# 12vdc Fridges - Average Power Used?



## MrRob (May 12, 2022)

I’ve recently installed a Dometic CRE80 in place of the old 3way in our camper.

We have just got back from 3 nights away to test it, the Victron Orion Smart 12 12 30 B2B charger and new 285ah deep cycle lead leisure batteries Ive installed work as expected.

We also wanted to see how long our Eco Flow River pro Lithium battery (62ah) will take the day to day strain of powering the fridge as it recharges fast off the generator whenever that is convenient/possible.

All works fine but I’m still unsure as to how much power the fridge is likely to draw on average as we saw it use 30ah and then 60ah in two days of similar use & weather conditions.

Anyone got some figures for actual battery use for similar dc fridges?


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## mistericeman (May 12, 2022)

MrRob said:


> I’ve recently installed a Dometic CRE80 in place of the old 3way in our camper.
> 
> We have just got back from 3 nights away to test it, the Victron Orion Smart 12 12 30 B2B charger and new 285ah deep cycle lead leisure batteries Ive installed work as expected.
> 
> ...


Both our Waeco chest fridge 
AND 240v under counter/Victron inverter fridges hit an average of 4 amps kicking in about once an hour for a few minutes (usually around 3 to 4 minutes when fridges in use) 
Less when stuff is just shut up


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## Fazerloz (May 12, 2022)

Our Waeco Cr65 runs 20mins on 20 mins off.  Rated at 45w


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## MrRob (May 12, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> Our Waeco Cr65 runs 20mins on 20 mins off.  Rated at 45w


Yep, that’s about what my CRE80 is doing I think.


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## Fazerloz (May 12, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Yep, that’s about what my CRE80 is doing I think.


If your 80 is like our 65 there is a earth terminal next to the compressor that is not mentioned in the manual .  Put a earth wire on to the van body.


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## MrRob (May 12, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> If your 80 is like our 65 there is a earth terminal next to the compressor that is not mentioned in the manual .  Put a earth wire on to the van body.


I have high and low external vents (it replaced a traditional 3way) so may put baffling in to feed cool air & stop it mixing with heated exhaust air… but it’s a pain to pull as it is air tight to interior because it’s next to the water heater vent

… I could run thicker wire too.


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## trevskoda (May 12, 2022)

My electric fridge has no cooling gear on the back and is completely sealed, burns a qtr of an amp when running which is not that often, it will run 24 hrs on 180 ah battery bank with out any solar, but I'm sure longer in summer when the 200w of panels kick in.


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## Fazerloz (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> I have high and low external vents (it replaced a traditional 3way) so may put baffling in to feed cool air & stop it mixing with heated exhaust air… but it’s a pain to pull as it is air tight to interior because it’s next to the water heater vent
> 
> … I could run thicker wire too.


It may be a pain to pull but it will be worthwhile  in the long run.


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> It may be a pain to pull but it will be worthwhile  in the long run.


Yep, we are due to be away for 10+ days in the van on Monday so I’ll probably leave it until we get back. Lithium power pack and 30 minutes of generator each day should see us through for now.


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> My electric fridge has no cooling gear on the back and is completely sealed, burns a qtr of an amp when running which is not that often, it will run 24 hrs on 180 ah battery bank with out any solar, but I'm sure longer in summer when the 200w of panels kick in.


My van has a 3D roof profile so stick on panels won’t work & I don’t want chunky framed panels up there either, hopefully I can get away without solar.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> My van has a 3D roof profile so stick on panels won’t work & I don’t want chunky framed panels up there either, hopefully I can get away without solar.


You could carry a portable solar kit. That could be handy to have?  I have roof-mounted solar but also have a socket in the rear valance where I can plug in another solar array. (At home I plug into some panels I have on a shed roof to supplement the panels on the van roof).


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## Nabsim (May 13, 2022)

I have a Waeco 110ltr e fridge freezer and it averages around 48amps in 24 hours


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## Robmac (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Yep, we are due to be away for 10+ days in the van on Monday so I’ll probably leave it until we get back. Lithium power pack and 30 minutes of generator each day should see us through for now.



Will you be driving during those 10 days and charging the powerpack?


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

Nabsim said:


> I have a Waeco 110ltr e fridge freezer and it averages around 48amps in 24 hours


I think you mean "48 *amp hours* in 24 hours" ! 
One small word for a reply, one giant leap in consumption.  averaging 48 amps would be over 1,000 amp hours per day.


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## Nabsim (May 13, 2022)

r4dent said:


> I think you mean "48 *amp hours* in 24 hours" !
> One small word for a reply, one giant leap in consumption.  averaging 48 amps would be over 1,000 amp hours per day.


