# Should I carry a spare tyre? AND legality of tyres older than 10 years



## The Raptor (Jun 29, 2021)

I would just like to offer this experience with other members. When I purchased my Autotrail Motorhome 11 years ago all that was provided was a tyreweld and pair of tough gloves. Following discussions on forums I decided to buty a spare rim and tyre “Just in case”……well on the way back from Orkney I had that blowout that tyreweld would have fixed NOT…..








The spare was successfully put on and I got home with my spare.
HOWEVER my son who was a policeman in the past said I may be fined with points as my spare was over 10 years old as the tyre regulations changed in February 2021 and this could/would get a 3 point penalty and immediate prohibition order.
Here is the link about this new law and Q&A after so it may help / inform people.
UK gov.uk link
Hope this is useful and yes my front tyres are only 7 years old. (Reading link private Motorhomes over 3.5 tonnes may not be included, but it’s advice is to risk assess all vehicles)
Cheers
Dave


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## Fisherman (Jun 29, 2021)

Tyres are what keep you on the road, get new tyres.
Sadly I have seen what happens with dodgy tyes.


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## SquirrellCook (Jun 29, 2021)

Dremel and remove the date code.  I didn’t type this


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## mark61 (Jun 29, 2021)

Are MH's 3.5T and under included?


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## SquirrellCook (Jun 29, 2021)

SquirrellCook said:


> Dremel and remove the date code.  I didn’t type this


Ok, just read this is as bad.  Stupidly you can still use an old carcass with a remould.


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## QFour (Jun 29, 2021)

SquirrellCook said:


> Dremel and remove the date code.  I didn’t type this


Why would you want to drive round on old tyres. They do deteriate over time


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## The Raptor (Jun 29, 2021)

mark61 said:


> Are MH's 3.5T and under included?


Apparently not, but the advice was to risk assess all exempted vehicles anyway, there is a very lengthy discussion on the gov.uk link with lots of questions with DVLA giving answers


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## maingate (Jun 29, 2021)

Only applies to commercial vehicles of certain classes (ie, used for hire or reward).


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## winks (Jun 30, 2021)

A spare is always a good thing but with the miserly payloads applicable to some vans they are sacrificed to artificially up the available payload. I agree with Qfour re driving on old tyres having had twelve year old tyre blow out a while ago. 

Cheers

H


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## Scotia (Jun 30, 2021)

That's one of the first things I did when I purchased the motorhome was make a bracket to hold a spare wheel.


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## rugbyken (Jun 30, 2021)

having had 3 motorhome’s over the last 17 years i have had 4 blow outs none of which the cans of gunk would have got me moving the last when i had only had this hymer a month was a bolt hole recovered to a garage in portugal & new tyre took 4 days to arrive ,


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## Fazerloz (Jun 30, 2021)

The Raptor said:


> HOWEVER my son who was a policeman in the past said I may be fined with points as my spare was over 10 years old as the tyre regulations changed in February 2021 and this could/would get a 3 point penalty and immediate prohibition order.
> Here is the link about this new law and Q&A after so it may help / inform people.
> UK gov.uk link
> Hope this is useful and yes my front tyres are only 7 years old. (Reading link private Motorhomes over 3.5 tonnes may not be included, but it’s advice is to risk assess all vehicles)
> ...



As motor caravans of all weights are Class 4 MOT I find it strange you post this as your own link  clearly states.

"A class 4 motor caravan is out of scope for the new tyre regulations."

I guess we shouldn't believe everything a policeman tells us.


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## Richard Wasteney (Jun 30, 2021)

Regardless of the law, just look at The Raptor’s photo and tell me you’re happy on tyres over 10 years old. It’s good practice that could save your life. I bought a motorbike from a dealer two years ago with 14 year old tyres on which I instantly replaced. No point going back to the dealer with the issue as they would point to the law but it’s a risk I don’t find palatable


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## Fisherman (Jun 30, 2021)

We are talking about what keeps us all on the road here, are you feeling lucky, then drive with 10 year old tyres. Quite frankly I don’t give a sh-t what the law says. And don’t forget it’s not only your life that’s on the line here.


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## 1807truckman (Jun 30, 2021)

From  what I read on the link the ten year rule is only applicable to HGV, coaches and mini busses with more than 9 seats on the front steered axles, having said that it's just common sense to change the tyres by the time they're ten years old afterall they're what keep you on the road.
On my previous Hymer I bought a rim and tyre because it only came with tyre gunk and a compressor, can't say it was for weight saving as it had a 1000kg payload availableeven with full water tanks, full fuel tank and full gas bottles this was on a Mercedes Sprinter 5 tonne chassis.


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## campervanannie (Jun 30, 2021)

Scotia said:


> That's one of the first things I did when I purchased the motorhome was make a bracket to hold a spare wheel.View attachment 99444View attachment 99445


Dear mr Scotia please will you make me one of those it looks so much easier to carry your spare than the silly rack underneath that gets all rusty and sieges up.


