# weight !!!!



## rugbyken (Aug 14, 2018)

on the way back from druridge bay we passed the free weighbridge i’d been told about off theA19 thinking i was running almost empty i popped in and found to my horror that i was 4050 gross with a plated weight of 3850 i had one full gas bottle & half a tank of water, i have a spare wheel that i added with an angle iron frame dumping those & just carrying a tyre may free up about 50 kgs , i can clear out my tool box (again) but short of leaving jan at home can’t see a way of getting myself legal? never been stopped in 17 years here and abroad but don’t want to risk it too much


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## trevskoda (Aug 14, 2018)

Have you thought of going on a diet.:scared:
How many vans are over weight or near from new,not much point when going away and not able to take the things you require,cloths deck chairs barbys etc.


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## izwozral (Aug 14, 2018)

I was running overweight  every time in the Rimor by at least 250kg and I suspect I am very much overweight on the back axle with the Bessacarr. Not been stopped either but it does concern me, not only about getting a fine and having to ditch whatever but also from a safety and insurance aspect.


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## delicagirl (Aug 14, 2018)

i spent ages on this subject a couple of years ago.   the only way is to totally empty the van then weigh it.  and weigh everything that goes back in again.  put it in a spreadsheet and then weigh it again.  its amazing what junk we have in there that we have forgotten about but never ever use.

SVTech could advise IF your van is capable of up-plating.  You might want to photograph your van's plate and put it up here as there is a wide range of knowledge in our community on this subject....   

what sort of van have you got ?

the risks are   -   driving a vehicle which is heavier than your driving license allows  -  you would lose your license;   after having an accident  if your van is weighed the insurance could be invalid;  and if you are stopped you WILL have to dump a whole load of belongings before you are allowed to continue your journey......   VOSPA bought a couple of dozen portable weigh stations in recent years and so they can pop up anywhere


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## Beemer (Aug 14, 2018)

As I am due a trip to Germany, I clicked on Youtube to see how the German police deal with overweight vans.
There is no grey area with the Germans, if your van is overweight, and they do weigh your van axles at the side of the road, you have to lose the weight and take a fine.
In most cases on Youtube, emptying their fresh water tank sorted out their weight problems, so perhaps, if you fear you may be overweight then not filling with fresh water may help a bit..
I almost, always take about 100litres (150ltr tank) of fresh with me, because the vehicle does not rattle so much with a bit of weight on board.
Mpg is not really an issue, but of course I would like better, but if it was an issue, I would have bought a camper instead of 4.5t of van.


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## rugbyken (Aug 14, 2018)

have started to scrutinise the loading this morning we carry 3 tables could loose at least one but not much weight there we have 4 chairs again could leave a couple behind my tool box spanner’s & screwdrivers seem to breed in there scope for change there , i carry a long & short ehu cable as i’ve only plugged in about 8 nights in 130 away could make do with a long lightweight one same with adaptors & splitters , i carry a telescopic ladder & spare gas bottle might have room for improvement there lol, biggest area of improvement is water when fully loaded 120 litres in tank & 30 ltrs of drinking water that’s over 300llbs in weight there still think my best option is leave jan at home but she’s not keen,


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## Byronic (Aug 14, 2018)

With FWD Fiats Pugs and Lemons, as said the rear axle is generally the axle
most likely to overload first.
However on twin wheel RWD heavier vans surprisingly it can be much easier 
to overload the front axle. I have a rated a 2.3t max. front axle with 4.7t rear axle.
Loaded ready for a bon voyage, when weighed the front comes in at 1.9t
and the rear at 2.9t.
So a safety margin of 1.8t on rear and only .4t on front. The interior layout
and distribution of load is fairly conventional, and there's a m/bike on the 
rear which actually helps lighten the front end, without adding anything of
much consequence on the rear.


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## runnach (Aug 14, 2018)

Cheerful Charlie said:


> I wouldn't worry about it
> The fine is peanuts as long as you aren't more than 10 percent over
> Never weighed any of our motorhomes but am a pretty good guesstimator , the rv was always about half a tonne over , this one is fine in fact probably got about half a tonne left .
> Having owned commercial vans for over 30 years I've never had one stopped for weight, really not worth worrying about.


