# Which battery brand do I trust



## goneoff (Jun 27, 2020)

I need advice as to which pair of batteries I should install in our motorhome. Ideally I wanted 2 x Exide 142ah but they are too long. Trying to keep the amp hours as high as possible with a maximum length of 330mm narrows the field down to a handful; rendering the handful down of other questionable brands there are basically two 120ah batteries; a Enduroline EXV135 and a Lucas LX35MF from what I have read on various forums both have been described as budget batteries (whatever that means) which is a concern. So I’m looking to establish which one of the dubious pair to buy. Or alternatively if anyone knows a better wet battery at a similar or better amp hour then please let me know. Alternatively let me know which of the two battery brands I should buy. Someone suggested Leoch batteries but again I don’t know if they are any good. What I do know is that the battery industry is full of skullduggery and re-labelling. That’s why I need some help. Thanks


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## Deleted member 56601 (Jun 27, 2020)

Contact Alpha batteries for advice, they are really helpful and we get a member's discount with them


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## mjvw (Jun 27, 2020)

Get over to Alpha great service and advice
Plus Discounts
https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/leisure-batteries/


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## trevskoda (Jun 27, 2020)

Varta or bosch silver power frame batteries,these will hold for 5 years as the plate frames dont disintrigrate ,just dont ruun them below 65/70 % discharge,there is nothing in lead acid to beat them,second choise would be yeasu.


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## st3v3 (Jun 27, 2020)

Whatever you do choose, another vote for getting it from alpha, with our discount. 

If they don't have something listed, it might be worth asking anyway.


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## witzend (Jun 27, 2020)

Would always be Numax for me really good battery an your not paying for adverts


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## Fazerloz (Jun 27, 2020)

If you can fit them in two Trojan 6v T105


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## Fisherman (Jun 27, 2020)

Another vote for alpha even without the discount of 7.5% on here.
I bought a second Varta battery from them last year. They priced it £25 cheaper than anyone else before the discount. The battery was delivered in two days.


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## mfw (Jun 27, 2020)

Price + warranty is a good way - alternator goes wrong could knacker batteries also discharge them too low could knacker them as well - just my view anyway


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## wildebus (Jun 27, 2020)

goneoff said:


> I need advice as to which pair of batteries I should install in our motorhome. Ideally I wanted 2 x Exide 142ah but they are too long. Trying to keep the amp hours as high as possible with a maximum length of 330mm narrows the field down to a handful; rendering the handful down of other questionable brands there are basically two 120ah batteries; a Enduroline EXV135 and a Lucas LX35MF from what I have read on various forums both have been described as budget batteries (whatever that means) which is a concern. So I’m looking to establish which one of the dubious pair to buy. Or alternatively if anyone knows a better wet battery at a similar or better amp hour then please let me know. Alternatively let me know which of the two battery brands I should buy. Someone suggested Leoch batteries but again I don’t know if they are any good. What I do know is that the battery industry is full of skullduggery and re-labelling. That’s why I need some help. Thanks


As has been suggested, contact Alpha Batteries for good advice.  If you have the information such as max physical size (length, widrth and height), then that will help eliminate batteries that could be suitable except for their size.
Leoch are a top quality brand and are a very big manufactuer of Batteries of all sorts of shapes and sizes.

I see there have been recommendations on Trojans and on the Powerframes.  If they suit your setup, then fine, but they are by no means an automatic or even a good choice for all so don't go into the discussion with pre-conceived ideas.

Also as far as fitting a battery in a limited space, if you get the right technology battery, you can mount the batteries in different orientations  (maybe you are limited to 330mm length but have more height then that? Put it on its side  (IF the battery permits it).  Just an example of keeping the selection open and not discounting options.
Having said that, you said "...if anyone knows a better wet battery".  Why do you specifically want a wet-cell battery?