I have noticed you like to correct me as you have done the same correction before. Do you think anyone reading doesn’t know what I mean?


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> I’ve recently installed a Dometic CRE80 in place of the old 3way in our camper.
> 
> Anyone got some figures for actual battery use for similar dc fridges?



Dometic quote an average of 2.16 amp. Over a 24 period this is around 50 ah. 








						Dometic Waeco Coolmatic -  CRE80 Compressor Fridge | Electric Cool Boxes | Leisureshopdirect
					

Buy a Dometic Waeco Coolmatic -  CRE80 Compressor Fridge | Electric Cool Boxes | Leisureshopdirect




					www.leisureshopdirect.com
				




A 285ah lead battery will, without some charging, last almost 72 hours.


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

Nabsim said:


> I have noticed you like to correct me as you have done the same correction before. Do you think anyone reading doesn’t know what I mean?


Yes I do.
There are many members who don't understand the difference.  A lot are confused by all the different units involved in electricity.

Didn't mean to upset or insult you, just trying to avoid misunderstanding by members who don't know their amp from their watt.


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

mistericeman said:


> Both our Waeco chest fridge
> AND 240v under counter/Victron inverter fridges hit an average of 4 amps kicking in about once an hour for a few minutes (usually around 3 to 4 minutes when fridges in use)
> Less when stuff is just shut up



I assume that is 4 amp at 230v (about 50 amp at 12v).


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

r4dent said:


> I assume that is 4 amp at 230v (about 50 amp at 12v).


no, that will be 4A at 12V.  Around 50W.

I don't think ANY normal fridges draw close to around 1000W in use!


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

r4dent said:


> Dometic quote an average of 2.16 amp. Over a 24 period this is around 50 ah.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ha yes, thanks.  I’d read that before I purchased but almost ignored / forgot it as I have no idea how their test conditions or use varies the real world results.

Oddly with us the lower 30ah day shows an average of about 23 degrees inside the van and the 60ah day was cooler average of 21 (but much more wind into the vents) although temps did peak higher at 26 just before sunset when sun reflected off the puddles in car park!

Probably too soon to make any big adjustments to our system.



Robmac said:


> Will you be driving during those 10 days and charging the powerpack?



Yes. Although I’d aim to recharge the leisure batteries then. The 8 amps the lithium pack will take (from the 30 available from the B2B) can quickly be made up from the generator at 40-60 amps input.

I will probably wire a 12v feed between starter battery and lithium pack (and power fridge)  to bypass the B2B when on the move at some point.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> I’ve recently installed a Dometic CRE80 in place of the old 3way in our camper.
> 
> We have just got back from 3 nights away to test it, the Victron Orion Smart 12 12 30 B2B charger and new 285ah deep cycle lead leisure batteries Ive installed work as expected.
> 
> ...


Ok,  a few comments ....

A typical decent Compressor Fridge will use around 1.5Ah/Hr average.  When running it will be around 4A, but the compressor only runs part of the time, so it averages at around 1.5A. 
In hot weather, the power consumption goes up notably - on the official figures, it can nearly double.  For most people, that does not matter massively as if they are wild-camping, they typically have solar and the solar in hot (so sunny usually) brings in more power then when overcast and cooler.   As you DON'T have solar, the increased consumption could be an important factor (so maybe as I suggesed, a portable solar kit could be handy?)
USING the fridge makes a remarkable difference as well.  when I say "using", I mean opening door to take food out, put food back, etc.  The official figures and most consumption data (including mine) will be based on the door kept closed.   I have noticed that when I look at my power logging for the fridge, I can actually tell very easily when I load it up or do any kind of re-arranging - the 'cool' goes very quickly through an open door and much faster than you might imagine.   I wonder if that was a factor in your 30Ah vs 60Ah power use days?

Now on power use, I found my Waeco 50CRX would run for just about 2 days on a pair of 100Ah Lead Acid batteries until they dropped to 50% - so that would be 100Ah taken out in those 2 days.   that is around about the same as your findings by the look of it (90Ah in two days).
Now of course bear in mind you are not only running the fridge, but using lights or whatever.  My 240V Compressor Fridge uses significantly less power per day than the Motorhome habitation system generally when I am using it, so my battery bank is not sized to support the fridge but using what I want to use.  Unless you are very frugal, off-grid and with no solar, you will be using that generator a fair bit I would guess?

As you have fitted the Compressor Fridge where the old 3-Way fridge is, you could take advantage of the venting and fit a cooling kit if you think the fridge migght be getting hot and so less efficient?  
I fitted a "proper" cooling kit to mine.  When I say "proper" I simply mean a commercially packaged all-in-one kit with temperature-controlled speed control and a nice little  control panel.   You can obviously rig up your own more cheaply, but I decided to treat myself  
I found the fans fitted perfectly on the Thetford mesh vent screen ...