Lucky perhaps ? the Police and VOSA only yesterday were on the A64 stopping caravans and motorhomes not for the first time either !

Channa


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## Peisinoe (Aug 14, 2018)

If the spare wheel is 50kg Remover the other 4 & that gets you to your weight. . I dont know how you would lose that much


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## Wully (Aug 14, 2018)

Well I did try and help you out this weekend by lightening you’re drinks cabinet see you’ve not decided to empty or discard any of the fine drinks that you carry on board good decision


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## Pauljenny (Aug 14, 2018)

You could go teetotal.
If you discard your underfloor wine cellar, you'll have cracked it.

Edit: 
Looks like Wully is as sensible as.me


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## Wooie1958 (Aug 14, 2018)

***** said:


> Talking of weight and back to thread, on our latest van, I have had difficulty with the weight distribution.
> Hardly any storage areas up front and a water tank rear of the back axle! Grr!
> Every hole up front, including under the two front seats is stuffed with heavy items




That was precisely the problem i had with mine being a low profile ( 3 cupboards over the cab ), a 2.4m rear overhang and a garage       :scared:

At 3,850kg max i was overweight on the rear axle and light on the front axle with no way of moving any more weight forwards so that`s why i uprated to 4,100kg     :hammer:

Thankfully all the 250kg uprate all went on the rear axle so now it`s comfortably underweight       :dance:


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## mark61 (Aug 14, 2018)

Build your own . Get stuff placed where you want, and there are far better materials than verruca board. Doesn't have to weigh tons to be strong.


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## mark61 (Aug 14, 2018)

Apologise, when I say build your own, I mean it in the loosest sense. IE, spec it and get someone else to build it


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## Byronic (Aug 14, 2018)

mark61 said:


> Build your own . Get stuff placed where you want, and there are far better materials than verruca board. Doesn't have to weigh tons to be strong.



The main reason motorhome manufacturers will not use lightweight frame and panel combined
with hollow core construction is because it's much more labour intensive than double faced solid 
panel work. They can keep overall costs down and sod the weight, that's something the customer 
can deal with at the weighbridge.


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## Robmac (Aug 14, 2018)

I have a set of weigh pads so can weigh my van anytime I like.

I think I took them out of the van to save weight and clutter though!


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## Deleted member 58330 (Aug 14, 2018)

I was worried so I bought a 5T van that includes 1000kg payload even after 90% fluids and gases..now I do not worry esp on the a55 north wales route as VOSA are always pulling vans in by queensferry.  Think they give free 5% allowance and fine at 10% so I think 5250kg should cover it.


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## Byronic (Aug 14, 2018)

MidAgeTraveller said:


> I was worried so I bought a 5T van that includes 1000kg payload even after 90% fluids and gases..now I do not worry.



But a lot of motorhomers hope for someone to come up with a well equipped 3.5t 
spacious van with a 1tonne payload that's the challenge. A lot of advantages in being 
<3.5t. You could say the motorhomers version of the search for the Holy Grail !


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## runnach (Aug 14, 2018)

***** said:


> Just open the tap on any old car park, you could even use it as a paddling pool for youngsters:banana:
> Forgot to say, make sure you have the hazardous waste safety gear on, with gloves and goggles
> Better still, open the black, the kids could float a few logs down stream! lol



And don't forget to warn the public, it is important to have hazchem large diamonds festooned on the front and rear of your rig.

People like flashing yellow lamps too

Oh and PPE , hi Viz jackets and a hard hat (yer flat cap wont do )

Channa


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## Nabsim (Aug 14, 2018)

***** said:


> Not forgetting the orange boards, indicating you are carrying hazardous goods, and a target for French Plods



Just fit a couple of bio-hazard and radiation stickers on the bus, that will keep them at bay


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## GWAYGWAY (Aug 14, 2018)

