# One Less Problem



## StreetSleeper (Aug 7, 2020)

As some of you may or may not know I have never been happy with the engine in my van. I had the engine totally overhauled and replaced most of the relevant sensors, recently I went back down south to get it professionally set up on LPG but was still not 100% happy with it's running. With a fuel consumption of 10mpg on LPG and 12mpg on petrol I have always felt something must be adrift; lacking power which meant having to change from fourth to fifth on a flat and on a slight incline I had to go down the box. In  a recent conversation I had with Phil we came to the conclusion it could only be one or two things as it was playing up on LPG and petrol so I decided to buy a new crankshaft sensor, which arrived today, so I got about removing the old one and this is what I found.






It's a piece of wire from a wire brush; I have no idea how it got there but I think this may have been the problem. The van runs now nice and smooth on petrol but still like a bag of nails on LPG. Looks like a trip down south to get the LPG side re-calibrated is in order.

Rae


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## The laird (Aug 7, 2020)

For goodness sakes its the start of a solution rae


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## izwozral (Aug 7, 2020)

Our Talbot ran sweet as a nut on LPG and like a dogs breakfast on petrol. Changing to LPG whilst driving was like having a turbo booster and no amount of fiddling with the petrol side would improve the running. Just wished we could have had a bigger LPG tank.


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 7, 2020)

The laird said:


> For goodness sakes its the start of a solution rae



Hello Gogsy,
Certainly one less problem.............and that's a good start.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 7, 2020)

izwozral said:


> Our Talbot ran sweet as a nut on LPG



Hello Ral,
I have to ask you one question, is your Talbot carburettor or injection?

Rae


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## Silver sprinter (Aug 7, 2020)

Any excuse to go south, hope you have got to the bottom of it


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## izwozral (Aug 7, 2020)

Hi Rae.
The Talbot was sold many years ago, it was carburettor kit.


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 7, 2020)

Silver sprinter said:


> Any excuse to go south, hope you have got to the bottom of it



Hello Gerry,
Nobody up here would touch it so had to go to Wales and now I've ended up seeing a guy in Norfolk. Having the same problem trying to get a towbar.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 7, 2020)

izwozral said:


> it was carburettor kit.



Hello Ral,
Thought it would be; I have fitted quite a few carburettor kits and I have always had good results.

Rae


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## 1 Cup (Aug 8, 2020)

O Pump tyres up, lol .


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## RichardHelen262 (Aug 8, 2020)

It’s a shame you have spent so much on the engine and conversion, as it would have been better and less hassle to do a diesel conversion


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 8, 2020)

1 Cup said:


> O Pump tyres up, lol .



Hello Jeff,
Why, they're only flat at the bottom?

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 8, 2020)

helen262 said:


> less hassle to do a diesel conversion



Hello Richard,
Funny you should say that, I can assure you it has crossed my mind one or two times; especially as the fuel consumption is so low, 10 mpg on LPG but I will tell you why I chose petrol over diesel: Nicola Sturgeon said she wanted diesel banned from major locations. I'm sure Bill, 2CV, could tell you the exact number but, basically, it was going to be very hard to travel using a diesel in Scotland and so we went for a petrol. 

Rae


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## RichardHelen262 (Aug 8, 2020)

You could have changed it to diesel but forget to change it on the v5


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 9, 2020)

helen262 said:


> You could have changed it to diesel but forget to change it on the v5



Hello Richard,
An engine change hasn't been ruled out, I will have to look at the financial gains. At the moment I will stick with what I've got and, hopefully, sort out all the problems; the biggest problem nowadays is the lack of LPG filling stations.

Rae


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## Trotter (Aug 10, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> Hello Richard,
> An engine change hasn't been ruled out, I will have to look at the financial gains. At the moment I will stick with what I've got and, hopefully, sort out all the problems; the biggest problem nowadays is the lack of LPG filling stations.
> 
> Rae


You could be the first to have a Peugeot EV. No problems with getting solar in Scotland


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 10, 2020)

Wouldn't it be great if you *could* put electric engines in the old campers?

Suppose it's just a pipe dream as guessing 
a) problem getting a new EV engine that would fit and 
b) it'd probably be *very* expensive...