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## QFour (Jun 27, 2020)

Fit ONE of these .. I rang them and asked if you needed anything other than the battery and they said NO. It's just a straight swap. 100Ah battery will give you nearly the same usable power and about half the weight of one 80Ah battery. It is under 330mm. Our new MH is going to have one fitted when it turns up. If you are thinking of buying a couple of batteries might be worth a look and you certainly won't give yourself a hernia trying to lift one in.


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## wildebus (Jun 27, 2020)

QFour said:


> Fit ONE of these .. I rang them and asked if you needed anything other than the battery and they said NO. It's just a straight swap. 100Ah battery will give you nearly the same usable power and about half the weight of one 80Ah battery. It is under 330mm. Our new MH is going to have one fitted when it turns up. If you are thinking of buying a couple of batteries might be worth a look and you certainly won't give yourself a hernia trying to lift one in.


Warning .... *It is NOT a straight swap*!

Underlined and emboldend because ....

If you charge that battery when it is at 0C or below - very possible in the UK in the Winter, then the battery will be damaged and seriously so.  This is typical for lithium batteries and the info on the link shows this battery is no different ("_... Battery must not be charged below freezing_")

So yes, fit one in exchange and it is a good price, but you DO need more than just the battery!  You need a method to disable any charging at low temps.


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## molly 2 (Jun 27, 2020)

As I understand you also need a monitoring system  as the voltage doesn't  drop  until flat ,  also is the wiring  could be too thin to carry the high current  a lithium  can  take  when charging  .please take this post as more of a question than a factual  statement .


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## wildebus (Jun 27, 2020)

molly 2 said:


> As I understand you also need a monitoring system  as the voltage doesn't  drop  until flat ,  also is the wiring  could be too thin to carry the high current  a lithium  can  take  when charging  .please take this post as more of a question than a statement .


This is a good point.  You cannot use a voltmeter reliably to monitor a Lithium Battery in the same way that one can be used with Lead Acid.  The voltage on Lithium tends to be very flat so a glance at a voltmeter could mean the battery is anything from around 100% to 5% charged and it is only right at the end the voltage falls off the cliff.


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## molly 2 (Jun 27, 2020)

wildebus said:


> This is a good point.  You cannot use a voltmeter reliably to monitor a Lithium Battery in the same way that one can be used with Lead Acid.  The voltage on Lithium tends to be very flat so a glance at a voltmeter could mean the battery is anything from around 100% to 5% charged and it is only right at the end the voltage falls off the cliff.


Do you have a comment  about the wiring  ?  I have 2 x105 amp  badged. ?? Leisure  Battery's  ,  about 4 years old  when their time is up  lithium is so tempting  . also is the onboard  charger compatible  Sargent 328 . .at 14.4 volts   
Not adjustable , as I'm sure you know the Sargent also controls the solar to engine and LB  battery .  46 klg   against  about 14  is so tempting  .


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## winks (Jun 27, 2020)

Couple of suggestions. If you're still looking.









						Hankook XL31S Dual Purpose Leisure Battery
					

Hankook XL31S Dual Purpose Leisure Battery product brought to you by BMS Technologies LTD Offering free next working day delivery.



					www.batterymegastore.co.uk
				












						Hankook XL31 Dual Purpose Leisure Battery
					

Hankook XL31 Dual Purpose Leisure Battery product brought to you by BMS Technologies LTD Offering free next working day delivery.



					www.batterymegastore.co.uk
				




Cheers

H


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## Nabsim (Jun 27, 2020)

Cables should be designed for max charge source Baz. A lithium battery may be able to accept a lot more current quicker but if source can’t deliver it there shouldn’t be a problem. Really you would want to take advantage of having that type of battery though so should check everything.
They can only be plug and play if the system supports it.


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## Fazerloz (Jun 27, 2020)

Could have sworn The OP particularly asked about wet batteries, but there you go.


