# Driving with gear box friction?



## Clunegapyears (May 20, 2019)

In Corsica. Thank goodness for our extended Fiat warranty. Apparently there is friction in the ??? in the gear box causing the Motorhome to judder and loose power. My French is not technical.  Not sure how long Fiat here will take to have to look at it and order spare parts. But the insurance covers a hotel.  
My questions are:
1.  The mechanic said it was fine to drive it slowly for about 2 hours to the garage that has agreed to look at it. Is this really not going to damage the engine?
2.  What might the friction in the ???? gear box be?  I can start googling technical terms once I have an idea what it is!
Thanks in anticipation
Out to supper to drown our woes (limited woes as we’re ok)


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## harrow (May 20, 2019)

Friction in the gearbox ? 
Well there should be very little, bearing damage maybe or 
are they referring to a dragging clutch ?


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## Clunegapyears (May 20, 2019)

Thanks. Definitely the gear box - knew the French for that.


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## andyjanet (May 20, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> In Corsica. Thank goodness for our extended Fiat warranty. Apparently there is friction in the ??? in the gear box causing the Motorhome to judder and loose power. My French is not technical.  Not sure how long Fiat here will take to have to look at it and order spare parts. But the insurance covers a hotel.
> My questions are:
> 1.  The mechanic said it was fine to drive it slowly for about 2 hours to the garage that has agreed to look at it. Is this really not going to damage the engine?
> 2.  What might the friction in the ???? gear box be?  I can start googling technical terms once I have an idea what it is!
> ...



Is it an auto or manual


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## colinm (May 20, 2019)

Could be the preload in the gearbox bearings, but this is very difficult to diagnose unless its very bad, but then you wouldn't be advised to drive it.


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## caledonia (May 20, 2019)

Friction? No oil or damaged bearings  would cause friction? Been a mechanic for all my working life but that’s a new one on me. Will have look in the secret book of mechanics excuses


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## Clunegapyears (May 20, 2019)

A litre of red (shared) and a full tummy. Shall endeavour to stop worrying. 
The low loader that arrived was far too small for us, so no wonder he didn’t want to deliver us ... and it would have been too late as the garage would have been shut. 

Ho hum.


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## yeoblade (May 20, 2019)

Friction = Clutch. My guess is the DMF is playing up.


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## Clunegapyears (May 21, 2019)

*Not going anywhere*

Engine purrs nicely but into gear and no movement. Had to call for, hopefully, a larger low loader to take us to Fiat in Bastia.   At least the sun is shining


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## r4dent (May 21, 2019)

Get them to type description of the problem then put it in Google translate.


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## witzend (May 21, 2019)

I'd take a guess that the "friction" their talking about is they can hear a rubbing/squeal or whirring sound which would indicate some problem. Have you had any recent work done to front hubs ?


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## Clunegapyears (May 22, 2019)

No noise from the problem. 
Fiat Assist’s agency counterpart slow to respond then had problems finding a garage to accept us. After escalating it, at 10 pm finally some plans in place. Taxi to hire car 9.15. Will book a chalet on the campsite we’re on. Low loader at 2.00. 
Will follow van to garage to A) see where’s its gone. B) supervise unloading!  C) establish when the garage can start its investigation.   Will have google translate to hand.


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## RV2MAX (May 22, 2019)

If you can put it in gear then the clutch is working and you have stripped a drive shaft or other drive spline , or the clutch has failed completely and there is no drive going into the gearbox. Your problem is a lack of "friction" (drive) rather than an excess of it .


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## Biggarmac (May 22, 2019)

Thats 2 of us in garages tomorrow with gearbox woes.  After spending 3 hours and €70 in an Italian garage I am taking my van to a Renault  garage in France tomorrow at 9am. Its only across the road from the campsite where I am stewarding a rally for the next couple of weeks. Will see what their diagnoses is.  Not under warrenty sadly.


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## colinm (May 22, 2019)

Biggarmac said:


> Thats 2 of us in garages tomorrow with gearbox woes.  After spending 3 hours and €70 in an Italian garage I am taking my van to a Renault  garage in France tomorrow at 9am. Its only across the road from the campsite where I am stewarding a rally for the next couple of weeks. Will see what their diagnoses is.  Not under warrenty sadly.




Mainly Traffics, but also some Masters (and a lot of cars) have wreaked their gearboxes due to a manufacturing fault. Depending on age there is an outside chance of getting some money back.