First action is to go to another CERTIFIED weighbridge and get it done again PROPERLY. Front axle  Rear axle and a combined weight.  then compare them adding the two axles together. there should be little difference.    
When I got my new Hymer I went straight to the local weighbridge and he told me to  just put the front on the bridge then drive over and have the  rear done.  THE TOTAL  was 4200 kgs with sod all in it apart from  a bit of fuel 20 litres of fuel and a bit of clothes and some food.   I was nearly sick as I had just emptied my bank balance on a new  3500kg motorhome that weighed 4200kgs  albeit  it wqas plated at  3860 kilos.    I took the Hymer  price list which does give ALL the accessory weight on it and wrote it all out and it was nowhere near theat weight.
SO next went to another weigh bridge with a PROPER operator who knew what to do.. Front axle all the way on UNTIL the rear wheels were nearly on as well, Drive on to the MIDDLE of the  bridge for total then off the far end  until the front wheels were JUST OFF.   Total of the the front and rear axles were  3510kilos and total weight was 3520kg.. nowhere near what the first bloke told me.. The bridge has load cells and they are NOT at the edges of the  platform so I was outside of them and trying to lift the rest of the bridge like a seesaw same with the rear wheels and the total included a bit of the actual steel platform weight.  The in service weight was  JUST out side the limit of 3500 but  near enough for a country job as it was a 3860 plate.. I did raise it to 4200kgs but might have to drop it back down on my birthday when it might need to be 3500 again.  I had bought that van, to be able to drop the weight down should I not get a medical.  
Another thing is that there might well be a bit of bias on the set  up of the one you tried to frighten users into thinking they were well over and drop the load down a bit  (FOR SAFETY) Proper weighbridges are for the accurate , within reason, weighing that might lead to a court case.   Load cells used on the road side  are taking the weights of the axles as they raise and pull away the  the  rising axle add to the one being weighed.  Careful weighing is not in the VOSA  handbook. They are looking for highest possible weights to nick the operator.
You might be surprised at the second weighing  I certainly was relieved at mine.  It was worth the tenner for the three seperate weighings.
If anybody is stopped do not forget to empty the grey water and maybe the  fresh over the  shoes of the person  stopping you.


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## Nabsim (Aug 14, 2018)

What about the cassette Gway?


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## Byronic (Aug 14, 2018)

GWAYGWAY said:


> If anybody is stopped do not forget to empty the grey water and maybe the  fresh over the  shoes of the person  stopping you.



Fresh first, then the grey and if I had a black waste
underbody tank a quick squirt of that as a topcoat!


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## hextal (Aug 14, 2018)

Byronic said:


> But a lot of motorhomers hope for someone to come up with a well equipped 3.5t
> spacious van with a 1tonne payload that's the challenge. A lot of advantages in being
> <3.5t. You could say the motorhomers version of the search for the Holy Grail !



I got close. Converted my van, 2up with everything loaded and brimmed I've still got 700kg spare capacity.

But..... It's a MWB not a LWB or XLWB - so was pretty easy. Even has solid oak worktops


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## Byronic (Aug 15, 2018)

hextal said:


> I got close. Converted my van, 2up with everything loaded and brimmed I've still got 700kg spare capacity.
> 
> But..... It's a MWB not a LWB or XLWB - so was pretty easy. Even has solid oak worktops



Yes should be possible to get a decent payload on a 3.5t SWB chassis. Long termers usually
want more space which naturally means more body weight, furniture and fittings that 700kg
soon gets swallowed up and then they're surprised left with Rapido typical 200kg payload!

I've a plethora of cupboards in my present XLWB PVC layout (altered couple of time over the years) it
has 38 or 40 doors or hatches! all the usual motorhome gear, +m/bike rack I've managed
to keep the conversion weight to c. 900kg. utilising as many weight saving means as practically
applicable eg frame and panel furniture carcassing, double skin hollow doors, insulated floor
decked with 6mm ply on spaced battens. 3mm flexible insulation (easy to form to bodywork 
contours) topped with 50mm cut to profile ligtweight rigid ex. polystyrene insul.


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## GWAYGWAY (Aug 15, 2018)

Nabsim said:


> What about the cassette Gway?



ThT is reserved to go over the sods head if he books you..


