# advise on german lhd import please!!!!!!!!!!!



## tetleys (Jan 27, 2008)

hi all,

iam very new to motorhoming and have been looking for my first motorhome for the last couple of months which has not been very sucessful on a budget of £7500.(only been able to find mid to late 80s models for this) i have been advised that i can get much better value for money by purchasing from germany and so iam considering purchasing a lhd citroen based 1992 hymer camp lhd 2.5 deisel 108km motorhome,

i just wanted to know weather anybody out there had had any problems with such a vehicle,is a citroen hymer any good? and was parts ie for the lhd drive base vehicle difficult to get hold of? and was parts any more expensive than a rhd drive vehicle?also what if any thing goes wrong with the internall appliances ie, water boilers, wc, pumps, cooker, sink etc etc, are these easy to repair/get hold of here in england, or are they the same as any british motorhome?
also, is it quite easy to resell a lhd motorhome in general, or do the mojority of motorhome owners only stick to right hand drive vehicles?

the reason why iam asking all this is because i do not want to end up with a vehicle that i will struggle to get reasonabley priced parts for either the base vehicle or the motorhome part of the vehicle, and i wouldnt want to have to travel to germany every time i wanted a spare part.
also, if i bought the vehicle and later found that i wanted to resell it, would a lhd vehicle be difficult to resell here in england?

i really would appreciate as much advise as possible as iam planning to go to germany for a couple of days i may purchase a lhd citroen based 1992 108km 2.5 diesel hymer camp 55 which appears to be in an immaculate condition for approx under £8000. 
it would also be very useful to know weather you think that this is a good price and if the worst came to the worst and i had to resell it weather i would expect to get my money back?
also is there anything that i need to look out for in particular?

sorry for all the questions, but i really do not want to make any mistakes.

thanks.


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## Trevor (Jan 27, 2008)

tetleys said:


> hi all,
> 
> iam very new to motorhoming and have been looking for my first motorhome for the last couple of months which has not been very sucessful on a budget of £7500.(only been able to find mid to late 80s models for this) i have been advised that i can get much better value for money by purchasing from germany and so iam considering purchasing a lhd citroen based 1992 hymer camp lhd 2.5 deisel 108km motorhome,
> 
> ...


Sorry i cant help much bu i am sure there is a thread on here about someone buying from Germany


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

Hi Tetleys.
I have answered your questions before on either Wild or Motorhome Fun (not so fun) and I reckon that the Camp is a good motorhome, but you must see it and check its condition.
There is a local dealer to me that imports used German M/Hs and he specializes in Hymers. they are called www.motorhomes-r-us.com
You could also speak to Walkers on wild as he has recently purchased a used m/h from Germany.
I have a Hymer and it is my second and I think the quality  is as good as you will get. Hymer have been building m/hs for many years and have sorted out what is good or just looks good.
Go for it if it looks ok


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

tetleys said:


> hi all,
> 
> iam very new to motorhoming and have been looking for my first motorhome for the last couple of months which has not been very sucessful on a budget of £7500.(only been able to find mid to late 80s models for this) i have been advised that i can get much better value for money by purchasing from germany and so iam considering purchasing a lhd citroen based 1992 hymer camp lhd 2.5 deisel 108km motorhome,
> 
> ...


the price certainly sounds good, age shouldn't be a major problem if it has beeen well cared for. are you buying from a dealer?
importing is straight forward ask dvla for an import pack, you will need to have it mot'd when you get it home as you can not register it without you will need an insurance certificate too. there is a £50 registration fee and no there is no import duty to pay. in germany it will need to have export plates issued, the dealer will normally do this for you it needs a tuv to get these and you will need at least green card insurance to drive it home again the dealer can usually sort this out, your insurance company can register on the chassis number but only for a short period of time.
make sure you give it a very good look over (check everything works)as i doubt at this age the dealer will give any warranty, and if they do its a long drive back to get the work done. the hymer coachbuild seems to be of very good standard and so far i am very pleased with my import


