# towbar



## teachertrish (Jan 17, 2008)

Hi All,we Are Looking For A Towbar For Our M/h-we Got It New From Lazydays In November And Now Need A Towbar-they Reccomend A Company Called Towtal..anybody Heard Of Them And Any Reports?


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## Guest (Jan 17, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> Hi All,we Are Looking For A Towbar For Our M/h-we Got It New From Lazydays In November And Now Need A Towbar-they Reccomend A Company Called Towtal..anybody Heard Of Them And Any Reports?



Yes, they are in Fenton, Stoke on Trent.
They specialize in A Frames & Tow Bars.
They tried to fix my gas fire a few years ago and I was not impressed after taking my m/h to them 3 times and they failed to rectify the problem, but I think they were out of there depth as not their normal line of work.
I think they will be as good as anybody for a tow bar as all the local dealers use them.
Don Ammotts, Brownhills & Lazy days.
I would have thought that you must have someone nearer to your area that could fit one for you.
Oh, if you do go to Towtal, make sure that you cover your carpets as they may walk over them in dirty boots.
Hope this helps
PS, You could look up www.towtal.co.uk


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## walkers (Jan 17, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> Hi All,we Are Looking For A Towbar For Our M/h-we Got It New From Lazydays In November And Now Need A Towbar-they Reccomend A Company Called Towtal..anybody Heard Of Them And Any Reports?


towbars for motorhomes seem to be highly priced, they are not even type approved (don't have to be yet, unlike car ones)
i'm having one purpose built by a good friend who welds it will be just as good if not better he is a bit of a perfectionist. the cost to me is some metal and a bottle of whisky, consider trying either a friend who can weld or a small engineering shop you will get just as good a job from what i have seen at less money.
the other option is if you have only a small rear overhang maybe towequipe do a version for the chassis cab which could fit.
good luck and happy towing
tony


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## lenny (Jan 17, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> Hi All,we Are Looking For A Towbar For Our M/h-we Got It New From Lazydays In November And Now Need A Towbar-they Reccomend A Company Called Towtal..anybody Heard Of Them And Any Reports?



I got one for my renault traffic on E.Bay. Just search on towbar/make of van and you will probably get some Witter options
Mine was about £75 + pp ,I fitted myself in a couple of hours.


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## shortcircuit (Jan 17, 2008)

I got mine from Towsure      http://www.towsure.com/

Contact was John Tanner.

Highly professional company with the personal touch.  If I need another towbar then this is where I would go.

Gave all details and unit was delivered on time.  Took me 30 minutes to fit as everything was spot on.  

I bought electrics too.  Ended up with a mile of 12 core which I have used in my kit car


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## avandriver (Jan 17, 2008)

lenny said:


> I got one for my renault traffic on E.Bay. Just search on towbar/make of van and you will probably get some Witter options
> Mine was about £75 + pp ,I fitted myself in a couple of hours.




I had a trafic    pics here


A great van but boy was it underpowered 


Steve.



ps   sorry if I hijacked the thread


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## lenny (Jan 17, 2008)

avandriver said:


> I had a trafic    pics here
> 
> 
> A great van but boy was it underpowered
> ...



Good pics,Steve your van was unique apart from the fact that mine is identical.


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## Telstar (Jan 18, 2008)

*Towbar*

Hi

I also got my towbar from Towsure.  For some reason they don't list type approved towbars for non-alco chassis motorhomes anymore, but a call to John Tanner may identify if they can still get them built (made to order in Germany).  It was expensive compared to normal towbars, but I have piece of mind with it having an 'e' number and no drilling.

Jon


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

Thanks all for the replys,Andy is good at welding but the rear overhanh is about two metres from the axle,or about a metre from the end of the chassis,We were quoted 400quid from them.Where would they bolt the bar too?do the put bolts through the floor of the body as after the chassis ends it would be very flexible..


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## avandriver (Jan 18, 2008)

You would have to extend the rear of the chassis for a tow bar to be fitted .

If you bolted it through the floor the floor would be ripped off 


Steve


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

thanks steve,mmm-that makes me concerned because the waste tank takes up most of the space under there-theres no chassis extentions that we can see.what do they do then?


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

avandriver said:


> You would have to extend the rear of the chassis for a tow bar to be fitted .
> 
> If you bolted it through the floor the floor would be ripped off
> 
> ...



You may find that the chassis has already been extended to take the m/h body. Mine was on my previous Hymer and the tow bar was fitted to the extension by Hymer


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> thanks steve,mmm-that makes me concerned because the waste tank takes up most of the space under there-theres no chassis extentions that we can see.what do they do then?



