# French playing 90 day rule games.?



## jennyp19 (Jan 22, 2020)

I’ve just had message from a friend who spends a lot of time in Spain ie more than 90 days at a time.

‘The French are playing stupid but costly games at french ports, fining Brits returning to UK, for staying more than 90 days in EU, even tho we are still in Europe. Fines of 265 euros per person, to be paid on the spot, or they confiscate your vehicle.‘
Has anyone had this happen yet. If so which ports.?
Apparently always been the case but has not been enforced.


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## korky (Jan 22, 2020)

Frankly that is a load of nonsense and not even factually correct. The 90 day rule will only apply when we have left after the transition period.


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## jennyp19 (Jan 22, 2020)

I agree seems wrong but it wouldn’t surprise me if it happens.  
A bit like them not changing a lot of the speed signs when they changed the speed limits.


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## witzend (Jan 22, 2020)

There has Always been a 90 day rule and speed limits are being altered again now


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## jennyp19 (Jan 22, 2020)

That’s what my friend said - they’re now enforcing the 90 day rule. 
At least now I’m aware and it’s a gamble. if they’re doing this it certainly puts a new slant on the cost of Santander or Rotterdam crossings.


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## trevskoda (Jan 22, 2020)

See the thanks you get for liberating them 70 odd years back,frogs have short memories.


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## Canalsman (Jan 22, 2020)

Your friend is going to have to change his or her arrangements in the future ...

Nothing changes regarding access to the EU during the transition period currently due to end on 31 December. 

The speed limit signs in France were changed to reflect the lower 80kph limit. I travelled extensively through France soon after the reduction and noted that they had been replaced. 

There are some 90kph signs because some sections of road, typically multi-lane, still have that limit in place.


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## iampatman (Jan 22, 2020)

There has always been a 90 day limit in Spain but rarely enforced. 

Pat


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## barryd (Jan 22, 2020)

I Would like to see some proper evidence of this. We are actually still in the EU and have full free movement. I think anyone (not just the UK) if they spend more than 90 days in one country is supposed to register but they are entitled to be there.  At a French port they would have no idea how long you had spent in France.  We are currently free to roam from country to country as long as you like but generally 90 days per country I believe although it was never enforced as there are no passport controls within Schengen anyway.  Lets see the evidence.  However if there is any truth in it those thinking of winging it after we leave and overstaying may be in bother as it would be easy to check then as it wont matter where you have been, 90 days in any 180 is the max.


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## QFour (Jan 22, 2020)

In Spain I think you are supposed to report to the local police station if you are staying in the country for more than 90 days.


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## korky (Jan 22, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> See the thanks you get for liberating them 70 odd years back,frogs have short memories.


That's disgraceful.


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## Canalsman (Jan 22, 2020)

John H shed light on the existing 90 day limit a while back:



John H said:


> The 3 month thing for EU residents is an interesting one. For many years, many of us - including me - were under the misapprehension that an EU resident could only legally spend 3 months in another EU country. This "rule" was never enforced and it was assumed by us that this was because it would be difficult to prove because of the lack of border controls within Schengen. It turns out, however, that any such rule is over-ridden by the freedom of movement directive, which states that as long as you can prove that you have sufficient funds to cover your stay you can stay as long as you want and enjoy all the reciprocal arrangements - including EHIC. In addition to my own experience, I could itemise many cases of friends who have been here in Spain for longer than 3 months and got free treatment for everything ranging from strokes to broken limbs.


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## jennyp19 (Jan 22, 2020)

I hope you’re all correct - time will tell.


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## trevskoda (Jan 23, 2020)

korky said:


> That's disgraceful.


Lighten up.


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

jennyp19 said:


> I hope you’re all correct - time will tell.


I might be wrong but arent the customs in Calais British ?


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

At the tunnel at least .


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## peter palance (Jan 23, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> See the thanks you get for liberating them 70 odd years back,frogs have short memories.


and malta, ok.pj p.s, keep going


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## harrow (Jan 23, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> Lighten up.


No your right. My dad was on the beach in france just twice.


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## trevskoda (Jan 23, 2020)

To me the whole world should be open to travel as long as police etc know who is where and when to stop crime,why should we be gated in to one zone,disgraceful  in this day and age.


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## peter palance (Jan 23, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> Lighten up.


take the lead out of your boots,keep moving trev, there is a wide world out there, keep moving.ok.pj.


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## Kontiki (Jan 23, 2020)

I think I read that after the transition period the whole of the EU that is in the Schengen area are treated  as if it were one country so that you will only be able to spend 90 days in any period of 180 days. As it's looking like I won't be able to manage the longer trips/stays (in the first couple of years we were retired we spent more time touring in Europe than in the UK) I feel sorry for people who now find they can't. I think you can apply for an extension but not sure how. The 3 month rule has always been there in that you should register if you stay more than that but never really enforced, after we brexit it is easier for them to know as the limit applys to the whole of the EU not any one country.


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## jennyp19 (Jan 23, 2020)

My friend’s statement was that the French have already taken it into their heads to start enforcing a rule that is already there. 

If they are, I’m guessing there aren’t that many Brits who will be coming home yet after spending more than 3 months out of UK.
If it’s happening complaints will start to happen when the weather improves here.


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## jagmanx (Jan 23, 2020)

Differring "layers" .

Schengen rules  conflict with EU Law for EU citizens but it has not mattered (Or just not bothered)
At this precise moment we are still EU. That is clearly going to change maybe in stages.
I suspect our "Friends in Brussels" will play "hardball" with this and other things.
The conundrum for them is that Spain and Portugal will also be losers...Not sure there will be any winners except politicians / eurocrats !
As in post #21 my sympathies are with those who are used to no restrictions.
Not being selfish but for us a minor headache in that a trip to Northern Scandinavia becomes a tad rushed...
But plenty to see in UK
Again interesting to wonder if you go to ROI via NI..Will there be any problem.
All the talk is of a soft border which COULD imply no effective limit ?
Then again Get the Ferry from ROI to France ???


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## korky (Jan 23, 2020)

trevskoda said:


> Lighten up.


It's alright saying lighten up. Your comment was ignorant.


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## Kontiki (Jan 23, 2020)

Looking at this website it doesn't look like ROI is in     Schengen Countries
This is just one of the things that will hurt everybody, also between 16 & 70 you will need to pay 7€ for a 3 year travel permit + 2 international driving licences if you want to visit France & Spain


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## Penny13 (Jan 23, 2020)

Option 1 ... Sorn our vehicle like others 
Option 2 ... Stay as an illegal 
Option 3 ... Ron loses his pocket money paying fine


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## shortcircuit (Jan 23, 2020)

A few years ago I had a discussion with a couple who told me there was no need to road tax your vehicle when abroad as it was a “British “ tax.  I said I understood vehicle had to be totally road legal as in UK.  Nonsense says them, “ we were both police officers and know what we are talking about.  I have a great respect for the police but these were a pair of plonkers.


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## Kontiki (Jan 23, 2020)

One year I was chatting to a caravanner who had spent the winter in Spain, he said he sorn'd his car & cancelled the insurance!! Said he didn't need it as he was out of the UK. I would have thought it was easy to catch people like him coming into the country at the port, they could have a number recognition camera linked to the DVLA.


