# Tyre pressure advice please



## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

I've got a Ducato trigano 2.3 van conversion with Michelin tyres.
Can someone tell me what the tyre pressure should be please?
It says something on the wall re 65psi but that seems a lot ?
Cheers
Dean


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## SimonM (Sep 10, 2017)

Get your front and rear axle weights and then send an email to Michelin, let them know what tyres you are using and they will send you back an answer with their recommendations normally within the hour.


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

Thanks both, I'm away Friday on a jolly for 2 weeks and don't have time to weigh it. 
The link doesn't work above
Thanks
D


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## jeffscarborough (Sep 10, 2017)

As others have said get it weighed. Then this list will show you the correct pressures for your vehicle.

https://www.tyresafe.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/motorhome-leaflet.pdf


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## colinm (Sep 10, 2017)

Motorhome Tyre Inflation Pressure Advice - TyreSafe - Promoting UK Tyre Safety and Driver Awareness

Get your axle weights. enter all info, then compare to the recomended pressures on the van. N.B this is not the pressure on the tyre side wall.
Myself I run above the pressures calculated as I like more presise handling, that it gives on my van.


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

Just had a look and the nice people from trigano have put a sticker on the door jam saying,
Front 59psi  rear 65psi 
Thanks all for the help
D


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## maingate (Sep 10, 2017)

gypo said:


> I've got a Ducato trigano 2.3 van conversion with Michelin tyres.
> Can someone tell me what the tyre pressure should be please?
> It says something on the wall re 65psi but that seems a lot ?
> Cheers
> Dean



If the tyre wall states 65 psi Max pressure then it is a van tyre not a Camper tyre.

It does not really matter if the correct tyre pressure is well below that figure. For instance the 4 rear tyres on my Tag Axle van are all Michelin XC. 3 are XC Camping, one is just XC. They run at 50 psi so it does not matter at all.


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## Obanboy666 (Sep 10, 2017)

Regarding the 65max psi stamped on the tyre wall, had the same query when I bought my first motorhome fitted with Conti Vanco tyres 4 years ago.
I contacted both Swift, a waste of time and Continental who were very helpful. They stated the 65 max psi stamped on the tyre wall was for the North American market and not relevant for Europe.
I weighed the vehicle fully loaded and after much googling found a calculator for tyre inflation recommendations. Ended up running the rears at 74 psi & the fronts at 65 psi which was slightly lower than what the calculator recommended but gave a comfortable ride and the tyre wear was ok.


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## maingate (Sep 10, 2017)

***** said:


> A lot depends on where and in what heat a person tours.
> If as I believe your most use is in cold UK, and shorter distances, then you can get away with wrong pressures, (not saying yours are wrong for your van) but  running for long distances in hot conditions and possibly heavy is very different.



The axles are rated at a Max loading of 1500 Kg each and run at well under that figure. There is no heavy load on them and the 50 psi takes into account the rise in pressure when running.


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

Just been down the weigh bridge 
Here are the results, the van is empty atm, I do have a 70lt water tank roughly in the middle of the van.
Front 1520kg
Middle 2780kg
Rear 1260kg
Thanks
D


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## Deleted member 5816 (Sep 10, 2017)

The van should be weighed fully loaded with full fresh water and fuel tanks plus all passengers

Alf





gypo said:


> Just been down the weigh bridge
> Here are the results, the van is empty atm, I do have a 70lt water tank roughly in the middle of the van.
> Front 1520kg
> Middle 2780kg
> ...


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

***** said:


> Sorry gypo, that only gives you an indication of how it is at this time. As I said earlier, you really need a fully loaded weigh. Any other time is guess work for normal running. You can weigh every item you put into the van, but then distribution (where you put things) will play a significant part!
> By the way, what is middle? , have you three axles or do we presume you mean weight of both axles!
> If you van is empty as you say, this only gives a rough idea of payload!
> 
> ...



