# Latest on N Yorks TRO (Scarborough and Whitby)



## maureenandtom (Oct 14, 2015)

As most will know, the TRO restricting overnight parking in Scarborough and Whitby was passed by the council and is now in force.

However,it wasn't passed entirely and some streets (originally in the temporary orders) were deleted from the TRO and have now become available once again to motorhomers.   The "No Overnighting" Signs have now been taken down.







The streets which are now made available for overnight parking are Royal Albert Drive (above), A174/Sandsend and Cayton Bay.

A sucessful campaign, I think, proving that it is possible to sway councils.

You can read more here:
https://**************.wordpress.com/2015/10/14/24-hour-parking-royal-albert-drive/


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## marydot (Oct 14, 2015)

Is it ok to overnight in the layby opposite Sainsbury's?

Marydot


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## yorkshire lad (Oct 15, 2015)

Thank god for that as started staying at Sandsend 25 years ago but never stopped just because someone in a suit and tie said I had to, and never been harassed by police except by 1 walking in cold and said I could do with a cuppa as well, so we made him 1, and just chatted for 20 min.


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## Paulby (Oct 15, 2015)

maureenandtom said:


> As most will know, the TRO restricting overnight parking in Scarborough and Whitby was passed by the council and is now in force.
> 
> However,it wasn't passed entirely and some streets (originally in the temporary orders) were deleted from the TRO and have now become available once again to motorhomers.   The "No Overnighting" Signs have now been taken down.
> 
> ...



Hi, the link does not appear to work.

Paul


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## maureenandtom (Oct 15, 2015)

marydot said:


> Is it ok to overnight in the layby opposite Sainsbury's?
> 
> Marydot



I haven't been able to find a Sainsbury's on the three streets where parking restrictions have been lifted so if your Sainsbury's is on one of these roads and is still signed as being restricted I'd like to hear of it - with a photograph if possible.

These are the signs which have been taken down at the three locations no longer covered by an order.






They are still in place at other locations.  But these three are now free of restrictions.


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## clf86ha (Oct 15, 2015)

does anyone know how much the parking fine is if we park where we shouldn't in Whitby/Scarborough?


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## alcam (Oct 15, 2015)

clf86ha said:


> does anyone know how much the parking fine is if we park where we shouldn't in Whitby/Scarborough?


Can't remember but I got one (7am Sunday) a couple of years ago and appealed, which was rejected. Emailed the council person concerned and it was dropped because of technical (legal) reasons


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## camping_gaz (Oct 15, 2015)

Nice one!  i like parking on that stretch of road at Scarborough, near the toilets, its jut a walk up the hill and over to the shops and its a dog accessible beach   :camper:


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## alcam (Oct 15, 2015)

camping_gaz said:


> Nice one!  i like parking on that stretch of road at Scarborough, near the toilets, its jut a walk up the hill and over to the shops and its a dog assessable beach   :camper:



Yes I've just assessed my dog , he's a lazy b####rd


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## camping_gaz (Oct 15, 2015)

alcam said:


> Yes I've just assessed my dog , he's a lazy b####rd



oh thanks for that, i spell checked it and just click on first word without actual reading it  :camper:


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## noarlunga (Oct 15, 2015)

Paulby said:


> Hi, the link does not appear to work.
> 
> Paul



The link didn't work because it had been altered with asterisks replacing the name of 'He Who Shall Not Be Named'.

This link should work. removed by admin,


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## Admin (Oct 15, 2015)

noarlunga said:


> The link didn't work because it had been altered with asterisks replacing the name of 'He Who Shall Not Be Named'.
> 
> This link should work. removed by admin,



I have removed the link.

After threats of legal action from this person I am unable to publish any information about him.


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## maureenandtom (Oct 15, 2015)

Paulby said:


> Hi, the link does not appear to work.
> 
> Paul



Yes, I'm sorry - I should have realised there would be difficulty with that link.  Been away a while.

Never mind;  it gives me an opportunity to give you the full report at:

North Yorkshire County Council

and then click on the link to "Motor Home Prohibition Order" which will give you the full submission and recommendations.

It's interesting.  The decision to remove those three roads was in response to submissions put to the council.  It also shows that there are a number of motorhomers who agree with the restrictions on motorhome parking - and that's interesting too.   It seems that we who wildcamp are the minority who give other motorhomers a bad name.

