# New batteries



## Harrytherid (Nov 29, 2021)

Van is getting old, like owner, so can't justify or afford lithium.  Running heating (it is the fan that does it) on latest trip (Leicester) has killed both the 110Ah leisure batteries (fairly old anyway) so I need to replace them.  I would like, therefore, advice as to the best lead/acid to replace them with.  I know this has been done before but things change so sorry if it is boring.  Thank you in advance,  Harry


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## davep10000 (Nov 29, 2021)

Personally, I have found lead carbon to be a good compromise (I have a couple of Leoch 268Ah 6V ones).
If you can fit them in, these would be my choice...





						110Ah Gel Lead Carbon Ultra Deep Cycle Battery – Wildebus
					






					www.wildebus.com


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## Obanboy666 (Nov 29, 2021)

I bought and fitted 2 x lead carbon 110 amp gel batteries as suggested by Wildbus earlier this year and they have performed brilliantly to date. They were on offer at Alpha batteries and I used the discount negotiated by Phil. Just check your charger can charge them, fortunately my charger can.


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## number14 (Nov 29, 2021)

I've had my eye on these so pleased to read your good experience. My charger has a gel setting but not AGM so would save me buying a new charger. My solar controller is also good for gel.


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## trevskoda (Nov 29, 2021)

If charger not up to it then Bosch/varta stop start would be a good buy, mind you the lead carbon seem a good price and if me id buy them for your use.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 29, 2021)

Thanks all but how do I find out if charger any good.  The wagon and therefore built in charger is 2007 McLouis on Fiat chassis.  Solar panel is 80 Watt panel with MPPT controller.  I have come back from Leicester with a stomach infection so am not feeling up to taking the seat off to get at one of the batteries so I will do it in a day or two when I feel better but thanks for the rapid response.  They sound fantastic so here's hoping.  I knew you would be good,  Harry


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## wildebus (Nov 29, 2021)

You probably have a Nordelettronica charger.   Meant to be fairly good I believe?


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## trevskoda (Nov 29, 2021)

Not much solar this time of year, and its seems rather on the small side, 100w to 100ah batts is normal, you may require to read up on charger speck.


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## Robmac (Nov 29, 2021)

I've always been pleased with my 2 x Trojan T125 traction batteries. They are 6V and so have to be wired in series rather than parallel to make up 12V.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 30, 2021)

Thanks all.  I shall have to get that pesky seat off to check the charger and report back with the model etc at the same time as I measure the space available.  What idiot decided to make that seat so difficult to remove eh?  Not feeling well enough today but am better than yesterday, so maybe tomorrow.  There is space for more solar so perhaps I shall invest in a new one.  The old one is a bit long in the tooth,  well over ten years old if I remember right.  Thanks again


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## wildebus (Nov 30, 2021)

Harrytherid said:


> Thanks all.  I shall have to get that pesky seat off to check the charger and report back with the model etc at the same time as I measure the space available.  What idiot decided to make that seat so difficult to remove eh?  Not feeling well enough today but am better than yesterday, so maybe tomorrow.  There is space for more solar so perhaps I shall invest in a new one.  The old one is a bit long in the tooth,  well over ten years old if I remember right.  Thanks again


If you have access issues, bear in mind batteries like the Trojans mentioned would not be a good idea as they require regular checking and occasion topping topping up.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 30, 2021)

Thanks Widebus,  The lead/carbon will be what I will go for if I can make it all work especially with the maintenance issue even though I made a captive nut to replace one of the loose ones which required two hands in a very awkward position and it is much easier than it was as a result, it is still a bind getting that seat off.  Yours Harry.


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## trevskoda (Nov 30, 2021)

Todays vans/cars are not made for folk to twiddle at, bin them before mot and buy new, yea right, hope you get sorted with the led carbon as wildbus stated.