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## wildebus (Jun 27, 2020)

molly 2 said:


> Do you have a comment  about the wiring  ?  I have 2 x105 amp  badged. ?? Leisure  Battery's  ,  about 4 years old  when their time is up  lithium is so tempting  . also is the onboard  charger compatible  Sargent 328 . .at 14.4 volts
> Not adjustable , as I'm sure you know the Sargent also controls the solar to engine and LB  battery .  46 klg   against  about 14  is so tempting  .


The way the Lithium Battery pricing is dropping, it certainly has become a lot more affordable and worth checking out.

I don't know if the 328 Charger is compatible with Lithium.  It is quoted as a Smart 3-stage Charger so it is likely compatible with the "drop in" style of Lithium Batteries, but maybe worth a call to Sargent Tech Support for their comment. 
You do need to consider the low-temp charging aspect though as mentioned.  A simple and useful way to deal with this if adding to an existing setup is to use a Battery that will not just cut out charging at zero Celcius, but actually still charge BELOW zero.  Alpha Batteries sell a version of the RB100 that can charge at down to -20C which I would think would be well within any realistic UK requirements
This is the model here - https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-100ah-relion-low-temperature-lithium-ion-battery-rb100lt/  .  An extra £50 over the normal one, but saves the hassle of adding in extra temp-sensing wiring and adds piece of mind.
You could alternatively get one that has a BMS that cuts the charge if temp goes low, or add your own circuit to do this, but whatever the approach taken, it is important to make sure this is considered otherwise you could end up with an expensive brick.


When you say about the wiring and your comment "_...is the wiring  could be too thin to carry the high current  a lithium  can  take  when charging_ ", I would hope that the wiring installed is suitable for the possible current the charger could deliver already? A Lithium Battery charges much more efficiently so the charger could be providing the max current the charger can deliver for a longer time, so it is possible the cable could get bit warm if underspecced, but for say the Sargent 328, I think that is a 25A charger? and the standard Sargent cabling is usually 4mm2. I would say those two are perfectly compatible.


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## wildebus (Jun 27, 2020)

Fazerloz said:


> Could have sworn The OP particularly asked about wet batteries, but there you go.


He did indeed  (hence your suggest on the T105s   ).
I did wonder why and asked specifically Wet Batteries.  Maybe we will find out why he likes Wet Cells?


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## Deleted member 56601 (Jun 27, 2020)

To get away from the childish bickering and back on subject. I use and can certainly recommend Trojans as good wet cell batteries.


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## Robmac (Jun 27, 2020)

Edina said:


> To get away from the childish bickering and back on subject. I use and can certainly recommend Trojans as good wet cell batteries.



I can't fault the Trojans Chris, they have done everything asked of them and never fell short.


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## Trotter (Jun 27, 2020)

Edina said:


> To get away from the childish bickering and back on subject. I use and can certainly recommend Trojans as good wet cell batteries.


Just as it was getting interesting .


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## trevskoda (Jun 27, 2020)

He will never get a trojan in that space,the varta bosch wet are always a good bet using silver power frame tec,about £105 a pop,easy charged from a smart charger and nothing to tec,once you go to other fancy batts the charging and hi tec is way over peoples heads.


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## helmit (Jun 27, 2020)

Edina said:


> To get away from the childish bickering and back on subject. I use and can certainly recommend Trojans as good wet cell batteries.


Me too Chris would  highly recommend trojans if you want lead acid and can carry the weight.


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## GinaRon (Jun 27, 2020)

Can I ask where you would buy a battery box from to put a second battery in please


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## Canalsman (Jun 28, 2020)

I am very pleased with a Varta LFD 230Ah Powerframe battery that I installed a couple of years ago.


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## Deleted member 56601 (Jun 28, 2020)

GinaRon said:


> Can I ask where you would buy a battery box from to put a second battery in please


Most chandlers stock them
https://www.midlandchandlers.co.uk/products/marine-grade-battery-box-120amp-30640


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## Deleted member 64209 (Jun 28, 2020)

and then there's. https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/accessories-tyres/36011/the-best-new-car-batteries-reviewed


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## Okta (Jun 28, 2020)

No doubt Autoexpress is a good source of information for car batteries but it is not where I would look for help with leisure batteries.