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## Millie Master (Jan 23, 2020)

korky said:


> Frankly that is a load of nonsense and not even factually correct. The 90 day rule will only apply when we have left after the transition period.



How wrong can someone be!!!!

Under Schengen rules a UK passport holder can only stop a maximum of 90 days unless they have already applied for a cartes de séjour and I quote below an extract from the www.thelocal.fr website. dated 8th August 2019: -

"You would be permitted to enter France at passport control as a UK citizen under the Schengen rules for up to *90 days*, so the applications for cartes de séjour would need to be made during this time."

I used to live in France and did so for 10 brilliant years and it really used to peeeee me off how many English people totally flouted EU & French laws, such as not re-registering their UK cars etc. and as for these without a cartes de séjour, well my mind used to boggle, no wonder so many hard working French artisans as well as law abiding tradesman Brits were so totally fed up with so many UK nationals who flouted the law!!


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## korky (Jan 23, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> How wrong can someone be!!!!
> 
> Under Schengen rules a UK passport holder can only stop a maximum of 90 days unless they have already applied for a cartes de séjour and I quote below an extract from the www.thelocal.fr website. dated 8th August 2019: -
> 
> ...


I meant


Millie Master said:


> How wrong can someone be!!!!
> 
> Under Schengen rules a UK passport holder can only stop a maximum of 90 days unless they have already applied for a cartes de séjour and I quote below an extract from the www.thelocal.fr website. dated 8th August 2019: -
> 
> ...


If you read the original post it states that the French are fining people for staying more than 90 days in EU.Not for staying more than 90 days in one single country e.g France which has always been the rule but not previously enforced.


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> How wrong can someone be!!!!
> 
> Under Schengen rules a UK passport holder can only stop a maximum of 90 days unless they have already applied for a cartes de séjour and I quote below an extract from the www.thelocal.fr website. dated 8th August 2019: -
> 
> ...


I think the point is that Schengen rules will only come into force after the transition period . UK Gov website seems to confirm this to my satisfaction , but I may not be correct . Hope anybody who has first hand experience of being fined will post here . Make sure they are bona fida police !


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## kenspain (Jan 23, 2020)

This is why my friend that spends more time over here and Portugal ask me to help him get his van registered onto Spanish Plates. So I Registered him at my address and got his van now on Spanish plates .All he dose is gets a cheap flight to return to the UK and I go and pick him up when he comes over,


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## Canalsman (Jan 23, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> I might be wrong but arent the customs in Calais British ?



Yes, but it's the UK Border Force.

Customs checks, if any, are on the UK side.


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## John H (Jan 23, 2020)

The 90 day rule for stays in the EU already exists. People have been fined for overstaying for many years. Quite simply, if you are not a citizen of a member state you are limited to 90 days in any 180. Thus, Americans, Canadians, Australians, Chinese, Turks, etc etc have been penalised if they  have overstayed. After the end of the transition period (December 31st 2020) we will be citizens of a non-member state and therefore open to being fined too. Up to that point, any attempt to fine us is illegal. If you get stopped by someone purporting to be a police officer, check his/her credentials carefully. If you have any doubts, ask them to take you to the nearest police station and speak to a senior officer. If you hear of a story about someone being fined check what nationality they are. Whatever you have heard, Brits are not liable to a fine until we actually leave the EU.


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## peter palance (Jan 23, 2020)

korky said:


> It's alright saying lighten up. Your comment was ignorant.


no point in being less, they just step all over you,some have to bite. come what may, ok,pj


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## REC (Jan 23, 2020)

We will be away this trip more than 90 days, but just in case of the French trying to fine, we will have receipts from each country to show not in any one country over 90 days. But as others have said, it is still freedom of movement for member states in EU till after transition. We have temporary residence in Portugal (5yrs) but still not really clear how this will be affected by Bexit until the government publish clear guidelines


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## TJBi (Jan 23, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> How wrong can someone be!!!!
> 
> Under Schengen rules a UK passport holder can only stop a maximum of 90 days unless they have already applied for a cartes de séjour and I quote below an extract from the www.thelocal.fr website. dated 8th August 2019: -
> 
> ...


The above post is extremely misleading due its its highly selective quotation from the full article, which relates to the situation AFTER Brexit and after any transition period. How wrong can someone be!!!!


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

John H said:


> The 90 day rule for stays in the EU already exists. People have been fined for overstaying for many years. Quite simply, if you are not a citizen of a member state you are limited to 90 days in any 180. Thus, Americans, Canadians, Australians, Chinese, Turks, etc etc have been penalised if they  have overstayed. After the end of the transition period (December 31st 2020) we will be citizens of a non-member state and therefore open to being fined too. Up to that point, any attempt to fine us is illegal. If you get stopped by someone purporting to be a police officer, check his/her credentials carefully. If you have any doubts, ask them to take you to the nearest police station and speak to a senior officer. If you hear of a story about someone being fined check what nationality they are. Whatever you have heard, Brits are not liable to a fine until we actually leave the EU.


Yes this is how we see things . Do you think the Schengen clock will start on the 31st December 2020 giving us a further 90 days or will it be backdated , eg fined on the 1st Jan 2021 if you have already been in for more than 90 days ?


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

POI Admin said:


> Yes, but it's the UK Border Force.
> 
> Customs checks, if any, are on the UK side.


So UK border force are allegedly fining people ? I would find that strange and French customs trying to fine you when you are already on British soil . Equally find that strange ?


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## Canalsman (Jan 23, 2020)

UK customs on this side of the Channel!

Actually the French authorities check your credentials then the UK Border Force. 

The original poster's reporting of fines is actually impossible because at this point we are still in the EU!


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## jacquigem (Jan 23, 2020)

Yes, thank you that is what I thought


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## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

Coincidentally received this today from UK Gov website

*Passports and travel after Brexit*
Check your passport is valid for travel before you book your trip. Your passport should be valid for the proposed duration of your stay; you do not need any additional period of validity on your passport beyond this.
You’ll need to renew your passport before travelling if you do not have enough time left on your passport.
The rules on travel will stay the same until the implementation period ends on 31 December 2020. During this time you can continue to travel to countries in the Schengen area or elsewhere in the EU with your UK passport.
We will update these pages with details of any changes to the rules as soon as information is available. You should sign up for updates to this guidance.

Confirms I think that we are safe till 31/12/20 when implementation (ie transition ) period ends.

My question is still after the implementation period ends will we get another 90 days under Schengen or will we have to get out by 31/12/20 if we have already been in the Schengen area for 90 days ?


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

Logically you should get 90 days from the time of the rule coming into force with no "Hangover from New Year's Eve"
New year new era new start !
But bureaucrats & politicians rarely see logic (unless cash is involved !)
So it could be the last "good winter" not relevant for us but I hope so for others !


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## DnK (Jan 24, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> My question is still after the implementation period ends will we get another 90 days under Schengen or will we have to get out by 31/12/20 if we have already been in the Schengen area for 90 days ?



Currently nobody can answer your question. 

