# Gas cheaper



## zipnolan (Dec 2, 2009)

may be of use to some out there, i bought this valve to refill my red gas bottles saving £10 each 13kg bottle so it paid for its self after 3 refills.

LPG PROPANE AUTOGAS RED BOTTLE GAS FILLING ADAPTER GPL on eBay (end time 09-Oct-09 10:13:02 BST)


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 2, 2009)

[​
Incoming!​


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## Kontiki (Dec 2, 2009)

I think its from the same place I got mine from, the first one leaked a bit through the non-return. I contacted them & it was replaced, they also refunded the return postage. I paid the same but have seen them for under £20 .


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## Deleted member 919 (Dec 2, 2009)

Seen quite a few threads on this but would not do it myself (and dont need to as i sell calor) as a risk of overfilling and i think that if the garage saw you filling a valve that was not fixed they would stop you doing it.
Quote
SIMPLE TO USE, CONNECT ADAPTER TO BOTTLE, THEN FILLER GUN, OPEN THE VALVE ON THE BOTTLE, NOW START FILLING, WHEN YOU HAVE REACHED YOU LIMIT, STOP. CLOSE BOTTLE VALVE AND REMOVE FILLER GUN AND ADAPTER.
How do you know when the limit is reached?


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## Kontiki (Dec 2, 2009)

If the bottle is empty then it's quite simple to put the correct amount in, if partially full then you can do it by weighing. Seen abroad where they will refill anything (even a bucket if they could) they seem to fill them up & open the valve until they see vapour coming out (this is dangerous). 
Calor prices are so expensive compared to refilling with autogas.


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## biggirafe (Dec 2, 2009)

rebbyvid said:


> Seen quite a few threads on this but would not do it myself (and dont need to as i sell calor) as a risk of overfilling and i think that if the garage saw you filling a valve that was not fixed they would stop you doing it.
> Quote
> SIMPLE TO USE, CONNECT ADAPTER TO BOTTLE, THEN FILLER GUN, OPEN THE VALVE ON THE BOTTLE, NOW START FILLING, WHEN YOU HAVE REACHED YOU LIMIT, STOP. CLOSE BOTTLE VALVE AND REMOVE FILLER GUN AND ADAPTER.
> How do you know when the limit is reached?



There has been endless discusion about refilling calor bottles and there seems to be 2 camps, those that will and those that won't. Both sides have good reasons and can put forwards a good argument. Personally I'm against doing it myself as it will invalidate my vehicle insurance and also my local LPG garage will not allow it for the same reason, if there was an accident we would not be insured. I have kids and a large investment to protect.

Those on this forum that do it are no doupt competent people but unfortunatley anyone can currently buy these adapters from ebay and some of those people will be the same idiots I have passing me on the motorway pulling caravans at 85 mph or the idiot I once saw lighting a BBQ in an awning using petrol. Its those idiots that frighten me and no ammount of reasoned argument will persuade me those people should be allowed to do this.

Head down incoming


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## peppers (Dec 2, 2009)

zipnolan said:


> may be of use to some out there, i bought this valve to refill my red gas bottles saving £10 each 13kg bottle so it paid for its self after 3 refills.
> 
> LPG PROPANE AUTOGAS RED BOTTLE GAS FILLING ADAPTER GPL on eBay (end time 09-Oct-09 10:13:02 BST)



perfectly safe for anyone blessed with common sense (a rare thing these days)


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## Deleted member 207 (Dec 2, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> There has been endless discusion about refilling calor bottles and there seems to be 2 camps, those that will and those that won't. Both sides have good reasons and can put forwards a good argument. Personally I'm against doing it myself as it will invalidate my vehicle insurance and also my local LPG garage will not allow it for the same reason, if there was an accident we would not be insured. I have kids and a large investment to protect.
> 
> Those on this forum that do it are no doupt competent people but unfortunatley anyone can currently buy these adapters from ebay and some of those people will be the same idiots I have passing me on the motorway pulling caravans at 85 mph or the idiot I once saw lighting a BBQ in an awning using petrol. Its those idiots that frighten me and no ammount of reasoned argument will persuade me those people should be allowed to do this.
> 
> Head down incoming




Darwin's evolutionary laws in practice, 21st Century style.


