# Using a small heater with 2 batteries and an invertor



## woldsweather (Feb 18, 2016)

Not very techy minded. Only 2 nights out in the MH. We have 300w solar panel 2 batteries. I tried out using a small greenhouse heater (no idea on wattage/output) today (on the drive) but the invertor made an unhealthy sounding whistle. I am wondering if there is the possibility of a very low power heater to take the cold off at night rather than use gas?


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## st3v3 (Feb 18, 2016)

Batteries don't really work for making heat sorry.


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## Deleted member 9849 (Feb 18, 2016)

You really don't want to be using any mains appliance with a heating element through an inverter on 12volts,it will soon flatten the leisure batteries.Gas heating is the way to go when off grid.


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## woldsweather (Feb 18, 2016)

Just  seems wrong sleeping with gas on.


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## trevskoda (Feb 18, 2016)

Forget a inverter as it will eat batterys and the gh is about 60w total usless,go for either diesel night heater or the older caravan indirect gas heater which uses no lecy and are safe


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## Deleted member 9849 (Feb 18, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> Just  seems wrong sleeping with gas on.



Winter duvet...15 tog rating.....alternatively.... :shag:


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## woldsweather (Feb 18, 2016)

trevskoda said:


> Forget a inverter as it will eat batterys and the gh is about 60w total usless,go for either diesel night heater or the older caravan indirect gas heater which uses no lecy and are safe



I don't have a choice I have a MH with gas bottles and an invertor and microwave. We just use it to briefly warm up already cooked food.


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## woldsweather (Feb 18, 2016)

Well weve just forked out 27 K and that's what we have.


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## Teutone (Feb 18, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> Well weve just forked out 27 K and that's what we have.



Thousands of motorhomers around Europe sleep with the gas heater running.


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## Stealthcamper99 (Feb 18, 2016)

You raise a good point though. I was looking for a decent overnight silent heater that runs from something other than diesel (Too noisy) or gas (I don't have any) 

So far I haven't found a 100% ideal solution.

Andy


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## Deleted member 5816 (Feb 18, 2016)

Have you not got an Eberspacher heater ? what type of heating do you have ?

Alf



woldsweather said:


> Not very techy minded. Only 2 nights out in the MH. We have 300w solar panel 2 batteries. I tried out using a small greenhouse heater (no idea on wattage/output) today (on the drive) but the invertor made an unhealthy sounding whistle. I am wondering if there is the possibility of a very low power heater to take the cold off at night rather than use gas?


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## woldsweather (Feb 18, 2016)

OK will fit CO monitor and go for it!


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## 0191carl (Feb 18, 2016)

Diesel night heater the way forward with thermostat just upgraded mine as old was either on or off


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## Mul (Feb 18, 2016)

Teutone said:


> Thousands of motorhomers around Europe sleep with the gas heater running.




... yup, 's wot they're installed for !


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## Tony Lee (Feb 19, 2016)

Electric blankets ARE a viable heating method for motohomers with at least a couple of hundred Ah of batteries AND the means to get the batteries back up to full charge at least every couple of days. Just don't run blankets with fancy controls and timers off a modified square wave inverter.


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## woldsweather (Feb 19, 2016)

Tony Lee said:


> Electric blankets ARE a viable heating method for motohomers with at least a couple of hundred Ah of batteries AND the means to get the batteries back up to full charge at least every couple of days. Just don't run blankets with fancy controls and timers off a modified square wave inverter.




Now thanks for reminding me - had though of and forgotten that idea. Are these sleep to leave on all night? I have Reynards Disease and this sounds a better option than extra heat outside the bed.


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## Beemer (Feb 19, 2016)

We leave the gas heating on all night if the temperature outside decrees.  However, the thermostat is set low so that there is just enough warmth to stop it freezing inside.
In the morning, I usually am the one to jump out of bed, turn up the heating and jump back in.