There has got to be some kind of extension to take the weight of the coachbuilt body as support is needed to nearly the very rear????
I would have thought


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

right-you lot have got us going...
away out with torch to have a look
i will post the results.lol


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

just in,from the rear of the chassis the extention drops about 300mm then along under the shower/toilet area for 1100mm,the steel is 100mm by 30mm angle on its edge and at the very rear back up to chassis height with a flimsy steel frame fixed with self tapping screws.any ideas?


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

Mine was box section and the tow bar was about 3 inch angle (very strong)
Can,t help without looking at it, maybe you could post pickys for the expert tow bar builders to look at and advise


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

I think I have a similar problem on my replacement Hymer.
The extension is strong but there is a water tank at the rear and any tow bar would have to drop down under the tank and then come back up. I don't think that would be too clever


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## avandriver (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> just in,from the rear of the chassis the extention drops about 300mm then along under the shower/toilet area for 1100mm,the steel is 100mm by 30mm angle on its edge and at the very rear back up to chassis height with a flimsy steel frame fixed with self tapping screws.any ideas?



Sounds like a job for a specialist Trish 

Dont take the risk of a D.I.Y job 

What you could do is take of the water tank /extend the chassis properly /fit the tow bar /then refit the water tank on to the new chassis section 



Steve


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

thanks graham,when i foned towtal they said it wouldnt be a problem but I dont want to go all the way down to stoke to be told no-can do.It sounds like our vans are alike, towbar could be made and fitted but the trailer noseweight would be about two pounds never mind a scooter.


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> thanks graham,when i foned towtal they said it wouldnt be a problem but I dont want to go all the way down to stoke to be told no-can do.It sounds like our vans are alike, towbar could be made and fitted but the trailer noseweight would be about two pounds never mind a scooter.



I don't like them as they messed me about, but towbars are their specialty and they do lots. I drive past them every day and they are always busy and full.
The dealers have been using them for several years now so they must be OK at tow bars.


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

ok,so do you and steve reckon that they will manage and it wont be a wasted journey..


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> ok,so do you and steve reckon that they will manage and it wont be a wasted journey..



Tell them what your m/h is and ask them to check it out before you go.
You could always send them a picy by email just to confirm that they know what you are talking about.


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## avandriver (Jan 18, 2008)

Surely there is a nearer towing specialist than stoke 


Steve


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

avandriver said:


> Surely there is a nearer towing specialist than stoke
> 
> 
> Steve



I would have thought so and I must say that I wouldn't fancy driving all the way down here from where you are.
There must be someone up there


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

we hav tried,there is a place in glasgow but they said no as itold them i wanted to put a scooter rack on the back,lazydays said it can be done-but from what we have heard they will tell you anything-infact they foned us today asking when we will be taking delivery-we got the van in november....


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> we hav tried,there is a place in glasgow but they said no as itold them i wanted to put a scooter rack on the back,lazydays said it can be done-but from what we have heard they will tell you anything-infact they foned us today asking when we will be taking delivery-we got the van in november....



Yes, they have a terrible reputation!
I think that Towtal would do it as they are the so called experts, and adding a scooter rack is very easy, but what about your rear axle weight.
Don't forget that with a long overhang, if you put say a 250kg scooter on the back it will probably add about 325kg with the leverage taken into consideration and not to forget the weight of the tow bar plus leverage weight.


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## teachertrish (Jan 18, 2008)

thanks graham,dont really know if we will put a rack on-its more to protect the rear lights when the ladder is down and for corner steadies to be mounted.Thanks for your input,I will phone towtal and ask to speak to someone with some idea of what they are doing..


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## Guest (Jan 18, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> thanks graham,dont really know if we will put a rack on-its more to protect the rear lights when the ladder is down and for corner steadies to be mounted.Thanks for your input,I will phone towtal and ask to speak to someone with some idea of what they are doing..



On our previous Hymer, we had a tow bar and a scooter rack and a large overhang
The crazy thing was that we carry everything we may need and we were up to our max weight without putting a scooter on, so we never did
OH, it was on when we purchased it, but far too many users do not weigh their m/h and only guess it.
I drive for a living and I cannot afford to be done for overweight, that is why I am very particular


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## walkers (Jan 19, 2008)

take another look at the rear of your chassis extension if it has 2 12mm holes 145 mm apart on either side it is probably an alko chassis extension. these holes are in the same place on an alko chassis, hope this helps


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## alanval (Jan 19, 2008)

***** said:


> On our previous Hymer, we had a tow bar and a scooter rack and a large overhang
> The crazy thing was that we carry everything we may need and we were up to our max weight without putting a scooter on, so we never did
> OH, it was on when we purchased it, but far too many users do not weigh their m/h and only guess it.
> I drive for a living and I cannot afford to be done for overweight, that is why I am very particular





We are the same tow bar was on when we bought the van.we have taken it off as it put us up to the max weight.We want to take bikes with us this time ,the previous owners must have been very overweight ..the towbar is about about 160k.with the long overhang the back was way down.