The bit I've been referring to is at paragraph 14.1(ii) but here's a picture of it:






You could print and keep a copy in the van if you anticipate problems.


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## noarlunga (Oct 16, 2015)

Admin said:


> I have removed the link.
> 
> After threats of legal action from this person I am unable to publish any information about him.



Sorry about that. I wasn't aware that the issue was that dire.


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## campervanannie (Oct 16, 2015)

I take it now that all members that stamped there little feet and vowed never to darken the door step of north Yorkshire again will have a sudden change of mind now and go back to parking up for days and days at a time to spark fresh cries of ban the motorhomes, oh well it will be nice while it lasts not long I fear.


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## caledonia (Oct 16, 2015)

All down to Mr cannot be named apparently and the "donations" he recieved. Lol


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## John H (Oct 16, 2015)

Having read the full Council document, it reveals some fascinating facts, not least of which is that in the second consultation, slightly more local residents were against the ban than in favour of it, adding to our argument that motorhomers (at least the responsible ones) can benefit the community. I suspect that this, more than the overwhelming response from motorhomers against the ban, that was most significant in the eyes of those making the decision. If I am right, it  demonstrates that by taking the reasoned approach rather than the threatening approach it is possible to convince authorities of the value of allowing motorhomers into their communities. Well done, North Yorkshire Council - I hope our community doesn't let you down.


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## groyne (Oct 16, 2015)

Just read through the report, I won't now consider joining the Caravan Club.



> 6.1.5 The Caravan Club wrote in to express its “support (for) the general principle behind preventing what (it) terms as 'wild camping', i.e. motorhomes using such areas as overnight camp sites”.


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## 2cv (Oct 16, 2015)

6.1.5 The Caravan Club wrote in to express its “support (for) the general principle behind preventing what (it) terms as 'wild camping', i.e. motorhomes using such areas as overnight camp sites”. 



groyne said:


> Just read through the report, I won't now consider joining the Caravan Club.



That is very interesting. As a member (I sometimes use their CLs) I shall be writing to them to complain about this. Shocking really.


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## groyne (Oct 16, 2015)

> I visit the locations to sea-fish/surf and would be denied access (2)
> 
> It is appreciated that those wishing to fish or surf, and therefore requiring access to the sea front locations at tide dependent times, with larger vehicles will be restricted. The locations which are most often used (Sandsend, Cayton and North Marine Road) are recommended to be removed from the restriction, as they restrict such access, following other comments received and as there are few residents in the locations, displacement in these locations may have the undesirable effect of displacing motor-caravans to locations where more highway users and residents are affected.



So you can thank me (and one other person) for getting the restrictions removed from these areas as this was my main argument.:lol-053::lol-053:



Also it appears that apart from the restricted areas you can park up where you like.



> Motor caravan parking shouldn’t be allowed at all (2)
> It is not considered appropriate or desirable to restrict motor caravans from all streets in Scarborough Borough. This would remove the rights of those with motor caravans to reasonable access to facilities in town centres. Motor caravans are welcome in North Yorkshire, however in the streets affected the duration and proliferation of motor caravan parking impacts upon the needs of the residents and other highway users and the order attempts to balance these sometimes conflicting needs.



Though I'm sure 99% of wild campers wouldn't park outside a strangers house for the night.


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## alcam (Oct 16, 2015)

camping_gaz said:


> oh thanks for that, i spell checked it and just click on first word without actual reading it  :camper:


Sorry I can't resist exorcising my schoolboy humour


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## Dougw (Oct 20, 2015)

alcam said:


> Sorry I can't resist exorcising my schoolboy humour



Whatever possessed you ?


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## alcam (Oct 20, 2015)

Dougw said:


> Whatever possessed you ?


You got it!


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## antiquesam (Oct 20, 2015)

2cv said:


> 6.1.5 The Caravan Club wrote in to express its “support (for) the general principle behind preventing what (it) terms as 'wild camping', i.e. motorhomes using such areas as overnight camp sites”.
> 
> 
> 
> That is very interesting. As a member (I sometimes use their CLs) I shall be writing to them to complain about this. Shocking really.



I would be surprised if the Caravan Club hadn't supported the banning of wildcampers as they have a vested interest in forcing people into their sites.


