# Teutone's DIY LED lights



## Teutone (Mar 22, 2012)

First thing if you want to improve your battery run time is to eliminate power hungry devices.

LED lights are a good way to save the all so precious AH's of the battery.

I started buying just one LED cluster off EBAY to see how the light colour is and once I was happy I ordered the rest.

First the main ceiling light got some attention. When I took it apart it was looking rather sorry. The two 20W halogen bulbs fitted had melted the sockets 
out of the plastic housing (see the brown plastic in the picture). Makes me wonder how this is deemded "safe"....

With a hot air gun I formed the plastic back in shape and re-attached the sockets. Next was to add two replacement "bulbs" in place of the 20Watt Halogens.
Opted for two LED barrels in warm white.






close up of the new LED "bulbs" 





They will be fine for just a normal light but as Tim the Toolman Taylor says "we need more POWER" :hammer:
so I added a cluster of 48 LED's with a seperate switch to be able to run this independent if we need proper light





little switch I had left over from another project





which means cutting a hole in the lamp. Of course a SQUARE hole again :scared: (did I mention I don't like cutting square holes?)





switch fitted, LED's wired up, ready to go back in the Motorhome. I have used 4 dabs of clear Silicone to glue the LED's cluster down





next I takled the light over the kitchen area. It was fitted with a normal 21W car bulb (like one for your indicator)
Handy to have an old bulb handy otherwise you need to destroy a new one to get hold of the metal socket.
I removed the glass and the rest of the internals and soldered the LED clusters wire to the metal socket. This way I can just connect the LED
cluster like a normal bulb and can revert back anytime I want. 





a few dabs of clear silicone and all was working





with the cover on it looks very good and distributes the light nice and even.





next was the bathroom light. Used some 24 LED clusters to replace the 20W halogen bulbs.
It's the same light fitting as in the living area and was melted the same way.

There is a two stage switch, one LED cluster coming on "1" and on "2" they both light up.
Because the LED's are really bright, I disabled two rows on the first cluster. Otherwise it would just be too bright.

These smaller clusters got much hotter when switched on than the bigger clusters I used in the other lights. Mounted them on some
nylon spacers I had lying around. Will keep an eye on them to see if there is an issue with the heat





For the bunk bed lights I just used the same LED barrels as in the first picture. Just in bright white as I had these left over from my "test purchase"

All done and ALL the LED lights are now consuming what ONE Halogen bulb used to need.

WARNING: Make sure you check the polarity of your sockets and LABEL them. LED's do NOT tolerate to be wired up the wrong way round. Some have devices build in to protect them but other haven't
and the LED's may get damaged. So careful!


----------



## mikeandhismotorhome (Mar 22, 2012)

I did a similar thing but are you aware of the led with the socket already in place?
eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace

I use these as straight swap out replacements from the awning light to the corner spot lights. 

A word of caution though - always go for warm white for mood lighting the standard white is
too harsh for anything other than kitchen and bathroom in my opinion.

Nice tutorial.


----------



## clarkpeacock (Mar 22, 2012)

Thanks for this Teutone.

You have inspired me to try similar so I have ordered some of these to do a few tests.
48 SMD LED Light Panel Bulb 

They seem to come with a selection of adapters at a give away price.  Whether they actually arrive from China remains to be seen!


----------



## Teutone (Mar 22, 2012)

clarkpeacock said:


> Thanks for this Teutone.
> 
> You have inspired me to try similar so I have ordered some of these to do a few tests.
> 48 SMD LED Light Panel Bulb
> ...



I bought at the same place.....:lol-049:

takes a while but they will arrive!


----------



## Teutone (Mar 22, 2012)

mikeandhismotorhome said:


> I did a similar thing but are you aware of the led with the socket already in place?
> eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace
> 
> I use these as straight swap out replacements from the awning light to the corner spot lights.
> ...



Fully agree, only warm white! Even in the bathroom I tool the "cool" white ones out. But there is warm white and warm white.
The "barrels" I've shown are really yellow'ish and I wasn't happy but my wife like them.

Sure there are some with the right fittings available, but I bought some other stuff from this seller and didn't want to order from another place and pay additional postage.

...and I like tinkering in my garage :banana:


----------



## Sparks (Mar 22, 2012)

Post Deleted


----------



## Makzine (Mar 22, 2012)

Very informative post Teutone, thanks I will be looking at mine shortly and now know which way I will be going as regards fittinng new bulbs.:cheers:


----------



## sean rua (Mar 22, 2012)

Yet another brilliant thread!
Thanks, Teutone.


----------



## Teutone (Mar 22, 2012)

Thank you for all the kind words. I am a great believer in sharing experience and hope I can encourage people to get their hands dirty.


----------



## mikeandhismotorhome (Mar 22, 2012)

You have, my MH has concealed lighting above the cupboards which I now intend to 
replace with strips of leds. Just ordered 5m worth, again warm white and self adhesive.
Should be just a question of taking he power away from the fluorescents and connecting
to a strip of leds.
Such fun.


