# 60kg PAYLOAD



## mikigough (Mar 8, 2017)

I bought a brand new chausson 728 from Tcmotorhomes, Herne bay. on the 1st of march. I decided to weigh it on the 2nd, only me in it and nothing else, 3440kg, a bit of a shock as I only weigh 62kg. So in actual fact , when we picked it up , my wife is 62kg , we were overweight . I took it to 2 different weighbridges the next day, same result, 3 weighbridges can't lie. When I phoned Tony of Tcmotorhomes, he said, Just enjoy your new motorhome, don't worry about weight. Yea, sure, Mr VOSA wouldn't agree. I took it back the next day and got my money back although I still lost out in expenses. People should be made aware of these cowboy dealers. Thanks to members in here for warning me about payload.

Mickey.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

That was the attitude of the dealer i bought my latest off van when i asked him about the payload.

He didn`t have a clue and just said, don`t worry about it there`s loads of room to store stuff.

I already knew but still thought i`d ask him out of curiosity, i have subsequently uprated mine via Sv Tech and now have over 800kg payload.


----------



## antiquesam (Mar 8, 2017)

I know we should all adhere to the Law but has anyone had a tug from VOSA in a coachbuilt or A class motorhome? I've been pulled many times in commercials but never in my motorhome.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

Yes, twice.

1, M6 Stafford.

2, M65 Bamber Bridge.


----------



## Obanboy666 (Mar 8, 2017)

Well done you for getting your money back without it seems to much hassle.
I could have been in a similiar situation 3 1/2 years ago when I bought my Swift. More by good luck than good management I had 350kg payload which I found to be adequate for me.
Like me you now know about payload, it was the first thing I checked before buying my pvc last year.


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 8, 2017)

I think the majority of motorhomes plated at 3500kg on UK roads would be overweight when in full touring mode,especially those more than 7m long.The only way to check properly is to pack the van as you would for a holiday,fill the water and fuel tanks and take it to a weighbridge and don't forget the dog(s).

I have advocated for a long time that dealers ought to provide a weighing service when supplying a new motorhome but they would be worried about the results.Our friends bought a new Rapido from Brownhills plated at 3500kg,when SV Tech weighed them at the Newark show they had no payload available and the rear axle weight was at the limit.Brownhills response-we weren't aware.:rolleyes2:


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 8, 2017)

***** said:


> Our previous Hymer Exsis I 562 (on the Ford base) fully loaded with everything but the kitchen sink, including two cycles, two full  11kg gas tanks, full water plus extra 30 litres. Spare wheel, tools, lots of food, including a few bottles of wine and beer. Basically, loaded for a long European tour, weighed in at 3480kg.
> From memory the net weight was around 2830kg before extras fitted!
> If we carried an extra passenger, or carried a dog, the van was then over loaded!
> 
> *Our present 7 metre Hymer 654 SL is 3480 empty!* but is plated at 4500kg gross!



Hence my comment that most motorhomes of 7m or above that are plated at 3500kg would be overweight in full touring trim.Another point to consider is the extra weight of all accessories fitted-extra leisure batteries,solar panels etc...all add up.

My previous van was a 6.5m long Autotrail(3500kg) and when mrs wakk had finished packing for a long trip I didn't have the courage to take it to a weighbridge.:rolleyes2:


----------



## yorkslass (Mar 8, 2017)

This has been a problem for many years but seems to have become worse. We have been to the NEC show a few times, and it always annoyed me that they would put up endless amounts of info, but never the payload. I can only assume the manufacturer didn't supply them, I wonder why, and the dealer didn't bother to find out.
Well done in getting your money back. I would be inclined to try get your expenses back too.


----------



## Tim120 (Mar 8, 2017)

Hi Mickey,
I followed your thread on the other site, such a shame you're not having the FUN you were expecting.
While looking at motorhome sites I stumbled upon this:-

MagBaz Travels - Marquis: Note for the Group Aftercare Manager

Which was a similar experience and very well detailed about the struggle to get his money back.
The rest of the site is worth a read I think too.
It's a blog from someone with over 25 years experience of motorhomeing and adventures on blikes.

I hope we will hear about your new choice before too long and stories of your travels in it too.

Take care.
Tim.