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## n brown (Aug 10, 2020)

it's finding room for 200,000 AA batteries that would cause problems


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## Debroos (Aug 10, 2020)

I'm not criticising any size of motorhomes but I have personally seen more than once on seaside car parks, the  entire front row taken up by motorhomes. The rows behind being locals in cars with no view at all.
This parking was, of course totally legal but I can understand the locals getting fed up.
Hopefully none of them were members of this forum but I think often people just don't think through the effects of their actions.
I have a horrid feeling that we've been guilty ourselves on occasion...


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## 2cv (Aug 10, 2020)

Here are the Scottish LEZ proposals.  They have identified 43 potential zones. Having said that the timescales keep falling back as implementation would cause such disruption to travel and businesses. Euro 6 is the minimum required at present in the plans, but in time more stringent levels will follow so even buying a new diesel van may not give the required emissions levels for more than a few years.


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## trevskoda (Aug 10, 2020)

The is a co in england doing electric converts,last week they did a royal enfield on tv,cars is there main thing but a van will be easy,batteries are expensive but prices will come down and places to charge will grow over the next few years,range from 100 to 200 miles so far.


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## Ian and Cath (Aug 10, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> Hello Gerry,
> Nobody up here would touch it so had to go to Wales and now I've ended up seeing a guy in Norfolk. Having the same problem trying to get a towbar.
> 
> Rae


Try calling 01772634215 or 07887997653 for your tow bar. He specialises in motorhome  tow bars. I got mine including fitting for £300. It's near Blackpool  but you can park up overnight  nearby


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## Debroos (Aug 10, 2020)

Debroos said:


> I'm not criticising any size of motorhomes but I have personally seen more than once on seaside car parks, the  entire front row taken up by motorhomes. The rows behind being locals in cars with no view at all.
> This parking was, of course totally legal but I can understand the locals getting fed up.
> Hopefully none of them were members of this forum but I think often people just don't think through the effects of their actions.
> I have a horrid feeling that we've been guilty ourselves on occasion...



I've somehow put this in the wrong thread! duh...apologies
should have been under 'my rant for the day'!


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## mariesnowgoose (Aug 10, 2020)

Debroos said:


> I've somehow put this in the wrong thread! duh...apologies
> should have been under 'my rant for the day'!



Are we having a touch of covid-brain today?


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## harrow (Aug 10, 2020)

2cv said:


> Here are the Scottish LEZ proposals.  They have identified 43 potential zones. Having said that the timescales keep falling back as implementation would cause such disruption to travel and businesses. Euro 6 is the minimum required at present in the plans, but in time more stringent levels will follow so even buying a new diesel van may not give the required emissions levels for more than a few years.



I'm already in a LEZ  and just a bit further in it becomes a ULEZ with very strict rules with Euro 6 as a minimum. Older commercial diesels are a no go.


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## Debroos (Aug 10, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Are we having a touch of covid-brain today?



More of a permanent deluge methinks...the days of having a senior moment are but a pleasant memory now...


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

Hi Rae,

Why not just convert to carb? A couple of 45 DCOE's should do the job  or maybe just one? 
There's a couple of decent LPG converters in the Telford area if you need another opinion.

Regards,
Del


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

A Civic we did in Florida






Regards,
Del


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## Trotter (Aug 10, 2020)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Wouldn't it be great if you *could* put electric engines in the old campers?
> 
> Suppose it's just a pipe dream as guessing
> a) problem getting a new EV engine that would fit and
> b) it'd probably be *very* expensive...


Someone might pull you up over "Engine".
I, on the other hand will be my usual, gentle self.
'Tis a "Motor". Or possibly a "Power plant".   But, do we care?


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## Wully (Aug 10, 2020)

That figure of 10 and 12 mile to the gallon frightens the life out of me that’s America Muscle car v8 and v10 numbers. I’d take it to the roughest Housing estate you know leave the doors open with the keys in the ignition but fill the tank first give them a chance to get it home


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## Wully (Aug 10, 2020)

Sorry for the jibe mate. But those numbers are scary you’re like me and do the long trips down south must be costly. Hope you get it sorted and can get back to enjoying your van If anything you bloody deserve it for your patience.


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## in h (Aug 10, 2020)

Wully said:


> That figure of 10 and 12 mile to the gallon frightens the life out of me that’s America


Don't forget that their miles are the same size as ours, but their gallons are smaller.


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## Wully (Aug 10, 2020)

That should really help out. Rae make sure you don’t buy American fuel you’ll only get 8 mile to gallon.