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## Harrytherid (Dec 1, 2021)

Thank you so much for the advice, Wildebus and others.  Unfortunately the height limit for one of them (that under passenger seat) is 215 mm.  The other not so critical as I can raise the height of the locker floor under which it resides but unless advised otherwise I shall buy two the same.  The charger is indeed a Nordelettronica, an NE186 so I hope I can consider that satisfactory for either the DC120-100C or a Leoch XR1750.  The old batteries were Banner 100AH  (or 110, depending which bit you read) they seem to be in doubt as to what capacity they are)  Harry


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## wildebus (Dec 1, 2021)

What van is it you have?  if it is a Sevel (Ducato/Relay/Boxer) then what quite a people do is cut all the insulated floor covering away to allow them to fit taller batteries then would otherwise fit.
This guy has quite a nice step-by-step process filmed of squeezing in oversized batteries under the seat






Also, most GEL and AGM batteries would be ok put on their side which gives an effective height of around 180mm, so that is an option as well.
If you do find you need to fit the two batteries apart, remember the +ve cable interlink between the two batteries must be protected both ends with a suitable fuse as both ends are energy sources.  (pointing this out for anyone who may be reading this thread and might not be aware of needing to do this).


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## Harrytherid (Dec 1, 2021)

Thanks Wildebus.  Wow, what thoughts, my wagon is a Ducato based McLouis Tandy 670G, so the floor digging is an option as, possibly, is battery on side.  However before we went away I started altering our down stairs toilet and with Christmas and family coming, I must finish the toilet before getting on with the van electrics any more. I know what my priorities are but my wife's are different.  I have to give it all extensive thought anyway.  In the mean time, any other thoughts you may have will be gratefully received.  Both ends of the interlinking cable are fused and isolated from each other and the rest of the system with a rotary switch.  Kindest regards, Harry


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## Robmac (Dec 1, 2021)

Banner are a respected make so if it comes to it, replacing with the same wouldn't be a bad option if they have served you well in the past. And you know they will fit.


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## Harrytherid (Dec 2, 2021)

Yes I know Banner are a respected make, Robmac, but the carbon enhanced ones sound better and I must go for the best I can afford but thanks for the interest.   Wildebus, you say most most GEL and AGM batteries would be ok put on their side but do we know that includes the lead carbon you are recommending, if so that is definitely an option. Harry


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## wildebus (Dec 2, 2021)

Harrytherid said:


> Yes I know Banner are a respected make, Robmac, but the carbon enhanced ones sound better and I must go for the best I can afford but thanks for the interest.   Wildebus, you say most most GEL and AGM batteries would be ok put on their side but do we know that includes the lead carbon you are recommending, if so that is definitely an option. Harry


I would be 99.9% sure it would.  I say most as there is bound to be one or two that are different!   I would check with Alpha just to make sure.
I happen to have the manual for the AGM version of that GEL battery in front of me and it  advises avoiding having it upside-down, but that is it.


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## Harrytherid (Dec 2, 2021)

Hello wildebus,  That is good enough for me.  Someone mentioned that you had negotiated a deal, is there a way I can take advantage of that?  Kind regards,  Harry


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## bartman (Dec 2, 2021)

Robmac said:


> I've always been pleased with my 2 x Trojan T125 traction batteries. They are 6V and so have to be wired in series rather than parallel to make up 12V.


I've had a pair of Banner batteries for a few years now, and they have served me well, but are on their way out now and I won't be buying them again. The reason is that they are not sealed batteries, and require fairly frequent topping up. If they are in an difficult place to access that is a difficult process, even checking the levels isn't easy (edit: I've quoted the wrong post from Robmac, don't know how to correct it!)


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## Robmac (Dec 2, 2021)

bartman said:


> I've had a pair of Banner batteries for a few years now, and they have served me well, but are on their way out now and I won't be buying them again. The reason is that they are not sealed batteries, and require fairly frequent topping up. If they are in an difficult place to access that is a difficult process, even checking the levels isn't easy.



Good point.

Although, my Trojans supposedly need a lot of maintenance if you read the manual, but I think all I have ever done is topped them up maybe twice in the 4 years or so that I have had them and they are still going strong.


