----------



## izwozral

This doesn't help with the payload question but is further evidence [maybe] that is really is a pimped up version of the L300?



Mitsubishi L300 History:

The L300, manufactured by Mitsubishi Motors, is a Van (small truck) and has been in production since the late 1980's.

Production of the Mitsubishi Van began in the early 1970's, then called the Delica, but Mitsubishi eventually changed the van to the L300, while the Delica name went to the people mover vehicle, which had its own design.

Since 1986, the L300 has gone though just one generation, keeping the same design, *with updates on part of the interior and frontal exterior only*, as well as a few new features.

The van is available in Diesel and Petrol, but diesel has been far more popular. The same engines have remained since 1986, but with a few new variations with the petrol engines.

Diesel engines are available in 2.0ltr and the bigger sized engine, 2.5ltr (codenamed the 4D56), which was also available in the turbo engine (codenamed the 4D56T). The standard 4D56 produces 58kW @ 4000rpm, with the Turbo Diesel producing 68kW.


----------



## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> This doesn't help with the payload question but is further evidence [maybe] that is really is a *pimped up version of the L300?*
> 
> 
> 
> Mitsubishi L300 History:
> 
> The L300, manufactured by Mitsubishi Motors, is a Van (small truck) and has been in production since the late 1980's.
> 
> Production of the Mitsubishi Van began in the early 1970's, then called the Delica, but Mitsubishi eventually changed the van to the L300, while the Delica name went to the people mover vehicle, which had its own design.
> 
> Since 1986, the L300 has gone though just one generation, keeping the same design, *with updates on part of the interior and frontal exterior only*, as well as a few new features.
> 
> The van is available in Diesel and Petrol, but diesel has been far more popular. The same engines have remained since 1986, but with a few new variations with the petrol engines.
> 
> Diesel engines are available in 2.0ltr and the bigger sized engine, 2.5ltr (codenamed the 4D56), which was also available in the turbo engine (codenamed the 4D56T). The standard 4D56 produces 58kW @ 4000rpm, with the Turbo Diesel producing 68kW.




Thank you Izzy  -  could this be why my next door neighbours refer to me as "the tart next door" do you think ? :lol-061:

Thanks for all that info though..   every little helps as they say.

Having investigated the "grill" at the front of the van between the two headlights  - its not an airflow device of any sort, its just a bit of "pretty design" on the front of the panel which holds the headlights in place.


----------



## wildebus

My investigation team have noted this bit of information:
Mitsubishi - Delica (L400) - 2.5 TD (105 Hp) - Technical specifications, Fuel economy (consumption)

Don't know if above is relevant to your vehicle, as different regions have different specs, but matching ages (a K plate is issued for vehicles first registered between 1992-1993) and engine size, the Delica would appear to be an L400 base, not L300?


----------



## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Getting there. The J500 you refer to, is actually JB500 and refers to the model of MH. So, a JB500 motorhome on a L300 4x4 cab & chassis.
> 
> Have you come across this thread?
> 
> Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 with JB500 body




Thanks Mark and David  i compared the list of coding meanings on the Delica owners clip which you kindly posted, and the van vin number on my log book  -  the codings make my van a 2WD standard body, petrol - and the rest of my VIN number contains digits not on the list anyway...

so  another investigation which has not yielded extra info.

The VIN number in the van could well be under the drivers seat but i have not been able to find it - i have no carpet in the cab but i do have rubber matting/insulation and i dont want to rip all that out in case the cab then becomes too noisy. Later on i'll have a  go at lifting the drivers seat  to see if there is any info under it.  i have lifted passenger seat several times for oil-top up,  but have not yet lifted the drivers seat.

i seem to be drifting farther and farther away from the original conundrum of how much stuff i can carry in my van !!!   its all interesting stuff though


HOWEVER   -  i have just found a plate above the drivers wheel arch which is all in Japanese but which has  the figures 2.4 and 3.5 on it......   so  this looks hopeful - all i need now is a japanese reader to interpret for me...  and i could have my answer......


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> Thanks Mark and David  i compared the list of coding meanings on the Delica owners clip which you kindly posted, and the van vin number on my log book  -  the codings make my van a 2WD standard body, petrol - and the rest of my VIN number contains digits not on the list anyway...
> 
> so  another investigation which has not yielded extra info.
> 
> The VIN number in the van could well be under the drivers seat but i have not been able to find it - i have no carpet in the cab but i do have rubber matting/insulation and i dont want to rip all that out in case the cab then becomes too noisy. Later on i'll have a  go at lifting the drivers seat  to see if there is any info under it.  i have lifted passenger seat several times for oil-top up,  but have not yet lifted the drivers seat.
> 
> i seem to be drifting farther and farther away from the original conundrum of how much stuff i can carry in my van !!!   its all interesting stuff though
> 
> 
> HOWEVER   -  i have just found a plate above the drivers wheel arch which is all in Japanese but which has  the figures 2.4 and 3.5 on it......   so  this looks hopeful - all i need now is a japanese reader to interpret for me...  and i could have my answer......



Assuming you have a smartphone, there are apps that use the camera and do real-time translation! Amazing stuff, but point your phone camera at the plate and you will see hopefully an English translation on the screen 
Not tried it on japanese, but have on chinese.

Search for something like "camera translation app"


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> Assuming you have a smartphone, there are apps that use the camera and do real-time translation! Amazing stuff, but point your phone camera at the plate and you will see hopefully an English translation on the screen
> Not tried it on japanese, but have on chinese.
> 
> Search for something like "camera translation app"



the camera bit in my phone is not working - i guess i could try with my digital camera


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> the camera bit in my phone is not working - i guess i could try with my digital camera


if you take a picture and post it here, maybe someone could point their phone camera at the picture with the app running?
Always a solution somewhere somehow


----------



## ricc

seems to be a lot of going round in circles chasing red herrings.


whatever is on the log book re no of seats is irrelevant,  some clerk thought it was a mini bus. or thought 8 seats would cover all eventuallities.

what the details are on the bodywork is irrelevant , its chassis and axle strength and  brakes that matter.


a paper replating exercise on a non existant plate aint going to actually acheive anything relevant to safety or reliability.

if theres no weight plate and nothing on dvlc database leave well alone.

the only area that you should be worrying about is tyres.    somewhere on the tyre sidewall in small print should be wax load xxx kg at xxx psi   or a load index code that should lead to the same info. . weighbridge should have given you your axle weights,   as long as your tyre and pressure combination is adequate for the rear axle load you should be safe and in a position to argue legal in the absense of any weight data that says otherwise.

if the tyres are obviously adequate for the weight youd be very unlucky for any roadside check to want the agro of trying to take it further when the computer wont give an instant weight.


----------



## delicagirl

2014 was when it was registered.  It was imported second hand by a dealer who had bought it at auction in Japan and had it shipped over here. i have met several folks with "grey imports"  and they all have the same difficulties with data.


----------



## delicagirl

ricc said:


> seems to be a lot of going round in circles chasing red herrings.
> 
> 
> whatever is on the log book re no of seats is irrelevant,  some clerk thought it was a mini bus. or thought 8 seats would cover all eventuallities.
> 
> what the details are on the bodywork is irrelevant , its chassis and axle strength and  brakes that matter.
> 
> 
> a paper replating exercise on a non existant plate aint going to actually acheive anything relevant to safety or reliability.
> 
> if theres no weight plate and nothing on dvlc database leave well alone.
> 
> the only area that you should be worrying about is tyres.    somewhere on the tyre sidewall in small print should be wax load xxx kg at xxx psi   or a load index code that should lead to the same info. . weighbridge should have given you your axle weights,   as long as your tyre and pressure combination is adequate for the rear axle load you should be safe and in a position to argue legal in the absense of any weight data that says otherwise.
> 
> if the tyres are obviously adequate for the weight youd be very unlucky for any roadside check to want the agro of trying to take it further when the computer wont give an instant weight.




Thank you Ricc   that makes so much sense to me  - indeed i was feeling as if was chasing my tale and getting nowhere. 


I have had a good look at the front tyres (which i know are not the main issue) - they have a lot of tread left on them.  They are  Blizzard japanese  tubeless steel belted radial tyres   DM-Z3 225/70R/5 100Q  -  maximum load 800kgs  300 Kpa  at  a max pressure of 44psi .  I will need to move the van tomorrow to access the back tyres which are not as easy to read.

I know its the back tyres that are the important ones as my water/diesel/waster tanks are all at the back of the van.   I had 44psi in all tyres when i MOTd it.   Ricc thanks for having given me a much better understanding of the crux of this matter  -  ie weight/tyre strength   -  I'll  go to my local tyre specialist and have a chat with them - they supplied my spare tyre last spring and know the van, and at least i now know its weight to input into our discussions. 

Just so i understand you correctly if i get two new back tyres which are designed to carry 3.5 tons and can be inflated to 60psi i should be ok ?


----------



## runnach

A couple of weeks ago Collette you asked what a "grey import " was, now you know!. 

The issues you face , perhaps explains one or two groups I worked for in the motor trade wouldn't take a grey import in part exchange.

Personally I think the "greys " offer good value for money in some instances,but perhaps worthy of consideration to anyone thinking of buying "grey" 

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> A couple of weeks ago Collette you asked what a "grey import " was, now you know!.
> 
> The issues you face , perhaps explains one or two groups I worked for in the motor trade wouldn't take a grey import in part exchange.
> 
> Personally I think the "greys " offer good value for money in some instances,but perhaps worthy of consideration to anyone thinking of buying "grey"
> 
> Channa



Aye -  I've learned so much about my van from the guys and gals on this forum and when the time comes to sell it (when i am in my dotage!!) i will be able to pass it all on to the next owner.  I paid £10k and have probably spent another £5k on it, but it has another 100,000 left in the engine, no sign of rust anywhere, and is just what i want. 

If my struggles with this van have helped others learn stuff about their vans  then my frustrations and postings and the many kind responses will have been of value.


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> Aye -  I've learned so much about my van from the guys and gals on this forum and when the time comes to sell it (when i am in my dotage!!) i will be able to pass it all on to the next owner.  I paid £10k and have probably spent another £5k on it, but it has another 100,000 left in the engine, no sign of rust anywhere, and is just what i want.
> 
> If my struggles with this van have helped others learn stuff about their vans  then my frustrations and postings and the many kind responses will have been of value.



Please don't take my post as a criticism of any kind, merely pointing out potential headaches.

re tyre pressures a bit of experimenting I think re pressures is best answer to that question 

Channa


----------



## Chris356

If your front tyres are from Japan they will have jis on the wall but the most important thing is when they were manufactured - in the uk and Europe they have the month and year on the tyre wall. With it being imported when it was over 10 year old it didn't need a types approval (sva) and also with it being a motor caravan even if it was under 10 year old it is exempt from the sva


----------



## wildebus

The vehicle is registered as an MPV, which is an M1 classification.
That form is for a vehicle that will be registered as an N1 and therefore does not apply.
Maybe the DVLA wasn't interested in processing what would be the wrong form?

(The advantage of owning a small van which is actually an MPV is knowing the difference  )


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> *Please don't take my post as a criticism of any kind*, merely pointing out potential headaches.
> 
> re tyre pressures a bit of experimenting I think re pressures is best answer to that question
> 
> Channa



I didn't !!!!


----------



## Byronic

4x800kg tyres =3200kg indicating (unless whoever fitted them got it wrong) that this is not a 3500kg van. If you do get pulled over for weighing, why should Plod or VOSA just turn a blind eye, they may well investigate further if there's no proof on the vehicle or database. And who knows to what lengths an insurance company will go to in certain circumstances.This predicates on the figures on #1 post being correct ie 2500kg - 2490kg=10kg payload allowance left in a fairly lightly loaded van?
Or am I missing something?


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> *4x800kg tyres =3200kg* indicating (unless whoever fitted them got it wrong) that this is not a 3500kg van. If you do get pulled over for weighing, why should Plod or VOSA just turn a blind eye, they may well investigate further if there's no proof on the vehicle or database. And who knows to what lengths an insurance company will go to in certain circumstances.This predicates on the figures on #1 post being correct ie 2500kg - 2490kg=10kg payload allowance left in a fairly lightly empty van?
> Or am I missing something?



i have only inspected 2 tyres as yet - i dont  know the size of the other two tyres till tomorow - but with it being a 4WD van i guess they are all going to be the same


----------



## Byronic

I can't think of a vehicle intended to be fitted with different spec. tyres. There's just the chance that someone has made a "mistake" and it should be shod with 1000kg. hence I wrote "indicates". I hope I'm wrong of course. Taking that "like" back would make me feel better!
I was hoping for a flood of respondng posts contradicting my assumptions!


----------



## colinm

OK we are now getting a bit more info from you, but still need to know the individual axle weights.
i'll stick my neck out here.
I can now say with some confidence that the tyre blew out because it was overloaded and under inflated.
the figures you have found on the arch are most probably the tyre pressures in bar, BUT in your case would only apply to the empty van (bit of a guess until axle weights are available), once you start loading the van you will be pushing the rear tyres to max even if you inflate them more.
It strikes me you may need to consider adding air suspension to rear, and upping the tyres to 107 load index, this should  solve the axle loading problems and ensure you have no more blow outs, as for overall max weight, i'll pass on that to any expert on delica's.


----------



## wildebus

Your mention about being 4WD and tyres therefore probably being the same brought a thought to mind....
Do you know if it is permanent 4WD or not?
Many 4WD systems will require the tyres front and back to have a similar rolling radius within a few percentage of each other. If it is part-time 4WD (often labelled AWD on japanese cars), then the system is _usually_ more forgiving.
On my older RAV4s I have had from 2005, there was a specific warning about this in the handbook, and I usex to rotate the tyres front to rear to even the wear out periodicially.
The same was true of my Celica 4WD from 1990, but my RAV4 from 2011 had 4WD on demand and the tyre wear didn't matter that much.

Mentioning this in case when you check out the tyres in case two seem correct and two don't, you might need to think about changing all 4 regardless rather then just 2 so all 4 are similar.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> OK we are now getting a bit more info from you, but *still need to know the individual axle weights.*
> i'll stick my neck out here.
> 
> I can now say with some confidence that the tyre blew out because it was overloaded and under inflated.
> the figures you have found on the arch are most probably the tyre pressures in bar, BUT in your case would only apply to the empty van (bit of a guess until axle weights are available), once you start loading the van you will be pushing the rear tyres to max even if you inflate them more.
> It strikes me you may need to consider *adding air suspension to rear*, and *upping the tyres to 107 load index*, this should  solve the axle loading problems and ensure you have no more blow outs, as for overall max weight, i'll pass on that to any expert on delica's.




i wasn't ignoring that colin - i have just  looked at the weigh bridge paperwork and it does not give me an individual axle weight.  The van was weighed on a huge weigh plate designed for the largest of lorries. Should i go back and ask for a separate axle weight weigh?

Could you kindly explain the phrase adding air suspension to rear and upping the tyres to 107 load index   -  thank you.


----------



## Byronic

colinmd said:


> OK we are now getting a bit more info from you, but still need to know the individual axle weights.
> i'll stick my neck out here.
> I can now say with some confidence that the tyre blew out because it was overloaded and under inflated.
> the figures you have found on the arch are most probably the tyre pressures in bar, BUT in your case would only apply to the empty van (bit of a guess until axle weights are available), once you start loading the van you will be pushing the rear tyres to max even if you inflate them more.
> It strikes me you may need to consider adding air suspension to rear, and upping the tyres to 107 load index, this should  solve the axle loading problems and ensure you have no more blow outs, as for overall max weight, i'll pass on that to any expert on delica's.



No good getting anything done until you establish the MAM of the vehicle. If it's 2500kg then changing the tyres would be a waste,  800kg is fine.  If MAM is 3500kg then a change is needed and all is OK. If the MAM is unknown and the purpose is to pull the wool over plods eyes then a change is probably required, I say probably because the original tyres are just as likely to fool plod as any new higher rated variety, and for reasons of safety of course, the van would have to be used as 2500kg MAM.


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> i wasn't ignoring that colin - i have just  looked at the weigh bridge paperwork and it does not give me an individual axle weight.  The van was weighed on a huge weigh plate designed for the largest of lorries. Should i go back and ask for a separate axle weight weigh?
> 
> Could you kindly explain the phrase upping the tyres to 107 load index   -  thank you.



i'm making a whole load of guesses and assumptions here.
forget any 'heavy duty' nonsense you may read on the tyres, (I have two of my 4x4 on 'extra load' tyres, these are totaly unsuitable for van type loads) the important bit is the 'load index', on your tyres this appears to be 100.
I'm going to guess your axle loads at 1t front 1.5t rear based on the photo which seems to show it dragging it's arse, this is near the top limit for 100 index tyres, once you start adding load most of this will go on back and it would be prudent to get a higher rated tyre, the likes of Renault go for 107 load index tyres on the 2.5t Traffic which is a bit OTT but may be better safe than sorry, you would need to check what higher rated tyres are commonly available in the size you use.


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> Your mention about being 4WD and tyres therefore probably being the same brought a thought to mind....
> Do you know if it is permanent 4WD or not?
> Many 4WD systems will require the tyres front and back to have a similar rolling radius within a few percentage of each other. If it is part-time 4WD (often labelled AWD on japanese cars), then the system is _usually_ more forgiving.
> On my older RAV4s I have had from 2005, there was a specific warning about this in the handbook, and I usex to rotate the tyres front to rear to even the wear out periodicially.
> The same was true of my Celica 4WD from 1990, but my RAV4 from 2011 had 4WD on demand and the tyre wear didn't matter that much.
> 
> Mentioning this in case when you check out the tyres in case two seem correct and two don't, you might need to think about changing all 4 regardless rather then just 2 so all 4 are similar.




i dont know the answer to your question about permanent 4WD -  i have two gear sticks one normal, and the other one allows me to access the 2 seperate 4WDs - although i only use one of them - as the van is too tall and top heavy to go down really steep-sloping terrain.  My garage said i definitely need 4 tyres the same.


----------



## colinm

Byronic said:


> No good getting anything done until you establish the MAM of the vehicle. If it's 2500kg then changing the tyres would be a waste,  800kg is fine.  If MAM is 3500kg then a change is needed. If the MAM is unknown and the purpose is to pull the wool over plods eyes then a change is probably required, I say probably because the original tyres are just as likely to fool plod as any new higher rated variety, and used only if the  van is considered (not proven) as being 2500kg.



If as I guess the rear is at 1.5t unladen 100 index tyres are not fine at all, the tyres must be suitable for the most laden axle not 1/4 of MAM, as an example my van is 3.5t, but runs on 119 load indax tyres as the rear axle is rated at 2.4t.
p.s. also not to forget the van has already suffered a rear blow out, of what seems to have been a serviceable tyre.


----------



## mark61

Sure it will be a part time 4x4.

Searching classified of similar MH's, of those that show a GVW, most show 2805Kg. Searching for cab chassis in commercial sections most 2700Kg. Not much help really, as like most vans, different models with different GVW would have been available.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> No good getting anything done until you establish the MAM of the vehicle. If it's 2500kg then changing the tyres would be a waste,  800kg is fine.  If MAM is 3500kg then a change is needed and all is OK. If the MAM is unknown and the purpose is to pull the wool over plods eyes then a change is probably required, I say probably because the original tyres are just as likely to fool plod as any new higher rated variety, and for reasons of safety of course, the van would have to be used as 2500kg MAM.



Please tell me what MAM stands for.....

the purpose of all this research is not to pull the wool over anyone's eyes, but to get my van as safe as i can -  the blow out  i had 2 weeks ago was quite scary and i don't want to do that again if i can avoid it.    It's also in my mind that i may go for a very long jaunt next year/2018 and i need to have the van  legal and to be able to carry as much as poss without endangering the van or me.

If i have to buy 5 new tyres then that's what i have to do  -  but until i can establish the van's weight - that's pointless  -  as we all recognise.

Monday i will phone the weigh bridge and see if i can get the axles separately weighed - then go and talk to the local tyre specialist and come back here with more information. Once again guys thank you - enjoy your saturday night


----------



## mark61

Maximum Authorised Mass.

Stick with GVW


----------



## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Maximum Authorised Mass.
> 
> Stick with GVW




AAARRGGHH    -   whats  GVW  stand for then !!!!!


----------



## ricc

just as a comparison my 2.8 tonne transit panel van is on 195 14s , tyres are bog standard cheap ones,  sidewalls say max 900kg at 65 psi

if your running somewhere in the 2.5 to 3 tonne range your rear tyres at 44psi are overloaded, if theyre rated at 800kg you need to be running near max pressure.   even then the rear could be overloaded because of the uneven load distribution between front and rear.   be worth putting heavy stuff as far forward as possible


basically tyres blow out because the sidewalls are flexing too much, increasing the pressure reduces the flexing, driving style and speed also has an effect.  heavier rated tyres have stiffer sidewalls .  get the sidewalls too stiff and the ride gets harder cos the tyre doesnt flex over bumps and grip is reduced cos the tyre doesnt mould onto the road so well.

sounds like you need to talk to a decent commercial tyre fitter


----------



## delicagirl

ricc said:


> just as a comparison my 2.8 tonne transit panel van is on 195 14s , tyres are bog standard cheap ones,  sidewalls say max 900kg at 65 psi
> 
> if your running somewhere in the 2.5 to 3 tonne range your rear tyres at 44psi are overloaded, if theyre rated at 800kg you need to be running near max pressure.   even then the rear could be overloaded because of the uneven load distribution between front and rear.   be worth putting heavy stuff as far forward as possible
> 
> 
> basically tyres blow out because the sidewalls are flexing too much, increasing the pressure reduces the flexing, driving style and speed also has an effect.  heavier rated tyres have stiffer sidewalls .  get the sidewalls too stiff and the ride gets harder cos the tyre doesnt flex over bumps and grip is reduced cos the tyre doesnt mould onto the road so well.
> 
> sounds like you need to talk to a decent commercial tyre fitter



i just recalled a commercial firm i talked to in Shepton last year - they were quite helpful -  i assume their tyre fitter will need to know each axle weight so i guess my first port of call is the weigh bridge again.

Forgive my naiveity in this...   but wouldn't it be more practical to take a full van to be weighed,  so that the tyre fitter knows what weight the tyres will be carrying when i am fully loaded  ?


----------



## Martlet

*Thank You All*

Thank You Collette, for you have frequently started threads that have been both educational and entertaining.

Thank You All, those that have posted sound advice, for it not only helps the OP but also many of the other readers. 
Your spirit of helpfulness is what makes You and this forum so great.

Regards,
Martlet.


----------



## shaunr68

Martlet said:


> Thank You Collette, for you have frequently started threads that have been both educational and entertaining.
> 
> Thank You All, those that have posted sound advice, for it not only helps the OP but also many of the other readers.
> Your spirit of helpfulness is what makes You and this forum so great.
> 
> Regards,
> Martlet.


Well said.  I have just read through the entire thread and have nothing helpful at all to add, other than wishing Delicagirl good luck in resolving this matter, and to apologise for my rather smutty and puerile observation on the following, which made me spit coffee down my t-shirt :lol-053:



Chris356 said:


> If your front tyres are from Japan they will have jis on the wall



The following might be seen as irresponsible, and I'm not suggesting you take this course of action, but here's what I'd do.  You can't possibly be prosecuted for running over the GVW if there *is no* GVW either on the log book or plated on the vehicle itself.  I would err on the side of caution, treat it as a 2.8 ton gross weight and change the tyres accordingly, and ensure I kept within this assumed limit.  As long as the vehicle is not obviously overloaded, handles and brakes normally then all's well and nobody is any wiser.


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> i just recalled a commercial firm i talked to in Shepton last year - they were quite helpful -  i assume their tyre fitter will need to know each axle weight so i guess my first port of call is the weigh bridge again.
> 
> Forgive my naiveity in this...   but wouldn't it be more practical to take a full van to be weighed,  so that the tyre fitter knows what weight the tyres will be carrying when i am fully loaded  ?



I would suggest it is useful to know unloaded as well as loaded, so you know what payload you have added/ have available. Information is power 
I would think most weighbridges will be ok with you making a return trip to cover both bases.
Different bridges vary, but my local one belongs to a commercial haulage company, but have always let me get my vans weighed at no charge as long as I don't request a formal ticket and just a handwritten slip of paper. 

Maybe going over old or previously discussed ground, but something to bear in mind about tyres is commercial tyres get inflated at a much higher pressure then car or SUV/4WD tyres, so if you were thinking about chunky 4WD tyres, then that could well be doable and available at high rated loads such as 107, but the maximum pressure will probably be just 44PSI. A commercial tyre will have a pressure of around 65PSI or so. Which is most appropriate may depend on the type of trip you are intending 
My own vehicle has the pressure info on the door pillar as typical and has pressures for both types of tyres. I am currently running AT (All Terrain) Tyres to help traction on my 2WD Camper in fields and tracks.


----------



## Byronic

shaunr68 said:


> The following might be seen as irresponsible, and I'm not suggesting you take this course of action, but here's what I'd do.  You can't possibly be prosecuted for running over the GVW if there *is no* GVW either on the log book or plated on the vehicle itself.  I would err on the side of caution, treat it as a 2.8 ton gross weight and change the tyres accordingly, and ensure I kept within this assumed limit.  As long as the vehicle is not obviously overloaded, handles and brakes normally then all's well and nobody is any wiser.



As regards to the V5. I seem to recall that certain modifications must be notified to the DVLA and are the responsibility of the Registered Keeper. Pleading ignorance is not necessarily a viable defence, and blaming anything including the missing plate on the bloke you bought the vehicle from may not suffice either.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> As regards to the V5. I seem to recall that certain modifications must be notified to the DVLA and are the responsibility of the Registered Keeper. Pleading ignorance is not necessarily a viable defence, and blaming anything including *the missing plate* on the bloke you bought the vehicle from may not suffice either.



I haven't finished looking yet  ...  i may just go down to the Taunton Japanese restaurant and get a waiter to translate every flaming japanese label in the van !!!!!   Desperate times...   neeed  desperate measures ...


----------



## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> Please tell me what MAM stands for.....
> 
> the purpose of all this research is not to pull the wool over anyone's eyes, but to get my van as safe as i can -  the blow out  i had 2 weeks ago was quite scary and i don't want to do that again if i can avoid it.    It's also in my mind that i may go for a very long jaunt next year/2018 and i need to have the van  legal and to be able to carry as much as poss without endangering the van or me.
> 
> If i have to buy 5 new tyres then that's what i have to do  -  but until i can establish the van's weight - that's pointless  -  as we all recognise.
> 
> Monday i will phone the weigh bridge and see if i can get the axles separately weighed - then go and talk to the local tyre specialist and come back here with more information. Once again guys thank you - enjoy your saturday night



Not you pulling the wool, I'm sure  you'd never do such a thing! But some off the posts are suggesting you just take the risk and bung bigger tyres on. Even disregarding whether you actually need them or not. I wonder if they'd do so themselves. The chances are you are 2500kg and until you know and can prove better you'll have to do things bearing that in mind. Take as much out of the van as you reasonably can in the meantime to ensure you're under 2500kg, then at least the vehicle complies even if your paperwork doesn't.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> *Not you pulling the wool, I'm sure  you'd never do such a thing!* But some off the posts are suggesting you just take the risk and bung bigger tyres on. Even disregarding whether you actually need them or not. I wonder if they'd do so themselves. The chances are you are 2500kg and until you know and can prove better you'll have to do things bearing that in mind. Take as much out of the van as you reasonably can in the meantime to ensure you're under 2500kg, then at least the vehicle complies even if your paperwork doesn't.



Watch me !!!  i do have some free time next week...  i'll just mosey on down to taunton with a small lump of the folding stuff to hand, smile at the restaurant  manager and ask if he can spare one of his young men for a few minutes..... ....   the more data i have the better. 

as i have said a few times  here,   this is not about "compliance"  its about safety and i really need to know all relevant weights before making any decision as to what to do next. 

I won't be beaten ....  i guess we all know that !


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> As regards to the V5. I seem to recall that *certain modifications* must be notified to the DVLA and are the responsibility of the Registered Keeper. Pleading ignorance is not necessarily a viable defence, and blaming anything including the missing plate on the bloke you bought the vehicle from may not suffice either.




Do you know which mods ?


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> Do you know which mods ?


could be a body change . or up plating 
or down plating . 
changing brake operations . hydraulic to air etc .
even changing the type of suspension . 
engine sizes . 
i,m sure contacting mitsubishi they will be able to tell you every thing the standard version of your vehicle should be . 
we are lucky in uk we can change tyre sizes etc . in many eu countries that in itself means a log book change . 
the problem i see is really you have a vehicle thats great for weekends away . and a holiday two weeks a year . but for long terming we need high payloads . even a 3.5 ton is hardly good enough . think you have a great vehicle but carrying lots of gear just cant happen . 
i used to run vw t2,s but long terming was over weight all the time . i decided 16 yrs ago had to change . best move i ever made . 
did buy a mazda bongo . ideal for weekends etc ,my partner could use it as her car . but later she left i decided sell it another insurance tax mot . better to spend less on diesel in my truck. you may find you really will have to rethink your life style .


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> could be a body change . or up plating
> or down plating .
> changing brake operations . hydraulic to air etc .
> even changing the type of suspension .
> engine sizes .
> i,m sure contacting mitsubishi they will be able to tell you every thing the standard version of your vehicle should be .
> we are lucky in uk we can change tyre sizes etc . in many eu countries that in itself means a log book change .
> the problem i see is really you have a vehicle thats great for weekends away . and a *holiday two weeks a year *. but for long terming we need high payloads . even a 3.5 ton is hardly good enough . think you have a great vehicle but carrying lots of gear just cant happen .
> i used to run vw t2,s but long terming was over weight all the time . i decided 16 yrs ago had to change . best move i ever made .
> did buy a mazda bongo . ideal for weekends etc ,my partner could use it as her car . but later she left i decided sell it another insurance tax mot . better to spend less on diesel in my truck. you may find you really will have to rethink your life style .



i was away for 2 months last summer and 3.5 months this summer alan ... i only stayed at campsites about once a month  for a treat -   and apart from the tyre shredding and needing a new slave cylinder in the clutch (which can happen to any older vehicle) the van behaved impeccably.  If i have to travel with less stuff i will (I actually only used 1/3rd of the clothes i took with me this summer)  - if i have to rearrange where i store stuff, i will,  -  if i have to get the suspension raised and new tyres put on there -  i will.    But until i find out the axle weights and talk to a commercial tyre guy -  its speculative as to what my van is capable of carrying..

As a solo woman traveller i don't plan to go to the really wild places you go to - that would be foolish -  but if i meet up with others and join a small group of travellers now and again  i will do that - for safety' sake.

i'm going to the overland weekend event at Stratford race-course and will learn a lot more there for sure.

Mitsubishi cannot find my details as yet either !!   But they are on the case and i will call them again next week.


----------



## shaunr68

Byronic said:


> As regards to the V5. I seem to recall that certain modifications must be notified to the DVLA and are the responsibility of the Registered Keeper. Pleading ignorance is not necessarily a viable defence, and blaming anything including the missing plate on the bloke you bought the vehicle from may not suffice either.


I understand what you're saying, you're right of course however if the vehicle was imported from Japan in 2014 in its present form, then surely the DVLA *have* been notified.  No modifications have been undertaken since.

It's another matter entirely of course if a VIN plate was added on import and has since, by way of some shenanigans, been removed.  But do we know the vehicle ever had one?


----------



## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> Do you know which mods ?



As he said


----------



## delicagirl

shaunr68 said:


> I understand what you're saying, you're right of course however if the vehicle was imported from Japan in 2014 in its present form, then surely the DVLA *have* been notified.  No modifications have been undertaken since.
> 
> It's another matter entirely of course if a VIN plate was added on import and has since, by way of some schenanigans, been removed.  But do we know the vehicle ever had one?




 i subsequently found out that the dealer i bought it from, a couple of months after he imported it, was WELL capable of schenanigans, !!

RE Vin plate  -  I have no way of knowing...  other than asking a  japanese translator abut all the labels/ plates in the van....    see my earlier posts


----------



## Byronic

shaunr68 said:


> I understand what you're saying, you're right of course however if the vehicle was imported from Japan in 2014 in its present form, then surely the DVLA *have* been notified.  No modifications have been undertaken since.
> 
> It's another matter entirely of course if a VIN plate was added on import and has since, by way of some shenanigans, been removed.  But do we know the vehicle ever had one?



Recorded as MPV could not the body have been changed here perhaps not recorded. Should it not be a motorcaravan. Sherlock is needed.


----------



## vwalan

tyres do puncture . by the time we have stopped they can be shredded . it happens . 
most tyre fitters dont know alot about vehicles . thats a bit like asking an mot tester . they both may not know anything about mechanics or really vehicles . 
but really it would be good for you to find the limits of your vehicle . 
mind its also nice to be able to carry extras . i know at the moment i can return from spain with enough beer wine so i dont buy any in uk . that more than covers extra diesel i might use having a bigger vehicle . i can also take food from uk thats more expensive in eu. 
it can be a win ,win situation . 
if i go back to being under 3.5 ton its actually more costly than being what i am now . 
but lets hope you get it sorted soon .