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## zipnolan (Dec 2, 2009)

may i add .... CARE TO BE TAKEN AT ALL TIMES.
I suppose tha chap that sells calor is totaly against this valve.
wonder why ?
of course filling BBQ's n gas bottles in an awning is very dangerous .... better to get the wife to do it !


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## ajs (Dec 3, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> There has been endless discusion about refilling calor bottles and there seems to be 2 camps, those that will and those that won't. Both sides have good reasons and can put forwards a good argument. Personally I'm against doing it myself as it will invalidate my vehicle insurance and also my local LPG garage will not allow it for the same reason, if there was an accident we would not be insured. I have kids and a large investment to protect.
> 
> Those on this forum that do it are no doupt competent people but unfortunatley anyone can currently buy these adapters from ebay and some of those people will be the same idiots I have passing me on the motorway pulling caravans at 85 mph or the idiot I once saw lighting a BBQ in an awning using petrol. Its those idiots that frighten me and no ammount of reasoned argument will persuade me those people should be allowed to do this.
> 
> Head down incoming


 

you great big wuss 

regards
aj



.. _getting board with this subject.. again..and again__

__...._


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## maingate (Dec 3, 2009)

If 1kg of gas is equal to 2 litres, then I am getting 40 litres of gas for £28, in a bottle (2 actually)

That price is from Energas. They have a main depot near me and I buy direct from them. This will give you an idea of the mark up on bottled gas as I am getting it only slightly above the pump price and I have not paid any money out on new installations.

The only drawback is in the winter when usage is high, I could run out and have to pay full whack.


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 3, 2009)

maingate said:


> The only drawback is in the winter when usage is high, I could run out and have to pay full whack.



  A plus for using re-fillable, ehm, red bottles is that should you run out away from an LPG station, you can bite the bullet and get an exchange.

 Also, you could take the oppotunity to pick a nice new clean bottle!

  Jobs a goodun!


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## John H (Dec 3, 2009)

maingate said:


> If 1kg of gas is equal to 2 litres, then I am getting 40 litres of gas for £28, in a bottle (2 actually)



I don't know much about gas (which is why I let the experts fit my system for me) but I love playing around with figures. Yours show that you are paying 70p a litre. My local garage is selling LPG at the pump for 55p. Thus you are paying £6 more per 40 litres than I am. This further means that it would take around 70 refills for you to pay for the installation I have got. If you refill/exchange once a month then you would pay for my system in about six years. I've no idea where all this gets us but I enjoyed working it out. Happy travels!


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## biggirafe (Dec 3, 2009)

John H said:


> I don't know much about gas (which is why I let the experts fit my system for me) but I love playing around with figures. Yours show that you are paying 70p a litre. My local garage is selling LPG at the pump for 55p. Thus you are paying £6 more per 40 litres than I am. This further means that it would take around 70 refills for you to pay for the installation I have got. If you refill/exchange once a month then you would pay for my system in about six years. I've no idea where all this gets us but I enjoyed working it out. Happy travels!



Where are the energas dealers I want some of this cheap gas


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## ajs (Dec 3, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> Where are the energas dealers I want some of this cheap gas


 

 cost yer 50 squid there and back in fuel longneck 

 regards


aj


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## biggirafe (Dec 4, 2009)

ajs said:


> cost yer 50 squid there and back in fuel longneck
> 
> regards
> 
> ...



Yes thats about my luck at the moment.

I have a price back from FES, they have relented and will sell me the kit direct for a single bottle refillable system.

Fill Point Kit 2  £39.83

27 litre (13kg) Valved tank with remote fill     £146.19 inc vat

Adapter to allow filling in France                   £8.48 inc vat 

Shipping  but expect it to be £12.00 plus vat or less for next working day delivery

Total = £206

Thats not bad. I'm going to order it next week. Should have it fitted before going to Wales. I need to do it now as my bottle is about 1/4 full and it seems pointless spending money on a new bottle.


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## hobenhobo (Dec 5, 2009)

I'm relatively new to campers, so all this discussion regarding filling up of propane bottles is confusing me, am i to understand then that with an adaptor as mentioned i could go into a lpg garage and fill up my empty propane bottle?.Would this (LPG) then work my cooker and fridge etc?