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> the price certainly sounds good, age shouldn't be a major problem if it has beeen well cared for. are you buying from a dealer?
> importing is straight forward ask dvla for an import pack, you will need to have it mot'd when you get it home as you can not register it without you will need an insurance certificate too. there is a £50 registration fee and no there is no import duty to pay. in germany it will need to have export plates issued, the dealer will normally do this for you it needs a tuv to get these and you will need at least green card insurance to drive it home again the dealer can usually sort this out, your insurance company can register on the chassis number but only for a short period of time.
> make sure you give it a very good look over (check everything works)as i doubt at this age the dealer will give any warranty, and if they do its a long drive back to get the work done. the hymer coachbuild seems to be of very good standard and so far i am very pleased with my import



Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think that while you drive home to the uk it would be on third party insurance only


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> Please correct me if I am wrong, but I think that while you drive home to the uk it would be on third party insurance only


depends on the company but should be possible to get fully comp, i didn't but when i insured mine it was covered fully comp on the chassis and would include use in europe so i could have had fully comp to bring it home if only i had known, so check with your insurance and if they say no ring around, it is possible


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> depends on the company but should be possible to get fully comp, i didn't but when i insured mine it was covered fully comp on the chassis and would include use in europe so i could have had fully comp to bring it home if only i had known, so check with your insurance and if they say no ring around, it is possible



Hi walkers, I read that on these trade plates that they issue in Germany, that you are only on third party. I take it that there are ways around this?


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> Hi walkers, I read that on these trade plates that they issue in Germany, that you are only on third party. I take it that there are ways around this?


yes insure it on the chassis number, btw they are  not trade plates but export plates the vehicle is registered in your name for up to 30 days to export it from their country.ring your insurance company (or the one you have rung who will cover it the way you want it) when you collect the vehicle they will cover it on the chassis number and as with your previous van you will have entitlement to use it abroad. the insurance with the plates is seperate to any insurance you might take out, that is the minimum legal requirement and they don't issue the plates with out it


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> yes insure it on the chassis number, btw they are  not trade plates but export plates the vehicle is registered in your name for up to 30 days to export it from their country.ring your insurance company (or the one you have rung who will cover it the way you want it) when you collect the vehicle they will cover it on the chassis number and as with your previous van you will have entitlement to use it abroad. the insurance with the plates is seperate to any insurance you might take out, that is the minimum legal requirement and they don't issue the plates with out it



I see, thanks for the info.
How is your m/h going?


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> I see, thanks for the info.
> How is your m/h going?


sitting on the driveway waiting to go away
it is going well am pleased with it, just having a towbar made up as i said on a different thread. lynn is making some curtains up for the lounge/bedroom so it'll be really plush for its next outing. managed to work the heating and hot water out i had a problem with the water running back but put a non return valve in and works like a dream now (have to disconnect non return every time i drain but no major hassle) surprisingly hot water not tried the shower yet but reckon i should get a good one in this van


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> sitting on the driveway waiting to go away
> it is going well am pleased with it, just having a towbar made up as i said on a different thread. lynn is making some curtains up for the lounge/bedroom so it'll be really plush for its next outing. managed to work the heating and hot water out i had a problem with the water running back but put a non return valve in and works like a dream now (have to disconnect non return every time i drain but no major hassle) surprisingly hot water not tried the shower yet but reckon i should get a good one in this van



Yes, I think that you will find that the Hymer showers are very good as we use ours all of the time. (Four showers this weekend)
I have just got a little problem with mine.
I drained the water down again today and I found a small pool of water under the boiler ( about a tea spoon full at most)
I am hoping it is a hose clip, but I will not be sure untill I refill the boiler again to find out where it is coming from.
Too late today to do this so I will worry about it untill next week end


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> Yes, I think that you will find that the Hymer showers are very good as we use ours all of the time. (Four showers this weekend)
> I have just got a little problem with mine.
> I drained the water down again today and I found a small pool of water under the boiler ( about a tea spoon full at most)
> I am hoping it is a hose clip, but I will not be sure untill I refill the boiler again to find out where it is coming from.
> Too late today to do this so I will worry about it untill next week end


probably nothing sinister as i know you are a stickler for draining down so unlikely to be frost damage, most likely a loose clip or knackered seal


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> probably nothing sinister as i know you are a stickler for draining down so unlikely to be frost damage, most likely a loose clip or knackered seal


Yes thanks I am meticulous at draining down
I do so hope.
Where would the seal be???
Is that in the bottom of the boiler?