----------



## MarkJ (Mar 8, 2017)

***** said:


> Mickey, sorry to hear your weight problems, but I expect you are not alone, but you did have the good sense to check yourself. You just can't trust dealers, and as I have said before, the payload figures were altered a few years ago to show pay load with just 20 litres of water in the tank and other heavy items removed.
> Payload always used to be taken after 90% water, gas and fuel (roughly) but customers now seem to want so much more in their vans as standard equipment, that vans have now got heavier. The only way the makers can get the weight down is to fit and use lighter materials, which obviously must be easier to break!
> Personally, I would get legal advice about your new van not been fit for purpose! Sorry, but it is fact!
> Check out the Hymer Exsis range (and other similar) as they do have a good payload!
> ...



Has the definition of MIRO changed? I didn't know that. I've just bought a new van and the MIRO on the homologation papers was higher than what the specs said and then the actual MIRO weight was about 60kg more than that. As it happens we still have enough payload, but it's irritating (to say the least).


----------



## vanmandan (Mar 8, 2017)

Wooie1958 said:


> Yes, twice.
> 
> 1, M6 Stafford.
> 
> 2, M65 Bamber Bridge.



so were you over or under ??
anyone know the penalty for being overweight ??? (van not person).


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

vanmandan said:


> so were you over or under ??
> anyone know the penalty for being overweight ??? (van not person).





Under both times     :dance:     1st time ( before uprating ) only just     :scared:     but the 2nd time ( after uprating ) it was comfortably under       :dance:


----------



## MarkJ (Mar 8, 2017)

***** said:


> Yes, it has changed over the last few years!



I found this, plus some similar definitions


"The MIRO is the weight of your motorhome as it left the factory, a full tank of fuel and an average driver weight of 75kg, but before any other contents are added."

Last time I looked MIRO included 90% full water tank and other fluids. So my apologies to my van manufacturer - the difference between his and my weights is accounted for by that! Grrrr, though.


----------



## MarkJ (Mar 8, 2017)

vanmandan said:


> so were you over or under ??
> anyone know the penalty for being overweight ??? (van not person).



I believe you can be fined on a sliding scale depending on how much you are over and told to remove excess weight before you can drive off.

Ok if all you have to do is empty some water tanks, but how to choose between partner and dog if at least one has to be left behind?


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

They`re never going to do that David because then they`d be stuck with a lot of motorhomes they couldn`t sell       :scared:


----------



## n brown (Mar 8, 2017)

MarkJ said:


> I believe you can be fined on a sliding scale depending on how much you are over and told to remove excess weight before you can drive off.
> 
> Ok if all you have to do is empty some water tanks, but how to choose between partner and dog if at least one has to be left behind?


 that's easy - the dog can't get on a bus , can it ?


----------



## Fazerloz (Mar 8, 2017)

antiquesam said:


> I know we should all adhere to the Law but has anyone had a tug from VOSA in a coachbuilt or A class motorhome? I've been pulled many times in commercials but never in my motorhome.




Not had a tug personally in MH but I've seen motorhomes in the weigh area at Ainley Top. Jct 24 M62 quite often. We used to get pulled there regularly in the works pickups and vans as our base was just down the hill at Holywell Green.


----------



## Robmac (Mar 8, 2017)

I have one of these;

Caravan weight control | Chassis | Car & caravan accessories - Obelink.co.uk

Mine is actually the next model up, but I can't find it online now. I have used it immediately after using a weighbridge and the results were only a few KG different, so they seem to be a good indicator.

If ever I am worried about being overweight, I use it. I do however, use it differently to how most others do. The difference being that I put a slat of wood the same thickness as the machine under the 3 other wheels when I weigh the van. This then allows for the displacement of fuel, water etc. as the van is very slightly tilted on the machine. As well as the general weight shift of a vehicle being at an anlge, however slight.

I also try to use it on my workshop floor whenever possible as I know that is dead level.


----------



## antiquesam (Mar 8, 2017)

Fazerloz said:


> Not had a tug personally in MH but I've seen motorhomes in the weigh area at Ainley Top. Jct 24 M62 quite often. We used to get pulled there regularly in the works pickups and vans as our base was just down the hill at Holywell Green.