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## Nabsim (May 13, 2022)

Funnily enough averaged out I don’t seem to get much difference in power consumption between hot and cold weather or summer and winter. It may be partly because I don’t open the door very often, don’t have milk in tea/coffee and don’t drink alcohol or fizzy drinks so not going for cold cans.

I can only work off my battery monitor, I don’t have anything measuring just my fridge but I know usually what’s drawing power at any given time so have a pretty good idea.

I don’t turn my fridge off overnight as I hear quite a few do, that may be something to eek out your power drain a little maybe? January into February this year I tried not using the fridge and the difference was amazing even though I knew my fridge was my main user. I don’t think I will bother again though as with the fridge and freezer with just me and the dogs I can easily do three weeks between shops and still me eating nice veggies


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

mistericeman said:


> Both our Waeco chest fridge
> AND 240v under counter/Victron inverter fridges hit an average of 4 amps kicking in about once an hour for a few minutes (usually around 3 to 4 minutes when fridges in use)
> Less when stuff is just shut up





r4dent said:


> I assume that is 4 amp at 230v (about 50 amp at 12v).





wildebus said:


> no, that will be 4A at 12V.  Around 50W.
> 
> I don't think ANY normal fridges draw close to around 1000W in use!


Domestic fridges have a max watt of around 800w, which would be just under 4 amp @ 230v.




__





						How Many Watts Does a Refrigerator Use? [Or Mini-Fridge] - EnergyBot
					

The average home refrigerator uses 350-780 watts. Click to learn how you can find how much your specific model uses, including mini-fridges.




					www.energybot.com
				




MrIceman stated the fridges runs for about 1.5 hours a day (24 * 4 mins)

*If the 4a is at 230v*
4 amp x 230v * 1.5hrs = 1380 wh per day = 1380 * 365 wh per year = 500 kwh per year

*If the 4a is at 12v*
4 amp x12v    * 1.5hrs  =    72 wh per day =    72 * 365 wh per year = 27kwh per year 

An efficient modern 230v fridge uses around 100 kwh per year.

I still think 4amp @ 230v is more realistic.

I am hoping MrIceman will clarify the situation.


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## Robmac (May 13, 2022)

Nabsim said:


> Funnily enough averaged out I don’t seem to get much difference in power consumption between hot and cold weather or summer and winter. It may be partly because I don’t open the door very often, don’t have milk in tea/coffee and don’t drink alcohol or fizzy drinks so not going for cold cans.
> 
> I can only work off my battery monitor, I don’t have anything measuring just my fridge but I know usually what’s drawing power at any given time so have a pretty good idea.
> 
> I don’t turn my fridge off overnight as I hear quite a few do, that may be something to eek out your power drain a little maybe? January into February this year I tried not using the fridge and the difference was amazing even though I knew my fridge was my main user. I don’t think I will bother again though as with the fridge and freezer with just me and the dogs I can easily do three weeks between shops and still me eating nice veggies



I'm sorry Neil but that doesn't make sense.

Not drinking alcohol is just plain wrong.


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## Nabsim (May 13, 2022)

Robmac said:


> I'm sorry Neil but that doesn't make sense.
> 
> Not drinking alcohol is just plain wrong.


No but probably helps me reduce my power use


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

Thank you all for the info and advise. I’m hoping 60ah a day is towards the top end of usage, if so we can manage that load with the generator and lithium power pack at least in the short term.



wildebus said:


> Ok,  a few comments ....
> 
> A typical decent Compressor Fridge will use around 1.5Ah/Hr average.  When running it will be around 4A, but the compressor only runs part of the time, so it averages at around 1.5A.
> In hot weather, the power consumption goes up notably - on the official figures, it can nearly double.  For most people, that does not matter massively as if they are wild-camping, they typically have solar and the solar in hot (so sunny usually) brings in more power then when overcast and cooler.   As you DON'T have solar, the increased consumption could be an important factor (so maybe as I suggesed, a portable solar kit could be handy?)
> ...



That all makes sense to me.

Do you have a link for the cooling fans please?  as that might save me making one and it failing to achieve anything like with the old fridge where it seemed to make things worse.

We just used the fridge as normal for the test 

The last 10 years we haven’t tended to stay put for more that two nights and only tend to use phones, tablets and lights in the evenings with generator power for Microwave or habitation AC if we ever needed it off grid.