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> Yes thanks I am meticulous at draining down
> I do so hope.
> Where would the seal be???
> Is that in the bottom of the boiler?


i was thinking more at one of the pipe connections they have a small rubber washer inside the connections


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> i was thinking more at one of the pipe connections they have a small rubber washer inside the connections



Thanks for that.
I will have to suffer until next saturday and fill the boiler and maybe have to heat it up and wait for the leak
Just have to keep fingers and toes crossed and hope it is a pipe clip.
I know which one if it is as I have checked the area where it is coming from, 
but I had drained and too late to refill.
Just have to worry all week
But if it is and I don't think it will be Frost Damage.
 If it happens to me and how carfull I am, I even drain before driving home so that any dregs can work out of the pipes, then it could happen to anybody


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## tetleys (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> the price certainly sounds good, age shouldn't be a major problem if it has beeen well cared for. are you buying from a dealer?
> importing is straight forward ask dvla for an import pack, you will need to have it mot'd when you get it home as you can not register it without you will need an insurance certificate too. there is a £50 registration fee and no there is no import duty to pay. in germany it will need to have export plates issued, the dealer will normally do this for you it needs a tuv to get these and you will need at least green card insurance to drive it home again the dealer can usually sort this out, your insurance company can register on the chassis number but only for a short period of time.
> make sure you give it a very good look over (check everything works)as i doubt at this age the dealer will give any warranty, and if they do its a long drive back to get the work done. the hymer coachbuild seems to be of very good standard and so far i am very pleased with my import


hi and thanks for taking the time to give me advise, but in your opinion are parts for a lhd vehicle hard to find? and are they more expensive than rhd vehicles? also is a lhd vehicle difficult to sell if i wanted to resell it? and would you think that i would be able to get my money back? also are all the appliances and equipment in side the same as any british motorhome?also, is a citreon any good in terms of reliability and parts?thanks.


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

tetleys said:


> hi and thanks for taking the time to give me advise, but in your opinion are parts for a lhd vehicle hard to find? and are they more expensive than rhd vehicles? also is a lhd vehicle difficult to sell if i wanted to resell it? and would you think that i would be able to get my money back? also are all the appliances and equipment in side the same as any british motorhome?also, is a citreon any good in terms of reliability and parts?thanks.



Left hand drive will always be more difficult to sell, but the Citroen, Fiat Ducato & Boxer are all the same.
Internal appliances will be the same


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

tetleys said:


> hi and thanks for taking the time to give me advise, but in your opinion are parts for a lhd vehicle hard to find? and are they more expensive than rhd vehicles? also is a lhd vehicle difficult to sell if i wanted to resell it? and would you think that i would be able to get my money back? also are all the appliances and equipment in side the same as any british motorhome?also, is a citreon any good in terms of reliability and parts?thanks.


think about it this way, the lhd 92 has a dash mounted gear lever less likely to go wrong than the floor mounted gear stalk. most parts are identical as you are talking about a europe wide chassis the main differences in parts are things like the steering and gear linkages oh and the dash is the opposite way round everything else is pretty much the same as the rhd, gearbox engine brakes etc all the main wearing parts. as for the resale, well you got it cheaper than a rhd model and you won't sell it at the same price as a rhd but you shouldn't have trouble selling it on as some people prefer them if they travel in europe a lot, i hven't tried to sell a lhd so not sure what the resale is like but i know i looked at lhd over here and they were more expensive than what i bought over there, i am not saying you willl make money when it comes to selling but i don't think you will lose loads either simply because you got it cheaper in the first instance, expect it to be worth less than a rhd equivalent. mine btw is a fiat but the chassis is the same main difference will be the engine and gearbox.