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## in h (Aug 10, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> I went back down south to get it professionally set up on LPG but was still not 100% happy with it's running. With a fuel consumption of 10mpg on LPG and 12mpg on petrol I have always felt something must be adrift


I had my last car converted to LPG - I'd bought a petrol one so I could do that. 
It's never easy to be accurate with MPG on LPG because full is a movable feast and the gauge is a bit of a guess, but I kept notes so the average was easy to work out Overall, it did only marginally less MPG on LPG than it had done on petrol. 
The calorific values of the two fuels are about the same per KG, but the KG per gallon is far higher for petrol than for propane.
It ran every bit as well on LPG as on petrol. There was a very tiny difference in throttle response, but you'd need to be very familiar with the car to detect that tiny difference. And one was no "better" than the other.
The conversion was a good one, and it worked brilliantly. Done by a (very) local garage who specialised in such stuff.
Wish I hadn't sold that car.


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

in h said:


> Don't forget that their miles are the same size as ours, but their gallons are smaller.


... and cheaper  

Regards,
Del


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## in h (Aug 10, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> ... and cheaper


Er, no. Not cheaper. Much, much cheaper.


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

Wully said:


> That figure of 10 and 12 mile to the gallon frightens the life out of me that’s America Muscle car v8 and v10 numbers. I’d take it to the roughest Housing estate you know leave the doors open with the keys in the ignition but fill the tank first give them a chance to get it home


Because LPG is about half the price of petrol that's actually 20/24 mpg for the same cost as petrol  

Regards,
Del


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## in h (Aug 10, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> Because LPG is about half the price of petrol that's actually 20/24 mpg for the same cost as petrol


Round here, you can get LPG for 49.9p a litre, Don't think you can get petrol for anything like as low as 99.8p per litre. Though I haven't looked at petrol prices, as I don't buy any.


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

in h said:


> Round here, you can get LPG for 49.9p a litre, Don't think you can get petrol for anything like as low as 99.8p per litre. Though I haven't looked at petrol prices, as I don't buy any.


I was going on Shell and BP prices but that's even better on those prices   The cheapest we've seen LPG lately is 59.9p/litre

Regards,
Del


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## Trotter (Aug 10, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> ... and cheaper
> 
> Regards,
> Del


Not cheaper. The correct price.


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## alwaysared (Aug 10, 2020)

Trotter said:


> Not cheaper. The correct price.



Average price per US gallon (approx 3.78 litres) in Florida, it was only 99.9c per gallon when when we moved there in 2000 

Regards,
Del


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

2cv said:


> Here are the Scottish LEZ proposals.  They have identified 43 potential zones. Having said that the timescales keep falling back as implementation would cause such disruption to travel and businesses. Euro 6 is the minimum required at present in the plans, but in time more stringent levels will follow so even buying a new diesel van may not give the required emissions levels for more than a few years.



Thank you Bill for doing that for me.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Ian and Cath said:


> Try calling 01772634215 or 07887997653 for your tow bar. He specialises in motorhome  tow bars. I got mine including fitting for £300. It's near Blackpool  but you can park up overnight  nearby



Thanks Ian, problem being I have a doughnut tank that will need to be removed so they can fit a tow bar and then the tank can be replaced.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

harrow said:


> I'm already in a LEZ  and just a bit further in it becomes a ULEZ with very strict rules with Euro 6 as a minimum. Older commercial diesels are a no go.



I think once it comes in, in Scotland, it will devastate the tourist industry.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> Why not just convert to carb? A couple of 45 DCOE's should do the job  or maybe just one?
> There's a couple of decent LPG converters in the Telford area if you need another opinion.



Hello Del,
It's a single carb manifold that is required, it also has to be made of aluminium.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Wully said:


> I’d take it to the roughest Housing estate you know leave the doors open with the keys in the ignition but fill the tank first give them a chance to get it home



Hello Wully,
I think it would be easier to just put a Ford badge on it.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Wully said:


> you bloody deserve it for your patience.



I do believe I'll get there. I don't expect high mpg, 13-15 would be nice.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> It's never easy to be accurate with MPG on LPG



The way that we do it: we always fill up to the max at the same station. When we do a long trip we always fill up to the max, do the trip, return to the original station and then work out the average from there.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> Er, no. Not cheaper. Much, much cheaper.