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## brian c (Jun 30, 2021)

Well I was warned that my tyres were Over ten years and would fail class 4 mot.     Checked  class 4 mot tyres age. On internet And it states it’s a fail if over 10 years or undated. Motstation verified this.   So not sure about class4 excluded threads or onlyhgvs etc.  Personally check your tyre date and check at mot. Stan.  And yes I would trust a policeman if he told me that such and such was illegal/ legal  I often wonder if some of the advice given is a bit dated. Ie. It was legal when I was a lad  so it’s legal now.  I took my test in 1966 in a 4 ton lorry and only heard about the age limit/ tyres 2 months ago it was also pointed out to me that there were  small cracks in the tyre that I had not seen      So I agree with some posts. If there old change them.  Brian.


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## Sky (Jun 30, 2021)

Driving on old tyres is (IMO) the same as smoking - both will kill you eventually, but even more sad is both can kill those around you too.


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## wildebus (Jun 30, 2021)

campervanannie said:


> Dear mr Scotia please will you make me one of those it looks so much easier to carry your spare than the silly rack underneath that gets all rusty and sieges up.


Underslung spares are a right PITA!   the VW T5 has those and when I first got my T5 it took nearly an hour of significant physical activity to undo the two securing nuts to free the wheel  (probably not been touched for ages and IIRC the spare was bald as well! )


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## RV2MAX (Jun 30, 2021)

brian c said:


> Well I was warned that my tyres were Over ten years and would fail class 4 mot.     Checked  class 4 mot tyres age. On internet And it states it’s a fail if over 10 years or undated. Motstation verified this.   So not sure about class4 excluded threads or onlyhgvs etc.  Personally check your tyre date and check at mot. Stan.  And yes I would trust a policeman if he told me that such and such was illegal/ legal  I often wonder if some of the advice given is a bit dated. Ie. It was legal when I was a lad  so it’s legal now.  I took my test in 1966 in a 4 ton lorry and only heard about the age limit/ tyres 2 months ago it was also pointed out to me that there were  small cracks in the tyre that I had not seen      So I agree with some posts. If there old change them.  Brian.


quoted from MOT Manual  cars and passenger vehicles  Section 5 tyres .   
Tyre age​
The check of tyre age applies to all vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, other than vehicles of historical interest.

so cars (Class 4) and motorcaravans (class 4)  with less than 9 seats  not applicable   HTSH  

RFF    



(m) A tyre over ten years old is fitted to a front steered axle of a bus, coach, or any axle on a minibus with a single wheel fitmentDangerous A date code illegible:

(i) on a tyre fitted to a rear axle of a bus or coach
(ii) or not visible on a tyre fitted to a front steered axle of a bus or coach or any axle on a minibus with a single wheel fitment

Minor
Major


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## mark61 (Jun 30, 2021)

RV2MAX said:


> quoted from MOT Manual  cars and passenger vehicles  Section 5 tyres .
> Tyre age​
> The check of tyre age applies to all vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, other than vehicles of historical interest.
> 
> ...


 Exactly, the various .gov sites are very clear and up to date.

Not that any of it helps me, can't remember having a tyre for more than 4 years, 5 max.


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## Fazerloz (Jun 30, 2021)

brian c said:


> Well I was warned that my tyres were Over ten years and would fail class 4 mot.     Checked  class 4 mot tyres age. On internet And it states it’s a fail if over 10 years or undated. Motstation verified this.   So not sure about class4 excluded threads or onlyhgvs etc.  Personally check your tyre date and check at mot. Stan.  And yes I would trust a policeman if he told me that such and such was illegal/ legal  I often wonder if some of the advice given is a bit dated. Ie. It was legal when I was a lad  so it’s legal now.  I took my test in 1966 in a 4 ton lorry and only heard about the age limit/ tyres 2 months ago it was also pointed out to me that there were  small cracks in the tyre that I had not seen      So I agree with some posts. If there old change them.  Brian.


IF you do not have 8 passenger seats the your MOT station is wrong. I would not use them what else could they be wrong about. 

Taken from the latest Mot manual.
Tyre age​The check of tyre age applies to all vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, other than vehicles of historical interest.

Tyre age is determined by the date code on the sidewall and will be a three or four-digit code. Tyres with a three-digit code will be more than 10 years old.

The code is usually located in a ‘window’ on the sidewall and may or may not be located at the end of the DOT number (see image below).







The first two digits of the code represent the week of manufacture of the tyre and the second two digits represent the year of manufacture. In the example above, the tyre was manufactured in week 35 of 2016.

Tyres over ten years old at the time of test must be failed if they are on:


any front steered axle
any rear axle of a minibus with a single wheel fitment.
Tyres not displaying a date code must also be failed. However, date codes are only required to be marked on one side of the tyre so it may not be possible to see the date code on twin wheel fitments. Under these circumstances you should advise the presenter and assume the date code is present and the tyre age is acceptable.

On tyres where the date code is illegible, for example, due to kerbing or deliberate tampering, a major or minor defect must be recorded, depending on the location of the tyre.


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## Fisherman (Jun 30, 2021)




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## Red Dwarf (Jun 30, 2021)

Should I carry a spare tyre? Yes. I mentioned in another thread some time ago that if you’re here in the far north you can easily be a hundred miles away from a new tyre. The local recovery agent tells me that many folk get stranded because of an irreparable tyre and no spare wheel. 
Given the roads here can shred a tyre inner wall if you go over the edge of the road surface, not carrying a spare seems  at best, careless. The lack of spare wheels with many modern vehicles is down to weight reduction to improve the demands of economy.
Drive carefully on rural roads, take it easy over cattle grids and watch out for the rough edge of the tarmac!