People are jumping to conclusions that we will be restricted to 90 in 180 days because we become a third Country after Brexit and therefore will be required to have a Schengen visa which has that time/duration limitation for travel in Schengen Area. There's a good site about Schengen here and theres an a page of info that may give us a glimmer of hope here on that site we won't need a visa and therefore there would be no time restriction. It also gives info about future travel in Schengen Area such as the ETIAS system where we will need to apply on line for authorisation to travel in EU/Schengen Area from Jan 2021.


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## antiquesam (Jan 24, 2020)

I'm a bit confused as to how the French would know how long you've been in Europe. No one has ever done anything but glance at my passport as I've entered France, which I did every week when working, and no one but the ferry company had any interest in who I was when I returned to the UK. As far as anyone in the French Government know I could have been away since 1990.


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## shortcircuit (Jan 24, 2020)

My passport is scanned at Dover by the ferry operator and by Passport Control on the way back at Calais.  I have no doubt these systems will be integrated and big brother will know when you are in and out


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## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

I assumed they scanned our passports when we came in from the tunnel ? Hope I am wrong .

 Maybe new rules will only apply on first trip out after 31/12/20 ?


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## barryd (Jan 24, 2020)

DnK said:


> Currently nobody can answer your question.
> 
> People are jumping to conclusions that we will be restricted to 90 in 180 days because we become a third Country after Brexit and therefore will be required to have a Schengen visa which has that time/duration limitation for travel in Schengen Area. There's a good site about Schengen here a*nd theres an a page of info that may give us a glimmer of hope here on that site we won't need a visa and therefore there would be no time restriction.* It also gives info about future travel in Schengen Area such as the ETIAS system where we will need to apply on line for authorisation to travel in EU/Schengen Area from Jan 2021.



Am I missing something here in your link?  I cant see anything that offers any prospect of staying beyond the 90 days for third countries, quite the opposite.


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

Agreed 
ETIAS just bypasses the need for Schengen but still has the 90 in 180 limit


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## DnK (Jan 24, 2020)

barryd said:


> Am I missing something here in your link?  I cant see anything that offers any prospect of staying beyond the 90 days for third countries, quite the opposite.



It's under the section "UK Nationals Travelling to Schengan Area"

............ Britons will be treated as non-EU countries are.

*Though they will not be subject to visa requirements*, they still need to apply for and get an ETIAS starting from January 2021. My thinking being no visa no visa rules. Jagmax though rightly says the ETIAS will be restricted to 90 in 180 for non visa required countries.


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## DnK (Jan 24, 2020)

jagmanx said:


> Agreed
> ETIAS just bypasses the need for Schengen but still has the 90 in 180 limit



Hmm! Yeah I get what your saying. Ah, my glimmer of hope just gone.


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## DnK (Jan 24, 2020)

Is there still a glimmer of hope?, again from the Schengen site.

We have developed this form, so you can check if you will need to apply for an ETIAS Authorization or a Schengen Visa before traveling to Schengen Area.


Will you need ETIAS to travel to Europe, starting from 2021? 
Select your citizenship*

 ×United Kingdom

*You could potentially need ETIAS! *
As of now, it is still unclear how traveling for Britons will be arranged in a post-Brexit Europe.
The UK and EU will be negotiating about the free movement of people, and there is a possibility that the outcome would be: ETIAS for UK citizens!


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## witzend (Jan 24, 2020)

jennyp19 said:


> I’ve just had message from a friend .


Sounds like the start of a gassing thread


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

witzend said:


> Sounds like the start of a gassing thread


More of a GUESSING thread !!!


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## trevskoda (Jan 24, 2020)

peter palance said:


> take the lead out of your boots,keep moving trev, there is a wide world out there, keep moving.ok.pj.


How did you know about the lead,that church roof will never be the same.


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## jennyp19 (Jan 24, 2020)

No it’s not.  If you look on the heading I posted I put a ? at the end - 
I was wondering if this had happened to anyone on here.  The amount of people this could happen to is minimal and probably the ones it could happen to will find out as they travel back when the weather improves. I hope it’s rumour as well.


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## trevskoda (Jan 24, 2020)

peter palance said:


> no point in being less, they just step all over you,some have to bite. come what may, ok,pj


I cannot bite as teeth are at dentist to get sharpened,sorry for any thing i said which may offend,am i ok to go now osifer.


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## trevskoda (Jan 24, 2020)

I take it if i get the irish passport then i can come and go if i wish but what about my vans reg as its N I British plates,surly its me and not the van as they can be bought anywhere, or would this get you a pull by the feds.


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## kenspain (Jan 24, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I'm a bit confused as to how the French would know how long you've been in Europe. No one has ever done anything but glance at my passport as I've entered France, which I did every week when working, and no one but the ferry company had any interest in who I was when I returned to the UK. As far as anyone in the French Government know I could have been away since 1990.


My son told me that they are working on the idea that as soon as you enter an EU country you will be given a sticker to put in your windscreen with a date you entered .


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## barryd (Jan 24, 2020)

The only glimmer of hope was the campaign for British citizens to be allowed to retain EU Citizenship but its hardly a weak twinkle let alone a glimmer.  This was started back in 2016 by Charles Goerens (A Luxembourg MEP) and backed by Guy Verhofstad who despite an element of loathing from many in the UK is actually very pro Brit. Well some of us.   I cant see it flying though although I wouldn't put it past the EU to actually offer it to UK citizens and for Johnson and his crew to decline.  The EU generally dont see freedom of movement for Brits within Europe as a bad thing, they see Freedom of movement as a good thing as do I.  Sadly that is not the case here.  

What I find amusing is the outrage on other social media that we may have to queue at a third country queue at airports, pay a visa charge or be limited in how long we can stay.  What did people think was going to happen?


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

barryd said:


> The only glimmer of hope was the campaign for British citizens to be allowed to retain EU Citizenship but its hardly a weak twinkle let alone a glimmer.  This was started back in 2016 by Charles Goerens (A Luxembourg MEP) and backed by Guy Verhofstad who despite an element of loathing from many in the UK is actually very pro Brit. Well some of us.   I cant see it flying though although I wouldn't put it past the EU to actually offer it to UK citizens and for Johnson and his crew to decline.  The EU generally dont see freedom of movement for Brits within Europe as a bad thing, they see Freedom of movement as a good thing as do I.  Sadly that is not the case here.
> 
> What I find amusing is the outrage on other social media that we may have to queue at a third country queue at airports, pay a visa charge or be limited in how long we can stay.  What did people think was going to happen?


Too True Barry, But if we post more it will be political etc etc. The whole thing has been a nightmare for 2.5 years and more to come.
I accept it was voted for and NOW we are Stuck with it OR F***ed by It. hard hat on. Before the Brexiteers get up in arms NOTICE I say I accept the referendum decision..ENUFF !


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## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

jagmanx said:


> Too True Barry, But if we post more it will be political etc etc. The whole thing has been a nightmare for 2.5 years and more to come.
> I accept it was voted for and NOW we are Stuck with it OR F***ed by It. hard hat on. Before the Brexiteers get up in arms NOTICE I say I accept the referendum decision..ENUFF !