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> Recorded as MPV could not the body have been changed here perhaps not recorded. Should it not be a motorcaravan. *Sherlock is needed.*



Pleeeeeease Send Dominic Cumberbatch round ANY time - the kettle'll  be on   lol !!!

I have seen other vans pretty identical to mine on sale in this country, imported by the same sharky dealer, so i doubt he would have done anything like changing the body/hab etc.......

in fact i KNOW he didn't even empty the cassette  - and there is only one way i can possibly know that   - work it out    -  UGHH !!!


----------



## shaunr68

delicagirl said:


> i subsequently found out that the dealer i bought it from, a couple of months after he imported it, was WELL capable of schenanigans, !!
> 
> RE Vin plate  -  I have no way of knowing...  other than asking a  japanese translator abut all the labels/ plates in the van....    see my earlier posts





Byronic said:


> Recorded as MPV could not the body have been changed here perhaps not recorded. Should it not be a motorcaravan. Sherlock is needed.


Thanks both, I understand what you're saying now.  I had assumed the vehicle was a motor caravan from new, a factory conversion, and imported as such, therefore the DVLA would have been satisfied with classification and so on as part of the import process.  Sorry if that took us off at a tangent.

Cheers
Shaun


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> tyres do puncture . by the time we have stopped they can be shredded . it happens .
> most tyre fitters dont know alot about vehicles . thats a bit like asking an mot tester . they both may not know anything about mechanics or really vehicles .
> but really it would be good for you to find the limits of your vehicle .
> mind its also nice to be able to carry extras . i know at the moment i can return from spain with enough beer wine so i dont buy any in uk . that more than covers extra diesel i might use having a bigger vehicle . i can also take food from uk thats more expensive in eu.
> it can be a win ,win situation .
> if i go back to being under 3.5 ton its actually more costly than being what i am now .
> but lets hope you get it sorted soon .





Thank you -   i will get it sorted  - somehow !!    we each use our vans in different ways, like we do our houses,   and whilst you need capacity for  beers etc i need space for organic porridge/soya milk and books !!


----------



## delicagirl

shaunr68 said:


> Thanks both, I understand what you're saying now.  I had assumed the vehicle was a motor caravan from new, a factory conversion, and imported as such, therefore the DVLA would have been satisfied with classification and so on as part of the import process.  Sorry if that took us off at a tangent.
> 
> Cheers
> Shaun




no worries  Shaun   - i am off at tangents most of my life !!!!


----------



## Byronic

shaunr68 said:


> Thanks both, I understand what you're saying now.  I had assumed the vehicle was a motor caravan from new, a factory conversion, and imported as such, therefore the DVLA would have been satisfied with classification and so on as part of the import process.  Sorry if that took us off at a tangent.
> 
> Cheers
> Shaun



And I thought it must have been a rebodied job sometime after importation. But it was an imported as a camper and yet detals in the V5 don't match, confusing!
Benedict Cumberpatch might conclude that the Importer got all his V5 mixed up and assigned them to the wrong vehicles.


----------



## vwalan

cant help with organic porridge but lots use soya milk when away . dont know the prices as i tend not to use alot of milk use coffee whitener. 
as for books . you might say i carry a library. dont think many carry more than me . usually got at least 200 books on board . i do enjoy a good read. 
i need space as well for bacon and gammon joints . dont like lots of the stuff sold in southern europe . 
i dont really drink alot but coming home for 6 months at 3 cans a beer a day is almost 200 litres . never mind some spare . add wine and 400 litres fuel soon mounts up. can save 160 quid sometimes just on diesel.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> And I thought it must have been a rebodied job sometime after importation. But it was an imported as a camper and yet detals in the V5 don't match, confusing!
> Benedict Cumberpatch might conclude that the Importer got all his V5 mixed up and assigned them to the wrong vehicles.



i think Dominic would not get chance to do any "concluding" if he came round  to look at it !!!


Seriously  - i think the data in my V5 log book is accurate its just that there is very little data on it..


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> cant help with organic porridge but lots use soya milk when away . dont know the prices as i tend not to use alot of milk use coffee whitener.
> as for books . you might say i carry a library. dont think many carry more than me . usually got at least 200 books on board . i do enjoy a good read.
> i need space as well for bacon and gammon joints . dont like lots of the stuff sold in southern europe .
> i dont really drink alot but coming home for 6 months at 3 cans a beer a day is almost 200 litres . never mind some spare . add wine and 400 litres fuel soon mounts up. can save 160 quid sometimes just on diesel.



So is soya milk readily available in Europe and northern africa Alan ?


----------



## trevskoda

I did not want to say but as you left my cave i thought it was well over axle weight and looked as if it were under sprung and not to stable,i would as others have said get it looked at by someone who knows what there at for you safety sake .
I can carry a big load in my bus & tow 3 ton trailer but it is in the higher weight bracket which requires a med cert at 70 so 11 years to go,but i think its worth it and turns well over 30mpg.


----------



## Tbear

A lot of talk about tyres but if you increase the weight by 40% then you will almost certainly bottom the suspension constantly and the shocks will be useless so making cornering dangerous. The brakes will be inadequate so braking distance will be extended and on long downhill runs they may well overheat and fail all together. Apologies for being so negative but you really need to take it to someone who can sort it properly for you.

Sorry!

Richard


----------



## Tbear

trevskoda said:


> I did not want to say but as you left my cave i thought it was well over axle weight and looked as if it were under sprung and not to stable,i would as others have said get it looked at by someone who knows what there at for you safety sake .
> I can carry a big load in my bus & tow 3 ton trailer but it is in the higher weight bracket which requires a med cert at 70 so 11 years to go,but i think its worth it and turns well over 30mpg.



Sorry Trev. I was faffing about while typing and missed your much more diplomatic post

Richard


----------



## colinm

Talk of 3.5t and 40% increase in MAM is a bit OTT IMO.
THE 'empty' weight has been established at 2490kg, most vans don't have more than 500kg user payload, some have more some have less.
I don't know if thats doable or not but thats 3t and 20%. At a squeeze 300kg ehich is just over 10% might surfice
My last MOT the van was weighed by MOT garage to establish axle weights for brake test, has this been done for yours?


----------



## Tbear

colinmd said:


> Talk of 3.5t and 40% increase in MAM is a bit OTT IMO.
> THE 'empty' weight has been established at 2490kg, most vans don't have more than 500kg user payload, some have more some have less.
> I don't know if thats doable or not but thats 3t and 20%. At a squeeze 300kg ehich is just over 10% might surfice
> My last MOT the van was weighed by MOT garage to establish axle weights for brake test, has this been done for yours?



From my reading and I will admit that I just skimmed some of it, it is a 2500kg that OP wants to plate as 3500kg and may well be running as such now. I make that 40% but if you are at the maxed out end and you increase by 10%, then you are dangerous. I am not going to advise someone to rake a risk without knowing for sure what is going on. The facts here are sketchy to say the least. MOT station may well help but for an import I would want to know the tester well. Yes I am a sceptic at times but we are giving advise to a lone female camper.

My van failed its last MOT because of rust around places like the suspension mounts so I sold it for Parts.

Richard


----------



## colinm

Tbear said:


> From my reading and I will admit that I just skimmed some of it, it is a 2500kg that OP wants to plate as 3500kg and may well be running as such now. I make that 40% but if you are at the maxed out end and you increase by 10%, then you are dangerous. I am not going to advise someone to rake a risk without knowing for sure what is going on. The facts here are sketchy to say the least. MOT station may well help but for an import I would want to know the tester well. Yes I am a sceptic at times but we are giving advise to a lone female camper.
> 
> My van failed its last MOT because of rust around places like the suspension mounts so I sold it for Parts.
> 
> Richard



Nobody has 'advised' this, AFAIK contact is being made with SV Tech.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Talk of 3.5t and 40% increase in MAM is a bit OTT IMO.
> THE 'empty' weight has been established at 2490kg, most vans don't have more than 500kg user payload, some have more some have less.
> I don't know if thats doable or not but thats 3t and 20%. At a squeeze 300kg ehich is just over 10% might surfice
> My last MOT the *van was weighed by MOT garage to establish axle weights for brake test*, has this been done for yours?



Thanks for that colin   -  i hadn't known that - and its most useful  - i can take the van a few miles to the MOT garage and get the axles weights very easily.

Based on your 500kg user payload   -  i guess i also need to know my fuel tank capacity so that i can work out how much my diesel weighs - then i can work out how much "stuff" i can put inside.  I wil go back to the specifications posted earlier in this thread and see if that is there.,

I don't want to put the total mileage i have driven in this van in the 2 years i have owned it on a public forum, but it has been "well used". In all that time i have never felt unsafe, or unstable, or in danger, or that the brakes were iffy. However, since posting here  i now absolutely recognise the inherent problems* if* i am overloading this van, hence this post, and my quest to find out its weight!! Until i get the axles weighed then we are speculating.  I will do that tomorrow and come back and tell you all.

Even when the van is empty its rear end has always looked low in comparison to the front as the hab body has been designed that way.  Obviously when i drained the water tanks prior to being loaded onto the trailer, the rear end came up a small amount - to be expected. 

I am not giving up on this van and no i don't want a big hymer - far too big for me.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Nobody has 'advised' this, AFAIK contact is being made with SV Tech.



I am not contemplating a SV Tech paper-exercise to replate  - i am trying to establish my safe user payload - if i can find it, i may then replate -  one step at a time.


----------



## wildebus

colinmd said:


> Talk of 3.5t and 40% increase in MAM is a bit OTT IMO.
> THE 'empty' weight has been established at 2490kg, most vans don't have more than 500kg user payload, some have more some have less.
> I don't know if thats doable or not but thats 3t and 20%. At a squeeze 300kg ehich is just over 10% might surfice
> My last MOT the van was weighed by MOT garage to establish axle weights for brake test, has this been done for yours?


Colin, what class of vehicle do you have?
I don't think I have ever seen an MOT station either weigh a vehicle prior to an MOT test, or even have the facilties to do so, except for my local Council depot which has a weighbridge, but totally separate to the MOT area. 
I honestly think you are bringing questions into this which are not normal at all.


----------



## vwalan

wildebus said:


> Colin, what class of vehicle do you have?
> I don't think I have ever seen an MOT station either weigh a vehicle prior to an MOT test, or even have the facilties to do so, except for my local Council depot which has a weighbridge, but totally separate to the MOT area.
> I honestly think you are bringing questions into this which are not normal at all.



alot of mot stations have weigh bridges built into the brake tester machine . 
you dont see anything it just comes up on the computer . 
motor bike ones usually weigh as well. its all modern technology these days . they can be a bit out so dont treat them as being as truly accurate as we would like but close enough for brake testing .


----------



## wildebus

vwalan said:


> alot of mot stations have weigh bridges built into the brake tester machine .
> you dont see anything it just comes up on the computer .
> motor bike ones usually weigh as well. its all modern technology these days . they can be a bit out so dont treat them as being as truly accurate as we would like but close enough for brake testing .



Ah, that is interesting to know. 
Does that mean that you pop into your local MOT station on which you are on reasonable terms with and get a reasonably accurate (bearing in mind your comment) weight for each axle rather then hunting out a weighbridge which are usually a lot more scarce on the ground?


----------



## mark61

delicagirl said:


> I am not contemplating a SV Tech paper-exercise to replate  - i am trying to establish my safe user payload - if i can find it, i may then replate -  one step at a time.




One step at a time is the way, lets see what the axle weights are and what info (if any) the dealer is able to get from VIN. 

Looking on Mobile.de, there are a fair few coachbuilt MH's on the same or similar model, Hymer, Dethleff, plus other well known makes. 

I wouldn't be thinking of trading it in yet.


----------



## vwalan

wildebus said:


> Ah, that is interesting to know.
> Does that mean that you pop into your local MOT station on which you are on reasonable terms with and get a reasonably accurate (bearing in mind your comment) weight for each axle rather then hunting out a weighbridge which are usually a lot more scarce on the ground?



you can only ask . but i think it only works in a sequance . plus no weight slips . 
but almost every town as weigh bridges . many hgv yards have them . they usually will do it as a favour . builders yards you name it they are all over the places , sand pits . steel yards .


----------



## delicagirl

andyjanet said:


> Delicious,  it's a Mitsubishi l300 jb 500 there is a lot of photos on Internet I will do more research for you tomorrow is there not a weight plate near the passenger door shut? Andy




Thanks  -  there are no plates of any kind around the passenger door Andy


----------



## colinm

A couple of points.
Not all MOT stations have the facility to weigh vehicles, the one I use for my small vehicles doesn't, due to an odd brake test I weighed one myself and found it was approx 350kg front and rear with driver and half a tank!
I've never dealt with SV Tech, but my understanding is they will advise on more than just paperwork.

My van is based on Ducato H2L4 maxi , its MAM is 3.5t this is actually a down plating from 4.05t.


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Surly your insurance company would know what type of vehicle it is & there for the weight capacity !, As let's be honest 'They would have to know what they are infact insuring !'
Try seeing if the Engine number throws up any leads !.


----------



## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> One step at a time is the way, lets see what the axle weights are and what info (if any) the dealer is able to get from VIN.
> 
> Looking on Mobile.de, there are a fair few coachbuilt MH's on the same or similar model, Hymer, Dethleff, plus other well known makes.
> 
> *I wouldn't be thinking of trading it in yet. *



I'm not !!!!

I'm on a mission with this weight investigation now    lol


----------



## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> Surly your insurance company would know what type of vehicle it is & there for the weight capacity !, As let's be honest 'They would have to know what they are infact insuring !'
> *Try seeing if the Engine number throws up any leads* !.




I am in stitches of laughter here.......    as one lead is suggested  -   this sweet wee van of mine knobbles it   -   there is no engine number on the V5 log book -  but i think i can find it under the front seats....  here is  a second reason for me to  get all the seats lifted  .....

but  -  i am off clothes shopping for girlie stuff this afternoon ...  so am gonna put my other hat on for a while and stop trying to understand "man stuff" at least for a few hours !!!!


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> you can only ask . but i think it only works in a sequance . plus no weight slips .
> but *almost every town as weigh bridges* . many hgv yards have them . they usually will do it as a favour . builders yards you name it they are all over the places , sand pits . steel yards .



There is often a list of weigh bridges on your local council website


----------



## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> Surly *your insurance company would know what type of vehicle it is & there for the weight capacity* !, As let's be honest 'They would have to know what they are infact insuring !'
> Try seeing if the Engine number throws up any leads !.




If i/we and the might of WCers investigative powers cannot find out - how would my insurers find out ?


----------



## Nesting Zombie

They might have access to a different database than we have, & if they haven't, then don't ever worry about being over weight, as apparently it couldn't be proven if you was lol lol


----------



## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> They might have access to a different database than we have, & if they haven't, then don't ever worry about being over weight, as apparently it couldn't be proven if you was lol lol




Zombie  - this is not about my fooling an insurance company or government official  this is about my safety. If i am significantly overweight for my axles and suspension and tyres and one of these collapses in the back of beyond  (and insurers will only recover a vehicle from a tarmac road)  - then i could lose my van -  or be injured.  I'm sure you would not want either of those things to happen to me.


----------



## colinm

Nesting Zombie said:


> Surly your insurance company would know what type of vehicle it is & there for the weight capacity !, As let's be honest 'They would have to know what they are infact insuring !'
> Try seeing if the Engine number throws up any leads !.





Nesting Zombie said:


> They might have access to a different database than we have, & if they haven't, then don't ever worry about being over weight, as apparently it couldn't be proven if you was lol lol



Some one I know had an accident with his car and trailer, to cut a very long story short, when the investigator came to see a demo of turning of car and trailer he just happened to notice it was a streched limo not a 4 door saloon.


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> Zombie  - this is not about my fooling an insurance company or government official  this is about my safety. If i am significantly overweight for my axles and suspension and tyres and one of these collapses in the back of beyond  (and insurers will only recover a vehicle from a tarmac road)  - then i could lose my van -  or be injured.  I'm sure you would not want either of those things to happen to me.



Im sure there would be a Q of lads here willing to give kiss of life.


----------



## delicagirl

trevskoda said:


> Im sure there would be a Q of lads here willing to give kiss of life.



Now Trev  -  dont you start fisticuffs with Izzy as to who will be first in the queue  :lol-053:


----------



## pughed2

*weight issues*

hello delica........I just saw your reply to my posting on here, so decided briefly to try to put your mind at rest over all this. There is no reason I can think of why (apart from fuel saving) you should be concerned about the weight of your vehicle. If you are concerned about tyre pressures, please go to the website tribby.co.uk, section mechanical and technical, article tyre pressures, and scroll down to my post pughed2 which tells you exactly how to work out your tyre pressures with no base references. Secondly to address your issues of security, as I am in exactly the same position, consider........1)obviously the physical security of the van, prefer to leave it outside houses or in busy places 2) arrange when overnighting to have the van locked obviously, and ready to roll asap if a gang of thugs arrive, 3)at every wildcamping stop check your mobile phone signal, and if abroad the number you would need to call police, keep in mind if in france possible slow or no response, elsewhere the police can be invaluable depending on event, and in cases of dispute between vanner and residents, usually will support the vanner so stay legal and 4) always park near to habitation of some sort, obviously to get help if needed, 5) check your location, street name on google maps or mapfactor downloaded sat nav, so if you do need to call police, you can tell them exactly where you are..............all this takes just 5 or 10 minutes when parking up.............currently wilding torbay area........steve bristol


----------



## delicagirl

pughed2 said:


> hello delica........I just saw your reply to my posting on here, so decided briefly to try to put your mind at rest over all this. There is no reason I can think of why (apart from fuel saving) you should be concerned about the weight of your vehicle. If you are concerned about tyre pressures, please go to the* website tribby.co.uk*, section mechanical and technical, article tyre pressures, and scroll down to my post pughed2 which tells you exactly how to work out your tyre pressures with no base references. Secondly to address your issues of security, as I am in exactly the same position, consider........1)obviously the physical security of the van, prefer to leave it outside houses or in busy places 2) arrange when overnighting to have the van locked obviously, and ready to roll asap if a gang of thugs arrive, 3)at every wildcamping stop check your mobile phone signal, and if abroad the number you would need to call police, keep in mind if in france possible slow or no response, elsewhere the police can be invaluable depending on event, and in cases of dispute between vanner and residents, usually will support the vanner so stay legal and 4) always park near to habitation of some sort, obviously to get help if needed, 5) check your location, street name on google maps or mapfactor downloaded sat nav, so if you do need to call police, you can tell them exactly where you are..............all this takes just 5 or 10 minutes when parking up.............currently wilding torbay area........steve bristol




Thanks steve - i will check it out on my return from a girlie afternoon in Bath   bw


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> If i/we and the might of WCers investigative powers cannot find out - how would my insurers find out ?



That is an easy question to answer the onus would be on you to prove what it is is. A lot of insurance contracts are done via telephone and internet and cover offered using "limited information" As you are already finding no one really knows what it is ! This of course in a total loss claim could prejudice you, it is hard to prove what you have got. The idea of insurance really is to indemnify third parties, Full Comp is really a bit of a upsell. God forbid you wrote your van off but I think you would have a real challenge establish its fair market value with an insurer. I don't wish to sound negative but is well meant advise as someone who has Insurance experience.

Until such time as you can establish axle weights , tyres and pressures are secondary. As Alan says tyres can blow, over a period of time they can delaminate all sorts of things. If the rear tyres have been on a while a good tyre fitter by looking should be able to tell if they are ran under or over inflated tread wear tells you this.

A right puzzle this one isn't it ? 
Channa


----------



## flyinghigh

delicagirl said:


> Thank you -   i will get it sorted  - somehow !!    we each use our vans in different ways, like we do our houses,   and whilst you need capacity for  beers etc i need space for organic porridge/soya milk and books !!



replace the books with a kindle that will save a bit of weight


----------



## ricc

grossly overinflated tyres tend to wear the tread in the centre ..

 grossly underinflated tend to wear more on both edges

but its not an exact science.


one edge worn more means something isnt aligned properly in either suspension or steering.


----------



## runnach

ricc said:


> grossly overinflated tyres tend to wear the tread in the centre ..
> 
> grossly underinflated tend to wear more on both edges
> 
> but its not an exact science.
> 
> 
> one edge worn more means something isnt aligned properly in either suspension or steering.


 indeed, which is why I mentioned the rear tyres, no steering to worry about . A good experienced tyre fitter can tell often from looking at a tyre whether it has been under/over inflated or indeed the steering geometry requires correction 

Channa


----------



## factorydave04

hi delica girl is this link any help? 
Mitsubishi Delica MOTORHOME 5/6 BERTH 2.5 TD MANUAL 4WD TOYOTA HIACE | in Winterbourne, Bristol | Gumtree


----------



## factorydave04

hi delica girl is this link any help
Mitsubishi Delica MOTORHOME 5/6 BERTH 2.5 TD MANUAL 4WD TOYOTA HIACE | in Winterbourne, Bristol | Gumtree


----------



## trevskoda

ricc said:


> grossly overinflated tyres tend to wear the tread in the centre ..
> 
> grossly underinflated tend to wear more on both edges
> 
> but its not an exact science.
> 
> 
> one edge worn more means something isnt aligned properly in either suspension or steering.



Like the mark one imp.:scared::lol-053:


----------



## listerdiesel

Going back a few pages, the Japanese plate that was found with 2.4 and 3.5 on it suggests rather strongly to me that those are the GVW for the solo vehicle and the GTW when towing a trailer, very similar to our Bedford Midi that we had some years back. More than 3.5 tonnes would have required a tachograph for commercial use, so many makers kept it below the limit.

Given the engine size and rating, I wouldn't have thought much more was feasible.

Just a thought.

Peter


----------



## delicagirl

factorydave04 said:


> hi delica girl is this link any help
> Mitsubishi Delica MOTORHOME 5/6 BERTH 2.5 TD MANUAL 4WD TOYOTA HIACE | in Winterbourne, Bristol | Gumtree



Hi factorydave thanks for the gumtree link   -   the  van at £7995  appears to be an identical van to mine, (which i paid £10k for 2 years ago) , and it is being sold by the same shyster dealer.   This one is priced at almost half the price of the last one he had for sale...   so there is summat not right !!!!!  He lists the dimensions and says the gross weight is 2520 KG(KILOGRAM).


----------



## delicagirl

listerdiesel said:


> Going back a few pages, the *Japanese plate that was found with 2.4 and 3.5* on it suggests rather strongly to me that those are the GVW for the solo vehicle and the GTW when towing a trailer, very similar to our Bedford Midi that we had some years back. More than 3.5 tonnes would have required a tachograph for commercial use, so many makers kept it below the limit.
> 
> Given the engine size and rating, I wouldn't have thought much more was feasible.
> 
> Just a thought.
> 
> Peter



Hi Peter  -  i also wondered about that  ......   i have visited a engineer neighbour tonight (who has been away for a few days) and who has been a van owner  for decades. He know about all  the trials and tribulations of my wee japanese conundrum  -  so i outlined this story so far for him and  his immediate response was  that my van was a 3.5 ton van - and so i have nearly 1000 lbs of user payload .....


----------



## mark61

listerdiesel said:


> Going back a few pages, the Japanese plate that was found with 2.4 and 3.5 on it suggests rather strongly to me that those are the GVW for the solo vehicle and the GTW when towing a trailer, very similar to our Bedford Midi that we had some years back. More than 3.5 tonnes would have required a tachograph for commercial use, so many makers kept it below the limit.
> 
> Given the engine size and rating, I wouldn't have thought much more was feasible.
> 
> Just a thought.
> 
> Peter



I thought the same, but 900Kg for towing doesn't seem very much, but of all the info we have so far, it seems likely.


----------



## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> That seems extremely unlikely to be the case. I am pretty sure that the 3.5 tonnes is the train weight, not the GVW. Almost all 3.5 ton vans have twin back wheels for a start.
> 
> If the GVW was 3500, why was it running on tyres that were so grossly inadequate for its weight? I think it is a 2.5 tonne van at most.
> 
> I repeat my advice: g*et the weight down as far as you possibly can, then get it weighed*. Only then can you actually assess the situation.



When i had it weighed at the beginning of this thread the van was fairly empty -  it contained no water, no clothes, no food, no books,  and less than a half tank of fuel - so it was pretty empty when compared with its usual payload   - i guess the bits no bobs remaining in the lockers  - hookup cable, hosepipe, spare - engine belts and oil -  a bit of crockery, some torches and 2 saucepans would not weigh a significant amount  -  but to set our minds at rest i will do what everyone suggested earlier on and empty it, weigh it and take it to a commercial tyre place and chase up Mitsubishi.....


----------



## Canalsman

Doing some Googling I found this:

Motorhome orientation - www.nzmotorhome.co.nz

They have just bought a 'van like yours ... and they say they have the manuals (in Japanese).

Might be a good plan to make contact and see if their manuals have the weight/payload figures you're seeking.


----------



## FULL TIMER

re the weights on the jap plate these could also be 2.4 as the kerb weight and 3.5 as max gross weight, going back some in one of the links it was suggested that these vehicles were available with kerb weights ranging from around 1700 kg - around 2600kg,


----------



## Canalsman

delicagirl said:


> Hi factorydave thanks for the gumtree link   -   the  van at £7995  appears to be an identical van to mine, (which i paid £10k for 2 years ago) , and it is being sold by the same shyster dealer.   This one is priced at almost half the price of the last one he had for sale...   so there is summat not right !!!!!  He lists the dimensions and says the gross weight is 2520 KG(KILOGRAM).



I hadn't realised that your 'van is as small as it is ... just 4.9m long.

I had a similarly aged 6m 'van with a maximum laden weight of 3,200Kg, and if you take a very crude pro-rata measure that would indicate a MLW of say 2,600Kg.

The MLW is likely to be higher than that, but it certainly won't be 3,500Kg.

I wonder where the 2,520Kg figure comes from?


----------



## runnach

factorydave04 said:


> hi delica girl is this link any help
> Mitsubishi Delica MOTORHOME 5/6 BERTH 2.5 TD MANUAL 4WD TOYOTA HIACE | in Winterbourne, Bristol | Gumtree



I note the ad 521 days old , so possibly imported in the same batch as yours ? Also if you look at the rear tyre  it seems underinflated or under significant load !

Channa


----------



## runnach

hairydog said:


> When I try to look at that Gumtree ad, it says it's no longer available. Is there a way to look at old Gumtree ads?



Just scroll down, there is a picture of the van. Incidentally just a thought the jb500 could have nothing to do with it no more than a model number assigned by whoever built the body. I have a CI  euro 100 which really means very little in terms of the base vehicle 

Channa


----------



## mark61

channa said:


> Just scroll down, there is a picture of the van. Incidentally just a thought the jb500 could have nothing to do with it no more than a model number assigned by whoever built the body. I have a CI  euro 100 which really means very little in terms of the base vehicle
> 
> Channa



Yes, the JB500 is the model of Motorhome. Nothing to do with the Mitsubishi part, which is an L300.


----------



## delicagirl

FULL TIMER said:


> re the weights on the jap plate these could also be *2.4 as the kerb weight and 3.5 as max gross weight,* going back some in one of the links it was suggested that these vehicles were available with kerb weights ranging from around 1700 kg - around 2600kg,



That would be the perfect answer to this quest  Alan !!!!


----------



## mark61

Have come across these vehicles on Mobile.de, which I think so far give the most accurate info as far as GVW goes, especially the commercials, but I also see it being very feasible the MH's being uprated the extra 100KG

The L300 was/is been around for a long time, at least 3 or 4 completely different models, over the years (although they may not look that different) later models have a slightly higher GVW than the earliest, also finding stats gets more difficult as the vehicle has been given different names. The Delica name as far as I can see, is given the people carrier/station wagon version of the panel van. The commercials have been marketed as L300's, Express, and a few other names.



Mitsubishi Frankia als Alkoven in Niederneisen bei Limburg/Lahn

Mitsubishi L 300 2,5D Pritsche als Pritsche in Berlin Niederschöneweide


----------



## Byronic

hairydog said:


> That seems extremely unlikely to be the case. I am pretty sure that the 3.5 tonnes is the train weight, not the GVW. Almost all 3.5 ton vans have twin back wheels for a start.
> 
> If the GVW was 3500, why was it running on tyres that were so grossly inadequate for its weight? I think it is a 2.5 tonne van at most.
> 
> I repeat my advice: get the weight down as far as you possibly can, then get it weighed. Only then can you actually assess the situation.




Increasingly looking like 2.5tonne GVW/MAM.

Yes much as I've posted earlier. Unless the weighing was grossly incorrect then someone has put a too heavy a body on an inadequate chassis, they haven't allowed for payload. Could have been purposeful could have been ignorance. The tyres already on it may well be adequate @ 2.5Ttonnes, they may at least have got that part correct!


----------



## delicagirl

POI Admin said:


> I hadn't realised that your 'van is as small as it is ... *just 4.9m long.*
> 
> I had a similarly aged 6m 'van with a maximum laden weight of 3,200Kg, and if you take a very crude pro-rata measure that would indicate a MLW of say 2,600Kg.
> 
> The MLW is likely to be higher than that, but it certainly won't be 3,500Kg.
> 
> I wonder where the 2,520Kg figure comes from?



That is what i have always thought it was (2meters wide and 2.7 meters high)-  and its why i want to keep it  -  its small and cute and fits into one parking bay and is just the right size for me - and it lets me go down  the TINIEST of lanes !!


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> I note the ad 521 days old , so possibly imported in the same batch as yours ? Also if you look at the rear tyre  it seems underinflated or under significant load !
> 
> Channa



it could well be  -  this is being sold by the same dealer that i bought from - that is how he makes his living  -  from grey imports - and changing his business name every couple of years !!

 - and this one you have found has an awning, but mine doesn't.


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> it could well be  -  this is being sold by the same dealer that i bought from - that is how he makes his living  -  from grey imports - and changing his business name every couple of years !!
> 
> - and this one you have found has an awning, but mine doesn't.


 Stock turn on caravans and motorhomes can be extremely slow, One of my ex sales managers had a Ford Escort in a garish colour we had over a year, It became a standing joke. It was so funny one of our traders sent it a birthday card. Suffice to say the mentioned Sales Manager far from amused!!.

Motor caravans and caravans are far more seasonal than passenger cars, Very few dealers seem to understand the importance of stock turn to be honest but perhaps I shall save that for another thread.

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> Stock turn on caravans and motorhomes can be extremely slow, One of my ex sales managers had a Ford Escort in a garish colour we had over a year, It became a standing joke. It was so funny *one of our traders sent it a birthday card*. Suffice to say the mentioned Sales Manager far from amused!!.
> 
> Motor caravans and caravans are far more seasonal than passenger cars, Very few dealers seem to understand the importance of stock turn to be honest but perhaps I shall save that for another thread.
> 
> Channa




:dance:  lol


the way we're going here this thread may need a birthday card also !!!!


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> :dance:  lol
> 
> 
> the way we're going here this thread may need a birthday card also !!!!



Who gives a flying ? at least we are droning on about a camper !!!....Not getting very far tbh , but all a good collective bonding excercise 

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

POI Admin said:


> Doing some Googling I found this:
> 
> Motorhome orientation - www.nzmotorhome.co.nz
> 
> They have just bought a 'van like yours ... and they say they have the manuals (in Japanese).
> 
> Might be a good plan to make contact and see if their manuals have the weight/payload figures you're seeking.



Thanks i have just joined and offered them any help they need and asked them the weight question .....


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> Who gives a flying ? at least we are droning on about a camper !!!....Not getting very far tbh , but all a good collective bonding excercise
> 
> Channa



Maybe when its all sorted  i should arrange a Delica Thank You Meet and get a barrel of beer in for the collective bonders -  call it the Bonders Bash  !!!!!


----------



## Byronic

That rare occasion, when it would be a blessing in disguise to discover that a m/home had a waterlogged body. 

And after a drying out finding that it actually weighs in at 1.5 tonnes.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> That rare occasion, when it would be a blessing in disguise to discover that a m/home had a waterlogged body.
> 
> And after a drying out finding that it actually weighs in at 1.5 tonnes.



You're not suggesting i drive it into Chew Valley Lake for  a swim are you ??    lol !!!


----------



## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> You're not suggesting i drive it into Chew Valley Lake for  a swim are you ??    lol !!!



No! Don't do that. Much better to hope it's already waterlogged, not add to it!

Seriously have you considered contacting Mr. Sharkey of Japanese 50 Shades of Grey Imports, and see what he has to say. He probably has a Freephone 0800 number for complaints......if not he probably needs one! 
If within reasonable distance why not drive past see if he has any more similar vans available. Could be a lot of fun to be had (if nothing else) if you ask a few pertinent questions and can remain incognito.