Also worth mentioning. If you do have a spare wheel, carry the suitable tools to change it. I’ve seen cars that have been lowered and the original jack being too big to fit under the vehicle.


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## Fazerloz (Jun 30, 2021)

How many of you actually check the date code on the tyre before haviing a new tyre fitted. Or just accept that its a new tyre that is been put on.


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## wildebus (Jun 30, 2021)

Red Dwarf said:


> Should I carry a spare tyre? Yes. I mentioned in another thread some time ago that if you’re here in the far north you can easily be a hundred miles away from a new tyre. The local recovery agent tells me that many folk get stranded because of an irreparable tyre and no spare wheel.
> Given the roads here can shred a tyre inner wall if you go over the edge of the road surface, not carrying a spare seems  at best, careless. The lack of spare wheels with many modern vehicles is down to weight reduction to improve the demands of economy.
> Drive carefully on rural roads, take it easy over cattle grids and watch out for the rough edge of the tarmac!
> 
> Also worth mentioning. If you do have a spare wheel, carry the suitable tools to change it. I’ve seen cars that have been lowered and the original jack being too big to fit under the vehicle.


Saying it is 'careless' not to carry a spare is in itself a careless thing to say.   
One problem on many motorhomes is where to carry the spare even if you wanted one.  Not that many have garages or lockers big enough for a spare.

I don't carry a spare in the motorhome.  Guess why?  (And it is not a matter of not caring as my last car did not have a spare as standard so I put on in the boot, and the current car did not come with a spare so I bought one to put in the spare wheel sized space under the boot floor).


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## izwozral (Jun 30, 2021)

Scotia said:


> That's one of the first things I did when I purchased the motorhome was make a bracket to hold a spare wheel.View attachment 99444View attachment 99445


Ah, but does it dispense beer?


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## Red Dwarf (Jun 30, 2021)

wildebus said:


> Saying it is 'careless' not to carry a spare is in itself a careless thing to say.


Really, why? I would think myself careless if I was setting off (especially to remote places) if I didn’t have a spare wheel and tools to change it. 
Much after 5pm up here in the north you’re going nowhere or being recovered if you don’t have a spare. That a vehicle doesn’t have provision for carrying a spare, make provision!
I mentioned some time ago about a guy in a VW T5 camper who popped two tyres going over a cattle grid. He had really low profile tyres on silly big alloys. He had one standard T5 wheel with a standard tyre. Holiday somewhat ruined.

No spare, you’re taking a gamble.


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## wildebus (Jun 30, 2021)

Red Dwarf said:


> Really, why? I would think myself careless if I was setting off (especially to remote places) if I didn’t have a spare wheel and tools to change it.
> Much after 5pm up here in the north you’re going nowhere or being recovered if you don’t have a spare. That a vehicle doesn’t have provision for carrying a spare, make provision!
> I mentioned some time ago about a guy in a VW T5 camper who popped two tyres going over a cattle grid. He had really low profile tyres on silly big alloys. He had one standard T5 wheel with a standard tyre. Holiday somewhat ruined.
> 
> No spare, you’re taking a gamble.


tell the vehicle dealers who sell you the vehicle, not the customer.

what do you think breakdown services are for?


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## Red Dwarf (Jun 30, 2021)

Yes, it’s odd that spare wheels have become an add on accessory.

Breakdown services in the highlands. I’ve experienced having to wait over eight hours for RAC recovery.  My point is that in remote areas a simple puncture can take a day to sort out if you haven’t got a spare.
Recovery is mostly done by local agents, in busy periods the nearest recovery to become available might be a hundred miles away.


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## Drover (Jun 30, 2021)

I carry a puncture repair kit, admittedly it wont fix a large rip. But holes ip to 12mm no problems.


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## wildebus (Jun 30, 2021)

Red Dwarf said:


> Yes, it’s odd that spare wheels have become an add on accessory.
> 
> Breakdown services in the highlands. I’ve experienced having to wait over eight hours for RAC recovery.  My point is that in remote areas a simple puncture can take a day to sort out if you haven’t got a spare.
> Recovery is mostly done by local agents, in busy periods the nearest recovery to become available might be a hundred miles away.


8 hours in the highlands for RAC Recovery!!  That's dreadful.

Then again, I broke down on the M3/M25 Junction around 8AM on a Sunday.  Eventually got an RAC Recovery vehicle picking up my car around 3PM I think it was.   Think I got home around 6PM or something  (and I lived around 45 minutes from where the car broke down).   Move to Greater London and save an hour 


Now as far as waiting for recovery if you can't swap a tyre, there are a mryiad of things that can go wrong with a vehicle past a puncture - just how many things do you cater for if you have to somehow build a bracket for a spare wheel on or in your motorhome (hey, who needs that shower anyway?), why stop there? Maybe carry head gaskets, timing belts, starter motors, fan belts, cam shafts, the list is endless (maybe a spare axle if you have a Mercedes bus?).

Time for realistic pragmatism.


