# Solar panel Vs generator



## toymaker (Aug 27, 2008)

Hi
I am ditherering whether to buy a roof mounted solar panel, about 85 watts, or a small generator.  We will probably never spend more than 3 or 4 nights away from a hook up and have two 90 amp/hr batteries fitted.  Any thoughts based on experience greatfully recieved. 

Cheers all, hope the rain stops soon.


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## Davesport (Aug 27, 2008)

Hi Toymaker.

Seeing as you've posted this on a wildcamping forum I guess there's only one answer. 

From experience I'd recommend the solar option. I have a Kipor I bought & carried about in the van before I installed the solar panels. Irrespective how quiet these things are meant to be I always find them intrusive. I used mine twice & then started looking at the solar options. 

A lot depends on how heavy a user of power you are. Do you use any 240V ? If you're going to use lots of amps then you might need a genny. Personally I've optimised things so I don't use any 240V & can run comfortably from 2 X 85 Ah/hr batteries & 2 X 90W solar panels.

Pro's with solar power. Silent in operation. Works all the time that there's light & it's maintenance free.

The Genny gives you lots of 240V power but for me I find the noise disturbs the tranquility.

A quality solar panel of about 90 W will give you about 5A under "ideal" conditions, usually much less. There's an easy way to increase this though. Install more panels  

Have a look at this http://www.motorhomefacts.com/ftopict-42369-hymer.html+solar for a look at the instalation I did on my own van. It took a couple of afternoons to complete but has given us freedom from hook-ups & noisy generators.

Dave.


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## Deleted member 2636 (Aug 27, 2008)

Please go down the solar panel route - I have just spent a weekend on a site and have had to put up with several generators.

It was so bad that we had to ask one person to either turn the thing off or leave the site. The genny was a Wolf and was not that loud but the F---ing fumes were a different matter


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## David & Ann (Aug 27, 2008)

I agree with baloothebear. The noise you can just about live with, the fumes are killing. I used to run a genny, now I am on 120 x 2 panels. It is a god send. Just be careful not to load too much 230v at any one time. I have 100AH x 3 batts: that keeps me safe from running out of juice. I always check my batt: indicator daily.


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## terry1956 (Aug 27, 2008)

*Hi,*

Hi, It all depends on what power you want, and the time spend off mains,
after spending 100,s on solar panels, I found that this just did not do the job, we have two pug dogs so do not go away in high season to much just around feb to may. 
I obtained an honda EU20i, which does not give out any fumes at all, gives out lots of power etc etc, I have fitted the gen in an outer case and fitted a better exhaust system so it cuts down the noise, I never run the thing at night, just a few hours mid day to keep the batterys up and the air con on for the dogs if its to hot for them.
This year was down in italy on a camper stop over, and the temp inside the van was over 34c, the power hock up was under 3amps, and I needed that gen on most of the day and evening to power the air con, a power pull of 4amps, Boy was it nice to be able to get into the van at a nice cool 20c.
solar panels just would not give the power needed, and that would mean a return trip.
terry


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## Deleted member 207 (Aug 27, 2008)

You need to do the sums;

Add up the watts that each appliance draws and the volts that they operate at.
Convert the watts to amps using the formula (watts/volts) = amps.
Estimate the number of hours each appliance will operate.
Multiply the amps for each appliance by the hours of operation to give you a total number of amp hours (amps * hours) = amp hours

If any appliances have to be operated through an inverter you have to factor in the inverter efficiency - say 80% efficient then any 240V appliances need to have another 20% amp hours added. The inverter spec plate will say exactly what the efficiency is.

Then look at using no more than 70% of battery storage, eg 2 x 100amp hour batteries should give you 140 amp hours of useful battery life. Try not to draw down below that amount as it can reduce the life of the batteries, although true deep cycle batteries thrive on being drawn down.

Then you need to size your solar panels to ensure that they can keep the batteries topped up.

