# GOOD NEWS on NO OVERNIGHT PARKING



## Deleted member 5816 (Aug 7, 2009)

Dear All,  GOOD NEWS

As you may be aware I have been in contact with ScotlandTranserv whom maintain the Trunk road network in Scotland for the Highland Council regarding the increase in No Overnight Parking signs
here is their reply I am supprised by the outcome   

this is the Email received  


Dear Mr Barker: 

In regards to: No Overnight Parking signs on the trunk road network 

Following the initial correspondence which had been received on the 3rd August 2009, Scotland TranServ has fully investigated the details of your correspondence and is pleased to report our findings which are noted below.

Since your initial correspondence has been received, a detailed investigation has taken place and I am pleased to confirm that the signs are not legally enforcable and act as a detterent to ensure the safety of the travelling public is not compromised with large numbers of traffic potentially leaving and entering onto the trunk road network.        

I trust that I have been able to answer your query sufficiently, however if you have any further questions or wish to report any further information please contact me using the methods shown below.

To report defects please telephone 0800 028 1414, this service is available on a 24 hour basis and is operational 365 days a year.

Alternatively, you may wish to report defects using the web page shown below.    Please note this is only monitored during 9am to 5pm each work day. 

Scotland Transerv - Defect Reporting 

If you have a general enquiry the web address below is available and is checked during 9am to 5pm each work day. 

Scotland Transerv - Contact Details 

In addition to these methods, I can be contacted during 8am to 4pm each work day on the contact details shown below.     Alternatively please phone 0800 032 2520 out with these hours for general enquiries relating to the trunk road.

Regards 

xxxxxxx  xxxxxx

I have withheld the name and referance number but should anyone like a full copy please PM me

Regards

Alf


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## Randonneur (Aug 7, 2009)

Hi Alf,

Thanks for your work in letting us know these signs are'nt legally enforceable. I'm still a bit confused about what they mean by " large numbers of traffic entering or leaving the trunk road network ". 

Some of those laybys I've seen you'd have trouble getting a 6 metre M/home on!.


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## oldiebutgoodie (Aug 7, 2009)

Randonneur said:


> Hi Alf,
> 
> Thanks for your work in letting us know these signs are'nt legally enforceable. I'm still a bit confused about what they mean by " large numbers of traffic entering or leaving the trunk road network ".
> 
> Some of those laybys I've seen you'd have trouble getting a 6 metre M/home on!.



Also some of the roads I saw them on didn't have any other traffic on them for hours when we were up there this last couple of weeks unless you counted the sheep.


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## Deleted member 967 (Aug 7, 2009)

Alf 1 said:


> Dear All,  GOOD NEWS
> 
> As you may be aware I have been in contact with ScotlandTranserv whom maintain the Trunk road network in Scotland for the Highland Council regarding the increase in No Overnight Parking signs
> here is their reply I am supprised by the outcome
> ...



Are you now going to try the Highways Agency for England and their Welsh counterparts.

I am in touch with Natural England regarding the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act (1960) regarding the definition of a caravan. Under that act it is an offence to use a caravan off a designated caravan site, except under certain circumstances.  i.e.The 28 day rule. or as an exempted organisation.

In that it states that a commercial vehicle adapted or constructed for human habitation is a caravan.  So every wagon with a sleepercab is technically a caravan, like a motorhome.

This act is outdated and does not take into account the improvements in design since 1960 where few vehicles had onboard sanitation and water storage tanks.  The Caravan Club still treats motorhomes in their guidance as caravan by instructing members to empty all tanks before going off site for stability.

Natural England are also hot on spacing between units in case of fire, mininum spacing 20ft between units, nothing within 10ft of another unit.  I have pointed out that wagons carrying dangerous and inflamable materials are not parked at least 20ft apart when they are in motorway service areas or lorry parks and the crew are sleeping in the vehicle.  Motorway service areas quote that motorhomes should not park with lorries, because the lorries carry such loads. 

Lorries park up all over, while their crew take rest breaks and they are not hassled by the police.  Motorhome however do not get the same treatment.


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## Deleted member 5816 (Aug 7, 2009)

John I will have a go and quote my email reply can you PM me your contact and I will find time over the weekend to have a go.