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## Fazerloz (Jun 30, 2021)

Red Dwarf said:


> Really, why? I would think myself careless if I was setting off (especially to remote places) if I didn’t have a spare wheel and tools to change it.
> Much after 5pm up here in the north you’re going nowhere or being recovered if you don’t have a spare. That a vehicle doesn’t have provision for carrying a spare, make provision!
> I mentioned some time ago about a guy in a VW T5 camper who popped two tyres going over a cattle grid. He had really low profile tyres on silly big alloys. He had one standard T5 wheel with a standard tyre. Holiday somewhat ruined.
> 
> No spare, you’re taking a gamble.


What other spares do you carry as many things can leave you stranded or ruined hol. Where does the list end, gearbox perhaps.


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## Glass man (Jun 30, 2021)

Beware, if you go anywhere really remote like the far north of Finland, Sweden or Norway you can be over 100km from a garage and MUCH further from a tyre specialist. I found a van with a flat 130km away from the nearest garage. Fortunately the van had a spare.
In remote locations breakdown insurance may not help you as you have not fulfilled all the requirements for having a " serviceable vehicle. "


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## jagmanx (Jun 30, 2021)

IMHO
1 Not having a servicible spare is lunacy.
2 Running with old Tyres is also Lunacy
3 Not checking tyre pressure is simply STOOPID.
END.
Old MOTs checked Brakes Steering and lights only.
My simple list is Brakes Steering and Tyres...no explanation needed !


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## mark61 (Jun 30, 2021)

I always carry a spare tyre, but, I've not had to do a roadside change over since the late 90's. I've had a few punctures, but always slow, very slow. So why do I still carry one? Probably because I know the places I'm most likely to really damage a tyre, no recovery truck is going to be coming to assist. I'd be relying on mates. 

Horses for courses, anyway, I'm pretty sure the people here who don't usually carry a spare, are more than sensible enough to carry a spare if heading out into the wilderness or places where recovery will be a very long wait.


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## wildebus (Jun 30, 2021)

Glass man said:


> Beware, if you go anywhere really remote like the far north of Finland, Sweden or Norway you can be over 100km from a garage and MUCH further from a tyre specialist. I found a van with a flat 130km away from the nearest garage. Fortunately the van had a spare.
> In remote locations breakdown insurance may not help you as *you have not fulfilled all the requirements for having a " serviceable vehicle. "*


So you are saying the vehicle manufacturers are selling MILLIONS of unservicable vehicles then?   don't talk total tosh.


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## Bigshug (Jun 30, 2021)

This was a kumho less than a year old on my brothers motorhome!


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## jagmanx (Jun 30, 2021)

To add to my thoughts.
In 2019 near Interlaken we had a "very flat" the tyre was kaput.
We had a spare which was duly fitted and we could drive back to our campsite.
There was a local garage who did the job of replacing the tyre.
It was Friday 5pm going on 6pm
So no progress  not Until after the weekend !!!

Without a spare we may have been recovered to the centre of Interlaken and been forced to book hotel type accommodation and for maybe 4 nights....at some cost As it was we could return to the campsite and wait there .
my spare was old so 2 tyres and fitting for £400 plus.
campsite extra nights at £40 a night. But we could eat our food in the motorhome and relax in the day !
Interlaken Hotel and food for 4 nights...At least £600 extra !

Simple ..... make sure you have a useable spare wheel/tyre ( Or a spare wallet. ! )

Ok a mobile tyre fitter MAY have been available but ?????
Some breakdown policies insist on a spare..No spare No recovery !


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## mark61 (Jun 30, 2021)

If I remember correctly, spare tyre and tools to change tyre are mandatory in Czechia and Slovakia.
Pretty sure they are the only European countries with that rule. Could have changed since I been, don't know.


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## trevskoda (Jun 30, 2021)

Talking new tyres , well when i bought 2 as new mth old tyres from Dublin with ice spikes which I removed, two weeks later the belts twisted in one and almost impossible to drive, so now its brother is my spare which is on my bum.


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## jagmanx (Jun 30, 2021)

Not much use if it makes the vehicle impossible to drive..
Is it a Linux distro ?????


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## Chris356 (Jun 30, 2021)

This was my continental 7 years old only covered 4,000 miles blew put at 70mph the bottom pics again continental 7 years old 20,000 miles noticed it flat after being parked up for 2 days


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## Chris356 (Jun 30, 2021)

7 years 20,000 miles


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## trevskoda (Jul 1, 2021)

Them tyres look like 30 bob skidwells.


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## Nabsim (Jul 1, 2021)

Red Dwarf said:


> Really, why? I would think myself careless if I was setting off (especially to remote places) if I didn’t have a spare wheel and tools to change it.
> Much after 5pm up here in the north you’re going nowhere or being recovered if you don’t have a spare. That a vehicle doesn’t have provision for carrying a spare, make provision!
> I mentioned some time ago about a guy in a VW T5 camper who popped two tyres going over a cattle grid. He had really low profile tyres on silly big alloys. He had one standard T5 wheel with a standard tyre. Holiday somewhat ruined.
> 
> No spare, you’re taking a gamble.