----------



## nij (Mar 22, 2012)

A great thread.

I changed mine recantly, but fitted mine 'under counter'. As there was no existing lighting there I bought a 'strip light', it makes a massive improvement.

eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace


----------



## Beemer (Mar 22, 2012)

I just love leds, have ordered 5 sets to replace existing amp guzzlers. :banana:


----------



## terry111 (Apr 15, 2012)

*LED Driver*

Hi

I was just about to order some LED lights and have seen the suppliers recommend using a "constant voltage LED driver" to ensure bulb longevity and lumen output.

This obviously complicates the change over. Is this really necessary?

Thanks

Terry


----------



## Teutone (Apr 15, 2012)

terry111 said:


> Hi
> 
> I was just about to order some LED lights and have seen the suppliers recommend using a "constant voltage LED driver" to ensure bulb longevity and lumen output.
> 
> ...



Well, do you need a set of tailormade golf clubs to have a nice game? sure it will make a small improvement but is it worth the money?

If my LED's burn out in half of the time the manufacturer claims (don't know exactly but guess some 5000 hrs....) I will just replace them with another one I paid £1.78 for. Taking the cost into consideration what a "safe" and "constant" driver setup will cost, I am sure I have a decade to go just to break even.

LED's have some downsides, they don't like a lot of over current and will just not work if the voltage is too low. but I have run down the battery to well below 10V and they are still lighting up.

There will alwyas be a better (read more costly) way of doing things, you just have to work out where the cost / performance sweet spot is in my opinion.

Take leisure batteries for an example. You can double or triple your cost with ease but will you see the same sort of performance increase?

Sometimes cheaper can be better if you look at things in real life perspective and 90% will just be fine for most of us.


----------



## terry111 (Apr 15, 2012)

Thank you. I'll get on and order some.


----------



## Beemer (Apr 15, 2012)

Teutone said:


> LED's have some downsides, they don't like a lot of over current and will just not work if the voltage is too low. but I have run down the battery to well below 10V and they are still lighting up.



mmm... I have connected a set of double leds to the speaker output on my habitation ICE and they have lit up in time with the music, so this must mean that leds will work with low voltage.


----------



## Teutone (Apr 15, 2012)

Beemer said:


> mmm... I have connected a set of double leds to the speaker output on my habitation ICE and they have lit up in time with the music, so this must mean that leds will work with low voltage.



allmost all LED's are around 2.5volt to 3.5 Volt, for car use on 12Volt there is a resistor somewhere soldered in. Sure some "12 Volt" LED's will light up dimmly with very low voltage as well.


----------



## ian81 (Apr 15, 2012)

terry111 said:


> Hi
> 
> I was just about to order some LED lights and have seen the suppliers recommend using a "constant voltage LED driver" to ensure bulb longevity and lumen output.
> 
> ...


Some LED's supplied have voltage regulators built in but many of the cheaper ones do  not. Generally for wild camping this is not a problem as the battery voltage when used will be running down and probably less than 13v. However if you happen to use EHU regularly the voltage will potentially rise above 14v and this is likely to destroy some or all of the individual LED's as we found out to our cost the other year when we parked for a few days at a friends.


----------



## Teutone (Apr 15, 2012)

ian81 said:


> Some LED's supplied have voltage regulators built in but many of the cheaper ones do  not. Generally for wild camping this is not a problem as the battery voltage when used will be running down and probably less than 13v. However if you happen to use EHU regularly the voltage will potentially rise above 14v and this is likely to destroy some or all of the individual LED's as we found out to our cost the other year when we parked for a few days at a friends.



hmmm, good point. 
Maybe I should give these a try, 12 Volt regulator  @ £0.29 each

eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace


----------



## Beemer (Apr 15, 2012)

Teutone said:


> hmmm, good point.
> Maybe I should give these a try, 12 Volt regulator  @ £0.29 each
> 
> eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace



Know the shop very well.
It is a mine of useful electrical and electronic bits, some of which I have no idea their use !!!

I will take on board the information ian81 has posted about over voltage damaging leds and persue the useful link Teutone has posted with regards to the 12v regs at Bardwells in Sheffield.
Thank you to both of you, this could save me a few hours having to replace leds if operated on EHU. :idea-007:
What a really useful web site this is!


----------



## ian81 (Apr 16, 2012)

Teutone said:


> hmmm, good point.
> Maybe I should give these a try, 12 Volt regulator  @ £0.29 each
> 
> eBay - The UK's Online Marketplace



...this probably won't do the job.

Rather you need to use a low dropout 12v regulator such as the LM2940

Unfortunately the regulator mentioned (7812) have quite a high voltage drop - typically up to 3 Volts. Therefore, to obtain a reliable 12 Volt output voltage, an input of 15V+ is required - more than a 12V battery produces even when under charge. To get around this problem low dropout regulators were developed.

