# Chinese



## pamjon (Nov 12, 2022)

How come everything I want to buy is from China! I tried to buy an outside table for the Motor Home , did loads of research and sent emails asking the question, where is it manufactured but in the end I had to buy Chinese. 
Now I need a set of snowchains, hopefully will never had to put them on but I have to carry them for the Police in France. Low and behold the only ones I can buy at a sensible price is from China. When I look on Ebay it says from Litchfield or Uttoxeter which is just down the road from us but scroll down and the business seller is based in China. 
I was looking at the zip tie ones (orange) which seem if you have to use them very easy to put on. Do we not make anything in this country anymore?
PJ


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## izwozral (Nov 12, 2022)

Try finding shoes not made in China! Even some of the better known makes are now being made in China. 
We stayed in a hotel recently, it had the obligatory bible - printed in China! 
China has taken over the world by stealth and is now your master.


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## mistericeman (Nov 12, 2022)

pamjon said:


> Do we not make anything in this country anymore?
> PJ


YES ......

But people moan about the price .....


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## Red Dwarf (Nov 12, 2022)

Remember when stuff was expensive? You’d save up to buy something, and because that something was expensive, you would maintain and fix it. And that something was probably made in the UK.
Every time I visit the tip I’m amazed at what folk throw away. I remember as a kid working my socks off to get the money together to buy a secondhand push bike. If I wanted a bike now, just take your pick at the tip!
We want and like cheap stuff, that means it has to be made with a cheap workforce.

When I moved house earlier in the year, I left my huge sofas behind as they wouldn’t fit into my down sized bungalow. Spent a couple of days looking at new sofas, all looked like crap and were expensive. Found two sofas and an armchair on gumtree and did a deal at £150 delivered. Happy bunny, I’d reckoned on having to spend at least £2k....
Would you buy second hand furniture?


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## trevskoda (Nov 12, 2022)

Yep everything is made in china including all the electrical stuff for the BMW cars that people with too much money buy, and they scorned at my Sodas, well I had the last laugh.


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## witzend (Nov 12, 2022)

@pamjon 








						Snow Chains for Ducato Van 215/70x15 | in Truro, Cornwall | Gumtree
					

H/D Snow Chains for Ducato Van 215/70x15 + other sizes see photo for list of other sizes they fit. The other pic is what I paid for them when new  I bought these as they are Required to be carried while in mountain areas of France in winter months. Collection from Truro c




					www.gumtree.com


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## witzend (Nov 12, 2022)

Red Dwarf said:


> Remember when stuff was expensive?
> Would you buy second hand furniture?


Yes & Yes   Buying Then Selling at Local Auctions


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## Robmac (Nov 12, 2022)

One of the only things I buy these days which isn't made in China is a takeaway from my local Chinese restaurant!


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## Boris7 (Nov 12, 2022)

izwozral said:


> Try finding shoes not made in China! Even some of the better known makes are now being made in China.
> We stayed in a hotel recently, it had the obligatory bible - printed in China!
> China has taken over the world by stealth and is now your master.


I buy mine Here expensive but last 10 years plus


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## izwozral (Nov 12, 2022)

Boris7 said:


> I buy mine Here expensive but last 10 years plus


Established in Australia now owned by China, they just don't know it yet!


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## Boris7 (Nov 12, 2022)

izwozral said:


> Established in Australia now owned by China, they just don't know it yet!


But not


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## izwozral (Nov 12, 2022)

I bought a pair of Clarke shoes 13 years ago, the clod hopper type, round toed, soles half inch thick, sturdy as hell. Paid £8 in the sales, they were cheap because they were dark blue. Got some black leather dye, sorted. 
Still wear them even though they are not looking their best. And they were UK made!


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## izwozral (Nov 12, 2022)

Boris7 said:


> But not


I mean Australia is owned by China, certainly most of the ports and the accompanying infrastructures are.


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## oppy (Nov 12, 2022)

All phobile moans are made there as are designer pumps too, I'm glad to be a philistine


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## izwozral (Nov 12, 2022)

Motorola are Japanese so will be buying theirs next. Designer pumps are for pussy's, hob nailed boots are deriguer oop norf.
EDIT Motorola are now made in India!


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## oppy (Nov 12, 2022)

izwozral said:


> Motorola are Japanese so will be buying theirs next. Designer pumps are for pussy's, hob nailed boots are deriguer oop norf.
> EDIT Motorola are now made in India!


Sorry young Ral, they are assembled there but still built in China. I know this as a fact....................honest


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## mistericeman (Nov 12, 2022)

oppy said:


> Sorry young Ral, they are assembled there but still built in China. I know this as a fact....................honest


So is much of what most of us buy ....

So many reasons (primarily cost )that stuff isn't made in the UK these days ....

We do make some very niche stuff regardless of cost (most of the F1 car chassis are rooted in the UK ...or at least we're recently )
We make some pretty specialised kit for space etc too ...
BUT by and large it's cheaper to make mass produced stuff abroad


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## wildebus (Nov 12, 2022)

As this is a forum for people with Motorhomes and Campervans, if anyone wants B2B chargers, Battery Maintainers and MPPT controllers, you can get ones that are Designed AND Built in the UK at Merlyn Electronics in Salford, Manchester.


(Yes, the raw components will likely be made in Chinese chip factories, but if that is the source, that is the source)


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

Linn Sondek turntables are UK made,  and so are neam amps and many other top notch real Hifi.
I do love my linn and treat it as a baby.