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## Clunegapyears (May 23, 2019)

The Moho won’t get assessed until it arrives at a garage.  Whenever that may be!!!  Was supposed to be picked up yesterday afternoon, but the breakdown company eventually rang me to say he had to hire a bigger low loader and would be here this morning.  
Later a phone call from RAC Commercials... the breakdown guy wanted confirmation of €1500 before he rented the bigger recovery vehicle!!!
RAC have escalated this to Italy!!!!
We have the hire car and after 3 days (so far), we are off to explore a bit of Corsica.


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## Stanski (May 23, 2019)

*CORSICA - Guess it is a nice place to break down*

As others have said seems like a clutch (70%) - Gearbox (30%).
How many miles has vehicle done? - and how old?

CORSICA
How did you travel to Corsica, from France I guess.  Which ferry operator?

Good luck with it all.


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## Nabsim (May 23, 2019)

is yours the automatic gearbox? when you say it goes into gear is that just the selector saying that or do you know jt gas gone in like with a manual?


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## vanmandan (May 23, 2019)

Hi K sorry to hear of your problem. for some reason thought you had an Iveco drivetrain.
if its Fiat....  dont say I didn't warn you.
Fix
It
Again
Tomorrow.
I hope you don't have to get shipped back to the mainland.
can't be too many motorhome specialists in Corsica.
 hope it all works out.
enjoy the sun, weather grim oop north.
Ciao, D.


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## Clunegapyears (May 23, 2019)

Stressful day. 

To answer some questions…
Motorhome will only be three years old this coming October.
3 L chain driven Fiat. Manual gearbox. 36,000 miles on the clock.

Low loader arrived. But there is a fixed height barrier at the entrance to the campsite. Quite high but obviously not high enough with our 3 m on top of the low loader. We pushed the MH off the campsite pitch so that he could put the towing pin into the front and tow us off the campsite. However, the pin snapped and has broken the front face, grill and part of the metal pin is still in the screw fixing. Campers are a lovely bunch. About 12 of them came to our assistance and pushed us all the way through the campsite. 

 A SLOW 90 km drive to a truck repair place. We had assumed, wrongly, we were going to the Fiat Professional garage. On arrival the low loader driver wanted me to sign off the job is completed. But he would not let me indicate the damage. He and one of the mechanics tried to put quite a lot of pressure on me that he would have to pay for the damage. I apologised deeply, agreed it wasn’t his fault but said that the insurance would not let me sign it without indicating the damage. Not a pleasant experience trying to deal with this in a foreign language. 

Then I spoke to one of the mechanics to ask if you had any idea when he would be able to start taking a look at our motorhome. Not at all, he said. We have not had the paperwork from Fiat. As it is an insurance claim Fiat should be doing the work.

An email with damagepictures now gone to Fiat. Too tired and too late this evening to get back onto the phone. Deal with that tomorrow.


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## yeoblade (May 23, 2019)

Good luck, you obviously did the right thing with insisting you document the damage, during a stressful time, easy to overlook it.
If they have to ferry it off the island, get em to go straight to Italy. Good luck 

Sent from my mobile using Tapatalk


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## The laird (May 23, 2019)

Hope you get a good sleep and things improve tomorrow


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## yeoblade (May 24, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> Stressful day.
> 
> To answer some questions…
> Motorhome will only be three years old this coming October.
> ...



That sounds very dangerous, as they say 'that could take someones eye out!' or more ,seriously though was it fully screwed in, I know the threads can rust up, were they pulling at an angle?


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## Clunegapyears (May 25, 2019)

Yes pulling at an angle. And agree good that no one hurt by steel rope. 
Of course the low loader driver is now claiming he is only responsible for the pin stuck in side and the other damage was there already. Ho hum. See where Fiat insurance take this. 

You mechanically minded were spot on. Not the gear box but the clutch. This is sadly NOT COVERED under waranty as is down to wear and tear. I’ve asked Fiat insurance to get an email to me what exactly the work required is and the cost. This vehicle is not 3 years old until end October. Apparently I have to present Fiat UK with the bill to ask for a goodwill contribution, as we we bought it in the Uk. Will be ringing Fiat uk Monday. 

The good news is it should be ready end of next week. In the meantime we are out and about in the hire car. And able to get up into the hills and along roads we wouldn’t choose to take the MH. so that’s our silver lining!


