# High visibility clothing, compulsory for motorcyclists in france too



## yeoblade (Aug 18, 2018)

Didn't realise this but just like a car you must carry Hi Viz on yer motorbike, ready to put on if broken down, and pillion.
11 euro fine if spot checked and 135 € if not wearing it when needed !
Something else to buy and carry..........


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## trixie88 (Aug 19, 2018)

i think high viz jackets.vests should be compulsory here also.....and especially cyclists should wear one all the ime time when on the bike........some of them lend into the background that you are almost upon them before you see them.........also carrying a warning triangle  makes sense and first aid kit should be compulsory......


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## trevskoda (Aug 19, 2018)

trixie88 said:


> i think high viz jackets.vests should be compulsory here also.....and especially cyclists should wear one all the ime time when on the bike........some of them lend into the background that you are almost upon them before you see them.........also carrying a warning triangle  makes sense and first aid kit should be compulsory......



Not forgetting a fire extinguisher and mobile ph.


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## izwozral (Aug 19, 2018)

And waste tanks.


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## Nabsim (Aug 19, 2018)

Sounds like they are trying to get us Brits away from our beloved black leather and into their penchant for fluorescent coloured nylon bike gear Yeo.

Must admit I did get a real bright pink and white bike jacket bucket in the 90’s, Fieldsheer I think and loved it. Put it on over leathers if it was cold or wore as a casual jacket when we w3re camped up 

Don’t mention cyclists, I had a road rage incident on the way up on Friday, feckin idiots lucky one west hurt.


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## runnach (Aug 19, 2018)

Lots of research done re people seeing various colours and all is not what it seems. How we scan etc

Recent years have seen running lights on bikes ,yet every car manufacturer seems to have followed suit so any advantage negated

Channa


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## trevskoda (Aug 19, 2018)

I do think by law all folk out at night walking ,on bikes etc should wear a floresent band round wast or arms/leg etc,many old country folk walk around late at night here and many have been knocked down due to them insisting on wearing old time dark suits which you dont pick up until to late,why should driver bear the brunt for there folly.


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## Borders2 (Aug 19, 2018)

Most modern cycling kit incorporates reflective seams at least if not more. My front light powered by a Son hub dynmo  makes motorists dip.  My rear light is over god knows what lumens but trust me it flashes red across a normal 15ft rd. 

As we all should know it's impossible to legislate for idiots. 

B2


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## alwaysared (Aug 19, 2018)

Nabsim said:


> Sounds like they are trying to get us Brits away from our beloved black leather and into their penchant for fluorescent coloured nylon bike gear Yeo.



You only have to wear it if you breakdown, they tried to introduce the compulsary wearing of them for bikers a couple of years ago but when the French bikers protested it was changed to having to carry one incase of breakdowns etc. instead. 

Regards,
Del


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## Tompa (Aug 19, 2018)

trixie88 said:


> i think high viz jackets.vests should be compulsory here also.....and especially cyclists should wear one all the ime time when on the bike........some of them lend into the background that you are almost upon them before you see them.........also carrying a warning triangle  makes sense and first aid kit should be compulsory......



Where do you put all that on a bike if you haven,t got a top box?


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## trevskoda (Aug 19, 2018)

Borders2 said:


> Most modern cycling kit incorporates reflective seams at least if not more. My front light powered by a Son hub dynmo  makes motorists dip.  My rear light is over god knows what lumens but trust me it flashes red across a normal 15ft rd.
> 
> As we all should know it's impossible to legislate for idiots.
> 
> B2



Good lad,dynos went out with nelsons eye,not ment to have flashing red at rear ,but i think its very good to be honest.


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## trevskoda (Aug 19, 2018)

Borders2 said:


> Most modern cycling kit incorporates reflective seams at least if not more. My front light powered by a Son hub dynmo  makes motorists dip.  My rear light is over god knows what lumens but trust me it flashes red across a normal 15ft rd.
> 
> As we all should know it's impossible to legislate for idiots.
> 
> B2



Legislate for idiots,feck have the country here would be under lock & key.:scared:


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## Deleted member 52918 (Aug 19, 2018)

A top box on a m/bike is no big deal, but I think all two wheeled users should be wearing florescent jackets anyway.