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## Tezza33 (Nov 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> Linn Sondek turntables are UK made,  and so are neam amps and many other top notch real Hifi.
> I do love my linn and treat it as a baby.View attachment 114715


******* rubbish as a snow chain though


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## izwozral (Nov 13, 2022)

oppy said:


> Sorry young Ral, they are assembled there but still built in China. I know this as a fact....................honest


Damn. Two bean cans and a length of string then.
Flipping string and cans will probably be made in China too though


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## Wooie1958 (Nov 13, 2022)

pamjon said:


> How come everything I want to buy is from China! I tried to buy an outside table for the Motor Home , did loads of research and sent emails asking the question, where is it manufactured but in the end I had to buy Chinese.
> Now I need a set of snowchains, hopefully will never had to put them on but I have to carry them for the Police in France. Low and behold the only ones I can buy at a sensible price is from China. When I look on Ebay it says from Litchfield or Uttoxeter which is just down the road from us but scroll down and the business seller is based in China.
> I was looking at the zip tie ones (orange) which seem if you have to use them very easy to put on. Do we not make anything in this country anymore?
> PJ



China has 2 large warehouses in Litchfield and Uttoxeter as well as several other sites in the UK so they can dispatch from them.

That way you don`t get charged customs / VAT like you would if it was sent to you direct from China.


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## mariesnowgoose (Nov 13, 2022)

Wooie1958 said:


> China has 2 large warehouses in Litchfield and Uttoxeter as well as several other sites in the UK so they can dispatch from them.
> 
> That way you don`t get charged customs / VAT like you would if it was sent to you direct from China.



Stupid question, but how does that work?

Surely any goods manufactured in China still have to be shipped into the UK to be stored in said warehouses before distribution, so I’m assuming they would be subject to the same import duties and VAT as goods from other parts of the world at point of entry?

How is it a different arrangement for Chinese goods as opposed to goods from anywhere else?

(Can you tell I’ve never been an international trader?!  )


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## Millie Master (Nov 13, 2022)

Going back to the OP, I was and am so fed up with the fact that oh so many products you want to buy, turn out to be Chinese, so when it came to our table which we use both inside and out, I made my own and 7 years later it is still like new!

The one thing that does drive me absolutely bonkers, stark raving mad is when a UK company tries so damn hard to disguise their products are actually made in China............  Just the other day we bought and extending line washing line from the company known as Minky who proudly advertise "Celebrating 80 years, British Design & Manufacturing", so on receipt of the clothes line I thoroughly checked everything and there hidden, almost invisibly in the smallest of white out 6 point type the dreaded words "made in China"!!

It's the same with Hunter wellies, there they are carrying all their Royal Warrants, now you try and find anywhere on them where they are made and you will be doing so for a long time, but there, stamped into the very low quality rubber of the heel, the same dreaded country of manufacture and yet they are still allowed to carry a Royal Warrant!


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## mark61 (Nov 13, 2022)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Stupid question, but how does that work?
> 
> Surely any goods manufactured in China still have to be shipped into the UK to be stored in said warehouses before distribution, so I’m assuming they would be subject to the same import duties and VAT as goods from other parts of the world at point of entry?
> 
> ...


 They will have paid duties VAT before you purchase.

That saves you delivery being held up while you get sent a letter from Royal Mail informing of fees payable before you get your parcel. Oh, plus the Royal Mail handling fees which is about £12 I think.


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## mark61 (Nov 13, 2022)

No good blaming the Chinese, we were walked into this by our leaders, the ones voted for and the ones not voted for. Not just here either, all of the west.


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## alcam (Nov 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> Linn Sondek turntables are UK made,  and so are neam amps and many other top notch real Hifi.
> I do love my linn and treat it as a baby.View attachment 114715


Linn turntables and Skoda cars !
Which cost the most ?


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

alcam said:


> Linn turntables and Skoda cars !
> Which cost the most ?


I take it you have never seen or heard a linn but only jap crap. 
And never been in a real car.


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## alcam (Nov 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> I take it you have never seen or heard a linn but only jap crap.
> And never been in a real car.


Certainly heard a Linn , in Ivan Tiefenbraun's (?) house actually.
Guy was an absolute arse but , yes , great equipment


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## molly 2 (Nov 13, 2022)

I suppose china makes all the polutchion that we can't,


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

molly 2 said:


> I suppose china makes all the polutchion that we can't,


Yes a very dirty industrial country, but they are trying to clean it up, they need our dosh.


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## colinm (Nov 13, 2022)

molly 2 said:


> I suppose china makes all the polutchion that we can't,


'We' like to pretend that the UK produces very little pollution, the reality is we have exported the pollution to China by getting them to make everything for us.


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## wildebus (Nov 13, 2022)

alcam said:


> Certainly heard a Linn , in Ivan Tiefenbraun's (?) house actually.
> Guy was an absolute arse but , yes , great equipment


Back in the days of "proper" Hi Fi and Separates,  it was said that the typical Linn Sondek owner only ever used to own and play one disc - that being the reference platter to make sure it was setup correctly.

I used to be into Home Cinema pre the days of HDMI and DVDs and the "reference" video for the aficionados was much more fun ....  "Who Framed Roger Rabbit"  

What's up , Doc?


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> Back in the days of "proper" Hi Fi and Separates,  it was said that the typical Linn Sondek owner only ever used to own and play one disc - that being the reference platter to make sure it was setup correctly.
> 
> I used to be into Home Cinema pre the days of HDMI and DVDs and the "reference" video for the aficionados was much more fun ....  "Who Framed Roger Rabbit"
> 
> What's up , Doc?


Yes there was a lot of snobbery about the folk that had linns, not me I used mine lots of times and have a massive pile of direct metal master records from way back, some now worth more than my camper.


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## mistericeman (Nov 13, 2022)

To be honest ....there's a heap of snobbery in the 'Hi fi 'world ....

By the time most folks can afford the overpriced willy waving stuff their ears are so knackered they couldn't tell the difference .