Best Regards

Alf


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## messenger 2.5td (Aug 9, 2009)

Hi all,great original thread makes you think this how many of these signs are legally enforcable?What deems their legality?Has anyone ever been prosecuted for ignoring a no overnighting sign or been forced to move on? Anyone have any legal knowledge to throw light on this?Andy


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## mildred (Aug 9, 2009)

John Thompson said:


> I am in touch with Natural England regarding the Caravan Sites and Control of Development Act (1960) regarding the definition of a caravan. Under that act it is an offence to use a caravan off a designated caravan site.



I've just had a look at that act. linky.  The First Schedule would seem to indicate that a site license is not required for less than two nights use if the "site"  has not been used for more than 28 days in the year for that purpose.  So is a lay-by a "site" ? or is it part if the "highway" where one is limited to "passing and re-passing" - never stopping?

Where are the lawyers when we need them?


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## Deleted member 5816 (Aug 9, 2009)

messenger 2.5td said:


> Hi all,great original thread makes you think this how many of these signs are legally enforcable?What deems their legality?Has anyone ever been prosecuted for ignoring a no overnighting sign or been forced to move on? Anyone have any legal knowledge to throw light on this?Andy



*DID you not read the OP post number 1 *it quotes the reply from ScotlandTraserve the maintainers of the roads in the Highlands for the Highland Council.

*your answer is in post 1* the third paragraph

This is a follow on thread for No Overnight Parking.

Alf


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## derekfaeberwick (Aug 9, 2009)

N.B.  The trunk road network.

  These are not looked after by local authorities, lesser roads are. I wonder if the No overnight  parking signs on these roads are binding.


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## Deleted member 5816 (Aug 9, 2009)

I have already raised this point with them when I received the reply 
I am awaiting the answer but they do maintain *all *the roads in the
Highlad Reigon.I will post when I get their reply.



I am begining to wish I had never posted the reply I have had several people
asking if there are laybys to stay for a couple of days big enough to take a large motor home and car trailer.   
I hope next year does not see all the laybys closed and blocked.
It is always the same a few spoil it for the rest of us.

PLEASE be fair.

Alf


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## gazznsam (Aug 10, 2009)

i'm taking my motorhome and trailer around scotland anyway, planned it before i even knew this site existed, so it's not your post that has encouraged us to suddenly start wild camping.

we've toured europe for the past few years, and did 9 months one time staying on one campsite, only because we needed an addresse for a part for the scooter rack that had snapped to be sent out by the maker.

we can not afford to stay on 15 quid a night campsites, we need no facilities, we make our own power from the solar panels, we need a fill of water once a week, and likewise once a week a place to dump the grey tank, and i can find a portaloo every few days to empty the bog.

so i can't justify paying so much for a parking place, some people love campsites, they need club houses, swimming pools, entertainment laid on etc,

others want somewhere miles from anyone, but still want a good mobile phone signal and they must be able to get good TV reception,

some travel all day, stop the night on the side of a road, and are gone before it gets light, 

we would like to see a few nice places whilst we are up here, our motorhome is too big to take into towns easily, it takes up 1 and a half parking spaces when solo, so we took along the car as well this time, 

i can't walk very far, and don't really like to be parked up in the middle of nowhere and just sit and watch the view all day everyday, 

hence the car, park up somewhere out of the way, and use the car to see the sights, get closer to places so i can walk to the attractions, and spread where we spend our money around a bit more, helping out loads of little buisenesses.

if we had to stay on campsites, then that's all we'd do, we'd have no money for food, fuel or sight seeing, and i'm not just saying that, we have just under £15 a day for everything, 

all i wanted to know was if there was a suitable out of the way carpark near fort william that i could park up on for 2 or 3 nights, where i wouldent cause a problem, and be able to use the car to go into fort william and spend money at their shops.

is it just becuase i have a trailer? or would it be alright if i had a 35 foot long american RV with a garage holding the car?


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## Deleted member 5816 (Aug 12, 2009)

*No overnight parking*

It seems the *MAN *that is authorised to reply to our query is on holidy he is due back on monday so a reply may be forthcoming next week.

Alf


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## Guernsey Donkey (Aug 12, 2009)

Hi Alf

Thanks for all your hard work on behalf of us all. We in the Western Isles don't have this problem but in saying that I would ask all who visit the Western Isles to use common sence and not park in a locals back yard (sort of thing) as some try to do because that gets right up peoples noses and makes it bad for other campers to the Islands for years to come.


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