Although most of the last 4/5 year we have had to hook up anyway if we wanted cool things in the fridge so perhaps we need to re-learn how to fridge.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

This is the fan kit I bought - https://amzn.to/38sl9A3
It is not cheap at £57, and you will get posts saying you can do your own for a lot cheaper, and I could have done that myself as well, but I don't regret buying the kit and I would actually get the same kit again.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

r4dent said:


> Domestic fridges have a max watt of around 800w, which would be just under 4 amp @ 230v.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Very few will be that high and no current domestic fridges are close.  I KNOW mriceman was meaning 4A at 12V.   That information has been shared on previous similar threads.
I can tell you now that 4A at 230V is NOT CORRECT.
Your maths are flawed.   You are assuming the duty cycle is 6% whic is very low (it may be correct but it would be unusual).  Why do you assume that number as a standard?  You are extrapolating a post with an assumption of information, you do not know what fridge he has in terms of efficiency, and combining it with a website with unstantiated data to get a faulty conclusion.


Here is an REAL example of a domestic compressor fridge and its power use:
Over a 6 hour period, it is on (i.e. Compressor running) for approx 60 minutes - that is a 17% duty cycle  (around 3 times your assumption).
The power draw whilst running is an average of 55W  - on a 12V system, that would be approx 4.5A


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## mistericeman (May 13, 2022)

r4dent said:


> Domestic fridges have a max watt of around 800w, which would be just under 4 amp @ 230v.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yup 4a 12v (though there is obviously a very short spell of 'inrush' as the inverter kicks in... 

Kicks in about once an hour (obviously when your not in and out of it for wine) 
The Waeco actually runs slightly less on average being a chest type, so the cold air doesn't flood out when you open it...


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## Canalsman (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> Ok,  a few comments ....
> 
> A typical decent Compressor Fridge will use around 1.5Ah/Hr average.  When running it will be around 4A, but the compressor only runs part of the time, so it averages at around 1.5A.
> In hot weather, the power consumption goes up notably - on the official figures, it can nearly double.  For most people, that does not matter massively as if they are wild-camping, they typically have solar and the solar in hot (so sunny usually) brings in more power then when overcast and cooler.   As you DON'T have solar, the increased consumption could be an important factor (so maybe as I suggesed, a portable solar kit could be handy?)
> ...


One observation.

You would do well to blank off the grille on either side of the fans. Without doing that you reduce the efficiency because the fans draw air from the sides as well as from below.


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## r4dent (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> Your maths are flawed.



My math is NOT flawed.
Saying my math is flawed is like a red rag to a bull, (I studied Maths at University) 
I agree that the answers are outside the anticipated range and this made me to suspect the data which is why I sought clarification from mistericeman.



wildebus said:


> You are assuming the duty cycle is 6%  Why do you assume that number?  Why do you say the fridge is running for 1.5 hours in a 24 hour period?



Saying that I assume is more of a red flag than saying my maths is flawed.
I'm Not* assuming* 6%, it is what mistericeman said it was using .



mistericeman said:


> Kicking in about once an hour for a few minutes (usually around 3 to 4 minutes)



4 minutes every hour =4 /60 = 6.7 %.
4 minutes every hour =4 x 24 = 96 minutes per day



wildebus said:


> Why do you assume that number as a standard?  You are extrapolating a post with an assumption of information, you do not know what fridge he has in terms of efficiency, and combining it with a website with unstantiated data to get a faulty conclusion.



Again, I never assumed 6.7% to be a standard. I never referred to a fridge other than his.
I do agree that the data is unstantiated [sic].



wildebus said:


> that is a 17% duty cycle  (around 3 times your assumption).



Again 6.7% is not an assumption by me, it is based on incorrect data.
Your estimated 17% is just over 10 minutes every hour (around 3 times mistericeman’s statement)

Using 17%  then 4 amp @ 12v gives a far more realistic annual usage.
4 amp x12v x 24hrs x 17% = 200wh per day = 200 * 365 wh per year = 73kwh per year.
An efficient modern 230v fridge uses around 100 kwh per year.

Still friends?


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

Canalsman said:


> One observation.
> 
> You would do well to blank off the grille on either side of the fans. Without doing that you reduce the efficiency because the fans draw air from the sides as well as from below.






It’s going in horizontal between the back of fridge and van wall above top of the vent opening. I’ve got a chunky vent and gas pipes to avoid.
I’ll experiment with foam baffles to channel the flow of cool air and or stop warm air back flow into the fridge fan.


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## saxonborg (May 13, 2022)

Canalsman said:


> One observation.
> 
> You would do well to blank off the grille on either side of the fans. Without doing that you reduce the efficiency because the fans draw air from the sides as well as from below.


Just an observation, that air drawn in at the sides would be the same ambient temperature as the air being pulled into the bottom vent so do you think baffling each side of the fans would make a big difference?


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

Canalsman said:


> One observation.
> 
> You would do well to blank off the grille on either side of the fans. Without doing that you reduce the efficiency because the fans draw air from the sides as well as from below.