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## spigot (Nov 13, 2022)

Red Dwarf said:


> Remember when stuff was expensive? You’d save up to buy something, and because that something was expensive, you would maintain and fix it. And that something was probably made in the UK.
> Every time I visit the tip I’m amazed at what folk throw away. I remember as a kid working my socks off to get the money together to buy a secondhand push bike. If I wanted a bike now, just take your pick at the tip!
> We want and like cheap stuff, that means it has to be made with a cheap workforce..
> *Would you buy second hand furniture?*


*Definitely,* my American dresser is over 100 years old, the bureau bookcase is 150 years old, large bookcase also 150 years old, display cabinet 200 years old as is the chest of drawers, table is 250 years old but the oldest item is the longcase clock, the maker went skint in 1710!

Recently, I wanted another Tall narrow chest of drawers, I couldn't believe the muck on sale in the stores, 700 quid for what I would call a criminal waste of trees.
I found a scruffy old oak 7 drawer chest at a boot sale for 20 quid, painted the carcass white, stripped & polished the drawer fronts, turned some rosewood handles & I now have a serviceable & posh looking chest


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

mistericeman said:


> To be honest ....there's a heap of snobbery in the 'Hi fi 'world ....
> 
> By the time most folks can afford the overpriced willy waving stuff their ears are so knackered they couldn't tell the difference .


I got mine in my early twenties, mutton jeff these days.


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## trevskoda (Nov 13, 2022)

spigot said:


> *Definitely,* my American dresser is over 100 years old, the bureau bookcase is 150 years old, large bookcase also 150 years old, display cabinet 200 years old as is the chest of drawers, table is 250 years old but the oldest item is the longcase clock, the maker went skint in 1710!
> 
> Recently, I wanted another Tall narrow chest of drawers, I couldn't believe the muck on sale in the stores, 700 quid for what I would call a criminal waste of trees.
> I found a scruffy old oak 7 drawer chest at a boot sale for 20 quid, painted the carcass white, stripped & polished the drawer fronts, turned some rosewood handles & I now have a serviceable & posh looking chest


Same here, a few bits of stuff my grandad and his mates made, all top notch, then you take a trip to ikea and become sick, as you say a waste of wood.


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## izwozral (Nov 13, 2022)

You couldn't sell brown furniture a few years back, nobody wanted it. Now the ikea generation are beginning to realise that the crap they bought does not travel well. 
There is definitely more brown furniture being 'upcycled' these days, quick paint job, light sanding for that distressed look and you have very trendy piece that will last for generations. 
Recently bought a solid oak extending dining table with 4 barley twist legs, wave form stretchers excellent condition and superbly made. £40 retail in an antique shop, snatched the guys hand off. 
Just going to sand it down to it's natural golden oak and polish it.


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## merl (Nov 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> Linn Sondek turntables are UK made,  and so are neam amps and many other top notch real Hifi.
> I do love my linn and treat it as a baby.View attachment 114715





trevskoda said:


> Linn Sondek turntables are UK made,  and so are neam amps and many other top notch real Hifi.
> I do love my linn and treat it as a baby.View attachment 114715


Owned a Sondek for a couple of years myself Trev, great TT but a sod to set up and get the best out of. Tried several 'upgrades' including power supplies, Trampolin etc but the biggest upgrade I got was was simply taking the lid off!!
Had a Michell Odyssey for many years now, superb TT and a Great British Product!








						Michell Gyrodec | Reference Turntable | Michell Audio
					

The GyroDec turntable first introduced in the early 1980’s had a design far beyond any other turntable at the time. Utilising a hanging pendulum style sub chassis and isolated drive motor, it literally turned turntable design on its head!




					www.michellaudio.com


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## Nabsim (Nov 13, 2022)

Have a look at Minirig speakers if you are after portable Bluetooth gear, made in Bristol. Belting bits of kit


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## alcam (Nov 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> Yes there was a lot of snobbery about the folk that had linns, not me I used mine lots of times and have a massive pile of direct metal master records from way back, some now worth more than my camper.


Bizarrely I was at young Tiefenbraun's house (son of owner?) to sort (give technical advice) about his tv reception.
He was a snobby git but easily persuaded to play stuff on his sound system


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## wildebus (Nov 13, 2022)

I always find it amusing that there was this desire to have great Hi-Fi, with seperates in racks with anti-vibration floor pins, amps with valves for warm sounds, insanely priced turntables, etc, etc, and then MP3 players arrived and all just about anyone begun to care about is how many tracks they can carry in their pocket, and how they had to have the smallest player.

To paraphrase Harry Enfield...  Sod the sound quality, come here and look at my Pod


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## Red Dwarf (Nov 13, 2022)

All you need to know about hi-fi here...


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## Tezza33 (Nov 13, 2022)

pamjon said:


> Now I need a set of snowchains, hopefully will never had to put them on but I have to carry them for the Police in France. Low and behold the only ones I can buy at a sensible price is from China. When I look on Ebay it says from Litchfield or Uttoxeter which is just down the road from us but scroll down and the business seller is based in China.


PM sent   




trevskoda said:


> I used mine lots of times and have a massive pile of direct metal master records from way back, *some now worth more than my camper.*


I have bootleg cd's worth more than a Skoda


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## merl (Nov 13, 2022)

My theory is ultimate sound quality started to decline with digitisation. As soon as you 'chop' the sound waveform up and store it as 1s and zeros you lose subtle nuances that literally 'make' the music. It still sounds perfectly acceptable and of course you can copy it a gazillion times without any loss and a huge library can be stored on a tiny chip but that leads to the 'more is better' attitude towards music and ultimately the magic that was lost in the digitisation can never be retrieved.