Yes both axles, it's just how the fella wrote it down
Thanks all for the info for, I'll,  try get down there again in the mean time I'll tweak it a bit
D


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## 271 (Sep 10, 2017)

gypo said:


> Just been down the weigh bridge
> Here are the results, the van is empty atm, I do have a 70lt water tank roughly in the middle of the van.
> Front 1520kg
> Middle 2780kg
> ...



How many axles do you have? Those weights look suspiciously like;
Axle 1: 1520kg
Axle 2: 1260kg
Gross Vehicle Weight: 2780kg

If you do have a middle axle it looks like one has not been weighed.


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## maingate (Sep 10, 2017)

271 said:


> How many axles do you have? Those weights look suspiciously like;
> Axle 1: 1520kg
> Axle 2: 1260kg
> Gross Vehicle Weight: 2780kg
> ...



That's why it's important to say what the van is. Nobody can give good information as we don't know what van it is. It could be anything from a SWB Transit to a 30 foot long ex Mobile Library.


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)

maingate said:


> That's why it's important to say what the van is. Nobody can give good information as we don't know what van it is. It could be anything from a SWB Transit to a 30 foot long ex Mobile Library.



I did say in the first post 
D


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## Deleted member 5816 (Sep 10, 2017)

You do not list your van model etc in your profile which important when asking for advice the details in your first post on this thread are very vague. Given your profession it's all about details

Alf




gypo said:


> I did say in the first post
> D


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## maingate (Sep 10, 2017)

maingate said:


> That's why it's important to say what the van is. Nobody can give good information as we don't know what van it is. It could be anything from a SWB Transit to a 30 foot long ex Mobile Library.



Oops, my mistake. Sorry about that. 

I did check your profile and there was nothing in it about your van.


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## gypo (Sep 10, 2017)




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## big al (Sep 10, 2017)

*tyere pressure*



gypo said:


> I've got a Ducato trigano 2.3 van conversion with Michelin tyres.
> Can someone tell me what the tyre pressure should be please?
> It says something on the wall re 65psi but that seems a lot ?
> Cheers
> Dean



Hello .
As Gareth said most motorhomes run at high pressure and on the wall of the tyre it will say the max pressure to run at as your van is a conversion I would run them at the 65psi or go to a tyre company for info hope this helps you.
Regards.
Big Al.


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## Canalsman (Sep 10, 2017)

As suggested above, please use this to obtain the correct pressures:

Motorhome Tyre Inflation Pressure Advice - TyreSafe - Promoting UK Tyre Safety and Driver Awareness

Guesswork is not advised - too much at risk!


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## st3v3 (Sep 10, 2017)

POI Admin said:


> As suggested above, please use this to obtain the correct pressures:
> 
> Motorhome Tyre Inflation Pressure Advice - TyreSafe - Promoting UK Tyre Safety and Driver Awareness



I'm not sure that is very accurate. After it said I needed 80 psi I reduced the weight - right down to 500 and 600 kg and it still says 80psi. That can never be right!

The manual for my base van says 65psi fully loaded.


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## Deleted member 5816 (Sep 10, 2017)

And what van would that be you don't list one in your profile

Alf




st3v3 said:


> I'm not sure that is very accurate. After it said I needed 80 psi I reduced the weight - right down to 500 and 600 kg and it still says 80psi. That can never be right!
> 
> The manual for my base van says 65psi fully loaded.


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## Canalsman (Sep 10, 2017)

I have just tried it, and though getting the correct tyre pressure for the front axle it suggested 80psi for the rear axle ...

The web page states the following:

_CP-type tyre construction enables the use of higher inflation pressures to provide resistance to the difficult conditions of use encountered on motorhomes. Therefore, when CP-type tyres are fitted on the rear axle in a single formation set the inflation pressures to 5.5 bar (80 psi) for all loads._

I don't concur with this, nor do the tyre manufacturers if Continental are typical.