I am not sure if I understand what you mean - or if it would matter either TBH?


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

I think the potential issue is that the fans might just circulate cold air in and out of the grill without it being pushed up the back of the fridge to the top where the work is done. And the already hot air that is just circulating up by the fridge fan too. I’m pretty sure that’s what happened with my attempt to improve things with the 3way.


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

A contrary thought … if I put my big floor fan in my doorway it pushes air a long way into the house. Enclosing the gap around it might make it more efficient but probably not worth the effort… I guess it depends how strong the fan is.


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## Fazerloz (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> I am not sure if I understand what you mean - or if it would matter either TBH?


Personally I would think it could make matters worse by blanking. with your fans been temp controlled. Blanking would reduce the natural convection making your fans have to kick in far more often than they do normally. I am assuming they do not run every time the comp kicks in and only when needed.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> Personally I would think it could make matters worse by blanking. with your fans been temp controlled. Blanking would reduce the natural convection making your fans have to kick in far more often than they do normally. I am assuming they do not run every time the comp kicks in and only when needed.


They are temp/speed controlled.  kick in at a certain temp, speed increasing as (if) temp increases.   Plus a manual override with speed selections.  (this is why I would get the kit again - very nicely designed setup)

Fitted the controller behind the table storage cupboard for easy access if needed ...


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## trevskoda (May 13, 2022)

How come there is no cooling piping on the back of my we fridge, its all closed in and you can hardly hear it run, I did put vents above just to keep air around it and to stop any damp or smells


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## Fazerloz (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> They are temp/speed controlled.  kick in at a certain temp, speed increasing as (if) temp increases.   Plus a manual override with speed selections.  (this is why I would get the kit again - very nicely designed setup)
> 
> Fitted the controller behind the table storage cupboard for easy access if needed ...
> View attachment 108638


Do you have the fans in the top sucking hot out or in the bottom blowing cold in.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

MrRob said:


> I think the potential issue is that the fans might just circulate cold air in and out of the grill without it being pushed up the back of the fridge to the top where the work is done. And the already hot air that is just circulating up by the fridge fan too. I’m pretty sure that’s what happened with my attempt to improve things with the 3way.


A compressor fridge is quite a bit different to an Absorption.   The heat is generated by the compressor unit which is at the bottom of the unit.   there is no heat generation anywhere else.  With my last camper, the (compressor) fridge was not vented externally at all and I fitted a computer fan that pointed directly at the compressor.   When it kicked in, the temp drop was notable.

If you were trying to improve cooling/airflow to a larger degree (maybe in a very hot environment?) you could fit fans to both the top and bottom vents, with one set to push and the other to extract.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> Do you have the fans in the top sucking hot out or in the bottom blowing cold in.


bottom, blowing outside air in directly at the rear workings of the fridge.

It never gets really hot anyway.  The fans were a precaution that I use since fitting a CRX into my T5 conversion which had no airflow at the rear and while it never failed to work, it did hit 50C at the back, and felt that was a bit too warm.
First fan setup in van after T5 was temp on/off controlled computer fan.   motorhome setup is the posh Titan kit.


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## Fazerloz (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> A compressor fridge is quite a bit different to an Absorption.   The heat is generated by the compressor unit which is at the bottom of the unit.   there is no heat generation anywhere else.  With my last camper, the (compressor) fridge was not vented externally at all and I fitted a computer fan that pointed directly at the compressor.   When it kicked in, the temp drop was notable.
> 
> If you were trying to improve cooling/airflow to a larger degree (maybe in a very hot environment?) you could fit fans to both the top and bottom vents, with one set to push and the other to extract.


The comps are mounted at the top on the 65s and 80s with the condenser down the back so get quite hot at the top end.


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## Canalsman (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> bottom, blowing outside air in directly at the rear workings of the fridge.
> 
> It never gets really hot anyway.  The fans were a precaution that I use since fitting a CRX into my T5 conversion which had no airflow at the rear and while it never failed to work, it did hit 50C at the back, and felt that was a bit too warm.
> First fan setup in van after T5 was temp on/off controlled computer fan.   motorhome setup is the posh Titan kit.


I had assumed that the fans were at the top drawing air out. That's why I suggested blanking the areas to the side of the fans.

In that scenario, which is my installation, not blanking it will bleed air from the sides into the fans. That is the line of least resistance to the air flow. I remember picking up this tip from instructions for fitting a bathroom extractor fan. It advised explicitly not to site the fan near the door but as far away as possible to ensure that air was drawn through the room rather than drawing air through the doorway and straight out through the fan.

I think the description was 'short circuiting' the air flow.