When I was doing my M/C test, I was taught by an ex White helmets display team member, who at that time trained the police bikers, he told me why I should always wear florescent clothing.
He said imagine you're driving a car on a country road at night, you drive down a long straight towards oncoming car lights & feel a bump, it could be an animal OR it could be a black clad biker lying in the road after an accident!

I also think that cyclists should have a registration plate on their bikes to stop them running red lights & damaging car mirrors, it should be compulsory to have flashing lights front & rear to aid visibility.

I treat cyclists & other vulnerable road users with the same care that they show for they're self preservation, if they wear bright gear & are riding/walking sensibly, then I do everything I can to pass them safely but if they don't give a damn for they're safety, why the hell should I!!

Phill


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## barryd (Aug 19, 2018)

I think flashing lights are a bad idea.  They are a distraction a bit like people who run fog lights when its not foggy.


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## Deleted member 52918 (Aug 19, 2018)

barryd said:


> I think flashing lights are a bad idea.  They are a distraction a bit like people who run fog lights when its not foggy.


Yes they are a distraction but in this case, a good one!

It really annoys me when people expect to be seen while they look like the landscape!!

Phill


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## trevskoda (Aug 19, 2018)

New regs just in.
I would have my work cut out on some roads here


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## Deleted member 68397 (Aug 19, 2018)

*Under your seat?*

If you only need it when broken down, under your seat?
I agree with the need to use it when broken down, at least we dont need to carry a full triangle etc.
As for visibility when riding, if a motorist fails to see a biker with often twin headlights on or daylight running lights, the hi vis vest is not the issue, it's the fact the motorist is still allowed to drive with that poor eyesight.
Maybe some enterprising company should manufacture hi vis badges or back patches for the bike fraternity.
A lot of the Cordura, textile jackets have Hi vis but nothing for those like ourselves who prefer leather protective gear.
I appreciate this is a MH oriented forum, my apologies for going of piste.

Slainte, Growlie.


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## trixie88 (Aug 19, 2018)

:juggle:





Tompa said:


> Where do you put all that on a bike if you haven,t got a top box?[/QUOTE
> 
> 
> sorry tompa...i was thinking more of a car when mentioning warning triangle and first aid box.....however,
> ...


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## Fazerloz (Aug 19, 2018)

The legislation around reflective vests is written in a very motorcycle unfriendly way, stating that the vest must be in reach of the rider and pillion from the seat of the motorcycle. So in theory, you cannot get off your motorcycle to retrieve the vest. The best advice, either wear your hi vis vest while riding in France or put it in your tank bag. If you have a pillion, you will also need a vest for them.
You now have to wear CE approved gloves as well.
Its worse in Belgium for rules.


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## landoboguy (Aug 19, 2018)

I always wear my hi vis when riding, I just customise it from these guys Hi Vis Workwear with Custom Printing and Embroidery - Hi Vis
Had a pic of my MH on the last hi vis one with my other bike is a Motor home


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## barryd (Aug 19, 2018)

To be honest I dont worry too much about getting knocked off the scooter in France.  Firstly the roads mainly where we go are quieter but I find the French drivers and most of mainland Europe much more bike aware and considerate.  I do about 4000 miles each summer on the scooter and this year we decided to have 5 weeks in Flamborough in Yorkshire.  Every single journey just about anywhere be it Bridlington, Filey, Scarborough or Whitby involved a near death experience.  The standard of driving and observation is just shocking.  I even had a road rage incident in Bridlington where they seem to have carved up the entire town centres roads.  Traffic lights I filtered to the front as you do on a scooter and this bloke at the front went ape sh1t.  Screeching his wheels and blaring his horn in an effort to get ahead and put himself, us and everyone at risk.  Im not sure a high viz jacket or even a bloke running in front with a red flag would make much difference to be honest.


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## alwaysared (Aug 19, 2018)

time4t said:


> A top box on a m/bike is no big deal, but I think all two wheeled users should be wearing florescent jackets anyway.
> Phill



Or just teach car drivers to open their eyes! Why should I be told what to wear on my motorbike?
But I do have an idea, why don't we put two wheels at the back instead of one, that should stop us falling off and while we're at it we could put two wheels at the front, that way the car drivers will think we're one of them and they'll see us!
Anyone who wants to wear an Hi-Vis should wear one, but please don't tell me I have to wear one.