Their data book that includes loading tables can be found here:

http://blobs.continental-tires.com/...560e449f/download-technical-databook-data.pdf

The above mentioned leaflet is perhaps a better guide:

https://www.tyresafe.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/motorhome-leaflet.pdf


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## colinm (Sep 10, 2017)

st3v3 said:


> I'm not sure that is very accurate. After it said I needed 80 psi I reduced the weight - right down to 500 and 600 kg and it still says 80psi. That can never be right!
> 
> The manual for my base van says 65psi fully loaded.



I was puzzled by your post as the pressures for my van where much lower at rear, I then entered some ficticious values and used C and CP tyres, it would appear that they have 'Michelin disease', i.e. if they think you are in a campervan they go for max pressure, try again with same rated C tyres.


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## RoadTrek Boy (Sep 10, 2017)

Reading through this thread I find it strange that nobody has mentioned tyre construction, the MAX pressure put on the tyre wall for the north American market is the max pressure for that tyre at the max load also on the tyre wall..  putting 60 or 80psi into a tyre marked max 44 psi is a no no..
The tyre pressures given with the vehicle are for the original tyres fitted to that vehicle...
Good Luck...


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## john1974 (Sep 10, 2017)

haven't read all of posts but my relay ducato boxer (2006) when fully loaded is 65 all round.. as indicated by a sticker in the door jam.  I agree that the correct pressures could be more accurately found by van in full load form on a weighbridge, but mine certainly are 65's 

tyre sidewall max pressure is a little more than 65, cant remember how much more, possibly 70 or 80

John


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## Canalsman (Sep 11, 2017)

I don't believe this is correct.

The maximum pressure marked on the tyre side wall only applies to North America so cannot be used for calculation. 

Even if it did apply, the load capability of a tyre vs pressure is not a linear relationship.

The only correct way to establish the correct pressure for a given axle loading is to use the tables provided by the tyre manufacturer e.g. Continental for whom I provided the link above.

As an alternative the information provided by Tyresafe is undoubtedly sourced from the tyre manufacturers so is basically sound though as I said earlier I do not concur with their assumption about camping tyre pressures on the rear axle.


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## st3v3 (Sep 11, 2017)

Alf said:


> And what van would that be you don't list one in your profile
> 
> Alf



Sprinter, not that it matters...


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## st3v3 (Sep 11, 2017)

Is the north America thing something to do with limiting injury if it pops by any chance, and nothing to do with what the tyre can cope with?


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## RoadTrek Boy (Sep 11, 2017)

Are you saying that according to Continental same van and tyres, in North America you run at 45psi everything's fine and dandy (max pressure marked on sidewall ) load rating fine for your van, bring it in to Europe and and you should put in 80psi.
Sounds like nonsenseto me...


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## Val54 (Sep 11, 2017)

hairydog said:


> What you believe is a matter for you,but the facts are not necessarily in accordance with your beliefs.
> 
> Three points:
> 
> ...



Exactly why Michelin have stopped giving precise results for rear axles. They will give you a front axle reading based on supplied figures, in our case the van manufacturer rating of 80psi dropped to a Michelin recommendation of 52 psi. Our rear axle loading per tyre is 950kg with the tyres rated at 1250kg loading. In theory we could drop the rear pressures to around 61psi i.e. 76% of the 80psi max, but we find that is too soft and run them at around 70psi most of the time.
Dave


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## maingate (Sep 11, 2017)

hairydog said:


> What you believe is a matter for you,but the facts are not necessarily in accordance with your beliefs.
> 
> Three points:
> 
> ...



Not so.

If the tyres are underinflated for the load, the shoulders will wear. An overinflated tyre will wear down the middle.


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## st3v3 (Sep 11, 2017)

maingate said:


> Not so.
> 
> If the tyres are underinflated for the load, the shoulders will wear. An overinflated tyre will wear down the middle.



That's what he said 




hairydog said:


> .....* tell them to grossly overinflate their  tyres. *
> 
> They'll get a terrible ride, the tyres will wear down the middle and the grip will be terrible, but you don't need to be worried about being sued when an overloaded tyre pops.