Same formulas, but in reverse.

eg your appliances draw 90amp hours
You have 12 volt solar panels.
The sun shines 6 hours
(90amps * 12 volts)/ hours = 180 watts of solar panels

Bear in mind that solar panels mounted on the roof are not working at their best efficiency until the sun is more or less overhead.


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## David & Ann (Aug 27, 2008)

terry1956 said:


> Hi, It all depends on what power you want, and the time spend off mains,
> after spending 100,s on solar panels, I found that this just did not do the job, we have two pug dogs so do not go away in high season to much just around feb to may.
> I obtained an honda EU20i, which does not give out any fumes at all, gives out lots of power etc etc, I have fitted the gen in an outer case and fitted a better exhaust system so it cuts down the noise, I never run the thing at night, just a few hours mid day to keep the batterys up and the air con on for the dogs if its to hot for them.
> This year was down in italy on a camper stop over, and the temp inside the van was over 34c, the power hock up was under 3amps, and I needed that gen on most of the day and evening to power the air con, a power pull of 4amps, Boy was it nice to be able to get into the van at a nice cool 20c.
> ...



You have a valid point with the airconditioning Terry. It really boils down to what you want and what you can afford. I must say all the advice given is robust, which is why this site has a good following.


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## terry1956 (Aug 27, 2008)

*In answer*

After playing around trying to get the best system to protect the pugs, who just can,t take the heat, and the way the weather is these days, we just had to have power on tap for the air con, and before some wise person comes up with keep the windows open, etc. try it on a boiling hot day.
I notice that some sites in france have power points reated at under .4amps, just enough to keep the lights on ??
I think its about time that elec power rates became part of the info given out along with the prices.
terry


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## Deleted member 207 (Aug 27, 2008)

.4 amps why would they even bother?

There are 12V/24V air con units available for the trucking industry, they rely upon the cab being cooled by the vehicle AC then keeping it cool with the auxilliary unit. Eberspacher make one called "Sleeping Well" and there is a Dutch company whose name escapes me who make another similar unit. You still need BIG batteries to run them as they draw down at about 18 amps an hour on 12V.


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## Deleted member 2636 (Aug 28, 2008)

terry1956 said:


> Hi, I obtained an honda EU20i, which does not give out any fumes at all, ----- Boy was it nice to be able to get into the van at a nice cool 20c.
> solar panels just would not give the power needed, and that would mean a return trip.
> terry



All engines give off fumes... Sorry. Even engines being run using Propane as a fuel. It's a by-product of combustion.

We did have several people running gennies at on time or another. The noise was intrusive, surprisingly; but the fumes were another matter


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## tresrikay (Aug 28, 2008)

SOLAR, SOLAR, SOLAR.....
There is no alternative.
When we were at Cnip, on Lewis recently, on the grazing trust site that used to be wildcamping, there was a wide boy with a Fendt caravan, the ones the pikies in France use and he was running his (12/6p burn the ozone layer,  gas all the nieghbours, keep all the kids awake) genny untill 11.15 p.m.but get this he had the genny 20 mtrs from his own van and right under his nieghbours window. What a W****r but no one said anything as he was a real look at me and your dead type.
 The only good place for a genny is back in the genny shop.


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## BedfordMJ (Aug 28, 2008)

I wanted an air-conditioning unit on my truck so I had a generator fitted a Dometic one. The noise is not so bad we did find last weekend one day was very still and we left the Dog in for half an hour went back to check him and the Carbon monoxide monitor was going off, my advice if you have one fit a alarm and don't leave unattended. I could have killed my Dog.
If you don't have appliances that use loads of power solar could be the best thing to fit and no doubt much cheaper!