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 5, 2009)

hobenhobo said:


> I'm relatively new to campers, so all this discussion regarding filling up of propane bottles is confusing me, am i to understand then that with an adaptor as mentioned i could go into a lpg garage and fill up my empty propane bottle?.Would this (LPG) then work my cooker and fridge etc?



  That's correct.


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## coventrycraig (Dec 5, 2009)

I didnt know about this neither.

Im up for a bit of that!!!



Craig


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## Norris (Dec 5, 2009)

With regard to refilling gas bottles at a garage, the autogas pumps are set to switch off when they reach the maximum pressure aren't they? I would imagine that the pressure in a gas bottle is about the same as in my gas tank so it doesn't seem a problem.


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## biggirafe (Dec 5, 2009)

Norris said:


> With regard to refilling gas bottles at a garage, the autogas pumps are set to switch off when they reach the maximum pressure aren't they? I would imagine that the pressure in a gas bottle is about the same as in my gas tank so it doesn't seem a problem.



there has been a lot of talk about this, the pump needs to turn off when the bottle is about 80% full. If not you are in danger of liquid propane being pushed out of the valve and through your cooker when you us it
Proper refillable bottles have a float in them that will turn off the inlet valve when required during filling.

yes you can work out how much an empty bottle can take and fill it carefully, its possible but is it worth the risk some will say yes some will say no.


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## NWPT (Dec 5, 2009)

If all continental adaptors can be fitted its definately worth tinking about as its lots cheaper than a fixed tank or Gaslow system.


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## barryd (Dec 6, 2009)

Dont frig around with Gas, thats my opinion.  Pay a man to fit a proper Gaslow system that you and your insurance company can be happy with.

BD


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## biggirafe (Dec 6, 2009)

NWPT said:


> If all continental adaptors can be fitted its definately worth tinking about as its lots cheaper than a fixed tank or Gaslow system.



Thats very debatable. Yes its cheaper but The Adapter on ebay is about £40 with postage, then you need to buy all the euro adapters you need. My fixed tank + remote fill point has cost just over 200 inc delivery and inc euro adapters and if needs be I can still plug it into a standard bottle.

For me it all depends how much value you place on the hastle factor and safety. I'm prepared to believe that its a fairly safe thing for the right person to be doing I am not convinced that its a safe thing for a 'numpty' to be doing. Overfilling a bottle is very dangerous no one has disputed that, there are known instances of overfilled bottles causing fires. Hense you will run into insurance issues and garages that will not let you do this. After filling up I would rather not have any worry.

I believe from earlier threads the same is true in europe, you will be refused at a lot of garages. One chap on here posted that he still carried other bottles and adapters for just such an occasion.

Ok so I have to pay an extra £100 - £150 for a fully usable system thats recognised across europe that I can refil at any LPG garage without any hastle. Thats 2 tanks of diesel in real terms, Personally I don't think the 'saving' is that great or worth it.

You pays your money and takes your choice


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 6, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> For me it all depends how much value you place on the hastle factor and safety. I'm prepared to believe that its a fairly safe thing for the right person to be doing I am not convinced that its a safe thing for a 'numpty' to be doing. Overfilling a bottle is very dangerous no one has disputed that, there are known instances of overfilled bottles causing fires. Hense you will run into insurance issues and garages that will not let you do this. After filling up I would rather not have any worry.



  Sorry, but many of us ,myself included, have disputed that. No more dangerous than filling up with petrol IMHO.


  Derek and


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## biggirafe (Dec 6, 2009)

derekfaeberwick said:


> Sorry, but many of us ,myself included, have disputed that. No more dangerous than filling up with petrol IMHO.
> 
> 
> Derek and



Ah ok, I thought that we all agreed overfilling a bottle was dangerous, ok maybe you can go more than 80%, What happens when you fill a bottle to the top then? In a car you spill some petrol, what would be the result of a bottle overfilling particularly when you come to use it?


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 6, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> Ah ok, I thought that we all agreed overfilling a bottle was dangerous, ok maybe you can go more than 80%, What happens when you fill a bottle to the top then? In a car you spill some petrol, what would be the result of a bottle overfilling particularly when you come to use it?



,

  Oops correct. Too early for the old eyes.


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## biggirafe (Dec 6, 2009)

derekfaeberwick said:


> ,
> 
> Oops correct. Too early for the old eyes.