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## Nabsim (May 25, 2019)

Monday is a Bank Holiday in the Uk, you may not get them til Tuesday


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## ricc (May 25, 2019)

was the towing eye/pin that snapped part of the motor homes equipment supplied by fiat , or one of the tow trucks?


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## trevskoda (May 25, 2019)

Cannot see how a clutch would fail at only 36 thu miles,very unlikely and rare unless a left shoe is heavy or holding at lights/driving with foot on pedal,do hope you get sorted soon to continue your hols.


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## Tezza33 (May 25, 2019)

I would ask them for the clutch parts they are removing, if you are trying to get a goodwill contribution it will help if it shows a problem other than wear and tear


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## caledonia (May 25, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Cannot see how a clutch would fail at only 36 thu miles,very unlikely and rare unless a left shoe is heavy or holding at lights/driving with foot on pedal,do hope you get sorted soon to continue your hols.



Drivetrain unsuitable for vehicle type and probably a bit of a left foot issue.


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## witzend (May 25, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> A SLOW 90 km drive to a truck repair place. We had assumed, wrongly, we were going to the Fiat Professional garage.



Pity you didn't go to a Fiat dealer its easier to get any good will deal with Fiat thru one of their dealers Make sure they use OEM parts if they won't let you take parts away take clear pics of both sides of every part replaced. I know it's at low mileage but I'd get them to replace slave cylinder if its inside bell housing


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## bobj808 (May 25, 2019)

My slave cylinder failed at 27000 miles on my 2009 2.3 Ducato mh - almost impossible to get it in gear. Gearbox out to do the job as it's inside it for some absurd reason. Changed the clutch at same time although garage said it was fine. Fiat was just over £1000 as it is a 2 man x 6 or 8 hour job. Got it done much cheaper at an independent. Know it's not nice, but better clutch/slave than gearbox. Regards towing eye - we often need paddock tows at motocross - I keep the screw hole pumped full of grease - if not it rusts quickly and you can only get a small portion of the eye screwed in which is no way enough to tow a mh. Good luck with your repairs. Bob.


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## Clunegapyears (May 26, 2019)

Thank you all.  Will ask for knackered parts and check OEM parts.  Communication is slightly awkward as my French is not up to technical and the Corsican accent strong. 

We neither have a heavy left boot .... But on the flat, we will hold in gear at lights.  Know now not to do that!

Pin was ours and fully home.  Pin broke as, he was pulling us from the side ...low loader chap should have known better ...  pix on motorhomer.


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## caledonia (May 26, 2019)

hairydog said:


> Leaving it in gear at the lights won't wear the clutch out if you keep the pedal right down. It will wear the release bearing out slightly sooner, perhaps, but that's not what has happened.
> Holding it still on a hill with the clutch will wear it out fast, but surely you weren't doing that?
> Chances are that the clutch was adjusted badly, or the release mechanism was sticky, at the pedal wasn't full 'up' from the clutch's point of view.
> When it is fixed, check for this: driving up a hill, depress the clutch a little so the engine revs a bit (but not freely), then bring the clutch back up sharply. The clutch should grip and bring the engine back under control with a thump, not a slur.



There’s no adjustment on a hydraulic clutch and your method for testing could rip the centre out of the driven plate.


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## trevskoda (May 26, 2019)

hairydog said:


> Leaving it in gear at the lights won't wear the clutch out if you keep the pedal right down. It will wear the release bearing out slightly sooner, perhaps, but that's not what has happened.
> Holding it still on a hill with the clutch will wear it out fast, but surely you weren't doing that?
> Chances are that the clutch was adjusted badly, or the release mechanism was sticky, at the pedal wasn't full 'up' from the clutch's point of view.
> When it is fixed, check for this: driving up a hill, depress the clutch a little so the engine revs a bit (but not freely), then bring the clutch back up sharply. The clutch should grip and bring the engine back under control with a thump, not a slur.



Balls it also eats the fingers of the diaphriam and weakens it over time along with very early wear of the release brg,remember your driving instructions,hand brake on select nuteral.


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## trevskoda (May 26, 2019)

caledonia said:


> There’s no adjustment on a hydraulic clutch and your method for testing could rip the centre out of the driven plate.



Some hyd clutches did have adjustment at slave cyl,skoda estelle did.


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## caledonia (May 26, 2019)

Yes I agree Trev most trucks have adjustable hydraulic clutches but we’re talking modern vehicles here.