Coming back to 90 day position just had a meeting with my local  Councillor in La Marina regarding other matters and he informed me that if I stay in Spain for more than 90 days I need Spanish Residency . This surprised me as I had previously only thought that Residency only needed if I stayed more than 6 months . Also thought that if I take out residency must stay for more than 6 months in Spain . Also if staying for more than 3 months need Spanish driving licence but then he was not sure how long I could drive in UK on Spanish licence as I would have to surrender my UK licence. He is to find out ?  Regards Confused .com but will post if anything meaningful comes out


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

Yep Confusing
OK if you are going to live Spain (KenSpain) and also a friend of mine has bought a flat
BUT I suggest not for motorhomers...lots of reasons as you imply !


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## REC (Jan 24, 2020)

I think this is the problem, there are so many things affected by Brexit that each country, and possibly each bureaucrat, currently seems to have their own take on the new rules which often haven't yet been decided upon! Wait and see seems to be the only answer, just don't try and plan anything in advance.


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## Kontiki (Jan 24, 2020)

Without wishing to start the B****T argument although I accept that it is over but don't expect me a committed remoaner to happily keep quiet. as far as my view is prove me wrong then I will  be more than willing to grovel  & ask for forgiveness for not believing that Boris will deliver an outcome where we are better off in any way. I really do hope for everybody's sake a lot of these concerns can be agreed to but fear our rights such as freedom of travel, EHIC cards etc. will be way down the list of priorities. It will affect us as well as places such as Spain who obviously welcome us pensioners spending our cash in the winter months.


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## Fisherman (Jan 24, 2020)

Kontiki said:


> Without wishing to start the B****T argument although I accept that it is over but don't expect me a committed remoaner to happily keep quiet. as far as my view is prove me wrong then I will  be more than willing to grovel  & ask for forgiveness for not believing that Boris will deliver an outcome where we are better off in any way. I really do hope for everybody's sake a lot of these concerns can be agreed to but fear our rights such as freedom of travel, EHIC cards etc. will be way down the list of priorities. It will affect us as well as places such as Spain who obviously welcome us pensioners spending our cash in the winter months.



I could not agree more kontiki. It begs the obvious question, and only time will tell.


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## barryd (Jan 24, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Coming back to 90 day position just had a meeting with my local  Councillor in La Marina regarding other matters and he informed me that if I stay in Spain for more than 90 days I need Spanish Residency . This surprised me as I had previously only thought that Residency only needed if I stayed more than 6 months . Also thought that if I take out residency must stay for more than 6 months in Spain . Also if staying for more than 3 months need Spanish driving licence but then he was not sure how long I could drive in UK on Spanish licence as I would have to surrender my UK licence. He is to find out ?  Regards Confused .com but will post if anything meaningful comes out



I think you can get something called a Padron to stay in Spain and some are arguing that they will be able to take one out in order to get round the 90 day rule but as far as I am aware it only applies if you have a Spanish address. Im not sure a campsite or aire counts.   I suspect the Spanish authorities may well turn a blind eye to overstayers, they may not if fining them becomes a good revenue stream but I think the issues will arise at Schengen entry ports / borders.  If you have overstayed it will flag up as soon as you get there.  What they then do with you I guess depends on who what and where but people do get fined and can be refused entry in the future.   I just dont see a way round it sadly without "winging it" and hoping for the best.


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

With regards to "winging it" No !
But maybe Spain/Portugal will force a Sprouty solution


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## antiquesam (Jan 24, 2020)

barryd said:


> I think you can get something called a Padron to stay in Spain and some are arguing that they will be able to take one out in order to get round the 90 day rule but as far as I am aware it only applies if you have a Spanish address. Im not sure a campsite or aire counts.   I suspect the Spanish authorities may well turn a blind eye to overstayers, they may not if fining them becomes a good revenue stream but I think the issues will arise at Schengen entry ports / borders.  If you have overstayed it will flag up as soon as you get there.  What they then do with you I guess depends on who what and where but people do get fined and can be refused entry in the future.   I just dont see a way round it sadly without "winging it" and hoping for the best.


How will it flag up. See my comments at 45.


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## jagmanx (Jan 24, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> How will it flag up. See my comments at 45.


Passports are scanned  now using their bar codes and almost certainly date-stamped.. The wonders of modern technology.
Ferry companies and the shuttle ask for passport numbers etc etc..Then there is ANPR !
Data Protection...My Rear End !


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## witzend (Jan 24, 2020)

Surely nothing has been agreed yet so all this is just speculation. It'll be months yet before anything will be agreed and we'll be informed when we need to know. As for the 90 day rule  who was fined this is like gassing thread a friend of a friend told someone he knows of someone !!!!!


----------



## jennyp19 (Jan 24, 2020)

witzend said:


> Surely nothing has been agreed yet so all this is just speculation. It'll be months yet before anything will be agreed and we'll be informed when we need to know. As for the 90 day rule  who was fined this is like gassing thread a friend of a friend told someone he knows of someone !!!!!


It may be speculation- but this can be a reality. The rules are in place already - it’s just whether the French enforce them or not. Hence my comment- the Santander or Rotterdam Ferries will start to be appealing. The Spanish have already said they will still want the UK tourists.


----------



## John H (Jan 24, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Yes this is how we see things . Do you think the Schengen clock will start on the 31st December 2020 giving us a further 90 days or will it be backdated , eg fined on the 1st Jan 2021 if you have already been in for more than 90 days ?



It is difficult to see how it could legally be backdated because until 31st December we are bound by EU rules. They cannot then say that we weren't bound by those rules at a later date. Thus the 90 day rule will kick in on Jan 1st 2021 - unless, of course, there is a further extension to the transition period


----------



## John H (Jan 24, 2020)

witzend said:


> Surely nothing has been agreed yet so all this is just speculation. It'll be months yet before anything will be agreed and we'll be informed when we need to know. As for the 90 day rule  who was fined this is like gassing thread a friend of a friend told someone he knows of someone !!!!!


The only speculation is whether/when we leave the Single Market. If/when we do then the 90 day rule WILL kick in - as already stated by both the EU and our own government. https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/info/files/brexit_files/info_site/travelling.pdf

I do, however, share your scepticism about tales of people being fined before we leave.


----------



## kenspain (Jan 24, 2020)

barryd said:


> I think you can get something called a Padron to stay in Spain and some are arguing that they will be able to take one out in order to get round the 90 day rule but as far as I am aware it only applies if you have a Spanish address. Im not sure a campsite or aire counts.   I suspect the Spanish authorities may well turn a blind eye to overstayers, they may not if fining them becomes a good revenue stream but I think the issues will arise at Schengen entry ports / borders.  If you have overstayed it will flag up as soon as you get there.  What they then do with you I guess depends on who what and where but people do get fined and can be refused entry in the future.   I just dont see a way round it sadly without "winging it" and hoping for the best.


We tried that for my friend they would not except a camp site as an address so I got him a papron at my address so we could put his van on Spanish reg.


----------



## Millie Master (Jan 24, 2020)

jennyp19 said:


> It may be speculation- but this can be a reality. The rules are in place already - it’s just whether the French enforce them or not. Hence my comment- the Santander or Rotterdam Ferries will start to be appealing. The Spanish have already said they will still want the UK tourists.