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## Deleted member 75172 (Aug 15, 2018)

*Restriction at age 70?*



***** said:


> Until you get to 70 and the medical kicks in! Worry time:idea-007:



I had not heard of this restriction before.
Although i have a while to go does anyone have more details or link to web site?
Thanks


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## runnach (Aug 15, 2018)

Peteabix said:


> I had not heard of this restriction before.
> Although i have a while to go does anyone have more details or link to web site?
> Thanks



This probably answers your questions

Renew your driving licence if you're 70 or over - GOV.UK

The important part unless you take the appropriate medical and tell them renewal for all intents is post 97 and licence restrictions that go with that up to 3500 kgs the grandfather rights on your current licence aren't renewed automatically 

Have a read and one or two here have been through the process and can give advice 
Channa


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## wesaaron (Aug 15, 2018)

I recently found out about the poor payload on some motorhomes as we have just swapped from a caravan to motorhome,  it was after we got it I realized that with a max gross weight of 3500kg we only had 230kg payload!

Did a bit of research and have got it uprated to 4000kg, (just waiting for DVLA to return new V5) not all that cheap to do but now we have peace of mind, no potential insurance problems and the vehicle is probably safer with suspension and tyres that have the correct weight rating, looking forward to our first outing in MH.


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## LT Man (Aug 17, 2018)

I also had no payload at 3500kg
7m coach built van
Took everything out / off it and weighed it
I mean everything, took out jack and awning off side  All cushions mattress etc No gas bottles .no water .no fuel as was running on fumes  in other words if i turned it upside down and shook it nowt would move. 
Weighted it with no occupants ......3000kg     What chance did i have   none by miles      
Supposed to be 320kg payload       Still struggle at 3850     It is crazy what they get away with when quoting figures

LT Man


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## yorkslass (Aug 17, 2018)

LT Man said:


> I also had no payload at 3500kg
> 7m coach built van
> Took everything out / off it and weighed it
> I mean everything, took out jack and awning off side  All cushions mattress etc No gas bottles .no water .no fuel as was running on fumes  in other words if i turned it upside down and shook it nowt would move.
> ...




As I see it, they get away with quoting misleading figures because they are never challenged.

If i bought from a dealer it would be returned  as not fit for purpose.

Alternatively, there are plenty organisations/magazines who could hi light or even challenge the manufacturer's but they don't.  Too much lost advertising revenue involved.


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## bazzybabes (Aug 17, 2018)

My Hymer, B584 4000 kg, on a maxi chassis, was at the weighbridge in Rochdale yesterday, stripped of almost everything but with a full tank of fuel and a full refillable gas cylinder, 2 leisure batteries and 2 solar panels.

Nothing else. No water. Not even me. It weighed exactly 3000 kg.

The day before I rang SVTech who told me if I wanted to downplate to 3500, I would have to get below 3100 kg.

My C1/D1 expires in September and if DVLA won't re-issue it, downplating is probably my only option.

I am planning to overwinter in Iberia so downplating may be a necessity as maybe losing another couple of stones! :dance:


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## delicagirl (Aug 17, 2018)

bazzybabes said:


> My Hymer, B584 4000 kg, on a maxi chassis, was at the weighbridge in Rochdale yesterday, stripped of almost everything but with a full tank of fuel and a full refillable gas cylinder, 2 leisure batteries and 2 solar panels.
> 
> Nothing else. No water. Not even me. It weighed exactly 3000 kg.
> 
> ...



its ridiculous how much stuff we have in vans that we dont need.   the only way to be sure is to weigh everything you want to put in the van and put it into a spreadsheet...  tedious but useful.  you can then decide if ....x   y   and  z  really ARE necessary   just in case......


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## runnach (Aug 17, 2018)

***** said:


> !
> I suggest serious research is required prior to buying and don't trust the salesmen to know proper weights!



I wouldn't disagree with that. The problem is the reference material for salespeople are manufacturers shiny brochures they have no more info than the customers.

Back in the day Fiat Ducato 1,8 lwb hr at the point of registration we deliberately weighed minus tool kit and spare wheel to generate a v5 (with weight ticket) so the vehicles were mot d at 3yrs (plated weight) and not annually avoiding operator licences in some cases.

I dare say it as all changed, in those days we dealt with LVLO before they got shut and went all PC based, It was a lot easier

Channa


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## runnach (Aug 17, 2018)

***** said:


> I recon you are right that most just read from a brochure and don't ever use a van themselves, however I have been told by Travelworld that some of their sales persons have been to the German factory, so I would expect them to know more.
> I have recently found Travelworld sale persons to be pretty clued up, including actual weights.
> Quite refreshing!