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## maingate (Sep 11, 2017)

hairydog said:


> Well, I'm sorry to have to say that I agree with you. The problem is not a difference of opinion, just your ability to comprehend what you read.



Just happy to boost your superiority complex. :lol-049:


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## Byronic (Sep 11, 2017)

Inability.


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## maingate (Sep 11, 2017)

Byronic said:


> Inability.



Thanks Ronald. 

ps, I never figured you to be a Ronald, Ronald.


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## Byronic (Sep 11, 2017)

maingate said:


> Thanks Ronald.
> 
> ps, I never figured you to be a Ronald, Ronald.



Shuold have been Ronaldo, but the Brit. (papa) browbeat the Spaniard (mama). The last and
only time he ever did poor old chap!


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## Canalsman (Sep 11, 2017)

hairydog said:


> What you believe is a matter for you,but the facts are not necessarily in accordance with your beliefs.
> 
> Three points:
> 
> ...



We've been at cross-purposes over the maximum pressure.

I was referring to the figures for North America ... I have been to check my tyres, Michelin Camping, the front tyres are newer than the rears.

The rears have a panel for North America maximum pressure but it's blank. This panel is missing on the newer front tyres.

Both tyres have the load rating of 116Q at 80psi. This equates to a maximum load per tyre of 1,250Kg, giving an axle load of 2,500Kg.

However my rear axle load is 2130Kg and the suggested tyre pressure, using the Continental data for the same size, type and ply rating, is 65psi. This approximates to (2130/2500) x 80, which equals 68psi.

What is interesting from the Continental data is that the relationship between tyre pressure and load is not linear.

For a rear axle load of 2,410Kg they suggest 76psi, for an axle load of 1,540Kg they suggest 44psi.

Now (1540/2410) x 76 = 48psi, significantly more than the 44psi indicated. So it seems that for lower axle loadings the tyre pressure is proportionately less than might be expected.

Continental also differentiate between front and rear axle loadings. For the front axle the tyre pressure for a given loading is much less than at the rear. For example, the 2,500Kg maximum loading which at the rear requires 80psi only requires 69psi at the front.

So using tyre pressures at the front that are excessively high is going to give a terrible ride!


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## Byronic (Sep 12, 2017)

hairydog said:


> Rear axles are more likely to be overloaded than front ones.



I'm wondering if that is true of Motorhome usage as compared with Commercial usage.
With commercial usage there is usually going to be far greater opportunity to
distribute the load to suit the axle ratings. Tyre manufacturers have recognised this
difference perhaps by producing the "camping" tyre? A bit cynical maybe but just
stamping "camping tyre" on a standard but slightly higher load rated tyre might
have been all they did 

As an example, my van is rated 7t, front axle 2.3t. rear 4.7t. with GVW 6.6t.
Converted but otherwise empty the front axle comes in @ 1.9t, the rear @ 2.4t.
total 4.3t. Payload remaining is 0.4 t. front axle and 2.3t. rear axle, total 2.3t.

I load the van up with say fuel/water/booze and it all has to go between the axles
because that's where the storage happens to be. You can immediately see how easily
the front axle rating could be exceeded. Now in my case this gives me a good excuse 
to carry a m/bike, because cantilevering 0.2t. out beyond the rear axle will deduct c. 0.1t.
from the front axle, but does not get anywhere near overloading the rear of course.


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## kito (Sep 12, 2017)

This link maybe explain 

https://www.tyremen.co.uk/blog/do-i-need-specialist-camping-tyres-my-motorhome


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## Byronic (Sep 12, 2017)

kito said:


> This link maybe explain
> 
> https://www.tyremen.co.uk/blog/do-i-need-specialist-camping-tyres-my-motorhome



This link has been posted before, read the first paragraph carefully.
I think it should be regarded as tyremen's promo personally, but
others may get to quite a differing conclusion.