Having lived there for 10 years, I know only too well how the dear old gendarmes can be very much a law unto themselves!

As this is very much the case (and the reason why so many French people dislike/hate them) if it is a law and you happen to have been stopped by them and are foolish enough to start exhibiting any kind of frustration then I know from bitter experience that they can become shirty and exceptionally nitpicking.


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

barryd said:


> I think you can get something called a Padron to stay in Spain and some are arguing that they will be able to take one out in order to get round the 90 day rule but as far as I am aware it only applies if you have a Spanish address. Im not sure a campsite or aire counts.   I suspect the Spanish authorities may well turn a blind eye to overstayers, they may not if fining them becomes a good revenue stream but I think the issues will arise at Schengen entry ports / borders.  If you have overstayed it will flag up as soon as you get there.  What they then do with you I guess depends on who what and where but people do get fined and can be refused entry in the future.   I just dont see a way round it sadly without "winging it" and hoping for the best.


Yes I think you are right , we have always signed onto the Padron as a means of legitisimising our stay but the councilor today said we should not sign the Padron unless we are applying for residencia ?


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

John H said:


> The only speculation is whether/when we leave the Single Market. If/when we do then the 90 day rule WILL kick in - as already stated by both the EU and our own government. https://ec.europa.eu/info/sites/info/files/brexit_files/info_site/travelling.pdf
> 
> I do, however, share your scepticism about tales of people being fined before we leave.


Yes John but will it be backdated or will it apply to the future or new entry visits ? Only time will tell I guess.


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

John H said:


> It is difficult to see how it could legally be backdated because until 31st December we are bound by EU rules. They cannot then say that we weren't bound by those rules at a later date. Thus the 90 day rule will kick in on Jan 1st 2021 - unless, of course, there is a further extension to the transition period


I hope this is the case John but maybe they say being in the EU shielded you from Schengen rules and now you are no longer in the EU you are so no longer shielded . Ferries and tunnel could be pretty busy on the 31st December 2020 ?


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

REC said:


> I think this is the problem, there are so many things affected by Brexit that each country, and possibly each bureaucrat, currently seems to have their own take on the new rules which often haven't yet been decided upon! Wait and see seems to be the only answer, just don't try and plan anything in advance.


For what its worth ,the one thing the councilor did say was that as there has been a deal agreed then there will be on unilateral deals with Spain or any other EU single country  . Everything will need agreeing via Brussels .


----------



## antiquesam (Jan 24, 2020)

witzend said:


> Surely nothing has been agreed yet so all this is just speculation. It'll be months yet before anything will be agreed and we'll be informed when we need to know. As for the 90 day rule  who was fined this is like gassing thread a friend of a friend told someone he knows of someone !!!!!


As you say these facilities are available, but I'm not sure they are used, especially as we apparently have no knowledge of who enters the UK. The only thing the French police have checked on my return journey has been a swab check of the steering wheel for drugs or explosives, and I quite often went out in one vehicle and returned in another.


----------



## barryd (Jan 24, 2020)

witzend said:


> Surely nothing has been agreed yet so all this is just speculation. It'll be months yet before anything will be agreed and we'll be informed when we need to know. As for the 90 day rule  who was fined this is like gassing thread a friend of a friend told someone he knows of someone !!!!!



As mentioned by John H the 90 day system has been in place for some time.  The UK will simply drop into that third country category so no speculation at all.  Unless of course we agree on freedom of movement or are somehow able to retain our EU Citizenship which entitles us to roam freely.  The first is about as popular with Brexiteers as a fart in a spacesuit and the second extremely unlikely and I suspect even if the EU offer it this government would stick a spanner in the works anyway.

The supposed fines by Gendarmes before we have left I find very hard to believe. If true they were either con men or have acted illegally.  However when I researched this way back in 2016 as it was something that concerned me very much I did indeed find first hand accounts of third country nationals being heavily fined and kicked out including one who was refused entry when he tried to return and one in the Netherlands that actually got locked up.


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## antiquesam (Jan 24, 2020)

jagmanx said:


> Passports are scanned  now using their bar codes and almost certainly date-stamped.. The wonders of modern technology.
> Ferry companies and the shuttle ask for passport numbers etc etc..Then there is ANPR !
> Data Protection...My Rear End !


These facilities are available but I'm not sure if they are used. We apparently have no record of Europeans in the UK and the only check I've had from the French police is a swab rubbed on the steering wheel and ANPR doesn't work if you travel out in one vehicle and return in another, as I often did.


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## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

Well you cant expect the UK to work efficiently can you ?


----------



## antiquesam (Jan 24, 2020)

No but are the French any better? I've never seen a French policeman come out of their office in Calais or Folkestone and they don't have any presence in Portsmouth.


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## jacquigem (Jan 24, 2020)

Probably not , but as said above passport scanned on entry to and exit from Schengen. More than 90 days ? get ready for sanctions. The only thing we need to know is when this starts and then we can plan accordingly


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## barryd (Jan 24, 2020)

This report from 2018 talks about a new Schengen entry system that is supposed to be coming online this year.  Sounds like they are going to introduce Biometric ID methods for third country nationals entering the zone.  https://blog.gemalto.com/government...l-revolutionize-schengen-area-border-control/  Clearly they are taking it seriously.

There are little or no checks at our UK ports at the moment I presume because we are in the EU and have free movement.  If there are customs checks for commercials and checks for every individual tourist WTF are the queues going to be like?


----------



## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

There won't be any queues or checks - Boris says, so it must be true


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## John H (Jan 25, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> I hope this is the case John but maybe they say being in the EU shielded you from Schengen rules and now you are no longer in the EU you are so no longer shielded . Ferries and tunnel could be pretty busy on the 31st December 2020 ?


Being in the EU does not shield you from Schengen rules. Everybody visiting Schengen countries is subject to Schengen rules. Those rules allow unlimited stays if you are a member (the freedom of movement directive over-rules all else, despite what some posts above have said). Any new rules associated with a new situation (ie us being out) will apply from the date of the new rules but the more I think about it the more impossible it would be for the new rules to back-dated. If we are in the Single Market intil 31st December then we are in it and able to travel freely.


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## John H (Jan 25, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> As you say these facilities are available, but I'm not sure they are used, especially as we apparently have no knowledge of who enters the UK. The only thing the French police have checked on my return journey has been a swab check of the steering wheel for drugs or explosives, and I quite often went out in one vehicle and returned in another.]/
> 
> Anyone who enters the UK or Schengen legally has their passport scanned. They know exactly how long you have been there.


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## jacquigem (Jan 25, 2020)

John H said:


> Being in the EU does not shield you from Schengen rules. Everybody visiting Schengen countries is subject to Schengen rules. Those rules allow unlimited stays if you are a member (the freedom of movement directive over-rules all else, despite what some posts above have said). Any new rules associated with a new situation (ie us being out) will apply from the date of the new rules but the more I think about it the more impossible it would be for the new rules to back-dated. If we are in the Single Market intil 31st December then we are in it and able to travel freely.