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## terry1956 (Aug 28, 2008)

*In answer*

Hi, did look at the 12v air con systems, But its not true air con, just blown air using water to cool the hot air, They do bring the temp down a bit, but the max is 10c under the outside temp, less if the air is damp. This is just not good enough for the dogs. 
As to the way gens are used and the types being used, well thats down to the owners. I did see a funny thing a few years ago, i was parked up on an italian service station taking a break from driving and along side pulled up an italian motorhome, the doors flashed open in time and out jumped three jolly campers all surrounded by a mass of exhaust fumes, it turned out that one bright sole had the idea of using a gen inside the motorhome to power up their roof air con when on the move, not so bright an idea, but boy is was funny to see them all jump out and the fumes just had to be seen.
terry


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## tresrikay (Aug 28, 2008)

terry1956 said:


> Hi, did look at the 12v air con systems, But its not true air con, just blown air using water to cool the hot air, They do bring the temp down a bit, but the max is 10c under the outside temp, less if the air is damp. This is just not good enough for the dogs.
> As to the way gens are used and the types being used, well thats down to the owners. I did see a funny thing a few years ago, i was parked up on an italian service station taking a break from driving and along side pulled up an italian motorhome, the doors flashed open in time and out jumped three jolly campers all surrounded by a mass of exhaust fumes, it turned out that one bright sole had the idea of using a gen inside the motorhome to power up their roof air con when on the move, not so bright an idea, but boy is was funny to see them all jump out and the fumes just had to be seen.
> terry



Like I said best place for a genny is back in the shop and no matter who uses them they are still noisy, dirty, smelly, heavy and cost loads to run whereas a panel, once fitted is silent, clean, odourless, light and is free to run....... I rest my case.


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## shortcircuit (Aug 28, 2008)

tresrikay said:


> Like I said best place for a genny is back in the shop and no matter who uses them they are still noisy, dirty, smelly, heavy and cost loads to run whereas a panel, once fitted is silent, clean, odourless, light and is free to run....... I rest my case.



I had a problem between my leisure battery and the control unit which resulted in me being unable to power the heating.  Solar power is not very efficient in the dark and and I fortunately have all small generator which allowed me to use the heater, hot water etc.

Its a case of horses for courses...........I rest my case


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## terry1956 (Aug 28, 2008)

*In answer*

Hi, I am with G ON THIS, All this talk of going green and carbon foot prints is all bull and for the weak minded sheep,If the powers that run the world really knew that it was CO2 that was at the root of all problems, they would stop the burning of the rain forest for a start, stop all air travel for a 2nd and close down the coal burning countries of the far east. But what do they do, tax the motorist, think about it??   I was also told that travel is good for the mind, But there are always people who are so narrow minded one would think they had not been any place bar the their local campsite.
To get the same output per 1/2 hour of running a good gen you would need a bank of solar panels bigger then the roof space of a motorhome and 24 hours full sun, the cost alone of the solar panels far outweighs the price of a good gen, and  one never gets 24 hour sunlight
terry


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## Davesport (Aug 29, 2008)

Looks to me like Toymakers thread has been hijacked by the "I've got a genny & will use it regardless (of the inconvenience & annoyance caused to others) faction. You can put any amount of spin on this that you like. Used inconsiderately generators are ANNOYING.

I personally would be mortified if my leisure activities caused inconvenience or annoyance to someone else. 

The attitude of the last three posts is pretty much at odds with my own views. If we ever meet in one of the quiet & tranquil places that I stop at, please don't start your genny. 

I'm sticking with my recommendation for solar power. 

Anyway, I though only gypsies used generators 

Dave.


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## shortcircuit (Aug 29, 2008)

Davesport said:


> Looks to me like Toymakers thread has been hijacked by the "I've got a genny & will use it regardless (of the inconvenience & annoyance caused to others) faction. You can put any amount of spin on this that you like. Used inconsiderately generators are ANNOYING.
> 
> I personally would be mortified if my leisure activities caused inconvenience or annoyance to someone else.
> 
> ...



I take great exception to your post as it is not based on any fact.  Can you please say where in my post I indicated that I behaved as you suggest. 

Im affraid your brain is like solar power,it don,t work in the dark. I would suggest you put more thought into your posting rather than trying to offend with a blinkered view.