I've been put on the scales many times in a Daf LT 7.5 tonne because they look like the springs are on the floor when they are empty. But the only tug I have had in anything smaller was at Portsmouth Ferryport when they stopped me for having a headlight out. They said I would be fined, but when I said that we were packed too tight on the freight deck to do my checks and I couldn't see if the headlights were good in the lorry in front as there was too much light he let me off, as if it went to court I'd get off with my explanation.
I suspect they need a reason to stop you, or your Company is on the list of serial offenders, in which case you get stopped daily.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

Change your glasses Rob        :scared:     :lol-049:

Caravan weight control 1500 kg. | Chassis | Car & caravan accessories - Obelink.co.uk


----------



## 2cv (Mar 8, 2017)

Not only the total weight but the individual axle weights need to be considered. Especially with a long overhang it is very easy to exceed rear axle weight.
Anyone passing J10 near Stirling on the M9 can quickly pull off and check their weights at the VOSA weighbridge there. It is rarely in use by them.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

2cv said:


> Not only the total weight but the individual axle weights need to be considered. Especially with a long overhang it is very easy to exceed rear axle weight.
> Anyone passing J10 near Stirling on the M9 can quickly pull off and check their weights at the VOSA weighbridge there. It is rarely in use by them.





I use it every time we are up there  :dance:

The last time we was in there they had a articulated Fairground Wagon which also had a Catering Trailer hooked up to the back of it as well.

It was a battered old Foden unit and the trailer looked like part of the Waltzer ride and a huge twin axle Catering Trailer hitched as well.

They impounded it.


----------



## Robmac (Mar 8, 2017)

Wooie1958 said:


> Change your glasses Rob        :scared:     :lol-049:
> 
> Caravan weight control 1500 kg. | Chassis | Car & caravan accessories - Obelink.co.uk



Must admit Graham, I didn't look very hard for it. But yes, that's the one.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

Robmac said:


> Must admit Graham, I didn't look very hard for it. But yes, that's the one.





I dropped enough hints to the wife and both kids that they could club together and buy me one for christmas but it didn`t work     :sad:


----------



## IanH (Mar 8, 2017)

Re which to leave behind, wife or dog, saw this recently to see which one loves you most................

Put both in car boot, drive around for a few hours...........open boot, now see which one is wagging its tail and SO pleased to see you!!!:hammer:


----------



## MarkJ (Mar 8, 2017)

Robmac said:


> I have one of these;
> 
> Caravan weight control | Chassis | Car & caravan accessories - Obelink.co.uk
> 
> ...



Now that's what I call a proper gadget. Must get one!


----------



## Robmac (Mar 8, 2017)

MarkJ said:


> Now that's what I call a proper gadget. Must get one!



If you do Mark, make sure you use it on flat smooth ground with no gravel, otherwise you will crack the unit!


----------



## jagmanx (Mar 8, 2017)

*Incredible*

But you got your money back OK (apart from Expenses)

Best of luck finding something else !


----------



## vanmandan (Mar 8, 2017)

article on overweight motorhomes......

Overweight Motorhomes – How To Avoid This Too Common Problem – MotorhomePlanet.co.uk


----------



## Wanderer015 (Mar 8, 2017)

Something else to remember, If your 3500kg gvw motorhome weighs over 3050kg you are subject to the lower van speed limits too,  50mph on single road, 60mph on a dual carriageway, 70mph only on motorways


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 8, 2017)

www.wildcamping.co.uk/forums/motorh...lp-please-me-re-weight-issues.html?highlight=

i know its a long read but there is some useful info on here...


----------



## malagaoth (Mar 8, 2017)

I think that this must be a fairly common thing - although 60Kg is a little excessive!
I was tyre kicking in a showroom a few weeks back and saw quite a large 6 berth M/h  plated at 3500kg and the thought crossed my mind that with 5 passengers on board there couldnt be much payload left.

My Nuevo is plated at 3300kg and is, I feel, a little marginal on payload why AS took a 3500kg van and converted it and then plated it at 3300 I dont know if I was sure I was keeping it I would be wanting to take it back to 3500


----------



## Ed on Toast (Mar 8, 2017)

During a recent visit to S V Tech, in Leyland, Lancashire, I was told that the VOSA had recently purchased a large number of portable weight pads, that can weigh moving vehicles. 

I am not one to scaremonger but if they have invested in a large number of these, I would expect they intend to be out an about using them in the near future.

In these times of austerity, government cuts, all agencies are being encouraged to generate income for the treasury. So, if, as previously stated, a large number of fellow MH's are indeed over weight, I would expect VOSA to see rich pickings to be had. 