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## Trotter (Jun 28, 2020)

POI Admin said:


> I am very pleased with a Varta LFD 230Ah Powerframe battery that I installed a couple of years ago.


After reading this thread, I went onto the Alpha Battery site, with pen, paper and abacus  . The idea was to work out the price per amp hour, in Agm batteries. I’d like to keep my storage around  300ah . Their Energy brand 105ah @ £120 works out at £1.14 per ah, while the 290ah @ £345 = £1.18.
Therefore 105ah x 3 = 315ah for  £360 . While the 290ah is £345. Pretty much the same, give or take. The advantage with the 290ah, to me anyway, is not having to faff around with putting 3 batteries in parallel.

That’s a long way around getting to my question.

I read somewhere, can’t remember where. That multiple batteries will give a better performance than one large one.
At the time it didn’t make a lot of sense, still doesn’t. Something like if one battery goes down, with 3 you can revert to 2. Then replace the duff one. That can’t be right.  AlthoughI suppose if 1 large one, goes down  your snookered.
Any thoughts? Although, not about the need for high amp hours. ‘Cos size matters.
( That’s what she said.
I think you had to be there.)


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## clarkpeacock (Jun 28, 2020)

goneoff said:


> I need advice as to which pair of batteries I should install in our motorhome. Ideally I wanted 2 x Exide 142ah but they are too long. Trying to keep the amp hours as high as possible with a maximum length of 330mm narrows the field down to a handful; rendering the handful down of other questionable brands there are basically two 120ah batteries; a Enduroline EXV135 and a Lucas LX35MF from what I have read on various forums both have been described as budget batteries (whatever that means) which is a concern. So I’m looking to establish which one of the dubious pair to buy. Or alternatively if anyone knows a better wet battery at a similar or better amp hour then please let me know. Alternatively let me know which of the two battery brands I should buy. Someone suggested Leoch batteries but again I don’t know if they are any good. What I do know is that the battery industry is full of skullduggery and re-labelling. That’s why I need some help. Thanks



If you have room, I can highly recommend Yuasa EN100-6 6v batteries in pairs. As many as you can fit in. They can be used in any orientation except inverted, so positioning is quite flexible.









						EN100-6 - EN - VRLA - High Rate - Industrial - Batteries
					

<p><strong>Features</strong></p>  <ul>  <li>EUROBAT Classification: Over 12 years 'Very Long Life'</li><li>High rate discharge performance VRLA battery</li>  <li>Compliant with IEC60896-21+22 </li>  <li>ABS case material Fire Retardant to UL94:V0<




					www.yuasa.co.uk
				




I have 10 of these in pairs giving  12v 500AH in my home, which is completely off grid. There were here when I bought the place 3 years ago, so I recently starting thinking that I should be planning to replace them soon and contacted Yuasa to find out how to date them. Quite incredibly,  they are 21 years old and still working fine!

I am about to replace with Yuasa EN160-6. Wonder if they will last as long. Yuasa quote on the data sheet a typical life of 12 years.

I also plan to replace the Varta powerframes in my Moho with these in due course.

Date of manufacture confirmed by Yuasa by the serial number as per pictures below. 22nd November 1999.


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## molly 2 (Jun 28, 2020)

Many coach built motorhomes  have low payloads .the better quality the battery  the heavier it is .I have 2x 105 LBs at 46 klg  a 100 amp lithium way's only 14 klg  for about the same usable power  and much less space .that is the main reason I would consider lithium


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## goneoff (Jun 28, 2020)

molly 2 said:


> Many coach built motorhomes  have low payloads .the better quality the battery  the heavier it is .I have 2x 105 LBs at 46 klg  a 100 amp lithium way's only 14 klg  for about the same usable power  and much less space .that is the main reason I would consider lithium


I don't have a issue with weight (only my own  I have full air suspension and plated at 4500 kg.