Regards,
Del


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## Byronic (Aug 19, 2018)

That's what we need more laws more regulation more enforcement.
Then I can just hear the complaints "boohoo I forgot my fluorescent
jacket got a £100 fine, who makes these petty laws up! 
Advice, information who can argue with that, take it if it makes sense to you
just let the rest make their own decisions. It's the price you pay for freedom.


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## runnach (Aug 19, 2018)

Wearing bright clothing , daylights are not the problem it is a bit of make belief.?

The science behind it all is saccadic masking the way we observe as humans, it is believed it gets worse as we get older.IT IS a trait of the human species nothing to do with groups of road users

YouTube

A short road safety video that explains

Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 19, 2018)

The Fire Brigade vehicles are painted red. Not the preferred colour to
be better seen under many lighting conditions. But certain shades of yellow are.
The Spanish Brigades and others are yellow.
Bring in a law, change them!


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## alwaysared (Aug 19, 2018)

channa said:


> Wearing bright clothing , daylights are not the problem it is a bit of make belief.?
> 
> The science behind it all is saccadic masking the way we observe as humans, it is believed it gets worse as we get older.IT IS a trait of the human species nothing to do with groups of road users
> 
> ...



So that's why they see us until we get on the bike!

Regards,
Del


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## runnach (Aug 19, 2018)

alwaysared said:


> So that's why they see us until we get on the bike!
> 
> Regards,
> Del



Nicely prove my point ! the only accident shown was when a bike was moving at speed which is the saccadic part.

So no bright clothing headlamps will save us but perhaps educating folk in the link I provided will ! Authority not for the first time is barking up the wrong tree

Saccidic masking is not a new idea part of the reason aircraft dashboards are laid out the way they are and pilots taught how to scan properly so no important info is ignored same applies on landings and take offs too I am told

Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 19, 2018)

Own up who wears a fluoro. jacket with POLITEinscribed on it 
I'm informed other motorists tend to notice you then, strange I can't think why.
Probably the fairly SAD effect


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## Byronic (Aug 19, 2018)

Cheerful Charlie said:


> Try riding a motorcycle in Spain :lol-049::sad::scared:
> It's actually scary but then the Spanish think it's a good idea to stop on the sliproads to motorways if a car is coming :lol-049::scared::scared:



I don't only try riding a moto in Spain I've actually done it! I think quite a few on this 'ere
forum have, no problems, only scooter kids in towns embarrass me at the lights!

At times, particularly on a light low speed bike when entering a motorway 
from a slip road it can be the safest option to stop short on the
slip lane, because to force your self into a full nearside lane would be
suicidal, and it's illegal to take to the hard shoulder.
I'm not ashamed to admit I've had to take this evasive action on
the A12, a motorway in all but name. Never occurred on my 650.


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## Deleted member 52918 (Aug 19, 2018)

In the end it comes down to personal choice so if the choice is made by an individual to not bother with their own safety, then those same individuals shouldn't be surprised if something unfortunate happens to them.

When I'm driving a vehicle I look for everyone else who is using the road, same as all drivers should, when I used to ride a m/cycle, I'd pay more attention to cars etc., & when cycling or walking on the roads, I get the feeling that everyone wants to kill me but, since I started wearing bright gear, no not Lycra, (if I wore Lycra I'd probably cause loads of accidents) I've noticed that most people give me more room when they pass.

All I do is wear an orange vest over my clothes, it's no big deal.

Phill


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## Byronic (Aug 19, 2018)

Would the wearing a burqa (helmet under), with a cardboard cutout of an AK 47
stuck diagonally across your motorbike front get you noticed ?


Yes I know, by the police!


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## Fazerloz (Aug 19, 2018)

I don't know which Spain you have ridden in Charlie, but it's not the same Spain as me.