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## linkshouse (Nov 14, 2022)

merl said:


> My theory is ultimate sound quality started to decline with digitisation. As soon as you 'chop' the sound waveform up and store it as 1s and zeros you lose subtle nuances that literally 'make' the music. It still sounds perfectly acceptable and of course you can copy it a gazillion times without any loss and a huge library can be stored on a tiny chip but that leads to the 'more is better' attitude towards music and ultimately the magic that was lost in the digitisation can never be retrieved.


Yeah, I sure miss all that hiss and crackle! (ducks and runs for cover)


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## Pedalman (Nov 14, 2022)

I knew Linn Sondek were expensive but £23,300 for the turntable ?  Whow !


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## Wooie1958 (Nov 14, 2022)

linkshouse said:


> Yeah, I sure miss all that hiss and crackle! (ducks and runs for cover)




Yup, it all went down hill when the upgraded from this


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## wildebus (Nov 14, 2022)

Wooie1958 said:


> Yup, it all went down hill when the upgraded from this
> 
> View attachment 114738


Pah! New fangled nonsense.  Bring back the cylinder


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## linkshouse (Nov 14, 2022)

Wooie1958 said:


> Yup, it all went down hill when the upgraded from this
> 
> View attachment 114738


I remember there being one of these in our outhouse (back in the day council houses didn’t have garages or sheds, they had outhouses). I seem to think it got broken by us, kids being kids, winding it up like we were trying to start a car.


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## spigot (Nov 14, 2022)

Wooie1958 said:


> Yup, it all went down hill when the upgraded from this
> 
> View attachment 114738



Still use mine to play my Al Bowlly records!


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## wildebus (Nov 14, 2022)

merl said:


> Owned a Sondek for a couple of years myself Trev, great TT but a sod to set up and get the best out of. Tried several 'upgrades' including power supplies, Trampolin etc but the biggest upgrade I got was was simply taking the lid off!!
> Had a Michell Odyssey for many years now, superb TT and a Great British Product!
> 
> 
> ...


£3500!  As daft as a Linn!

Back in the day I had what was regarded as a very good turntable at a sensible cost - and still made by a British company....

Dual CS505 - think it was around £60.  
Did the job perfectly i.e. played records to listen to rather than sitting there trying to identify flaws.  
I got it out the loft to try and use it again back in 2007 but the rubber belt had perished and stuck itself to the pulleys.  Threw it and gave all my LPs to a niece and just stuck with the CDs.

Hi-Fi snobbery can be akin to Wine Snobbery.  The actual enjoyment of the product takes 2nd place to analysing it. 
There is a good phrase that can be used when doing many things in life and I reckon is very appropriate to the world of High Fidelity (and Wine for that matter) ... "The Best is the enemy of the Good".  The striving for perfection (which is never achieved) stops you enjoying what you started out wanting in the first place.


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## trevskoda (Nov 14, 2022)

wildebus said:


> £3500!  As daft as a Linn!
> 
> Back in the day I had what was regarded as a very good turntable at a sensible cost - and still made by a British company....
> 
> ...


Some folk are deaf, not your fault.


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## retep2305 (Nov 14, 2022)

pamjon said:


> How come everything I want to buy is from China! I tried to buy an outside table for the Motor Home , did loads of research and sent emails asking the question, where is it manufactured but in the end I had to buy Chinese.
> Now I need a set of snowchains, hopefully will never had to put them on but I have to carry them for the Police in France. Low and behold the only ones I can buy at a sensible price is from China. When I look on Ebay it says from Litchfield or Uttoxeter which is just down the road from us but scroll down and the business seller is based in China.
> I was looking at the zip tie ones (orange) which seem if you have to use them very easy to put on. Do we not make anything in this country anymore?
> PJ


Hi. We have unfortunately just had to sell our Motorhome. I have a brand new, unused set of snow chains for Ducato wheels. If your interested I can dig them out and send you some pics.


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## merl (Nov 14, 2022)

wildebus said:


> £3500!  As daft as a Linn!
> 
> Back in the day I had what was regarded as a very good turntable at a sensible cost - and still made by a British company....
> 
> ...


_£3500! As daft as a Linn!_
Well currently £3500 only gets you the TT and the arm is another 1k.
I reckon I could re-sell mine second hand for around 3k,  I paid £1800 back in 2007 and that included the arm so even taking inflation into account I see it as I've had a superb piece of equipment that looks beautiful and I've thoroughly enjoyed listening to AND it's made me money. 
Not so daft me thinks!


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## spigot (Nov 14, 2022)

pamjon said:


> How come everything I want to buy is from China! I tried to buy an outside table for the Motor Home , did loads of research and sent emails asking the question, where is it manufactured but in the end I had to buy Chinese.
> Now I need a set of snowchains, hopefully will never had to put them on but I have to carry them for the Police in France. Low and behold the only ones I can buy at a sensible price is from China. When I look on Ebay it says from Litchfield or Uttoxeter which is just down the road from us but scroll down and the business seller is based in China.
> I was looking at the zip tie ones (orange) which seem if you have to use them very easy to put on. Do we not make anything in this country anymore?
> PJ


Hey guys, what's all this about snow chains in France? I've driven there dozens of times & never taken snow chains.

Is this a new thingy?


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## Tezza33 (Nov 14, 2022)

spigot said:


> Hey guys, what's all this about snow chains in France? I've driven there dozens of times & never taken snow chains.
> 
> Is this a new thingy?


Not new but it depends which area of France you are going to, we were stopped going over the Alps so that they could check the tyres, I was OK with full winter tyres and snow chains but quite a few were told to  turn around and go back, that was over ten years ago









						Winter tyres, chains: mandatory equipment in mountainous areas from 1 November 2022
					

Winter tyres or snow chains: mandatory equipment in mountainous areas from 1 November 2022




					www.service-public.fr
				





Edit:. Not quite ten years ago it was 2015, I know because we bumped in to Stanski





						PROBABILITY OF THIS HAPPENING? - Maths Genius needed. Unbelieveable!
					