On a summer visit to AutoGas 2000, i was advised to get my MH weighed, great advice, I was 40kg over.  It cost £10 btw at a local scrap yard (front axle weight, rear axle weight and obviously combined)

I then took it to see S V Tech, where i was able to 'Up Plate' from 3,400kg to 3,650kg for a fixed fee of some £280. It is now a PHGV and saves me £70 ish, a year on road tax.


So, in time it will have paid to 'Re-Plate'  but more importantly it gives me 250kg more to keep me well within the law. 

Worth just adding:

Chris at AutoGas2000 and Gareth at S V Tech excellent customer service and great respective knowledge


----------



## Wully (Mar 8, 2017)

I wonder what the outcome would be if you had a vosa check done and you were found to be say 40 50 kilos overweight is it a fine and points or more severe. Just saying because some of these weight restrictions are load of tosh these motorhomes are basically commercial vehicles and could carry a lot more than the given weights. I ran an old Nissan cabstar pickup back in the eighties it was rated to carry 1 ton in U.K. But same pickup same suspension was rated to carry up to 3 ton depending on what country you were in. Just saying vans could carry a lot more safely but think it's government red tape and regs.


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 8, 2017)

Ed on Toast said:


> During a recent visit to S V Tech, in Leyland, Lancashire, I was told that the VOSA had recently purchased a large number of portable weight pads, that can weigh moving vehicles.
> 
> I am not one to scaremonger but if they have invested in a large number of these, I would expect they intend to be out an about using them in the near future.
> 
> ...



SV Tech will only up-plate your van if it is safe to do so. They will not cooperate with you on a "paper-work exercise."  They told me that not every vehicle can be upweighted  -  if your axle is simply not designed to carry the weight you want it to be - SV will not upgrade it.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 8, 2017)

***** said:


> You will find, it is much easier to update a vehicle on the Maxi Chassis or with 16 inch wheels.
> Tyre load index also plays a part, even rear axle air ride helps a little, it gave us an extra 100kg on the rear axle.
> There are many permutations!
> When I uprated our Hymer Tramp from 3500kg to 4100kg, SV Tech needed proof of the tyre size, also proof that the AiRide was fitted.
> ...


----------



## Ed on Toast (Mar 9, 2017)

delicagirl said:


> SV Tech will only up-plate your van if it is safe to do so. They will not cooperate with you on a "paper-work exercise."  They told me that not every vehicle can be upweighted  -  if your axle is simply not designed to carry the weight you want it to be - SV will not upgrade it.



S V TECH are extremely knowledgeable and only apply the law. I hope my previous post did not intimate anything else.

Very professional and highly recommended.


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 9, 2017)

Ed on Toast said:


> S V TECH are extremely knowledgeable and only apply the law. I hope my previous post did not intimate anything else.
> 
> Very professional and highly recommended.



Yes,I'll second that.They are professional and have a good reputation.

They are also commercially perceptive.Having a stand at the main motorhome shows just inside the main entrance and then offering a free weigh check for motorhomers as they arrive must generate a lot of business for them.


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 9, 2017)

Ed on Toast said:


> S V TECH are extremely knowledgeable and only apply the law. I hope my previous post did* not intimate anything else.*
> 
> Very professional and highly recommended.



Not at all....  i think SVTech are brilliant.  My dog of a van had no weight plate and no weight figures on the log book  - and between SVTech and I and correspondence with Mitsuibishi HQ in Japan we finally got the correct load figure and i am now plated and know what i can carry.


----------



## Tim120 (Mar 9, 2017)

*What Can Be Done About It*

Surely the issue here is not how do I make what I have bought fit for purpose.

Assuming Mickeys' van is not a one off, where did the advertised payload of 400kg come from?
Do they build one just for the scales so they can say 400kg?
Or do they just grab a figure from thin air.

Maybe it is just Chausson.... sorry that should have been CHAUSSON make motorhomes not fit for purpose.


----------



## Wisewoman (Mar 9, 2017)

All this talk of weight has got me thinking about my VW T4 camper. As its a PVC and not a conventional motorhome and as it started life as a standard short-nose VW van, then presumably it was designed to carry quite a lot of extra weight anyway so do I need to worry?

I know it's had a section of its roof cut off to accommodate a hi-top - but presumably that wouldn't have made much difference to its basic weight as fibreglass is lighter than metal.