I suspect that pushing air from the bottom it will be less of an issue though I'd still be inclined to do it.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

Canalsman said:


> I had assumed that the fans were at the top drawing air out. That's why I suggested blanking the areas to the side of the fans.
> 
> In that scenario, which is my installation, not blanking it will bleed air from the sides into the fans. That is the line of least resistance to the air flow. I remember picking up this tip from instructions for fitting a bathroom extractor fan. It advised explicitly not to site the fan near the door but as far away as possible to ensure that air was drawn through the room rather than drawing air through the doorway and straight out through the fan.
> 
> ...


Yup, I can see if you are pushing air out, you would want to do that.
I suppose sucking the air in it could go straight out on the sides but the distance between fans and 'target' it is unlikely.

Right now, the vents are actually blocked off currently top and bottom to stop the fridge getting too cold from the natural venting.   About time to remove those now.


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## wildebus (May 13, 2022)

Fazerloz said:


> The comps are mounted at the top on the 65s and 80s with the condenser down the back so get quite hot at the top end.


interesting.  and unusual


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> How come there is no cooling piping on the back of my we fridge, its all closed in and you can hardly hear it run, I did put vents above just to keep air around it and to stop any damp or smellsView attachment 108636View attachment 108637


Where does the extracted heat go?

CRE venting in manual is




Mine is sealed from the inside of the van and vents high and low in side of van. The fridge fan and elements could be enclosed with only vents for incoming cool and out going warm air. Might be more efficient as per the vent fan discussion


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## MrRob (May 13, 2022)

wildebus said:


> interesting.  and unusual


Good packaging? at the top It robs freezer not fridge space.


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## wildebus (May 14, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Good packaging? at the top It robs freezer not fridge space.


Maybe it depends where the freezer section is? On mine it is at the bottom. Same as in the house fridge/freezer.


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## Nabsim (May 14, 2022)

Mine is the older MDC110, it has the compressor at the top where the freezer compartment is but has cooling tubes(?) all over the back of the unit. There are big fridge vents behind it from where the van originally had a tall 3-way fitted and gets a lot of ventilation, so much so I have blanked off the top a couple of years ago. Top vent is probably three or four feet above top of fridge though and it does have vents into hab area above it.


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## wildebus (May 14, 2022)

Nabsim said:


> Mine is the older MDC110, it has the compressor at the top where the freezer compartment is but has cooling tubes(?) all over the back of the unit. There are big fridge vents behind it from where the van originally had a tall 3-way fitted and gets a lot of ventilation, so much so I have blanked off the top a couple of years ago. Top vent is probably three or four feet above top of fridge though and it does have vents into hab area above it.


I replaced pretty well like for like, however the new fridge was around 2" shorter and 2" narrower.   those gaps on the side in the winter allowed cold drafts from the exterior vents to come in to the van interior through the (neccessary for hinge action) gaps at the front, so I blocked the top half with insulation to eliminate.   The discussion has reminded me it is time to remove the insulation from the lower vent.

PS.   if temperature is an issue, it should be noted that the walls on the sunny side of a van can get very hot and that heat can pass over to the fridge workings.   A compressor fridge won't care much, but it can affect the absorption fridge.  I was thinking of putting silver foil on the inner side of the van wall to reflect the heat but never got round to it before fitting the fridge, but still think it could be a good idea.


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## MrRob (May 14, 2022)

The CRE80 Is usefully smaller that the 3way it replaced so we have somewhere to store some of our “curtains” and an extra kitchen / junk draw. I did think about extra insulation for the new fridge as some boat installations have seen it reduced consumption. But I like the extra space.



My top vent is mat black so heats up in direct sunlight… I have wondered if that interferes with the draw the vents achieve. Hence trying the vent fan.


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## MrRob (May 15, 2022)

The fans are in … I can’t find anywhere convenient to mount the control panel so it’s stuck to the back of the fridge 

It’s been warm and windy here today and fridge is on the shaded side and I haven’t seen/heard  them kick in so that’s good.





Bought a cheap Bluetooth thermometer to monitor temperature and it seems additional insulation would indeed be a good thing as temperature rises as fast as fridge cools. Even without the door opening where temp jumps up.


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## wildebus (May 15, 2022)

Where I fitted mine was handy for access, but in reality it is not something you need to access really, so fitting where you have will work well 

I found fridge internal temps vary much more than you would expect between the compressor turning on and off.  And this was true of both normal 240V domestic fridges and a 12V Weaco motorhome fridge.
I no longer use the fridges own thermostat to control when it goes on, but just set it to max and use an temp sensor that goes to the Cerbo and then goes to a relay that activates when the freezer goes above -11.5C and off again (cutting power) when it goes below -12.5C.  A very tight range, but even then the range varies more than that as the effect of the compressor running is delayed, but still is a significant improvement on leaving the fridge to its own devices. Also allows you to set the temp appropriate to the use e.g. I have it set so it operates as a 2* Freezer rather than a 4*, which is fine for my needs as well as using a little less power overall.
Relay State is Fridge power control - Fridge has power when closed, no power when open; 
Temperature is the Freezer (can monitor better on Freezer section than Fridge I found).