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## trevskoda (May 26, 2019)

caledonia said:


> There’s no adjustment on a hydraulic clutch and your method for testing could rip the centre out of the driven plate.



Correct,the right way to operate a clutch is ,clutch in select gear throttle eng but release power and catch the flywheel with clutch  on decending revs,this method works well as the dec flywheel has much less torque but the right amount to get you away.
Many of my cars have clocked well over 200 th miles and still had beef on the plate.


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## harrow (May 26, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> But on the flat, we will hold in gear at lights.  Know now not to do that!



*Funny enough that is now how they are taught to drive,* 

if red traffic light ahead then a *manic sequential change down* through the gears, holding it in first gear with the *clutch down waiting for the green light !*


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## mistericeman (May 26, 2019)

Bear in mind a lot of modern clutch release bearings are plastic/nylon...
Fine for coping in short bursts.... 
Not designed for being held running over longer periods building heat up in them.


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## trevskoda (May 26, 2019)

harrow said:


> *Funny enough that is now how they are taught to drive,*
> 
> if red traffic light ahead then a *manic sequential change down* through the gears, holding it in first gear with the *clutch down waiting for the green light !*



Its nut gear at white stop line,only clutch at a broken white line as in give way.
when i was going through my test with instructor<though i could drive> he had a big shifter wrench which he wolloped your leg with if you did not select nute and foot of clutch.:hammer:


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## caledonia (May 27, 2019)

hairydog said:


> Wrong. Some hydraulic systems do have adjustment, and those that don't can be incorrectly installed or have distorted mechanisms.
> 
> As for your stupid comment about ripping the centre out, I'm amazed that anyone could be so misled. If the clutch can't cope with the pedal being lifted quickly once, it is seriously of fit for purpose.



Your idea of dumping the clutch on a hill is just plain stupid and modern vehicles which most of us drive with hydraulic clutches will have no adjustment. I’ve been a mechanic all my working life and know how a clutch should be checked, installed and used. A little knowledge is dangerous!


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## caledonia (May 27, 2019)

hairydog said:


> There is no polite way to address your ignorant wrongless.
> As you say, a little knowledge is dangerous. You clearly only have a little knowledge.



 Crack on mate&#55357;&#56834;As for my ignorant wrongless&#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834; I bow to your superior knowledge. Hopefully people aren’t stupid enough to use your clutch slur test. Whatever clutch slur is?&#55357;&#56834;&#55357;&#56834;


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## Deleted member 5816 (May 27, 2019)

I wonder if this is the Fiat DMF problem arising again.

Alf


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## bobj808 (May 27, 2019)

So it's just not me that he thinks is stupid. Two of us now. lol Bob.


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## caledonia (May 27, 2019)

bobj808 said:


> So it's just not me that he thinks is stupid. Two of us now. lol Bob.



With the knowledge and great wisdom he thinks he has I think there will be more than two of us Bob.


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## mistericeman (May 27, 2019)

caledonia said:


> With the knowledge and great wisdom he thinks he has I think there will be more than two of us Bob.



Yup count me in too....
 I even got a posting ban, on the other side after disagreeing with him ;-)


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## caledonia (May 27, 2019)

mistericeman said:


> Yup count me in too....
> I even got a posting ban, on the other side after disagreeing with him ;-)



Looking forward to his reply.


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## trevskoda (May 27, 2019)

Dumping or letting a clutch out fast is fine when driving through gears but NEVER when starting of,apart from the fact the engine/box mounts will or could over time give out,i also saw a few drive input shafts broken or twisted over the years.:rolleyes2:


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## caledonia (May 27, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Dumping or letting a clutch out fast is fine when driving through gears but NEVER when starting of,apart from the fact the engine/box mounts will or could over time give out,i also saw a few drive input shafts broken or twisted over the years.:rolleyes2:



Especially on a hill.


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## yeoblade (May 27, 2019)

Alf said:


> I wonder if this is the Fiat DMF problem arising again.ALF





yeoblade said:


> Friction = Clutch. My guess is the DMF is playing up.



:ditto::ditto::ditto:


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## GWAYGWAY (May 27, 2019)

Modern hydraulic clutch release bearing are on the end of a hollow tubular cylinder and the pressure pushes a hollow  piston up the  tube, there is no adjustment as the  pressure goes immediatley the foot is off the clutch pedal .  ( keep the bloody foot off it)   it is the same with brakes open  curcuit and not touching  the disc until the slack is taken with the pedal movement.  some master cylinder have an adjustable  pushrod.