On the gov website it's listing it's revenue weight as 2515KG. Is this the same as the max weight I can have with all my crap in it?

Cheers!


----------



## Wisewoman (Mar 9, 2017)

OK - Thanks for exploding my mistaken belief that fibreglass is a lightweight material!  As for its units - not sure what they are made of but it was converted by a conversion company that no longer exists. I bet she's pretty heavy with my underslung water tank full too. 

 I guess the only way to be sure is to take it to a darn weighbridge.


----------



## colinm (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> OK - Thanks for exploding my mistaken belief that fibreglass is a lightweight material!  As for its units - not sure what they are made of but it was converted by a conversion company that no longer exists. I bet she's pretty heavy with my underslung water tank full too.
> 
> I guess the only way to be sure is to take it to a darn weighbridge.



DVLA have done some strange things over the years with V5's, so you need to check the data plate on the vehicle and if you are concerned about possible overloading get it weighed fully loaded.


----------



## mark61 (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> All this talk of weight has got me thinking about my VW T4 camper. As its a PVC and not a conventional motorhome and as it started life as a standard short-nose VW van, then presumably it was designed to carry quite a lot of extra weight anyway so do I need to worry?
> 
> I know it's had a section of its roof cut off to accommodate a hi-top - but presumably that wouldn't have made much difference to its basic weight as fibreglass is lighter than metal.
> 
> ...




You need to check the chassis plate for weights.
Like most van models, there are various weight options within what look like identical vehicles.
A T4 could be a 800, a 1000, and in LWB a 1200. These numbers relate to a difference in carrying capacity.

Chassis plate will reveal all. Well, nearly all.


----------



## mark61 (Mar 9, 2017)

Certainly causes a lot of confusion, but nearly always the info is within the numbers that follow the model name. Somewhere your model will be referred to as a 1.9TD 3.1 or something similar.  

All down to money, theres a few £1000 between a,  lets say a 3000GVW model and a 3500GVW model

(Assuming the plate is the original Fiat one, and not a Hymer plate)


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> All this talk of weight has got me thinking about my VW T4 camper. As its a PVC and not a conventional motorhome and as it started life as a standard short-nose VW van, then presumably it was designed to carry quite a lot of extra weight anyway so do I need to worry?
> 
> I know it's had a section of its roof cut off to accommodate a hi-top - but presumably that wouldn't have made much difference to its basic weight as fibreglass is lighter than metal.
> 
> ...



Hi are there not some weight figures on your log book ?   thats where my search started......


----------



## GWAYGWAY (Mar 9, 2017)

I see that the wood?? in my Hymer cupboards and partitions in the ML I, is in fact a plywood made with two layers of Balsa and actually extremely light for what it is, it does make you wonder what the UK people who build with MDF or chipboard do, to TRY and bring it down to a lighter weight. As for motorhome worktops,  made with Household worktop, that stuff is HEAVY.  I did take out both the front seats to do some work and they are incredibly heavy for what they actually are.  A class windscreens are also heavy as the size is greater than the standard.


----------



## Wisewoman (Mar 9, 2017)

delicagirl said:


> Hi are there not some weight figures on your log book ?   thats where my search started......



I wasnt at home earlier - I am now  home and I found the 'plate'. It has four weights on it - the gross weight is 2515kg and the gross comb. weight is 4000kg then you have a front axle weight of 1280kg and rear axle of 1380kg.

Am i right in thinking that the combo weight is something to do with towing something?


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> I wasnt at home earlier - but I will check the log book when I get home and look for the 'plate'



I'm sure you know, But The Plates may look like this if its a van like mine (Peugeot Boxer 320 TD)




I've then got another Plate for when The Coachworks & 3rd Axel was Fitted



AND yet ANOTHER Plate for when I had the Vehicle UP Weighted Last year via SV TECH (That isn't a plate at all, its a sticky 'Tamper Proof' Sticker. ALL 3 of mine MUST be on show. (I need a bigger Engine Bay !)


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 9, 2017)

Nesting Zombie said:


> I'm sure you know, But The Plates may look like this if its a van like mine (Peugeot Boxer 320 TD)
> 
> View attachment 51534
> 
> ...



NZ  i have a feeling SVTech would rather we did not publish their plating information to prevent copying by scroats......


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 9, 2017)

They don't make this Understanding malarkey easy do they lol lol.