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## malagaoth (Sep 13, 2017)

> Most motorhomes have huge rear overhangs and a lot of additional loading goes onto the rear


.

very true and I really dont know how they keep their rear axle weights sensible, my Nuevo doesnt have a huge overhang  - although it is end kitchen which doesnt help and the rear axle weight is right up at the plated maximum (1900kg) so I dont know how much bigger M/hs and M/h with huge overhangs keep the weight down.

The standard rear springs on the Nuevo were 'upside down' until I fitted coil helper springs which helped matters  but now I am considering fitting upgraded triple leaf springs (standards being twin leaf) but I am mindful that this would be even more weight!
1900kg is also pretty much the maximum recomended weight for standard 109 rated commercial tyres so it looks like I will have to switch to camping tyres at the next change


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## Byronic (Sep 13, 2017)

hairydog said:


> I think it is. Most motorhomes have huge rear overhangs and a lot of additional loading goes onto the rear.



Yes that's generally accepted. However this is not the point I'm making.
For arguments sake let's say both a motor caravan and a van are loaded
to the legal max. now the commercial van driver usually has the opportunity
to distribute the load to make the best of his axle rating, whereas the motor
homer usually doesn't have this degree of flexibility any load usually ends up over the rear with the temptation to overload eg by way of m/bike rack on long
cantilever and 300L of booze in the garage. I'm suggesting that the tyre designers have recognised this niche type of usage by introduction of a specific tyre. I doubt that they will promote the camping tyre as suitable for 'you m/ homers running around on max. load on the rear axle or a little over' though.!


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## Canalsman (Sep 13, 2017)

malagaoth said:


> .1900kg is also pretty much the maximum recomended weight for standard 109 rated commercial tyres so it looks like I will have to switch to camping tyres at the next change



109 load rated tyres are rated at 1,030Kg maximum, so 2,060Kg for the axle. So these are the correctly rated tyres for your maximum axle loading of 1,900Kg.

There's no benefit changing the tyres for a higher load rated tyre unless you're going to get the 'van replated. In which case there are much higher load commercial tyres available.


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## malagaoth (Sep 13, 2017)

My local dealer is unable to suggest higher rated tyres, 'the book' says that I should run my current tyres at 65psi which is their maximum pressure this results in lost dental fillings on anything other than a bowling green surface  - 'camping car' tyres specify a pressure of 80psi which would probably result in detached retinas!


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## malagaoth (Sep 13, 2017)

both seem to specify pressures not a kick in the behind off 80psi and the use of metal valves


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## Canalsman (Sep 13, 2017)

malagaoth said:


> My local dealer is unable to suggest higher rated tyres, 'the book' says that I should run my current tyres at 65psi which is their maximum pressure this results in lost dental fillings on anything other than a bowling green surface  - 'camping car' tyres specify a pressure of 80psi which would probably result in detached retinas!



I suggest he might be wrong ...

In any case, as I said, the tyres you have are correctly rated unless you're replating. Are you planning to do that?

If so you'd be advised to check on the feasibility first with a company such as SV Tech.


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## Val54 (Sep 13, 2017)

malagaoth said:


> My local dealer is unable to suggest higher rated tyres, 'the book' says that I should run my current tyres at 65psi which is their maximum pressure this results in lost dental fillings on anything other than a bowling green surface  - 'camping car' tyres specify a pressure of 80psi which would probably result in detached retinas!



If the tyres are rated at a load of 1030kg per tyre and you are running them with a load of 950kg per tyre, then 1030/950 = 92% loading. If the maximum pressure of the tyre is 65psi, then 92% of 65 is 59.8 psi, so you could try them at 60/61psi assuming you are fully loaded.
Dave


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## Deleted member 207 (Sep 13, 2017)

I cant help myself, I've got to jump in having just read about 75% of this thread.