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## goneoff (Jun 28, 2020)

wildebus said:


> He did indeed  (hence your suggest on the T105s   ).
> I did wonder why and asked specifically Wet Batteries.  Maybe we will find out why he likes Wet Cells?


Yes I deliberately said wet batteries, don't partially like them but I think they will suit what I'm trying to do now. I certainly don’t want to go to the expense at this point buying Lithium plus I don’t think the expense would end there with just the batteries as usually additional pieces of kit will be required to do a decent job (not wanting to kick off the bickering again  as for AGM’s they would be a bit of a worry being totally sealed, we tend to travel south and with the batteries sighted under the lounge seat next to the boiler they will get warm; knowing AGM’s can create quite a bang if they get too hot I'm not putting them on my wish list. I will probably fit Lithium in a 2-3 years but now I just need the biggest bang for my buck within the space I have available. The problem with a lot of suggestions I have had is that they take the Ah down to circa 100Ah we are used to 2 x 140 Exide in our old Rapido and needed them at certain times when the sun wasn’t playing ball. Thanks for your interest.


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## trevskoda (Jun 28, 2020)

GinaRon said:


> Can I ask where you would buy a battery box from to put a second battery in please


Any marine shop will have them,you also require a strap to hold the lid on,all should be fixed down.


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## wildebus (Jun 28, 2020)

goneoff said:


> Yes I deliberately said wet batteries, don't partially like them but I think they will suit what I'm trying to do now. I certainly don’t want to go to the expense at this point buying Lithium plus I don’t think the expense would end there with just the batteries as usually additional pieces of kit will be required to do a decent job (not wanting to kick off the bickering again  as for AGM’s they would be a bit of a worry being totally sealed, we tend to travel south and with the batteries sighted under the lounge seat next to the boiler they will get warm; knowing AGM’s can create quite a bang if they get too hot I'm not putting them on my wish list. I will probably fit Lithium in a 2-3 years but now I just need the biggest bang for my buck within the space I have available. The problem with a lot of suggestions I have had is that they take the Ah down to circa 100Ah we are used to 2 x 140 Exide in our old Rapido and needed them at certain times when the sun wasn’t playing ball. Thanks for your interest.


Thanks for the explanation for your reason  .   I do understand your point ref Lithium - they are still a lot more than Lead Acid and the extra support items does push the total cost up for sure.
I'd still recommend calling Alpha Batteries.  They have a good range of Wet Cells and has been noted by a couple of people, are very well priced sellers even before any member discount is applied.


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## yorkslass (Jun 28, 2020)

Trotter said:


> After reading this thread, I went onto the Alpha Battery site, with pen, paper and abacus  . The idea was to work out the price per amp hour, in Agm batteries. I’d like to keep my storage around  300ah . Their Energy brand 105ah @ £120 works out at £1.14 per ah, while the 290ah @ £345 = £1.18.
> Therefore 105ah x 3 = 315ah for  £360 . While the 290ah is £345. Pretty much the same, give or take. The advantage with the 290ah, to me anyway, is not having to faff around with putting 3 batteries in parallel.
> 
> That’s a long way around getting to my question.
> ...


We have four leisure batteries, 2 are approx 13 years old and 2 about 11 years old. I once asked Phil why they had lasted so long as some folk have to change every 3/4 years or even less. His explanation makes a lot of sense,  When they are being used the load/discharge is spread evenly so they have never gone dangerously low which means they have had a longer life. As a numpty , it made sense to me.#


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## Trotter (Jun 28, 2020)

yorkslass said:


> We have four leisure batteries, 2 are approx 13 years old and 2 about 11 years old. I once asked Phil why they had lasted so long as some folk have to change every 3/4 years or even less. His explanation makes a lot of sense,  When they are being used the load/discharge is spread evenly so they have never gone dangerously low which means they have had a longer life. As a numpty , it made sense to me.#


And me!
I reckon the more energy you have in store = bigger battery bank. The lower percentage you're using = batteries last longer.