I asked if I could have a spare wheel and tyre as an optional extra on the Astra estate I got a few years ago and was told no, compressor and gunk only option. The Mokka I have now did not have the option either nor did the other car I had new in the last 9 years. Every puncture I have had has been the wrong type for the gunk to work and seal properly as they have all been sidewall cuts from stones on the country lanes where I lived. I would have much preferred a spare.
Moving to the motorhome I do carry a spare and a wheel brace but not a suitable Jack. I had a rear blowout a couple of years ago and after breakdown came to change my wheel I decided I didn’t need one just the spare. The guy was twice the size of me and had a five or six foot extension on a long bar and he put a lot of effort into getting the bolts undone. I took the decision on the grounds I am not physically capable of changing the wheel on the van. I don’t think that makes me careless as I assessed the job before reaching my conclusion. So i know where you are coming from but if I have to wait for breakdown then so be it.


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## Nabsim (Jul 1, 2021)

As to age of tyres, I didn’t worry about carrying a perfect 12 year old spare. It had no evidence of deterioration or sera or damage? Why would I want to throw away a perfectly good Continental when the manufacturer themselves say they only need to be checked not replaced? That of course in the absence of any applicable law


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## Scotia (Jul 1, 2021)

izwozral said:


> Ah, but does it dispense beer?


That's on the other side as you well know Ral.


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## Scotia (Jul 1, 2021)

Fazerloz said:


> What other spares do you carry as many things can leave you stranded or ruined hol. Where does the list end, gearbox perhaps.


Not as daft as it sounds. Had a mate who rode a BSA Bantam and was heading to Achmore to visit friends. He knew the big end was on its way out ( pressed crankshaft on a two stroke) he was determined to get as many miles out of it so took a spare crank with him. He split the motor when he arrived in the Highlands for his return journey,  he reconed he would have made it back on the original crank taking it easy.


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## jagmanx (Jul 1, 2021)

Nabsim said:


> I asked if I could have a spare wheel and tyre as an optional extra on the Astra estate I got a few years ago and was told no, compressor and gunk only option. The Mokka I have now did not have the option either nor did the other car I had new in the last 9 years. Every puncture I have had has been the wrong type for the gunk to work and seal properly as they have all been sidewall cuts from stones on the country lanes where I lived. I would have much preferred a spare.
> Moving to the motorhome I do carry a spare and a wheel brace but not a suitable Jack. I had a rear blowout a couple of years ago and after breakdown came to change my wheel I decided I didn’t need one just the spare. The guy was twice the size of me and had a five or six foot extension on a long bar and he put a lot of effort into getting the bolts undone. I took the decision on the grounds I am not physically capable of changing the wheel on the van. I don’t think that makes me careless as I assessed the job before reaching my conclusion. So i know where you are coming from but if I have to wait for breakdown then so be it.


I do not follow your logic.
I like you cannot do !
But the breakdowm man can.....but only if a spare is available...ie you have a spare. See my earlier post !


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## maingate (Jul 1, 2021)

I will probably get some flak for this but my spare is 15 years old.  

It came with the van from new, has been stored underneath in a rack (out of harmful UV rays) and has never been used. It might be a gamble but I reckon it will get me to a garage or home (whichever is closer).


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## wildebus (Jul 1, 2021)

maingate said:


> I will probably get some flak for this but my spare is 15 years old.
> 
> It came with the van from new, has been stored underneath in a rack (out of harmful UV rays) and has never been used. It might be a gamble but I reckon it will get me to a garage or home (whichever is closer).


Newer than my spare!


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## wildebus (Jul 1, 2021)

jagmanx said:


> I do not follow your logic.
> I like you cannot do !
> But the breakdowm man can.....but only if a spare is available...ie you have a spare. See my earlier post !


The last time I called for a breakdown was I think in 2014.  Had the T4 Camper (with a spare) and the Car.  Problem was the cars clutch decided to give up the ghost on the drive to the festival we were at.
RAC (I think) man came to recover the car - did a flat tow back to the house.   I noticed in the back of his van he had spare wheels   won't cover every vehicle of course, but in terms of emergency get you homes, could be handy for many drivers.



Scotia said:


> Not as daft as it sounds. Had a mate who rode a BSA Bantam and was heading to Achmore to visit friends. He knew the big end was on its way out ( pressed crankshaft on a two stroke) he was determined to get as many miles out of it so took a spare crank with him. He split the motor when he arrived in the Highlands for his return journey,  he reconed he would have made it back on the original crank taking it easy.


That's not carrying a spare, that is carrying a repair.


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## wildebus (Jul 1, 2021)

Nabsim said:


> I asked if I could have a spare wheel and tyre as an optional extra on the Astra estate I got a few years ago and was told no, compressor and gunk only option. The Mokka I have now did not have the option either nor did the other car I had new in the last 9 years. Every puncture I have had has been the wrong type for the gunk to work and seal properly as they have all been sidewall cuts from stones on the country lanes where I lived. I would have much preferred a spare.
> Moving to the motorhome I do carry a spare and a wheel brace but not a suitable Jack. I had a rear blowout a couple of years ago and after breakdown came to change my wheel I decided I didn’t need one just the spare. The guy was twice the size of me and had a five or six foot extension on a long bar and he put a lot of effort into getting the bolts undone. I took the decision on the grounds I am not physically capable of changing the wheel on the van. I don’t think that makes me careless as I assessed the job before reaching my conclusion. So i know where you are coming from but if I have to wait for breakdown then so be it.


