# leisure battery saga sorted....



## ajs (Feb 11, 2009)

.

 some of you may recall me asking stupid questions about leasure batteries a few weeks ago 
and geoff W gave me some advice AND offered to fit 1 for me 

 well i bit the bullet today and went to Tewkesbury and popped into battery mega store .. 
nice man fitted a DC 27 for me fer £90 squid 

http://www.batterymegastore.co.uk/c...e.cgi?product=Batteries_Caravan!Exrider_Green

cheaper than web price cus i went in.. i.e.no postage (and free fitting)

3yr guarantee, summat about over 400 cycles (what ever that means)
and 105A to replace my old under drivers seat 85A.. ( yes it fitted)

 anhhoo.. spose proof of pudding is how well it performs... 
only run lights off it so i'll be keen to see how many hours it lasts between recharges ..

think it was a good deal .. whada fink folks 

 regards
ajs

managed to avoid spanner usage yet again .. btw.. thanks Geoff for yer offer


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## kangooroo (Feb 11, 2009)

I also bought my replacement leisure battery from Battery Megastore.  Although I'm only down the M50 from them, I opted for mail order but have to say the service was superb - right down to a text message confirming dispatch and when delivery would be (9am the next morning).

Also, Battery Megastore upgraded my order free of charge from a sealed lead calcium to a deep cycle battery.

Excellent service and highly recommended.


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## PaulC (Feb 11, 2009)

What are the differences between the two batteries? Because if you look in the Sterling website  (do a google) there is not a lot between normal starter type batteries!


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## kangooroo (Feb 11, 2009)

PaulC said:


> What are the differences between the two batteries? Because if you look in the Sterling website  (do a google) there is not a lot between normal starter type batteries!




£20 in price at the time - and, hopefully, a longer life!


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## Hirohito (Feb 12, 2009)

*Leisure Battery Wiring*

Have had the split charge relay sitting on the desk here for months trying to get a simple-to-follow wiring diagram.( I like to do these things myself). At last & again at last, along comes Rifleman with one that should win an Oscar !! I can now get the leisure boyo wired up....Thank you Rifleman......


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## ajs (Feb 13, 2009)

.

 I’m still trying to work out what a deep cycle is...

i know what a by-cycle is, and a uni-cycle  but i've never come across a deep 1...

isit 1 that has been fished out of a canal 

 regards
aj


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## Hirohito (Feb 13, 2009)

*Deep Cycle Battery.*

Put simply, a deep cycle battery delivers a regular consistent voltage as the battery is used. In contrast, the starter battery delivers "spiky" voltage as required. In modern cars, vans etc.,a deep cycle battery may be used as a starter battery due to the up to date electronics. There is also a charging & structural difference between the two batteries.


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## PaulC (Feb 13, 2009)

Well according to the Sterling website there is no such thing as a deep cycle battery that can be bought at a reasonable price. The so called leisure batteries are just starter batteries that have been re-labeled. Any opinions?


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## BedfordMJ (Feb 14, 2009)

PaulC said:


> Well according to the Sterling website there is no such thing as a deep cycle battery that can be bought at a reasonable price. The so called leisure batteries are just starter batteries that have been re-labeled. Any opinions?



Yes that is how I understand it.


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## Hirohito (Feb 15, 2009)

*Leisure Batteries*

I'm afraid, 'tis a lot more complicated than that. I installed a "furling" wind turbine for the house & with the kit, was the special battery. I ordered another battery as I needed the 24 volt system  to commence the regulator. The battery was designated "matt-glass" so that it would retain the charge & let it out in the manner required for the lights etc.,  The battery was £150.00 with £50.00 carriage. I can not see a  starter battery fulfilling this function. The leisure battery in my Transit is deep-cycle for the same reasons for current release. But anyway, 'nuff said, each to his own !!


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## PaulC (Feb 15, 2009)

Well all I can say is that according to the Sterling website deep cycle batteries are so costly that it is unlikely that  so called leisure batteries are constucted that way and are in fact starter batteries!


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## Belgian (Feb 15, 2009)

PaulC said:


> Well according to the Sterling website there is no such thing as a deep cycle battery that can be bought at a reasonable price. The so called leisure batteries are just starter batteries that have been re-labeled. Any opinions?