Yes well we hope you are right but I guess we will just have to wait and see and hope the authorities issue clarification nearer the time


----------



## runnach (Jan 25, 2020)

I agree with John , it would be highly unusual for new rules to be set retrospectively. After a date is set and arrangements finaliised I would expect the rules negotiated to apply.. as things stand we are still part of the eu so business as normal. As far as I can tell there are no immediate changes within the proposed transition period. Any concessions still need to be thrashed out


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

Are we sure the fine actually happened to British citizens?
I can't see any reports on t'web.


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## Kontiki (Jan 25, 2020)

Saying 'someone' has been fined doesn't make it any more true than when people knew somebody who knew somebody whose friend had been gassed. There will be rumours everywhere while uncertainty prevails. Cause Boris will sort it hmmm 'dead in a ditch' 'lying in front of bulldozers' I'm sure I could fill pages on what the Boris has promised. Lets see what he can actually deliver.
Unless it has happened to them then its just unproven hearsay.


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## kenspain (Jan 25, 2020)

An English couple got fined in our village because the had been living here for 5 months and not changed there cars reg over to Spanish


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

That's nothing new is it? Or have the Spanish been lenient in the past with vehicle documentation?
I thought visitors had 6 months before registration but residents only 30 days?
They'd have run into bother of one sort another anyway eventually with mot-insurance-tax running out.
It must be tempting to try it on with UK vehicle given the rigmarole and 'VAT' on value for import.


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## Millie Master (Jan 25, 2020)

kenspain said:


> An English couple got fined in our village because the had been living here for 5 months and not changed there cars reg over to Spanish


And so should any Brit in any EU country who take the pi55 out of the system, I did know of a couple or so cases when I lived in the Dordogne when the culprits were the kind of stupid idiots who didn't know that you never ever argue with a gendarme !


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## jagmanx (Jan 25, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> And so should any Brit in any EU country who take the pi55 out of the system, I did know of a couple or so cases when I lived in the Dordogne when the culprits were the kind of stupid idiots who didn't know that you never ever argue with a gendarme !


Except the one in "Allo Allo" anyway this thread is an interesting way of "pissing the time". Despite what I have posted as others have said. "wait and pee" Sorry see !


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## jacquigem (Jan 25, 2020)

kenspain said:


> An English couple got fined in our village because the had been living here for 5 months and not changed there cars reg over to Spanish


Thats interesting Ken , I thought we had 6 months before vehicles needed to be re registered but guess you live and learn. Do you know if you can take a quick break in Portugal or France to reset the clock ?


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## kenspain (Jan 25, 2020)

I don't think you can as Portugal is still the EU


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## jagmanx (Jan 25, 2020)

Morocco ?


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## R0B (Jan 25, 2020)

Does anybody know how Gib fits in?


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## jacquigem (Jan 25, 2020)

kenspain said:


> I don't think you can as Portugal is still the EU


Yes i understand you cant to get round Schengen but wondered if different rules apply re car reg . I had been told that if i stay in Spain for more than 3 months(again I thought it was 6 months!) I should be applying for  residency even under current rules . My councillor wasnot sure if Leaving Spain even to another EU country reset that clock. He is due to check and come back to me


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

Spa ish rules below - most countries the same 6 months 








						Car registration in another EU country - Your Europe
					

How long can you stay in an EU country before you have to register your car there? Where should your car be registered if your stay is only temporary? Can you be exempt from registering your car? Are there penalties if you don't register your car?




					europa.eu


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

R0B said:


> Does anybody know how Gib fits in?



Gib is in EU as British dependency.
Well for another week anyway!


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## kenspain (Jan 25, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Yes i understand you cant to get round Schengen but wondered if different rules apply re car reg . I had been told that if i stay in Spain for more than 3 months(again I thought it was 6 months!) I should be applying for  residency even under current rules . My councillor wasnot sure if Leaving Spain even to another EU country reset that clock. He is due to check and come back to me


Sorry if I miss lead any one the couple in my village have lived here 6 months and are getting there car registered on Tuesday but still got to pay the fine, what a joke it,s only 4 days overdue


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

I rather suspect that our DVLA would be just as inflexible!


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## Sharpie (Jan 25, 2020)

Well they have had six months to not get around to doing it, so I have little sympathy.


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## jacquigem (Jan 25, 2020)

Fair enough but I think there are many travelling vans that have traditionally visited Spain for periods of more than 6 months and the authorities have traditionally turned a blind eye  . I guess British vans will be increasingly targeted as we move to exit EU and everything seems to be moving towards 3 month maximum visits


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## Sharpie (Jan 25, 2020)

Further, perhaps they may also  be relying on the NHS and an EHIC to look after them. Rather than making other arrangements such as joining the Spanish heathcare system. Since they have been there for over 6 months that would suggest that they are not "ordinarily resident" in the UK so would not.









						Planning your healthcare
					

Healthcare information and advice for UK nationals moving to, or working in, the EU, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland on or after 1 January 2021.




					www.nhs.uk
				




Many many expats have discovered this only when they needed it and it wasn't there for them.

Really if you are going to move abroad, do your homework and follow the rules. Don't expect to just carry on regardless.


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## Sharpie (Jan 25, 2020)

We are also planning to kick out EU people on a similar basis. Lots of French working in the city, and their employers, have made plans or already left. Polish workers too.


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## jacquigem (Jan 25, 2020)

I dont want to move abroad but have enjoyed travelling for more than 3 months


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## Markd (Jan 25, 2020)

If you stay in the same place for more than 6 months you may expect local plod to notice.
In this case they knew they had to do it - just didn't. 
Anyway this time next year it won't be an issue when we're on 90 day max trips!


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## barge1914 (Jan 25, 2020)

DnK said:


> Is there still a glimmer of hope?, again from the Schengen site.
> 
> We have developed this form, so you can check if you will need to apply for an ETIAS Authorization or a Schengen Visa before traveling to Schengen Area.
> 
> ...


It’s ETIAS for all non-Schengen country citizens, I understand it’s a security thing that will be required irrespective of whether you come from a country that enjoys visa free travel or not.


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## DnK (Jan 25, 2020)

barge1914 said:


> It’s ETIAS for all non-Schengen country citizens, I understand it’s a security thing that will be required irrespective of whether you come from a country that enjoys visa free travel or not.



Yeah, I get that. The glimmer of hope is: "The UK and EU will be negotiating about the free movement of people",


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## witzend (Jan 25, 2020)

jennyp19 said:


> The Spanish have already said they will still want the UK tourists.





kenspain said:


> My son told me that they are working on the idea that as soon as you enter an EU country you will be given a sticker to put in your windscreen with a date you entered .


Thats from a Spanish police man so  don't seem much like they want us either


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## jagmanx (Jan 26, 2020)

Easy...just get a new windscreen


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## jagmanx (Jan 26, 2020)

Many Europeans whether ordinary people or minor/ major politicians and nearly all of the Eurocrats see brexit as being a nonsense a complete waste of time and effort etc.
I am not being political re the Vote in UK and the rights and wrongs.
But from a European perspective why should they do us any favours as "We have created the problem".
OK Spain may want to be more flexible (but then there is the long-running Gibraltar issue).
I cannot see France or others being influenced by Spain.
BTW Spain has 2 territories in Morocco ! So 2x Pots calling the kettle....