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## mistericeman (Dec 2, 2021)

I bought these 3 x new 105ah AGM batteries from Alpha last year.... 

Been very happy so far


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## SimonM (Dec 2, 2021)

I used to sell Banner batteries, and used them myself, and I agree they needed far too regular topping up sessions. I am now using Bosch, and so far so good. We used to sell Platinum and never had any issues with these either. 

I have just replaced the Fiamm original fitment starter battery in my 10yo Ducato. Embarrassingly I’ve never looked at it because it’s tucked away under the passenger’s feet, and of course it failed mid-France in October. When I opened the fillers all the cells were nice and wet.


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## iandsm (Dec 2, 2021)

I quite fancy these, they are a decent make their website gives lots of information








						Yuasa Active Leisure Battery L36-AGM | Halfords UK
					

Shop the latest An NCC Class A battery, the Yuasa Active Leisure Battery L36-AGM is the ideal choice for motorhome and caravan owners who spend lots of time off grid. The battery will easily power high-energy appliances such as televisions and motor movers. at Halfords UK




					www.halfords.com


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## trevskoda (Dec 2, 2021)

Lab tests proved that bosch/varta stop start was miles better than so called pleasure batts, the carbon ones wildbus recommends would be my pick.


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## jp11 (Dec 6, 2021)

For what it's worth, there seems to be shift away from fancy AGM, Gel and carbon/calcium by various experts.  EFB is highly recommended (enhanced flooded battery).  Traditional chemistry but much improved.  Leaders appear to YUASA and Varta (other brands may be available).  110AH YUASA L36 EFB is good and Halfords market it as their own HB700 at a considerably lower price. £110 I believe.


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## Harrytherid (Dec 7, 2021)

Good job I am still waiting for an answer to my final questions to Wildebus, jp11. or I would have ordered the Carbon enhanced batteries by now.  I am sure we would all like to know more.  ie what is wrong with the AGM, Gel and carbon/calcium.  What a minefield we are in over this matter.  Come on Wildebus let us have your input please.  Will we ever get a definitive answer?


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## Harrytherid (Dec 7, 2021)

I was thinking of doing some research myself and came across this.  https://www.amazon.co.uk/s?k=Battle...pplications&linkCode=gs3&tag=marinetalking-21.  what is the forum opinion as at £400 it is just about affordable and with the inbuilt control system it sounds like a straight swap for Lead/acid.  Am I crying at the moon or am I reading it correctly.  I think it just about fits under the seat.  Harry


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## bartman (Dec 7, 2021)

Looks like jp11 has been reading up on the views given in the site from North Wales that-shall-not-be-menioned-here! 
Seriously, it seems to me that if you are relying on alternator charging, AGMs are only viable if you're prepared to invest in a B2B


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## Harrytherid (Dec 7, 2021)

Not with the cryptic North Wales reference, Bartman, please elucidate,  Harry


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## number14 (Dec 7, 2021)

I think he means this http://www.WEBSITE BLOCKED BY ADMIN/battery-technology.php but, in my innocence, I don't know why it shouldn't be mentioned.
As with all things Internet, I take my advice from multiple sources making sure that it's not the same advice being quoted multiple times.

Unless, of course, you find it on this forum, in which case it must be correct!

Edit: oh, I see now after posting - blocked by admin - there must be some history I am not aware of. Apologies.


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## bartman (Dec 7, 2021)

Harrytherid said:


> Not with the cryptic North Wales reference, Bartman, please elucidate,  Harry


My understanding is that problems can arise with AGM batteries failing due to never getting fully charged - some mains chargers built into motorhomes can't supply the higher charging voltage required. Also, an alternator will not fully charge it unless you fit a B2B charger. Try searching Mr Google with AGM leisure battery failures.


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## trevskoda (Dec 7, 2021)

I would give the AGM type a mis, go for lead carbon or bosch/varta stop start which would be my second pic.