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## jeffmossy (Jun 28, 2020)

Yes I would agree also , we are a fairly heavy user with electric kettle , microwave , lorraine's hairdryer , so I look at prob 3 years life out of mine


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## trevskoda (Jun 28, 2020)

jeffmossy said:


> Yes I would agree also , we are a fairly heavy user with electric kettle , microwave , lorraine's hairdryer , so I look at prob 3 years life out of mine


Have you no gas for kettle.


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## jeffmossy (Jun 28, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> Have you no gas for kettle.



Yes Trev but I decided to invest in a set up were I use mostly AC power , it was that Geeky guy who put the thoughts in my head and I am quite happy with it at present with all this solar power , but when winter comes we have to be a lot more careful with the consumption


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## GinaRon (Jun 30, 2020)

Ron is looking at buying new batteries but wondered if instead of buying 2x 110 batteries he bought one 140 to save him the problem of having to mess with joining the two together and all the faff that entails, do you think this would be enough for wildcamping. We do not use a lot of items just lights, heating and occasional telly.


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## trevskoda (Jun 30, 2020)

GinaRon said:


> Ron is looking at buying new batteries but wondered if instead of buying 2x 110 batteries he bought one 140 to save him the problem of having to mess with joining the two together and all the faff that entails, do you think this would be enough for wildcamping. We do not use a lot of items just lights, heating and occasional telly.


I have 180 but may add a extra 90 to make sure electric fridge dont drain me down to far,i have 200w of solar on my hat.


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## GinaRon (Jun 30, 2020)

Well I spoke to the battery people the 140 would not be enough he had a 240 but that is too big for our locker and it looks like we are  going for 2 140 batteries.


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## 2cv (Jul 1, 2020)

We only have space for a 110ah in our small van, though we do have 100w solar and a small golf cart battery which is only used in the depths of winter. It’s sufficed for 5 days stationary at new year.


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## molly 2 (Jul 1, 2020)

2cv said:


> We only have space for a 110ah in our small van, though we do have 100w solar and a small golf cart battery which is only used in the depths of winter. It’s sufficed for 5 days stationary at new year.


What type and brand is it , lead acid  agm or ??


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## 2cv (Jul 1, 2020)

molly 2 said:


> What type and brand is it , lead acid  agm or ??



It’s AGM and as fitted originally because it’s the only one that fits in the small space. The make is Platinum, which I can recommend having had one fail a month before the guarantee ran out they gave a full refund without question.


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## Obanboy666 (Jul 1, 2020)

Slightly off topic but can you buy battery boxes for say a 240 amp battery ? They are obviously considerably larger than a 100 / 110 amp battery which is the common size. I’ve yet to find any when I’ve searched online.


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## barlicker (Jul 2, 2020)

winks said:


> Couple of suggestions. If you're still looking.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I bought 2 of these just before the lock down and used them for 10 weeks. They are not deep cycle batteries and you can have mine for half price. I bought a 115amp Bison battery, tubular internals.


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## MarkP (Jul 7, 2020)

What!! A discount with Alpha Batteries??? Flip I just bought a solar kit off them.... how do you get the discount??


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## barlicker (Jul 7, 2020)

MarkP said:


> What!! A discount with Alpha Batteries??? Flip I just bought a solar kit off them.... how do you get the discount??


No discount ! Yer can have mine half price because they are not as described, only good for a starter battery.


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## st3v3 (Jul 8, 2020)

barlicker said:


> No discount ! Yer can have mine half price because they are not as described, only good for a starter battery.



Have you spoken to Alpha?

Discount info can be found here:




__





						Full Member Discounts
					

Full Member Discounts




					motorhomer.com


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## MarkP (Jul 8, 2020)

Thanks very much, wish I'd realised before but no doubt I'll use them again, they have been very good.


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