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## walkers (Jan 27, 2008)

the age of your intended purchase may have more effect on saleability than the drive side but then it is a hymer and that seems to help


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## Guest (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> the age of your intended purchase may have more effect on saleability than the drive side but then it is a hymer and that seems to help



I think that when you are buying an older van, the condition is more important than the age and at the price that you are talking about it is even more important.
Left or right hand drive matters little if you are comfortable driving either.
Just check it out and if you are happy with the condition, go for it
On an older van, you can not go far wrong with a Hymer as they have been around for a long time and their reputation was built up on the older models and not the newer ones.
The older models are probably as near to indestructible as you will get with superb durability


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## tetleys (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> Left hand drive will always be more difficult to sell, but the Citroen, Fiat Ducato & Boxer are all the same.
> Internal appliances will be the same


thank you.


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## tetleys (Jan 27, 2008)

walkers said:


> think about it this way, the lhd 92 has a dash mounted gear lever less likely to go wrong than the floor mounted gear stalk. most parts are identical as you are talking about a europe wide chassis the main differences in parts are things like the steering and gear linkages oh and the dash is the opposite way round everything else is pretty much the same as the rhd, gearbox engine brakes etc all the main wearing parts. as for the resale, well you got it cheaper than a rhd model and you won't sell it at the same price as a rhd but you shouldn't have trouble selling it on as some people prefer them if they travel in europe a lot, i hven't tried to sell a lhd so not sure what the resale is like but i know i looked at lhd over here and they were more expensive than what i bought over there, i am not saying you willl make money when it comes to selling but i don't think you will lose loads either simply because you got it cheaper in the first instance, expect it to be worth less than a rhd equivalent. mine btw is a fiat but the chassis is the same main difference will be the engine and gearbox.


thanks youve put my mind more at rest, thanks.


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## tetleys (Jan 27, 2008)

***** said:


> I think that when you are buying an older van, the condition is more important than the age and at the price that you are talking about it is even more important.
> Left or right hand drive matters little if you are comfortable driving either.
> Just check it out and if you are happy with the condition, go for it
> On an older van, you can not go far wrong with a Hymer as they have been around for a long time and their reputation was built up on the older models and not the newer ones.
> The older models are probably as near to indestructible as you will get with superb durability



thanks for putting my mind more at rest.


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## Belgian (Jan 27, 2008)

You won't have any problems with spares for the engine (at least on the continent) It is PSA (Fiat, Citroën, Peugeot), very common; one of the realiable sturdy atmospheric diesels. I have a 94er of those series; never had any problems. They are surely more relialebel than the later computerised common rails wich all have the same motorblock.
Hymer has a good reputation as built-up also. "Deutsche Grundigkeit".
If it's a good price and in good condition you will not be desapointed I suppose.


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## tetleys (Jan 29, 2008)

Belgian said:


> You won't have any problems with spares for the engine (at least on the continent) It is PSA (Fiat, Citroën, Peugeot), very common; one of the realiable sturdy atmospheric diesels. I have a 94er of those series; never had any problems. They are surely more relialebel than the later computerised common rails wich all have the same motorblock.
> Hymer has a good reputation as built-up also. "Deutsche Grundigkeit".
> If it's a good price and in good condition you will not be desapointed I suppose.



thanks for that advise it is much appreciated, however, you said that parts are not a problem on the continent? what i meant was getting parts for a citroen,fiat,peougeot, etc over here in england? is getting parts here a problem for a lhd vehicle? also  are the parts more expensive?i would imagine that the engine, wheel bearings etc etc would all be the same, but what if i needed a new lhd steering rack?or a lhd exhaust? or a lhd column change gear lever etc? would i be able to get them type of parts over here in england with no problems and at a reasonable cost either new or used? as it is this that is worrying me, i wouldnt want to buy a vehicle that i would struggle to get parts for, or had to pay way over the odds to get parts from the continent.
thanks.


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## Deleted member 207 (Jan 30, 2008)

I've come upon this thread a bit late in the piece, so may duplicate some info already posted.

I've bought campervans from Germany twice, both are Mercedes Westfalias James Cooks based on the 309D model. In both cases I found them through www.mobile.de which has a fair selection of used campervans for sale privately and commercially. Its a good website to get an idea of market values as well. There are other websites - do a weblookup on "verkauf wohnmobil". The other James Cook we owned was bought in London and based on the 207D model.