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## molly 2 (Dec 7, 2021)

iandsm said:


> I quite fancy these, they are a decent make their website gives lots of information
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My batterys just died , L 35  are at the top of my list , agm are out as my system can't charge them anyone used them or any recommendations   .


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## trevskoda (Dec 7, 2021)

Lead carbon or Bosch/varta stop start silver power frame.


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## witzend (Dec 8, 2021)

Halfords got a offer on 








						Yuasa Active Leisure Battery L36-AGM | Halfords UK
					

Shop the latest An NCC Class A battery, the Yuasa Active Leisure Battery L36-AGM is the ideal choice for motorhome and caravan owners who spend lots of time off grid. The battery will easily power high-energy appliances such as televisions and motor movers. at Halfords UK




					www.halfords.com


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## AllanD (Dec 8, 2021)

molly 2 said:


> My batterys just died , L 35  are at the top of my list , agm are out as my system can't charge them anyone used them or any recommendations   .


The Yuasa L36 EFB is what I chose earlier this year from Alpha Batteries (with the Wildcamping discount) as a straight replacement for my original lead acid. The EFB model is enhanced but is still a lead acid battery which is why a went for it because like you my charger has limitations on what it can handle.



			https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-yuasa-100ah-efb-leisure-battery-l36-efb/
		


It has worked very well and I'm very pleased with it.

Hope that helps.


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## merl (Dec 9, 2021)

Lead acid batteries have several problems that lead to shortened lifespan.
 Every discharge cycle shortens its life and reduces it's Ah rating, the deeper the discharge the greater the damage, this is particularly bad when you discharge below 50% of it's capacity. This effect is worsened by the fact that the last 10% (approx) of the batterie's charge has to be trickled in slowly over a long period of time and hence you're often starting a cycle from less than 100% and often 85-90% of theoretical maximum battery capacity, so basically if you're going to avoid discharging deeper than 50% of it's capacity and your starting from 85% charge then your 100Ah battery is only going to deliver 35Ah and this is when it's brand new! Leaving the battery in a partial state of charge (PSOC) results in internal sulphating which again reduces capacity further. It follows that as the battery gets partially 'worn out' a sudden avalanche of deeper discharges and lower capacity quickly destroys the battery.
Lead carbon batteries have several advantages over lead acid.
They charge easier meaning you'll probably start each cycle from a higher charge level.
They are able to deliver many more discharge cycles over their lifespan.
They are far more PSOC tolerant and can be left partially discharged for long periods without the negative effects.
 At the moment I'd probably plump for this:
https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/12v-100ah-ritar-agm-lead-carbon-ultra-deep-cycle-battery-dc12-100c 
At £170 delvered it's only £15 more expensive than the Yuasa L36 from Halfords and I'd expect it to be considerably superior.


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## iandsm (Dec 9, 2021)

merl said:


> Lead acid batteries have several problems that lead to shortened lifespan.
> Every discharge cycle shortens its life and reduces it's Ah rating, the deeper the discharge the greater the damage, this is particularly bad when you discharge below 50% of it's capacity. This effect is worsened by the fact that the last 10% (approx) of the batterie's charge has to be trickled in slowly over a long period of time and hence you're often starting a cycle from less than 100% and often 85-90% of theoretical maximum battery capacity, so basically if you're going to avoid discharging deeper than 50% of it's capacity and your starting from 85% charge then your 100Ah battery is only going to deliver 35Ah and this is when it's brand new! Leaving the battery in a partial state of charge (PSOC) results in internal sulphating which again reduces capacity further. It follows that as the battery gets partially 'worn out' a sudden avalanche of deeper discharges and lower capacity quickly destroys the battery.
> Lead carbon batteries have several advantages over lead acid.
> They charge easier meaning you'll probably start each cycle from a higher charge level.
> ...


Thats an interesting post thank you, I wonder of they are the same as the  Leoch equivalent battery is considerably  more expensive


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## trevskoda (Dec 9, 2021)

Next time round its lead carbon for me.