The cheapest we've ever found LPG was in Birmingham which, as a matter of interest, has more LPG stations than Scotland.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> Because LPG is about half the price of petrol that's actually 20/24 mpg for the same cost as petrol



Not at motorway prices.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> Round here, you can get LPG for 49.9p a litre



That's good, I thought we were doing well; Morrison's is charging 53.7p

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> I was going on Shell and BP prices but that's even better on those prices   The cheapest we've seen LPG lately is 59.9p/litre



And like you say Del, that's the cheapest you've seen it...........but what was the most expensive? We don't always have a choice of buying the cheapest.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Thank you for everyone's feedback. For me this has been a very frustrating time, the trials and tribulations of getting the LPG conversion done then having to get the engine rebuilt and never being happy with the way the engine was running. I'm hoping, with my recent finding, we will be able to get back and do what we enjoy the most: getting out in our van.

Rae


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## Wully (Aug 11, 2020)

It’s funny that wee wire may be the root of your problems I remember Once having a similar problem with a hair stuck between my teeth and Just couldn’t perform right until it shifted


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## alwaysared (Aug 11, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> Not at motorway prices.
> 
> Rae



It would be if compared to motorway petrol prices though, the most expensive LPG we've seen lately was 69.9p/litre on the services.

Regards,
Del


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## Trotter (Aug 11, 2020)

Motorway fuel? Don’t know about Scotland Rae, but down here, in the civilised end of the UK, there’s usually a supermarket, even if it’s bloody  Tesco’s, within a couple or three miles.
Motorway services are for ‘avin a pee. Or if you feel like splashing the cash, buying a four for three sausage roll deal from MMMMMMGreggs
Take care
Ps. Iceland, the shop, not the country, island, sell frozen MMMMMMGregg sausage rolls. Although it has to be said, there’s a MMMMMMGreggs on every corner, well almost.
It’s said that MMMMMMGreggs were banned from having a football team, ‘cos every time they got a corner, they tried to open a shop
Have I gone far enough off thread now?


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> It would be if compared to motorway petrol prices though, the most expensive LPG we've seen lately was 69.9p/litre on the services.



Hello Del,
Unfortunately, we have a 70 litre tank that only holds 60 litres of LPG which gives us a range of round about 130 miles but they recommend you don't go down to empty because of debris in the tank. So, basically, we have about 120 miles which means, if we're going south, our first stop will be Abington services; if we're going down the A1 side we will be looking at topping up at Lindisfarne which will get us to Morrison's at Boroughbridge. If we are ever travelling south the first two fills are going to be service stations. Something that we're having to do now is phone up the fuel station prior to travelling to it just to make sure they have LPG in or if they are still selling it. 

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Trotter said:


> Motorway fuel? Don’t know about Scotland Rae, but down here, in the civilised end of the UK, there’s usually a supermarket, even if it’s bloody  Tesco’s, within a couple or three miles.



Good morning Mr T,
Tesco don't sell LPG.........Morrison's and ASDA's do...........some not all. We are not blessed with LPG stations in Scotland, a few on the west coast and about the same on the east. 



Trotter said:


> Motorway services are for ‘avin a pee. Or if you feel like splashing the cash, buying a four for three sausage roll deal from MMMMMMGreggs



I quite like the showers and, I have to confess, a pee stop can't be a bad thing.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

Wully said:


> It’s funny that wee wire may be the root of your problems I remember Once having a similar problem with a hair stuck between my teeth and Just couldn’t perform right until it shifted



Are you sure it wasn't a hair lip?

Rae


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## n brown (Aug 11, 2020)

Wully said:


> It’s funny that wee wire may be the root of your problems I remember Once having a similar problem with a hair stuck between my teeth and Just couldn’t perform right until it shifted


somebody ought to write a song about that . oh , they did


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

alwaysared said:


> I was going on Shell and BP prices


Shell and BP prices always seem to be way above everyone else. Shell are pulling out of LPG because hardly anyone buys their LPG, which is understandable. 
If you look at filllpg.co.uk or mylpg.eu you can see where lpg is available and what it costs.


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> Not at motorway prices.


When I had an LPG car, the range with the LPG tank and the petrol tank was somewhere between 800 and 900 miles, so it was not too hard to reach a cheaper refill.


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> The way that we do it: we always fill up to the max at the same station. When we do a long trip we always fill up to the max, do the trip, return to the original station and then work out the average from there.