 Val


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## walkers (Jan 19, 2008)

alanval said:


> We are the same tow bar was on when we bought the van.we have taken it off as it put us up to the max weight.We want to take bikes with us this time ,the previous owners must have been very overweight ..the towbar is about about 160k.with the long overhang the back was way down.
> 
> Val


that sounds like a very heavy towbar, the reason for us fitting a towbar is so that we can carry the weight in the trailer rather than the van. thus eliminating the risk of the van being overweight. the towbar that i looked at on a german website weighs in at 17kg plus noseweight of 50kg this puts 100kg approx on my rear axle to reduce the effect of this the spare wheel which is carried at the very rear of the boot area of the van will be carried in the trailer thus the weight on the rear axle i estimate at a healthy 57kg. and all the heavier stuff in the trailer means i can keep the van at under its max weight.


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## Guest (Jan 19, 2008)

Hi Tony, the trouble with a trailer is that you don't want it with you all the time and you would be forever swaping things around for when you do have and don't have the trailer with you
But for payload, you can't beat one


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## walkers (Jan 19, 2008)

***** said:


> Hi Tony, the trouble with a trailer is that you don't want it with you all the time and you would be forever swaping things around for when you do have and don't have the trailer with you
> But for payload, you can't beat one


for a weekend i wouldn't ned it as would only need a small payload anyway but for a holiday it is essential, another 1.3t payload if needed though that is a lot more than i would need, oddly enough the fuel consumption with is very little different to the fuel consumption without


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## Guest (Jan 19, 2008)

walkers said:


> for a weekend i wouldn't ned it as would only need a small payload anyway but for a holiday it is essential, another 1.3t payload if needed though that is a lot more than i would need, oddly enough the fuel consumption with is very little different to the fuel consumption without



But the ferry costs more


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## walkers (Jan 20, 2008)

***** said:


> But the ferry costs more


something i am gonna have to live with as we are going on a long break and will need more stuff than usual


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2008)

*I see*



walkers said:


> something i am gonna have to live with as we are going on a long break and will need more stuff than usual



I do see your point


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## Nosha (Jan 20, 2008)

My motorhome dealer use Midland Magneto of Nottingham, they made a full width bar like a truck underrun bar to protect the back of the m/h and its plastic bumper and lights. £650 fitted with electrics, bloody dear I thought; but found the likes of PWS of Poole etc charge about the same!

It's well made and a good fit to the extended chassis, but the paint/finish is NOT very durable. It will need repainting this year in Hammerite at only 2yrs old!


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## terry1956 (Jan 25, 2008)

Hi all, will towbars are a target for some to make lots of money thats for sure, I have seen prices from 400 to 800 pounds for a motorhome bar and all sorts of reasons given why they need to be that price, well there is not one good reason bar great big mark ups.
After shopping round for a towbar for my hymer B544 and looking at some in person I went ahead and made my own, OK I am a coded welder, will I was a long time ago and did my h&c in engineering etc. But the total cost was £30 pounds all in, and thats made with 3x1 mild steel.
I use it to tow my box trailer with the quad bike in, we have a scooter but when we placed it on the rear the hymer was 70kgs overweight on the rear axle and very light at the front, so we went for the quad, no tax or mot,s needed in france for same and 30 pounds insurrance pa for full europe cover.
But with some skill anyone can get a towbar made better and at less cost then the prices from so say motorhome towbar people.
look at your local steel shops, small engineering firms etc.
michael


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## teachertrish (Jan 25, 2008)

Michael,today i phoned towtal,I told them about the distance from the chassis to the rear was 1100mm they said thats not a problem and at the very rear the wont be connecting to the coachbuilt body(all the load will be from the read of the chassis.Their price for a rear bumper framework was 170plus vat or for towbar spec was 350plus vat,I too am capable of welding so it wouldnt be a prob for me but when you did yours what was the lenth of your frame after the chassis?is my 1100mm too far without support and should i go for bumper spec only...