The training from manufacturers is very hit and miss (cars) in my time the best by a country mile was Jaguar.

We had a theory called "green blood" when you visited the factory and they had finished with you if they cut you little" green leapers" would appear rather than blood.

They must have done something right to this day I still have a big soft spot for the "big cats" ..... Volvo trucks were quite good Seat meanwhile yup brochures!! lol

Channa


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## runnach (Aug 17, 2018)

***** said:


> We have had a couple of small warranty issues and Travelworld have referred to Hymer for authorisation.
> It was just parts, they were sensible and let me do the work myself. They even agreed to pay warranty in retrospect after I did a repair in Portugal
> It seems that when they fit extras, they are fitted to Hymer spec, which is reassuring.
> Mercury outboards used to give excellent training to mechanics and sales staff also went on mechanical service courses!



That sounds like good service !,,, manufacturers are very cautious letting dealers self authorise, TW wont be too upset you sorted it yourself as warranty rates are normally crap and it keeps everyone happy which is the objective

I have said before Hymer Group are following very much the Volkswagen group model which has put VAG at number 1 . I am optimistic the Motorhome industry is starting to clean its act up and we should see a more customer focussed industry. (or am I having a wishful thinking moment)

Back to weights and plating it can be extremely complicated and easy to get caught out which is where companies like SVtech are worth their weight in gold. If dealers can get it wrong what hope do customers have ?

Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 17, 2018)

There used to be a major trader in Erith Kent, Bromley Motorcaravans. The bloke
that owned it flew around in a helicopter so that indicates how successful he
was. BMs sole raison d' etre was flogging new motorhomes, smart showroom 
flowers and dinner set chinaware in all the displayed vans! But all the part exchanges were jammed
in round the back. Between them never more than 300mm and that's all four sides!
Barely any concession was made to flogging off the second hand stuff. 
The 'real' money must have been made on the new sales.

I used to call in late at nights to buy an accessory or 2 before catching a ferry 
and got to know the workshop manager left to run the place on his own.
He was the only employee that actually owned or ever owned a motorhome,
bar one, the owner, and even that was only back in the day? He started up the business
by building ex ambulance conversions based on his own personal van. 
All the sales staff were clued up on sales talk of course, but according to the w/s
manager none really empathised with the m/h customer, and I gathered most could 
fittingly have stood in for JC and crew on attitudes to motorhoming and motorhomers!


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## jenks (Aug 17, 2018)

Just found this useful link: Consolidated code of practice: enforcement weighing of vehicles - GOV.UK

If they use a temp weigh station with portable weighing pads there is an axle tolerance of +/- 100kgs (section 3.5). I think most motor homers might get away with this, however from an insurance / license point of view still better safe than sorry?


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## runnach (Aug 17, 2018)

***** said:


> We had an excellent relationship when we had a  Mercury / Mercruiser dealership. We could authorise warranty and never had one case rejected, but we were a proper franchised dealership and carried in stock all of the recommended parts.
> That is the trouble with M/H dealers, they are not proper franchises as car dealers used to be.
> Used SV Tech and they are excellent!



That's partly what I mean by Hymer following the VAG template. They will start imposing dealer standards. Stock holding requirements , Part stocking and most importantly reducing front end dealer margins eg instead of 10 % up front paid 6 % up front and the other 4 % retained payable on customer satisfaction scores marketing spend advertising etc. the weighting in favour of customer satisfaction.

That is what all the car franchises are doing nowadays thus questionaiires every time you visit the money involved is staggering.

Those that don't want to play ball wont have a franchise !

A funny tale re how precise it gets we had Porsche in Leeds and were fined for a broken showroom tile a puddle on the forecourt, but the best bit we had sent a young receptionist round the corner to Makro to buy in refreshments for the customer waiting area. Using her nouse and a Yorkshire lass she made the mistake of buying "my mums orange juice" we got into trouble for that franchise standard stipulates two brands of orange juice must be offered and must be premium brands !