You also have to fill in similar temperature conditions for consistency.


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> If you look at filllpg.co.uk or mylpg.eu you can see where lpg is available and what it costs.



We used to buy the book but now we just use filllpg.co.uk. Recent conversation I had with Phil is he is going to start putting up a list of LPG stations on the site.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> the range with the LPG tank and the petrol tank was somewhere between 800 and 900 miles



Before lockdown we were going to get another two tanks fitted; one tank would have been for both needs, as in habitation & travel, and these two tanks would have given us about a 500 mile range.

Rae


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 11, 2020)

in h said:


> You also have to fill in similar temperature conditions for consistency.



Unfortunately, living in Scotland, we don't seem to have the same sort of hot weather as you get down south.

Rae


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

You still get temperature difference. LPG expands a lot with temperature. If you buy on a chilly morning, every litre can have several percent more grammes than if you wait for a sunny afternoon.


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## Trotter (Aug 11, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> Good morning Mr T,
> Tesco don't sell LPG.........Morrison's and ASDA's do...........some not all. We are not blessed with LPG stations in Scotland, a few on the west coast and about the same on the east.
> 
> Saw the words, fuel and motorway service stations in the same sentence and just went off on one Tesco’s are not on my ,to shop at list, for reasons I would bore you
> ...


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

I think I have bought LPG at a Tesco, though I'm blowed if I can remember where.
[Later]Found this: "We did start selling LPG in 2004, but withdrew it in 2011 due to a lack of demand."


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## Wully (Aug 11, 2020)

I was on a camp site last month that had an lpg tank and proper garage style pump that’s the first and only time I’ve seen that ok it was 65p but really handy the site was at Brean sands forget the name.


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## alwaysared (Aug 11, 2020)

I use autogas.app to find LPG, it's web based so no app to install and it works on all platforms, even Linux for @trevskoda

Regards,
Del


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## in h (Aug 11, 2020)

Despite the name, I think that shows sites that are not selling Autogas branded LPG. I'd not seen that one before. Thanks for the hint.


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## alwaysared (Aug 12, 2020)

in h said:


> Despite the name, I think that shows sites that are not selling Autogas branded LPG. I'd not seen that one before. Thanks for the hint.


Yes it does show all brands, the farm I use when in the Telford area is on there and they have no association with the Autogas brand. Morrisons are also listed on there. Some haven't been updated for a while so I just phone first and I will then submit an update accordingly. That way it becomes more up to date and we all benefit.

Regards,
Del


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## in h (Aug 12, 2020)

Yes, I noticed how out of date it was compared to the others. I think lockdown has made a difference.


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## StreetSleeper (Aug 12, 2020)

Ian and Cath said:


> Try calling 01772634215 or 07887997653 for your tow bar. He specialises in motorhome  tow bars. I got mine including fitting for £300. It's near Blackpool  but you can park up overnight  nearby



Hello Ian,
Thank you for bringing that fellow to my attention; phoned him up today, told me he could do the business, suggested where I may park up for the evening if I arrive early and a damn good reasonable price. Will keep you informed on how it all turns out.

Rae


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## Pandaman2020 (Aug 17, 2020)

harrow said:


> I'm already in a LEZ  and just a bit further in it becomes a ULEZ with very strict rules with Euro 6 as a minimum. Older commercial diesels are a no go.


I’ve got a 2005 Transit that I converted and it is exempt from London LEZ and ULEZ till 2025 because I have disabled tax on it. I also don’t have to pay Tolls and most Bridge charges. Worth checking if you are a Blue Badge holder with maximum mobility!


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## Pandaman2020 (Aug 17, 2020)

StreetSleeper said:


> I do believe I'll get there. I don't expect high mpg, 13-15 would be nice.
> 
> Rae


I’ve had my mk6 Transit Remapped and put a higher ratio rear axle on and on a run I get 33 - 35 mpg pottering around town I get about 27 mpg, very happy with that


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## mistericeman (Aug 17, 2020)

Wully said:


> That figure of 10 and 12 mile to the gallon frightens the life out of me that’s America Muscle car v8 and v10 numbers. I’d take it to the roughest Housing estate you know leave the doors open with the keys in the ignition but fill the tank first give them a chance to get it home



It's also 1980 ex military FFR landrover and Sankey trailer territory ;-)


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