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> No! Don't do that. Much better to hope it's already waterlogged, not add to it!
> 
> Seriously have you considered contacting *Mr. Sharkey of Japanese 50 Shades of Grey Imports*, and see what he has to say. He probably has a Freephone 0800 number for complaints......if not he probably needs one!
> If within reasonable distance why not drive past see if he has any more similar vans available. Could be a lot of fun to be had (if nothing else) if you ask a few pertinent questions and can remain incognito.




i would not trust a single word that came out of his mouth -  you cant drive past  - his site is in a locked yard - and you now need an appointment to come and see him or look at his vans.


The Delica Detectives will have to mosey along without his input I'm afraid. :raofl:


----------



## Byronic

Nowt to lose just asking if he has any Mitsubishi L300 3.5 tonne Delicas there, or on the way. He might say no such thing as a 3.5 tonne L300, so go away or similar words!


----------



## mark61

Converters have been doing the same thing for years, I remember in about 1979 telling a friend of my dads not to get a Auto Trail MH on the 207D version of the Mercedes T1 vans, which only had a 2800GVW.
He didn't listen to a kid, lol.


----------



## delicagirl

Thank you david and mark -   i am removing everything from the van slowly but surely   -  due to other commitments its gonna be wednesday before I can  finish this ..   but already i am realising just how heavy "stuff" is - and how much Stuff is still left in the van......  mind you looking on the bright side  i have found "stuff"! i thought i had lost !!!!!


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Thank you david and mark -   i am removing everything from the van slowly but surely   -  due to other commitments its gonna be wednesday before I can  finish this ..   but already i am realising just how heavy "stuff" is - and how much Stuff is still left in the van......  mind you looking on the bright side  i have found "stuff"! i thought i had lost !!!!!



Ah, the old "here's a cupboard lets put something in it" syndrome, fingers crossed this will go someway to sorting the problem. Once you have done this I guess you will be getting the axles weighed, from there you can see where to go next. If it looks like you will get a useful payload, you are probably best loading what you think is needed for your travels including tanks with as much in as you need to see what this comes to, and to establish a tyre pressure.
I'm sure one way or another your saggy rear end will be sorted.


----------



## andyjanet

colinmd said:


> Ah, the old "here's a cupboard lets put something in it" syndrome, fingers crossed this will go someway to sorting the problem. Once you have done this I guess you will be getting the axles weighed, from there you can see where to go next. If it looks like you will get a useful payload, you are probably best loading what you think is needed for your travels including tanks with as much in as you need to see what this comes to, and to establish a tyre pressure.
> I'm sure one way or another your saggy rear end will be sorted.


I take great offence to that Collette does Pilates and put those of us to shame that tried it at the Rutland meet 2015, so her rear end is anything but saggy, peach in a sack comes to mind &#55357;&#56841;


----------



## runnach

andyjanet said:


> I take great offence to that Collette does Pilates and put those of us to shame that tried it at the Rutland meet 2015, so her rear end is anything but saggy, peach in a sack comes to mind ��



Tell me again ? how pert ....when we say peach in a sack , sack of what ? It doesnt matter mind running riot for a second ...deep breathes I am in control honest 

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

andyjanet said:


> I take great offence to that Collette does Pilates and put those of us to shame that tried it at the Rutland meet 2015, so her rear end is anything but saggy, *peach in a sack* comes to mind &#55357;&#56841;



with or  without central nut Andy ?     lol !!!


----------



## trevskoda

I have had a fantastic idea,when bringing tin food try weightwatchers soup as it will be lighter.:raofl::raofl::raofl:


----------



## delicagirl

my delica-van-emptying continues   - its quite scary how much stuff is in there.... 

several folks gave me useful "bits n bobs" and in they went .. I never used the clothes horse -  why did I think I might?   The packing up process in May went something like : -    "i'll be away for a while  I might need that" ....  and in it goes - and   "maybe I wont have enough to occupy myself" -  so books, embroidery, drawing stuff, music, puzzle books, playing cards and instruments  all went in, as well as enough shampoo/conditioner as would supply the Treorchy Male Voice Choir, and sufficient cleaning cloths to make a child's wardrobe, along with a quantity of small water bottles containing enough CO2 to feed my garden plants for a month,    and on it goes...   so to have told you that my van WAS empty when I took it to the weigh-bridge was a bit of an exaggeration 

oh  and the table, chair, drawing boards  (why one person needs 2 drawing boards is beyond me), tent pegs (Why???)  windscreen screens, rope  (who exactly is going to tow/be towed on a 10 foot rope?), hosepipe  (but no tap-connector -  useful huh?) 

3 saucepans -  when I only have 2 rings???  a heavy large chopping board,  cutlery for 6 - hell yeaaaa  lets have a Meet in my van - I can do the catering as I lost count of the number of plates, real and paper...

I'm gonna get mad with myself if I keep this up....


----------



## delicagirl

trevskoda said:


> I have had a fantastic idea,when bringing tin food try weightwatchers soup as it will be lighter.:raofl::raofl::raofl:




great logic trev  ....   OH  how I wish that were true my friend


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Ah, the old "here's a cupboard lets put something in it" syndrome, fingers crossed this will go someway to sorting the problem. Once you have done this I guess you will be getting the axles weighed, from there you can see where to go next. If it looks like you will get a useful payload, you are probably best loading what you think is needed for your travels including tanks with as much in as you need to see what this comes to, and to establish a tyre pressure.
> I'm sure one way or another your *saggy rear end* will be sorted.



IF we are talking about my van's rear end (I am Terribly Fussy who gets to see t'other saggy rear end  )  I have always thought my van look weird....   I know  I know..  so am I.....    but ....   the measurement from the top of the wheel arch to the ground on the front wheel  is  33"   whilst the back measurement is 21"   - so of course it looks as if it has a saggy bum ... its  is lob sided....


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> IF we are talking about my van's rear end (I am Terribly Fussy who gets to see t'other saggy rear end  )  I have always thought my van look weird....   I know  I know..  so am I.....    but ....   the measurement from the top of the wheel arch to the ground on the front wheel  is  33"   whilst the back measurement is 21"   - so of course it looks as if it has a saggy bum ... its  is lob sided....



And theres me thinking i required short inside leg trousers when in fact its just a saggy bum i have.:scared::lol-053:


----------



## ricc

a better guide to saginess of the van's rearend would be the levelness of what should be horizontal lines,   top and bottom of side windows,  maybe the roof line , and probably the most telling and most important the floor in the living area.


if you havnt got a spirit level ,  a large bowl nearly full to the brim of water will give a good guide if stood on the floor when parked on a level bit of ground.    the surface of the  water in the bowl is allways horizontal

summit longer like a baby bath is even better


----------



## izwozral

ricc said:


> a better guide to saginess of the van's rearend would be the levelness of what should be horizontal lines,   top and bottom of side windows,  maybe the roof line , and probably the most telling and most important the floor in the living area.
> 
> 
> if you havnt got a spirit level ,  a large bowl nearly full to the brim of water will give a good guide if stood on the floor when parked on a level bit of ground.    the surface of the  water in the bowl is allways horizontal
> 
> summit longer like a baby bath is even better



You forgot to add: You will need to point your des res in both directions, it doesn't matter if you do a 3 point turn or go round a roundabout, the important thing is, do not remove the bath of water at any time.




:goodluck:


----------



## delicagirl

ricc said:


> a better guide to saginess of the van's rearend would be the levelness of what should be horizontal lines,   top and bottom of side windows,  maybe the roof line , and probably the most telling and most important the floor in the living area.
> 
> 
> if you havnt got a spirit level ,  a large bowl nearly full to the brim of water will give a good guide if stood on the floor when parked on a *level bit of ground. *   the surface of the  water in the bowl is allways horizontal
> 
> summit longer like a baby bath is even better



Ric   -    Moi ?  level ??    i slept at some insane angles when i was away - mainly because it took me weeks to teach myself how to use the ramps  - i did eventually learn how to use them , but by that time a bed with a few degrees of angularity were "nae bother"


if it was lashing down, and it frequently did, i often used the "pencil test"  -  i put a round pencil on my table and if it  rolled  - i wasn't level  -  if it didn't move i was level -  cunning huh?     it meant i didn't have to go out into the rain .......

Where i would find room to store a baby bath is a challenge i would rather not face right now, as the "weight challenge"   (both the vans and my own) are more than enough at one time..... :wacko:


----------



## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> You forgot to add: You will need to point your des res in both directions, it doesn't matter if you do a 3 point turn or go round a roundabout, the important thing is, *do not remove the bath of water at any time.*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> :goodluck:



You's is just bein silly now.....    :dance:


----------



## Martlet

*Improvised level*



ricc said:


> a better guide to saginess of the van's rearend would be the levelness of what should be horizontal lines,   top and bottom of side windows,  maybe the roof line , and probably the most telling and most important the floor in the living area.
> 
> 
> if you havnt got a spirit level ,  a large bowl nearly full to the brim of water will give a good guide if stood on the floor when parked on a level bit of ground.    the surface of the  water in the bowl is allways horizontal
> 
> summit longer like a baby bath is even better



I have on occasion utilised a 2 litre plastic bottle almost full of water; the bottle being taped to the edge of a straight plank. 
Not the most precise instrument, but adequate.

Regards,
Martlet.


----------



## oldish hippy

a plastic water bottle fill to top of label then stand on floor if it not level then you can see as it goes over label


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> I am Terribly Fussy who gets to see t'other saggy rear end



Well not according to your neighbors or those at the meets :raofl:


----------



## colinm

Gf would often disagree with my sense of level, so I brought a 'bullseye level' off the bay which I place on table, less than £2 inc p&p. It is slightly inaccurate and I was going to correct it with a bit of tape on one edge, but then I realised that if the van isn't 100% level I can always spin the level to show it is. :banana:


----------



## delicagirl

oldish hippy said:


> a plastic water bottle fill to top of label then stand on floor if it not level then you can see as it goes over label





Genius Hippy    pure genius


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Gf would often disagree with my sense of level, so I brought a 'bullseye level' off the bay which I place on table, less than £2 inc p&p. It is slightly inaccurate and I was going to correct it with a bit of tape on one edge, but then I realised that if the van isn't 100% level I can always spin the level to show it is. :banana:



I do have one of these baby triangular spirit levels which I look at when parking up -  but they only give a guide.


----------



## ScamperVan

Or an app, eg

Bubble Level – Android Apps on Google Play


----------



## izwozral

ScamperVan said:


> Or an app, eg
> 
> Bubble Level – Android Apps on Google Play



Ditto.

Something less to carry and your phone isn't normally buried at the bottom of a box somewhere in the garage or in some cupboard, if only you knew which one.


----------



## invalid

To be fair, nothing is truly level; we are sitting in a van that is sitting on a ball spinning in space in a universe that’s probably on its side. That should motivate some interesting answers.:lol-061:


----------



## RoadTrek Boy

invalid said:


> To be fair, nothing is truly level; we are sitting in a van that is sitting on a ball spinning in space in a universe that’s probably on its side. That should motivate some interesting answers.:lol-061:



Irriot.....:lol-049::lol-049::lol-049::lol-049:


----------



## izwozral

invalid said:


> To be fair, nothing is truly level; we are sitting in a van that is sitting on a ball spinning in space in a universe that’s probably on its side. That should motivate some interesting answers.:lol-061:



Are you Professor Brian Cox or are you just tickling our asteroids?


----------



## ricc

we seem to have lost the plot a bit

levels were introduced to attempt to determin how saggy  and hence how overloaded or not the rear end actually is ,  theory being that overweight will sag down considerably at the back.   unladen may be a tad rear high, but a reasonable safe load shouldnt cause to much sag.


come on people get a grip.


----------



## delicagirl

ricc said:


> we seem to have lost the plot a bit
> 
> levels were introduced to attempt to determin how saggy  and hence how overloaded or not the rear end actually is ,  theory being that overweight will sag down considerably at the back.   unladen may be a tad rear high, but a reasonable safe load shouldnt cause to much sag.
> 
> 
> come on people get a grip.




Ricc do you think that the measurements I put up yesterday  (of the distance between ground and the top of the front and rear wheel arches) mean that we could be looking at an optical illusion in terms of how much "apparent rear sag" the van has when full ?

am off to get it weighed empty now....


----------



## colinm

The front wheel arch is Mitsubishi original, rear is by converter, so you cannot say they are comparable.
Your photos appear to show back well down, and I noted Trev though it looked overloaded in the flesh.


----------



## Deleted member 52918

delicagirl said:


> Ricc do you think that the measurements I put up yesterday  (of the distance between ground and the top of the front and rear wheel arches) mean that we could be looking at an optical illusion in terms of how much "apparent rear sag" the van has when full ?
> 
> am off to get it weighed empty now....



If I were you I'd get it weighed first, then I'd see how level the van floor is with a spirit level, on of course, level ground!!

Phill


----------



## delicagirl

I have a Lot more information for us all to consider after this afternoon's jaunt ......

I took the van to my local tyre specialist (who knows the van well) - and he said that the blow out was caused by a 20 year old tyre !!!!  and it shredded because of its age.  I still have one other 20 year old tyre on the van,  and two 10 year old tyres, and I brand new tyre (fitted after the blowout).  So I need to sort this out quickly.

I went to the weighbridge again -  REALLY empty this time (except for half a tank of diesel).  It weighs 2330 kgs.

I told him all about the weight saga. 

We discussed tyres at some length, and the types of terrain I will be going on, and how to calculate safe user payloads.

To summarise what he said : -

If I change all 4 tyres for regular camper-van tyres (which are a stronger type of tyre than 4WD tyres) - I could inflate these tyres up to a maximum of 65psi which would give me a potential user payload of 1800kgs.    (So  2330kgs empty weight + 1800kg  "stuff"  = 4130 kilos in total) 

If I continued with 4WD tyres   I would only have a user payload of   870 kgs, as the maximum psi would be 44psi - so that would be 2330 empty weight, plus 870 kilos user payload =  3200 kilos.

So I now don't know what to do  -  it seems to boil down to 2 choices : -

if I get rid of the 4WD tyres, and go with standard 65psi tyres,   it will be much riskier for me to go into non-tarmac terrain, because they wont have the grip I get from my current 4WD tyres -  but I will be able to take more stuff.

If I stick with 4WD then  - how much "stuff " can I take once I have accounted for diesel and water  - being in mind that I don't know my fuel tank capacity   -  £50-£55 to fill it up. 

He recommends the standard 65psi tyres  (which are cheaper for me than 4WD tyres)   - so he is not trying an upsell.

Your thoughts  gentlemen and ladies please ? 

If I


----------



## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> I have a Lot more information for us all to consider after this afternoon's jaunt ......
> 
> I took the van to my local tyre specialist (who knows the van well) - and he said that the blow out was caused by a 20 year old tyre !!!!  and it shredded because of its age.  I still have one other 20 year old tyre on the van,  and two 10 year old tyres, and I brand new tyre (fitted after the blowout).  So I need to sort this out quickly.
> 
> I went to the weighbridge again -  REALLY empty this time (except for half a tank of diesel).  It weighs 2330 kgs.
> 
> I told him all about the weight saga.
> 
> We discussed tyres at some length, and the types of terrain I will be going on, and how to calculate safe user payloads.
> 
> To summarise what he said : -
> 
> If I change all 4 tyres for regular camper-van tyres (which are a stronger type of tyre than 4WD tyres) - I could inflate these tyres up to a maximum of 65psi which would give me a potential user payload of 1800kgs.    (So  2330kgs empty weight + 1800kg  "stuff"  = 4130 kilos in total)
> 
> If I continued with 4WD tyres   I would only have a user payload of   870 kgs, as the maximum psi would be 44psi - so that would be 2330 empty weight, plus 870 kilos user payload =  3200 kilos.
> 
> So I now don't know what to do  -  it seems to boil down to 2 choices : -
> 
> if I get rid of the 4WD tyres, and go with standard 65psi tyres,   it will be much riskier for me to go into non-tarmac terrain, because they wont have the grip I get from my current 4WD tyres -  but I will be able to take more stuff.
> 
> If I stick with 4WD then  - how much "stuff " can I take once I have accounted for diesel and water  - being in mind that I don't know my fuel tank capacity   -  £50-£55 to fill it up.
> 
> He recommends the standard 65psi tyres  (which are cheaper for me than 4WD tyres)   - so he is not trying an upsell.
> 
> Your thoughts  gentlemen and ladies please ?
> 
> If I



My guess is your tank holds approx 50 ltrs based on your fill price, this weighs approx 45 kilos.

New tyres all round is a must, whether they be 4WD or camper tyres, I will leave to the experts.


----------



## izwozral

Forgot to add, your payload figures look pretty iffy to me, again, I would be guided by the experts on here.


----------



## vwalan

so far you have only told us what the vehicles weighs . 
we know what weight the tyres can go up to if you tell us the load rating .
but what you still dont know is the vehicles capabilities . 
without proper info its just risking your licence . etc . 
regardless of how high a load the tyres can go  can the vehicle officially?
seems the tyre fitter knows abit about tyres but not very smart on vehicles . 
dangerous person to talk to i think.


----------



## Canalsman

vwalan said:


> so far you have only told us what the vehicles weighs .
> we know what weight the tyres can go up to if you tell us the load rating .
> but what you still dont know is the vehicles capabilities .
> without proper info its just risking your licence . etc .
> regardless of how high a load the tyres can go  cant the vehicle officially?
> seems the tyre fitter knows abit about tyres but not very smart on vehicles .
> dangerous person to talk to i think.



Couldn't agree more. The start point remains - *what is the legal weight limit for the vehicle?*


----------



## Byronic

vwalan said:


> so far you have only told us what the vehicles weighs .
> we know what weight the tyres can go up to if you tell us the load rating .
> but what you still dont know is the vehicles capabilities .
> without proper info its just risking your licence . etc .
> regardless of how high a load the tyres can go  cant the vehicle officially?
> seems the tyre fitter knows abit about tyres but not very smart on vehicles .
> dangerous person to talk to i think.



And everything so far points to 2.5Tonnes GVW. A 170kg payload with I think, with some equipment already removed. The original weight reading was probably pretty accurate @ 2490kg. Leaving 10kg payload.


----------



## vwalan

it does seem that way. but i rather not guess . 
got to get the right figures really . 
once the real figures are known then at least you can stand in court and say i,m not over weight because. 
or just hope your never stopped.
the rules are there if we can use them we should . if we break them then we get punished . 
one of the reasons i changed from my old vw t2 years ago i realized i just couldnt get my gvw down good enough . 
it was ok for weekends etc but for the africa trips with loads of spares it coped but was always over weight . 
i did have it jacked up front and rear on the suspension but at times it looked low. i decided my licence was worth too much.


----------



## Byronic

The twubble my bubble is getting that damned illusive GVW.


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> If I change all 4 tyres for regular camper-van tyres (which are a stronger type of tyre than 4WD tyres) - I could inflate these tyres up to a maximum of 65psi which would give me a potential user payload of 1800kgs.    (So  2330kgs empty weight + 1800kg  "stuff"  = 4130 kilos in total)



To add to Alans point, The statement I have quoted makes little sense 

1)running at 4130 kgs would require a different class of Mot to what you have got ? Alan is that correct ? over 3500 kgs 

Forget tyres for the time being, you need to establish axle weights , did the man weigh front and seperate as we suggested ? 

I dont think for a second, (and prepared to bet and i never bet unless I am sure) Your suspension, braking system the van leaving the factory was built and designed to run at over 4100 Kgs . 

At the end of the day Collete it is a complicated area of law to get your head around and asking what MAM means in an earlier post displays a bit of naiveity. That per se is not a crime , but someone like SV tech (never used them ) having asked 101 questions could give you guidance and lead you through the maze.

It seems that complicated they can make a living out of it 

Sorry for sounding a bit brutal ,

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> And everything so far points to 2.5Tonnes GVW. A 170kg payload with I think, with some equipment already removed. The original weight reading was probably pretty accurate @ *2490kg.* Leaving 10kg payload.




I took a big load of stuff out of the van after the  2490 kilo weighbridge visit - so a reduction of  160 kgs,  down to 2330 kilos in today's weigh, seems quite sensible to me.

I have just contacted the garage in Yorkshire who worked on the other delica van whose ebay picture appears on this thread, courtesy of Mark -  they seem to think it was a 3.5 - but they could not find a plate on that one either.

Aaarggh  !!!


----------



## Chris356

Chris356 said:


> If your front tyres are from Japan they will have jis on the wall but the most important thing is when they were manufactured - in the uk and Europe they have the month and year on the tyre wall. With it being imported when it was over 10 year old it didn't need a types approval (sva) and also with it being a motor caravan even if it was under 10 year old it is exempt from the sva



I did mention the manufacture date of your Japanese tyres but won't mention the jis


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> To add to Alans point, The statement I have quoted makes little sense
> 
> 1)running at 4130 kgs would require a different class of Mot to what you have got ? Alan is that correct ? over 3500 kgs
> 
> Forget tyres for the time being, you need to establish axle weights , *did the man weigh front and seperate as we suggested ? *
> 
> I dont think for a second, (and prepared to bet and i never bet unless I am sure) Your suspension, braking system the van leaving the factory was built and designed to run at over 4100 Kgs .
> 
> At the end of the day Collete it is a complicated area of law to get your head around and asking what MAM means in an earlier post displays a bit of naiveity. That per se is not a crime , but someone like SV tech (never used them ) having asked 101 questions could give you guidance and lead you through the maze.
> 
> It seems that complicated they can make a living out of it
> 
> Sorry for sounding a bit brutal ,
> 
> Channa




I asked, but his garage did not have that facility.   I can always take it to a different public weighbridge and do a 2x2 axle weigh  tomorrow if it will help the WCV Delica Detectives .....

Channa  you are  not brutal at all..  I knew nothing about any of this  last week, and  it is indeed a steep learning curve, there's no need to apologise.

I also wonder about going to SVtech -  but that's 200 miles from me..  and I DEFFO would not drive there on the current ancient tyres


----------



## delicagirl

Chris356 said:


> I did mention the manufacture date of your Japanese tyres but won't mention the jis



jis ?

jva??


please explain


----------



## vwalan

an email or a telephone call to mitsubishi in japan might be the only way. quoting the chassis number . 
i imagine they are possibly the only ones that will know what it started life as. 
there as to be a way of finding it out.


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> an email or a *telephone call to mitsubishi in japan* might be the only way. quoting the chassis number .
> i imagine they are possibly the only ones that will know what it started life as.
> there as to be a way of finding it out.



What's the time difference  !!!!!!   I'm on it.....


----------



## vwalan

channa said:


> To add to Alans point, The statement I have quoted makes little sense
> 
> 1)running at 4130 kgs would require a different class of Mot to what you have got ? Alan is that correct ? over 3500 kgs
> 
> Forget tyres for the time being, you need to establish axle weights , did the man weigh front and seperate as we suggested ?
> 
> I dont think for a second, (and prepared to bet and i never bet unless I am sure) Your suspension, braking system the van leaving the factory was built and designed to run at over 4100 Kgs .
> 
> At the end of the day Collete it is a complicated area of law to get your head around and asking what MAM means in an earlier post displays a bit of naiveity. That per se is not a crime , but someone like SV tech (never used them ) having asked 101 questions could give you guidance and lead you through the maze.
> 
> It seems that complicated they can make a living out of it
> 
> Sorry for sounding a bit brutal ,
> 
> Channa


channa ,as a motor caravan class 4 regardless of weight . if its on the log book etc as a motor caravan . 
but licencing ,taxing , all come into a different game . 
in truth very few vans at 3,500kg have ever only had 4 wheels . there is and as been but not many . its usually double rear on the rear . 
but lets not confuse at moment .


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> What's the time difference  !!!!!!   I'm on it.....



google may tell you. i cant . 
i dont know what day it is sometimes . ha ha .


----------



## vwalan

Mitsubishi Motors Global Network
but there is a uk place . i got it off mitsubishi web site on google .
might be worth a try. its different to mitsubishi commercial .


----------



## Byronic

vwalan said:


> channa ,as a motor caravan class 4 regardless of weight . if its on the log book etc as a motor caravan .
> but licencing ,taxing , all come into a different game .
> in truth very few vans at 3,500kg have ever only had 4 wheels . there is and as been but not many . its usually double rear on the rear .
> but lets not confuse at moment .



True. An exceptional exception is the MB Sprinters, they now have a rear single wheels 4.6 tonne option. Super Tyres, things move on.


----------



## shaunr68

delicagirl said:


> What's the time difference  !!!!!!   I'm on it.....



Current Local Time in Tokyo, Japan

Do you speak Japalingo?


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> channa ,as a motor caravan class 4 regardless of weight . if its on the* log book *etc as a motor caravan .
> but licencing ,taxing , all come into a different game .
> in truth very few vans at 3,500kg have ever only had 4 wheels . there is and as been but not many . its usually double rear on the rear .
> but lets not confuse at moment .




its described on the log book as an MPV and as an 8 seater.


 I had a brain wave and have found a small steel plate screwed down in the van close to the engine...  it says

MODEL   S- LO39G  YHND
CHASSIS LO39G - 0040. 600      (this is identical to the VIN number in my log book)
ENGINE  4D56 EXT W47B
TRANS AXLE V5M21 4875
COLOR INT OPT  274

02T 000


there is also a sticky label next to the engine which has Japanese writing and     17 8 1 and 111640 Kms  on it.

Does this help hinder or get us nowhere........


----------



## mark61

vwalan said:


> channa ,as a motor caravan class 4 regardless of weight . if its on the log book etc as a motor caravan .
> but licencing ,taxing , all come into a different game .
> in truth very few vans at 3,500kg have ever only had 4 wheels . there is and as been but not many . its usually double rear on the rear .
> but lets not confuse at moment .



Just as an aside, Mercedes did away with twin rear wheels on panel vans in about 77, other rear wheel drive manufacturers followed later, while the rest of the competition being front wheel drive have only ever had 4 wheels


----------



## sak

Delicagirl said her vehicle is an 8 seater MPV on the logbook so as it isn't registered as a motorcaravan/motorhome if it was 3500kg GVW it would require a class 7 mot, does it have a class 7 mot or a class 4 ?


----------



## Canalsman

vwalan said:


> in truth very few vans at 3,500kg have ever only had 4 wheels . there is and as been but not many . its usually double rear on the rear .



My Auto Trail Dakota, 4250Kg tops, only has four wheels ... And there are I think plenty of non-tag axle 'vans around over 3500Kg.


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> Mitsubishi Motors Global Network
> but there is a uk place . i got it off mitsubishi web site on google .
> might be worth a try. its different to mitsubishi commercial .




Thanks very much -   there is a main deal at Cirencester   - not that far away   -  couple of hours maybe


----------



## vwalan

i would give a ring on the colt car referance on the link in that global bit . gotta be an answer somewhere.


----------



## Byronic

SV Tech should be able to determine the GVW, supply a Letter of Declaration that the DVLA will no doubt accept,

showing weight details, issue an updated V5, and update their records. SV Tech subsequently supply Sticky Plate.

Then if only 2.5t or thereabouts is determined to be the GVW the "fun" begins.

Hope any info received from Japan is found acceptable by the DVLA in email form and perhaps in Japanese. Are they even obliged to accept a translation done by a private individual?


----------



## delicagirl

sak said:


> Delicagirl said her vehicle is an 8 seater MPV on the logbook so as it isn't registered as a motorcaravan/motorhome if it was 3500kg GVW it would require a class 7 mot, does it have a class 7 mot or a class 4 ?





it  has a Test Class 4  MOT certificate from April this year   (and it is a Turbo)  )  and is described as a motorhome on the MOT paperwork but as MPV on the log book


----------



## sak

I just looked up class 7 mot and it is for vehicles with a GVW between 3000kg and 3500kg


----------



## delicagirl

sak said:


> I just looked at class 7 mot and it is for vehicles with a GVW between 3000kg and 3500kg




so does this mean that the MOT tester made an assumption that it was a 2500kg truck ?

Everything seems to be pointing in the direction of a 2500kg truck now  - 

so  -  if that is the case  - (as you guys have thought all along, and I was reluctant to accept)  but...  I have now I  think,.....   how can I get it upgraded - what do I have to do to the van to legitimately carry more weight and then apply for a replating via SVTech?    Maybe I should go to see them ?  I am going to Lancashire on business on Oct 7th  and could take it to them    -   but    -  what sort of tyres will I buy to get me there safely ?????   

going round in circles  I know...   but..  I wont drive it anywhere other than the garage or weigh bridge knowing I am at risk of another blowout


----------



## Byronic

sak said:


> Delicagirl said her vehicle is an 8 seater MPV on the logbook so as it isn't registered as a motorcaravan/motorhome if it was 3500kg GVW it would require a class 7 mot, does it have a class 7 mot or a class 4 ?



You are correct. I purposefully overlooked that, assuming that once the GVW was ascertained it would all be sent to Clerk Kent at the DVLA for the V5 to be updated. Mr Sharkey the importer looks as though he has a lot to answer for!


----------



## vwalan

all m,caravans regardless of weight are class 4 .


----------



## sak

vwalan said:


> all m,caravans regardless of weight are class 4 .



But as it is MPV that isn't a motorhome, I am just thinking aloud and hoping the op finds a free answer to this mega puzzle.


----------



## delicagirl

sak said:


> But as it is MPV that isn't a motorhome, I am just thinking aloud and *hoping the op finds a free answer to this mega puzzle*.



So am I hoping !!!!!


----------



## Byronic

vwalan said:


> all m,caravans regardless of weight are class 4 .



Not this one it's an 8 seat MPV. But still gets MOT'd as Class 4. So it's OK on that issue lol.


----------



## vwalan

sak said:


> But as it is MPV that isn't a motorhome, I am just thinking aloud and hoping the op finds a free answer to this mega puzzle.



its daft i know . but at the mot station they decide also can alter things on computer so what was dvla know whats happening , sometimes . 
the rules dont always follow how we think they should . 
sometimes its easier not to have to have an mot . 
there are ways .


----------



## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> so does this mean that the MOT tester made an assumption that it was a 2500kg truck ?
> 
> Everything seems to be pointing in the direction of a 2500kg truck now  -
> 
> so  -  if that is the case  - (as you guys have thought all along, and I was reluctant to accept)  but...  I have now I  think,.....   how can I get it upgraded - what do I have to do to the van to legitimately carry more weight and then apply for a replating via SVTech?    Maybe I should go to see them ?  I am going to Lancashire on business on Oct 7th  and could take it to them    -   but    -  what sort of tyres will I buy to get me there safely ?????
> 
> going round in circles  I know...   but..  I wont drive it anywhere other than the garage or weigh bridge knowing I am at risk of another blowout



You have driven many miles on old and faulty tyres without a problem until your blow out. As you like to off road and as the vehicle is 4WD then I would tend to go for 4x new 4WD tyres, then drive to SvTech and let them do their stuff.


----------



## delicagirl

David it could well be the record of an oil change as there is another label next to it with oil manufacturers initials on it...  I have only had the van since 2014 so its not anything I did -  but if it IS the kilometre milege then -  it's very odd - as  when i bought it  the clock said, (and the paperwork from the shysters dealer said)  92925   ......   surprise surprise

it could of course have been 'clocked' by the previous Japanese owner/dealer before sending it to auction in japan which is where my sharkey dealer got it from  -  there's no proof   -  but engine-performance-wise its in good   -   it ZOOMED along today with no user pay load...   maybe I should just use it nude and eat out all the time then I would not need a pay load :lol-061::lol-061::lol-061:


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## runnach

[No message]


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## delicagirl

Byronic said:


> Not this one it's an 8 seat MPV. But still gets MOT'd as Class 4. So it's OK on that issue lol.




Well that's one less thing to worry about    (where is the sardonic/sarcastic emoticon when you want it !!!!!!!!)


----------



## wildman

[*maybe I should just use it nude* and eat out all the time then I would not need a pay load :lol-061::lol-061::lol-061:[/QUOTE]
Mmm now there's an idea


----------



## delicagirl

you gotta have a  sense of humour with this van....   fortunately I do.....:wacko:


----------



## izwozral

Have you ever done a HPI check on it Collette? They start from about £2, it may come up with some interesting/disturbing information seeing as the dealer is less than honest.


----------



## colinm

This is the archive of listings in japan.
lo39g | JPN CAR NAME +FOR+SALE+JAPAN IS GOGLE BEST RESULT


----------



## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> Have you ever done a HPI check on it Collette? They start from about £2, it may come up with some interesting/disturbing information seeing as the dealer is less than honest.



and yet another little spanner is thrown into the conundrum  that is the Delica-van    ...   no  -  go on Izzie  enlighten me. :drive:  I know that a  HPI is to check if a vehicle has outstanding debt to a finance company on it  -  but this is registered as only being in the uk for about 2 months prior to my buying it .... so how would this HPI be relevant to a vehicle which has spent most of its life in Japan?


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> This is the archive of listings in japan.
> lo39g | JPN CAR NAME +FOR+SALE+JAPAN IS GOGLE BEST RESULT



Hi Colin  i think i looked through this earlier in the week  (heck its only Tuesday .....feels like we've been at this Sherlock stuff for weeks )  and i got sidetracked half way through...    are you suggesting that i look through it and hopefully find my van's details which will give us further info or to find similar vans and look at their technical specifications for a weight ?  I'm more than happy to do that as long as i know what i am looking for.