However.on Thursday, I found I was dragging my Smart with the brakes on because the pedal did not return ALL the way because of a bit of cable drag. and they got very hot very quickly, I did notice the effort that was needed to pull it and stopped.   A bungee to the seat frame, to hold the pedal back was the answer, enough to release the pressure and allow wobble to give a clearance on the discs. Same with the clutch system.


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## maingate (May 27, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Dumping or letting a clutch out fast is fine when driving through gears but NEVER when starting of,apart from the fact the engine/box mounts will or could over time give out,i also saw a few drive input shafts broken or twisted over the years.:rolleyes2:



Many years ago me and the Shift Electrician fitted a new clutch to his Mk 1 Escort in the Fitting Shop at work one weekend. We got it all back together but the clutch was not operating when he tried it (it was still on the ramps in the Shop. I lay under the front of the car with a torch and thought I had found the problem and shouted for him to stamp on the clutch pedal (the cable had not seated properly). He stamped on the clutch pedal ... the ramps shot one way and the car shot out of the Fitting Shop in reverse. :raofl:

Luckily I was unhurt and the car got through the double doors OK.


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## bobj808 (May 28, 2019)

Ah, hairydog - take it you were the school bully before you became an old bully. Purpose of forums are to pass on views, experiences, thoughts. Sometimes we - not you obviously - are at variance, but we've done our best. It's then up to the OP to make an informed decision/judgement on the available information. You called me stupid because I gave my views on new old stock tyres. That is my view, it is open to debate, but I don't consider I am stupid for giving my opinion. We must meet sometime and I'll tell you some war stories as a senior undercover Police Officer who has worked all over Europe and speaks Spanish and German (don't like the French lol) - we'll enjoy a beer and you'll realise that not everyone apart from you is stupid.  Bob.


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## tidewatcher (May 28, 2019)

*Drifting*

To be honest I am a little uninterested in a bout of willie waving, there is a member in dire straights looking for either technical help or at the least some moral support. I feel for him being in such a situation. Now, gearbox friction? It sounds like a case of lost in translation, more to the point has anyone had a problem with their gearbox which could have been badly described as gearbox friction?


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## trevskoda (May 28, 2019)

maingate said:


> Many years ago me and the Shift Electrician fitted a new clutch to his Mk 1 Escort in the Fitting Shop at work one weekend. We got it all back together but the clutch was not operating when he tried it (it was still on the ramps in the Shop. I lay under the front of the car with a torch and thought I had found the problem and shouted for him to stamp on the clutch pedal (the cable had not seated properly). He stamped on the clutch pedal ... the ramps shot one way and the car shot out of the Fitting Shop in reverse. :raofl:
> 
> Luckily I was unhurt and the car got through the double doors OK.



Surly if you stamped and opened the clutch she would not be in drive,unless of course it was not adjusted at that point,silly billy.


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## trevskoda (May 28, 2019)

runnach said:


> Hmmm, hairy, are you not being a tad harsh and disrespectful to members with your abrasive replies?



Born on a sheet of sand paper,tough lad,hence the rubbing of folk up the wrong way.:lol-049:


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## Stanski (May 28, 2019)

*Whats the latest news?*

Over to you Clungapyears - what happened over the weekend?


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## trevskoda (May 28, 2019)

runnach said:


> Rubbed up and now rubbed oot!



All h/dogs posts have gone,what happened.:rulez::hammer:


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## harrow (May 28, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> All h/dogs posts have gone,what happened.:rulez::hammer:



did you send the boys round ?


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## maingate (May 28, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Surly if you stamped and opened the clutch she would not be in drive,unless of course it was not adjusted at that point,silly billy.



He put it in reverse (in readiness for driving off the ramps) but nothing happened and it was still in gear when I told him to stamp on the clutch pedal. My instruction certainly rectified the problem.


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## caledonia (May 28, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> All h/dogs posts have gone,what happened.:rulez::hammer:



Dummy spat oot maybe?


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## The laird (May 28, 2019)

Think it should be left as it is


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## st3v3 (May 28, 2019)

He's got the boot I recon....


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## caledonia (May 28, 2019)

Not a good situation to be in stranded abroad.