I have been on several weigh bridges over the last Year or so, & I ALWAYS have 100% full everything (Gas, Fuel & Water) & a Full Supermarket Shop on board when I do.

I'm running at around the

1650
1300
1150

Mark if memory serves, (i have of course got the exact figures & Axel weights somewhere) but I don't worry about it thease days as I know i have Plenty of Spare Donut n Cider Payload in hand


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 9, 2017)

Yep I think you may be right. That is how I read it as well. I DONT & will NEVER tow anyway, its a 29ft vehicle as it is. So I preferred to have all the weight allowance added to what I can 'CARRY'. as apposed to saving some for Towing !.
I think the Key thing is the AXEL weights & Ratings in all of this. So technically so long as these are not breached, Maybe I could tow up to there limits !...


----------



## mark61 (Mar 9, 2017)

Nesting Zombie said:


> Yep I think you may be right. That is how I read it as well. I DONT & will NEVER tow anyway, its a 29ft vehicle as it is. So I preferred to have all the weight allowance added to what I can 'CARRY'. as apposed to saving some for Towing !.
> I think the Key thing is the AXEL weights & Ratings in all of this. So technically so long as these are not breached, Maybe I could tow up to there limits !...



They must have left GTW blank for a reason, even if I can't think of one. I would expect it to be 4500Kg as the previous plate, which highlights another grey area in that you can't work out your towing weight simply by deducting GVW from GTW. So assuming your van plated a 4500kg GVW only weighed in at 3500Kg, that would allow you 1000Kg towing, as long as all the brackets and tow bars were rated at that plate or more. Can of worms


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> I wasnt at home earlier - I am now  home and I found the 'plate'. It has four weights on it - the gross weight is 2515kg and the gross comb. weight is 4000kg then you have a front axle weight of 1280kg and rear axle of 1380kg.
> 
> Am i right in thinking that the combo weight is something to do with towing something?



The way I see that information is
The Vehicle itself MUSTNT EVER weigh more than 2515kg
AND With that 2515kg, The Front Axel MUSNT EVER be heavier than 1280kg & The Rear Axel MUSNT EVER be heavier than 1380kg. IF you can Maintain these Axel Loadings then you may Tow up to a maximum COMBINATION WEIGHT of 4000kg. So that may be in the form of a Braked Trailer weighing in at some 1480kg ish

PLEASE note That is just MY interpretation,,, Not necessarily what it actually means.


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 9, 2017)

Isn't it a MINEFIELD ! I'm not so sure it goes on just 'Size of Vehicle' I'm guessing it goes on Make of Vehicle, Tyre Size, Shock Ratings & loads of other good stuff !. Lets be honest about it,,, Keep in mind what a small  Landrover can Tow ?.

I think that your actual Vehicle Mustn't weigh more than 3100kg (suitably split over the Axels) & if the axel loads can be maintained then you can Tow 1500kg ish !.


----------



## colinm (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> I wasnt at home earlier - I am now  home and I found the 'plate'. It has four weights on it - the gross weight is 2515kg and the gross comb. weight is 4000kg then you have a front axle weight of 1280kg and rear axle of 1380kg.
> 
> Am i right in thinking that the combo weight is something to do with towing something?



The gross comb. weight would seem to be the GTW(gross train weight) which is the max combined weight of van and trailer.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 9, 2017)

Wisewoman said:


> I wasnt at home earlier - I am now  home and I found the 'plate'. It has four weights on it - the gross weight is 2515kg and the gross comb. weight is 4000kg then you have a front axle weight of 1280kg and rear axle of 1380kg.
> 
> Am i right in thinking that the combo weight is something to do with towing something?





2515kg is the maximum weight allowed of your vehicle, that includes yourself and passenger if applicable

4000kg is the maximum weight allowed of your vehicle, that includes yourself and passenger if applicable and trailer / caravan when they are connected / hitched.

1280kg is the maximum allowed weight on your front axle, that includes yourself and a passenger if applicable.

1380kg is the maximum allowed weight on your rear axle, that includes yourself and passenger if applicable.

All of the above assumes the vehicle is loaded to the point you would be when you normally travel.



Go to a weighbridge fully loaded or how you normally travel and get it weighed, don``t forget to get back in the vehicle or at least stand on the weighbridge.