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## colinm

This listing for tipper truck with your model number is interesting.
At 0.75t capacity of this age of vehicle this would again indicate a 2.5t MAM
1992 #Mitsubishi #Delica #4×4 #Diesel #tipper #truck #dump #sale #japan | JPN CAR NAME +FOR+SALE+JAPAN IS GOGLE BEST RESULT


----------



## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> and yet another little spanner is thrown into the conundrum  that is the Delica-van    ...   no  -  go on Izzie  enlighten me. :drive:  I know that a  HPI is to check if a vehicle has outstanding debt to a finance company on it  -  but this is registered as only being in the uk for about 2 months prior to my buying it .... so how would this HPI be relevant to a vehicle which has spent most of its life in Japan?



It also establishes mileage discrepancy, vin/chassis check, log book check, insurance write off, if scrapped, import and export. Could be interesting?


----------



## colinm

This all points to your van being 2.5t, BUT there is the vague possibility it could be higher, t'other year I was looking at a Toyota, the web and all the UK toyota 'experts' told me what I was looking for didn't exist, if it wasn't for the fact i'd driven throu central america in one I might have believed them.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> This listing for tipper truck with your model number is interesting.
> At 0.75t capacity of this age of vehicle this would again indicate a 2.5t MAM
> 1992 #Mitsubishi #Delica #4×4 #Diesel #tipper #truck #dump #sale #japan | JPN CAR NAME +FOR+SALE+JAPAN IS GOGLE BEST RESULT




Yes the internal layout of the cab is identical to mine and the engine looks almost the same.  It is a 2WD though and mine is 4. 

I think the forum guys have provided me with enough evidence that it is a 2.5 truck and I must go forward on that basis.....


----------



## delicagirl

Thanks for reminding me David  -  yes I am a member... i'll go over there shortly and have a little rootle round.....

I have just remembered why I have not been there...  I cant get in  - either it does not like my user name (or I have it wrong) or it does not like my email address and I am going round and round  and round...    time for a visit to neighbours  to get some sanity in my head !!!!!!


----------



## izwozral

I am not up to speed with grey imports but wouldn't it verify the mileage, which Collette has some doubt about? Also, the chassis number hasn't been found yet [or has it?], wouldn't this come up on the HPI check?

Given the distrust Collette has with the dealer, I would have thought any verification of what is in front of Collette would be a bonus - or not.


----------



## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> Thanks for reminding me David  -  yes I am a member... i'll go over there shortly and have a little rootle round.....
> 
> I have just remembered why I have not been there...  I cant get in  - either it does not like my user name (or I have it wrong) or it does not like my email address and I am going round and round  and round...    time for a visit to neighbours  to get some sanity in my head !!!!!!



A stiff G&T works wonders in times of stress.


----------



## mark61

hairydog said:


> You're right about 4WD, but completely wrong about vans. Of course there are no twin wheeler FWD vans. But Mercedes don't make FWD vans.



Oh yes they do.


----------



## Robmac

mark61 said:


> Oh yes they do.



And how would you know Mark?

.......oh yeah, silly me!


----------



## colinm

whilst going to weighbridge empty will give some info, sometime or other you will need to know the axle weights loaded, it is possible to calculate this, but the 'easy' option is to load the van as you would intend using it, no junk, but include everything (peachy rear end and all) that is required for you to use it in an acceptable way, water, fuel, clothes, food, whatever. Only then can you work out how to proceed.
As for 4x4 tyres, there is a 235 section tyre with greater load capacity, if you have 6" or wider rims you might be able to use these, they will be slightly wider and slightly greater dia, I think they should fit ok, any decent tyre fitter will confirm.


----------



## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> Better still, use it nude and fill it with helium.




HaHa  !!   wouldn't the helium make me talk like mickey mouse ???


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## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> HaHa  !!   wouldn't the helium make me talk like mickey mouse ???



well i think minnie mouse might be more appropriate.


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## ricc

in the short term you need to replace the old tyres, ones already blown tothers could go anytime.   you can get van tyres with m&s tread (mud and snow) which will give more grip offroad than a pure road tyre. that will give tyres capable of carrying 3.5 tonnes gvw,  yes theres loads of 3.5tonne single rear wheel vans arround,  4wd tyres will give more ultimate grip but less weight capability, but were talking foot deep mud or steep slippery grass slopes.   the m&s van tyres will cope well on gravel tracks and relitavly level grass camp sites..... with my rwd transit i use m&s tyres and carry a set of snow chains for wet grass.
it does rather look like your actually 2.5 tonne gvw, which means your only actually legal to 2.5 whatever tyres youve got, if you go the replating to 3.5 route youll need the van tyres for that weight.

having sorted the tyres you have several options

keep below 2.5 tonnes ,loose as much weight as possible , only carry whats essential...dont carry a months food when your passing shops every day or two.


or keep as close to 2.5 as possible and hope your not unlucky and get pulled in and weighed, legally its a risk, mechanically if youre driving sensibly brakes ,chassis and suspension have pleanty of reseve capacity that you wont reach the engineering limits.  they are designed with a factor of safety.... usually means you work out the numbers then double the answeres just in case.
if your rear sags it may be worth fitting a new set of heavy duty springs.. depends on whats available off the shelf, or there are companies that will make spings 

belt and braces and most expensive is the replate to 3.5 tonnes route, if its possible


personally id fit new m&s van tyres and try and keep the weight down and see how that works out


----------



## delicagirl

ricc said:


> in the short term you need to replace the old tyres, ones already blown tothers could go anytime.   you can get van tyres with m&s tread (mud and snow) which will give more grip offroad than a pure road tyre. that will give tyres capable of carrying 3.5 tonnes gvw,  yes theres loads of 3.5tonne single rear wheel vans arround,  4wd tyres will give more ultimate grip but less weight capability, but were talking foot deep mud or steep slippery grass slopes.   the m&s van tyres will cope well on gravel tracks and relitavly level grass camp sites..... with my rwd transit i use m&s tyres and carry a set of snow chains for wet grass.
> it does rather look like your actually 2.5 tonne gvw, which means your only actually legal to 2.5 whatever tyres youve got, if you go the replating to 3.5 route youll need the van tyres for that weight.
> 
> having sorted the tyres you have several options
> 
> keep below 2.5 tonnes ,loose as much weight as possible , only carry whats essential...dont carry a months food when your passing shops every day or two.
> 
> 
> or keep as close to 2.5 as possible and hope your not unlucky and get pulled in and weighed, legally its a risk, mechanically if youre driving sensibly brakes ,chassis and suspension have pleanty of reseve capacity that you wont reach the engineering limits.  they are designed with a factor of safety.... usually means you work out the numbers then double the answeres just in case.
> if your rear sags it may be worth fitting a new set of heavy duty springs.. depends on whats available off the shelf, or there are companies that will make spings
> 
> belt and braces and most expensive is the replate to 3.5 tonnes route, if its possible
> 
> 
> *personally id fit new m&s van tyres and try and keep the weight down and see how that works out*




I think that is a really sensible idea   - 

  i also like the earlier idea of filling my van back up again  (without the un-necessary "stuff" i hoiked out of it today) and then re-weighing it.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> whilst going to weighbridge empty will give some info, sometime or other you will need to know the axle weights loaded, it is possible to calculate this, but the 'easy' option is to load the van as you would intend using it, no junk, but include everything (peachy rear end and all) that is required for you to use it in an acceptable way, water, fuel, clothes, food, whatever. Only then can you work out how to proceed.
> As for 4x4 tyres, there is a 235 section tyre with greater load capacity, if you have 6" or wider rims you might be able to use these, they will be slightly wider and slightly greater dia, I think they should fit ok, any decent tyre fitter will confirm.




Thank you  -   this is also a sensible suggestion - and the larger tyres would give me some extra payload.   I'll go talk to the tyre man again tomorrow - then begin to fill up the van again and go to a different weighbridge   -  i really cant go back to the same weighbridge for the third time in a week can i ???  They didn't charge me today and would think i am taking the mick if i turn up again !!


----------



## mark61

Have read a few times now that 4WD tyres will have a lower load rating than a commercial tyre. I for one, am going to need some facts to back a statement like that up. 

I have all terrain tyres fitted, their load rating is a fair bit higher then the standard tyres. Just like standard tyres, there is a huge range.


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Thank you  -   this is also a sensible suggestion - and the larger tyres would give me some extra payload.   I'll go talk to the tyre man again tomorrow - then begin to fill up the van again and go to a different weighbridge   -  i really cant go back to the same weighbridge for the third time in a week can i ???  They didn't charge me today and would think i am taking the mick if i turn up again !!



The important bit will be getting front and rear axle weights to see if tyres and/or suspension are over loaded.
It looks like you will struggle to keep within 2.5t and have a van suitable for your needs, but there may well be some scope to up this as just a paperwork job, if an axle is overloaded that will require a physical change such as air assistance, we don't at this moment know the designed axle limits, but it will be greater than 1/2 the MAM, anyone want to take a guess at designed axle limit? I would guess at 1.35t or maybe with luck as high as 1.5t.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> *The important bit will be getting front and rear axle weights* to see if tyres and/or suspension are over loaded.
> It looks like you will struggle to keep within 2.5t and have a van suitable for your needs, but there may well be some scope to up this as just a paperwork job, if an axle is overloaded that will require a physical change such as air assistance, we don't at this moment know the designed axle limits, but it will be greater than 1/2 the MAM, anyone want to take a guess at designed axle limit? I would guess at 1.35t or maybe with luck as high as 1.5t.



Thank you Colin   -   Just so i am sure what is needed  -  do i go to a different weighbridge, and then put my front wheels ONLY on the weighplate, get a reading from that, then put the back two wheels only on the weighbridge and get that reading -  preferably when the van is utterly empty of "stuff" ?  ?

Maybe you might explain why it is important to know why each axle needs to be weighed separately please ?   thank you


----------



## colinm

mark61 said:


> Have read a few times now that 4WD tyres will have a lower load rating than a commercial tyre. I for one, am going to need some facts to back a statement like that up.
> 
> I have all terrain tyres fitted, their load rating is a fair bit higher then the standard tyres. Just like standard tyres, there is a huge range.



In 225/70-15 the only offroad tyres I can find are up to 100 load index, whereas van tyres can be had as 112 load index thats 40% extra capacity.


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Thank you Colin   -   Just so i am sure what is needed  -  do i go to a different weighbridge, and then put my front wheels ONLY on the weighplate, get a reading from that, then put the back two wheels only on the weighbridge and get that reading -  preferably when the van is utterly empty of "stuff" ?  ?
> 
> Maybe you might explain why it is important to know why each axle needs to be weighed separately please ?   thank you



Close but no bananas, you need to do this loaded up.
Each axle will have a designed limit (which we don't at moment know) and each tyre will have a limit to the load it can carry, this we do know. Somehow or other you should be able to track down the axle limits, if not a best guess will have to suffice, but that's really the last resort.
As an example, my van is plated at 3.5t, the front axle has a limit of 2.1t, the rear axle has a limit of 2.4t,


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Close but no bananas, you need to do this loaded up.
> Each axle will have a designed limit (which we don't at moment know) and each tyre will have a limit to the load it can carry, this we do know. Somehow or other you should be able to track down the axle limits, if not a best guess will have to suffice, but that's really the last resort.
> As an example, *my van is plated at 3.5t, the front axle has a limit of 2.1t, the rear axle has a limit of 2.4t*,



so although the plate says you cannot carry more than 3.5tonne  (you, van and 'stuff' combined weight)   -   your 2 axles will safely carry  2.1+2.4  = 4.5 tons  -  have I understood this ?


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> Thank you  -   this is also a sensible suggestion - and the larger tyres would give me some extra payload.   I'll go talk to the tyre man again tomorrow - then begin to fill up the van again and go to a different weighbridge   -  i really cant go back to the same weighbridge for the third time in a week can i ???  They didn't charge me today and would think i am taking the mick if i turn up again !!



When you do start to bring your gear back into the van, it might be an idea to make sure the heavy stuff is low down and put the lighter kit in the higher cupboard
Would help keep the CoG (Centre of Gravity) as low as possible, as I recall you were concerned about being a little top-heavy;  and if you are carrying books, they add up to a lot of weight and it is easy to just automatically put them on high shelves.
If you tell the weightbridge people what you are doing and why, they may well be intrigued and would want to keep weighing the vehicle to see how it goes (I think I would be if someone came to me with this task  )

The earlier suggestion of M&S Commercial Van Tyres sounds very sensible, giving probably as much off-road capability as you would realistically want in the Delica with the extra strength of a van tyre construction.


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Thank you Colin   -   Just so i am sure what is needed  -  do i go to a different weighbridge, and then put my front wheels ONLY on the weighplate, get a reading from that, then put the back two wheels only on the weighbridge and get that reading -  preferably when the van is utterly empty of "stuff" ?  ?
> 
> Maybe you might explain why it is important to know why each axle needs to be weighed separately please ?   thank you



Close but no bananas, you need to do this loaded up.
Each axle will have a designed limit (which we don't at moment know) and each tyre will have a limit to the load it can carry, this we do know. The load on your axles is very unlikely to be same front and back, one or other (probably back) will be higher, you need to know it's not so high it is overloading the tyre/axle.  Somehow or other you should be able to track down the axle limits, if not a best guess will have to suffice, but that's really the last resort.
As an example, my van is plated at 3.5t, the front axle has a limit of 2.1t, the rear axle has a limit of 2.4t,


----------



## mark61

delicagirl said:


> so although the plate says you cannot carry more than 3.5tonne  (you, van and 'stuff' combined weight)   -   your 2 axles will safely carry  2.1+2.4  = 4.5 tons  -  have I understood this ?




No, the 3.5 tonne is the max weight.  The combined axle weights always equal more then the GVW, just to give some leeway with loading.


----------



## wildebus

mark61 said:


> No, the 3.5 tonne is the max weight.  The combined axle weights always equal more then the GVW, just to give some leeway with loading.


With a key thing being that your tyres should be a minimum of 1/2 the maximum axle weight. So in the example above, even thought it is a 3.5t van, you would need tyres rated at 1.2t at a minimum soas to match the potential loading.


----------



## colinm

delicagirl said:


> so although the plate says you cannot carry more than 3.5tonne  (you, van and 'stuff' combined weight)   -   your 2 axles will safely carry  2.1+2.4  = 4.5 tons  -  have I understood this ?



Might have been better if I had used another van as example.
Fiat build my van as 4t, but many like mine are sold plated as 3.5t.
So I can safely carry 2.1t on front axle, or 2.4t on rear axle as long as total doesn't exceed 4t, but legaly I can only carry 3.5t.
All vans AFAIK, the total of both axle loads is greater than the plated weight, this allows you to be at max load but be slightly unbalanced front to back.


----------



## delicagirl

i have tracked down the email address of  Mitsubishi  Head office in Japan, so i have just contacted them, with all the info we have and a photo, to ask its weight.  I also have a direct phone number so can call them if i don't get  a response.  Fingers crossed.


----------



## ricc

easiest way to explain axle weights is to take a 3,5 tonne flatbed truck...  

gross wight,  gvw, mam is 3.5 tonne 
(gross train weight... vehicle and trailer say 5 tonnes)


unladen weight of truck , kerb weight ,  2 tonnes 

max load  is then 1.5 tonnes


with an empty 2 tonne truck there could easily be more weight on front axle than on the back  say 1.5 on front axle and .5 on rear

then stick a 1.5 tonne concrete block on the extreem rear of the load bed.  all the added weight is on the rear axle, now 1.5 on front and 2 on rear
move the concrete block to the front ofthe loadbed...assume weight is split between both axles front now has 1.5 pluss .75    ...2.25  rear has -5 plus .75  ....  1.25


though its only a 3.5 tonne truck each axle could have to carry  more than half the weight.  2.25 on the front in this theoretical example .

in practice the engineers will overengineer the axles , probably each will take over 3 tonne easily , limiting factor will be the tyres...  both from design load when new and degradation over time.


----------



## vwalan

[No message]


----------



## Tbear

POI Admin said:


> Couldn't agree more. The start point remains - *what is the legal weight limit for the vehicle?*



And there is a legal weight limit for some very good reasons. You are putting your life and others at risk by going well over it. I am sure that many of us have gone over weight at times, travelling with full tanks now and again must put me over a little but constantly going well over is a serious accident weighting to happen. I know I am sounding like a broken record on this one but its not just a day in court or the cost of a new tyre you need to worry about.

Richard


----------



## vwalan

lots of imports dont have train weights , american pickups are renown for it . 
fifth wheel owners can easily get caught out with it . 
mind even uk built vehicles dont always show train weights . i had a 13ton dodge that never had one from new . 
its not just uk though that dont fill every thing in on log books . germany ,holland and france i used to import vw,s from and they all have discrepancies . 
mind uk is much stricter mot than the others . lots vehicles pass abroad that wouldnt pass in uk. 
but it was interesting the upped weight on your plates . 
i prefer down plating , its the way forward for over 70,s and have big payloads in their fivers .


----------



## wildebus

I think there are variances which are due to the time the vehicles are registered?
I just had a look at 4 V5Cs I have for 4 different vehicles and they all show different types of info regarding weight...

1) The oldest is a VW T4 from Year 2000, which started life as a commercial panel van, but ended up as a MOTOR CARAVAN, with taxation class of PLG (as it was a panel van originally)
The VIN plate has weight info, but the V5C has NO weight info whatsoever; and also does no show a M1/N1 type definition (think that came in in 2001?).
Annoyingly, I don't have a copy of the old V5C before I sent it away for reclassification as a Camper to compare.

2) I have a V5C from my old RAV4 from 2004. This is an ESTATE, and taxation class is PETROL CAR.  This has an M1 Vehicle Category.
This has no MPM (Max permissible weight), but DOES have a Mass in Service.  It had no towing masses indicated (but towbars are made and used with these vehicles)
Something else that appears on this V5C is emissions info

3) Got a V5C from my VW Shuttle from 2008.  This is classed as an MPV, Taxation Class DIESEL CAR. This has an M1 Category 
Wth this vehicle, I see a MPM quoted as well as a Mass In Service. I also see towing mass data appearing on the V5C. This V5C also has a Revenue Weight recorded.
Something else that appeared is Sound Level Data as well as Emissions Info.

4) Finally a V5C from my DS5 from 2013. This is classed as a 5 Door Hatchback, Taxation Class DIESEL CAR. This has an M1 Category
This V5C contains all the same info as the 2008 Shuttle, including MPM, Mass in Service, towing mass data, emissions and sound levels, but has no Revenue Weight.


So it very much seems to me that what info is included in a V5C is heavily dependant on the age of the vehicle and when it was registered. As time as gone on, more and more information has been recorded on new registrations, and the registration document enlarged to allow for that info, but when the standard V5C is reissued on older vehicles for whatever reason (change of owner/address/reg number/etc), those extra fields are blank not because they are not relevant, but because the information was not originally recorded as the time of first registration.

How that compares to other European Countries I don't know, but I would imagine there are plenty of little nuances in each Country that are not followed by other ones, but it is of course the UK ones that are important.


So .... for a 1992/1993 MPV, it is likely there are LOADS of fields that are not populated on the V5C, purely because in 1992/1993 they just were not required by the DVLA, and the V5C is a catch all form for EVERY Registered Vehicle in the UK from oldest to newest.


----------



## delicagirl

Tbear said:


> And there is a legal weight limit for some very good reasons. *You are putting your life and others at risk by going well over it*. I am sure that many of us have gone over weight at times, travelling with full tanks now and again must put me over a little but constantly going well over is a serious accident weighting to happen. I know I am sounding like a broken record on this one but its not just a day in court or the cost of a new tyre you need to worry about.
> 
> Richard





I do know that now Richard  which is why i am putting so much effort into finding out.  As i have said all through this thread, this search is all about safety - mine and others.     I am, indeed quite shocked, that inadvertently i have been over loading my van - i know ignorance is no excuse, but with the many obstacles we have all encountered on this thread to find my "van weight"  its no wonder i didn't know.   Driving back from the garage and to the weigh bridge yesterday knowing i was on such old tyres was really quite scary. 

Lets hope Mitsuibish respond quickly to my email.


----------



## vwalan

hi, yes i understand hymer upped it really .its a shame hymer didnt seem to put an up plate on the vehicle . they are as lax as dvla.
this where confusion sets in . 
life just isnt easy. 
my log book quotes the revenue weight ...no other weights . 
but its original ministry plating certificate shows axle ,gvw and train weights . plus tyre size and load rating . and single on front double on rear. 
as it is its now plating and testing exempt . i still keep the paperwork but now its a tractor body type .2axle+artic wheelplan.


----------



## Tbear

delicagirl said:


> I do know that now Richard  which is why i am putting so much effort into finding out.  As i have said all through this thread, this search is all about safety - mine and others.     I am, indeed quite shocked, that inadvertently i have been over loading my van - i know ignorance is no excuse, but with the many obstacles we have all encountered on this thread to find my "van weight"  its no wonder i didn't know.   Driving back from the garage and to the weigh bridge yesterday knowing i was on such old tyres was really quite scary.
> 
> Lets hope Mitsuibish respond quickly to my email.



My comments where not aimed at you as you are clearly doing the best you can to sort it out and make as many people aware of the problem as posible. More the bit more pressure in the tyres and you will be fine attitude of some.

Richard


----------



## Byronic

You said on another thread that old Merc. vans are slow. The pic. attach. View attachment 46500gives a clue as to why Mercedes vans of yesteryear are slow. The VIN PLATE is actually an aluminium plate, not a piece of kitchen foil.
And Teutonic efficiency depicts what should be shown on a VIN PLATE.


----------



## delicagirl

i also contacted SVTech this morning and spoke to a guy who knew all about the problems of japanes grey imports  - i have sent him a photo of the van and all the info we have found up to now....  so again  i am waiting to hear back from him also.


----------



## delicagirl

Mitsuibishi UK  have replied to my other email:-

" The Mitsubishi Delica isn’t a genuine UL specification vehicle, therefore, I am unable to provide you with the information that you require.

I can however confirm that all vehicles have plates fitted which confirm the vehicles kerb weight, gross vehicle weight and the maximum towing weight. Again as model isn’t a UK specification I cannot confirm where specifically these plates will be located."

Lets hope Mitsubishi in  Japan will provide something when they wake up ......   they are 9 hours ahead


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Hi ya,
Well at least you are making 'Some' headway..
So my question is, (& one I touched on earlier in the thread) . With all this doubt on available information.
What 'Vehicle Details' have your insurance company infact Coverd ?.
Have you 'Actually' been insured all this time & make sure you're infact insured NOW ?.
If yes,,,Then phone them & ask for the Weight Parameters, Class of vehicle & listed 'Usage' (eg Motorcaravan etc) & if you have Breakdown with your insurance as is often the case, is your vehicle within the maximum recoverable weight allowed.
By doing this you 'May' get some more information, or at the very least get it in writing that your insurance & Breakdown covers you & your vehicle regardless of the minimum information they hold. 
I may not have put that very well in this post, but hope you can kinda get my point lol.


----------



## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> Hi ya,
> Well at least you are making 'Some' headway..
> So my question is, (& one I touched on earlier in the thread) . With all this doubt on available information.
> What 'Vehicle Details' have your insurance company infact Coverd ?.
> Have you 'Actually' been insured all this time & make sure you're infact insured NOW ?.
> If yes,,,Then phone them & ask for the Weight Parameters, Class of vehicle & listed 'Usage' (eg Motorcaravan etc) & if you have Breakdown with your insurance as is often the case, is your vehicle within the maximum recoverable weight allowed.
> By doing this you 'May' get some more information, or at the very least get it in writing that your insurance & Breakdown covers you & your vehicle regardless of the minimum information they hold.
> I may not have put that very well in this post, but hope you can kinda get my point lol.




Thanks  -  my van certainly is recoverable as i was trailered home recently from Lancashire to Somerset with a suspected Broken Clutch (turned out to be a slave cylinder). My vehicle is insured and Recovered via AIB  who were fantastic.  But i take your point about checking what details they have on their computer.


----------



## Dowel

I have been following this thread with interest. I had assumed that you had already found some info on the Delica owners club forum but, reading that you could not access the site, wondered if the following might be of any help:

From:  Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™  -  Mitsubishi Delica L300 and L400 Owners Club

Thread title: L300 with JB500 body
_Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 with JB500 body

Ho55	Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 14:53
tyre sticker is next to the Latch on the B-Pillar on mine, front is 2.4Bar=35 psi  and rear is 3.0bar=43psi 

Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:52
Mines a turbo but doesn't have a T on the engine number...it has it on the Model number, look in front of the drivers seat there will be a flap in the carpet that is behind your knees when sat in the seat, lift that, your 'data plate' should be underneath top line is model number mine reads [KC-P25T-HNJT] p25 is chassis type the T is for turbo

Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:02
Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 Vehicle Identification  ...clicky that link and it will take you to a post in L300 FAQ's to help you decode your chassis number

Has photos of locations for Chassis No and VIN plate posted by

Mystery Machine	Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 21:01_

Interesting that the plate shown in the link does not include any weight information. My little van has a VIN plate similar to those posted by David and others showing:
Kerb weight
Gross train weight
Max weight on front axle
Max weight on rear axle

I do hope that Mitsubishi Japan will be able to give you all the info you need although it may be that they only have info for the base vehicle before conversion. 

If so I hope you will be able to get more from the company who made the conversion and may have uprated various components: wheels, supension and so on to increase the payload.

If not I guess it is time to call in SVTech.

Apolgies if you have already seen this info

Do you know someone called Clottie from Somerset?

Have you posted a photo of your van? I assumed it would look like those 4x4 monsters that Russians like to blast through the wilderness, as can be seen in youtube videos.


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Brilliant,,,

It's just that I know some policies only covers up to a certain weight/Length of vehicle. So if you already have been recovered, then all good on that then.
As I said in post number 2, SV tech was of great help to me, Hope they come through for you.

BTW
Have you got a number on your dash by the bottom edge of your front window, better visible from the outside !. If so this might help !


----------



## delicagirl

Dowel said:


> I have been following this thread with interest. I had assumed that you had already found some info on the Delica owners club forum but, reading that you could not access the site, wondered if the following might be of any help:
> 
> From:  Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™  -  Mitsubishi Delica L300 and L400 Owners Club
> 
> Thread title: L300 with JB500 body
> _Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 with JB500 body
> 
> Ho55	Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 14:53
> tyre sticker is next to the Latch on the B-Pillar on mine, front is 2.4Bar=35 psi  and rear is 3.0bar=43psi
> 
> Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:52
> Mines a turbo but doesn't have a T on the engine number...it has it on the Model number, look in front of the drivers seat there will be a flap in the carpet that is behind your knees when sat in the seat, lift that, your 'data plate' should be underneath top line is model number mine reads [KC-P25T-HNJT] p25 is chassis type the T is for turbo
> 
> Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 9:02
> Mitsubishi Delica Owners Club UK™ :: View topic - L300 Vehicle Identification  ...clicky that link and it will take you to a post in L300 FAQ's to help you decode your chassis number
> 
> Has photos of locations for Chassis No and VIN plate posted by
> 
> Mystery Machine	Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 21:01_
> 
> Interesting that the plate shown in the link does not include any weight information. My little van has a VIN plate similar to those posted by David and others showing:
> Kerb weight
> Gross train weight
> Max weight on front axle
> Max weight on rear axle
> 
> I do hope that Mitsubishi Japan will be able to give you all the info you need although it may be that they only have info for the base vehicle before conversion.
> 
> If so I hope you will be able to get more from the company who made the conversion and may have uprated various components: wheels, supension and so on to increase the payload.
> 
> If not I guess it is time to call in SVTech.
> 
> Apolgies if you have already seen this info
> 
> Do you know someone called Clottie from Somerset?
> 
> Have you posted a photo of your van? I assumed it would look like those 4x4 monsters that Russians like to blast through the wilderness, as can be seen in youtube videos.


 

Hi thank you for that copy and paste  - i had seen that thread a while back when i could get in  and i had also copied and pasted it -   the sheet  with all the codings on it that "identifies " the van's characteristics makes no sense whatsover with my van's VIN number. 

There are some photos of my van in my profile here on this website.


----------



## mark61

They are considered slow these days, truth is they performed up hill and downhill, just as well, if not better than their contemporaries, it's just you wont find many of those on the road these days to compare.


----------



## ricc

given that an insurance company has covered it based on details supplied id not contact them until i was sure those details were wrong and had correct details to replace them.
tell them your unsure it is actually as described on the log book or dvla database.... when it may well be as described ... they will suspend cover then your in the poo , probably unneccessarily. cos it is actually 2.5 tonne gvw , youve just got to stay light until svtech or whoever can give you new heavier details to give to the insurance co.  or mitsubushi can confirm its more than 2,5 gvw


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> Mitsuibishi UK  have replied to my other email:-
> 
> " The Mitsubishi Delica isn’t a genuine UL specification vehicle, therefore, I am unable to provide you with the information that you require.
> 
> I can however confirm that all vehicles have plates fitted which confirm the vehicles kerb weight, gross vehicle weight and the maximum towing weight. Again as model isn’t a UK specification I cannot confirm where specifically these plates will be located."
> 
> Lets hope Mitsubishi in  Japan will provide something when they wake up ......   they are 9 hours ahead


 Diplomatically tells us the square root of **** all ....It would be  a brave person to actually state weights Do we know who did the motorhome conversion ? stating the obvious but i dont see that avenue explored. They really are the people to be speaking too 

Channa


----------



## runnach

Allow me to expand on that , we supplied Citroen c15 chassis cabs to Romahome. They had 765 kgs  to play with. So if the body weighed 400 kgs they had 365 kgs to play with. Of course from that 365 kgs you have the weight of occupants to factor in leaving payload. If and assumption on my part the customer elected extras that weigh something that reduces the payload. It is for this reason tracking the bodybuilder and their stats is a prudent move 

Channa

If japan reply the vehicle left the factory 1500 kgs with a capacity of 1000 kgs and your vehicle weighs 2350 kgs minus occupants and fuel you have 150 kgs to play with ...i.e fuel water chattels and yourself eat into that 150 kg figure I hope that makes sense .


----------



## mark61

channa said:


> Allow me to expand on that , we supplied Citroen c15 chassis cabs to Romahome. They had 765 kgs  to play with. So if the body weighed 400 kgs they had 365 kgs to play with. Of course from that 365 kgs you have the weight of occupants to factor in leaving payload. If and assumption on my part the customer elected extras that weigh something that reduces the payload. It is for this reason tracking the bodybuilder and their stats is a prudent move




I haven't been able to get very far with that. In fact now searching for JB500 returns links to this thread 

Have seen links to JB500's on this model of L300, and the later model, but haven't got anywhere as to finding who the actual converter is. Hopefully someone else may have more fruitful searches.


----------



## Byronic

mark61 said:


> They are considered slow these days, truth is they performed up hill and downhill, just as well, if not better than their contemporaries, it's just you wont find many of those on the road these days to compare.



I've had mine since near new that's over 20 years. By todays standards it is slow admittedly, but by the standards prevailing 20 years ago it was.......... slow, just not quite as slow, lol. 
There were turbo charged/intercooled variations that were faster than mine, perhaps what you're recalling.
Anyway it's a bloody motorcaravan, I bought the thing to go slow. I make reasonable efforts to get out of the way of those desiring to go faster than myself.


----------



## delicagirl

The converter/company that built the habitation box  has to be German as all switches etc are labelled in german - but there is no indication anywhere of who that is.

I lifted all the cab seats today and all the rubber mats and there is no plate in there anywhere  - i think someone has removed it.

The final place to look i guess is on the chassis  - so i will crawl under there tomorrow with a torch and see if i can see anything at all...


----------



## Tbear

delicagirl said:


> The converter/company that built the habitation box  has to be German as all switches etc are labelled in german - but there is no indication anywhere of who that is.
> 
> I lifted all the cab seats today and all the rubber mats and there is no plate in there anywhere  - i think someone has removed it.
> 
> The final place to look i guess is on the chassis  - so i will crawl under there tomorrow with a torch and see if i can see anything at all...



You need to decide what you are going to say to the clever git who spots it straight away. 

Richard


----------



## delicagirl

Tbear said:


> You need to decide what you are going to say to the clever git who spots it straight away.
> 
> Richard




"Would you like a bottle of whisky?"  comes to mind immediately   :dance:

my garage mechanics and i had a good old rootle round the van again today, looking everywhere  and he checked the  www for hints n tips.....


----------



## delicagirl

I'lll go back to the weigh bridge tomorrow and get the axles individually weighed


----------



## Canalsman

delicagirl said:


> The converter/company that built the habitation box  has to be German as all switches etc are labelled in german - but there is no indication anywhere of who that is.
> 
> I lifted all the cab seats today and all the rubber mats and there is no plate in there anywhere  - i think someone has removed it.
> 
> The final place to look i guess is on the chassis  - so i will crawl under there tomorrow with a torch and see if i can see anything at all...