The Germans have annual inspections of vehicles much the same as the MOT, its called a TUV. In my opinion its not as detailed as an MOT and you may find that the vehicle fails an MOT whilst having a TUV. Watch out for rust. It will fail on headlight adjustment and no rear fog lamps, beam benders are acceptable for the headlamp, although a wreckers will often have RHD headlamp lenses (they have an arrow pointing to the left side) below the price of the benders. Halfords can supply a fog lamp, just a pain to fit with a telltale lamp on the switch.

The German motoring club ADAC offer pre purchase inspections at a price, which can be very cheap insurance if you are not too mechanically minded. Look also for the gas equipment test and inspection gold roundalls on the back of the vehicle - every two years in Germany. If the vehicle has a gas tank its important to know that its in good condition.

Once you have bought the vehicle you and the previous owner have to go to the registration offices and surrender the old plates and buy export number plates and third party insurance or the minimum that the EU country you are in - they go together. They are valid for one month, and the plates will have the expiry date stamped on them. You'll get a green card at the same time. The registration documents will be typed up whilst you are there - no computers yet (which was a surprise to me) with your name and address and you'll be issued with an EU registration document.

Once you get it back into the UK, go to your local DVLA and get an imported vehicle infomation pack, fill out the forms and post them off to Customs at Dover, get an MOT, get insurrance, go back to the DVLA and pay for rego and any duty that Customs may impose.

Insurance issues that I had in the UK - all companies asked whether it was a model imported or built in the UK - as I had imported it I felt justified in saying yes!! But dont think I'd win in a fight.

Most European vehicles are built with both LHD and RHD versions with all but a few parts being common to them (headlamps lenses, steering and gear lever mechanisms, often air cleaner boxes are the ones that are not common). Some manufacturers (Merc and Renault) have parts supply policies for vehicles sold anywhere in the world - unlike the Japanese.


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## tetleys (Jan 30, 2008)

Roger said:


> I've come upon this thread a bit late in the piece, so may duplicate some info already posted.
> 
> I've bought campervans from Germany twice, both are Mercedes Westfalias James Cooks based on the 309D model. In both cases I found them through www.mobile.de which has a fair selection of used campervans for sale privately and commercially. Its a good website to get an idea of market values as well. There are other websites - do a weblookup on "verkauf wohnmobil". The other James Cook we owned was bought in London and based on the 207D model.
> 
> ...


thanks for your advise roger it is much appreciated.......so you would recommend buying a lhd motorhome then?


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## Guest (Jan 30, 2008)

*Go for it*

Hi tetleys
I think that with your proposed budget, that you will get a better left hooker for your money.
Only you can make the final decision so I wish you the best of luck.
I would go for one 
Lets put it another way,
You see lots of old Hymers around and that says it all


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## Deleted member 207 (Jan 31, 2008)

tetleys said:


> thanks for your advise roger it is much appreciated.......so you would recommend buying a lhd motorhome then?



I've only ever bought LHD units in Europe/UK, its not a drama driving in the UK, and is a lot easier driving in Europe. The few things that you need to be sure about is things like access doors - side rear doors will open on the offside in the UK - ie into the passing traffic, with young families this can be a safety issue getting kids in and out, for those who have managed to empty the nest its not so much an issue.

There's a few other things that will cost a few bob to get sorted - power sockets will all be European 2 pin, so you'll need adaptors. The power in socket will also need an adaptor to fit UK plugs. If you have a gas tank (instead of bottles) then you 'll need to get a set of adaptors to suit the UK Autogas pumps - about UKP50 last year for the three adaptors you need for Europe. I'd go for a gas tank, bigger than bottles and really easy to fill. Some dramas may occur in finding Autogas, but do a bit of weblooking to get a list in the country you visit.

Time of year that you buy will also dictate the value for money you get - Springtime and prices increase and stay high until Autumn, then decline to rock bottom in Winter. 

Dont forget to add in the cost of travel to from Europe - unless you use the 1 month export plates to have a wander around Germany.