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## 1 Cup (May 16, 2022)

Just fill the fridge with beer and freezer with ice packs to hold the cold in, an empty fridge runs more.
Mine is ok but always full with beer and when I run low I restock quickly.


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## trevskoda (May 16, 2022)

1 Cup said:


> Just fill the fridge with beer and freezer with ice packs to hold the cold in, an empty fridge runs more.
> Mine is ok but always full with beer and when I run low I restock quickly.


Other way round, many fridge makers tell you not to overfill it as less effective.


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## 1 Cup (May 16, 2022)

Yer its like a washing machine ram it in it don't work well 
But cans and plastice ice packs have room for air , you can help fridge by puttin the stuff in fridge at home first befor you leave. I used  to put my freezer packs in freezer  with 3 in1 now have the domestic 70ltr freezes them from fluid. I've not turned fridge off since Christmas.  
I turned it up to half way about a month ago to go to hereford and 200w solar wont fully charge battery its at about 80%so ill have to use b2b to fully charge
The pics have dates and watts used with fridge only apart fom time away.


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## mistericeman (May 16, 2022)

As a Airconditioning/ refrigeration engineer.... 

2 identical fridges 
One loaded and one empty 
And open/closed the same 
Etc 

Will run the same amount of time. 
.. 

The fridge space is a static load (food in the fridge isn't exothermic (generating heat) 
So like for like loaded/unloaded and left alone
Once down to temp.... That's it game over... 

All acedemic as IF the beer/food/wine is in there... 

I'm in and out like a fiddlers elbow


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## MrRob (May 16, 2022)

Luckily I like warm beer most of the time so I don’t have to go in there every few minutes   Unless it’s it’s above 20 deg then to heck with battery consumption I’m opening the door and stacking it with warm beer to chill.

Question/Thread was just to check that I’m within normal range for my type of fridge. But thanks again for all the help.


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## mistericeman (May 16, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Luckily I like warm beer most of the time so I don’t have to go in there every few minutes   Unless it’s it’s above 20 deg then to heck with battery consumption I’m opening the door and stacking it with warm beer to chill.
> 
> Question/Thread was just to check that I’m within normal range for my type of fridge. But thanks again for all the help.


I'm sure life was simpler when 'cold milk' was kept in a bucket of water in the shade lol


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## MrRob (May 16, 2022)

mistericeman said:


> I'm sure life was simpler when 'cold milk' was kept in a bucket of water in the shade lol


We did try that. Van floor got wet. Also warm long life or powdered milk on cornflakes is not nice.


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## 1 Cup (May 21, 2022)

This is the last 30 days with first 10 days fridge set at 2 of 5 bars.


 fridge 70ltr consumption from solar controller set at 3 of 5 bars


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## 1 Cup (May 21, 2022)

So about 500 watt per day . Its the only thing connect to battery. The temperature was not high


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## MrRob (May 21, 2022)

1 Cup said:


> So about 500 watt per day . Its the only thing connect to battery. The temperature was not high


Brilliant info, thanks.

We seem to be at about 700 wh per day at 4 of the 5 settings as 3 lets it get to over 6 deg C before kicking in.

Although now we are using the main lead leisure battery system to run it as that is more convenient (with the RiverPro lithium as back up), so I can’t monitor use precisely.


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## trevskoda (May 21, 2022)

A fridge must be at 2c for food stuffs, and a freezer at -20c


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## MrRob (May 21, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> A fridge must be at 2c for food stuffs, and a freezer at -20c


Noted thanks.




Apart from the door opening spikes and the attempt to run it on setting 3 rather than 4 around midday on the 18 the fridge has been behaving well. It just goes too low sometimes


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## trevskoda (May 21, 2022)

Looks ok to me.


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## 1 Cup (May 22, 2022)

-20 is so we can get the food home from shops ,, the  feezers  can be set lower , say -5  or evan -1 as it need to just do ice cubes and ice cream or ice packs  and save power. I'm  Not going to have a leg of lamb in there.


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## 1 Cup (May 22, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Noted thanks.
> 
> View attachment 108807
> Apart from the door opening spikes and the attempt to run it on setting 3 rather than 4 around midday on the 18 the fridge has been behaving well. It just goes too low sometimes


 I think thats normal as it has to spike to turn off the compressor !  Its only a short time not constant. 
3pm and 5pm was you cooking or something ?  Is the temp in van changed ie heating on ?