I am not pulling an April fool in August

PS I was allowed the occasional puddle I was in charge of Mazda lol
Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 17, 2018)

jenks said:


> Just found this useful link: Consolidated code of practice: enforcement weighing of vehicles - GOV.UK
> 
> If they use a temp weigh station with portable weighing pads there is an axle tolerance of +/- 100kgs (section 3.5). I think most motor homers might get away with this, however from an insurance / license point of view still better safe than sorry?




There's something 'not quite as it should be really, getting away with it" having to worry 
about cribbing a bit of leeway here and there. Tyre manufacturers admitting to producing 
special camping tyres because their regular commercial tyres aren't intended for constant
running at MAM and add to which the m/h owners self determined best guess margin on top of that.
Really the maximum weights should be set, and the owner/driver should aim to get
100kg "below" that set max. not above. If you can't make this grade then tough,  
upgrade, or get a more suitable van that will give a decent margin.

I'm getting like CC.


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## delicagirl (Aug 22, 2018)

getting back to weight.....   i am preparing my van for its long trip  and have emptied a couple of cupboards in it..    i took 2  VERY large and VERY heavy carrier bags of books into the house - some have been in there for 4 years and  i have still not read  them  !!!!    i really had convinced myself tht as i finished one i took it to a charity shop and bought another one to replace...   but it seems they have been breeding when i wasn't looking .......  

and i know i should use kindle...  but i did try, really i did, but couldn't get to grips with it....

Eire (where i am going)  has many charity shops that charge 10p 20p  for books so i should really ration myself to taking half a dozen lightweight books and swop them as i go along...    but i wouldn't bet on myself doing that !!

have you checked depths of your cupboards lately ?


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## rugbyken (Aug 22, 2018)

another website i posted this dilemma on pointed out that the weights might not be accurate , the type of weighbridge is a single plate about a meter wide that you drive over at walking pace so front wheels weighed then rear and a calculation made of gross weight , but of course a motorhome is not most vehicles and tends to be back axle heavy with in my case appliances batteries & water tank all sitting on or near back axle, time for a proper weighbridge i think,


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## delicagirl (Aug 22, 2018)

rugbyken said:


> another website i posted this dilemma on pointed out that the weights might not be accurate , the type of weighbridge is a single plate about a meter wide that you drive over at walking pace so front wheels weighed then rear and a calculation made of gross weight , but of course a motorhome is not most vehicles and tends to be back axle heavy with in my case appliances batteries & water tank all sitting on or near back axle, time for a *proper weighbridge* i think,



i couldn't agree more.  i am fortunate that my fuel and water tanks are almost opposite each other in the middle of both axles  and could well hold a similar amount of liquid.


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## Byronic (Aug 22, 2018)

delicagirl said:


> and i know i should use kindle...  but i did try, really i did, but couldn't get to grips with it....



I find a pair of Marigolds gives me a firm grip on a Kindle! Recommend Hi Viz Pink
easy for others to spot where your hands are in the dark. And I'm sure before long
it'll be compulsory to wear Hi Viz. gloves when changing a wheel at the roadside.
(Refer to appropriate thread for more info on being seen)!


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## delicagirl (Aug 24, 2018)

hairydog said:


> There are Kindles and there are Kindles. The Kindle Fire is well named: it is only good for chucking on the fire.
> 
> The proper *e-ink screen* ones are a thousand times better, but even then you also need to *install Calibre* on your computer to manage your Kindle library.




IT  -   AArrrrrggggghhhh     -   runs for the hills.....   books are simple:-   pick up -  turn page  -  read......


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## colinm (Aug 24, 2018)

delicagirl said:


> IT  -   AArrrrrggggghhhh     -   runs for the hills.....   books are simple:-   pick up -  turn page  -  read......




Gf is a bit of a technophobe, but she loves her Kindle 3g, you can KISS and just run it as standard.

She downloads free books, many are rubbish and she just deletes them, but that's probably no different to printed books. Minimal weight to carry and no chopping down tree to print them.