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## Teutone (Feb 19, 2016)

Beemer said:


> We leave the gas heating on all night if the temperature outside decrees.  However, the thermostat is set low so that there is just enough warmth to stop it freezing inside.
> In the morning, I usually am the one to jump out of bed, turn up the heating and jump back in.



same here. But if I am not making coffee as well I am not allowed to jump back into bed :lol-053:


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## Caz (Feb 19, 2016)

What sort of heating does your van have, Woldsweather?

My family and I have slept in various caravans, motorhomes etc for 20 + years with the gas heating left on all night to keep us warm. There is no danger from CO poisoning in a properly fitted gas heater as they are vented to the outside of the van.

Same with diesel heaters.

Most people leave their gas central heating on overnight at home, don't they? What's the difference?


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## woldsweather (Feb 19, 2016)

OK I am convinced to leave the heating on. I am surprised that most people leave heating on at night though at home. Have ours on an hour in morning and an hour tea time and wood burning stove, and no radiator on ever in our bedroom!


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## Teutone (Feb 19, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> OK I am convinced to leave the heating on. I am surprised that most people leave heating on at night though at home. Have ours on an hour in morning and an hour tea time and wood burning stove, and no radiator on ever in our bedroom!



I think a lot of people still believe that switching the house heating completely off during daytime will save them money. You need a lot of engergy to heat a fully cooled down house up again, much better to just turn down the heating a few degrees when you are not around and at night.


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## Mr D (Feb 19, 2016)

It does seem odd that when it comes to campervans and motorhomes we're still reliant on either gas or diesel. Gas is explosive, can be leaky pipes through vibrations of transit, to get value for money we need bigger cyclinders which can break my back - then there's diesel which is great but can drain batteries fast - then there is wood fire which is to hot, not very controllable and dirty and dusty even if you do vent to outside.

I was looking at the zibro paraffin heaters - very hot, controllable, clean burning, efficient, high BTU, don't smell anymore, safe to transport. Maybe one day we'll have reasonable priced paraffin heaters designed for motorhomes where they pull in air from outside and vent outside, even ones which also heat our water.


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## alcam (Feb 19, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> I don't have a choice I have a MH with gas bottles and an invertor and microwave. We just use it to briefly *warm up already cooked food.*



To be honest a pot with a lid will reheat food almost as quickly


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## Teutone (Feb 19, 2016)

Mr D said:


> It does seem odd that when it comes to campervans and motorhomes we're still reliant on either gas or diesel. Gas is explosive, can be leaky pipes through vibrations of transit, to get value for money we need bigger cyclinders which can break my back - then there's diesel which is great but can drain batteries fast - then there is wood fire which is to hot, not very controllable and dirty and dusty even if you do vent to outside.
> 
> I was looking at the zibro paraffin heaters - very hot, controllable, clean burning, efficient, high BTU, don't smell anymore, safe to transport. Maybe one day we'll have reasonable priced paraffin heaters designed for motorhomes where they pull in air from outside and vent outside, even ones which also heat our water.



not even speaking about the air pollution with a diesel heater. I wouldn't want to park next to a Motorhome with a diesel heater running.


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## wildman (Feb 19, 2016)

Teutone said:


> not even speaking about the air pollution with a diesel heater. I wouldn't want to park next to a Motorhome with a diesel heater running.


you should not be parked close enough for it to make a difference.


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## Teutone (Feb 19, 2016)

wildman said:


> you should not be parked close enough for it to make a difference.



That is nit picking don't you think? If the wind is in the right (wrong!) direction, I can be in the next pitch and smell the thing. NOx is not good for humans.