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## barryd (Aug 19, 2018)

Ive ridden in Spain without any problems.  The only place where you really need your wits about you ive found is big cities but that applies everywhere and around places like Nice and Monaco.   The problem there though is other bikes.  There seems to be a fashion on the busier parts of the Cote D'Azur of humongous powerful scooters the size of Harleys that just belt around all day long so you need eyes in the back of your head as well as left right and forward.  I love it though, bit of a buzz.  It all seems to work though and ive never seen an incident.  Cars just seem to accept that the scooters rule the road down there and actively get out of the way.  Stick yer leg out to say thanks and everybody is happy.


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## runnach (Aug 19, 2018)

I have only ridden on the Spanish islands and it was pretty non eventful bar one wheelie that left the wife stood in the middle of the road (not used to scooters)

I rode twice to the cote d azur and south west(solo) on the fazer and France I found easy. my theory so many youngsters / kids on mobylette scooters whatever they can lay their hands on motorists are more aware.

Channa


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## peter palance (Aug 20, 2018)

*may beeee*



Tompa said:


> Where do you put all that on a bike if you haven,t got a top box?



on your back! .pj


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## Fazerloz (Aug 20, 2018)

Anyone who wants a bit of excitement on two wheels needs to try keeping up with locals during rush hour in Rome. Those young girls can teach you a thing or two. Its far more hectic than anything I've ever come across in the rest of Europe. I need to try the far east.


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## Byronic (Aug 20, 2018)

Cheerful Charlie said:


> Lol my 650 was my low speed bike .
> You must have been lucky as the *******s will try and close any gaps on a motorway they don't like bikes filtering through traffic and it's the cars that stop on the slip roads they'd be getting my boot in their door if they want to play games :mad2:



Is that because you only rode it slowly, and your fast bike was a 50cc moped?

Anyway times have moved on, 650cc will get as fast as 98% will ever go or more likely think they went.
Of the remaining 2%, 1% are serving time, and the other 1% are usually old blokes parking up their micras
or motorhomes  telling me how fast they used to go back in the day when they "used to have a big bike didya not guess" yeah impress me.:lol-049::wave:


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## Byronic (Aug 20, 2018)

Fazerloz said:


> Anyone who wants a bit of excitement on two wheels needs to try keeping up with locals during rush hour in Rome. Those young girls can teach you a thing or two. Its far more hectic than anything I've ever come across in the rest of Europe. I need to try the far east.



You've obviously not tried the frontier crossing Gib to Spain rush hour going home.
Hundreds of scooters all knowing where there going and doing it day in day out means not letting 
anything get in the way, quicker than Marquez....possibly.
Dubai at Ramadan takes some beating, no dinner, all that lightheadeness!
Not the quantity of riders just the quality.


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## trevskoda (Aug 20, 2018)

alwaysared said:


> Or just teach car drivers to open their eyes! Why should I be told what to wear on my motorbike?
> But I do have an idea, why don't we put two wheels at the back instead of one, that should stop us falling off and while we're at it we could put two wheels at the front, that way the car drivers will think we're one of them and they'll see us!
> Anyone who wants to wear an Hi-Vis should wear one, but please don't tell me I have to wear one.
> 
> ...



So you dont wear a seat belt in the wagon then.:hammer:


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## trevskoda (Aug 20, 2018)

Cheerful Charlie said:


> Try riding a motorcycle in Spain :lol-049::sad::scared:
> It's actually scary but then the Spanish think it's a good idea to stop on the sliproads to motorways if a car is coming :lol-049::scared::scared:



Same here which most dont know,if you cannot enter from a slip onto main m/way you must give way or stop,father inlaw had to stop when he could not get on with thick lane of trucks just of the boat so he stopped and a girl thumped into his rear,police done here for careless and told here she should have stopped and f/inlaw  was correct in giving way.


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## Byronic (Aug 20, 2018)

trevskoda said:


> Same here which most dont know,if you cannot enter from a slip onto main m/way you must give way or stop,father inlaw had to stop when he could not get on with thick lane of trucks gust of the boat so he stopped and a girl thumped into his rear,police done here for careless and told here she should have stoped and f/inlaw  was correct in giving way.



Precisely my point Trev Post#30. If your route is blocked, stop. When it
happened to me on a lower powered m'bike I just pulled to the side, those behind
just went by, and they had to stop and wait for a while. I only got moving again
by taking the hard shoulder to get up to "speed" lol either that or wait for midnight!
Quick shoulder checks for the law of course.