If it weighs less than 2515kg      :dance:    Happy Days      :banana:

If it weighs more than 2515kg    :scared:   Lose Weight      :sad:


Apologies for being repetitive but it`s the only way sometimes to avoid confusion      :rolleyes2:


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 10, 2017)

Wooie1958 said:


> 2515kg is the maximum weight allowed of your vehicle, that includes yourself and passenger if applicable
> 
> 4000kg is the maximum weight allowed of your vehicle, that includes yourself and passenger if applicable and trailer / caravan when they are connected / hitched.
> 
> ...



surely its   1280 + 1380 =  (front plus rear axle figures)   2660 as the maximum weight allowable of both axles combined  ?


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 10, 2017)

delicagirl said:


> surely its   1280 + 1380 =  (front plus rear axle figures)   2660 as the maximum weight allowable of both axles combined  ?




That`s not quite how it works, an allowance is made on each axle because you cannot normally load the vehicle to the perfect ratio.


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 10, 2017)

Wooie1958 said:


> That`s not quite how it works, an allowance is made on each axle because you cannot normally load the vehicle to the perfect ratio.





my SV Tech plate says     GVW   2600.   GTW  3500.   Axle 1.  1150  Axle 2  1450.       (1150+1450 = 2600)   These figures came from Mitsubishi in Japan.

They explained to  me that the van could weigh up to  2600  and i could tow an additional 900 .......(3500-2600)    AARggh!!!!  again  !!!! lol


----------



## delicagirl (Mar 10, 2017)

i doubt i ever will David !!!!    Think i'll get on with my essay lol


----------



## mark61 (Mar 10, 2017)

Perhaps thats how SV Tech work their magic, by giving a GVW = to that of the combined axles. As already stated, the GVW is usually not as high as just adding axle max weights.


----------



## Wooie1958 (Mar 10, 2017)

My Peugeot Boxer based ALKO chassis motorhome has 3 VIN plates. All have allowances on each axle.

1, Peugeot Plate GVW 3500kg, GTW 5500kg, Axle 1 1850kg, Axle 2 2120kg.

2, ALKO Plate  GVW 3850kg, GTW 5500kg, Axle 1 1850kg, Axle 2 2120kg.

3, Sv Tech Plate GVW 4100kg, GTW 5500, Axle 1 1850kg, Axle 2 2300kg.


----------



## Tim120 (Mar 10, 2017)

*How are they getting away with it?*

I'll ask again:-

Surely the issue here is not how do I make what I have bought fit for purpose.

Assuming Mickeys' van is not a one off, where did the advertised payload of 400kg come from?
Do they build one just for the scales so they can say 400kg?
Or do they just grab a figure from thin air.

Anyone?


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 10, 2017)

Tim120 said:


> I'll ask again:-
> 
> Surely the issue here is not how do I make what I have bought fit for purpose.
> 
> ...



Mickeys' van is certainly not a one off.I stated earlier in this thread that in my opinion the majority of motorhomes plated at 3500kg MGVW and around 7m long(and shorter)are overweight and driving illegally on the road.

My suspicions are confirmed by this article......Motorhome payload - Practical Advice - New & Used Motorhome & Campervan Reviews - Out and About Live
Have a read and see how the manufacturers calculate the payload.

The only accurate way to ensure you are legal is to load the van as you would for a holiday with water,fuel and gas tanks full and everyone on board including pets,then check you are below the MGVW.Dealers seem to be unconcerned and quite flippant about this widespread problem,what they don't realise is you could be prosecuted and the insurance invalidated in the event of a claim.


----------



## Nesting Zombie (Mar 10, 2017)

Tim120 said:


> I'll ask again:-
> 
> Surely the issue here is not how do I make what I have bought fit for purpose.
> 
> ...



I'm guessing that it comes down to 'Their' interpretation of Payload !.
Dry Water Tank.
Dry Grey Tank.
Dry Black Tank.
A Gallon of Fuel.
No Gas.
Empty Cupboards.
Absolutely Nothing aboard.
& No One aboard.
Maybe !.

Don't know !.


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 10, 2017)

***** said:


> Steve, the link you post is well out dated, it shows the 90% fuel and water etc.
> Most manufactures now use 20 litres of water and have probably reduced other things!
> The link was made in 2013!
> They are massaging the figures and new M.H owners have no idea!
> My advice before buying is to weigh an empty van and work from there!



Which makes the problem even worse Graham.