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## Paulby (Oct 20, 2015)

antiquesam said:


> I would be surprised if the Caravan Club hadn't supported the banning of wildcampers as they have a vested interest in forcing people into their sites.



But surely they also have a vested interest in what their members want?


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## marydot (Oct 20, 2015)

*Whitby parking*

We tried the large layby opposite Sainsbury's, but at each end of the layby there is a sign saying 'No parking Overnight'.  (There is a C&CC CS site about 100 yards along the road).
Every site we tried had huge signs saying 'No Sleeping in Vehicles' and other similar warnings.  Our friends did not want to risk the quoted £100 fine.  We spent the night on the car park of the Rifle Club, next to the West Cliff car park, and paid a small fee to the Club.  Of course we were then obliged to have a couple of snifters in the club, or so my OH informed me!

Whitby needs sorting out!!!!!!!!!

Marydot


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## groyne (Oct 20, 2015)

How much was the small fee, but more to the point was it good beer?


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## jacquigem (Oct 21, 2015)

We can vouch for the beer and also a very friendly welcome


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## antiquesam (Oct 21, 2015)

Paulby said:


> But surely they also have a vested interest in what their members want?



Most of their members have bought a motorhome in order to drive to a site and do exactly what they did in their caravan. If you stay on a CC site and talk to some of the members you soon see that most of them think wilding equates to being a tramp or worse.


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## alcam (Oct 21, 2015)

marydot said:


> Whitby needs sorting out!!!!!!!!!
> 
> Marydot



Whitby is fine use your common sense , there is plenty parking


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## wints (Oct 21, 2015)

antiquesam said:


> Most of their members have bought a motorhome in order to drive to a site and do exactly what they did in their caravan. If you stay on a CC site and talk to some of the members you soon see that most of them think wilding equates to being a tramp or worse.



Not forgetting how do you cope without ehu, showers, toilets etc...???  We have spoken to caravanners who have never used their loos, showers..and wish that manufacturers hadn't built these in !
Spoke to a motorhomer with a very expensive bespoke panel van conversion who asked for this stuff not to be built in as he was only using sites....he also specified no gas at all as he was always on hook up.

But, each to their own...live and let live.

Allen


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## Jimhunterj4 (Oct 21, 2015)

wints said:


> Not forgetting how do you cope without ehu, showers, toilets etc...???  We have spoken to caravanners who have never used their loos, showers..and wish that manufacturers hadn't built these in !
> Spoke to a motorhomer with a very expensive bespoke panel van conversion who asked for this stuff not to be built in as he was only using sites....he also specified no gas at all as he was always on hook up.
> 
> But, each to their own...live and let live.
> ...



Good luck to him selling it on lol


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## Jimhunterj4 (Oct 21, 2015)

antiquesam said:


> Most of their members have bought a motorhome in order to drive to a site and do exactly what they did in their caravan. If you stay on a CC site and talk to some of the members you soon see that most of them think wilding equates to being a tramp or worse.



Aw shite, just realised I must be a tramp.......lol:cool1::camper::rabbit:


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## yorkslass (Oct 21, 2015)

Jimhunterj4 said:


> Aw shite, just realised I must be a tramp.......lol:cool1::camper::rabbit:



me too.my dad says that my mum was descended from Irish tinkers.


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## alcam (Oct 21, 2015)

Jimhunterj4 said:


> Good luck to him selling it on lol


My first thought


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## Deleted member 775 (Oct 21, 2015)

live about 30 mins from scarborough even nearer to whitby now ,so we visit a lot .loads of vans on sealife center the other weekend .


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## Tbear (Oct 21, 2015)

Hi Mandrake,

Long time, no hear from you. How long have you been up there?

Richard


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## Deleted member 775 (Oct 22, 2015)

Tbear said:


> Hi Mandrake,
> 
> Long time, no hear from you. How long have you been up there?
> 
> Richard



about a month now .our daughter bought a house up here so busy doing it up at the mo lots to do ,so i bought a seat alahmbra and are in the process of selling the car now (bmw 525d e60) its handier for moving things about in ,and will make a nice enough over nighter for us next summer put some curtans in and take the back seats out chuck a blow up bed in bobs yer uncle .just the job for  a night on the sealife center car park  ha ha


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## Tbear (Oct 22, 2015)

In that I would have thought you could park anywhere Good to you are out and about again.