That is not only an opinion; it is a fact ! 
I had to buy another leisure a few years ago; the battery specialist didn't have one at hand, so I got a starter battery. No worries, said the man, these are all the same only labelled with a higher price. The only real deep cycle batteries are the so called 'boat batteries' and they are too big for a MH. Just don't let your battery drop under 11 V and you are OK for years. A deep cycle can go down to 10 V- but at that low tension hardly anything will stil work. A solar will help to keep the battery uploaded.


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## Tony Lee (Feb 16, 2009)

> No worries, said the man. these are all the same



The mantra of a truly ignorant "expert".


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## PaulC (Feb 16, 2009)

Well I think it may have truth to it. Because so called leisue batteries should be deep cycle, otherwise why bother? But true deep cycle are too expensive!


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## ajs (Feb 16, 2009)

.

the message i'm gettin here is that everyone who has bought a "leisure" branded battery has been ripped off..



regards
ajs


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## lenny (Feb 16, 2009)

Dont worry Ajs, just get hitched up next to Geoff at Whitehouse farm. He,s like a mobile auto electrician with all the tools.
He fixed my battery problem last weekend and it only cost me 2 cups of coffee and a small pan of broth for his kin

And all the advice you need comes free


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## Dezi (Feb 16, 2009)

Unfortunately whether you have been ripped off or not is not the issue. The issue is there is a difference between leisure & engine starter batteries and the answer is yes for the above given reasons ( deep cycle etc )  Murvi currently – little pun – fit 2 x 110 amp squadron batteries, this coupled with a 85 Watt solar panel we keep us pretty much independent.    

% of full charge  	12V   	24V
100% 	                12.7   	25.4
90% 	                        12.6   	25.2
80% 	                        12.5 	        25
70% 	                        12.3  	24.6
60% 	                        21.2  	24.4
50% 	                        12.1  	24.2
40%                    	12      	24
30% 	                        11.8  	23.6
20% 	                        11.7  	23.4
10% 	                        11.6  	23.2

Dezi


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## Dezi (Feb 16, 2009)

just move the figures across to the !2 & 24v.

I might know about batteries but cutting & pasting Duh 

Dezi


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## ajs (Feb 16, 2009)

lenny said:


> Dont worry Ajs, just get hitched up next to Geoff at Whitehouse farm He,s like a mobile auto electrician with all the tools.
> He fixed my battery problem last weekend and it only cost me 2 cups of coffee and a small pan of broth for his kin
> 
> And all the advice you need comes free


 


yep... i'm aware.. he did offer to fit mine... but wasn't necessary in the end 
.. but what i want te know is.... is he any good a cleanin 


dizzi... you lost me after the word..._"unfortunately" _

_regards_
_ajs_


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## Airecraft (Feb 16, 2009)

ajs said:


> .
> 
> the message i'm gettin here is that everyone who has bought a "leisure" branded battery has been ripped off..
> 
> ...



Two things: Those I have spoken to who have met the MD of Sterling personally suggest he is a little, ahem, eccentric, though that does not mean their stuff is no good.
I have spoken to an electronics lecturer who informs me that, in simple terms, leisure batteries have lots of thin plates which maximise the electrolyte / plate interface giving long life but a tendency to deform under high current demand, whereas starter batteries have fewer, thick plates that supply peak power but lose voltage more rapidly on constant drain (though they partially recover if rested). This made sense to me and I don't see why one would be so much more to manufacture than the other.
Andy


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## Dezi (Feb 16, 2009)

AJS,

Keeping it simple a leisure battery should not be used for starting engines &  an engine battery should not be used for EFFECTIVE leisure use. Only swap in emergencies.
The chart above shows 12v is 100% at 12.7 & a 24v at 24.4
Then just work down the readings. Try not to let your batteries drop below % 30 if you want them to last.

Dezi


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## PaulC (Feb 16, 2009)

That's very good theory, but what about so called leisure batteries that are on the market? Are they genuine or just labeled that way? And what happens if you treat one of these  "leisure" batteries as a deep cycle one?