Long odds but I wonder if this company might have done the conversion:

Günstige Reisemobile in Braunschweig - kaufen oder mieten Sie Ihr Wohnmobil bei uns

The proprietor/owner appears to Jens Brinkmann (JB) and they have been in the motorhome trade for 24 years.

Might be worth sending them an email ...


----------



## Robmac

Regarding the plate and other info, it may be worth ringing these people for advice, as they are used to dealing with imports etc;

The UK's No 1 used Japanese car Importer, cars direct from Japan supplied registered in the UK. Over 20 years experience, ANY vehicle imported and supplied UK registered at the best prices by Algys Autos Ltd, the best used Japanese car Importer based

Or are you going to tell me that they supplied it in the first place! (Sorry, I haven't read the whole thread).


----------



## delicagirl

Robmac said:


> Regarding the plate and other info, it may be worth ringing these people for advice, as they are used to dealing with imports etc;
> 
> The UK's No 1 used Japanese car Importer, cars direct from Japan supplied registered in the UK. Over 20 years experience, ANY vehicle imported and supplied UK registered at the best prices by Algys Autos Ltd, the best used Japanese car Importer based
> 
> Or are you going to tell me that they supplied it in the first place! (Sorry, I haven't read the whole thread).



Thanks Rob - i will call them tomorrow  -   their website says they only deal in cars, but i can call and check it out...  just in case.  no i did not buy it from them !!


----------



## delicagirl

POI Admin said:


> Long odds but I wonder if this company might have done the conversion:
> 
> Günstige Reisemobile in Braunschweig - kaufen oder mieten Sie Ihr Wohnmobil bei uns
> 
> The proprietor/owner appears to Jens Brinkmann (JB) and they have been in the motorhome trade for 24 years.
> 
> Might be worth sending them an email ...



i just did that thank you.


----------



## Robmac

delicagirl said:


> Thanks Rob - i will call them tomorrow  -   their website says they only deal in cars, but i can call and check it out...  just in case.  no i did not buy it from them !!



Sorry Collette, I should have sent you a different link. They also deal in campers/motorhomes;

Toyota Hiace campervan for sale UK Registered, Isuzu Elf, Winnebago and all Campervan imported direct from Japan and supplied UK registered by Algys Autos Ltd


----------



## delicagirl

Robmac said:


> Sorry Collette, I should have sent you a different link. They also deal in campers/motorhomes;
> 
> Toyota Hiace campervan for sale UK Registered, Isuzu Elf, Winnebago and all Campervan imported direct from Japan and supplied UK registered by Algys Autos Ltd





Thanks again Rob  i will call them tomorrow -  they have vans very similar to mine and some contain an identical upholstery pattern so they may know the habitation builder as well......   another lead...  yea !!


Rob  - whilst investigating this lead i discovered that Argys insist on full payment for a vehicle, which can only be seen on their internet advert, because the vehicle is still on board a ship from Japan.  Their internet reviews are "not terribly encouraging."  It seems that most of the vans they buy in Japan are bought by UK Dealers sight-unseen.


----------



## Dowel

Ho55's van from Delica owners club forum looks very like yours




Photo tag is:
"(P25T) L300 Chassis Cab with a JB 500 Coachbuilt Camper Body, Rear LSD Diff, Front Locker diff, Lesjofors Rear Springs, Pajero GenII rims".


----------



## mark61

Come across this site, haven't had time to go through it though. Might have some useful info though. 

L300-Wohnmobil.info


----------



## ricc

looks like the same one wints found

refers to 1982 spec  so probably not eally relevant.... least hope so cos its 2 tonne max on there.


----------



## Livotlout

The JB500 is a conversion by Vantec of Japan......


----------



## delicagirl

Thank you everyone  for all the massive time and effort you have all been putting in to solve this conundrum.   i have now had a response fro Mitsubishi HQ in Japan (oh that uk businesses could turn round an email enquiry in less than 12 hours and with a 9 hour time difference  !!  i digress)    They have sent me the axle weights.

i will be discussing this with SV Tech this afternoon and will then come back to inform you all of what my options are .....


----------



## runnach

I suspect Mitsubishi Uk are unable to provide a CoC on the basis the Delicia was never a UK official import. unlike your Honda and motorcycle which were imported to the uK. Part of a CoC is that the vehicle complies with member states rules and regulations ( one of the reasons the Renault Twingo was never imported).

Perhaps we are looking at this the wrong way talking to importers, but perhaps better looking at exporters in Japan may be more fruitful ? 

Channa


----------



## colinm

Any more news?


----------



## delicagirl

Hi  - Sorry  -  its been a while.   Eventually i was able to contact the Japanese HQ of Mitsubish, (who took 2 hours to reply i spite of a 9 hours time difference!!)  and they gave me my 2 separate  axle weights  - and so i have a payload to work to now.   I emptied the van completely of all water, all my stuff etc  filled it with diesel and went to the weigh bridge again  ...   and so i now know how much stuff/water/food/books/clothes/music i can put in there and am currently weighing what came out,  to see where savings can be made,  and what stuff can go back in.

I can really recommend this to everyone if you are concerned....  it might be tedious, but it actually made me assess my priorities as to what i needed.  Until i finish the weighing and the spreadsheet i wont know what i can take and what i will leave behind.  But it is looking far less problematic than i first thought. 

I am also having it plated by SVTECH. 

If anyone has any weight saving ideas which will help others then maybe s/he could start a new thread and everyone can benefit, including those who have not seen this thread. For example a WCer suggested that i  substitute smaller lightweight saucepans and indeed this made a difference. I also cut down my cutlery, crockery and the amount of shampoo i used to carry !!

So my Delica Detectives, thank you for all your help and suggestions - they were all useful and taught me a lot about things i'd previously known nothing about.

I think our Motto should be     YOU CAN RELY ON A WC.    ....    maybe not  -  back to the drawing board !!!


----------



## The laird

delicagirl said:


> Hi  - Sorry  -  its been a while.   Eventually i was able to contact the Japanese HQ of Mitsubish, (who took 2 hours to reply i spite of a 9 hours time difference!!)  and they gave me my 2 separate  axle weights  - and so i have a payload to work to now.   I emptied the van completely of all water, all my stuff etc  filled it with diesel and went to the weigh bridge again  ...   and so i now know how much stuff/water/food/books/clothes/music i can put in there and am currently weighing what came out,  to see where savings can be made,  and what stuff can go back in.
> 
> I can really recommend this to everyone if you are concerned....  it might be tedious, but it actually made me assess my priorities as to what i needed.  Until i finish the weighing and the spreadsheet i wont know what i can take and what i will leave behind.  But it is looking far less problematic than i first thought.
> 
> I am also having it plated by SVTECH.
> 
> If anyone has any weight saving ideas which will help others then maybe s/he could start a new thread and everyone can benefit, including those who have not seen this thread. For example a WCer suggested that i  substitute smaller lightweight saucepans and indeed this made a difference. I also cut down my cutlery, crockery and the amount of shampoo i used to carry !!
> 
> So my Delica Detectives, thank you for all your help and suggestions - they were all useful and taught me a lot about things i'd previously known nothing about.
> 
> I think our Motto should be     YOU CAN RELY ON A WC.    ....    maybe not  -  back to the drawing board !!!


A wc is gonna put yer weight back up&#55357;&#56441;&#55357;&#56441;


----------



## colinm

So what where the figures given and what are your actuals?
I maybe should explain that 'weight and balance' is part of my work (aircraft not vehicles) so I have an interest in these things.


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> So what where the figures given and what are your actuals?
> I maybe should explain that 'weight and balance' is part of my work (aircraft not vehicles) so I have an interest in these things.



When i have finished the "stuff-weighing" i will come back and give you the readings colin - but that may not be till next week as this week is crazy and i am going away in a very safe van for the weekend !!


----------



## delicagirl

i am going away with minimal stuff for a short weekend break  - so i wont be filling the van/weighing all my stuff as if i were off on one of my long trips - i will finish doing that next week.  does that makes sense David


----------



## runnach

Crikey Collette 36 pages of people trying to help, It would be interesting to know what Mitsibushi have said, lots of conjecture on the weights my point, so from the horses mouth to coin a phrase be interesting to know. 

Channa


----------



## runnach

colinmd said:


> So what where the figures given and what are your actuals?
> I maybe should explain that 'weight and balance' is part of my work (aircraft not vehicles) so I have an interest in these things.



We shall have no AUTOW'S around here thank you :tongue:however could be useful for the vr speed :wacko:

channa


----------



## delicagirl

I know  Channa  -  a 35 page thread  -   its been so moving to have had such a lot of help, as i said before, it has been a roller coaster of a journey, and at one point i was considering selling the van, but thank goodness the forum's support helped me arrive at proper data to make decisions on. 

I want to finish this thread on a positive note, and so wont publish the figures till everything is weighed and the spreadsheet is complete and checked by my chum who is Head of sums !!  Then, if anyone on here wants the spreadsheet for their own use i will be more than happy to send it out for their use, although such things are available on the internet. 

I am as keen as everyoe else  to know the result...  i will let you know as soon as i have completed the weighing.


----------



## colinm

channa said:


> We shall have no AUTOW'S around here thank you :tongue:however could be useful for the vr speed :wacko:
> 
> channa



you've just reminded me, if you fly trilanders a chap runs out and puts a treasle under the rear fuselage because if the passengers get out before the hold is emptied it tips over backwards. lane:
http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/ito-nori/prop/jpeg/bnt12.jpg
Or maybe Colette's van needs a wheelie bar. :lol-061:
http://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/07/Wheelie-8-1600x1071.jpg


----------



## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> you've just reminded me, if you fly trilanders a chap runs out and puts a treasle under the rear fuselage because if the passengers get out before the hold is emptied it tips over backwards. lane:
> http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/ito-nori/prop/jpeg/bnt12.jpg
> Or maybe Colette's van needs a wheelie bar. :lol-061:
> http://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/07/Wheelie-8-1600x1071.jpg



I bet the trilander provides an interesting taking off and landing experience for the passengers ..its certainly not your run-of-the-mill tail-dragger is it ?  haha      lane:lane:lane:lane:lane:


----------



## runnach

colinmd said:


> you've just reminded me, if you fly trilanders a chap runs out and puts a treasle under the rear fuselage because if the passengers get out before the hold is emptied it tips over backwards. lane:
> http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/ito-nori/prop/jpeg/bnt12.jpg
> Or maybe Colette's van needs a wheelie bar. :lol-061:
> http://www.onallcylinders.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/07/Wheelie-8-1600x1071.jpg


 nay problems fly into Leeds a golf course at the side sure they wont miss a trolley for 10 minutes.

Years ago piloted a Cessna into Leeds (under supervision they're not that daft) It was like a Robin Reliant but with wings lol ...LBA is 622ft ASL , I remember the figures like yesterday hdg 323 for rway 32 110.9 frequency ...not that it mattered we had visual..However stabilisers 70 ft each side would have been useful..talk about getting blown about... Flown in and out ofLBA with the big boys as a pax. Talk about slam it down !! positive landing my backside ...give me Doncaster anyday almost two miles of runway to aim at lol. 

Channa


----------



## wildebus

Sounds like a result 



delicagirl said:


> .... If anyone has any weight saving ideas which will help others then maybe s/he could start a new thread and everyone can benefit, including those who have not seen this thread. For example a WCer suggested that i  substitute smaller lightweight saucepans and indeed this made a difference. I also cut down my cutlery, crockery and the amount of shampoo i used to carry !!
> ....



Weight saving tips?
Plastic weights nothing compared to glass, so if you are using glass storage bottles for anything, maybe decant to plastic? 
Like you have found, carry less - instead of carrying the large original chemical toilet containers, I have decanted some into Frijii Milkshake bottles. Saves just a kg or so in weight, but also save room, which for a campervan of my size is more useful, and in yours would make a difference as well.

Well, books and magazines are heavy, and even though nicer to use then electronic devices, sometimes needs must, so consider switching to a Kindle or another e-Reader.
Also something I have recently started using and am very impressed with is "Readly". For a monthly sub of £7.99, you have unlimited access to a load of magazines and can download then and read them at any time, so when at place with free wifi, can get the latest issues of Practical Caravan and Practical Motorhome, for example, and read later. Think you said you do sewing and crafting type stuff? Lots of those available, plus the usual "womens interests" of Woman, Womans Own, etc.
You can share the subscription with family and friends as well - £7.99 gives you 5 devices to use and different profiles.
I know I sounding like an advert, but if you like to read magazines and are on the road, it is BRILLIANT!
Click here to see more - if you use that specific link, you get a free month to try it as well, and I also get an extra free month for recommending it.

Looking forward to the weight updates


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> Sounds like a result
> 
> 
> 
> Weight saving tips?
> Plastic weights nothing compared to glass, so if you are using glass storage bottles for anything, maybe* decant to plastic*?
> Like you have found, carry less - instead of carrying the large original *chemical toilet containers*, I have decanted some into Frijii Milkshake bottles. Saves just a kg or so in weight, but also save room, which for a campervan of my size is more useful, and in yours would make a difference as well.
> 
> Well, *books and magazines are heav*y, and even though nicer to use then electronic devices, sometimes needs must, so consider switching to a Kindle or another e-Reader.
> Also something I have recently started using and am very impressed with is "Readly". For a monthly sub of £7.99, you have unlimited access to a load of magazines and can download then and read them at any time, so when at place with free wifi, can get the latest issues of Practical Caravan and Practical Motorhome, for example, and read later. Think you said you do sewing and crafting type stuff? Lots of those available, plus the usual "womens interests" of Woman, Womans Own, etc.
> You can share the subscription with family and friends as well - £7.99 gives you 5 devices to use and different profiles.
> I know I sounding like an advert, but if you like to read magazines and are on the road, it is BRILLIANT!
> Click here to see more - if you use that specific link, you get a free month to try it as well, and I also get an extra free month for recommending it.
> 
> Looking forward to the weight updates



Some great ideas there -  i went looking for melamine plates yesterday but refuse to eat off 3" Spiderman kids plates !!!  i  will try a different shop today. 

Books  -   i usually take novels i have finished with back to a charity shop, where ever i am, and buy another one there  (*but it usually ends up with "drop off 1 buy another 6!!"    i need to give myself a stiff talking to.)   So kindle ought to be a possibility   - but you guys know me and technology.  My uni books i do need in paper as i write all over them. 

i have already decanted half my chemical toilet liquid. 

Keep 'em coming please ....


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> Some great ideas there -  i went looking for melamine plates yesterday but refuse to eat off 3" Spiderman kids plates !!!  i  will try a different shop today.
> 
> Books  -   i usually take novels i have finished with back to a charity shop, where ever i am, and buy another one there  (*but it usually ends up with "drop off 1 buy another 6!!"    i need to give myself a stiff talking to.)   So kindle ought to be a possibility   - but you guys know me and technology.  My uni books i do need in paper as i write all over them.
> 
> i have already decanted half my chemical toilet liquid.
> 
> Keep 'em coming please ....


ASDA paper plates,turf after use.


----------



## wildebus

trevskoda said:


> ASDA paper plates,turf after use.



Paper plates work especially well with messy food you don't fancy cleaning up afterwards  use a 'proper' plate underneath for support and can't tell the difference.

Shame you can't get paper saucepans and pots to do the same with (or can you?!)


----------



## delicagirl

trevskoda said:


> ASDA paper plates,turf after use.



PAPER PLATES :scared::scared::scared::scared::scared:


A woman has to have SOME standards Trev .....:wave:


----------



## yeoblade

delicagirl said:


> I know  Channa  -  a 35 page thread  -   its been so moving to have had such a lot of help, as i said before, it has been a roller coaster of a journey, and at one point i was considering selling the van, but thank goodness the forum's support helped me arrive at proper data to make decisions on.
> 
> I want to finish this thread on a positive note, and so wont publish the figures till everything is weighed and the spreadsheet is complete and checked by my chum who is Head of sums !!  Then, if anyone on here wants the spreadsheet for their own use i will be more than happy to send it out for their use, although such things are available on the internet.
> 
> I am as keen as everyoe else  to know the result...  i will let you know as soon as i have completed the weighing.



Tut,  your such a tease.........................I read the 36 pages last night and feel there's some pages at the end of the book missing.


----------



## trevskoda

wildebus said:


> Paper plates work especially well with messy food you don't fancy cleaning up afterwards  use a 'proper' plate underneath for support and can't tell the difference.
> 
> Shame you can't get paper saucepans and pots to do the same with (or can you?!)



Dono but can you fly to spain on a paper plane.


----------



## Tbear

wildebus said:


> Paper plates work especially well with messy food you don't fancy cleaning up afterwards  use a 'proper' plate underneath for support and can't tell the difference.
> 
> Shame you can't get paper saucepans and pots to do the same with (or can you?!)



Did you not do that in science at school. Make a deep tray shape with paper and paper clips. Half fill with water and put it on a gas flame, you can boil the water so you could in theory cook like that.

Richard


----------



## Robmac

Tbear said:


> Did you not do that in science at school. Make a deep tray shape with paper and paper clips. Half fill with water and put it on a gas flame, you can boil the water so you could in theory you can cook like that.
> 
> Richard



Sounds good Richard.

I'll make a paper pie dish for my oven.


----------



## Tbear

Robmac said:


> Sounds good Richard.
> 
> I'll make a paper pie dish for my oven.



With your history?!  NO!!! DON'T DO IT!!!  

Richard


----------



## delicagirl

yeoblade said:


> Tut,  your such a tease.........................I read the 36 pages last night and feel there's some *pages at the end of the book missing*.



I don't know what the end is yet !!!!   as soon as I do  - next week hopefully - I will reveal all  - honest. 

I got new tyres today .....   hi:dance:nt .....


----------



## delicagirl

Tbear said:


> Did you not do that in science at school. Make a deep tray shape with paper and paper clips. Half fill with water and put it on a gas flame, you can boil the water so you could in theory cook like that.
> 
> Richard




Boil water in a paper tray ? :danger:    How does that work ?


----------



## Robmac

delicagirl said:


> Boil water in a paper tray ? :danger:    How does that work ?



Dunno the physics of it, but it does work.

The paper won't burn until the water has boiled away.


----------



## delicagirl

I found some decent new melaware plates in my local hardware shop today, thanks David   -  they are masses lighter than normal plates.


----------



## jeanette

Pity you didn't live local I have some that we don't need anymore as we have some


----------



## Tbear

delicagirl said:


> Boil water in a paper tray ? :danger:    How does that work ?



It's simple really. The water soaks into the paper to prevent it from burning. Wet paper conducts heat well so the water it the tray heats quickly. You have to play around with the dimensions of the tray a bit and size does matter so don't be too ambitious. From memory (not very reliable and it was a long time ago) a sheet of printing paper formed into about a 4 inch square worked well  Pouring the water out was the difficult bit so please be careful.

Richard


----------



## wildebus

Tbear said:


> It's simple really. The water soaks into the paper to prevent it from burning. Wet paper conducts heat well so the water it the tray heats quickly. You have to play around with the dimensions of the tray a bit and size does matter so don't be too ambitious. From memory (not very reliable and it was a long time ago) a sheet of printing paper formed into about a 4 inch square worked well  Pouring the water out was the difficult bit so please be careful.
> 
> Richard



Interesting.  A pan after boiling water is not too messy to clean though . How about if you made a pot of chilli say?


----------



## Tbear

wildebus said:


> Interesting.  A pan after boiling water is not too messy to clean though . How about if you made a pot of chilli say?



A paper pan has a life expectancy of minutes but that does not prevent you from doing research to improve it. Who knows we may be onto a whole new generation of cookware? Chilli however may be a bit of a messy way to start it 

Richard


----------



## wildebus

Tbear said:


> A paper pan has a life expectancy of minutes but that does not prevent you from doing research to improve it. Who knows we may be onto a whole new generation of cookware? Chilli however may be a bit of a messy way to start it
> 
> Richard



What might actually work is greaseproof paper rather then just plain paper?
I might do a search for "pan liners" .... Could be a great way to save the hassle of washing mucky pans with limited water.


----------



## Tbear

wildebus said:


> What might actually work is greaseproof paper rather then just plain paper?
> I might do a search for "pan liners" .... Could be a great way to save the hassle of washing mucky pans with limited water.



It has to be porous for the water to readily soak through to prevent burning but I like the idea of pan liner. Maybe you could have a mesh pan? Extremely lightweight and no washing up. Are we onto making our first million  Wild Camping Pots inc

Richard


----------



## jeanette

Tbear said:


> It has to be porous for the water to readily soak through to prevent burning but I like the idea of pan liner. Maybe you could have a mesh pan? Extremely lightweight and no washing up. Are we onto making our first million  Wild Camping Pots inc
> 
> Richard



Would it work with the paper as you say and one of those mesh things you get to do chips in the oven? Or is that me just been blonde again!!:rolleyes2::rolleyes2:


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> I don't know what the end is yet !!!!   as soon as I do  - next week hopefully - I will reveal all  - honest.
> 
> I got new tyres today .....   hi:dance:nt .....



I would not reveal to much on here some may faint.


----------



## wildebus

Here we go ....
Amazon.com: Disposable Foil Dutch Oven Liner, 12 Pack 12" 6Q liners, No more Cleaning, Seasoning your Dutch ovens. Lodge, Camp Chef.: Dutch Over Liner: Kitchen & Dining

Meant for an dutch oven, but all a dutch oven is is a heavy cassorole pot over a hob.
A metal pan may burn it through, but if using a clay type pan should work for general cooking?
Going to have to try this


----------



## wildebus

Tbear said:


> It has to be porous for the water to readily soak through to prevent burning but I like the idea of pan liner. Maybe you could have a mesh pan? Extremely lightweight and no washing up. Are we onto making our first million  Wild Camping Pots inc
> 
> Richard



Keeping with the foil liner, a metal framed support with removable clay bases to suit the size of liner you are using?


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Could you not kinda 'Justify' the extra weight IF the you was to use Aluminum Bowls ?. They can go ON the Hob, IN the oven & ofcoursebe used as Plates or Bowls to eat from !. Because they are Multipurpose you will actually only need a cpl of the nesting camping type, They even come with lids.


While your grub is cooking, it will give you time to Whittle a Spoon & Fork that can be chucked after use, saving having to carry cutlery around with you, & on the washing up lol lol.

Paul.


----------



## Tbear

And it works well, with a good heavy pan can last for years but we where just having fun with an idea for something which weighs next to nothing and could just be thrown away afterwards.

Richard


----------



## wildebus

Ah, but the task is to eliminate washing up of messy pans but in a reasonably economical way. A self-supporting disposable aluminium pan/bowl would be pretty expensive (and in fact are pretty much what cheap camping saucepans are). A foil liner on a support will have the strength, plus a handle to move it.

So ...to keep on topic, how is this weight saving?  Disposable saucepans = reduced washing up = less water to carry = less weight. 100 pan liners = 1Kg/1L water.


----------



## Tbear

Nesting Zombie said:


> Could you not kinda 'Justify' the extra weight IF the you was to use Aluminum Bowls ?. They can go ON the Hob, IN the oven & ofcoursebe used as Plates or Bowls to eat from !. Because they are Multipurpose you will actually only need a cpl of the nesting camping type, They even come with lids.
> 
> 
> While your grub is cooking, it will give you time to Whittle a Spoon & Fork that can be chucked after use, saving having to carry cutlery around with you, & on the washing up lol lol.
> 
> Paul.



Even I can whittle Chop Sticks 

Richard


----------



## jeanette

Tbear said:


> Even I can whittle Chop Sticks
> 
> Richard



There you go I think you'r on to winner there Richard!!! Money is in the bag!!!:lol-061:


----------



## Tbear

wildebus said:


> Keeping with the foil liner, a metal framed support with removable clay bases to suit the size of liner you are using?



Rapidly getting out of my depth here (I can heat baked beans with the best of them) but foil seems to work well in an oven environment but does not do so well on an intense flame. Therefore in should work well as long as it has good wide contact with something that conducts heat well. Good for a Dutch oven but not so good if you want to loose weight.

Richard


----------



## Nesting Zombie

wildebus said:


> Ah, but the task is to eliminate washing up of messy pans but in a reasonably economical way. A self-supporting disposable aluminium pan/bowl would be pretty expensive (and in fact are pretty much what cheap camping saucepans are). A foil liner on a support will have the strength, plus a handle to move it.
> 
> So ...to keep on topic, how is this weight saving?  Disposable saucepans = reduced washing up = less water to carry = less weight. 100 pan liners = 1Kg/1L water.



That's the easy bit,,,
Get a Hamster to lick them clean over night, Then recycle the Nutrient rich droppings left as a result by Baking Chocolate chip n Raison biscuits in the same pan !,,,(Just remember to remove Hamster before Baking !)


----------



## delicagirl

Nesting Zombie said:


> Could you not kinda 'Justify' the extra weight IF the you was to use Aluminum Bowls ?. They can go ON the Hob, IN the oven & ofcoursebe used as Plates or Bowls to eat from !. Because they are Multipurpose you will actually only need a cpl of the nesting camping type, They even come with lids.
> 
> 
> While your grub is cooking, *it will give you time to Whittle a Spoon & Fork that can be chucked after use*, saving having to carry cutlery around with you, & on the washing up lol lol.
> 
> Paul.



the problem about my whittling skills  - as I learnt in a free "Ebbw Vale Forest-Survival-Course" last year - is that I would need a chunk of wood as big as a bus to start with - in order to  end up with a blunt pen-knife-sized implement -   let alone a spoon and fork as well..  !!!  A bus-load-chunk of wood might rather defeat the whole "weight saving project"  - dontcha think ?:lol-061:


----------



## delicagirl

I tried to weigh my van table tonight  - its heavy and large -  what a performance !!!  I know how much I weigh, so I figured I would hold the table and get on the electronic scales  -  that may have worked, except there was no way I could read the scales whilst holding said table.  So I got off the scales, put the table on the scales and held it gently with one finger -  nowt    -  eventually an annoying message saying ERR  came up  -  err what does that mean - other than error.     Maybe cos tables don't have "Warm Feet to activate" the electronics.....    who knows....   So I get my next door neighbour in to read the scales while I am standing on it and clutching  table to my chest    -  according to her eyesight we weigh 12kgs between us  (me and table)  I WISH !!   

Time for tea Zebedee......    

Suddenly remember that the table was in the van when it was weighed "empty"  - so its been accounted for already......  DOH  ..  so why am I weighing it ???   Who knows.......    :anyone:


----------



## delicagirl

Tbear said:


> A paper pan has a life expectancy of minutes but that does not prevent you from doing research to improve it. Who knows we may be onto a whole new generation of cookware? Chilli however may be a bit of a messy way to start it
> 
> Richard




I can see the TV Advert now   "CHILLI WEAR  - GET YER PANS CLEANED THE NATURAL WAY - PAN-CLEANING HAMSTERS - SPECIALLY TRAINED IN FAR EASTERN CUISINE -  SEPTEMBER DISCOUNT  WE PAY YOU TO TAKE 'EM AWAY....."


----------



## jeanette

Unless you get the hair on the hamster to stand up stiff and then you can clean your pans with that!!! Hamsters don't wiegh much!!! :anyone:


----------



## vwalan

jeanette said:


> Unless you get the hair on the hamster to stand up stiff and then you can clean your pans with that!!! Hamsters don't wiegh much!!! :anyone:



mind you young ladies can save some payload with cheesecloth tops and long skirts . 
hee hee . 
used to be the way when campers were of the smaller varietey like vw,s etc . 
go on you know you want to. hee hee. 
even wear a little bell round your neck if you want to.


----------



## jeanette

vwalan said:


> mind you young ladies can save some payload with cheesecloth tops and long skirts .
> hee hee .
> used to be the way when campers were of the smaller varietey like vw,s etc .
> go on you know you want to. hee hee.
> even wear a little bell round your neck if you want to.



Could wear a little bell round your wrist!! Mmmm no that wouldn't work would it!!! :lol-061::lol-061: I'm saying nothing!!!


----------



## vwalan

jeanette said:


> Could wear a little bell round your wrist!! Mmmm no that wouldn't work would it!!! :lol-061::lol-061: I'm saying nothing!!!



i could rattle a big bell and shout unclean . hee hee .
mind i had a wash last year and i,m sure i didnt need it . 
only trying to help. ha ha .


----------



## trevskoda

I got on talking scales in tesco and they said one at a time please.:scared:


----------



## Byronic

I can see where this thread is going with helpful weight saving suggestions:idea-007:

Inflate the tyres with nitrogen instead of air. 

Fit partworn tires.

Sand the exterior paintwork off.

Chuck the passenger seat. Same for cushions, and replace with inflatables.

Scrape any rust off. Remove decals and nameplates.

Keep the engine oil level on the dipstick on the low mark.

Shorten exhaust system.

Just a few sensible suggestions, I'm sure I could think of a few ridiculous ones as well!


----------



## wildebus

A lot of people never fill their fuel tanks above half full. On some vans, that could be a 40kg or more saving.


----------



## delicagirl

David I think you may have misunderstood   -   I know how much I weigh and its  NOWHERE  near 80 kgs  -  so me and my table cannot possibly weigh more than 100 kgs.   Tomorrow  I may ask a neighbour with better eye sight to come in and see if she can read my scales when I am on there holding the table .... -  my guess is that the table cannot weigh more than 6-10 kilos  -  so yes a wooden table may be a possibility for more weight saving measures.

I am getting quite glad that the weekend is in sight as I can go away and enjoy a few days away without worrying about weight  - the vans  or mine !!!!


----------



## vwalan

Byronic said:


> I can see where this thread is going with helpful weight saving suggestions:idea-007:
> 
> Inflate the tyres with nitrogen instead of air.
> 
> Fit partworn tires.
> 
> Sand the exterior paintwork off.
> 
> Chuck the passenger seat. Same for cushions, and replace with inflatables.
> 
> Scrape any rust off. Remove decals and nameplates.
> 
> Keep the engine oil level on the dipstick on the low mark.
> 
> Shorten exhaust system.
> 
> Just a few sensible suggestions, I'm sure I could think of a few ridiculous ones as well!



you could get a divorce that cuts down on the weight alot . .then you can add toys like m,bikes . spear guns . another wet suit. etc . 
but really i think dg is possibly single and really needs to travel with someone with lots of pay load hee hee . 
is that silly enough. 
mind with my good looks ,charm , and nice personality and not at all vain .  could she do better . ?
mind i,m looking for a female with a big bag of money in one hand and a big bag of tools in the other and know how to use them . 
should you know of any send them  my way . hee hee


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> A lot of people never fill their fuel tanks above half full. On some vans, that could be a 40kg or more saving.



Thanks   -  whilst in Scotland  I decided to always fill up when I saw a fuel station, especially  in the highlands, as they were few and far between.   I don't think I could really relax and enjoy the landscape if I was constantly worrying about fuel - but thanks for the suggestion.


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> you could get a divorce that cuts down on the weight alot . .then you can add toys like m,bikes . spear guns . another wet suit. etc .
> but really i think dg is possibly single and really needs to travel with someone with lots of pay load hee hee .
> is that silly enough.
> mind with my good looks ,charm , and nice personality and not at all vain .  *could she do better . ?*
> mind i,m looking for a female with a big bag of money in one hand and a big bag of tools in the other and know how to use them .
> should you know of any send them  my way . hee hee



I'll give that some thought Alan  and get back to you :drive:


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> Thanks   -  whilst in Scotland  I decided to always fill up when I saw a fuel station, especially  in the highlands, as they were few and far between.   I don't think I could really relax and enjoy the landscape if I was constantly worrying about fuel - but thanks for the suggestion.


get away with him many carry ten times that amount . after all this year 400litres of diesel from spain saved 160 quid on uk prices . . that was on 1.26 to the pound . if you got 1.39 euro it was greater.


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> I'll give that some thought Alan  and get back to you :drive:



well it will soon be ferry time are you up to coming away. ?
spain possibly portugal for winter . 
you know you will be safe . 
the others will be watching .
course you may get a better offer . 
forget payload . have a nice time.


----------



## jeanette

delicagirl said:


> Thanks   -  whilst in Scotland  I decided to always fill up when I saw a fuel station, especially  in the highlands, as they were few and far between.   I don't think I could really relax and enjoy the landscape if I was constantly worrying about fuel - but thanks for the suggestion.



We did the same Collette when we where up in the Highlands because as you said they were few and far between and you couldn't risk running out of fuel way up there!! :scared:


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> well it will soon be ferry time are you up to coming away. ?
> spain possibly portugal for winter .
> you know you will be safe .
> the others will be watching .
> course you may get a better offer .
> forget payload . have a nice time.



Hi - I am at uni till Spring 2017  when i finally get my degree. So a 2016-7 winter away cant happen ....   but there are other winters.  

The whole point of this thread was to establish a safe payload and by next week I will have done that - I know I will have more payload than just a "weekend away" amount of stuff, and my plan is a very long trip away next year....   who knows where Alan...   you may be lucky !!!


----------



## izwozral

jeanette said:


> Could wear a little bell round your wrist!! Mmmm no that wouldn't work would it!!! :lol-061::lol-061: I'm saying nothing!!!



Naughty girl!


----------



## Tezza33

vwalan said:


> forget payload . have a nice time.