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## Fazerloz (Aug 20, 2018)

Byronic said:


> You've obviously not tried the frontier crossing Gib to Spain rush hour going home.
> Hundreds of scooters all knowing where there going and doing it day in day out means not letting
> anything get in the way, quicker than Marquez....possibly.



Oh yes I have.


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## yeoblade (Aug 20, 2018)

Fazerloz said:


> Anyone who wants a bit of excitement on two wheels needs to try keeping up with locals during rush hour in Rome. Those young girls can teach you a thing or two. Its far more hectic than anything I've ever come across in the rest of Europe. *I need to try the far east.*



I go to Thailand most years and they ride the scooters with the girl on the back, side saddle and she is on Facebook.
Mind you a lot of bare flesh to get gravel rash, though I've not seen an off yet.


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## Fazerloz (Aug 20, 2018)

yeoblade said:


> I go to Thailand most years and they ride the scooters with the girl on the back, side saddle and she is on Facebook.
> Mind you a lot of bare flesh to get gravel rash, though I've not seen an off yet.



The girls on the front are on facebook in Rome. :scooter:


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## yeoblade (Aug 20, 2018)

trevskoda said:


> Same here which most dont know,if you cannot enter from a slip onto main m/way you must give way or stop,father inlaw had to stop when he could not get on with thick lane of trucks gust of the boat so he stopped and a girl thumped into his rear,police done here for careless and told here she should have stoped and f/inlaw  was correct in giving way.



There a couple of slip roads leading onto the A303 dual carriage near me which I have seen a few accidents on and almost got hit my self because joining traffic WONT stop, when both lanes a full with summer traffic merging slip traffic needs to be a lot more careful, but they aren't.


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## Byronic (Aug 20, 2018)

I quite like the Far East emphasis on comfort rather than safety, example; the heel and 
toe gear lever so much nicer when wearing flip flops, helps prevent the big toe developing
a blister.lol


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## Fazerloz (Aug 20, 2018)

One thing I did pick up in Rome was setting off from traffic lights just using one hand. It feels so strange but they all do it because they have their phones and are using them in their left hands. Very few ride anything with a clutch, and do lock to lock turns between cars and buses, picking their way through traffic with great speed. 
Anyway I was impressed, but they are brought up with it and the car drivers just get on with it and don't get angry.  I thought Rome would be all horns and shouting but there was none of it.


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## Fazerloz (Aug 20, 2018)

Byronic said:


> I quite like the Far East emphasis on comfort rather than safety, example; the heel and
> toe gear lever so much nicer when wearing flip flops, helps prevent the big toe developing
> a blister.lol


Must say I like mine now I am fully used to it and don't have to think about it.


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## Byronic (Aug 20, 2018)

Fazerloz said:


> Must say I like mine now I am fully used to it and don't have to think about it.



The heel and toe shift or a blister, or both?


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## alwaysared (Aug 20, 2018)

trevskoda said:


> So you dont wear a seat belt in the wagon then.:hammer:



Of course and an helmet on the bike, although I didn't for 8 years in Florida and survived, when my time comes it won't matter what I'm wearing or not wearing. Back to the hi-vis, maybe we could make a law that all vehicles are painted yellow and that would eliminate  the need for the Hi-Vis. I'm just saying some laws are useful and others are silly, there are very good stats to show why the wearing of a seatbelt (and helmet on the bike) are sensible, how many accidents have actually been prevented by wearing a hi-vis jacket on a motorbike? As Channa pointed out the motorists are not going to see you anyway, the headlight on in the day is compulsary but guess what? People still don't see you. If I had a pound for every time somone has pulled out in front of me in the last forty odd years I'd be driving a Dethleffs like Wully :lol-049:

Regards,
Del


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## Porkie yorkies (Aug 21, 2018)

*Leathers*



Nabsim said:


> Sounds like they are trying to get us Brits away from our beloved black leather and into their penchant for fluorescent coloured nylon bike gear Yeo.
> 
> Must admit I did get a real bright pink and white bike jacket bucket in the 90’s, Fieldsheer I think and loved it. Put it on over leathers if it was cold or wore as a casual jacket when we w3re camped up
> 
> Don’t mention cyclists, I had a road rage incident on the way up on Friday, feckin idiots lucky one west hurt.