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## Tony Lee (Feb 16, 2009)

Aire_on_a_shoestring said:


> I have spoken to an electronics lecturer who informs me that, in simple terms, leisure batteries have lots of thin plates which maximise the electrolyte / plate interface giving long life but a tendency to deform under high current demand, whereas starter batteries have fewer, thick plates that supply peak power but lose voltage more rapidly on constant drain (though they partially recover if rested). This made sense to me and I don't see why one would be so much more to manufacture than the other.
> Andy


From Wikipedia


> The key structural difference between deep cycle batteries and cranking batteries are the lead plates, which are solid in deep-cycle batteries and composed of porous sponge-like plates in starting batteries. Some batteries that are labelled "deep-cycle" do not possess these solid lead plates, however, and are actually "hybrid" batteries. While a deep-cycle battery is designed to discharge down to as much as 20% of its charge capacity over several cycles, companies recommend that a hybrid battery not be discharged beyond 50% of its capacity.



From Outback Marine


> Starting Batteries
> Starting batteries need to supply heavy current (or high power) for a short period of time. Starting a healthy engine consumes only a small amount of overall energy. For example, the energy required to crank a 120-amp starter motor for 5 seconds would be around 0.17 amphours. (5 seconds x 120-amps = .17 amp-hours). - Or about the same amount of energy required to run an anchor light for 10 minutes.
> 
> They have a thin plate construction to maximise the plate surface area to efficiently deliver a burst of current suitable for starting. When a battery is charged and discharged, a small amount of plate material is eroded for each cycle - this is one of the wear out mechanisms for a lead-acid battery. The thin plate construction is not so much an issue for starting type batteries because they're designed to be kept fully charged all of the time.
> ...


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## oldiebutgoodie (Feb 16, 2009)

Belgian said:


> That is not only an opinion; it is a fact !
> The only real deep cycle batteries are the so called 'boat batteries' and they are too big for a MH. Just don't let your battery drop under 11 V and you are OK for years.



I am slightly confused over the above statement - my Vetus boat batteries are exactly the same size as normal batteries albeit heavier. What do you mean 'too big'?


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## Dezi (Feb 17, 2009)

Tony is correct in the information supplied, but I suspect that it is dated. The two 110 amp Squadron leisure batteries
we have in the new murvi are actually smaller than the 85 amp ones that were in the old murvi when we purchased it in 1999 - time moves on and components become more efficient.

Reminds of the old joke about the electronics factory. They were so successful that they moved into smaller premises.      

Dezi


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## PaulC (Feb 17, 2009)

But what are we buying in the shops? I now think there is no legel definition of a leisure battery. Where are is with a deep cycle battery I suspect! If it's not written stone, but it went to court I think that would be the case. So a leisure battery could be anything!


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## Tony Lee (Feb 17, 2009)

"Leisure" battery seems to be a peculiarly British (or maybe European) term.
I'm used to "Starting", "Deep Cycle" or "Marine" classifications - with many being convinced that the marine type are a compromise that is not particularly good for anything - although the mariners swear by them.

I agree that there is a lot of overlap and if you include in the equation the  creative puffery employed by many manufacturers and retailers, it is not surprising that most customers are left in the dark. In some cases the retailers haven't much of a clue either so it becomes the blind leading the blind with the customer paying as usual.

For many weekend warriors, the extra cost of true deep cycle may not be warranted, especially if EHU is usually available or there is a bit of driving done every couple of days. Just flog the battery and when it fails, pull into the nearest discount store and grab another one. Full-timers do need to do the research and spend the big bucks for a balanced system but there are not many of us in that category.


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## oldiebutgoodie (Feb 17, 2009)

Tony Lee said:


> "Leisure" battery seems to be a peculiarly British (or maybe European) term.
> I'm used to "Starting", "Deep Cycle" or "Marine" classifications - with many being convinced that the marine type are a compromise that is not particularly good for anything - although the mariners swear by them.



Having had a pair of Vetus marine batteries in my boat last for 11 years I for one am convinced of their value and reliability in a marine situation but could not justify the cost for my vans!


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## jojo (Apr 15, 2009)

*split relay chargers*

Hi
I have had my ducato camper for a few years now and fitted a split relay charger,it's been on now for two years.I have two good car batteries that are being charged each time i start the engine,the power goes to the main battery,then when that is charged excess charge goes to them,no power comes from the main battery,so the motor will always start.I think it cost about £35 and half hour to fit,hope this helps someone.


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