Hello ALL,  Merry New Year and Festivities to everyone  We are back from our 2 week adventure (and it was an adventure - starting on day 1 with leisure battery failing) around the ski slopes of the Alps, visiting Avoriaz (F), Les Contamines (F), Souze Doulx (I), Siestriere (I) and Mongenevre (F)...




					wildcamping.co.uk


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## trevskoda (Nov 14, 2022)

merl said:


> _£3500! As daft as a Linn!_
> Well currently £3500 only gets you the TT and the arm is another 1k.
> I reckon I could re-sell mine second hand for around 3k,  I paid £1800 back in 2007 and that included the arm so even taking inflation into account I see it as I've had a superb piece of equipment that looks beautiful and I've thoroughly enjoyed listening to AND it's made me money.
> Not so daft me thinks!


I was lucky and got mine from a chap who had bought it for his terminal wife, he brought it to my work and did not know to remove the heavy disc, after explaining to him it would have to go back to leric hifi in belfast to have the chassis tension reset we agreed £300, at that time they were £550 with no arm.


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## trevskoda (Nov 14, 2022)

I think snow chains are mandatory at a certain time of year and may be asked to see them, same with snow tyres.


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## barge1914 (Nov 14, 2022)

spigot said:


> *Definitely,* my American dresser is over 100 years old, the bureau bookcase is 150 years old, large bookcase also 150 years old, display cabinet 200 years old as is the chest of drawers, table is 250 years old but the oldest item is the longcase clock, the maker went skint in 1710!
> 
> Recently, I wanted another Tall narrow chest of drawers, I couldn't believe the muck on sale in the stores, 700 quid for what I would call a criminal waste of trees.
> I found a scruffy old oak 7 drawer chest at a boot sale for 20 quid, painted the carcass white, stripped & polished the drawer fronts, turned some rosewood handles & I now have a serviceable & posh looking chest


Show us yer chest


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## barge1914 (Nov 14, 2022)

spigot said:


> Still use mine to play my Al Bowlly records!


Al Bowley…yeh! Listened to him all through the midnight oil of my architecture school days, my flat mate had nothing else. Al Bowley, beer and toast….not to mention the curried porridge…well curry and porridge was  was all we had left at the end of the year.


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## reiverlad (Nov 14, 2022)

The reason that the majority of goods and parts are made in China is very simple-most companies now are run by accountants !!


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## alcam (Nov 14, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> I think snow chains are mandatory at a certain time of year and may be asked to see them, same with snow tyres.


New laws re 3 peaks tyres and/or snow chains will be enforced in France 2023


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## Tezza33 (Nov 14, 2022)

Not many people know that I was conceived in Beijing


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## trevskoda (Nov 14, 2022)

I better not mention Liverpool for me.


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## Tim120 (Nov 14, 2022)

They seem to struggle making...

Pandas...


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## Tezza33 (Nov 15, 2022)

Tim120 said:


> They seem to struggle making...
> 
> Pandas...


I never saw the connection, I tow a Fiat *Panda *with the van 

Don't mention TrevScouser


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## Harrytherid (Nov 15, 2022)

mariesnowgoose said:


> Stupid question, but how does that work?
> 
> Surely any goods manufactured in China still have to be shipped into the UK to be stored in said warehouses before distribution, so I’m assuming they would be subject to the same import duties and VAT as goods from other parts of the world at point of entry?
> 
> ...


Well Marie,  I HAVE been an international trader and it makes no sense to me.  Was a long time ago, I suppose.  Used to build and export boats, mostly to continent, before EEC


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## Harrytherid (Nov 15, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> I take it you have never seen or heard a linn but only jap crap.
> And never been in a real car.


Friend of mine bought a Transcriptors Reference turntable.  No better than a cd player in my opinion.  No matter now, I can't hear an anvil dropped let alone a pin.


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 15, 2022)

The problem is, we all want cheap and well made, never going to happen, back in Victorian days maybe, but not now we all want the latest last five minute gadgets etc, good quality and good workmanship go hand in hand with high prices, any silly bugger can work for nowt.

Confuscious he say, "good no cheap, cheap no good". which would be great but expensive can also be no good these days.


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## merl (Nov 15, 2022)

Dead right, paying good money doesn't ALWAYS get you a good product. Seems that the only way you can guarantee to get what you paid for is by going cheap hence the 'more is better' and our throw away culture. I dont know about you lot but I really fear the future of my grand children and generations beyond, it really makes me feel quite sad sometimes.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 15, 2022)

reiverlad said:


> The reason that the majority of goods and parts are made in China is very simple-most companies now are run by accountants !!


Yes and people like Dyson have exported our technology for their personal gain, and sod the rest of us.  Richest man in Britain, I am told, and most likely Chinese money.


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## Fisherman (Nov 15, 2022)

Remember Deep Purples live Lp made in Japan. I was a keen photographer and most of us used either Nikon, or Canon equipment, all made in Japan. But even the Japanese have moved some of their manufacturing to China. This iPhone is made in China, China is the workhorse of the planet. But once their standards of living and wages catch up we’re will our stuff be made. I reckon India will eventually replace China.


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## merl (Nov 15, 2022)

Fisherman said:


> Remember Deep Purples live Lp made in Japan. I was a keen photographer and most of us used either Nikon, or Canon equipment, all made in Japan. But even the Japanese have moved some of their manufacturing to China. This iPhone is made in China, China is the workhorse of the planet. But once their standards of living and wages catch up we’re will our stuff be made. I reckon India will eventually replace China.


Oh No! Can we stay away from LPs please, It just means more bullying for me and Trev!