1. Vehicle and tyre manufacturers spend years testing vehicles with tyres and pressures that achieve the best compromise of handling, ride and tyre durability - especially commercial vehicles - if you think you can do better than 750,000 to 1 million mile testing then you should be building vehicles.
2. They take the bother to stick a tyre placard with tyre and pressure options at max legal weight of the vehicle's axles. eg 60psi front 65psi rear for 215/R15 or 55psi front 60psi rear for 205R15.
3. The tyre placard lists the only tyre sizes that can legally be fitted in many countries and may also state the max axle weights for each tyre size/rating if there are options.
4. In some countries your vehicle will be considered unroadworthy if the tyres don't match the tyre placard, rare but if you get a full inspection its an easy one to pickup.
5. Dual tyres running soft are dangerous as the side walls of the adjacent tyres will touch and overheat/fail.


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## Val54 (Sep 13, 2017)

Roger said:


> I cant help myself, I've got to jump in having just read about 75% of this thread.
> 
> 1. Vehicle and tyre manufacturers spend years testing vehicles with tyres and pressures that achieve the best compromise of handling, ride and tyre durability - especially commercial vehicles - if you think you can do better than 750,000 to 1 million mile testing then you should be building vehicles.
> 2. They take the bother to stick a tyre placard with tyre and pressure options at max legal weight of the vehicle's axles. eg 60psi front 65psi rear for 215/R15 or 55psi front 60psi rear for 205R15.
> ...



Wth regard to your point 1, I was advocating the calculation that Michelin and others have now declined to give. Up until a few years ago it was possible to contact Michelin Technical Department with your specific weigh-bridge axle loading  receive their recommendations for front and rear tyre pressures. In my experience these were always significantly lower than the van manufacturers handbook recommendations. Make your own choice based on what you know about your own van axle loadings. As always, err on the side of caution and safety.
Dave


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## colinm (Sep 14, 2017)

Roger said:


> I cant help myself, I've got to jump in having just read about 75% of this thread.
> 
> 1. Vehicle and tyre manufacturers spend years testing vehicles with tyres and pressures that achieve the best compromise of handling, ride and tyre durability - especially commercial vehicles - if you think you can do better than 750,000 to 1 million mile testing then you should be building vehicles.
> 2. They take the bother to stick a tyre placard with tyre and pressure options at max legal weight of the vehicle's axles. eg 60psi front 65psi rear for 215/R15 or 55psi front 60psi rear for 205R15.
> ...



Like all Maxi's my axles are built to take 4.5t, but like most my van is plated at 3.5t, but the recommended pressures from the manufacturers are left unchanged at the higher figure, so yes I don't just think, I know that I can do better. If you look at the data plate on a car you will see a couple of options for pressures based on the load, for vans the manufacturers just blindly assume I will be carrying 700kg more on the rear axle than I actually do


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## Mash369 (Sep 14, 2017)

*Reply from Michellin*

Here is a reply I got from michellin:--

Hello Christopher,

Thank you for contacting MICHELIN Customer Service!

The recommended tyre pressure for the rear (single) axle of a motorhome running on the MICHELIN Agilis Camping is 80 PSI. This is due to the construction of the tyre with 2 casing plies enabling the use of higher pressures. Its construction and the use of higher pressures is designed to cope with continual heavy loads sometimes found on motorhomes and can help with wear pattern issues if lower pressures are used particularly on the rear axle.
The front tyres however can be adjusted to a pressure of 65 PSI for a more comfortable ride and optimum performance.

Here are some safety points to be taken into account when it comes to tyre pressures:

1. Always check the pressures when the vehicle tyres are cold. We consider the tyres being cold if they haven’t been used for at least 2 hours of it they have rolled less than 4 km at low speed. If the tyres are not under this conditions they are considered to be hot.
2. When the tyres are hot you should always add 4,4 PSI to the recommended  pressure.
3. Please remember - Never deflate a hot tyre!

I hope this information is helpful to you and please don´t hesitate to contact us again if you have any more questions or concerns. We are happy to help.

Kind regards,

Vassilena

MICHELIN Customer Service


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