Richard


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## redhand (Oct 22, 2015)

yorkshire lad said:


> Thank god for that as started staying at Sandsend 25 years ago but never stopped just because someone in a suit and tie said I had to, and never been harassed by police except by 1 walking in cold and said I could do with a cuppa as well, so we made him 1, and just chatted for 20 min.



Does this refer to the parking  area on right as you approach Sandsend from Whitby


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## Jimhunterj4 (Oct 22, 2015)

mandrake said:


> about a month now .our daughter bought a house up here so busy doing it up at the mo lots to do ,so i bought a seat alahmbra and are in the process of selling the car now (bmw 525d e60) its handier for moving things about in ,and will make a nice enough over nighter for us next summer put some curtans in and take the back seats out chuck a blow up bed in bobs yer uncle .just the job for  a night on the sealife center car park  ha ha



I had a seat Alhambra for 8 years mate, if yours is anything like mine was you won't be disappointed, it never missed a beat.


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## mickymost (Nov 9, 2015)

maureenandtom said:


> As most will know, the TRO restricting overnight parking in Scarborough and Whitby was passed by the council and is now in force.
> 
> However,it wasn't passed entirely and some streets (originally in the temporary orders) were deleted from the TRO and have now become available once again to motorhomers.   The "No Overnighting" Signs have now been taken down.
> 
> ...





As this is still showing on the council website as no sleeping or overnight camping and cars and light vehicles only


Details

Short/long stay

Long Stay
Number of spaces	364
Disabled bays	2
Surface	Tarmac
CCTV	No
Secure car Park	No
Toilets	Yes
Opening hours	24 Hours
Weight restriction 	Cars and Light Vehicles only
Height restriction 	No
Suitable for Motorhomes/ Caravans 	No - Prohibition of waiting of motor caravans between 11pm and 7am
Overnight sleeping	No sleeping or overnight camping
Payment Option	
RingGo


So can I park my camper/motorhome here next week 13/11 till 20/11 (between these dates not every night)  or am I liable to get charged with a PCN fine?


regards Mike


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## maureenandtom (Nov 9, 2015)

mickymost said:


> As this is still showing on the council website as no sleeping or overnight camping and cars and light vehicles only
> 
> 
> Details
> ...



These are the recommendations which were passed in the order:






You can trace the complete TRO from posts earlier in the thread.   

But, para (ii) seems clear enough.   _"The A174 Sandsend to Raithwaite, locations at Cayton Bay and Royal Albert Drive, Scarborough will become free of restrictions for overnight motor-caravan parking following the expiry of the recent temporary order."_

If this is where you intend to overnight then the council has said it is free of restrictions.   Print and keep a copy.


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## maingate (Nov 9, 2015)

He who must not be named is up to his tricks again.

http://forums.motorhomefacts.com/20...by-scarborough-m-home-parking-ban-tested.html


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## campervanannie (Nov 9, 2015)

Skoogal said:


> What would it matter if you stay one day or ten if another van takes the space you vacate?
> As long as everything is legal just enjoy and move about until you find somewhere that you like.



My post is not so much about parking up for days it was and is aimed at all those that vowed never to set foot on the east coast of Yorkshire U turn me thinks.


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## Deleted member 48306 (Nov 9, 2015)

we went up 3 week ago and ticket machine said no overnight sleeping but free parking end of oct so you don't have to look at ticket machine :banana::banana:


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## Captain Biggles (Nov 10, 2015)

*Powys Welcomes Motorhome Wild Campers!*

Yes it's true, Scarborough, Whitby and some other misguided places may not 'like the cut of our jib', but Powys welcomes Wild Campers to all their Council run Car Parks FREE to stay overnight from 6pm - 8am, just take a look at their Web Site....

Why not spend your pounds where they're appreciated?...

      Captain Biggles      lane:


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## Twaite (Nov 12, 2015)

maureenandtom said:


> As most will know, the TRO restricting overnight parking in Scarborough and Whitby was passed by the council and is now in force.
> 
> However,it wasn't passed entirely and some streets (originally in the temporary orders) were deleted from the TRO and have now become available once again to motorhomers.   The "No Overnighting" Signs have now been taken down.
> 
> ...