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## alcam (Nov 15, 2022)

Fisherman said:


> Remember Deep Purples live Lp made in Japan. I was a keen photographer and most of us used either Nikon, or Canon equipment, all made in Japan. But even the Japanese have moved some of their manufacturing to China. This iPhone is made in China, China is the workhorse of the planet. But once their standards of living and wages catch up we’re will our stuff be made. I reckon India will eventually replace China.


Remember when everyone complained about everything being made in Japan


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## mark61 (Nov 15, 2022)

Japan/China. Chalk and cheese.


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## spigot (Nov 15, 2022)

barge1914 said:


> Show us yer chest


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## alcam (Nov 15, 2022)

mark61 said:


> Japan/China. Chalk and cheese.


Very much so .
Chalk and cheese that is


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## Robmac (Nov 15, 2022)

Harrytherid said:


> Yes and people like Dyson have exported our technology for their personal gain, and sod the rest of us.  Richest man in Britain, I am told, and most likely Chinese money.



2nd richest I believe.


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## alcam (Nov 15, 2022)

Robmac said:


> 2nd richest I believe.


Forgot about you


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## Robmac (Nov 15, 2022)

alcam said:


> Forgot about you



Although a man of considerable wealth, taste and damned good looks I am not quite in that league.

I'm still a couple of shillings behind Trev.


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## izwozral (Nov 15, 2022)

Robmac said:


> Although a man of considerable wealth, taste and damned good looks I am not quite in that league.
> 
> I'm still a couple of shillings behind Trev.


Don't you mean a couple of shillings short of a pound Rob?


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## Fisherman (Nov 15, 2022)

Robmac said:


> 2nd richest I believe.


After yersel Rob


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## vindiboy (Nov 16, 2022)

If you want to see real waste, take a walk around car boot sales, kids toys,,clothes  prams, push chairs, just about everything and mostly in great condition and hardly worn or played with, all for peanut prices so the seller can buy more of the same, madness. No wonder some folks are in deep debt and can't afford their energy bills etc, lots of foreign chappies and ladies buying suitcases full of our cast off stuff to seel in there own Countries it seems, we love the car boots buying stuff and enjoy the banter often make a bob or to as some stuff sells easily on line, free to advertise on Gumtree and F B Market Place cash on collection, no brainer.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 16, 2022)

vindiboy said:


> If you want to see real waste, take a walk around car boot sales, kids toys,,clothes  prams, push chairs, just about everything and mostly in great condition and hardly worn or played with, all for peanut prices so the seller can buy more of the same, madness. No wonder some folks are in deep debt and can't afford their energy bills etc_, lots of foreign chappies and ladies buying suitcases full of our cast off stuff to seel in there own Countries it seems,_ we love the car boots buying stuff and enjoy the banter often make a bob or to as some stuff sells easily on line, free to advertise on Gumtree and F B Market Place cash on collection, no brainer.


At least they get reused, good no?  At least India is a democracy and no threat to us.


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## spigot (Nov 16, 2022)

barge1914 said:


> Show us yer chest



Actually it was a 5 drawer chest that I got from the boot sale, not a 7 drawer one. It was in a very scruffy condition, I painted the carcass white, stripped & polished the drawer fronts & turned some rosewood handles. the chest is residing in the cellar at the moment full of tools & bits & pieces.


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## spigot (Nov 16, 2022)

The 7 drawer item is a Georgian "Wellington" chest example which is in an annex to the kitchen.


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## colinm (Nov 16, 2022)

We have a whole range of furniture, some of it couple of centuries old, some Victorian, quite a bit of 20th C, some 21st C, some made by myself, and shock horror, some Ikea,


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## RoadTrek Boy (Nov 16, 2022)

spigot said:


> The 7 drawer item is a Georgian "Wellington" chest example which is in an annex to the kitchen.View attachment 114798


That battery won't last long with all them lights on...


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## maingate (Nov 17, 2022)

42 years ago I paid £1,000 for a craftsman made 8 feet long Chesterfield sofa and one Club chair. It was a lot of money back then but has been a great investment. The sofa has been recovered once but only because the African Grey Parrot we had caused a lot of damage to the leather, the Club chair is original.
In 42 years we would have had a number of Sofas and chairs, costing a lot more than the original investment.

I worked in China for 6 months and saw at first hand the brand new massive Trading Estates built to accommodate Western companies. There was nothing Mickey Mouse about them, they had brand new manufacturing equipment, were supervised by Western Staff and the locals were properly trained. The products are well made, quality checked ..... and cheaper.


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 17, 2022)

Very true, but I can only witness the other side of the story, a lot of cheaply made well photographed items which either didn't work or work very long fell apart, I have had some good stuff, but not much, and this is now not 42 years ago when most countries we making decent stuff, even us.


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## trevskoda (Nov 17, 2022)

I know a chap who imports chinese sofas, they cost him £30 each, we have a real horse hair sofa in the house from the early fifties still going strong, I was offered a large sum of money for it and some other chests of drawers by a film set co.


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## maingate (Nov 17, 2022)

Pudsey Bear said:


> Very true, but I can only witness the other side of the story, a lot of cheaply made well photographed items which either didn't work or work very long fell apart, I have had some good stuff, but not much, and this is now not 42 years ago when most countries we making decent stuff, even us.


There are still quite a few bespoke manufacturers around today, especially for furniture. Their prices may sound extortionate today (just the same as 42 years ago) but that is for their labour charges and skills at making items from quality materials. I probably paid around 5 times more than if I had bought a 3 piece suite from a shop in 1980. So look at the suite prices in the TV adverts, multiply by 5 and check how a much a top quality suite costs, one that will last for a very long time. I expect it will work out much cheaper in the long run.

Actually, thinking about it, I might get most of my £1,000 back if I advertised mine for sale.


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## Tezza33 (Nov 17, 2022)

maingate said:


> Actually, thinking about it, I might get most of my £1,000 back if I advertised mine for sale.