No worries :0)
I'm not 100% against this as some are but I do believe when new posters ask this question they deserve to hear both sides of the argument 

When I first saw the adapter advertised I though 'fantastic cheap refills' now I'm not so sure, in particular I have now found out they may not be made by a 'company' as such and approved but by a guy who buys the parts and puts them together himself.


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## derekfaeberwick (Dec 6, 2009)

derekfaeberwick said:


> Sorry, but many of us ,myself included, have disputed that. No more dangerous than filling up with petrol IMHO.
> 
> 
> Derek and


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## fugglestick (Dec 6, 2009)

*Hi all, this must be the mad house..... Sorry, wont come in.*

The difference between the Calor bottles and Gaslow is that Gaslow are desingned to be rfilled by you and Calor arent. Also the Gaslow have an overfilling safety valve. Stops you creating a nice reddish splash colour over the nearby wall when you get it wrong...

Nothing about being a wuss here, but just buy a Gaslow bottle  and you can achieve two things.
I have used refillable LPG for 15 years and it can give you two things.. Allows you to enjoy cheap gas, and oh er... stay alive...


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## barryd (Dec 6, 2009)

Plus you get a nice little filler cap on the side of your van just like a petrol filler cap so when you pull up to the LPG pump in any country they just think your filling up with LPG, no questions asked.  In germany we came across two pumps that we didnt have adaptors for but the nice lady came running out with a box full and found us the right one.  I doubt she would have been so helpful if I was pratting about with a bottle on the forecort.

We all like to save a few quid but for a couple of hundred quid to be safe when you spend tens of thousands of pounds on your MH why take the risk of not purchasing a proper system?  I can understand people trying to cut corners with a cheap telly, Solar panel or sat dish but Gas?  Nah.


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## biggirafe (Dec 6, 2009)

What does he think he is going to do with that fire extinguiser
http://www.flickr.com/photos/wrighthouse/3650163492/sizes/m/


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## gunerdoo (Dec 6, 2009)

*LPG Adapter*



zipnolan said:


> may be of use to some out there, i bought this valve to refill my red gas bottles saving £10 each 13kg bottle so it paid for its self after 3 refills.
> 
> LPG PROPANE AUTOGAS RED BOTTLE GAS FILLING ADAPTER GPL on eBay (end time 09-Oct-09 10:13:02 BST)



Hi "THIS ONE" seems to have a release valve on it


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## AndyC (Dec 7, 2009)

gunerdoo said:


> Hi "THIS ONE" seems to have a release valve on it



Not sure what that's supposed to do. I don't see how it can prevent overfilling.

AndyC


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## Kontiki (Dec 7, 2009)

I don't think I like the idea of a pressure relief valve, it says it 'DETECTS IT AND RELEASES PRESSURE' I prefer to work on my own system of weighing the bottle & if anything under filling it slightly. I have a proper refillable bottle (gaslow aren't the only ones who make these) I fitted myself with the filler on a bracket inside the locker. As I only have the one bottle I decided to carry a 6kg red propane bottle as a back up & also for the cadac gas bbq, for this one I have a filling adapter. If the calor was a reasonable price I probably wouldn't bother but at nearly 3 times the cost is some cases it's a bit of a rip off.


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## biggirafe (Dec 7, 2009)

Kontiki said:


> I don't think I like the idea of a pressure relief valve, it says it 'DETECTS IT AND RELEASES PRESSURE' I prefer to work on my own system of weighing the bottle & if anything under filling it slightly. I have a proper refillable bottle (gaslow aren't the only ones who make these) I fitted myself with the filler on a bracket inside the locker. As I only have the one bottle I decided to carry a 6kg red propane bottle as a back up & also for the cadac gas bbq, for this one I have a filling adapter. If the calor was a reasonable price I probably wouldn't bother but at nearly 3 times the cost is some cases it's a bit of a rip off.