ROI is more interesting and given the wish to avoid a hard border with NI over 3 months in ROI may be easy BUT ROI is not Spain.

Wait and see rather than hope IMO.
As has been posted Many countries have a similar 3 month rule.
Fortunately for us and others Canada being Ex-commonwealth has a 180 day entitlement for UK passport holders


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## John H (Jan 26, 2020)

jagmanx said:


> Fortunately for us and others Canada being Ex-commonwealth has a 180 day entitlement for UK passport holders


True but I think I'd rather spend our winter somewhere warmer! - Australia, perhaps?


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## Sharpie (Jan 26, 2020)

OK, here is some clear and factual info. about living in Spain, relevant until the end of this year:





__





						Living in Spain
					

Information for British citizens moving to or living in Spain, including guidance on residency, healthcare and passports.




					www.gov.uk
				




No excuse for not knowing or following the rules, or thinking that you can just get away with it.

FWIW I have two relatives, one lives in Spain, the other in France, and have done for decades.

The Spanish one long ago decided to do the job properly and took out Spanish citizenship. He feels no connection to the UK, his life is there.

The other cousin likewise, not sure what her arrangements are but she's been there for over ten years, and soon to get married to her long-term French partner. I'm looking forward to the wedding, they do these things in great style, no fatuous religiosity involved. Unless you want that on the top, certainly they don't and I'm expecting a big party for a couple of days, in an idyllic location.

Quite how this will affect we roaming gypsies I don't know, but there are, and always have been rules and I do expect that they will become enforced more tightly in the future. And may change again.

No point moaning about it, what will be will be, just have to hope that Boris negotiates a compromise, though I don't think it is top of his priority list. Couldn't possibly do a worse job than his predecessor.

They like us and we like them and we like to do business with each other. Hopefully some sensible arrangements will emerge, now that we, the people have given him a clear unambiguous mandate, and he appears to have become a more serious person beneath his previous buffoon image. Well we can hope. 

There is a year to sort this out, let's hope they crack on with it, watch this space.


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## Millie Master (Jan 26, 2020)

What I can't recall reading anywhere through this very lengthy topic is the fact that there are ever growing numbers of people living throughout Europe who are fed up to the back teeth of what the EU has become.
The programme Ed Balls presented last week when he visited Holland illustrated something that I have know for some time having listened to several Dutch friends that they are fed up with the EU and the same goes for a large number of French friends and I know of quite large numbers of people from Italy, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Polland and Hungary who are all wishing to follow the lead set by the UK.

So we will have to see......................  All I do know is that I no longer have any plans to ever cross the English Channel ever again.


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## REC (Jan 26, 2020)

deleted as Realised old news!


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## runnach (Jan 26, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> What I can't recall reading anywhere through this very lengthy topic is the fact that there are ever growing numbers of people living throughout Europe who are fed up to the back teeth of what the EU has become.
> The programme Ed Balls presented last week when he visited Holland illustrated something that I have know for some time having listened to several Dutch friends that they are fed up with the EU and the same goes for a large number of French friends and I know of quite large numbers of people from Italy, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Polland and Hungary who are all wishing to follow the lead set by the UK.
> 
> So we will have to see......................  All I do know is that I no longer have any plans to ever cross the English Channel ever again.


 You perhaps don’t intend visiting the mainland , that’s your choice , but those that do enjoy extended trips are having that choice in all probability removed. 

 I can’t see that being fair, after all normally we would wanting to extend our rights of movement not curtail what we have enjoyed the last 40 years you surely don’t have to be a remainder to appreciate that viewpoint, neither does the viewpoint of those Europeans who are fed up with the eu really hold much sway or influence.

The best we can hope for is during the transition period a deal is brokered that reflects freedom of movement both ways entirely different to emigration and immigration ... our relationship may see that happen after all the first and only member to leave ,but of course there is also the chance the uk will be made an example of , that sends a message to member states,

I just hope what ever happens we have definitive answers sooner rather than later so people can prepare for arrangements


----------



## kenspain (Jan 26, 2020)

witzend said:


> Thats from a Spanish police man so  don't seem much like they want us either


It,s not the Spanish police that want it the orders that have come from Brussels


----------



## iampatman (Jan 26, 2020)

I’m sure Millie that the large number ( tens, hundreds, thousands?) of people you know of in the Netherlands, France, Italy, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Polland (where’s that?) and Hungary will be desolate that you won’t be crossing the English Channel and returning to good old Blighty.

Pat


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> What I can't recall reading anywhere through this very lengthy topic is the fact that there are ever growing numbers of people living throughout Europe who are fed up to the back teeth of what the EU has become.
> The programme Ed Balls presented last week when he visited Holland illustrated something that I have know for some time having listened to several Dutch friends that they are fed up with the EU and the same goes for a large number of French friends and I know of quite large numbers of people from Italy, Greece, Spain, Portugal, Polland and Hungary who are all wishing to follow the lead set by the UK.
> 
> So we will have to see......................  All I do know is that I no longer have any plans to ever cross the English Channel ever again.


Good really glad we never met you . Coincidentally we have decided to go for Spanish residency , despite the cost as I cannot bear to be part of BBB , Boris's Bullshit Britain.


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

kenspain said:


> It,s not the Spanish police that want it the orders that have come from Brussels


Maybe Spain like Britain should have is grow some balls . No good saying we can rule the world if we cant win arguments in Britain?


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Maybe Spain like Britain should have is grow some balls . No good saying we can rule the world if we cant win arguments in Britain?


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Sorry Brussels , angry now sorry


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

channa said:


> You perhaps don’t intend visiting the mainland , that’s your choice , but those that do enjoy extended trips are having that choice in all probability removed.
> 
> I can’t see that being fair, after all normally we would wanting to extend our rights of movement not curtail what we have enjoyed the last 40 years you surely don’t have to be a remainder to appreciate that viewpoint, neither does the viewpoint of those Europeans who are fed up with the eu really hold much sway or influence.
> 
> ...


Agreed if this planet is ever to survive we need to learn how to work together


----------



## kenspain (Jan 26, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Sorry Brussels , angry now sorry


There is now a few party's now saying its time to leave the EU only time will tell how far they will get.


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Sharpie said:


> Further, perhaps they may also  be relying on the NHS and an EHIC to look after them. Rather than making other arrangements such as joining the Spanish heathcare system. Since they have been there for over 6 months that would suggest that they are not "ordinarily resident" in the UK so would not.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Actually we are quite happy , iof we die there is enough life insurance to pay for cremation and maybe someone will take our ashes home , but then again we are not that bothered anyway


----------



## kenspain (Jan 26, 2020)

lucky I am in the healthcare here I have herd that some places will not except EHIC card so I would advice anyone to ask before you have any treatment if they will except this card


----------



## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

IF the EU ever finished it would be nothing to celebrate.
2008 would be like a panto by comparison.
So I would be careful what you are wishing for.


----------



## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> Correct, many EU citizens are asking the question, what is this regime all about? With the amount of money each member state is mugged for by the Hierarchy within, we should ALL, be living in Utopia, which we are not.
> 
> Which is why UK will have a hard time, for having the balls to stick two fingers up to the well heeled who get fat on our sweat.
> 
> Please don't cease your trips over the channel, it is not the people, many of whom you have befriended over the years, it is the power hungry and greedy Eurocrats we need to be rid off!!