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## Heppy (Dec 9, 2021)

What about the one Wildebus is selling, that looks good.


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## merl (Dec 9, 2021)

Well they are an Alpha Batteries own brand and someone's making them for them.......? Even if they are not quite up to the Leoch spec they appear to be a very good purchase at that kind of price.
I have a Leoch myself, It was advertised on Flea-Bay as 1 yr old and hardly used being purchased as an emergency backup if needed when the caravanner was using CLs without mains power. I wouldn't normally go near a used Lead acid battery but as the Lead Carbons are pretty PSOC tolerant I thought I'd risk it, especially at £85. Got it home, charged it, gave it a 55% discharge and the output voltage was still around that of a new battery, conclusion was it was a 1 yr old battery that had hardly been used!
Been on the van for 18 months now and voltages/self discharge rates are really excellent. Wouldn't bother with lead acid now.
Keeping my fingers crossed that Lithium prices will drop over the coming years, they really are superb but quite an outlay all things considered, I guess as always it all boils down to the individuals use and hence energy requirements but if you're not spending days upon days off grid or powering high wattage equipment through an inverter then Lead Carbon seems the way to go.
Merl


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## bartman (Dec 9, 2021)

merl said:


> Lead acid batteries have several problems that lead to shortened lifespan.
> Every discharge cycle shortens its life and reduces it's Ah rating, the deeper the discharge the greater the damage, this is particularly bad when you discharge below 50% of it's capacity. This effect is worsened by the fact that the last 10% (approx) of the batterie's charge has to be trickled in slowly over a long period of time and hence you're often starting a cycle from less than 100% and often 85-90% of theoretical maximum battery capacity, so basically if you're going to avoid discharging deeper than 50% of it's capacity and your starting from 85% charge then your 100Ah battery is only going to deliver 35Ah and this is when it's brand new! Leaving the battery in a partial state of charge (PSOC) results in internal sulphating which again reduces capacity further. It follows that as the battery gets partially 'worn out' a sudden avalanche of deeper discharges and lower capacity quickly destroys the battery.
> Lead carbon batteries have several advantages over lead acid.
> They charge easier meaning you'll probably start each cycle from a higher charge level.
> ...


Those are the ones I've earmarked for my next pair - but Alpha appear to have described them as AGM in their link, I think that's a mistake. I hope it is anyway.


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## wildebus (Dec 9, 2021)

merl said:


> Well* they are an Alpha Batteries own brand and someone's making them for them*.......? Even if they are not quite up to the Leoch spec they appear to be a very good purchase at that kind of price.
> I have a Leoch myself, It was advertised on Flea-Bay as 1 yr old and hardly used being purchased as an emergency backup if needed when the caravanner was using CLs without mains power. I wouldn't normally go near a used Lead acid battery but as the Lead Carbons are pretty PSOC tolerant I thought I'd risk it, especially at £85. Got it home, charged it, gave it a 55% discharge and the output voltage was still around that of a new battery, conclusion was it was a 1 yr old battery that had hardly been used!
> Been on the van for 18 months now and voltages/self discharge rates are really excellent. Wouldn't bother with lead acid now.
> Keeping my fingers crossed that Lithium prices will drop over the coming years, they really are superb but quite an outlay all things considered, I guess as always it all boils down to the individuals use and hence energy requirements but if you're not spending days upon days off grid or powering high wattage equipment through an inverter then Lead Carbon seems the way to go.
> Merl


Xplorer is the Alpha Brand (which is how these are labelled) and Ritar (ritarpower.com) is the OEM.

Leoch is another excellent battery manufacturer



bartman said:


> Those are the ones I've earmarked for my next pair - but Alpha appear to have described them as AGM in their link, I think that's a mistake. I hope it is anyway.


The original model of the Ritar Lead Carbon battery Alpha imported _were _AGM  (these are the ones I have actually), but they decided to switch to the Gel version of the same battery, so while the link has AGM within the URL, they *are *GEL batteries.
(I am guessing instead of creating a new entry, they just updated the description which does give some confusion (I did point this out to Alpha last year actually  ))


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## Canalsman (Dec 9, 2021)

Alpha are launching their own Xplorer branded lithium batteries next year I'm told. 