Please don't tell me they were a copy of them crap ones that foggy wore :scared::scared:


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## Porkie yorkies (Aug 21, 2018)

*Re, packing for a bike trip*

I used to take everything that has been suggested on the safety front plus more clothes than I really needed.
No top box,no panniers just a little storage on the bike for tools, everything else in separate bin liners in a sailors waterproof rollsack
Problems solved, p.s. inflatable warning triangle


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## Fazerloz (Aug 21, 2018)

Porkie yorkies said:


> I used to take everything that has been suggested on the safety front plus more clothes than I really needed.
> No top box,no panniers just a little storage on the bike for tools, everything else in separate bin liners in a sailors waterproof rollsack
> Problems solved, p.s. inflatable warning triangle



That wasn't a warning triangle.


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## Byronic (Aug 21, 2018)

Porkie yorkies said:


> I used to take everything that has been suggested on the safety front plus more clothes than I really needed.
> No top box,no panniers just a little storage on the bike for tools, everything else in separate bin liners in a sailors waterproof rollsack
> Problems solved, p.s. inflatable warning triangle &#55357;&#56397;



Not compulsory but what about a tape measure, you'll need one to ensure that the inflatable
triangle is at least 45metres away in the event of....etc.
Unless you do you're unnecessarily running the risk of a "gotcha you're nicked". :lol-061:


When will it ever end, I'm thinking of carrying a pumped up shapely naked inflatable woman on the back of my
bike, that'll grab the attention of other motorists I'm sure, even some of the women drivers.


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## runnach (Aug 21, 2018)

Byronic said:


> Own up who wears a fluoro. jacket with POLITEinscribed on it
> I'm informed other motorists tend to notice you then, strange I can't think why.
> Probably the fairly SAD effect



A subject of many ridicules on the forums ...wannabe coppers and all the rest of it (only printed on the back but hey ho)

I don't own one nor want too, However I have a proper hi viz jacket which doubled up nicely getting into work elf and safety . I also have an ex paramedics waterproof jacket (no lettering)

Did I feel safer ? no ! let me explain why.

Previous to Maureen the moped (sports bike) I owned a pan European and before that a BMW RT 1150 both of which the police use albeit in white with flashing lights and stripes.

Often behind motorists they spotted you and would either drive like nuns or panick and become unpredictable or more unpredictable than normal.

My point is the so called safety gear can and does work against you at times 

Channa


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## Byronic (Aug 21, 2018)

channa said:


> Often behind motorists they spotted you and would either drive like nuns or panick and become unpredictable or more unpredictable than normal.
> 
> Channa



Do you know that would suit me, at least I would be prepared to keep well away from anyone 
I spotted driving like a nun or with unpredictably, I would assume it was the sight of me that was the cause 
of their nun like driving or unpredictability. :lol-061:

That makes sense doesn't it? lol.

Forewarned is forearmed.


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## Deleted member 68397 (Aug 21, 2018)

*Saccadic not a bad idea?*

Channa has the right idea, sack a few dicks in the strategic departments would solve a few problems and keep costs down.


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## Deleted member 52918 (Aug 21, 2018)

People can say what they want but the fact remains that if you drive, ride, walk on a road at night with no lights, no hi viz, earphones in both ears, car stereo volume up high.

You will get hit by another road user sooner rather than later!

The paramedics won't like you, the police will say it was self inflicted & the courts will take into account any contributory factors.

Most people look favourably on those who do everything they can to be safe, this does not include stupid suggestions like wearing a suit of steel armour, flashing hazard lights on helmets etc., 

But in the end it's up to the individual & they shouldn't be surprised when they get treated differently to those who put safety first!

Phill

Ps., It's about time that driving lessons included teaching people to actually look each way properly & to actually see what's there!


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## Fazerloz (Aug 21, 2018)

Mmmmm flashing lights on helmets now theres a thought. You could have blue ones and they wouldnt be illegal as long as they are not plugged into the bike.


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