There will be a lot of people wishing they didn't have a revenue weight because you cannot be overweight legally if pulled up, I know you can be unsafe and legally they can pursue that just as they can in a car which doesn't have a weight limit but you can tell when it doesn't feel right so load up accordingly


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> Thanks   -  whilst in Scotland  I decided to always fill up when I saw a fuel station, especially  in the highlands, as they were few and far between.   I don't think I could really relax and enjoy the landscape if I was constantly worrying about fuel - but thanks for the suggestion.



I tend to do the same, especially if the fuel is reasonably priced 
Life is too short to try to eek out the last litre all the time!


----------



## vwalan

tezza33 said:


> There will be a lot of people wishing they didn't have a revenue weight because you cannot be overweight legally if pulled up, I know you can be unsafe and legally they can pursue that just as they can in a car which doesn't have a weight limit but you can tell when it doesn't feel right so load up accordingly



my payload is more than the weight of most of the m,homes . 
dg, could come along and bring loads of things . but she nicely declined . 
never mind , maybe next year. 
i,m getting younger every year, well folk tell me i,m getting more childish , thats the same thing isnt it?


----------



## jeanette

vwalan said:


> my payload is more than the weight of most of the m,homes .
> dg, could come along and bring loads of things . but she nicely declined .
> never mind , maybe next year.
> i,m getting younger every year, well folk tell me i,m getting more childish , thats the same thing isnt it?



If we ever meet up Alan I will tell you okay!! But there again there is nothing wrong in enjoying yourself!! Mmm up to a point I mey add!!!!


----------



## trevskoda

wildebus said:


> A lot of people never fill their fuel tanks above half full. On some vans, that could be a 40kg or more saving.



Some members here are always half full.:cheers:


----------



## delicagirl

Hi David  I am in discussions with SVTech re my new plate at the moment and when I have a figure from them and I have weighed my van full next week, as I have already said, I will have the final piece of this long jigsaw in place and will certainly tell everyone - of course its not a secret - what would it be? 

I am working on the axle figures given to me by Mitsubishi HQ in Japan.

I am enjoying the comic end phase of this long saga - as are some other contributors  - the whole thing had me tearing my hair out for quite a while, so its good to have a lighter ending.  

I re read the whole thing yesterday and made a few notes about various facts I learnt, and also the re-reading helped me understand the issues more clearly.


----------



## delicagirl

i have 2 individual axle weights from Mitsubishi Japan - those are the figures SVTech are working with.  I don't yet know the weight of my vehicle + full diesel + full water + all my stuff in it -  that weight i will get from the weighbridge next week after i return from my weekend away in the van and after i have filled up with diesel.  

There is no need to keep out of it


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> i have 2 individual axle weights from Mitsubishi Japan - those are the figures SVTech are working with.  I don't yet know the weight of my vehicle + full diesel + full water + all my stuff in it -  that weight i will get from the weighbridge next week after i return from my weekend away in the van and after i have filled up with diesel.
> 
> There is no need to keep out of it



think he was just wondering what it weighed empty . individual axle weights . 
what mitsubishi give arent always what a vehicle actually weighs . 
as you emptied it and weighed it last week i believe what was the weights .


----------



## delicagirl

Firstly thank you all for the time and effort everyone put into this thread to enable me to understand the issues around weight and plating and tyres and loading etc.

As i promised here is The final jigsaw piece.... 

To summarise what happened  -  


When i thought i had an empty van I took it to the weigh bridge and it was 2490 kilograms.  The weigh bridge man told me that i had a 2500 kgs truck and therefore i only had a usable payload of 10kgs left. At that stage i didn't know what payload meant.  i accepted what he said and panicked because i had removed a huge amount of stuff from the van and had no water on board, and thought the van was almost empty of fuel.  If this was true, i didn't know how i could safely drive, as i would inevitably exceed the user payload - ie the safe weight that the axles could carry without danger.

Payload is the total weight of everything i put into the van - me, water, fuel, clothes, food and 'stuff'.  Weight figures are usually written on a metal plate normally found in the engine in the UK. My van is japanese and is not plated. There are no weight figures on the log book nor on DVLA.   I didn't know how much my van was designed to carry and so didn't know if i was overloaded or safe to be driving it at all.

Finally, after much research by many on  here,  and several discussions  with SVTEch and Mitsubishi in Japan, the latter informed me that my axle weights were :  Front axle can carry no more than  1150 kgs  and the rear axle no more than 1450 kgs  - giving a total payload of 2600.  They also informed me that no modifications can be made to the van to improve that payload. 

Mmm  ....  a depressing response. 

At this point i decided to *completely empty* the van, get it weighed again at the weighbridge, and then to weigh everything that  had been in the van on my last trip.   

With a full tank of diesel  (60 kilos), and nothing else at all,  the van weighed in at  2350 kgs.  

2600   -    2350   =  payload of  250 kgs  =    550lbs.  SVTech will plate the van for me at these figures.  So it is going to be feasible to stay within safe load limits.

 i  implemented a lot of the weight saving ideas that were suggested here, removed some of the upholstery which i never used, and discarded several luxuries which were heavy and also discarded some of the spare water that i have always carried.

 SVTech told me that over 80% of commercial vehicles, campers and  caravans which were weighed by VOSA last year on roadside checks were seriously overloaded, and VOSA have now bought a further 10 mobile weighing units as they see it as such a dangerous problem. 

So i now have a spreadsheet showing all the weights of my vans contents, and it has been a very challenging, at times stressful, but in the end very useful exercise.  I recommend you give it a go over the winter.

Far too many folks, here and at home and on sites, seem to be saying  "everyone is overweight don't worry"  -  well  i think we should worry.   If the weight of your English registered van is on your log book it is simple for VOSA/the police to discover if overweight is an issue in an accident, and if a van is overloaded you can bet your bottom dollar that the insurers will say  "no payout" and if someone else is injured and your van is responsible...    then what ? 

As i discovered on emptying my van, it had been  all too easy for me to say "i'll just take that, and that  - just in case"  - and they all added up to more weight than i should have been carrying.

Finally with regard to tyres and weight - i have been told by both SVtech and tyre specialists that just because you put a bigger tyre and/or more air in a tyre that does not mean that you have increased the payload, and it does not mean that you are safe.

i  replaced all my japanese tyres with new  4wheel drive tyres  so that i am legal in Europe in the winter, (without having to keep 2 sets of tyres)  as well as retaining my 4WD capacity to get out of muddy places and wet grass etc which i have found useful when i go off tarmac.

thanks to andy for having photographed and translated the japanese labels in my van - and to everyone on here for their time and advice and help.

I hope this explains some of the issues, especially to newbies who, like me, probably never even thought about weight.


----------



## yeoblade

Glad you got to a conclusion.

But:
To get the full 2600Kg you will need to balance the load exactly according to the axle limits, I thought MTPLM was generally less than the sum of the 2 axles to allow for imbalance. 

Or not ?

I had mine replated,  as without the missus and dog and motorbike I was just 5kgs under my MTPLM!


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## delicagirl

[No message]


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## mark61

It's worth doing a bit of research as far as these tyres are concerned.  The basic options are dirt track tyres, all terrains and mud terrains. Some (most) will be M+S rated, while a few will be M+S plus 3 peaks rated & Snowflake rated, often called 3PMSF.
 M+S aren't strictly a winter a tyre, but at the moment are legal to use as winter tyres but they have to have a certain depth of tread left.

As with all things, worth looking in to. There are crap off road tyres and quality ones. Value for money wise, the benefit of a quality all terrain tyre is a life of 70000 mile +, easily.


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## yeoblade

[No message]


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## mark61

[No message]


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## runnach

Does this mean Delicious , that delectable weekend you promised of depravity and delightful desires.. I now have to lose weight :rolleyes2:......Distraught I am :lol-053:.......Plan B my little nest of vipelets ...motorcycle and a tarp ...I like that word tarp !!!. ...no idea where all that lot came from!! (nurse my meds) I am glad you have a definitive answer.

Channa 

P.s I have 25 kgs capacity on the bike do you take sugar with coffee...:scared:xx


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## delicagirl

channa said:


> Does this mean Delicious , that delectable weekend you promised of depravity and delightful desires.. I now have to lose weight :rolleyes2:......Distraught I am :lol-053:.......Plan B my little nest of vipelets ...motorcycle and a tarp ...I like that word tarp !!!. ...no idea where all that lot came from!! (nurse my meds) I am glad you have a definitive answer.
> 
> Channa
> 
> P.s I have 25 kgs capacity on the bike do you take sugar with coffee...:scared:xx




no sugar Channa....  I am  sweet enough as I am.....    I  stopped taking sugar when I set off to hitch to Ethiopia when I was 19  - it was too heavy to carry  - I never took sugar in drinks again. 


you are in lyrical mode tonight !!!  I am delighted that you are planning your  great adventure... it will be amazing and as soon as you leave Europe you will forget all about WC and have a ball....    but do keep some records so you can tell us something about the adventure when you get back.  Shame I am still at uni for another year -  another time   !!!!


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## wildebus

It is amazing how many people have no idea how much their vehicles actually weigh in both camping mode and also empty of all their removable gear (I am thinking mostly here of people with conversions rather then factory-built Motorhomes).
And on top of that, many of these people, at least in the VW Transporter world, fit lowering springs which will change the real, effective, GVW as well as wheels without known load ratings and tyres that are underspecified for the weight carried.

You are to be applauded completely for taking this action :dance:
I hope others follow if they are not aware of their weights (My latest van I took to the weightbridge prior to starting the conversion, but have not yet returned to it now it is fully fitted out. Might do that later this week after this update from yourself!)


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> So you have 72 litres of diesel in the tank and nothing loaded. Did that weight include you yourself, or did you get out first? What about gas bottles? Aux batteries?



this weight included all the "fixtures" as I call them  -  batteries, gas bottles, big dining room table, all the upholstery,  - and I did include me in the calculation.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> No, it doesn't, but it substantially reduces the risk of a tyre bursting because it is overloaded. Which is where we came into this discussion, I seem to recall.




without going back through the whole thread I cannot recall what I posted earlier about this    -    -  another horror story that I discovered is that MOTs do not take any account of the age of a tyre and as long as the tread complies with the current law, the tyre will be legal.  My van had passed three MOTS with no advisories on tyres.   I did not realise that two of my tyres were 20 years old  (the age of manufacture is on the tyre itself if you can grovel around and find it) and two were 12 years old.  My local tyre specialist said the blow out was due to age.   All my tyres  had good tread. 

My van now has 4 brand new tyres...  at    36psi in the front and 41 in the back.


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## Fazerloz

Well done you. At least now you know exactly how you stand and can go on from there, which is more than most know.


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## jda

*Delica description*

Can't help with weight issue & jumped many posts but log book description was very similar to the Delica mpv I had - a great drive & seat arrangements allowed transport of bikes & basic camping except for the fact that the automatic transmission could not cope with the slightest mud!


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> That's good news!
> 
> At a pinch, you can switch to a single lightweight gas bottle, or perhaps a refillable one (you can top up a refillable, so don't need to carry a spare).
> 
> Batteries? Can you manage with just two? Perhaps that's all you have now.
> 
> You may find a smaller, lighter table would do.




I have 3 leisure batteries fed by a solar panel;  and 2 gasit bottles -  does anyone know if gasit do lighter weight bottles  ?

I will give it a go with standing on the scales with my table on my head !!!!!    I have thought long and hard about this table...  it is huge and strong because it drops down to form the double bed in the dining area for sleeping in the winter  (from where I can reach the gas fire to turn it on to heat the van before I finally get out of bed!!)    I also love the table because it can accommodate my laptop and mouse and lots of books and files and stuff when I am writing, and its also good for maintaining a stationery drawing board when I am sketching.... so its a treasured possession.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> The secret is to put the table on top of your head. Really!
> 
> Failing that, *set your phone up to take a video* of the scales readout.
> 
> But perhaps it doesn't matter if the table was included in the "empty" weight.




Most folks here know I am an IT-challenged woman  !!  last weekend I was telling vanning chums that my smart phone  (always MUCH smarter than me) has a camera but its lens is hazy, and photos don't look good  - "in fact"  -  I said  sadly  "it looks as if there is a sheet of crinkled cling film over the lens"   Said vanning chum took the phone and then said   "what ? like THIS Actual piece of cling film over the lens ?" and he peeled a bit off the phone....  I have only had the phone 3 years now and never noticed !!!!   Laughing at myself again, ....  or what  ????


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## colinm

delicagirl said:


> As i promised here is The final jigsaw piece....



The final piece of the puzzle is the weighing of each axle, until then you still don't know what it is practical to carry, the overall weight doesn't count for anything if the back axle(or front) is loaded up.


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## delicagirl

I thought it only polite to come back with some figures as soon as I could.....   my next visit to the weighbridge will have to wait a while I am sorry to say as my life is a bit mad at the moment  -  but when I do I will come back with the final final bit of the jigsaw !!!:dance:

Maybe I can have some guidance as to "loading" and "balance" -  now that I have the axle weights -  I had thought to put all the paper goods towards the front of the van and the tinned stuff/books/spare wheel towards the rear.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> Are you sure you need three leisure batteries? Try making a trip with just one.
> 
> 
> *I don't use camp sites other than for water and waste disposal-refilling.     When i first bought the van I employed a local guy who put in  "low wattage" new lights - but they were not LED lights.  I knew no different at the time.   I am about to have those replaced with LED lights, as the power usage of these low wattage lights is quite high.   As soon as I have done this, it might be interesting to see how I get on in the wild with only one battery and one solar panel in the winter*.
> 
> You don't need two Gasit bottles unless you use more than a complete bottlefull between passing LPG stations.
> 
> *LPG is very rare in Eire (and not a lot easier in Scotland) and the gauges on these gasit bottles are notoriously inaccurate  -  you can tap one with your finger nail and it will move substantially, so it could be a tricky lifestyle with only one gas bottle as my heating (gas fire) and cooking relies on LPG.*
> 
> Do you remember my post (a long way back) about what an item needed to be to get on board? Seems to me that your table qualifies.



*I remember it well - and many things in there now are multi functional  - thanks for that tip.*


HUH  ?   what did I do there then ?????


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## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> I have 3 leisure batteries fed by a solar panel;  and 2 gasit bottles -  does anyone know if gasit do lighter weight bottles  ?
> 
> I will give it a go with standing on the scales with my table on my head !!!!!    I have thought long and hard about this table...  it is huge and strong because it drops down to form the double bed in the dining area for sleeping in the winter  (from where I can reach the gas fire to turn it on to heat the van before I finally get out of bed!!)    I also love the table because it can accommodate my laptop and mouse and lots of books and files and stuff when I am writing, and its also good for maintaining a stationery drawing board when I am sketching.... so its a treasured possession.



Huge and Heavy Table? Is it solid? I bet you could reduce the weight of it by a significant amount by drilling a range of holes in it. Make them small but regular and it will still be strong enough for a bed support, yet practical enough for a table top (especially if you throw a table cloth over it) and the weight saved could be considerable. If you consider most caravans have slats that pull out for the bed extension sections and make up a bed support which has as much free air space between the slats as the slat width themselves, it should be doable


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## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> Huge and Heavy Table? Is it solid? I bet you could reduce the weight of it by a significant amount by drilling a range of holes in it. Make them small but regular and it will still be strong enough for a bed support, yet practical enough for a table top (especially if you through a table cloth over it) and the weight saved could be considerable. If you consider most caravans have slats that pull out for the bed extension sections and make up a bed support which has as much free air space between the slats as the slat width themselves, it should be doable




you have outlined some interesting ideas here -  I had no idea others vans use slats...   no one ever shows you a van in preparation for "bed time"  thanks for that idea


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## colinm

delicagirl said:


> I thought it only polite to come back with some figures as soon as I could.....   my next visit to the weighbridge will have to wait a while I am sorry to say as my life is a bit mad at the moment  -  but when I do I will come back with the final final bit of the jigsaw !!!:dance:
> 
> Maybe I can have some guidance as to "loading" and "balance" -  now that I have the axle weights -  I had thought to put all the paper goods towards the front of the van and the tinned stuff/books/spare wheel towards the rear.



We're still working in the dark here, but after reviewing the photo's in your profile, i'd say you will need to put as much stuff as forward as possible.


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## wildebus

This is my first incarnation for slats ...
[video=youtube_share;xzAc4S3wRwk]https://youtu.be/xzAc4S3wRwk[/video]
I experimented with making the gap wider, but then reverted back to equal slat width and air gaps width.
I did wonder about using a table instead of slats, as the dual-purpose would be quite appealing, but I have never actually used the table I made yet anyway, so didn't bother.


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## andyjanet

delicagirl said:


> Most folks here know I am an IT-challenged woman  !!  last weekend I was telling vanning chums that my smart phone  (always MUCH smarter than me) has a camera but its lens is hazy, and photos don't look good  - "in fact"  -  I said  sadly  "it looks as if there is a sheet of crinkled cling film over the lens"   Said vanning chum took the phone and then said   "what ? like THIS Actual piece of cling film over the lens ?" and he peeled a bit off the phone....  I have only had the phone 3 years now and never noticed !!!!   Laughing at myself again, ....  or what  ????



Brilliant, now tryin to clean soggy rice krispies from the keys on the works laptop, thankyou Collette if I was rude I would call it a senior moment but it seems you had a senior 3 years, x andy


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## dane

Good progress.

As an aside, saw a coachbuilt Delica with a "for sale" sign on the back of it at the AO show at the weekend (think it was also on ebay a couple of years ago?).  It had all manor of colourful steel attachments welded onto it, goodness knows what that weighs in at.  Looks purposeful though!


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## ricc

before you go drilling holes in the table , bear in mind bed slats are real wood, the table top could well be some sort of chip board...basically sawdust and glue , which is nowhere near as strong ,   a chipboard slat is a lot weaker than a pine one.


id say when loading get heavy items as far forward as possible.   if the van looks level its less likely to be picked for weighing at a roadside check.


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## colinm

colinmd said:


> We're still working in the dark here, but after reviewing the photo's in your profile, i'd say you will need to put as much stuff as forward as possible.



Further to this post I should maybe offer an explanation.
Although the front axle has a lower limit there is likely to be a lot of weight from the conversion on the rear axle. Plus when putting stuff 'forward' it is usually between the axles (unless it's in the overcab which is not recommended), having as much of the mass as possible between the axles is always a good plan.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> A tester cannot fail a tyre for simply being old. There is no legal age limit.
> 
> A tester can fail a tyre for having hardened and developed cracks through age.
> 
> How long a tyre lasts depends on lots of factors, not least how it is used and/or stored.
> 
> *If you leave tyres in bright sunlight, it can die of old age in a couple of years*.



indeed hairdog  -  the very first tyre i replaced in April this year (before my long trip) was my spare on the roof - it had not been covered up and was utterly degraded and incapable of use. i will get a cover for my new spare tyre.


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## wildebus

ricc said:


> before you go drilling holes in the table , bear in mind bed slats are real wood, the table top could well be some sort of chip board...basically sawdust and glue , which is nowhere near as strong ,   a chipboard slat is a lot weaker than a pine one.
> 
> 
> id say when loading get heavy items as far forward as possible.   if the van looks level its less likely to be picked for weighing at a roadside check.



A very valid point there. The slats I have are ply and meant as bed slats, so are also slightly curved which also adds extra strength and would be stronger then a flat ply plank of the same thickness.
(FWIW, From IKEA out of their Bargain Corner section and cut down to suit gap)


----------



## delicagirl

dane said:


> Good progress.
> 
> As an aside, saw a coachbuilt Delica with a "for sale" sign on the back of it at the AO show at the weekend (think it was also on ebay a couple of years ago?).  It had all manor of colourful steel attachments welded onto it, goodness knows what that weighs in at.  Looks purposeful though!




was it this one Mitsubishi Delica L300 4x4 Expedition Campervan Bugout Motorhome Monster Truck - YouTube    ?


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## mark61

delicagirl said:


> was it this one Mitsubishi Delica L300 4x4 Expedition Campervan Bugout Motorhome Monster Truck - YouTube    ?



Think it was that one, very similar anyway.


----------



## izwozral

Blimey, I hope everything was well strapped down, it was lurching like a trawler in a force ten gale. Looked pretty neat though.


----------



## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> Blimey, I hope everything was well strapped down, it was lurching like a trawler in a force ten gale. Looked pretty neat though.




This was an identical van to mine  -  He has cut away a lot of the bottom rear of the habitation box so that he can  have more ground clearance, and increased the distance from the ground to top of the wheel arch, strengthened the suspension in some way  and put in bigger tyres  -  as you say - plus all the heavy gear he has added to it  - i doubt he has any payload at all now.  But this van has allegedly been to south america.


----------



## dane

delicagirl said:


> was it this one Mitsubishi Delica L300 4x4 Expedition Campervan Bugout Motorhome Monster Truck - YouTube    ?



Yes, I think it was that one.  If not, as mark61 says, very similar.


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> A very valid point there. The slats I have are ply and meant as bed slats, so are also slightly curved which also adds extra strength and would be stronger then a flat ply plank of the same thickness.
> (FWIW, From IKEA out of their Bargain Corner section and cut down to suit gap)




i cut down some identical slats from an old bed and made a very similar, shorter device which i use for a leg rest in the van for the evenings. it also provides a handy shelf when i have removed the big heavy table in the evenings.  Mine does not slide as smoothly as yours though !!! and it occasionally collapses as i sawed a couple of slats  the wrong size -  but it was my first attempt.


----------



## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> i cut down some identical slats from an old bed and made a very similar, shorter device which i use for a leg rest in the van for the evenings. it also provides a handy shelf when i have removed the big heavy table in the evenings.  Mine does not slide as smoothly as yours though !!! and it occasionally collapses as i sawed a couple of slats  the wrong size -  but it was my first attempt.



It's not a jiggy-jiggy type of bed then?


----------



## wildebus

delicagirl said:


> i cut down some identical slats from an old bed and made a very similar, shorter device which i use for a leg rest in the van for the evenings. it also provides a handy shelf when i have removed the big heavy table in the evenings.  Mine does not slide as smoothly as yours though !!! and it occasionally collapses as i sawed a couple of slats  the wrong size -  but it was my first attempt.



Slightly modded mine now - I have 1/3 of length as a  solid ply sheet at the rear, and the remainder is the slats that pull out to forum the bed, and push back in and on top of the ply sheet out the way.
Changed it as I found I always had the mattress and duvet folded over and laid over the back anyway, so thought may as well have a permanent (but removable) base for that part.

The key part for sliding is making all the edges slightly rounded and no sharp bits so they slide without snags.  I'll take and post a "Mk 2" video with my current setup if it is of any interest?


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## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> It's not a jiggy-jiggy type of bed then?




"You offerying   jiggy-jaggy ???? :banana:


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## izwozral

delicagirl said:


> "You offerying   jiggy-jaggy ???? :banana:



Only if you get a health and safety certificate on that bed of yours chuck.


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## jeanette

Oi get a room!!! :lol-061: but not Collette's bed not safe!!!


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## izwozral

That back axle will be severely tested too, better put chocks on the wheels for good measure.


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## Dowel

Slats are very good for beds but if your table top is dual purpose and you use it for both then David's suggestion is a good one. A ply top and bottom with timber ribs between can be very light and strong. Roughly how big width x length x thickness is it?

Pleased to see that you are getting there with your van weight issues, a bit sad that the GVW and payload is not a little more for you but you will save on diesel running lighter 

I did try to reply to your PM of the 14th, pressed the send button (I thought) but can't find it in my sent folder so I suspect I failed the technology test too!


----------



## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> Yikes! I hope yours isnt like that. Did you see how the ns front wheel lifts off the ground at the slightest bump. That van isnt fit to drive on smooth roads, let alone a slightly bumpy track.
> 
> If yours is like that, you need to move the weight lower and further foward to make it stable. But I suspect yours will be much better than that, now youve rrmoved the excess weight.


 
that is quite a steep track but nevertheless - it shouldn't wallow like that. The guy driving it was a plonker of a dealer from Yorkshire.

 I took my van to a 4WD driving school a year ago and she said she would not allow me to drive on their steepest angled-sloping track as I was way too top heavy because the centre of gravity was too high.   She said I am fine in steep gradients (and I found a fair few of those in Eire and Scotland this year and was fine) - but advised me not to go down angled rough terrain and to not put ANYTHNG else on the roof (my spare wheel cannot go anywhere else other than the roof.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> I suggest slats all over. The primary reason to use slats instead of a board is for ventilation. Letting the underneath breathe lets moisture escape. Unless well aired, bedding you slept in/on can go mouldy in time.
> 
> Yes slats are lighter, easier to stow away and (if springy) more comfortable, but the primary advantage is ventilation.



I sleep over the cab on a memory-foam 2" mattress on top of upholstered cushions.  But the table becomes the middle of the downstairs bed if I sleep downstairs in the winter.


----------



## delicagirl

David I am not worried about my vehicle nor my life and I would thank you not to continue with this theme.  I have consulted experts who made the van and who are plating the van to a safe weight and I have weighed everything I am going to weigh.  So further to your earlier suggestion, I agree with you that you  "keep out of it".  Thank you.


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## oppy

How about making love stood up in a hammock?:heart::heart::heart:


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## ricc

from what ive seen most vehicles will fail the elk test,  but i've not seen any elks on the roads in the years ive been driving so its not something im going to lose any sleep over. no motor home, not even a hymer,  is going to handle like a sports car

the wallowing camper in the video wasnt a standard spec vehicle, it obviously had major suspension issues ,no doubt  partly due to excess weight , we can see the stupidly massive winch on the front but weve no idea what else the idiot owner has been up to , so its performance cannot be taken to be indicative of similar vehicles.

theres no way a std 4x4 camper is going places that a proper 4x4 like a landrover will go but itll cope with wet grass and sensible tracks, the thing to avoid is side slopes.   any vehicle is easier to roll sideways than end over end.


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## runnach

Old saying , a little knowledge is dangerous , read into that what you will 

Channa


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## jeanette

delicagirl said:


> I sleep over the cab on a memory-foam 2" mattress on top of upholstered cushions.  But the table becomes the middle of the downstairs bed if I sleep downstairs in the winter.



Collette your over cab bed must have a big enough headroom for you to sleep there does it would it be possible to see a photo of your van? I only ask as I can't sleep in ours so therefore we sleep downstairs,as we have a sitting area at the back of the van,


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## mark61

Lots of scare mongering without even seeing or driving the vehicle. Sure, you can have an educated guess, but thats all it is.


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## Robmac

I wonder if it actually was a Camel Trophy vehicle (As per the sticker).

If it was, that would suggest it may be quite a capable vehicle?


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> ricc, you are missing the point. There is no difference between a side slope and a swerve to avoid a child who just fell off a bicycle. A vehicle that is not stable is not safe to drive.
> 
> I hope that *delicagirl's van is not as unstable as the one in the film*, but it is clearly not appropriate to have a spare wheel on the roof of such a vehicle



HAVE A LOOK AT THE 6 PHOTOS OF MY VAN IN MY PROFILE FOR ALL TO SEE.   My van is not like this one in the film in many respects.


----------



## delicagirl

Robmac said:


> I wonder if it actually was a Camel Trophy vehicle (As per the sticker).
> 
> If it was, that would suggest it may be quite a capable vehicle?



I suspect the owner put all those decals on Rob  -  he was a definite show-off


----------



## runnach

Robmac said:


> I wonder if it actually was a Camel Trophy vehicle (As per the sticker).
> 
> If it was, that would suggest it may be quite a capable vehicle?


 Only place that as come close to a camel is at Twycross Zoo, It says oxo on buses but never sell it I find.

As for kipping arrangements I have exclusively used the overhead bunk, I prefer to use the dinette for eating and teasing you lot 








Channa


----------



## Robmac

channa said:


> Only place that as come close to a camel is at Twycross Zoo, It says oxo on buses but never sell it I find.
> 
> Channa



Ah, but that's an assumption Andy?


----------



## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> Lots of scare mongering without even seeing or driving the vehicle. Sure, you can have an educated guess, but thats all it is.




Thank you Mark   -  many of the folks on here have never seen my van, nor seen it move, nor have they driven it, yet some seem convinced that it will kill me.  

I will not be bullied by people who are annoyed that I have not taken their individual bits of advice.

I have learnt an enormous amount from this thread - and it is due to all those who contributed, of which there are many, and I thank you all.  If this thread helps others address their weight issues, that is a second great outcome of this story. 

I made my decision about the future of my van based on the knowledge I had gleaned here, and as a result of researches I pursued as a result of the many suggestions.  But also as a result of consulting with experts in their fields (who are not on this forum)  who were able to help me sort the wheat from the chaff of the plethora of suggestions which I received in good faith from WC members.   I have decided to keep my van  and be far more aware of weight in the future -  if something comes into the van, then something else must leave.    

if you guys want to argue as to whose ideas are better than others, then feel free, but I wont be engaging with that. 

Its been a steep but interesting learning curve. 

We are all entitled to make our own choices, and just because I did not do what some suggested - I do not think that warrants posting unwarranted and frightening possibilities for my safety.

I think its time I moved on and returned to happy vanning.   if anyone else want to private message me about weight issues, please feel free.


----------



## mark61

Robmac said:


> I wonder if it actually was a Camel Trophy vehicle (As per the sticker).
> 
> If it was, that would suggest it may be quite a capable vehicle?



Barring a few events (1 or 2) Camel Trophy vehicles have all been LR products. Great marketing, but Camel Trophy was dumped about ten years ago for the G4 challenge.

No one knows whats in the vehicle in the video, probably well over loaded, tracks always look much easier in videos too. L300 4x4's are great little trucks and have a good reputation for their off road ability. Of course chucking a huge box on the back ain't going to do it any favours, but that doesn't mean it's going to roll over at the first Elk, ;P


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## delicagirl

jeanette said:


> Collette your over cab bed must have a big enough headroom for you to sleep there does it would it be possible to see a photo of your van? I only ask as I can't sleep in ours so therefore we sleep downstairs,as we have a sitting area at the back of the van,



Hi Jeanette there are external pictures of my van on my profile, but I don't have any internal piccies.  I can sleep in the cab bed, but there is very little headroom, and I don't have a ladder, so its a bit of an "art" to get up there and in the right place !!!!  Its thanks to my pilates that I am this flexible.


----------



## Robmac

mark61 said:


> Barring a few events (1 or 2) Camel Trophy vehicles have all been LR products. Great marketing, but Camel Trophy was dumped about ten years ago for the G4 challenge.
> 
> No one knows whats in the vehicle in the video, probably well over loaded, tracks always look much easier in videos too. L300 4x4's are great little trucks and have a good reputation for their off road ability. Of course chucking a huge box on the back ain't going to do it any favours, but that doesn't mean it's going to roll over at the first Elk, ;P



Although I have seen many vehicles with 'Camel' stickers (maybe support vehicles) maybe I'm confusing it with Expedition Portal?


----------



## yeoblade

delicagirl said:


> Thank you Mark   -  many of the folks on here have never seen my van, nor seen it move, nor have they driven it, yet some seem convinced that it will kill me.
> ................./snip
> 
> I think its time I moved on and returned to happy vanning.   if anyone else want to private message me about weight issues, please feel free.



That would be a brave person  :lol-053:


----------



## mark61

Robmac said:


> Although I have seen many vehicles with 'Camel' stickers (maybe support vehicles) maybe I'm confusing it with Expedition Portal?



They give them away at shows.

Our shirts never caught on.


----------



## vwalan

you dont need 4x4 to go out and play with the camels though . it is possible in a mini artic . 
these these are out behind merzouga in the desert. 
if you like camels thats the place to go. mind you could go to a landrover show and see landrovers dressed for desert work that hardly ever leave tarmac.


----------



## Robmac

.......well I've seen Llamas alongside the A66!


----------



## ricc

hairydog said:


> ricc, you are missing the point. There is no difference between a side slope and a swerve to avoid a child who just fell off a bicycle. A vehicle that is not stable is not safe to drive.
> 
> I hope that delicagirl's van is not as unstable as the one in the film, but it is clearly not appropriate to have a spare wheel on the roof of such a vehicle



have you ever done any cross country off track driving?   rolling on a side slope is a world away from swerving to avoid a child on a bike.
its possible to roll any vehicle on a side slope if the angle is big enough.

arguably if youve got to swerve violently enough to roll the vehicle  to avoid a child falling off a bike you were driving too fast and too close to the bike in the first place,

dynamic stability of a vehicle is effected by speed and to some extent by driver input. for example a vehicle thats unstable at 70mph with violent driver inputs can be safe to drive smoothly at 30.

id be interested to know why youve decided that its "clearly inappropriate to have a roof mounted spare wheel",  

personally id look at mounting it on the front, purely because i wouldnt fancy lifting it up onto the roof but its not going to make a blind bit of difference to the stability of the vehicle in normal usage.  but front mounting will effect airflow over the radiator so could cause overheating in extreem conditions, not forgetting the weight of a substantial mounting bracket will eat into the payload.


----------



## vwalan

2005 barcelona dakar rallye. they didnt let me win . so i changed from the vw lt to put them off later years .