Might be worth waiting a little while if lithium is an option you're considering. 

I imagine their batteries will be more price competitive.


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## Harrytherid (Dec 10, 2021)

I asked a question of Amazon about one of the batteries they offer which is a cheapish lithium,  (£400 for 100AH) to which I put a link in an earlier post.  Here are my question and their answer,  Your comments please
A fellow customer answered your question,​"Can i use one of these to replace a similarly rated lead acid leisure battery in my motorhome the charger is a nordelettronica, ne186"​KB answered:​"Yes you can. Lead acid batteries will not fully charge this battery, but that only means it will prolong the life. Also, this battery can be discharged to 10% or so, rather than 50% with lead acid, so even if you can charge 90%, you will still have more capacity. Forget lead acid. These can also be stored upside down or on their sides. Much lighter too. This battery should last you a long while and they have a legit cs and warranty."​
 anyone know what a CS is? and does anyone fully understand the answer? and do we know the price and when the Explorer will be available

Harry


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## wildebus (Dec 10, 2021)

Harrytherid said:


> I asked a question of Amazon about one of the batteries they offer which is a cheapish lithium,  (£400 for 100AH) to which I put a link in an earlier post.  Here are my question and their answer,  Your comments please
> A fellow customer answered your question,​"Can i use one of these to replace a similarly rated lead acid leisure battery in my motorhome the charger is a nordelettronica, ne186"​KB answered:​"Yes you can. Lead acid batteries will not fully charge this battery, but that only means it will prolong the life. Also, this battery can be discharged to 10% or so, rather than 50% with lead acid, so even if you can charge 90%, you will still have more capacity. Forget lead acid. These can also be stored upside down or on their sides. Much lighter too. This battery should last you a long while and they have a legit cs and warranty."​
> anyone know what a CS is? and does anyone fully understand the answer? and do we know the price and when the Explorer will be available
> 
> Harry


well, #1, not that you would want to, but you cannot put lithium batteries upside down, either in use or in storage, so "KB" is a bit too much of a lithium 'fanboy' to really take his comments fully seriously.   In fact some Lithiums you cannot even use on their side    (the ability to use batteries on their side (or upside down!) is not just related to the technology but the actual construction within the battery box).

'cs' I would assume refers to Customer Service - I guess he is saying that the company is responsive to enquiries and provide support of their product.


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## Canalsman (Dec 10, 2021)

I don't think it advisable to use lead acid charge profiles for lithium...


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## merl (Dec 11, 2021)

> Harrytherid said:
> 
> 
> > I asked a question of Amazon about one of the batteries they offer which is a cheapish lithium,  (£400 for 100AH) to which I put a link in an earlier post.  Here are my question and their answer,  Your comments please
> ...


I have my doubts about using a lithium battery as a straight drop in replacement. First considering alternator charging when the engines running. You have an alternator capable of delivering say 80A connected to a Lithium battery capable of safely accepting a similar current but the wiring between them wont be able to accept anything near that. Sure there will be wiring resistance that will reduce the current flow but I wouldn't be surprised if fuses, connectors, control panel, relays etc started failing pretty quickly under the stain and worse case scenario would be the wiring overheating. 
Secondly the 240v charger would be given a hard time, with a normal lead acid battery the charger would initially be faced with possibly (depending on the depth of discharge) delivering it's maximum permissible 20A of high current into the partially discharged battery but this current would taper off quickly as the battery voltage rises. The lithium battery however would continue to swallow the whole 20A until it was virtually fully charged and then the current would drop off a cliff so to speak and drop to a very low level. Funnily enough my Nordelletronica charger is currently being repaired because it couldn't stand the continuous high load presented to it by a heavily discharged lead acid battery. The Nordelletronicas are a masterpiece of squeezing a quart into a pint pot and I feel that some compromises were made in the design in an effort to keep the chargers small, one of the internal transformers is notorious for failing which indeed it has done previously on mine. I know your newer model now has a cooling fan which will help and I don't know if the makers have beefed up the FETs that have failed this time in mine but personally I'd be sceptical of asking it to provide it's maximum 20A on every charge and I think you'd soon be replacing a broken charger.
My guess is that the lithium battery would be best served with it's own B2B charger, if so you'd have to factor in the expense of the B2B and the alterations to the wiring needed.
Merl