No please dont come , neither of you are welcome , and dont try to tell me that Westminster is anything less greedy and self centered than Brussels


----------



## R0B (Jan 26, 2020)

REC said:


> Jus read this...https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46237012
> Transition period is 21 months ? How did I miss that....thought everyone said it would end 31/12/2020?


That article is 14 months old. I'm sure the views/opinions expressed were believed at the time - things change :-(


----------



## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

channa said:


> You perhaps don’t intend visiting the mainland , that’s your choice , but those that do enjoy extended trips are having that choice in all probability removed.
> 
> I can’t see that being fair, after all normally we would wanting to extend our rights of movement not curtail what we have enjoyed the last 40 years you surely don’t have to be a remainder to appreciate that viewpoint, neither does the viewpoint of those Europeans who are fed up with the eu really hold much sway or influence.
> 
> ...



You really have to stop talking so much sense Andrew, you are spoiling the thread

I find it incredible that a group of people on a forum like this who have enjoyed unlimited unhindered access to Europe for so long, that some actually think there is something to celebrate in the restrictions that are sure to come. Talking about Europe splitting up and going back to pre common market days  with borders between each state. How is this beneficial to anyone on here.


----------



## antiquesam (Jan 26, 2020)

Markd said:


> Gib is in EU as British dependency.
> Well for another week anyway!


There is talk of Gibraltar joining Schengen to allow cross border employment.


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> Be hard not to, due to the fact Mrs R is a French citizen, who has done the paperwork to formally allow her residence in UK after Breakfast.
> 
> As for Westminster, how many tiers of bureaucracies does one have to fund and, the world is no better for this.


Ah hiding behind the woman I see. I agree get rid of westminster, and lets get governed by Brussels and ultimately world government


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> It could work, basically, Status Quo, without having to pay billions for the privilege. Heyho, toys out the pram for UK having the audacity to stand up an be counted.





runnach said:


> It could work, basically, Status Quo, without having to pay billions for the privilege. Heyho, toys out the pram for UK having the audacity to stand up an be counted.


You might be right but I think I will spend the rest of my life saying DBM IVR (Dont blame me I voted Remain )


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## antiquesam (Jan 26, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Ah hiding behind the woman I see. I agree get rid of westminster, and lets get governed by Brussels and ultimately world government


I sincerely hope you are just upset with life and trying to wind people up and not being serious with some of your comments.


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> Hiding behind no one, just telling you the facts on how it is.


Thats ok , reminds me of Farage , had a German woman I think but could not get citizenship so dropped her for a French woman I understand


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> Don't lose sleep over it





runnach said:


> Don't lose sleep over it


I wont , know exactly where i am going


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## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> It could work, basically, Status Quo, without having to pay billions for the privilege. Heyho, toys out the pram for UK having the audacity to stand up an be counted.



It *Could *work, it was working just fine.
And if your prophets of doom about the EU happened it would be back to borders all over Europe.
And the world economy would be in tatters.
Oh and talking about your favourite subject fake news Runnach. How about this for fake news.


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

runnach said:


> After he got the knock back from German government, did Farage receive French citizenship?


Would not surprise me , Dyson gone to Singapore , Insurance man behind Farage gone to West Indies , Witherspoons stopped his meetings when customers rebelled. Anyway we are where we are but why come to Europe when you dont believe in it ?


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## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

Nuff said from me.
Lets all wait and see what unfolds in the next few years.
I voted to remain, but I hope for all our sakes that Brexit works.


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I sincerely hope you are just upset with life and trying to wind people up and not being serious with some of your comments.


No I am not upset and not trying to wind people up but am deadly serious about my comments. I hate hippcrocy and am just trying to say it as I see it


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## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)




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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Well if we dont agree with co operation , lets go the whole way . I never agreed with West Yorkshire so how about independence for the independent peoples republic of South Yorkshire


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Just wish Boris would keep to one of his promises and be "Dead in a ditch "soon


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## antiquesam (Jan 26, 2020)

I'm starting to feel I'm suffering deja vu, going back to all the old fights from the last three years. Surely it's not necessary to drag up the old arguments with pictures of buses.


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Sorry but yes it is , No Surrender Here !


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## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I'm starting to feel I'm suffering deja vu, going back to all the old fights from the last three years. Surely it's not necessary to drag up the old arguments with pictures of buses.



Not any old bus Eh Sam.
As for fighting, I leave that to my missus, she's deadly.


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## antiquesam (Jan 26, 2020)

jacquigem said:


> Just wish Boris would keep to one of his promises and be "Dead in a ditch "soon


If you do as you intend does that mean you won't be troubling us with this vitriol then?


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## jacquigem (Jan 26, 2020)

Heh who said I am going to harm myself ? Just being Realistic that after 64 years of hard living my time might be coming up , and if I dont have EHIC or cant afford private insurance then I will have to take the consequences .   What do you mean by vitriol ? Just been voicing my opinion . Is that a crime ?


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## Fisherman (Jan 26, 2020)

I post on another forum for retired and serving firefighters.
Before the referendum on brexit we started a thread on brexit.
That thread has ran for four years now, viewed 68,000 times
and with over 400 posts.
The thread is still open, and brexit is still up for debate.
I have not seen any personal stuff
Yes there are strong feelings, and polarised opinions.
but nothing nasty.

I voted to remain, and I believe that brexit will prove to be one of our greatest errors. But it’s done now, and I don’t say this often, but I sincerely hope that I am wrong. We have to get on with it, try to make the best of it.

It’s said that discussing brexit can be like discussing religion.
I don’t agree, I reckon  discussing religion is easier, a lot easier.


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## REC (Jan 26, 2020)

R0B said:


> That article is 14 months old. I'm sure the views/opinions expressed were believed at the time - things change :-(


Realised it and deleted post but not before it was seen!


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## Millie Master (Jan 27, 2020)

Fisherman said:


> I reckon  discussing religion is easier, a lot easier.



And next to no-one can agree on that old chestnut either......................... thankfully my views are always right!!


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## Fisherman (Jan 27, 2020)

Millie Master said:


> And next to no-one can agree on that old chestnut either......................... thankfully my views are always right!!



Yes Millie, must be great being right all the time. I thought I was alone. I hope we never meet.


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## antiquesam (Jan 27, 2020)

I have some sympathy for small businesses that may be affected and those lorry drivers who leave the UK on monday and return on friday, of which there are many working out of the Portsmouth area and Kent, but I find it hard to be too upset that people can't spend more than half their year away from our shores.


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## R0B (Jan 27, 2020)

antiquesam said:


> I have some sympathy for small businesses that may be affected and those lorry drivers who leave the UK on monday and return on friday, of which there are many working out of the Portsmouth area and Kent, but I find it hard to be too upset that people can't spend more than half their year away from our shores.


Stockholm Syndrome


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## antiquesam (Jan 27, 2020)

R0B said:


> Stockholm Syndrome


Apparently Stockholm Syndrome affects hostages and the abused as they bond with their abusers. I know Portsmouth is an island but I can get off it without a beating lol.


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