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## Clunegapyears (May 29, 2019)

Thanks guys (and gals). ‘‘Tis I, katherine, that is on here. James normally has his nose in a book!

On Friday we were asked to pop into the garage. I explained that it is 2 hrs away,  my French is not technical and the Corsican’s have a strong accent, so they agreed to get an email over to me with what exactly the clutch problem was and the repair price. Chased daily. We are STILL waiting. The problem is dealing with RAC Commercials (Fiat Assist UK sub contract), fiat Italy and occasionally Fiat France. We’ve been escalating it, but ...

I did speak to a helpful lady at a a Fiat Professional garage in the UK, who said if the clutch failed due to a burned plate ... our cost with little chance of a goodwill gesture. But if bearings, then a warranty cost.

Have submitted photographic evidence of damage done during the recovery , but no word back on that either.  

We have the hire car and weather generally good, so we’ve been getting out to places we wouldn’t attempt in the MH. Just slightly raised stress levels every time I chase Fiat up. 

Thanks for Fiat Forum tip ... just about to register.


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## trevskoda (May 29, 2019)

Make sure you get the compleat clutch changed and not just the fric/ plate,other wise it will required to come out again very soon,sounds like a case of sorry to say poor driving tec,hope a lesson learned and you are on the road soon.:wave:


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## caledonia (May 29, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Make sure you get the compleat clutch changed and not just the fric/ plate,other wise it will required to come out again very soon,sounds like a case of sorry to say poor driving tec,hope a lesson learned and you are on the road soon.:wave:



Trev no one nowadays fits just a driven plate unless yer a tight wad Irishman I don’t think you can buy just a driven plate in Scotland.


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## mistericeman (May 29, 2019)

caledonia said:


> Trev no one nowadays fits just a driven plate unless yer a tight wad Irishman I don’t think you can buy just a driven plate in Scotland.



And clutch slave cylinder if its one of the ridiculous design ones buried inside the bell housing


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## yeoblade (May 29, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> Thanks guys (and gals). ‘‘Tis I, katherine, that is on here. James normally has his nose in a book!
> 
> On Friday we were asked to pop into the garage. I explained that it is 2 hrs away,  my French is not technical and the Corsican’s have a strong accent, so they agreed to get an email over to me with what exactly the clutch problem was and the repair price. Chased daily. We are STILL waiting. The problem is dealing with RAC Commercials (Fiat Assist UK sub contract), fiat Italy and occasionally Fiat France. We’ve been escalating it, but ...
> 
> ...



With your little hire car I'm sure you're enjoying a great tour of the Island as compensation.

As a heads up the new clutch kit DMF. is around £1,000  plus labour a similar amount again I'd thought, but may be cheap in Corsica. Re Fiat goodwill, I had a Fiat engine blow up @ 70K miles and 3 years ONE month old Van, Yes, one month out of warranty, their goodwill wasn't too forthcoming  not coming to much off the £3.2K bill. But keep at 'em anyway.


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## Clunegapyears (Jun 1, 2019)

Finally got a quote out of the garage end of yesterday. Only taken them over a week! Investigation, remove and replace gearbox, complete clutch kit, some sort of liquid and sleeve?… Just a couple of euros under 1300. But still no information as to when we will get it back
But it is progress!  

Moving location tomorrow ... another campsite chalet so we can explore elsewhere in Corsica. 24C and cloudless today


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## caledonia (Jun 1, 2019)

Reasonable quote. Hopefully the can get their finger out and have you up and running soon.


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## trevskoda (Jun 1, 2019)

Clunegapyears said:


> Finally got a quote out of the garage end of yesterday. Only taken them over a week! Investigation, remove and replace gearbox, complete clutch kit, some sort of liquid and sleeve?… Just a couple of euros under 1300. But still no information as to when we will get it back
> But it is progress!
> 
> Moving location tomorrow ... another campsite chalet so we can explore elsewhere in Corsica. 24C and cloudless today



Back in my day with inline engine ,box of clutch in box on £100 now i know why im poor.


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## Stanski (Jun 1, 2019)

*Clutch costs*

Can understand your sentiments Trevskoda, have done clutches on many family cars over the years, only ever charged cost of parts and accepted all the teas provided with the odd sandwich.
Went all the way to Yarmouth 1 day for a motor-race and clutch blew in first heat on first corner - drove all the way home as I had not got the parts to change it - ho hum.