No I agree this is just an attempt to convince those who have not done their homework that these things are somehow approved. My concern is that users will just keep filling up until the valve vents. Surely this is more dangerous as the bottle could in theory be nearly full or full at this point 
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/LPG-PROPANE-A...ervan_Caravan_Accessories?hash=item3a5590ce1b
But its up to each of us to make our choice 


I took delivery of my refillable kit today. Nice  It does have a guage on it but its behind the outlet. Mind you not sure how I will see it inside the cupboard anyway so I will be carrying a little 4kg bottle as a backup


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## biggirafe (Dec 9, 2009)

Well for all those considering fitting a refillable gas cylinder themselves I can say its one of the easiest jobs I have done on the motorhome. The kit came as in the post above all I needed to do was drill 3 small holes for the filler point inside the gas cupboard and bolt the hose between the fill point on the cylynder and the filling point that I screwed onto the cupboard wall. Job done Cheap Gas from now onwards. I choose to put the fill point here for a 3 reasons
1. Its easier than drilling a hole in the van
2. You need to open the cupboard to turn off the gas when you fill this will make me
3. When I sell the van I will take it with me to the next van






Filled up at our local LPG station. I've attached a set of POI's for the uk for a TomTom, if you want Europe email me but I got these from POIHandler - POIs like Speedcams, Hotels, Campings for your Navigation System


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## Kontiki (Dec 9, 2009)

As you say its not rocket science if you can use a spanner & drill a couple of holes its a piece of cake. Fitting the filler inside the gas locker is easier & far less daunting than drilling a hole through the van body.

I notice that you have the European adapters there as well, I keep mine in a small plastic container (the type you get vitamins in) with some of the hard foam type of packing to prevent the threads getting damaged. Also a coke   cap fits nicely over the gas filling point to keep the muck out.


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## biggirafe (Dec 9, 2009)

Kontiki said:


> As you say its not rocket science if you can use a spanner & drill a couple of holes its a piece of cake. Fitting the filler inside the gas locker is easier & far less daunting than drilling a hole through the van body.
> 
> I notice that you have the European adapters there as well, I keep mine in a small plastic container (the type you get vitamins in) with some of the hard foam type of packing to prevent the threads getting damaged. Also a coke   cap fits nicely over the gas filling point to keep the muck out.



Thanks I'm happy with the result, It cost me £12 to fill the bottle, not sure what the same is from Calor about £27 maybe.

My kit came with a dust cover, I left it off for the photo 
I like the idea of the little box, I'll do that. Just wondering what else to put in the cupboard now I don't need a second cylinder.

One word of caution for people, check where your wiring looms are, I originally thought about screwing the filler to the top of the cupboard but on checking I found that my wiring loom goes across the top.


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## NWPT (Dec 9, 2009)

@ Biggirafe.

Do you have a link for your refillable kit that you have just fitted?

Regards,

Gary


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## ALLERDALECHEF (Dec 9, 2009)

biggirafe said:


> Thanks I'm happy with the result, It cost me £12 to fill the bottle, not sure what the same is from Calor about £27 maybe.
> 
> looks tidy ,i just lugged a 13kilo into my gas locker .......cost £22, i recon i will need it as im heading to scottyland for a few days on a whisky buying expedition  and the weather is looking great but cold


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## biggirafe (Dec 9, 2009)

NWPT said:


> @ Biggirafe.
> 
> Do you have a link for your refillable kit that you have just fitted?
> 
> ...




Hi Gary
I bought mine from FES Autogas - LPG - Autogas Conversions- Trade only supplier
Their catalogue is here http://www.fesautogas.co.uk/catstp2009.pdf

I purchased the following
Tank 27 Litres
Filling Kit 2 (includes bracket, Pipe and cover etc)
Adapter to use my current regulator
2x Euro adapters


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## NWPT (Dec 9, 2009)

And only down the road


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## biggirafe (Dec 9, 2009)

NWPT said:


> And only down the road



Cool 
I just checked my statement £209 including postage and vat. So if you collect about £198


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## otis the staffy (Dec 9, 2009)

*lpg filling*

hi for the last 5 years have had refillable bottle fitted and used daily cost 43p to 53p per litre in U.K in Europe 50 to 70 cents 35p to 63p.I also invested in a filler for my spare bottle payed £12.20 for 22 litres last Friday had gadget for 4 years COST £30 used 29 times 600 litres for £290 not for numpties i agree but a handy tool for full timers as used here and Europe


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## ajs (Dec 9, 2009)

ALLERDALECHEF said:


> im heading to scottyland for a few days *on a whisky buying expedition * and the weather is looking great but cold


 
let us know when you get back... we will be expecting an invite 


regards 
aj


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