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## delicagirl (Aug 24, 2018)

colinmd said:


> Gf is a bit of a technophobe, but she loves her Kindle 3g, you can KISS and just run it as standard.
> 
> She downloads free books, many are rubbish and she just deletes them, but that's probably no different to printed books. Minimal weight to carry and no chopping down tree to print them.



i did try to read some books only to discover that i was not allowed to read the rest of the book till i paid money....    what an annoying thing that was....

re tree-chopping...  i never buy new books but recycle all my books at charity shops.   Books dont need to be recharged;  books can be written in; books are lovely to handle; you cant smash a glass screen if you drop a book -  i just love books !!!!


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## Byronic (Aug 24, 2018)

Audio Books as an alternative to a 'heavy'! ebook tablet, and for the obvious advantages over the physical 'real' thing when motorhoming.
Apparently there are thousands of titles available these days, doubtless not free. 10grammes USB weight or if that's too weighty a Micro SD card, play through the van sound system or just MP3 player + earbuds. 
Weight saving taken to the sublime limit.


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## colinm (Aug 24, 2018)

delicagirl said:


> i did try to read some books only to discover that i was not allowed to read the rest of the book till i paid money....    what an annoying thing that was....
> 
> re tree-chopping...  i never buy new books but recycle all my books at charity shops.   Books dont need to be recharged;  books can be written in; books are lovely to handle; you cant smash a glass screen if you drop a book -  i just love books !!!!




Funny enough although I'm the one into tech I'm not a big fan of ebooks, I borrow from the library, in fact been there today. Gf doesn't like tech, but you couldn't pry the Kindle from her hands.


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## runnach (Aug 24, 2018)

delicagirl said:


> i did try to read some books only to discover that i was not allowed to read the rest of the book till i paid money....    what an annoying thing that was....
> 
> re tree-chopping...  i never buy new books but recycle all my books at charity shops.   Books dont need to be recharged;  books can be written in; books are lovely to handle; you cant smash a glass screen if you drop a book -  i just love books !!!!



There is something more tactile with a book I get the benefits of kindles but have no desire to own one

Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 24, 2018)

A Kindle is wonderful, but a book is even more wonderful, can do exactly what a Kindle
does that is in telling a story or informing, just does it in a different way. But needs no complex parts or batteries.
Couldn't be simpler. If the Kindle had predated the book, we'd all be marvelling at the invention of the paper book
today. Larga Vida al Libro!


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## Byronic (Aug 24, 2018)

colinmd said:


> Funny enough although I'm the one into tech I'm not a big fan of ebooks, I borrow from the library, in fact been there today. Gf doesn't like tech, but you couldn't pry the Kindle from her hands.



Marigolds, makes a Kindle easy to pry away no matter how gripping the story!


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## bazzybabes (Aug 27, 2018)

*Physical books vs E-books*

Adding to the weight discussion, here is one physical book from my library which weighs 1.2kg and my total e-book library of over 9,000 books, including Dell notebook and Kindle, weight just over 1.5kg.


 

In a motorhome, it is really a no-brainer.


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## delicagirl (Aug 27, 2018)

bazzybabes said:


> Adding to the weight discussion, here is one physical book from my library which weighs 1.2kg and my total e-book library of over 9,000 books, including Dell notebook and Kindle, weight just over 1.5kg.
> 
> View attachment 66857 View attachment 66858
> 
> In a motorhome, it is really a no-brainer.





having to choose from 9000 books would make me so stressed i would probably smash it !!!!!   no one needs  that much choice  ESPECIALLY  in a van....  i cut down on weight in many other ways to accommodate my books.  just going through the van now and "rationalising" the 3 tool kits i've got in there ......


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## Byronic (Aug 27, 2018)

bazzybabes said:


> Adding to the weight discussion, here is one physical book from my library which weighs 1.2kg and my total e-book library of over 9,000 books, including Dell notebook and Kindle, weight just over 1.5kg.
> 
> In a motorhome, it is really a no-brainer.








Could be handy having no brains? A 1.4kg weight saving, could make the difference between a failed weighin and a pass


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## bazzybabes (Aug 27, 2018)

delicagirl said:


> having to choose from 9000 books would make me so stressed i would probably smash it !!!!!   no one needs  that much choice  ESPECIALLY  in a van....  i cut down on weight in many other ways to accommodate my books.  just going through the van now and "rationalising" the 3 tool kits i've got in there ......



But you don't need to stress out with calibre installed:

Select the genre, subject matter or author etc and choose within that selection.


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