Going back to the OP problem - is the costing just for parts and the investigation to date?  I would agree with Yeoblade the expected cost for a clutch would be nearer 2000.  As an example I went into Landrover only in January on behalf of a relative to see how much they wanted for Landrover 2 Clutch replacement = £2150.  Gave the job to a mechanic friend as I was getting away to spain and paid half.

All in all - good luck with the repair Clunegapyears - may see you around italy in a few weeks time.


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## yeoblade (Jun 1, 2019)

No mention specifically of replacing the Dual Mass Flywheel in the quote ? I would assume this model does has a DMF and they are a wear part. I think you should ask the garage. (dunno what it is in french ), or embrayage à double masse, peut-être


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## colinm (Jun 1, 2019)

yeoblade said:


> No mention specifically of replacing the Dual Mass Flywheel in the quote ? I would assume this model does has a DMF and they are a wear part. I think you should ask the garage. (dunno what it is in french ), or embrayage à double masse, peut-être



Depends on if it's euro6 or not, prior to that the 2.3 engines don't have DMF.


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## Stanski (Jun 13, 2019)

*How's the clutch?*

What has been done?


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## Clunegapyears (Jun 13, 2019)

Thank you for asking. It only took 16 nights for it to get back to us!  Corsica!!!
We are finding the clutch very light to use and are watching each other’s feet to make sure we are not resting our left foot!   
The main thing is that we are both so delighted to be back in and in our home.
The whole clutch kit was replaced. And when I checked it was the plate had burnt out. Too much riding the clutch on all the hills we opt to do, I guess. 
Just got to wait for the pay and claim on the accommodation… Minimum 60 days for overseas claims. Waiting to see if they argue about the amount of nights. I think we will have something to respond to that! And also we have a claim for the damage that was done by the low loader trying to pull a certain angle.
All this out when admin work interfering with our lives. 
Thank you all for the mechanical advice.


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## The laird (Jun 13, 2019)

Glad you are sorted now


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## trevskoda (Jun 13, 2019)

Good you are sorted,just remember when driving rest the left foot to the side and never control the forward speed with the clutch,in shift gear and out as fast as pos,when moving of give the engine a little rev then release throttle and catch the engine with the clutch on decending revs as there is less torque.
Hope the rest of your trip and homeward bound is blessed with no trouble ,regards trev.:wave:


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## QFour (Jun 15, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Good you are sorted,just remember when driving rest the left foot to the side and never control the forward speed with the clutch,in shift gear and out as fast as pos,when moving of give the engine a little rev then release throttle and catch the engine with the clutch on decending revs as there is less torque.
> Hope the rest of your trip and homeward bound is blessed with no trouble ,regards trev.:wave:



Sounds very archaic having 3 pedals to play with. Find it much easier with two  .. Especially in France with all their roundabouts.

..


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## trevskoda (Jun 15, 2019)

QFour said:


> Sounds very archaic having 3 pedals to play with. Find it much easier with two  .. Especially in France with all their roundabouts.
> 
> ..



Autos use more fuel,lazy mans outfit .:drive:


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## maingate (Jun 15, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Good you are sorted,just remember when driving rest the left foot to the side and never control the forward speed with the clutch,in shift gear and out as fast as pos,when moving of give the engine a little rev then release throttle and catch the engine with the clutch on decending revs as there is less torque.
> Hope the rest of your trip and homeward bound is blessed with no trouble ,regards trev.:wave:



I cannot understand why so many people hold a vehicle on the Clutch for longish periods ... especially on a Ducato which has a Clutch made out of Cheese.  I had a Ducato 2.8 jtd on a 5 Ton Tag Axle van and I treated that Clutch like it was Royalty. It still had the original Clutch but I have wondered how the new owner drove it, I expect holding it on a hill would burn the Clutch plate out very quickly.


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## mistericeman (Jun 15, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Autos use more fuel,lazy mans outfit .:drive:



Used to be the case.... BUT a lot of modern 6 or 8 speed autos are now capable of better fuel economy than the equivalent manual box... 

A nice auto is also a far nicer driving experience IMHO for most vehicles (obviously not a sporty little back road thrasher)
Especially in heavy traffic etc 

Days of clunky 3 speed autos are long gone.... Thankfully


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## caledonia (Jun 15, 2019)

mistericeman said:


> Used to be the case.... BUT a lot of modern 6 or 8 speed autos are now capable of better fuel economy than the equivalent manual box...
> 
> A nice auto is also a far nicer driving experience IMHO for most vehicles (obviously not a sporty little back road thrasher)
> Especially in heavy traffic etc
> ...