A low dropout regulator supplies a fixed output voltage with a typical voltage drop of just 0.5 Volts. This makes them perfect for use with 12 Volt lead acid batteries. Ideally a lead acid battery should never be allowed to get below 12.6 Volts (40% charge), and so since 12.6 - 0.5 is still over 12 Volts, a low dropout 12V regulator will be able to reliably supply a 12 Volt output whenever the battery has sufficient charge.

above quote from and more information see LM2940 12V 1A Low Dropout Regulator - Electric Circuit


----------



## Teutone (Apr 16, 2012)

ian81 said:


> ...this probably won't do the job.
> 
> Rather you need to use a low dropout 12v regulator such as the LM2940



Brilliant Info, thanks. I do not know enough about electronics and just try to read my way through the stuff I want to know. But that only gets you so far. I usually bench test stuff I am not sure about and see what happens.
BTW I was running my LED's on EHU and they are fine. So far.....
Voltage was around 13.6 V


----------



## Teutone (Apr 17, 2012)

found this very useful to read read, thanks again ian81
LM2940 12V 1A Low Dropout Regulator - Electric Circuit


----------



## mikeandhismotorhome (Apr 17, 2012)

Don't know what the fuss is about, I replaced all my bulbs about a year ago with cheap
Hong Kong/Chinese imports and I run on EHU around 50% of the time (around 6-12 weeks)
and have not had one failure. I don't think they are as "fragile" as some UK sellers make out.


----------



## Bigpeetee (Apr 17, 2012)

I too have used cheap led's from Ebay without issue.

All these LED's will originate from the Far East, usually China.

In my habitation area, there are reading lamps that can be used when motoring, these LEDs get used with the engine charging or occasionally on hookup without issue.

All of mine have a bridge rectifier so polarity doesn't matter as they are AC/DC

The LEDs are designed to replace 12v lamps fed by a transformer, these are a nominal 12v usually between 11-15v so the resistor calcs are based on the top end voltage not the nominal.

I put them on a variable power supply, and between 11.5v and 15v there was little difference in light output.  When I wound it up to 18v, they started to get warm!! but as soon as the voltage was reduced they returned to normal


----------



## Deleted member 13859 (Apr 17, 2012)

*led lighting*

hi all

very interested in this information as im thinking about changing my two 12volt strip lights! is there something on the market that just plugs in to replace the standard tube please as im not very good with this electic stuff, cant see it till its bit you!!!!

tranivanman


----------



## ian81 (Apr 17, 2012)

tranivanman said:


> hi all
> 
> very interested in this information as im thinking about changing my two 12volt strip lights! is there something on the market that just plugs in to replace the standard tube please as im not very good with this electic stuff, cant see it till its bit you!!!!
> 
> tranivanman



DC12V 24V T5 30cm LED TUBE TO REPLACE FLUORESCENT LIGHT IN MOTORHOMES AND BOATS. | eBay
or T5 Fluorescent Tube LED Replacement - Caravan / Camper | eBay

....but note that you have to remove the electronic ballast but it is a relatively simple job.

As far as voltage regulation goes personally the only LED's I would worry about are those that are 'polarity' concious such as LED strips that can be divided. Running these at much over 12v will potentially damage them. That is where I have had a problem but wouldn't worry with MR16 or G4 types.


----------



## oldish hippy (Apr 17, 2012)

tranivanman said:


> hi all
> 
> very interested in this information as im thinking about changing my two 12volt strip lights! is there something on the market that just plugs in to replace the standard tube please as im not very good with this electic stuff, cant see it till its bit you!!!!
> 
> tranivanman



How to install BTP LED tubes  here you go step by step instructions


----------



## Deleted member 13859 (Apr 17, 2012)

*led lighting*

thank you both ian81 and oldish hippy  for both your very quick and helpfull replies, very easy to understand,

im on it.


tranivanman


----------



## Neckender (Apr 21, 2012)

clarkpeacock said:


> Thanks for this Teutone.
> 
> You have inspired me to try similar so I have ordered some of these to do a few tests.
> 48 SMD LED Light Panel Bulb
> ...



I've used the same seller on ebay, 3--48 leds, 4 led clusters, 2--24warmleds, all for just over £12 delivered. fitted them today and I'm pleased with their performance. So I've orded another set as spares.

John.


----------



## Deleted member 13867 (Apr 21, 2012)

*Using rectifier diodes to protect leds*

When i installed some IKEA 12 volt strip-lights in the Motorhome
 Just to make sure that i did not exceed the rated voltage of 12 volts by any significant margin i have installed 2 silicon rectifiers and a 1 amp fuse in series with the lights Because the normal running voltage of motorhome electrics is about 13.8v which is 1.8 volts higher than the strips are rated at. The silicon rectifiers have a forward voltage drop of 0.7 volts each so a total forward drop of 1.4volts meaning the strips always run at 12.4 volts maximum and usually less than that depending on the state of charge of the leisure batteries the fuse of course just a precaution.


----------



## Teutone (May 27, 2012)

added some more LED lights but this time off the shelf stuff. 

above Diner






can swivvel in the clip brackets





above the bed





which is operated from this switch that I can switch it on without climbing up first


----------