Are you sure you don't have a Jack?
My VW LT had the same cab as your Sprinter and it has a standard jack tucked away in a place people may not realise  
(and it is a 4.6t vehicle so the jack provided would be suitable for a vehicle of that weight (and so cover yours as well)).


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## mark61 (Jul 1, 2021)

I'll take a 15 year unused and well stored spare any day over a 5 year old used tyre.


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## colinm (Jul 1, 2021)

Looked at the tyres on our van last week, although they all have plenty of tread and have recently passed MOT am not that happy with the oldest pair which are 10 y.o. and are looking perished, so am replacing them.
Am leaving the spare as it appears good condition as it has spent it's 10 years out of the sun, my only concern is the spare will then be a different model (although same size/rating) and I know the French can be a bit sniffy with replacing different tyres so if I have a problem in France might have to change it myself, but by the time we ever get to touring EU again should be fit enough to do that.


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## Fazerloz (Jul 1, 2021)

Scotia said:


> Not as daft as it sounds. Had a mate who rode a BSA Bantam and was heading to Achmore to visit friends. He knew the big end was on its way out ( pressed crankshaft on a two stroke) he was determined to get as many miles out of it so took a spare crank with him. He split the motor when he arrived in the Highlands for his return journey,  he reconed he would have made it back on the original crank taking it easy.


Thankfully having to carry a load of spares on the bike have long gone.


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## trevskoda (Jul 1, 2021)

I always put my best to the front, back is doubles so if one blows i can still land safe, one of these may be handy


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## Nabsim (Jul 1, 2021)

jagmanx said:


> I do not follow your logic.
> I like you cannot do !
> But the breakdowm man can.....but only if a spare is available...ie you have a spare. See my earlier post !


Is it the way I wrote it maybe? I DO carry a spare on the van but don’t have a suitable Jack. Breakdown will have a suitable Jack, long enough extension bar and hopefully the strength to break the nuts (I would never have got them undone when I had the blowout)


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## Nabsim (Jul 1, 2021)

wildebus said:


> Are you sure you don't have a Jack?
> My VW LT had the same cab as your Sprinter and it has a standard jack tucked away in a place people may not realise
> (and it is a 4.6t vehicle so the jack provided would be suitable for a vehicle of that weight (and so cover yours as well)).


There is a Jack under the cover in passenger footwell, is that where you mean? It isn’t hefty enough to lift the weight I don’t think. I will double check though as I now have doubt on what I saw. I still wouldn’t attempt to change a wheel on the van though


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## wildebus (Jul 1, 2021)

Nabsim said:


> There is a Jack under the cover in passenger footwell, is that where you mean? It isn’t hefty enough to lift the weight I don’t think. I will double check though as I now have doubt on what I saw. I still wouldn’t attempt to change a wheel on the van though


It is.
Got to think that if it was provided it must spec'ed up to the job?  (the potential litigation is it was not would be massive!)

I haven't used it either as I am not a fan of Bottle Jacks anyway


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## mark61 (Jul 1, 2021)

Pretty sure 3.5 tonne Sprinters come with a 3 tonne Weber bottle jack, been same since T1N days. 
No idea if the 4.6 tonne version has a beefier jack. Specs will be on it somewhere I would think.
As always, just make sure you have decent blocks/pads.


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## Deleted member 27480 (Jul 1, 2021)

I am interested as to what causes deterioration of a tyre, apart from road wear. Is it just UV light or does the rubber naturally age and crack even when a spare wheel is stored in the dark?


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## RV2MAX (Jul 1, 2021)

britcoms said:


> I am interested as to what causes deterioration of a tyre, apart from road wear. Is it just UV light or does the rubber naturally age and crack even when a spare wheel is stored in the dark?


Rubber is organic to start , with various additions , but naturally will biodegrade over time . Then the rubber goes thru a vulcanistaion process , this process will also continue over time  as the tyre absorbs light heat and friction over years  so gets stiffer to the point of cracking , then you have oxidation due oxygen and ozone , leading to break down of polymer bonds etc  further enhanced by the tyre being pressurized.   HTSH


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## witzend (Jul 1, 2021)

They don't make them like they used to When the USA left Cornwall for Normmandy D Day they left a old lorry on a relations farm after many years use it was cut up for scrap the rear wheels and chassie being used for a dump trailer its still in use with the original tyres carrying 10 ton loads regularly 3 layers of canvas showing when I mentioned it I was told not to worry they are 12 ply tyres


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## maingate (Jul 1, 2021)

Just a point worth mentioning.

When I decided to drop the spare wheel from its cradle to check it and clean the area I found the 2 bolts that hold the cradle up were a bit rusted. I could not free them off and so had to drop the whole assembly and pull it clear. Part of the problem is that the 2 bolts have a 14 mm head which is a bit of an odd size and not normally included in many socket sets. So it may be worthwhile checking if you have the correct socket or spanner for this task.

I have a Burstner but other European makes may use the same cradle.


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## Fazerloz (Jul 1, 2021)

maingate said:


> Just a point worth mentioning.
> 
> When I decided to drop the spare wheel from its cradle to check it and clean the area I found the 2 bolts that hold the cradle up were a bit rusted. I could not free them off and so had to drop the whole assembly and pull it clear. Part of the problem is that the 2 bolts have a 14 mm head which is a bit of an odd size and not normally included in many socket sets. So it may be worthwhile checking if you have the correct socket or spanner for this task.
> 
> I have a Burstner but other European makes may use the same cradle.