----------



## delicagirl

ricc - thank you for explaining about side slopes in a way I could not.  

 Re weight of the wheel  - several people have said how hard it would be to get it down, and in fact when the spare was handed down to me (at my request)  by the Recovery guy who came to change wheels when my tyre shredded, it was nowhere near as heavy as I had been led to believe   (but I am fairly strong though).    I have always carried a spare, and will always do so, as I feel that the Recovery will change the wheel and get me road worthy again, in an emergency situation, which then leaves me time, and calmness, to find a garage I can trust to do the repair.  Women are much more likely to be taken advantage of my unscrupulous garage owners, than men customers.

I have had 4 punctures in the last 18 months on 3 different vehicles.  If a vehicle is designed to carry a spare, and does not, then Recovery companies will be unable to do a roadside exchange of wheels and some will charge £120+ in UK to tow the vehicle to a garage ...  another good reason to carry a spare.

But mostly a spare gives me peace of mind.


----------



## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> ricc - thank you for explaining about side slopes in a way I could not.
> 
> I have had 4 punctures in the last 18 months on 3 different vehicles.  If a vehicle is designed to carry a spare, and does not, then Recovery companies will be unable to do a roadside exchange of wheels and some will charge £120+ in UK to tow the vehicle to a garage ...  another good reason to carry a spare.
> 
> But mostly a spare gives me peace of mind.



And if anyone else advises that it isn't wise to have a spare wheel on the roof, inform them that should you experience difficulties you'll have the wheel spinning with a washing machine motor, the gyroscopic effect will then make your van impossible to overturn.


----------



## trevskoda

hairydog said:


> Of course it can, and should. There are three sensible places you could put it, in order of preference:
> 1. On the front, on a brcket.
> 2. Underneath (though there may not be space)
> 3. In your garden shed. You don't need to carry a spare. My last car ran on  LPG and the tank was in the spare wheel well. In over 100,000 miles I never missed a spare. Carry a leak sealer aerosol and a small compressor.
> Would you change the wheel if you had a flat? I'd call out a breakdown service if I had a flat tyre on my motorhome. The last time that happened was in the1990s I think.
> 
> You very definitely shouid not carry your spare wheel on your roof. Its a bad idea for any vehicle, a catastrophic idea for yours


The day a aerosol fixes a rip in a side wall i will eat my hat,i carry 2 spares in my car after on a return trip from donegal had two puntures in which the last one was within 6 miles from home,the wife is very good at changing them.


----------



## runnach

Robmac said:


> .......well I've seen Llamas alongside the A66!


 I can beat that once saw an elephant stood on its head just outside Doncaster !!! turned out circus was in town ...not sure it was really on its head can elephants do that ? It was certainly an unusual pose ..Almost fell of my Suzuki 200 x5 I know that much.

Channa


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> Hi Jeanette there are external pictures of my van on my profile, but I don't have any internal piccies.  I can sleep in the cab bed, but there is very little headroom, and I don't have a ladder, so its a bit of an "art" to get up there and in the right place !!!!  Its thanks to my pilates that I am this flexible.



I know you could spring up there like a dainty gazelle.


----------



## runnach

trevskoda said:


> I know you could spring up there like a dainty gazelle.


 not only that for jiggy jiggy ...spooning ( I am told)

possibly lowered the academic tone but only said what you is alls thinking 


Channa


----------



## delicagirl

trevskoda said:


> I know you could spring up there like a dainty gazelle.




Thank you Trev !!!  thats very delicious of you to say so.   i have started work with a new pilates teacher and she is so far advanced of my last one that i feel as if i am starting all over again -  its very frustating....   but keeps me on my toes - or on the floor on the  mat as the case may be !!


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> Thank you Trev !!!  thats very delicious of you to say so.   i have started work with a new pilates teacher and she is so far advanced of my last one that i feel as if i am starting all over again -  its very frustating....   but keeps me on my toes - or on the floor on the  mat as the case may be !!


 I can do all that :tongue: or do I say to myself Channa yer wires are all in a knot and twisted again :idea-007:

I like the exercise idea but I do get tired thinking about it :baby:

Channa (sleepy one now)


----------



## trevskoda

channa said:


> I can beat that once saw an elephant stood on its head just outside Doncaster !!! turned out circus was in town ...not sure it was really on its head can elephants do that ? It was certainly an unusual pose ..Almost fell of my Suzuki 200 x5 I know that much.
> 
> Channa



That nothing,my local chip shop is now i think putting elephant meat in the food as a they have a price for jumbo hot dogs on there board.:scared:


----------



## Byronic

Ah, the silvery tongued charm of an Irishman, doesn't seem to work in getting anyone into the Linux camp though


----------



## trevskoda

Byronic said:


> Ah, the silvery tongued charm of an Irishman, doesn't seem to work in getting anyone into the Linux camp though



I in fact dont care if they give it a go or not but i give my advice free of all chains to those who wish to be enlightened grass hopper.:bow::wave:


----------



## runnach

trevskoda said:


> I in fact dont care if they give it a go or not but i give my advice free of all chains to those who wish to be enlightened grass hopper.:bow::wave:


 I am with you ,eyes can give a twinkle across the UK :ninja:

Linux no idea what it is ...heard of a lineup though does that count ? 

Channa


----------



## Byronic

I shall never be able to take those Linux stones from your hand, so I will never be enlightened, and will forever be a grasshopper condemned to just looking out of Windows.


----------



## jeanette

delicagirl said:


> Hi Jeanette there are external pictures of my van on my profile, but I don't have any internal piccies.  I can sleep in the cab bed, but there is very little headroom, and I don't have a ladder, so its a bit of an "art" to get up there and in the right place !!!!  Its thanks to my pilates that I am this flexible.



Collette I can get up but for some reason I'm not keen to sleep up there?! That's why I'm pleased we have the downstairs bit to sleep in and still have plenty of room in the van,otherwise we would be looking at another van! I will no doubt be msging you


----------



## wildebus

Ref your spare wheel, can't see any photos of your rear end (the delicacar that is!), so not sure what it looks like (is there a rear door there?), but if you could maybe get a mount made for a spare similar to what you see on the rear doors of 4x4s?
Something like this would be pretty simple to do if space and construction allowed (and would be easy enough to tidy up so it looked better!)





This is actually part of a steel wheel with bolts attached. You would put a plate inside for strength and rigidity.
Just a thought to possibly get the spare off the roof and both more accessible and lower the CoG.


----------



## Tezza33

hairydog said:


> On my old van, I didn't use the overcab bed in winter because the heat tended to rise and made that bed too warm. Do you have th same problem?



Are you asking if Collette is hot in bed? :shag:


----------



## trevskoda

Apart from the fact there is whats called pendulum effect with weight to high there is also the prob of getting it up & down,the spare wheel that is.
If it were my van i would get a bull bar made for the front and mount the wheel there which would be easy to work with though it would add a bit to the length,cooling will not be a problem in uk or most other hotter countrys as most coolant sys are 25% over size and there will be plenty of air movement through the rad.
I also find it scares the s--t out of folk when they look in there r/v mirror.:scared:


----------



## izwozral

tezza33 said:


> Are you asking if Collette is hot in bed? :shag:



I can answer that!:tongue:


----------



## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> I looked at the photos at the outset of all this, though I thought the spare wheel was a top box. You will note that I suggested removing it.
> 
> Your van looks good, the one in the film looks stupid as well as dangerously unstable.
> 
> However, it was you who mentioned the film in post #465 and you didn't say your van is not like that. Then in post #468 you wrote about it saying *"This was an identical van to mine*" so it is a fair assumption that they are similar.




Before it had the rear-end raising modifications done to it  - if you compare the film to my still photos on my profile you will see the differences.


----------



## delicagirl

wildebus said:


> Ref your spare wheel, can't see any photos of your rear end (the delicacar that is!), so not sure what it looks like (is there a rear door there?), but if you could maybe get a mount made for a spare similar to what you see on the rear doors of 4x4s?
> Something like this would be pretty simple to do if space and construction allowed (and would be easy enough to tidy up so it looked better!)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is actually part of a steel wheel with bolts attached. You would put a plate inside for strength and rigidity.
> Just a thought to possibly get the spare off the roof and both more accessible and lower the CoG.



At the back of the bus i have a window, two fridge vents and a storage locker where the gas water heater used to be, and as the van body is fibre glass i dont think it is strong enough to hold the weight of a bull bar plus a wheel.  A spare wheel at the front would mean that i need 2 parking bays to park in. Also i am trying to bring weight forward rather than add to the weight at the back


----------



## Byronic

Not as dangerous as your suggesting that the young lady in question actually believed me! 22 miles of water may be your saving grace, perhaps not 

Anyway what is there not to believe, advice it was, just not practical advice.


----------



## izwozral

If you must carry the spare on the roof then that is a calculated risk - and we all take those every day of our lives don't we. I am sure you are a good driver and your girl racer days are over.

You have had no problems up until the blow out and that was after thousands of miles.
You have had SvTech go through the weights, they are the real experts in this field.
You are having new tyres fitted.
Your vehicle is quite different from that in the video clip.

Collette, take no heed of the doomsayers, even if it is well intended advice, drive safe and you will not have any problems.

Bicycles and motorbikes are potential death traps on our busy roads, far more so than cars, it doesn't stop hundreds of thousands of riders enjoying  them. 

Just get out there and enjoy.


----------



## RoadTrek Boy

It may have already been suggested, but to reduce weight if you have steel wheels is to change them to good quality alloy ones, expensive,but it would give you a greater payload (low down in the van) and reduce the mass on the roof, a win win I think, :drive: whatever, enjoy your van! :wacko::wacko:


----------



## wildebus

RoadTrek Boy said:


> It may have already been suggested, but to reduce weight if you have steel wheels is to change them to good quality alloy ones, expensive,but it would give you a greater payload (low down in the van) and reduce the mass on the roof, a win win I think, :drive: whatever, enjoy your van! :wacko::wacko:


I think the "alloys to save weight" is a bit of myth to be honest. If you are talking about lightweight racing alloys, that would be the case, but an alloy wheel does not really weigh much difference to a steel wheel.
Steel is heavier yes, but a pressed steel wheel has a lot thinner material then a cast alloy wheel, so the weight saving on the material is negated and certainly not a VFM or price vs performance option (IMHO anyway)


----------



## delicagirl

izwozral said:


> If you must carry the spare on the roof then that is a calculated risk - and we all take those every day of our lives don't we. I am sure you are a good driver and *your girl racer days are over.*
> 
> You have had no problems up until the blow out and that was after thousands of miles.
> You have had SvTech go through the weights, they are the real experts in this field.
> You are having new tyres fitted.
> Your vehicle is quite different from that in the video clip.
> 
> Collette, take no heed of the doomsayers, even if it is well intended advice, drive safe and you will not have any problems.
> 
> Bicycles and motorbikes are potential death traps on our busy roads, far more so than cars, it doesn't stop hundreds of thousands of riders enjoying  them.
> 
> Just get out there and enjoy.



Thank you izzy   -  that makes a lot of sense, i think i have now got peace of mind and understand a lot more than i did a month ago.

In the van i rarely go over 50mph - otherwise i can watch the fuel gauge dropping at an alarming rate !!

Girl racer  -  mmm  -  you should see me in my 2 seater soft top, like yesterday, with the sun shining, and the whippy petrol accelerator engine letting me overtake safely in places where the van would not, and me hair blowing in the wind, and Sky on the CD at full volume and me singing me head off, wearing dark glasses.....     Girl racer ?  Thats ME  !!!!  I'm never growing old in my head  !!!!


----------



## Byronic

Spare wheel @ say 25Kg. Which is 1%  of the vehicles O/A weight, at a max. of a 3m lever, not enough to be really noticed in what is essentially a plodding commercial vehicle, sure as a principle weight (mass) should be kept as low as possible. The convincing way to confirm this is to drive with wheel on then with it removed.

Think of it this way when the driver of a double decker bus gets 2 or 3 obese people  (say 400kg ie 4% of the bus O/A weight) on the top deck of his bus does he get out and refuse to drive the bus? No, he just takes the bends 1 mph slower he doesn't pitch and roll the bus as much, and he does all this by the seat of his pants. He automatically adjusts his driving style to suit the vehicles ever changing capabilities as we all do.


----------



## wildebus

I think the answer is actually very simple ...

Sell the Delica and get one of these ...
[video=youtube_share;HBDPRYjGZi4]https://youtu.be/HBDPRYjGZi4[/video]
Not quite "amphibious" but it will ford 3 foot deep water. Only £90K and I want one!!


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Hi Gang,
Just reopened this thread, 
Did we get to the bottom of the Axel weights and Vehicle payload capacity ?.
Is it sorted !. I will have a read through ofcourse but just wondering.


----------



## Obanboy666

Nesting Zombie said:


> Hi Gang,
> Just reopened this thread,
> Did we get to the bottom of the Axel weights and Vehicle payload capacity ?.
> Is it sorted !. I will have a read through ofcourse but just wondering.



Beat me to it !
I was just going to sake the same question.


----------



## wildebus

Don't know if you watched through the video (it is quite long) but the owners HAVE done just that 
It is a very well thought out vehicle and ideal for one or two people. At the price, would be just a pipedream for most though.

And to the previous posts, yes, it is answered


----------



## vwalan

its only water. 
yet again dont need 4x4 to cross water. 
mind i dont fancy crossing the channel ha ha


----------



## Byronic

vwalan said:


> View attachment 47042
> its only water.
> yet again dont need 4x4 to cross water.
> mind i dont fancy crossing the channel ha ha



Used to take my Skoda Trekka with LSD through water twice as deep as that regularly in  NZ, only got stuck a few times actually quite a few times in a ribbon river. Trev. would have been justly proud.


----------



## delicagirl

What a brilliant top quality van   on the UTube Clip  !!!   i would need an over cab bed though....The owner said  £125,000   and if i had that  amount i might have a purpose built one made specially for me !!!   but i haven't  -   so delica it is......


----------



## mark61

Woelcke do some nice stuff. I've had a few good looks at their stuff.

That transporter may have done 3 foot depth and survived, but I doubt they make a habit of it.  Chances of breathers being lengthened are small, plus there is also loads of electrics below 3 feet. Waterproofed maybe, but not submergible. 

Land Rover owners will tell you the door seals leak to stop the vehicle floating.


----------



## Tezza33

Byronic said:


> Used to take my Skoda Trekka with LSD


It isn't a good idea to take LSD and drive, it can affect your ability
View attachment 47047View attachment 47044View attachment 47045View attachment 47046


----------



## mark61

delicagirl said:


> What a brilliant top quality van   on the UTube Clip  !!!   i would need an over cab bed though....The owner said  £125,000   and if i had that  amount i might have a purpose built one made specially for me !!!   but i haven't  -   so delica it is......



Euros, he must have ticked a lot of options too.
Nice thing about Woelcke is you can buy them empty and do the inside yourself. I spent far too long looking into this stuff, didn't I.


----------



## ricc

i once took a mk 2 escort through over bonnet flood water,  took sometime to dry out the interior and within a year it needed all new wheel bearings and new front lights.... this was a nearly new company vehicle not an old banger so it was all down to the immersion.


----------



## Nesting Zombie

Lol lol lol ha HA HA LOL Oh dear !,,,65 Kg per person,,,


I don't know why but that made me laugh ! But confirmed that I'm twice the man I thought I was !


----------



## Obanboy666

Well David unless you are 6'9" which I find unlikely you are seriously overweight.


----------



## runnach

for reference

BMI healthy weight calculator - Health tools - NHS Choices

Channa


----------



## Byronic

Difficult to reply to that post without identifying my occupation which I prefer not to do. But I will mention the following:
25kg or 35kg still represents a small percentage of the O/A. In any event what you yourself "expect" the weight to be is not necessarily what it is either.

The height to wheel track ratio for both vehicles would be approximately equal or at least not so different 2.2 : 4m
versus 1.6 : 3m at a guess. 

All vehicle manufacturers attempt to keep weight as low as possible, they don't deliberately make a vehicle more top heavy than is necessary. Mitsubishi included. Have you ever lifted vehicle double or bench seats they are bloody heavy, a bus carries a lot of weight at a high level even without passengers. I would not hazard a guess on whether an empty bus would tip over at a lesser or greater angle than an empty Delicavan, certainly not without a lot more data. 

Obese people don't go upstairs? That's a fact is it? Actually the worst case scenario is a full top deck and no one downstairs, and the driver will still be able to drive the bus safely because he will drive within it's reduced capabilities. I hope you're not a bus driver!


----------



## runnach

hairydog said:


> 65KG is the standard weight of a passenger as determined by the Department of Transport.
> At 105Kg you would need to be 2.05 metres (6ft 8.75in) tall to be in the 'normal' weight range. Very few people are as tall as that.



Brittania airlines (latterly Thomson) worked on 

75 kg male 
50 kg female
25 kg child

I am sure somebody somewhere must have been satisified mean averages. Add luggage (which is weighed) fuel and you have an All up take off weight.

From that pilots would "govern engine speeds on take off" to reduce overall wear and tear.

Channa


----------



## Fazerloz

All together now. The Wheels On The Bus Go Round and Round • Nursery Rhymes Song with Lyrics • Animated Kids Song - YouTube


----------



## Byronic

Anyone posting in on food related subjects should be compelled to post in their authenticated BMI and a selfie. Just for the lulz if nothing else.


----------



## runnach

Fazerloz said:


> All together now. The Wheels On The Bus Go Round and Round • Nursery Rhymes Song with Lyrics • Animated Kids Song - YouTube


 Can we stop it for a wee wee ? 

Channa


----------



## Robmac

Fazerloz said:


> All together now. The Wheels On The Bus Go Round and Round • Nursery Rhymes Song with Lyrics • Animated Kids Song - YouTube



NOoooooooooooooooooooooo!!


----------



## Fazerloz

Of course we can but I bet I can pi-s higher than you.


----------



## Byronic

hairydog said:


> Yes its a fact. Obese people don't go upstairs on buses. And no, I'm not a bus driver. I gave that job up in about 1980. Well, I was a coach driver and rarely took our only decker out. But I do speak from real world experience.
> 
> Your calculations are a bit out. The COG of an empty bus is about 1.5m up and its track is around 2.3M. The van we're talking about is built on a chassis with extra ground clearance and probably has a COG about 1.4M up. But its track is only 1.54M. They're a bit tippy at their original 1.98M height, but with a motorhome body on...



Grounded fatties, probably, a bit tippy. No I just can't be bothered


----------



## Tezza33

The only conclusion I have come to is don't sit on the top of Collettes van while she is driving fast around sharp cornersView attachment 47052View attachment 47053View attachment 47054View attachment 47055View attachment 47056


----------



## delicagirl

tezza33 said:


> The only conclusion I have come to is don't sit on the top of Collettes van while she is driving fast around sharp cornersView attachment 47052View attachment 47053View attachment 47054View attachment 47055View attachment 47056




i only drive fast round sharp(ish) corners in my 2 seater soft top with the hood down  --   only Very Special passengers are allowed onboard   ...   form a queue gentlemen  -  form a queue 
:lol-061:


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> i only drive fast round sharp(ish) corners in my 2 seater soft top with the hood down  --   only Very Special passengers are allowed onboard   ...   form a queue gentlemen  -  form a queue
> :lol-061:



Not sure about a soft top but there seems to be a few on here with a soft spot for you young lassie,keep them dangling.:lol-053:


----------



## delicagirl

tezza33 said:


> Are you asking if *Collette is hot in bed*? :shag:





i   should say so....   i have a Top Rated TOG  duvet :lol-053:


----------



## Tezza33

delicagirl said:


> i only drive fast round sharp(ish) corners in my 2 seater soft top with the hood down  --   only Very Special passengers are allowed onboard   ...   form a queue gentlemen  -  form a queue
> :lol-061:


I would join a queue to see you with your top downView attachment 47061View attachment 47062


----------



## delicagirl

oppy said:


> How about *making love stood up in a hammock*?:heart::heart::heart:



Isn't that one of the definitions of  "impossibility"


----------



## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> You sure about that? It's not a simple lever really, but more to the point it is unnecessary. The weight is too high, too far forward and frankly, in a very inconvenient place. And I question your figures. A Land Rover Defender wheel and tyre weighs 45 KG so *i'd expect these to be 35Kg at least.
> *
> What you need to consider is the stability cross-section triangle. Imagine that you slice through the van at its f-r balance midpoint. Then establish how high the centre of gravity is. To assess how far off level it can go before toppling, draw a triangle with the middle of each wheel's track as the bottom corners and the COG as the top. Rotate the triangle until one side of the triangle is vertical thenmeasure the anglethebase makes with the horizontal.
> 
> The vehicle in question has quite a narrow track and is quite high. Unlike a bus, its heavy bits are not deliberately made as low as possible.
> 
> 
> Have you seen how far a double-decker can tilt before it will topple? It's terrifyingly far. So the bus isn't anywhere near the limits of its stability, and not being 4WD isn't likely to go off-road.
> 
> A typical decker weighs 12T empty, plus 65KG per passenger. Typically 38 passengers on each floor, with extra standing downstairs only. So assume worstcase scenario; 5 passengers upstairs, none downstairs. Note 5 normal, not 2 or 3 obese (obese passengers don't go upstairs on buses). So 325KG is 3.5 metres up. That's 2.7% of the bus weight. That's not going to make much difference even though it is 2M above the COG. It will bring the COG up by about 2cm. The bus has a wide track so would have to be leaning a very long way to topple.






I doubt they are 35kgs   (77lbs)  because i did not find it at all difficult to pick up nor to take it from the hands of the Recovery guy when my arms were fully stretched up to the sky to take it from him.  i am quite strong due to training, but even i would be amazed if i could lift 77lbs that easily.

All these things are subjective anyways. 



To answer another question  -  when the shredded spare was in the local garage for a week or more i noticed no difference with the stability of the van whilst driving.


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> i only drive fast round sharp(ish) corners in my 2 seater soft top with the hood down  --   only Very Special passengers are allowed onboard   ...   form a queue gentlemen  -  form a queue
> :lol-061:


 You show me yours I shall show you mine !

Throw me about in a 2 seater sports car be fun I am sure.

Then I have my fun ...you ride pillion on the bike !!!... 0-60 3.82 seconds, glad you got core strength to hang on !!!:scared:.........I know a little road around Cheddar, sweeping bends , like riding on a switch blade knife !!!. Fish and Chips afterwards at WSM ....Jeez I know how to treat a girl :mad1:

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> You show me yours I shall show you mine !
> 
> Throw me about in a 2 seater sports car be fun I am sure.
> 
> Then I have my fun ...you ride pillion on the bike !!!... 0-60 3.82 seconds, glad you got core strength to hang on !!!:scared:.........I know a little road around Cheddar, sweeping bends , like riding on a switch blade knife !!!. Fish and Chips afterwards at WSM ....Jeez I know how to treat a girl :mad1:
> 
> Channa



i have always wanted to ride pillion again on a beeeg  bike after being on the back of a 900cc  bike doing  105mph on the M4 at 3.30am  when there were no speed cameras...... after the initial terror and clutching the driver's waist like a limpet,  i eventually let my arms drop down, and they kind of floated behind me with the wind rushing towards us....    brilliantly exciting.....


nowt wrong with fish n chips  channa !!


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> i have always wanted to ride pillion again on a beeeg  bike after being on the back of a 900cc  bike doing  105mph on the M4 at 3.30am  when there were no speed cameras...... after the initial terror and clutching the driver's waist like a limpet,  i eventually let my arms drop down, and they kind of floated behind me with the wind rushing towards us....    brilliantly exciting.....
> 
> 
> nowt wrong with fish n chips  channa !!



The grabbing on like a limpet thing is the whole idea :lol-061:.....I might be a tad stupid, I might be a tad mad ...but not daft !!!:lol-061:

Mushy peas with the Fish and Chips too !!!...if a very good girl, although I tend to be a steddie Eddie nowadays and cook my own, tis a Yorkshire thing.

As for Motorcycles , you either get it or you don't and no spare wheel weighing x to factor in to the equation, 

The equation τ = m(r^2)α is the rotational analog of Newton's second law (F=ma), where torque is analogous to force, angular acceleration is analogous to translational acceleration, and mr2 is analogous to mass (or inertia).
or rotational mass equations (whatever they are)  

Best off riding the thing and enjoying decent nosh 

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

channa said:


> The grabbing on like a limpet thing is the whole idea :lol-061:.....I might be a tad stupid, I might be a tad mad ...but not daft !!!:lol-061:
> 
> Mushy peas with the Fish and Chips too !!!...if a very good girl, although I tend to be a steddie Eddie nowadays and cook my own, tis a Yorkshire thing.
> 
> As for Motorcycles , you either get it or you don't and no spare wheel weighing x to factor in to the equation,
> 
> The equation τ = m(r^2)α is the rotational analog of Newton's second law (F=ma), where torque is analogous to force, angular acceleration is analogous to translational acceleration, and mr2 is analogous to mass (or inertia).
> or rotational mass equations (whatever they are)
> 
> Best off riding the thing and enjoying decent nosh
> 
> Channa



surely you mean that the angular acceleration's torque (squared) is equal to, or more than, the cube of a widget, digitised to a nominal factor ? 


I didn't read 1.25 pages of the  "Brief History of Time for nothing me old muccka !!!


----------



## Tezza33

channa said:


> The grabbing on like a limpet thing is the whole idea


That brings back a lot of memories, those were the days, complete with 60's music


----------



## Tezza33

delicagirl said:


> i have always wanted to ride pillion again on a beeeg  bike


If channa tries to convince you it has a joystick control then please don't believe him, just hold his waist and don't try steering it, that is my old lineView attachment 47067View attachment 47068View attachment 47069


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> surely you mean that the angular acceleration's torque (squared) is equal to, or more than, the cube of a widget, digitised to a nominal factor ?
> 
> 
> I didn't read 1.25 pages of the  "Brief History of Time for nothing me old muccka !!!



Slapped legs, If I had meant the angular acceleration , and nominal values of the widget I would have said so !!. Inverse proportionality is conjectural at best, dependant upon which beverage has been consumed. 

The study of idiopathic entheogenics at the university of life is so tiring 

Channa


But to liven things up even Great Whites can step on a lego brick


----------



## Fazerloz

You know how it works girls.
The louder you scream the faster we go.


----------



## Obanboy666

Well, it's widely used by the medical professionals but obviously they are wrong because as usual it's another subject matter that you are an expert on. 
Just admit you are overweight like the majority of the population and that's why you are on a healthy eating regime. :lol-049::lol-049::lol-049::lol-049:


----------



## Byronic

[No message]


----------



## Tbear

Nobody in the medical profession thinks that the BMI is exact, it is a rule of thumb to help people understand there body and the level of health risks that they are subject to. It then becomes a tool for them to set targets to improve themselves. Demeaning it because it does not work for international standard prop forwards and the like does little good but can add confusion and can reduce peoples incentive to drive their fitness forward. I for one congratulate obese people that reduce their BMI. It is that simple for me.

Richard

What's your BMI? - Live Well - NHS Choices


----------



## colinm

The BMI can be wrong, when I was racing at national/international level it showed me as over weight, which was clearly wrong by a mile.
Don't get me started on how often the so called experts have got it wrong with health advice.


----------



## Obanboy666

colinmd said:


> The BMI can be wrong, when I was racing at national/international level it showed me as over weight, which was clearly wrong by a mile.
> Don't get me started on how often the so called experts have got it wrong with health advice.



Read the previous post, it's a guide not an exact science.


----------



## Tbear

colinmd said:


> The BMI can be wrong, when I was racing at national/international level it showed me as over weight, which was clearly wrong by a mile.
> Don't get me started on *how often the so called experts have got it wrong* with health advice.



So why are you so foolish in consulting a medical professional in the first place. Make room for the people that value their help.

Richard


----------



## ricc

im not convinced by bmi either.  

the calculator then gives a recommendation for daily calorie intake , presumably based on the simplistic activity level entered earlier,    that also has a very dubious scientific basis.


----------



## Robmac

I think it is useful as a general guide. But people have different metabolisms.

Fortunately, Doctors are also aware of this.


----------



## Tbear

ricc said:


> im not convinced by bmi either.
> 
> the calculator then gives a recommendation for daily calorie intake , presumably based on the simplistic activity level entered earlier,    that also has a very dubious scientific basis.



Add a little common sense, titrate against response and you will find that their recommendations will lead you in the correct direction. When trying to create one rule to fit everybody, there will be people that it is wholly inappropriate for but the majority will gain from it. It gives my BMI as far too high.
I swim, canoe and cycle so have a reasonable muscle mass (confirmed on ultrasound by a surprised doctor the other day  ) so I carry less fat that it suggests, however I am still too fat and need to loose weight if I want to live to see 80.

Richard


----------



## andyjanet

I see the bickering from the drone thread has now spread to this one also, obviously summers finished and people are not happy about winter coming, here's  something that will upset more people only 85 days to christmas:dance:


----------



## Tbear

May I suggest that you don't go around trying to convince women that they need to see you naked to see that you are overweight and please don't feel the need to publish photos!

Richard


----------



## trevskoda

Tbear said:


> May I suggest that you don't go around trying to convince women that they need to see you naked to see that you are overweight and please don't feel the need to publish photos!
> 
> Richard



Prob put them off there dinner which in turn will help them loss weight.:banana:


----------



## colinm

Tbear said:


> So why are you so foolish in consulting a medical professional in the first place. Make room for the people that value their help.
> 
> Richard



I have had thousands of pounds taken from my income to pay the NHS, sometimes it's to good use like patching me up, other times it's been squandered on ridiculous health advice like the one to cut down on people using butter which resulted in 10's of thousands going to an early grave.


----------



## Tbear

colinmd said:


> I have had thousands of pounds taken from my income to pay the NHS, sometimes it's to good use like patching me up, other times it's been squandered on ridiculous health advice like the one to *cut down on people using butter which resulted in 10's of thousands going to an early grave*.



I look forward to reading your evidence that reducing any form of fat in a western diet is a bad idea. As for a lack of butter killing tens of thousands???

Richard


----------



## izwozral

Funny how this thread started off as a MH weight issue now it has become a peoples weight issue.

Can't wait for it to become a planetary mass weight issue.


----------



## colinm

Tbear said:


> I look forward to reading your evidence that reducing any form of fat in a western diet is a bad idea. As for a lack of butter killing tens of thousands???
> 
> Richard



Interestingly one of the healthiest populations have a Scandinavian diet which is very high in fats, but that's an aside which is not quite understood.
Back in the day the NHS where happy to advise people to cut down on saturated fats, to this end they promoted spreads many of which contained trans fats, a real killer.


----------



## ricc

one of the classic heath cons is the mediteranean diet .....totally ignors that the advice is based on one study done on people largely indigenous to the med , living in a med climate ,   no thought at all given to different racial types or  living in different climate zones before touting it as the panacea for all.

its some years since i looked at it , but if you actually look at the origional study its clear that there were one or maybe two large med countries that were part of the initial  survey but excluded from the data that was used to produce the final results cos they didnt fit the conclusions that the study was trying to prove.    sadly a practice found in too many health and lifestyle surveys.


----------



## delicagirl

I agree wholeheartedly with Davd here  -  many athletes allegedly have an unhealthy BMI when in fact they are fit as a fiddle because muscles weighs much more than fat.


----------



## mark61

Driving through muddy water is fun, but, yes, needs to be baked up with extra maintenance. I now avoid deep water when it looks more like slurry, blocks radiator in no time and takes ages to clean, and thats just the beginning of the extra work.


----------



## Tbear

colinmd said:


> Interestingly one of the healthiest populations have a Scandinavian diet which is very high in fats, but that's an aside which is not quite understood.
> Back in the day the NHS where happy to advise people to cut down on saturated fats, to this end they promoted spreads many of which contained trans fats, a real killer.



The evidence that I have seen coming out of Scandinavia is to reduce carbs and eat fresh food which is unrefined or interfered with. This will of course will include fish and dairy products in that area. The Norwegians that I know are all very fit and eat a diet rich in fish, fresh fruit and veg.

I cannot remember when the NHS promoted a diet high in calories from any source. Available evidence has switched between butter and marge as technology moves forward but the calories ingested to exercise ratio still remains the same. Too much oil and too little exercise equals obesity which will shorten your life, increase damage to your joints and increase your risk of cancer. If you wish to have a high calorie and high fat diet, please feel free. Smoke and drink large amounts of alcohol as well if you wish but please don't come bleating to the health service with your self inflicted problems in later life. 