I wouldn't advertise it yet Jim, the prices are going up so probably better to sit on it


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## trevskoda (Nov 17, 2022)

maingate said:


> There are still quite a few bespoke manufacturers around today, especially for furniture. Their prices may sound extortionate today (just the same as 42 years ago) but that is for their labour charges and skills at making items from quality materials. I probably paid around 5 times more than if I had bought a 3 piece suite from a shop in 1980. So look at the suite prices in the TV adverts, multiply by 5 and check how a much a top quality suite costs, one that will last for a very long time. I expect it will work out much cheaper in the long run.
> 
> Actually, thinking about it, I might get most of my £1,000 back if I advertised mine for sale.


A good one build as mine was now costing around 3 grand, how many folks would buy that these days, very few except the Hillery Hamiltons who drive a Jag, thats Irish for thought to be snobs.


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## Harrytherid (Nov 18, 2022)

My sweetheart (wife, well generally she is) wants a new 3 piece.  I recon a skilled refurbisher could make the leather as good as new and stain it to the colour she wants which we can't find anywhere, but no.  She wants new even though we are not exactly rolling in it and it is an electric reclining set that still works beautifully.  No amount of persuading will change her mind.


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

Just say no.


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## wildebus (Nov 18, 2022)

Harrytherid said:


> My sweetheart (wife, well generally she is) wants a new 3 piece.  I recon a skilled refurbisher could make the leather as good as new and stain it to the colour she wants which we can't find anywhere, but no.  She wants new even though we are not exactly rolling in it and it is an electric reclining set that still works beautifully.  No amount of persuading will change her mind.


Nothing wrong with wanting a change.  And THAT is why spending a large amount of money on something that will last a great deal of time is not actually the best thing to do always.  
You either end up keeping something you don't really want anymore,  just because it is "too good to get rid off",  or you do get shot and are annoyed as there was plenty of life left in it.


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

We have a black leather 3 seater and one of those wide chairs, I like em, they are in perfect condition, Liz wants a new one, but with her it's change for the sake of change, I'm happy with things the way they are and it took a year to pick this one as she procrastinates so much about everything, I just said go out and pick one as I'm fed up of trawling the stores, she got a bit more focussed then.


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## wildebus (Nov 18, 2022)

Fisherman said:


> Remember Deep Purples live Lp made in Japan. I was a keen photographer and most of us used either Nikon, or Canon equipment, all made in Japan. But even the Japanese have moved some of their manufacturing to China. This iPhone is made in China, China is the workhorse of the planet. But once their standards of living and wages catch up we’re will our stuff be made. I reckon India will eventually replace China.


Victron would agree with you.




Most of their stuff seems to be made in India.  Some in Vietnam, some Indonesia I think, but don't recall getting anything Victron with a "made in China" sticker?


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## wildebus (Nov 18, 2022)

Pudsey Bear said:


> We have a black leather 3 seater and one of those wide chairs, I like em, they are in perfect condition, Liz wants a new one, but with her it's change for the sake of change, I'm happy with things the way they are and it took a year to pick this one as she procrastinates so much about everything, I just said go out and pick one as I'm fed up of trawling the stores, she got a bit more focussed then.


One of those "wide chairs"?  Is she one of those women who insist on 'curling' up her legs on chair?
Wish I knew you were getting shot - took delivery of a 'wide chair' for her indoors a couple of weeks ago after a 10 week order time (not waiting on a slow boat from China, just slow UK workers  ) at an extortionate price.

PS. Started looking for the chair maybe a year ago!


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

We're not getting rid David, she just wants to but I'm staying firm on it, I use the big chair anyway, Liz uses the sofa.

It's an Italian make, Sisi Senza, this is the brown one, got no pics of ours or the big seat, but I like it as the arms are great for my mouse, and if we have company they are good seats too.


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## merl (Nov 18, 2022)

Go on then, I'll say it.......
If you rearranged your furniture you'd get in and out much easier mate


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

Well as I said its not ours nil points on the mirth.


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## Tezza33 (Nov 18, 2022)

From snow chains to rearranging furniture in just over 100 posts, it could only happen on here


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## wildebus (Nov 18, 2022)

Pudsey Bear said:


> Well as I said its not ours nil points on the mirth.


Those look pretty similar to mine ...



This lives in my Loft Studio/Man Cave as it had to make room for the new "wide chair"

I had a very nice 3 seater black leather settee and chair from John Lewis which went into storage after I moved, and by the time the house was done to bring in the furniture, I had paid more in storage fees then the furniture cost!  and to make it worse, the wife wanted a different settee anyway.   Sold the rather expensive John Lewis set for around £50


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

Do you have a Specsavers near you David???


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## wildebus (Nov 18, 2022)

Pudsey Bear said:


> Do you have a Specsavers near you David???
> 
> View attachment 114849 View attachment 114850


you are right.  mine does look a lot nicer


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## trevskoda (Nov 18, 2022)

Harrytherid said:


> My sweetheart (wife, well generally she is) wants a new 3 piece.  I recon a skilled refurbisher could make the leather as good as new and stain it to the colour she wants which we can't find anywhere, but no.  She wants new even though we are not exactly rolling in it and it is an electric reclining set that still works beautifully.  No amount of persuading will change her mind.


Tell her you are taking it to the dump, then get it recovered and brought back as a new one.


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## trevskoda (Nov 18, 2022)

Pudsey Bear said:


> Just say no.


So thats why you walk funny, nuts and kick spring to mind.


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 18, 2022)

I don't boss her, she doesn't boss me, seemples.