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## i0mark0i (Feb 19, 2016)

*automatic lockour*

Hi you don't say what type of gas heater you have but all will have an automatic lockout if the flame goes out the gas shuts off also don't block any air vents hope this helps


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## sasquatch (Feb 19, 2016)

Mr D said:


> It does seem odd that when it comes to campervans and motorhomes we're still reliant on either gas or diesel. Gas is explosive, can be leaky pipes through vibrations of transit, to get value for money we need bigger cyclinders which can break my back - then there's diesel which is great but can drain batteries fast - then there is wood fire which is to hot, not very controllable and dirty and dusty even if you do vent to outside.
> 
> I was looking at the zibro paraffin heaters - very hot, controllable, clean burning, efficient, high BTU, don't smell anymore, safe to transport. Maybe one day we'll have reasonable priced paraffin heaters designed for motorhomes where they pull in air from outside and vent outside, even ones which also heat our water.



I think you will find that a paraffin heater will produce a lot of condensation


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## wildman (Feb 19, 2016)

Teutone said:


> That is nit picking don't you think? If the wind is in the right (wrong!) direction, I can be in the next pitch and smell the thing. NOx is not good for humans.


I don't think it was nit picking have been around a number of Eberspacher heaters, mind you I am quite deaf so would not hear them as some people would, as for smell, well valid point; but luckily you have an engine and can move upwind of the problem, if not then its really not that bad. Having said that I do tend to wild all the time and don't park near others. If they park near me I just move anything for a quiet life.
An open gas fire or paraffin fire WILL cause a lot of condensation.
Edit just noticed you said next pitch which presupposes a campsite in which case I've no doubt a small leccy heater would do the job.


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## delicagirl (Feb 19, 2016)

how about   -  a good duvet, (winter TOG rating), and a hot water bottle,  and then leap out of bed in the morning to switch on the gas fire, get back in bed till the van warms up, and then get up again to make drinks and cook brekkie.....   or if I am sleeping downstairs in the winter,   as above re duvet/hottie -   but stretch arm out to switch gas fire on, and snuggle down again under duvet till van is warmed up.....  

Seriously, though, my gas fire is probably 20 years old, and I was also scared about leaving it on  at night  - but having done everything possible to ensure my gas safety (GASSAFE inspection, remedial repairs,  flue-checks, gas leak checks, maintenance checks) - I did switch my gas fire on at 4.00am one night this week when it was super cold and I left my back window  open a tiny tiny bit - I  slept like a log till 8.00am.  Even so there was some condensation on the inside of the van - presumably from my breath.


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## hextal (Feb 20, 2016)

I hate having the heating on at night, I prefer it to be on the cool side rather than the warm side.

Got a nice thick sleeping bag, which is usually mostly undone, plus I insulated the hell out of the van when I built it, so it doesn't cool down too fast.

Also, our lass kicks out like a billion degrees so, short of an ice age, any place she happens to be will be warm. Tempted to get her to kip in the car to keep the frost off the windscreen.


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> OK I am convinced to leave the heating on. I am surprised that most people leave heating on at night though at home. Have ours on an hour in morning and an hour tea time and wood burning stove, and no radiator on ever in our bedroom!



I fit oil heating in homes and can tell you that it uses less oil when left always on provided you set the living room and tank stats at correct temp,lr 21c tank 45/50c.
Think of a car doing 55mph on m/way returning 40mpg,then take it into town crawling along at 5mph it will drop to 20mpg.
What folk dont understand that it takes 3 days to get a house warmed up as the walls etc become secondary emitters throwing heat back,i can assume that a van with the stat set will be more economical and nice at night than jumping in & out of bet turning it up down of & on,of course i may be wrong even though i have done all the tests and found it to be so.


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

I get 12 weeks on 1000 ltr oil at home winter and use just over 2200 year round with all controls set correctly,if i turn it of & on it uses more.
D avid you are living like my wifes parents/a thing old folk tend to do, they turn heating of and sit in coats hats and blankets round them at evening,who wants to live like that not me i want to walk around home in t shirt at 21c, would you have my kids turn blue.:scared:


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

alcam said:


> To be honest a pot with a lid will reheat food almost as quickly



Depends which pot your eating out of.:scared:


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

True david but if it were me i would look for a small flat as there is only 2 of you and it would make more sense ,any way more money to co motorhomeing.