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## Guest (Jan 31, 2008)

*Habitation door*

I have never had a problem with the habitation door on the off side, in fact I prefer it that way and I know many other owners that feel the same
We never stop on a busy road so the use of the habitation door in those circumstances to us is irrelevant.
May be as stated above, if you have young kids, it may be


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## tetleys (Feb 1, 2008)

Roger said:


> I've only ever bought LHD units in Europe/UK, its not a drama driving in the UK, and is a lot easier driving in Europe. The few things that you need to be sure about is things like access doors - side rear doors will open on the offside in the UK - ie into the passing traffic, with young families this can be a safety issue getting kids in and out, for those who have managed to empty the nest its not so much an issue.
> 
> There's a few other things that will cost a few bob to get sorted - power sockets will all be European 2 pin, so you'll need adaptors. The power in socket will also need an adaptor to fit UK plugs. If you have a gas tank (instead of bottles) then you 'll need to get a set of adaptors to suit the UK Autogas pumps - about UKP50 last year for the three adaptors you need for Europe. I'd go for a gas tank, bigger than bottles and really easy to fill. Some dramas may occur in finding Autogas, but do a bit of weblooking to get a list in the country you visit.
> 
> ...



thanks for your advise roger, it is much appreciated


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## tetleys (Feb 1, 2008)

***** said:


> Hi tetleys
> I think that with your proposed budget, that you will get a better left hooker for your money.
> Only you can make the final decision so I wish you the best of luck.
> I would go for one
> ...


thanks *****, i really appreciate the advise.


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## Guest (Feb 10, 2008)

*Boiler sorted*



walkers said:


> probably nothing sinister as i know you are a stickler for draining down so unlikely to be frost damage, most likely a loose clip or knackered seal



Hi Tony.
I was too busy last weekend to sort it, but I sorted it this weekend while filling up for our Leek chill out weekend.
Yes it was a loose hose clip so I put a new jubilee clip on, and it fixed the problem.
I also found another possible leak source. I found that the overflow/vent pipe coming from the top of the boiler may also have leaked while blowing off pressure, so I also put a clip on this as no clip had been previously fitted.
Just shows the importance of draining and filling the boilers as without doing this as a matter of course I would not have known about this small leak and it could have resulted in problems further down the line


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## walkers (Feb 10, 2008)

***** said:


> Hi Tony.
> I was too busy last weekend to sort it, but I sorted it this weekend while filling up for our Leek chill out weekend.
> Yes it was a loose hose clip so I put a new jubilee clip on, and it fixed the problem.
> I also found another possible leak source. I found that the overflow/vent pipe coming from the top of the boiler may also have leaked while blowing off pressure, so I also put a clip on this as no clip had been previously fitted.
> Just shows the importance of draining and filling the boilers as without doing this as a matter of course I would not have known about this small leak and it could have resulted in problems further down the line


glad you got it sorted, just been away and come back and drained down too


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## walkers (Feb 14, 2008)

*did you buy one then?*

hi tetleys did you get your motorhome from germany in the end?


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## wildandwelsh (Mar 14, 2008)

tetleys said:


> hi all,
> 
> iam very new to motorhoming and have been looking for my first motorhome for the last couple of months which has not been very sucessful on a budget of £7500.(only been able to find mid to late 80s models for this) i have been advised that i can get much better value for money by purchasing from germany and so iam considering purchasing a lhd citroen based 1992 hymer camp lhd 2.5 deisel 108km motorhome,
> 
> ...



I have bought a 10 year old German Euromobil recently (LHD) from a guy who seems to make a living by popping over to Germany and bying a motorhome and then bringing it back to the UK to sell it on. I don't know much about Hymer but the Euromobil is great and the Ducato chassis is in beautiful condition. If you plan on doing most of you travelling in Europe then I think a LHD is a sensible buy. If you are going to stick to the UK then perhaps it isn't. Think how you are going to use it. If you would like to be put in touch with the guy I bought mine from for advice then let me know. Good luck, it is a nerve racking venture to embark on for the first time - this will be my first year of actually getting out there and travelling!


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