It does make things awkward. 14mm spanner is the Japanese industrial standard for a 10mm bolt.


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## trevskoda (Jul 1, 2021)

I have the lot in my van, large breaker bar, sockets, 30 ton bottle jack,tool roll, gloves and a mat, spare wheel nuts and a few studs, brake hose clamp, spare b flued, tow strap, jump leads,fan belt, clean pair of undies just in case its a big problem and I'm in deep poo.


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## Tim120 (Jul 1, 2021)

I do carry an under slung spare and also a jack which I think is of the scissors type. I doubt I could break the nuts and I will certainly not be trusting  the jack, not because I am concerned that it is not capable, clearly it must be as stated earlier about litigation.
It does not much passing for the van to rock, anything substantial causes a major movement, this is why I will wait for assistance.

Had MOT today and it was class 4 (no idea) and passed, I'm over 3500kg and part of the MOT was report on tyre age followed by condition of individual tyres.
I have no idea if I could have failed on age of tyres.


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## maingate (Jul 1, 2021)

Tim120 said:


> I do carry an under slung spare and also a jack which I think is of the scissors type. I doubt I could break the nuts and I will certainly not be trusting  the jack, not because I am concerned that it is not capable, clearly it must be as stated earlier about litigation.
> It does not much passing for the van to rock, anything substantial causes a major movement, this is why I will wait for assistance.
> 
> Had MOT today and it was class 4 (no idea) and passed, I'm over 3500kg and part of the MOT was report on tyre age followed by condition of individual tyres.
> I have no idea if I could have failed on age of tyres.


I have a 3/4" Impact socket and breaker bar but I never got round to sourcing a long piece of pipe. 

I hope I get a puncture next to a steel stockist or a pipeworks.


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## RV2MAX (Jul 1, 2021)

Tim120 said:


> I do carry an under slung spare and also a jack which I think is of the scissors type. I doubt I could break the nuts and I will certainly not be trusting  the jack, not because I am concerned that it is not capable, clearly it must be as stated earlier about litigation.
> It does not much passing for the van to rock, anything substantial causes a major movement, this is why I will wait for assistance.
> 
> Had MOT today and it was class 4 (no idea) and passed, I'm over 3500kg and part of the MOT was report on tyre age followed by condition of individual tyres.
> I have no idea if I could have failed on age of tyres.


All motorcaravans are class 4 mot .  even over 3500kg ,  unless you have more than 9 seats  tyre age is not relevant part of inspection . S5  mot manual on line Gov UK .  see post *20


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## trevskoda (Jul 1, 2021)

maingate said:


> I have a 3/4" Impact socket and breaker bar but I never got round to sourcing a long piece of pipe.
> 
> I hope I get a puncture next to a steel stockist or a pipeworks.


Simple, place the bar towards the back and reverse, the nut will be slackened, go round them all and bingo job sorted, did I ever tell you when I was in the desert with Monty.


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## ricc (Jul 2, 2021)

trevskoda said:


> Simple, place the bar towards the back and reverse, the nut will be slackened, go round them all and bingo job sorted, did I ever tell you when I was in the desert with Monty.


Why was Monty don in the desert? Not many gardens there


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## SquirrellCook (Jul 2, 2021)

trevskoda said:


> did I ever tell you when I was in the desert with Monty.


If you'd had read the book I just read, that's the last place in the world you'd have wanted to be!


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## Scotia (Jul 2, 2021)

Fazerloz said:


> IF you do not have 8 passenger seats the your MOT station is wrong. I would not use them what else could they be wrong about.
> 
> Taken from the latest Mot manual.
> Tyre age​The check of tyre age applies to all vehicles with more than 8 passenger seats, other than vehicles of historical interest.
> ...


Just checked mine and the 4 rear tyres are 07 showing signs of cracking around the sidewall so now £700 lighter, booked in for Tuesday.


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## trevskoda (Jul 2, 2021)

All my boat trailer wheels now require tyres, do it when I use it next me thinks.


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## RoadTrek Boy (Jul 2, 2021)

trevskoda said:


> Simple, place the bar towards the back and reverse, the nut will be slackened, go round them all and bingo job sorted, did I ever tell you when I was in the desert with Monty.


Wearing well for 90 plus Trev....


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## Nabsim (Jul 2, 2021)

wildebus said:


> It is.
> Got to think that if it was provided it must spec'ed up to the job?  (the potential litigation is it was not would be massive!)
> 
> I haven't used it either as I am not a fan of Bottle Jacks anyway





mark61 said:


> Pretty sure 3.5 tonne Sprinters come with a 3 tonne Weber bottle jack, been same since T1N days.
> No idea if the 4.6 tonne version has a beefier jack. Specs will be on it somewhere I would think.
> As always, just make sure you have decent blocks/pads.


It does have a bottle Jack in the compartment in passenger footwell but I haven’t double checked it yet. Originally the van came at 3800kgs but was uprated to 4000kgs, it may be the Jack wasn’t suitable after upgrade or I may have misread what it has on it. If I remember I will have a look today 

There were no blocks or pads in the van though so I am fairly sure it’s couldn’t lift the van as it is but again I need to check


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## mark61 (Jul 2, 2021)

Usually have to buy blocks or pads, or scavenge bits of scaffold board, can be a bit dodgy, and not the scavenging bit.