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## 1 Cup (May 22, 2022)

MrRob said:


> Brilliant info, thanks.
> 
> We seem to be at about 700 wh per day at 4 of the 5 settings as 3 lets it get to over 6 deg C before kicking in.
> 
> Although now we are using the main lead leisure battery system to run it as that is more convenient (with the RiverPro lithium as back up), so I can’t monitor use precisely.



Bit worried as temp is on the higher setting and it's only may 60 degrees? Or are you in a hotter country. 
I'm hope in for 80s and 90s in England. And still got 2 more clicks that mite not be enough.
Question :  English fridges  insulation the same as  equator fridges ? Should we put more insulation around them. Even tho its a 2020 fridge


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## MrRob (May 22, 2022)

It’s a perfect max of 22 deg C (70f) in van 18 outside in S Wales at the mo.
 3pm is afternoon tea time and 5 ish would be food prep and or adding shopping. So perhaps compressor is running a double shift to cool and staying on slightly longer than necessary.

These fridges are only rated to operate at plus 25 deg C iirc, so will need and benefit from additional installation if you want they to run colder in hotter temps or more efficiently.


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## trevskoda (May 22, 2022)

1 Cup said:


> -20 is so we can get the food home from shops ,, the  feezers  can be set lower , say -5  or evan -1 as it need to just do ice cubes and ice cream or ice packs  and save power. I'm  Not going to have a leg of lamb in there.


Incorrect, data from food safe council.


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## Nabsim (May 22, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> Incorrect, data from food safe council.View attachment 108840View attachment 108841


Think this was the data Charlie used with that Hymer as he couldn’t keep ice cream. Even though the guys at Lowdhams said it wasn’t fit for purpose Dometic said it was fine, turned out the spec they used was for cool boxes. Scandalous what manufacturers can get away with


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## wildebus (May 22, 2022)

The temp required does depend on the usage. If food is needed to be kept for longer periods, the temp needs to be lower. 
Below -18C is long term frozen storage (upto 12 months for some food)
Around -12C is safe for around 2 -3 weeks I think it is.
Around -6C is ok for a week or so. 
The typical HOME freezer is a 4* freezer. The typical MH freezer is a 2* freezer as it is expected it gets used for no more than a week or so and the compartments are small so food does not tend to be stored for long but rather bought to eat in the next few days.
Another problem with MH (3-way) fridges is they are poor at maintaining cold temp and fluctuate, so food thaws and refreezes.  This is not good, but you don't tend to know about it except for ice cream!  Always a good idea to get a logging temp sensor for a freezer for food safety.

FWIW, My freezer is a 4* one, but I run it as a 3* (-12C to -14C) as it saves a bit of power and I don't keep food in there long term.

Interestingly, I made some frozen Oven chips on Friday and the packet actually gave storage duration info depending on temp of freezer.  Don't think I have seen that before on chips?!


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## trevskoda (May 22, 2022)

The above data I posted is for a normal home freezer being used day to day, no wonder half of you lot are in and out of hospitals.


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## wildebus (May 22, 2022)

trevskoda said:


> The above data I posted is for a normal home freezer being used day to day, no wonder half of you lot are in and out of hospitals.


One thing I bear in mind .... I don't have any meat in my freezer.  That eliminates the great majority of "unsafe storage" bugs,


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## MrRob (May 22, 2022)

Milk, fruit juice, Cheese, packet meat for me, carrots for the dogs, in fridge section and Gluten free bread and mixed frozen veg in freezer. No room to store stuff we won’t eat in a few days in an 80l fridge.
But with a choice of range for temps 0-4 deg C on “4” or ?-6+ deg C on “3” I really have no choice.
A logging Bluetooth (fridge) thermometer is the best £10 I’ve spent for peace of mind. Saves opening door to check temp or if it’s running which is good because the CRE only has internal indication lights.


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## barlicker (May 24, 2022)

wildebus said:


> Ok,  a few comments ....
> 
> A typical decent Compressor Fridge will use around 1.5Ah/Hr average.  When running it will be around 4A, but the compressor only runs part of the time, so it averages at around 1.5A.
> In hot weather, the power consumption goes up notably - on the official figures, it can nearly double.  For most people, that does not matter massively as if they are wild-camping, they typically have solar and the solar in hot (so sunny usually) brings in more power then when overcast and cooler.   As you DON'T have solar, the increased consumption could be an important factor (so maybe as I suggesed, a portable solar kit could be handy?)
> ...


I have victron inverter/charger, two Leoch lead carbon batteries giving 230amps, a small domestic 240v fridge and I am happy.


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