Totally agree. Why manufacturers still make manual vehicles is beyond me. You won’t find many modern trucks with a manual box these days.


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## QFour (Jun 15, 2019)

trevskoda said:


> Autos use more fuel,lazy mans outfit .:drive:



You are a little bit behind the times. We also have a Toyota Hybrid which is brilliant for driving round our local roads at 20mph. Try that with a manual box and you will be in 2nd or 3rd. The Fiat auto box is just a manual box changed by computer. It does have it's quirks but on the whole it's great. Far better than keep changing up and down the box with that manual twiddly thing and heavy third pedal

..


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## trevskoda (Jun 15, 2019)

QFour said:


> You are a little bit behind the times. We also have a Toyota Hybrid which is brilliant for driving round our local roads at 20mph. Try that with a manual box and you will be in 2nd or 3rd. The Fiat auto box is just a manual box changed by computer. It does have it's quirks but on the whole it's great. Far better than keep changing up and down the box with that manual twiddly thing and heavy third pedal
> 
> ..



I still like my old toys,besides i know little about things post ww2.:scared:


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## tidewatcher (Jun 23, 2019)

*Lightfoot*

I have been following this thread with interest, changed our trusty old 1999 Bessacar 1.9 for a 2009 Timberland 2.3. The first thing I noticed was how light the clutch was and how sensitive the throttle was on initial opening, it was extremely easy to have the revs too high resulting in clutch riding and a non too smooth start. OK practice has made it easier but even so it can catch you out. Bear in mind I have been driving for over fifty years and spent some time in the motor trade driving numerous vehicles of different types and sizes. Anybody else find this or is it just me.......


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## caledonia (Jun 23, 2019)

tidewatcher said:


> I have been following this thread with interest, changed our trusty old 1999 Bessacar 1.9 for a 2009 Timberland 2.3. The first thing I noticed was how light the clutch was and how sensitive the throttle was on initial opening, it was extremely easy to have the revs too high resulting in clutch riding and a non too smooth start. OK practice has made it easier but even so it can catch you out. Bear in mind I have been driving for over fifty years and spent some time in the motor trade driving numerous vehicles of different types and sizes. Anybody else find this or is it just me.......



It’s just you!


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## tidewatcher (Jun 23, 2019)

*Right foot*

Bless you Cale! It's just on a previous entry it was mentioned to give some revs the take your foot off the throttle and catch the lunch as the revs drop to minimise initial torque loading. I do find the throttle very sensitive on the  very first part of the pedal travel and just wondered if it was normal and if not adjustable. All other parts of the throttle operation are fine. Maybe I just need to refine my footwear.......


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## tidewatcher (Jun 23, 2019)

*Predictive chaos*

Clutch not lunch. Nurse, the screens!


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## caledonia (Jun 23, 2019)

tidewatcher said:


> Bless you Cale! It's just on a previous entry it was mentioned to give some revs the take your foot off the throttle and catch the lunch as the revs drop to minimise initial torque loading. I do find the throttle very sensitive on the  very first part of the pedal travel and just wondered if it was normal and if not adjustable. All other parts of the throttle operation are fine. Maybe I just need to refine my footwear.......



Probably just a characteristic of that vehicle and will take a while to get used to it.


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## yeoblade (Jun 23, 2019)

I Prefered  'Lunch'

I think the clutch on my Fiat X250 2.3 2012 is very light to operate (and steering) in comparison to my new Renault van.

 I particularly remember changing from the 2004 fiat I had to this one and recalling how light both the clutch and gearbox shift was.


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## trevskoda (Jun 23, 2019)

tidewatcher said:


> Bless you Cale! It's just on a previous entry it was mentioned to give some revs the take your foot off the throttle and catch the lunch as the revs drop to minimise initial torque loading. I do find the throttle very sensitive on the  very first part of the pedal travel and just wondered if it was normal and if not adjustable. All other parts of the throttle operation are fine. Maybe I just need to refine my footwear.......



My little car is the same and only bites at last inch,i thought its required adjustment ,but no and have been told they have a very small finger diaphram which makes it thus,not nice in traffic along with the high revving 16 valve short stroke engine,but its what the boy racers hick deads want im told.:hammer:


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