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## Drover (Jul 2, 2021)

Burt Munro

 painted his tyres with black boot polish to hide the cracks in them when breaking the land speed record on his Indian a few years back.....he didn't worry and the scrutineers turned away ....


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## iandsm (Jul 3, 2021)

Fazerloz said:


> How many of you actually check the date code on the tyre before haviing a new tyre fitted. Or just accept that its a new tyre that is been put on.


Don't forget that the industry standard is that tyres manufactures up to five years ago should be treated as new when first fitted to a vehicle. At leas that what I read on Oponeo" website. SO the five or six years to the replacement date runs from the date they are fitted, not the date manufactured.

I recently had a new set fitted, three were dated as made in week 16/21 the fourth nine months earlier. I contacted Continental who told me that this was perfectly acceptable and to rely on the date fitted.

"
Tyre age and legalities​European regulations do not impose a coherent policy on the allowed age of tyres released for sale. That's why regulations may vary depending on the country. However, the EU clearly specifies new tyres' storage time and conditions. 

According to the European Tyre and Rim Technical Organisation (ETRTO), tyres are "new" for 5 years from the date of manufacture when stored in optimal conditions.

A tyre sold as a new product may be safely used for at least 5-6 years. Some sources indicate that the operational lifespan of a tyre may amount to even 10 years - with proper maintenance and storage, you can use your tyres longer.

Nevertheless, for your safety, it's better to replace the set after 5 years even if it's not approaching the legal minimum tread depth yet."

Now we are out of the EU I wonder if this still hold true.


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## trevskoda (Jul 3, 2021)

My brother inlaw when in the USA said many cars were running round with tyres down to the cords showing, age no idea.


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## Fazerloz (Jul 3, 2021)

iandsm said:


> Don't forget that the industry standard is that tyres manufactures up to five years ago should be treated as new when first fitted to a vehicle. At leas that what I read on Oponeo" website. SO the five or six years to the replacement date runs from the date they are fitted, not the date manufactured.
> 
> I recently had a new set fitted, three were dated as made in week 16/21 the fourth nine months earlier. I contacted Continental who told me that this was perfectly acceptable and to rely on the date fitted.
> 
> ...


Look elsewhere and you will find a different answer.  After all Openo have a vested interest in clearing their shelves.
The 10 years law that came in earlier this year is 10 years from the date of manufacture, date of sale is irrelevant. I know the law doesn't  apply to motorcaravans
If according to your post a tyre is already 4/5 years old when bought new as new as possible  then the user only gets 5/6 years of useable life. Whereas  someone who buys pretty much fresh  from the mould gets 10 years of useable life. Hence the check your date when buying new tyres.


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## jagmanx (Jul 3, 2021)

Maybe we should all contact...Lewis Hamilton and Pirelli...I will not bother as I take care and after one expensive deflation I replace all tyres after 4 or 5 years ! Maybe 30,000 miles (Pre-covid).Then agao I do not drive likd Lewis...mainly 55mph max sometimes 60mph !


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## trevskoda (Jul 3, 2021)

New ones can go pop, been there had the T shirt


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## SquirrellCook (Jul 3, 2021)

I’m sure glad this doesn’t apply to the tyres on the back of Murky, some are 16 years old and look like new. They are regroovable too. Though l would not bother. I guess it’s not powerful enough to wear them out. The front tyres don’t last 10 years though.


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## Drover (Jul 3, 2021)

britcoms said:


> I am interested as to what causes deterioration of a tyre, apart from road wear. Is it just UV light or does the rubber naturally age and crack even when a spare wheel is stored in the dark?


Not much rubber in todays tyres, they are mostly synthetic...
The sun is it's worse enemy


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## iandsm (Jul 4, 2021)

Fazerloz said:


> Look elsewhere and you will find a different answer.  After all Openo have a vested interest in clearing their shelves.
> The 10 years law that came in earlier this year is 10 years from the date of manufacture, date of sale is irrelevant. I know the law doesn't  apply to motorcaravans
> If according to your post a tyre is already 4/5 years old when bought new as new as possible  then the user only gets 5/6 years of useable life. Whereas  someone who buys pretty much fresh  from the mould gets 10 years of useable life. Hence the check your date when buying new tyres.


I am not sure teen years of useable life matters to me, Would change then at five/six years maximum for peace of mind anyway. Can you point to the elsewhere you mention please?


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## RichardHelen262 (Jul 4, 2021)

trevskoda said:


> New ones can go pop, been there had the T shirt


Maybe this is why


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## Apache Moho (Jul 4, 2021)

*Tyes age applies to any vehicle class 5 or higher
I had my tag axle mot'd recently and the examiner gave me a lecture about the 11 year old original tyres but said he cannot fail me on this issue.

However, I got them changed for 6 new hankook tyres at £70 each to avoid just what has happened to this poster *


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## brian c (Jul 4, 2021)

Well checked with mot station re them telling me tyres would fail if over ten years old. There answer was   Now       yes it would. But we did not realise that it was this 3.5 t motorhome       it would not apply to this one.   So as earlier advised.  Have changed my mot station thanks.   Brian.


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