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## Harrytherid (Dec 14, 2021)

Thank you so much all, Wildebus and Merl especially.  I think you have convinced me to go for the lead carbon that Wildebus is advocating but I still have not received instructions as to how best to obtain them, do I just click on Wildebus' link and go from there or what? The suppliers of the lithium I was on about do reply to the questions as KB says but only give a partial answer, always, so not much help.
Regards, Harry


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## rugbyken (Dec 14, 2021)

david ( wildebus) has a website and on it you will find links to his shop or contact him direct by P M on here


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## Trotter (Dec 14, 2021)

Harrytherid said:


> Thank you so much all, Wildebus and Merl especially.  I think you have convinced me to go for the lead carbon that Wildebus is advocating but I still have not received instructions as to how best to obtain them, do I just click on Wildebus' link and go from there or what? The suppliers of the lithium I was on about do reply to the questions as KB says but only give a partial answer, always, so not much help.
> Regards, Harry


Alpha sell Leoch 100ah Lead Carbon batteries. I have 3 x 115's in parallel. They work very well, and as a bonus, will safely give another 30% depth of discharge. That is 70% not the 50% expected from lead acid.
Would I do the same again, knowing what I know know. Not on your Nelly. I'd head straight for lithium. Changing anything on the van that needed to be upgraded to suit. My 3 LC Leoch's weigh in at over 90kg's. So, what's that? A dead body or two? That's got to effect MPG.
As a footnote.
Thanks to David, I'm already working part lithium. I hope that I can get away for a month or three, to give them a real test. I'll happily take a fourth jab if required. They're not doing much sitting on the drive. Hereford cancelled. Fingers, toes,knees crossed we can do Goosnaugh.


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## Trotter (Dec 14, 2021)

merl said:


> Lead acid batteries have several problems that lead to shortened lifespan.
> Every discharge cycle shortens its life and reduces it's Ah rating, the deeper the discharge the greater the damage, this is particularly bad when you discharge below 50% of it's capacity. This effect is worsened by the fact that the last 10% (approx) of the batterie's charge has to be trickled in slowly over a long period of time and hence you're often starting a cycle from less than 100% and often 85-90% of theoretical maximum battery capacity, so basically if you're going to avoid discharging deeper than 50% of it's capacity and your starting from 85% charge then your 100Ah battery is only going to deliver 35Ah and this is when it's brand new! Leaving the battery in a partial state of charge (PSOC) results in internal sulphating which again reduces capacity further. It follows that as the battery gets partially 'worn out' a sudden avalanche of deeper discharges and lower capacity quickly destroys the battery.
> Lead carbon batteries have several advantages over lead acid.
> They charge easier meaning you'll probably start each cycle from a higher charge level.
> ...


How weird. 
Go onto Alpha Batteries site. Select Leisure, select Lead Carbon. 1 listed. Select that, it's Leoch 100ah.
Alternatively, select meri's www. alpha link. Different battery entirely.

Nurse! The screens.


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## wildebus (Dec 14, 2021)

You must have other filters applied as well?
checkout https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/s...type=product&filter_ab_application=d9-leisure

quite a selection


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## Trotter (Dec 14, 2021)

wildebus said:


> You must have other filters applied as well?
> checkout https://www.alpha-batteries.co.uk/s...type=product&filter_ab_application=d9-leisure
> 
> quite a selection


Huh! You're trying to tell me about filters?.

What's a filter?


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