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

swiftcamper said:


> My old farmhouse in the UK had walls nearly a metre thick,much more economical to keep it warm than to let it cool down completely.



Correct but try and get folk to understand things,no mission,here is a dia of  heating sys to which all homes from 2007 must comply with by law though most are from the stone age from what i go to fix.


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## hextal (Feb 20, 2016)

My uncle was heavily involved in the testing of condensing boilers when they first came in. He said that basically the efficiency claims were total pants in that they were based on running them constantly, as opposed to cycling them.  He said that if you cycle them, as most households tend to, then the older combi boilers were actually more efficient.


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

hextal said:


> My uncle was heavily involved in the testing of condensing boilers when they first came in. He said that basically the efficiency claims were total pants in that they were based on running them constantly, as opposed to cycling them.  He said that if you cycle them, as most households tend to, then the older combi boilers were actually more efficient.




Boilers do the own cycle when left running on wall stat which may i add should be in living room rather than some i find in hall.
The new boilers are 20/30 % more efficent but the alloy condenser units bugger up in about 6 years and the price to renue out weighs the saving unless you fit a bosch woster at about £1500,most folk cannot afford this or will not put controls on boilers and some relay on those silly rad stats,only fitt these to a upstairs or a sep motor valve on timmer.
It it also a false thing to turn rads of in rooms not used as the others then have to work harder to catch up and never trip the stat.
If a house you have keep the room with stat door closed as heat goes upstairs ,but if a bungalow alls fine and easyer to control.
Also a sealed sys is more efficent than a open header tank sys,and i put 20ltrs of antifreeze in sys to stop pipes freezing if away in winter and the boiler trips out,it also keeps sys clean and lubs pumps /motor vaves etc.


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## delicagirl (Feb 20, 2016)

swiftcamper said:


> My old farmhouse in the UK had walls *nearly a metre thick*,much more economical to keep it warm than to let it cool down completely.




I have lived in old houses with walls this thick for many decades  and was always cold.  For the past 8  years I have lived in modern properties with modern thermal values and the difference is fabulous. I am warm and i stay warm and the house warms up quickly  (even detached ones).


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## trevskoda (Feb 20, 2016)

I may get it working right for you ,and yes i remember those cold days in our old house living with my grand parents who would rather have a new car at the door rather than heat in the house,never again will i live like that or would i inflict that hardship on my kids,i think they will remember me for my good hart rather that a new car/van at front door but to each there own.:wave:


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## delicagirl (Feb 20, 2016)

swiftcamper said:


> You are welcome to your modern houses, the old houses will be around long after they need to be demolished.
> Never had a problem heating an older house and once warm they stay warm unlike most modern houses.



No one can speak for "most modern houses"  because  building quality (and heating type) varies with the price paid for it.

I can be out for weeks and my 50 year old mid terraced single storey property is still warm when I get back to it.   I came home yesterday after a week away in freezing conditions and it was not cold at all.  My early Victorian semi 3 bedder  would have had ice inside the windows on my return !!

100  year old terraced houses are also awful to heat and keep warm  - they were simply not designed for low heat loss. Modern insulation can made a difference.


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## Obanboy666 (Feb 20, 2016)

All this central heating info reminds me of when my son and I stopped at an up market B&B on Skye to get away from it all after my wife's funeral 3 years ago.
Recently built large bungalow on an exposed peninsular. It was the strangest sensation entering the outer front door. I can best describe it as like entering an airtight lab. They said the bungalow was basically airtight, I haven't a clue how the heating / air system worked but they said their heating bills annually were in the region of £150 !
I watched an episode of Grand Designs building a property on Skye and it was built the same. Once 'sealed' an engineer came and checked how air tight the house was, it had to meet certain criteria to be signed off as OK.


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## Siimplyloco (Feb 20, 2016)

wildman said:


> you should not be parked close enough for it to make a difference.