Thanks love Scarborough  
Do you have too pay for overnight parking? 
Cheers


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## maureenandtom (Nov 12, 2015)

Twaite said:


> Thanks love Scarborough
> Do you have too pay for overnight parking?
> Cheers



If there are machines, you must check them.



nosfunk said:


> we went up 3 week ago and ticket machine said no overnight sleeping but free parking end of oct so you don't have to look at ticket machine :banana::banana:


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## maureenandtom (Nov 12, 2015)

Twaite said:


> Can you wild camp at Scarborough?
> Has anyone done this recently?
> You used to be able to overnight on the car park where the fish boat s were?
> Has anybody got a definite place they have stayed very recently please
> ...



It's official.  Overnight parking restrictions have been lifted at the locations stated.

That doesn't mean there's no charge;  there may be.   Nor does it mean that officialdom approves of you sleeping in your vehicle - it probably doesn't.   But officialdom knows it can't prove sleeping.   Because it can't prove sleeping the council made it a rule,  three years ago, not to park between 11pm and 7 am at those locations.   After objections this has now been lifted and parking is unrestricted at those locations but is still restricted at others.

But there may still be a charge;  it seems from posts above that the charging ceased (for the winter probably) at the end of October.

At those locations you can now park overnight.  I know of no rule preventing you sleeping there.  If there's a fee you should pay it.


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## Tbear (Nov 13, 2015)

This seems the ideal situation. The council charges, at least during the summer months so they gain. We cannot park in a few areas that would upset the locals so they should be happy and we get hard standing in a reasonable location which is cheap to free. Lets just hope that they police the idiots before they can ruin it all, dumping rubbish and sewage.

It would be a good thing if the big clubs and the motorhoming press published details of people being caught and severely punished for blatant public order offence such as dumping sewage on the street and in carparks or as I witnessed one day . On the beach where *their* children played!!!

Richard


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## maureenandtom (Nov 24, 2015)

Taken from elsewhere - North Yorks County Council has *apologised to motorhomers* for not removing the signs without backing or a traffic order quickly enough.


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## Deleted member 9849 (Nov 24, 2015)

We used to overnight on Royal Albert Drive,Scarborough.It's a lovely spot and would be good if we can park there again.I think the local council were daft to restrict the parking there especially out of season.I would have thought that local businesses would have welcomed the extra trade from motorhomers during the quiet winter months.Last time I went there(on the bus)they had put large rocks on the grass verge near the toilets to prevent motorhomes reversing their overhang over.This made it easier to get into the marked bays and was less likely to cause an obstruction on the road.A quite petty move from NYCC.This location has no residential areas,overlooks the sea,has easy access to both the north and south bays and is an excellent wild camping spot. 
It's important that campers don't drop litter or empty chemical toilets and generally treat the area with respect so as not to give the anti motorhome brigade any ammunition.


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## maureenandtom (Nov 25, 2015)

sidthekid said:


> *We used to overnight on Royal Albert Drive,Scarborough.It's a lovely spot and would be good if we can park there again*.I think the local council were daft to restrict the parking there especially out of season.I would have thought that local businesses would have welcomed the extra trade from motorhomers during the quiet winter months.Last time I went there(on the bus)they had put large rocks on the grass verge near the toilets to prevent motorhomes reversing their overhang over.This made it easier to get into the marked bays and was less likely to cause an obstruction on the road.A quite petty move from NYCC.This location has no residential areas,overlooks the sea,has easy access to both the north and south bays and is an excellent wild camping spot.
> It's important that campers don't drop litter or empty chemical toilets and generally treat the area with respect so as not to give the anti motorhome brigade any ammunition.



You can now do so again - paragraph (ii) below.


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## maureenandtom (Jan 11, 2016)

maureenandtom said:


> Taken from elsewhere - North Yorks County Council has *apologised to motorhomers* for not removing the signs without backing or a traffic order quickly enough.



I'm told that MMM have now published this in their printed magazine.

It had already been published in their on-line version which you can see here North Yorks Council apologies over motorhome signs - Motorhome News - New & Used Motorhome & Campervan Reviews - Out and About Live

The effect of this was that as many as 300 overnight parking places became available which had previously been denied us.


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