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## terry1956 (Jan 25, 2008)

*answer*

Hi like you, my hymer as a added chassis section at the rear, when I looked at the towbars made for the hymer they all fitted unto this extension not the main chassis. This all looked a bit odd to me, as you will know that a towbar needs to react to a lot of pulling force, if you take the case of my hymer the towbar needs to take the pull of around 1.5 ton and a nose weight of around 200 pounds at the ball hitch.
This is what I did, I made the two side arms run along the chassis extension and the used some angle to join it to the main part of the chassis, I used two bolts per side at this point. for the side arms I used 3 bolts each side using the holds predrilled into the chassis extension, from the arms I welded the cross iron and both arms have side extensions to take any side movement. I also added two straps just behind the two hitch to the chassis to off side the towing force from the cross iron, as this was 5 foot across i did not want a lot of force from the towing going into the side arm welds, these straps are just bolt on to allow a bit of flex.
so in anwser, if the extension chassis is in good condition then yes you can bolts to this only, but its better to try to get something onto the main chassis legs.
michael


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## teachertrish (Jan 25, 2008)

ok then,but at about 1.2m from the actual chassis will it have bounce?


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## terry1956 (Jan 25, 2008)

*not sure*

Hi not sure what you mean, but you need to look at the stress points for a towbar, must of these are taken up by the side legs of the bar, ie the pulling force, to cut down on the stress from this I as stated fitted angle steel sections from the side legs of the towbar to the main chassis, not the chassis extension. The second stress placed on a towbar is downword force on the ball hitch from the trailer, as you know this should be no more then 200 pounds so thsi can be taken by the extention alone, but rememeber some of that force will travel along the side arms into the main chassis. the 3rd stress factor is shock, and this is why i reinforced the rear arm with two flexable bolt on arms, as you will no the weak points are at the side of the welds, so to take some stress from these I bolted the straps,
hope this helps.
michael


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## teachertrish (Jan 25, 2008)

yip ok as i said,my plan would be to remove the extention and replace it with the upgraded version incorporating the towbar but the chassis extention carries the rear shower area too so i would have to put the new towbar rails alongside as the extention is very flimsy,its the bounce over 1100mm that i am worried about.towtal is needing 400quid and their work wont be any better than mine.


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## terry1956 (Jan 25, 2008)

*understand*

OK, did not read your 1st part of the thread, Can you not reinforce the extension by making a 3 sided brace and bolting the end side to the main chassis and then having the two legs bolted to the the extension, you can then use the towbar side legs to reinforce the extension as well, 
This makes a sandwich of the extension legs and the inner brace and the towbar legs.
This will remove any stress on the extension.


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## walkers (Jan 26, 2008)

terry1956 said:


> Hi all, will towbars are a target for some to make lots of money thats for sure, I have seen prices from 400 to 800 pounds for a motorhome bar and all sorts of reasons given why they need to be that price, well there is not one good reason bar great big mark ups.
> After shopping round for a towbar for my hymer B544 and looking at some in person I went ahead and made my own, OK I am a coded welder, will I was a long time ago and did my h&c in engineering etc. But the total cost was £30 pounds all in, and thats made with 3x1 mild steel.
> I use it to tow my box trailer with the quad bike in, we have a scooter but when we placed it on the rear the hymer was 70kgs overweight on the rear axle and very light at the front, so we went for the quad, no tax or mot,s needed in france for same and 30 pounds insurrance pa for full europe cover.
> But with some skill anyone can get a towbar made better and at less cost then the prices from so say motorhome towbar people.
> ...


i in the end as i needed to source the steel went to a small engineering firm, £75 to make a towing bracket up, well that was cheaper than buying the steel and a bottle of malt for my mate so they got the job. its not type approved but then nor are many many proffesionally made ones (nor are they all as well made)but then they as yet don't have to be for motorhomes.


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## teachertrish (Jan 26, 2008)

totally confused now,i took the m/h up to the local smiddy and they woudnt touch it as the bar at 1200 long will be alot of bounce,I dont know what to do now...


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## teachertrish (Mar 11, 2008)

its about two weeks now till we get down to towtal for either a bumper or a towbar fitted,we were on the other m/h forum and towtal gets a good writeup.I will never tow anything but will consider a scooter rack-whats everyones opinion, ala


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## walkers (Mar 11, 2008)

teachertrish said:


> its about two weeks now till we get down to towtal for either a bumper or a towbar fitted,we were on the other m/h forum and towtal gets a good writeup.I will never tow anything but will consider a scooter rack-whats everyones opinion, ala


make sure towtal fit you up with something you can put a scooter rack onto if thats what you want to use it for, it'll need more strength as there will be more weight than the noseweight of a trailer bouncing up and down upon it


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## wildman (Mar 21, 2008)

Towsure supply to the trade but if you were a trade outlet you could get one for under £30. They are not difficult to fit, if you cannot manage yourself get a price from a garage or mobile mechanic. Good Luck
Roger


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