Richard


----------



## colinm

Tbear said:


> I cannot remember when the NHS promoted a diet high in calories from any source. Available evidence has switched between butter and marge as technology moves forward but the calories ingested to exercise ratio still remains the same. Too much oil and too little exercise equals obesity which will shorten your life, increase damage to your joints and increase your risk of cancer. If you wish to have a high calorie and high fat diet, please feel free. Smoke and drink large amounts of alcohol as well if you wish but please don't come bleating to the health service with your self inflicted problems in later life.
> 
> Richard



Who's saying they have promoted a high calorie diet, certainly not me. 
The NHS where 'fooled' into believing that a diet low in saturates was the answer to a lot of health problems, well that's true to a certain extent, but it depends on what you replace the saturates with.
Go back a few decades and the advice was to switch to low fat foods and also spreads to replace butter, the problem is some of those foods such as spreads contained trans fats, also a lot of low fat food contained a lot of sugars, not enough emphasis was given to educate the general public that this was as bad or even worse than eating high fat foods, so we had a lot of people eating trans fats which are really nasty and sugars which the body will readily convert to fat given enough insulin.
Fast forward to today and we have a ban on trans fats in food, an obesity epidemic, and a greater number of people with diabetes.


----------



## Fazerloz

Tbear said:


> Too much oil and too little exercise equals obesity which will shorten your life, increase damage to your joints and increase your risk of cancer. If you wish to have a high calorie and high fat diet, please feel free. Smoke and drink large amounts of alcohol as well if you wish but please don't come bleating to the health service with your self inflicted problems in later life.
> 
> Richard



Are you advocating only those who have led a so called healthy lifestyle should be able to have NHS assistance which everyone has paid into. After all how many have gone to the NHS due to sport, Keep fit, allsorts of other activities  which cause self inflicted injuries. A fatty has just as much right to  knee surgery as someone who had caused the damage through playing football. Both self inflicted.


----------



## delicagirl

Some NHS trusts will not offer gastric surgery to the obese if the patient will not lose a defined amount of weight in a specific time  - this is a test of their own motivation,  and proof of their individual commitment to taking some responsibility for their own condition before consuming large amounts of NHS resources. 

The cost of treating the obese in terms of  strengthening floors in obesity units, buying large specially strengthened ambulances/chairs/surgical gurneys/wheel chairs  etc etc is growing.   The cost of treating injuries through sporting activities must surely pale into insignificance when compared with  the cost of treating 1/3rd+ of our adult population who are  overweight and in need of medications and treatments for a wide variety of weight-related conditions:-  high blood pressure, diabetes, asthma, flat feet, heart conditions, sleep apnoea, etc etc etc. 

 I'm sure our medical members can add to this list.

Our more mature  generation has had it instilled into us that the NHS is totally responsible for our lives.   This can no longer be the case as funding is  now such a crucial issue.

The NHS offers a post code lottery with regards to different treatments offered in different parts of the country, we all know that - so we already accept that not all treatments are available for all patients.   

Forcing the obese (and other "self inflicted" conditions - however they are defined) to participate in their own recovery has to be a good way forward to help them keep the weight off/reduce their medication/feel better  for the rest of their lives - both for their own sense of well being and health and for the finances of the NHS.


----------



## Tbear

colinmd said:


> Who's saying they have promoted a high calorie diet, certainly not me.
> The NHS where 'fooled' into believing that a diet low in saturates was the answer to a lot of health problems, well that's true to a certain extent, but it depends on what you replace the saturates with.
> Go back a few decades and the advice was to switch to low fat foods and also spreads to replace butter, the problem is some of those foods such as spreads contained trans fats, also a lot of low fat food contained a lot of sugars, not enough emphasis was given to educate the general public that this was as bad or even worse than eating high fat foods, so we had a lot of people eating trans fats which are really nasty and sugars which the body will readily convert to fat given enough insulin.
> Fast forward to today and we have a ban on trans fats in food, an obesity epidemic, and a greater number of people with diabetes.



People are getting fat because they eat too much and eat the wrong things and they know it. Nothing to do with the advise they have been given, rather in spite of it. Type 2 diabetes is on the rise because more people are getting fat. I am not overweight because I had some margarine on my toast but because of all the other rubbish I have consumed as well. Ironically to give me the energy to lug other fatter people about.

Richard


----------



## runnach

Tbear said:


> People are getting fat because they eat too much and eat the wrong things and they know it. Nothing to do with the advise they have been given, rather in spite of it. Richard



Not only that but eat the wrong time of day, Eat the wrong way round, Light lunches heavy dinners early evening , not giving the digestive system time to do its job. A lot of the issue I believe are lifestyle choices, some self inficted

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

Tbear said:


> People are getting fat because they eat too much and *eat the wrong things* and they know it. Nothing to do with the advise they have been given, rather in spite of it. Type 2 diabetes is on the rise because more people are getting fat. I am not overweight because I had some margarine on my toast but because of all the other rubbish I have consumed as well. Ironically to give me the energy to lug other fatter people about.
> 
> Richard



I do agree with this sentiment - but I think we need to look at our education system also  -  i have met many many 20-30 years olds who cannot cook, because they were not taught this basic skill at school,  and now eat entirely form takeaway shops.  If our schools improved their food education this could help.

Jamie oliver has been fighting this lack of awareness for many years now and his influence seems to be slowly taken on board by schools who are preparing their own menus  ....  I wish him well.


----------



## trevskoda

delicagirl said:


> Some NHS trusts will not offer gastric surgery to the obese if the patient will not lose a defined amount of weight in a specific time  - this is a test of their own motivation,  and proof of their individual commitment to taking some responsibility for their own condition before consuming large amounts of NHS resources.
> 
> The cost of treating the obese in terms of  strengthening floors in obesity units, buying large specially strengthened ambulances/chairs/surgical gurneys/wheel chairs  etc etc is growing.
> I blame most of this on that chap called Ken tucky & his scotch mate Mc donald.:lol-049:
> On tv today they were saying people eat at least 2 takaways every day,i would say more like 4 a day never mind the large volumes of inkahol hic burp that is consumed.


----------



## vwalan

delicagirl said:


> I do agree with this sentiment - but I think we need to look at our education system also  -  i have met many many 20-30 years olds who cannot cook, because they were not taught this basic skill at school,  and not eat entirely form takeaway shops.  If our schools improved their food education this could help.
> 
> Jamie oliver has been fighting this lack of awareness for many years now and his influence seems to be slowly taken on board by schools who are preparing their own menus  ....  I wish him well.



there are thousands in their 50,s and 60,s and even older that cant cook. 
it was taught at school but not many actually learnt it . 
education makes people highly educated . it does make them intelligent.
be far better if schools assisted in teaching life skills , these have been missing for generations . think the 50,s and 60,s teenagers started it . 
many cant even use a sweeping brush .
strangely i see youngsters wanting to learn these basic skills . but dont know who can teach them.


----------



## delicagirl

I eat take-a-ways at least 3 times a week  - but I buy fresh prepared salad boxes from my local baker - at a price far cheaper than I could buy the ingredients for and then I would have to wash and prepare the food. it is convenient for me to do so. 


but I guess the British image of take-a-ways is fat fast food   - but the other side of the coin is that   the likes of Marks and Spencer now sell very very healthy take a way meals at reasonable prices - but even those are beyond the budget of someone on benefits.


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> there are thousands in their 50,s and 60,s and even older that cant cook.
> it was taught at school but not many actually learnt it .
> education makes people highly educated . it does make them intelligent.
> be far better if schools assisted in teaching life skills , these have been missing for generations . think the 50,s and 60,s teenagers started it .
> many cant even use a sweeping brush .
> strangely i see youngsters wanting to learn these basic skills . but *dont know who can teach them*.




send em to me Al  !!!


----------



## delicagirl

David it is frightening how many local pubs close here each week - pretty soon there will be no local "non-restaurant" pubs left.....


----------



## vwalan

trevskoda said:


> delicagirl said:
> 
> 
> 
> Some NHS trusts will not offer gastric surgery to the obese if the patient will not lose a defined amount of weight in a specific time  - this is a test of their own motivation,  and proof of their individual commitment to taking some responsibility for their own condition before consuming large amounts of NHS resources.
> 
> The cost of treating the obese in terms of  strengthening floors in obesity units, buying large specially strengthened ambulances/chairs/surgical gurneys/wheel chairs  etc etc is growing.
> I blame most of this on that chap called Ken tucky & his scotch mate Mc donald.:lol-049:
> On tv today they were saying people eat at least 2 takaways every day,i would say more like 4 a day never mind the large volumes of inkahol hic burp that is consumed.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> have you not been told the secret of kentucky fried chicken ?
> i learnt it years ago.
> cant put it here its a secret. but they can be very healthy if done correctly .
Click to expand...


----------



## delicagirl

vwalan said:


> trevskoda said:
> 
> 
> 
> have you not been told the secret of kentucky fried chicken ?
> i learnt it years ago.
> cant put it here its a secret. but they can be very healthy if done correctly .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was taken out for a meal to an American Diner recently and not only were the portion sized huge, but everything was fried......  I rest my case......
Click to expand...


----------



## trevskoda

vwalan said:


> trevskoda said:
> 
> 
> 
> have you not been told the secret of kentucky fried chicken ?
> i learnt it years ago.
> cant put it here its a secret. but they can be very healthy if done correctly .
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have never found any chicken in it ,more like sparrow and never mind the gallon of sugery coke they drink with it.
> I used to eat at subway until a report found the put chemicals in to preserve which is used in plastics and known to cause cancer.
> Fish which you buy at big stores is 6 weeks and older which is not good and they are now saying only fresh is best,so rod out of loft and boat to be made ready once more.
Click to expand...


----------



## runnach

delicagirl said:


> I do agree with this sentiment - but I think we need to look at our education system also  -  i have met many many 20-30 years olds who cannot cook, because they were not taught this basic skill at school,  and now eat entirely form takeaway shops.  If our schools improved their food education this could help.
> 
> Jamie oliver has been fighting this lack of awareness for many years now and his influence seems to be slowly taken on board by schools who are preparing their own menus  ....  I wish him well.


 I think my links to Jamie Oliver clips adequately show I am with him on this topic.

The issue teaching young people and I speak from attempted experience is under 16 years of age incredibly difficult to get insurance cover, then there are crb checks then there is the raft of Health and safety documentation. Why would anyone bother ? 

The same is true of other occupations, a child leaves school at 16 is barely capable of flying a sweeping brush, the potential cost for employers minimum wages 
and all that, results in very few being able to employ the young even if they want too.Two years down the line disappear travelling etc that is one of  the big problems 

Channa


----------



## Tezza33

So what was the weight of your van Collette?View attachment 47081


----------



## runnach

This is what can be achieved, a bit of background.

Ben Chapman is one of Jamie Olivers sous chefs at the restaurant 15 in London,

Jamie's idea was to take young people off the street homeless a lot of them, drug issues and all that goes with it. And give them a career in catering.

Point 1.... His bank refused to back him point blank so he used his own money to fund the project. ( perhaps there is an issue there)
Point 2.... The restaurant has become successful and these young people "write offs" many have moved on to work at prestigious restaurants including Raymond Blancs Le Manoir

Point3... Ben Chapman is one of the proteges, homeless etc had his issues but the project has turned him around , the lad paying taxes like the rest of us. Head of section expect to pay £40 for one of his pastas.

Ben has settled down has a son of 4 who when he is not working spends time in the kitchen teaching little one to cook.

IT CAN BE DONE... we collectively need a shift in attitude and an adoption of the cando spirit

I make no apologies for my enthusiasm, There is a lost generation for whom perhaps little can be done. But we can sure as eggs are eggs influence the younger people

Jamie's Dream School | Jamie Oliver's Guide to Perfect Pasta, with Ben Chapman - YouTube

Channa


----------



## trevskoda

channa said:


> This is what can be achieved, a bit of background.
> 
> Ben Chapman is one of Jamie Olivers sous chefs at the restaurant 15 in London,
> 
> Jamie's idea was to take young people off the street homeless a lot of them, drug issues and all that goes with it. And give them a career in catering.
> 
> Point 1.... His bank refused to back him point blank so he used his own money to fund the project. ( perhaps there is an issue there)
> Point 2.... The restaurant has become successful and these young people "write offs" many have moved on to work at prestigious restaurants including Raymond Blancs Le Manoir
> 
> Point3... Ben Chapman is one of the proteges, homeless etc had his issues but the project has turned him around , the lad paying taxes like the rest of us. Head of section expect to pay £40 for one of his pastas.
> 
> Ben has settled down has a son of 4 who when he is not working spends time in the kitchen teaching little one to cook.
> 
> IT CAN BE DONE... we collectively need a shift in attitude and an adoption of the cando spirit
> 
> I make no apologies for my enthusiasm, There is a lost generation for whom perhaps little can be done. But we can sure as eggs are eggs influence the younger people
> 
> Jamie's Dream School | Jamie Oliver's Guide to Perfect Pasta, with Ben Chapman - YouTube
> 
> Channa


At £40 he can keep his pasta,  as i can feed 4 of us here for 2 weeks on that.


----------



## runnach

trevskoda said:


> At £40 he can keep his pasta,  as i can feed 4 of us here for 2 weeks on that.


 45 pence  apportion in the video clip too.....good work if you can get it Trev.....sod Czech engines being awkward or even the later German ones 

Channa


----------



## vwalan

trevskoda said:


> At £40 he can keep his pasta,  as i can feed 4 of us here for 2 weeks on that.



be hard to eat 40 quids worth of pasta cooked yourself thats for certain .


----------



## trevskoda

I do think that there two many cooking programs on tv just to fill in where as we should be getting quality rather than quantity .


----------



## vwalan

its always back to basic life skills . if another person can do it so can anyone . 
some do it better than others , some alot worse . but we can all do anything . 
health permitting etc . 
i trained as a chef then decided i didnt want to do it . went back to butchery . later went on to other things . ran my own garage . took hgv and psv tests just for fun . worked for ats for awhile . done loads of other jobs . i get bored and move to something else. cant imagine having one job for life . when at school i did paper round in a morning . worked in a restaurant on evenings . on Saturday worked in a butchers . 
my kids were the same . one is a manager for a big bed company . the other just goes from one job to another . he was a hotel manager and ran a garage at the same time . for the same boss . not me . mind he can lay sewer pipes . lay airport runways . just change your hat he says .


----------



## runnach

vwalan said:


> its always back to basic life skills . if another person can do it so can anyone .
> some do it better than others , some alot worse . but we can all do anything .
> health permitting etc .
> i trained as a chef then decided i didnt want to do it . went back to butchery . later went on to other things . ran my own garage . took hgv and psv tests just for fun . worked for ats for awhile . done loads of other jobs . i get bored and move to something else. cant imagine having one job for life . when at school i did paper round in a morning . worked in a restaurant on evenings . on Saturday worked in a butchers .
> my kids were the same . one is a manager for a big bed company . the other just goes from one job to another . he was a hotel manager and ran a garage at the same time . for the same boss . not me . mind he can lay sewer pipes . lay airport runways . just change your hat he says .



I agree Alan started off with Trust house Forte  Barnsdale Bar, Mr Christie manager left wanted or asked if I wanted a trainee position at post House in York ...I declined scared of leaving home truth be known ....where would I be now? fell out of love 3 years in jewellery into the motortrade , I did a bit better than OK. earned good money. Left , new beginning learned my gas and Air con , have/got qualifications in both , back in love with food. Current gaff cook in the kitchen but really spend more time on building brand blah blah.

what ever you do be the best that you can possibly be, you will get the knocks for sure. but a bit of grit determination will always win the day.

Where and what I do tomorrow ...who knows 

Apply yourself the best you can and the results eventually filter down good things 

Channa


----------



## delicagirl

tezza33 said:


> So what was the weight of your van Collette?View attachment 47081



Mitsubishi said  2600kgs is the maximum axle load for both axles so i have a payload of  550 lbs....  so that is doable


----------



## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> Mitsubishi said  2600kgs is the maximum axle load for both axles so i have a payload of  550 lbs....  so that is doable



That's what I for one like to see, someone with a positive attitude. 550 lbs looks so much better than 250kg.!!
Probably more than a few doom mongers that haven't actually bothered to weigh their vans.


----------



## Wooie1958

I knew exactly what mine weighed and that is why i contacted SvTech    SvTech      to increase the MTPLM  :hammer:

I am now a very legal and happy bunny   :dance:


----------



## delicagirl

Wooie1958 said:


> I knew exactly what mine weighed and that is why i contacted SvTech    SvTech      to increase the MTPLM  :hammer:
> 
> I am now a very legal and happy bunny   :dance:



Neither SVTech nor mitsubishi can show me ways to increase my payload - but i am having it plated anyway so that the next owner will not have all this hassle -  if they even care about weight issues


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## yeoblade

*SVTec.*

So are SVtec the ONLY ones in the country that can do this, having a monopoly is great, .............       for them!

I had mine done by SVTec,

Delicia Girl had hers done by SVTec,

A mate of mine had his mini car transporter weight changed by SVtec.

Was looking at a new motorhome last weekend,when I asked about the 3.5t GVW he told me it could be uprated by, yea you guessed it.

Not that there is anything wrong with them, gave me a good service, its just....competition is generally a good thing.


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## delicagirl

hairydog said:


> There is plenty of evidence if you care to look. The whole anti-fat thing is a scam and has cause epidemics of obesity and diabetes. People *need fat in their diet* to be healthy. They don't need any carbohydrate at all.



but the right sort of fat


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## mark61

yeoblade said:


> So are SVtec the ONLY ones in the country that can do this, having a monopoly is great, .............       for them!
> 
> I had mine done by SVTec,
> 
> Delicia Girl had hers done by SVTec,
> 
> A mate of mine had his mini car transporter weight changed by SVtec.
> 
> Was looking at a new motorhome last weekend,when I asked about the 3.5t GVW he told me it could be uprated by, yea you guessed it.
> 
> Not that there is anything wrong with them, gave me a good service, its just....competition is generally a good thing.



If buying new, is it not an option to get a vehicle with the GVW you want from factory?


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## Tbear

hairydog said:


> There is plenty of evidence if you care to look. The whole anti-fat thing is a scam and has cause epidemics of obesity and diabetes. People need fat in their diet to be healthy. They don't need any carbohydrate at all.



High fat, no carbs. So you eliminate fruit and veg from your healthy diet. Enjoy but I would not waste too much money on pensions.

Richard


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## delicagirl

mark61 said:


> If buying new, is it not an option to get a vehicle with the GVW you want from factory?



its my understanding, but i may be wrong, that UK manufactured vehicles have to have a VIN plate showing their weight  - but my "grey japanese import" van   does not have one


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## mark61

delicagirl said:


> its my understanding, but i may be wrong, that UK manufactured vehicles have to have a VIN plate showing their weight  - but my "grey japanese import" van   does not have one



I meant for Yeoblade


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## colinm

yeoblade said:


> So are SVtec the ONLY ones in the country that can do this, having a monopoly is great, .............       for them!
> 
> I had mine done by SVTec,
> 
> Delicia Girl had hers done by SVTec,
> 
> A mate of mine had his mini car transporter weight changed by SVtec.
> 
> Was looking at a new motorhome last weekend,when I asked about the 3.5t GVW he told me it could be uprated by, yea you guessed it.
> 
> Not that there is anything wrong with them, gave me a good service, its just....competition is generally a good thing.



As SVtech where unable to offer an upgrade over the Mitsubishi figure, then anyone could have taken the info from Mitsubishi and make up the plate, if Collette had kept us up to speed on SVTech being unable to offer an upgrade my advice would have been to buy a plate off ebay and mark it up herself, been there got the tee shirt.


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## Byronic

As I understand it SV Tech have the expertise that has earned a degree of credibility with the DVLA. That's what you pay for.

I would imagine an application based on the information within this thread would give ol' Brian at the DVLA a nervous breakdown, and accidental inclusion of some the dietary advice would probably see the poor b'stard top himself. :lol-061:


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## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> As *SVtech where unable to offer an upgrade over the Mitsubishi figur*e, then anyone could have taken the info from Mitsubishi and make up the plate, if Collette had kept us up to speed on SVTech being unable to offer an upgrade my advice would have been to buy a plate off ebay and mark it up herself, been there got the tee shirt.




Because it would  not have been safe to do so    -  if you haven't read this thread properly then i suggest you do  - this whole saga was about me finding out if I WAS DRIVING A SAFE VAN and CARRYING A SAFE PAYLOAD.  This was never just about a plate........    Should there be an accident. having a SVTech plate which i have organised,  shows an authentic and trustworthy source has enumerated the van's payload capacity and that i have done everything in my power to drive safely. 

Sadly there seem too many vanners( some here, some at home, and some i met on the road)  who don't want to find out if they are safe, and just stuff more and more stuff into their vans and have no idea if they are a danger to themselves or other road users.

i am not saying you are on of these colin, i dont know you.

i have had private messages from some who say "pump up your tyres to 64psi  -  you'll be ok."     Well  no  i wont do that.

Vans contain both flammable fuel and gas and gas bottles and a lot of wiring - unless maintained well and the weight limits adhered to, they are a disaster waiting to happen.   i am mitigating a disaster as best i can.


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## colinm

Byronic said:


> As I understand it SV Tech have the expertise that has earned a degree of credibility with the DVLA. That's what you pay for.
> 
> I would imagine an application based on the information within this thread would give ol' Brian at the DVLA a nervous breakdown, and accidental inclusion of some the dietary advice would probably see the poor b'stard top himself. :lol-061:



That would be true if SVTech where offering to upgrade from standard.
But in this case Colette has the data from Mitsubishi and has no need to make an application, I was in a similar situation some years ago and just made my own plate, I also made my own vin plate.


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## mark61

Doesn't matter who does the plates though. 
Don't think Colinmd was suggesting you made up increased weights for the plate, on the other hand, he may have been. 

SV Tech only make use of the additional weight that has been designed into a model. Vehicles are sold at 3500Kg because thats where a lot of legislation changes.


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## yeoblade

Byronic said:


> As I understand it SV Tech have the expertise that has earned a degree of credibility with the DVLA. That's what you pay for.
> 
> I would imagine an application based on the information within this thread would give ol' Brian at the DVLA a nervous breakdown, *and accidental inclusion of some the dietary advice* would probably see the poor b'stard top himself. :lol-061:


:raofl::raofl::raofl::wacko:




If SVtec are just plating the van the same as Mitsibitsi Japan produced it to,  then Collette's own detective work has to take the credit and SVTec the credit for making a sticky label.
And, of course Collette is happy in her own mind she is driving a safe vehicle.


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## delicagirl

yeoblade said:


> :raofl::raofl::raofl::wacko:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If SVtec are just plating the van the same as Mitsibitsi Japan produced it to,  then Collette's own detective work has to take the credit and SVTec the credit for making a sticky label.
> And, of course Collette is happy in her own mind she is driving a safe vehicle.



and lets not forget the masses of Delica Detectives on here who contributed so much to this saga......:wave:


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## colinm

delicagirl said:


> Because it would  not have been safe to do so    -  if you haven't read this thread properly then i suggest you do  - this whole saga was about me finding out if I WAS DRIVING A SAFE VAN and CARRYING A SAFE PAYLOAD.  This was never just about a plate........    Should there be an accident. having a SVTech plate which i have organised,  shows an authentic and trustworthy source has enumerated the van's payload capacity and that i have done everything in my power to drive safely.
> 
> Sadly there seem too many vanners( some here, some at home, and some i met on the road)  who don't want to find out if they are safe, and just stuff more and more stuff into their vans and have no idea if they are a danger to themselves or other road users.
> 
> i am not saying you are on of these colin, i dont know you.
> 
> i have had private messages from some who say "pump up your tyres to 64psi  -  you'll be ok."     Well  no  i wont do that.
> 
> Vans contain both flammable fuel and gas and gas bottles and a lot of wiring - unless maintained well and the weight limits adhered to, they are a disaster waiting to happen.   i am mitigating a disaster as best i can.



Colette, my first posting relating to this dates back to the AIB thread when I queried the amount of water you thought was being carried, as it seemed too much for a van of this type, I have been following it closely since then, I have done my best to try and give advice which I thought would be safe and in your best interest, as I posted before, weight and balance (abeit in aircraft) is part of my work and I've known people to die because they have been blazay over such things.


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## wildebus

Sort of on and off-topic ... SVTech are also a popular source to DOWNPLATE a vehicle in the VW World.
Quite a few people use them to certificate a revised weight of 2499kg GVW to be recorded on the V5C on the older T4 diesels post 'Motor Caravan' reclassification to allow them to be used within the LEZ (so generally within the M25 ring) and avoid paying £100 a day charge.
I don't think a DIY replating would be recognised by the DVLA and it needs to be an officially recognised body (this is my understanding - might be different for an increase?)
My own T4 conversion was the lowest weight already at 2460Kg so I didn't have to bother


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## delicagirl

colinmd said:


> Colette, my first posting relating to this dates back to the AIB thread when I queried the amount of water you thought was being carried, as it seemed too much for a van of this type, I have been following it closely since then, I have done my best to try and give advice which I thought would be safe and in your best interest, as I posted before, weight and balance (abeit in aircraft) is part of my work and I've known people to die because they have been blazay over such things.




Colin.  i was a pilot for a few years and  saw a video of a 4 seater plane in the bush loaded to the gunnels with about 8 people and their  luggage, which crashed on take off as the payload was waaaay  too high.  They were all killed. i have been interested in safety ever since - but as you guys all know  i am not a scientist and these new technical issues are a lot for me to learn, but learn i have. I value your input on this thread and others. 

i wont be carrying quite as much water in future - now that i know the capacity of my tanks !!!!!  

its interesting that my first simple question has led to such a long and fascinating research project.


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## colinm

AFAIK the data that has so far been obtained is not the actual weights but the allowed maximum weights, it's not often these vary from the original.


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## Byronic

delicagirl said:


> and lets not forget the masses of Delica Detectives on here who contributed so much to this saga......:wave:



Thanks.....From Detective Jacques Clouseau, one of the masses.


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## ricc

the weights on the plate,  gross train weight , gross vehicle weight and the axle weights are maximum  design weights  influenced by the strength of the axles, suspension rates. strength of chasis , capabilities of the brakes and the ability of the clutch to restart on a specified hill amongst other things.    the actual body and hence unladen or kerbweight of the vehicle dont come into it.

there is also a considerable difference to making your own plate to published figures cos the vehicle didnt have one and dvlc has nothing recorded   to making a revised plate and requesting a change to dvlc database for uprating based on desired figures plucked from thin air.


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## vwalan

use a vtg10 form for down plating . and send 26 quid to swansea and you can voluntarily down plate a vehicle with no alterations . 
if altering the vehicle might have to visit a ministry station just so they can look at it . 
then change the plate or better fit new plate with voluntary down plated on it to?????
then at least every one knows what it could be uplated to easily later on . 
its common for trucks to be down plated to alter taxation classes or to be driven on B+E licences when pulling fifth wheelers . 
fifth wheelers are the way forward for over 70yr olds .


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## vwalan

easier than pulling an aframed car. 
or a steerable drag trailer. 
bet its easier with a fifth wheeler than towing a m,bike trailer behind your hymer. 
and the m,bike can be inside the fifth wheeler. 
but lowering the gvw is easy. 
on some like 10 tonners we used to have to raise the rear bumpstops on a few trucks . to drop the gvw to 7.5 ton . 
we used to do alot of daf trucks at one time . 10 tonners were alot cheaper at auctions than 7.5 tonners so best learn how to drop them. 
but these days lowering iveco 6.5 ton cassis cabs or mitsubishi or izusu trucks is almost just a paper exercise.
reading a post above about vw ,s they should be very easy. 
there are several people in the chassis alteration game . wheel base are another crowd and i used to have a list of them . got given it by vosa years ago. cant find it must have been chucked out . but visit a truck body builders and they should be able to give a list of some . or vosa will know . 
i admit gareth marsh at svtec as always been very helpful if i had any problems . 
but there are others .


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## Wooie1958

vwalan said:


> easier than pulling an aframed car.
> or a steerable drag trailer.
> bet its easier with a fifth wheeler than towing a m,bike trailer behind your hymer.
> and the m,bike can be inside the fifth wheeler.
> but lowering the gvw is easy.
> on some like 10 tonners we used to have to raise the rear bumpstops on a few trucks . to drop the gvw to 7.5 ton .
> we used to do alot of daf trucks at one time . 10 tonners were alot cheaper at auctions than 7.5 tonners so best learn how to drop them.
> but these days lowering iveco 6.5 ton cassis cabs or mitsubishi or izusu trucks is almost just a paper exercise.
> reading a post above about vw ,s they should be very easy.
> there are several people in the chassis alteration game . wheel base are another crowd and i used to have a list of them . got given it by vosa years ago. cant find it must have been chucked out . but visit a truck body builders and they should be able to give a list of some . or vosa will know .
> *i admit gareth marsh at svtec as always been very helpful if i had any problems* .
> but there are others .






Gareth at SvTech is unbelievably knowledgeable and helpful    :dance:

He was the one ( through his contact at ALKO ) that found me the new part numbers for my ALKO shock absorbers.

I came up against a brick wall as the old number was showing as discontinued and nothing was cross referencing.

2 local dealers were little better than useless as they both suggested completely the wrong shocks.


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## wildebus

vwalan said:


> use a vtg10 form for down plating . and send 26 quid to swansea and you can voluntarily down plate a vehicle with no alterations .
> if altering the vehicle might have to visit a ministry station just so they can look at it .
> then change the plate or better fit new plate with voluntary down plated on it to?????
> then at least every one knows what it could be uplated to easily later on .
> its common for trucks to be down plated to alter taxation classes or to be driven on B+E licences when pulling fifth wheelers .
> fifth wheelers are the way forward for over 70yr olds .



Good info. Thanks 

Don't see many (well, I personally never seen any myself) 5th Wheelers in the UK. I was thinking about them the other day in fact and wondering if the trailer part is classed as a towed unit and your B+E comment tells me yes


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## Byronic

They are sometimes spotted alongside caravans in campsites. But nobody has ever seen a fifth wheeler in the wild, occasionally one is said to be seen wandering around  in Spain but it could be just a rumour.


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## Tbear

wildebus said:


> Good info. Thanks
> 
> Don't see many (well, I personally never seen any myself) 5th Wheelers in the UK. I was thinking about them the other day in fact and wondering if the trailer part is classed as a towed unit and your B+E comment tells me yes



Normally a couple at the Peterborough show.

Richard


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## vwalan

wildebus said:


> Good info. Thanks
> 
> Don't see many (well, I personally never seen any myself) 5th Wheelers in the UK. I was thinking about them the other day in fact and wondering if the trailer part is classed as a towed unit and your B+E comment tells me yes



mine is a proper mini artic the truck is a 6.3 ton gvw .the trailer was a 5 ton gvw trailer . but i lowered it to 3,500kg when i converted it to a living van . .my trailer puts half its weight on to the towing vehicle . 
you need a c1+e to drive it . but the next adaption to it is to move the trailer axles forward so the pin weight will be only 500kg , i will then lower the trucks gvw to 3,500kg gvw then when i reach 70 just drive it on a b+e .
many fifth wheel caravans are pulled by vehicles under 3,500kg gvw . with b+e before january 19th 2013 there was no weight limit on the trailer .just the train weight of the towing vehicle . 
the true trainweight of mine is 9.800kg gvw . 
i only lowered the trailer for mot purposes . 
when i get to 70 i shall up lift it back to 5ton . 
if i,m still alive . ha ha .


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## vwalan

Byronic said:


> They are sometimes spotted alongside caravans in campsites. But nobody has ever seen a fifth wheeler in the wild, occasionally one is said to be seen wandering around  in Spain but it could be just a rumour.



cheeky monkey!!
there is also a didicoy style merc drifting around spain and portugal as well. 
the owner is quite freindly . he doesnt bite . hee hee . 
there is several old time wilders on here that drift around spain . 
we do try to avoid each other but usually all head into the same hideaways .


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## jennyp19

I'd missed this post before and thought I would add part of another posting I made. 


As some of you know we just bought a new Mobilvetta- our dream van after seeing one in Belgium last year. The price was excellent. I'm not knocking the quality of fittings and extras which come with and main template is just what we want. I was however sickened when paperwork came back 3257 leaving just 243 k payload and that didn't include even a passenger. They had done the paper exercise to take it to 3650. So this meant total payload of 393k. Sounds a lot. Add 1 large passenger down to 293 k. Add awning 23 k and extra leisure battery 20 k. Now down  to 250 k. This is supposed to be a 4 seater MH - add 3 more passengers and you would be over loaded without adding anything else. 
Just remembered spare wheel as well another 20+ kilo - we were provided with one of those inflation kits - not a lot of use if the tyre shreds and you are in the middle of nowher. 


We did think of rejecting as not fit for purpose, but as we really do like the Mobi we decided to bite the bullet and have air suspension fitted to enable us to take it to 3850.  If I was a few years younger I would have gone down that route, but really couldn't cope with the stress and we want a long break in Spain. 



There are a lot of 3.5t MHs being sold to 1, people who don't want/can't keep C1 on licence after age of 70 or 2, were born after 1996 and haven't got entitlement to C1 on their licence. 



I suspect we will soon be hearing many stories from people who do not know that they are driving illegally. 

To the sceptic who say it won't happen, it does - i for one wouldn't like to be the one who gets pulled up weighed on weigh bridge and told to remove goods until vehicle is correct weight plus points on licence and a hefty fine. Also how long will it be in event of accident, your insurance company won't  pay out because vehicle was overweight.


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