I think we are agreed that this is a widespread problem throughout the motorhome industry,my advice is to do as the OP did and load the van in full touring trim then take it to a weighbridge.It is the only accurate and reliable way to check if you are legal or not.Another bit of advice for what it's worth is to take the dealers' claims regarding payload with the proverbial pinch of salt.


----------



## jennyp19 (Mar 10, 2017)

Motorhomes are not the only ones over weight. I was talking to someone who was at Blenheim horse trials (or something of that ilk) 600 horse trailers - about 400 were pulled in and fined because they were overweight.  One make of three horse trailer is now classed as 2 horses and a pony!!!

If we hadn't liked our new MH so much and the fact we got it at a very good price, we would have rejected ours as not fit for purpose. We bit the bullet and paid to uprate to maximum permissible of 3850. SAP have sorted it, paperwork and VIN plate. Great firm to deal with. Personally I think it's only a matter of time before this s..t hits the fan.

I would be interested to know how much some of these 3500 vehicles weigh straight from the showroom. 

Gross weight is supposed to include driver and 3/4 tank of derv - when we went to fill our tank, it took about 2/3 of what the burstner took to fill - smaller tank less to include in gross weight.


----------



## VanHaver (Mar 10, 2017)

Don't blame the dealers or the manufacturers, it's a case of US wanting the impossible dream.
All the luxury and a huge payload within the restrictions of UK law as regards gross vehicle weights and licence restrictions.
Will these change aprés Brexit?
Don't hold your breath on that one folks.
 Take the driver's cpc as an example


----------



## Tim120 (Mar 10, 2017)

> I think we are agreed that this is a widespread problem throughout the motorhome industry,my advice is to do as the OP did and load the van in full touring trim then take it to a weighbridge.It is the only accurate and reliable way to check if you are legal or not.Another bit of advice for what it's worth is to take the dealers' claims regarding payload with the proverbial pinch of salt.



Mickeys van was not all packed and ready to go in full touring trim. It was weighed with mickey 62Kg in it and nothing else and came in at 3440kg leaving 60Kg payload. The information regarding payload came from the manufacturer and was stated as 400Kg.


----------



## VanHaver (Mar 11, 2017)

jennyp19 said:


> Motorhomes are not the only ones over weight. I was talking to someone who was at Blenheim horse trials (or something of that ilk) 600 horse trailers - about 400 were pulled in and fined because they were overweight.  One make of three horse trailer is now classed as 2 horses and a pony!!!
> 
> If we hadn't liked our new MH so much and the fact we got it at a very good price, we would have rejected ours as not fit for purpose. We bit the bullet and paid to uprate to maximum permissible of 3850. SAP have sorted it, paperwork and VIN plate. Great firm to deal with. Personally I think it's only a matter of time before this s..t hits the fan.
> 
> ...


Not at all, gross weight is the weight that the vehicle and contents are at the moment.
As opposed to in the past or in the future.
Ie, when you are hooked into the weighbridge by the wasps and actually weighed.


----------



## phillybarbour (Mar 11, 2017)

Some manufacturers get it right. Weighted mine on the way home from dealer on the day I bought it, weight by Burstner quoted at 4410kg, actual weight 4395kg pretty close.

Since uprated it to 5300kg.

Also if you build a van a on the Burstner website with extras it adds the weight up as you go, not seen any other manufacturer do this but some probably do.


----------



## Deleted member 9849 (Mar 11, 2017)

phillybarbour said:


> Some manufacturers get it right. Weighted mine on the way home from dealer on the day I bought it, weight by Burstner quoted at 4410kg, actual weight 4395kg pretty close.
> 
> Since uprated it to 5300kg.
> 
> Also if you build a van a on the Burstner website with extras it adds the weight up as you go, not seen any other manufacturer do this but some probably do.



I don't think that manufacturers have a problem with heavier vans.It's the 3500kg weight limit that is the main problem,in their quest to keep below this magic figure for licensing and road restrictions they are bending the truth somewhat.


----------



## Penny13 (Mar 11, 2017)

My Chausoon is 350 and weighed it when newish was just over and again this year it's 385 working on removing things  
What extras where on yours I would seriously contact Giles Arnaud about that he deals with problems for the whole company !!!
garnaud@triango.fr


----------



## VanHaver (Mar 11, 2017)

When/if you're ever in the queue at the DVLA weighbridge pull the plug on the water tank and get any passengers to do a runner.


----------