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## reiverlad (Nov 18, 2022)

Before I was made redundant back in 2010, I spent about 4 years working for an agent of overseas companies. 
We found British customers for castings and forgings to be manufactured.
We represented a fair few companies from all over the world.
These included a couple from China, plus India, Turkey, Germany, Italy & Spain.
We are not talking about small companies – the supplier in Spain developed parts for the Mclaren road car, Italy made for the latest aircraft carriers.
Among some of the goods that were made in China were for the motor trade, including the hydraulic jack for the Range Rover. This cost 10% of the sales price to manufacture.
Everything stamped with the range rover part numbers etc. Testing was done in China exactly as it was done here in the UK. 
Any failures found here in the uk were replaced – no quibbles.
Most of the quality checks were to the suppliers standards, so it was to the quality the customer wanted.
One of the major suppliers of seals for the oil industry hunted all over the world for the cheapest prices. 
Back in 2010, they reckoned that China had only about 15 years left as the cheapest place to get things manufactured. 
India was already challenging them, but the reliability in India was still iffy but the Philippines, Cambodia etc were regarded as the next places to go to for low manufacturing costs, especially if you could bring your own inspection regime as well.
As I said – as long as accountants run companies then it won't matter where the goods are manufactured. 
Their companies just become assembly plants in reality.


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## spigot (Nov 18, 2022)

maingate said:


> There are still quite a few bespoke manufacturers around today, especially for furniture. Their prices may sound extortionate today (just the same as 42 years ago) but that is for their labour charges and skills at making items from quality materials. I probably paid around 5 times more than if I had bought a 3 piece suite from a shop in 1980. So look at the suite prices in the TV adverts, multiply by 5 and check how a much a top quality suite costs, one that will last for a very long time. I expect it will work out much cheaper in the long run.
> 
> Actually, thinking about it, I might get most of my £1,000 back if I advertised mine for sale.





Tezza33 said:


> I wouldn't advertise it yet Jim, the prices are going up so probably better to *sit on it.*



*Sit on it, *isn't that the idea with a sofa?


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## Tezza33 (Nov 18, 2022)

spigot said:


> *Sit on it, *isn't that the idea with a sofa?



Yes, that is why I thought it was funny, if it had been a bed I would have suggested he sleeps on it


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## Robmac (Nov 18, 2022)

Tezza33 said:


> Yes, that is why I thought it was funny, if it had been a bed I would have suggested he sleeps on it











						Rachel Green Jennifer Anniston GIF - Rachel Green Jennifer Anniston Woosh - Discover & Share GIFs
					

Click to view the GIF




					tenor.com


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## Pudsey Bear (Nov 19, 2022)




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## Doddy6 (Nov 23, 2022)

Tis linked to money,China has large population and low wages so items to cheap to make.Western world,Germany and USA in particular investing heavily in China.Good return on investment.


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## coundonroad (Nov 24, 2022)

wildebus said:


> £3500!  As daft as a Linn!
> 
> Back in the day I had what was regarded as a very good turntable at a sensible cost - and still made by a British company....
> 
> ...


I always thought Dual were German. (Pretty sure, anyway).


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## coundonroad (Nov 24, 2022)

I bought a Sondek (Nirvana/Valhalla, with Ittok and a Grace F9E MC cartridge) back in about 1983 from Sound Advice in Loughborough. It replaced a Rega Planar 3.
Sadly a few years later I had to sell it due to redundancy and needing to replace a boiler.
I replaced it with a secondhand Planar 3, and still have it (although I have replaced the arm with an RB300, and a belt or two, and a capacitor...).
Love that thing.


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## trevskoda (Nov 24, 2022)

coundonroad said:


> I bought a Sondek (Nirvana/Valhalla, with Ittok and a Grace F9E MC cartridge) back in about 1983 from Sound Advice in Loughborough. It replaced a Rega Planar 3.
> Sadly a few years later I had to sell it due to redundancy and needing to replace a boiler.
> I replaced it with a secondhand Planar 3, and still have it (although I have replaced the arm with an RB300, and a belt or two, and a capacitor...).
> Love that thing.


Good deck, the table is important for them mind you as no suspension.


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## Robmac (Nov 24, 2022)

coundonroad said:


> I bought a Sondek (Nirvana/Valhalla, with Ittok and a Grace F9E MC cartridge) back in about 1983 from Sound Advice in Loughborough. It replaced a Rega Planar 3.
> Sadly a few years later I had to sell it due to redundancy and needing to replace a boiler.
> I replaced it with a secondhand Planar 3, and still have it (although I have replaced the arm with an RB300, and a belt or two, and a capacitor...).
> Love that thing.



I remember a place called the Sound Factory in Loughborough run by Derek Whittington but can't remember Sound Advice. Where abouts was it?


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## coundonroad (Nov 24, 2022)

Robmac said:


> I remember a place called the Sound Factory in Loughborough run by Derek Whittington but can't remember Sound Advice. Where abouts was it?


Yes, now you mention it, I think it was changed to Sound Factory at a later date.
The first time we went there, for the LP12 demo, Derek was very late as apparently he was puking in the bath at home (that's how it was described anyway). Apparently he suffered very badly with migraines.
Anyway, I ordered the deck with a Basik arm, which was later changed for the 9in Ittok - a beautifully engineered thing. Quite fancied trying the 12in, but that was beyond my means.
(Edit: Duke Street rings a bell).


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## Robmac (Nov 25, 2022)

coundonroad said:


> Yes, now you mention it, I think it was changed to Sound Factory at a later date.
> The first time we went there, for the LP12 demo, Derek was very late as apparently he was puking in the bath at home (that's how it was described anyway). Apparently he suffered very badly with migraines.
> Anyway, I ordered the deck with a Basik arm, which was later changed for the 9in Ittok - a beautifully engineered thing. Quite fancied trying the 12in, but that was beyond my means.
> (Edit: Duke Street rings a bell).



I can't remember the exact location but I think it was in the Sparrow Hill area which I think would include Duke Street?


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