Ten feet away on an aire will be quite noisy enough. I've had four boats with Webasto/Eberspacher units fitted and leaving any of them running overnight would annoy lots of people!
John


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## Fletch6 (Feb 21, 2016)

When we go away I put the stat down to 10c it would take hours for the radiators to heat the house back up, but we have an air conditioner that warms the living room in 10 minutes flat. And compared to gas is much cheaper to run.


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## woldsweather (Feb 21, 2016)

swiftcamper said:


> Yes it is a strange one how some people let their houses go stone cold, then have to heat it all up again.
> Not sure that argument works in the van as they go cold much faster and heat up faster too.



My house temp doesn't drop below 18C and the heating tops it up to 19 (1 hr morning and night). House EPC  rated B.


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## trevskoda (Feb 21, 2016)

Well with all that money you dont have any work would have to be cash up front incase you do a bunk in the van.:lol-049::lol-053::wave:


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## trevskoda (Feb 21, 2016)

Obanboy666 said:


> All this central heating info reminds me of when my son and I stopped at an up market B&B on Skye to get away from it all after my wife's funeral 3 years ago.
> Recently built large bungalow on an exposed peninsular. It was the strangest sensation entering the outer front door. I can best describe it as like entering an airtight lab. They said the bungalow was basically airtight, I haven't a clue how the heating / air system worked but they said their heating bills annually were in the region of £150 !
> I watched an episode of Grand Designs building a property on Skye and it was built the same. Once 'sealed' an engineer came and checked how air tight the house was, it had to meet certain criteria to be signed off as OK.



They are not airtight but well insulated prob with ground pumps and solar with recycle heating,to expensive for most folk and it takes 20 years for payback.


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## trevskoda (Feb 21, 2016)

swiftcamper said:


> Hardly a modern house and being a mid terrace it is not going to lose much heat



You are right as i own a second house mid row terrace and it uses half what my cave uses.


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## woldsweather (Feb 21, 2016)

trevskoda said:


> I get 12 weeks on 1000 ltr oil at home winter and use just over 2200 year round with all controls set correctly,if i turn it of & on it uses more.
> D avid you are living like my wifes parents/a thing old folk tend to do, they turn heating of and sit in coats hats and blankets round them at evening,who wants to live like that not me i want to walk around home in t shirt at 21c, would you have my kids turn blue.:scared:



We use 1000 litres a year in our 5 bedroom house.


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## woldsweather (Feb 21, 2016)

My bedroom window as a child was 100% ice (and very beautiful patterns at that) as a child. Just a cole fire in the evening was all we had.


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## trevskoda (Feb 21, 2016)

I was lucky and came from a moneyed lot,grand mother sisters husband was the head banker of manhaten island and owned half of it but died childless but the money went missing,her second sister married the board of directors top man in general motors in usa,when she died we got the lot though by the time the legal eagals got there whake only about 20% of a million dollars was left,in the will it was laid out i was to get something so on my 16 birthday a new gilera 50 moped was bought for me and it was the only thing i ever got and was told you are on your own now get on with it.
Money was always keeped tight in our house even though the was plenty.


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## trevskoda (Feb 21, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> My house temp doesn't drop below 18C and the heating tops it up to 19 (1 hr morning and night). House EPC  rated B.



Gov recomend 21c house and 45/50c for water as not to scald a child turning on hot taps
18c is fine for night time and most wireless stats now can be set this way.
B is very good mine is c.


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## Teutone (Feb 21, 2016)

woldsweather said:


> My bedroom window as a child was 100% ice (and very beautiful patterns at that) as a child. Just a cole fire in the evening was all we had.



Because houses and heating system have been poorly in the past, it doesn't mean it has to stay like this. Back then we didn't have internet either, so would you turn it off now because as a child we didn't have it and children these days should sleep ice cold and have no internet?

Things move on and what used to be best practise in the past is now out of date. 

Your house is EPC B which is really good and shows how little engergy is required to be really comfortable these days. When we replaced the old back boiler with a modern combi boiler the heating bill went down dramatically. And our house is only a C.


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