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## Deleted member 2636 (Aug 29, 2008)

I'm not sure that this post has been "hijacked" -yet 
The use of gennys is pretty emotive at the best of times.
There are good units out there; the Honda, Kipor(spelling?) and some others should be mentioned. They are not obtrusive and can be made even better by converting them to Propane for the fuel source.
If you have a cheapy genny like my £35 effort from MAKRO then don't expect it to be quiet. You can help it along by adding an additional silencer from a moped and even an acoustic hood dropped over helps.
Solar panels have their place, as do gennys but I'm not too sure about wind gennys. The noise of the blades is really irritating and the 100ft mast along side one's M'home tends to give the game away if you're Wilding it


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## Trevor (Aug 29, 2008)

I don't see any problems with anyone using a genny for an emergency as long as it don't disturb anyone else around you.
I don't use one myself not anymore and i would prefer solar power, but the cost is out of my range for sure.
Not all solar panels require direct sunlight some will work in poor weather conditions but not as well as on a sunny days (sunny days what are they I don't remember).
IMHO with solar there is no pollution and no noise whatever simple as, not so with a genny silent or not.
Oh and by the way I am not a 100% greeny or a tree hugger i just think we should all respect the planet that we live on and the people that live on it with us, like the future generations your kids and their kids, yours and my offspring.
So don't give me the green this and that as I get sick of hearing it, and after all this tread is not about green or not green is it.


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## Davesport (Aug 29, 2008)

The genny V's solar power debate is going to go on & on. What i would say is nobody with a genny has ever asked me if it was OK for them to spark up their genny......ever. It's taken as a god given right by most.  The concept of carrying a generator at all times to be used only in the event of an emergency is a entirely new to me  The MH'ers I know who go to the extent of carrying a generator do so because it's the only source of power they have. When they stop the genny comes out......they have no alternative & in my experience that's the way things work. Irrespective of who's in the locality they need 240 power & they're not going to go asking if it OK. Have a reality check  And while we're on the subject, if the answer to the question was an emphatic NO what would you do then ?

I can also state that small 1 or 2 KW Honda or Kipor generators are not silent, especially whilst on load. I know because I've got a 2 KW inverter Kipor & a friend of mine has the equivalent Honda & also the 1Kw Honda. Using a cheap genny on anything equiped with a circuit board is sheer folly. The wave form & frequency are only loosely controlled & at some point something on one of your boards will expire. 

May I also suggest that you lighten up a little & not be so quick to rise to the bait, no names mentioned  Shortcircuit. With a user name like that you might be better of with solar power 

Right I've got to go for now as the ice in my G & T's begining to melt. Please don't take any of this personally as it's not meant that way. 

Regards, Dave.


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## Trevor (Aug 29, 2008)

> Davesport;40544
> The MH'ers I know who go to the extent of carrying a generator do so because it's the only source of power they have.


I suppose it depends on the way electrics are in your van, I have 240v and 
12v but i only use the 12v.

Right I've got to go for now as the ice in my G & T's begining to melt. Please don't take any of this personally as it's not meant that way. 
Enjoy your G & T.


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## shortcircuit (Aug 29, 2008)

Davesport said:


> May I also suggest that you lighten up a little & not be so quick to rise to the bait, no names mentioned  Shortcircuit. With a user name like that you might be better of with solar power
> 
> Regards, Dave.



What a sad little man you are.  I have only stated facts and you come out like a child insulting others without obtaining facts.

I attend Kart meetings when we need 240volts to clean rubber off tyres using hot air guns.  I also attended meetings early and leave later, possibly 4/5 days.  I have 220 A/h of battery however using blow air heating discharges these in that timescale and the generator is used to provide a boost to the batteries.  The instance I relate to was at a Kart meeting and I was attempting to highlight that solar power could not have overcome the problem that existed. 

Generators are accepted at Kart meetings and can run on for a considerable time.  If you found it unacceptible then you would need to move on.  So far I have not found the need to run my generator on public sites as there is either a hookup or I am only there for  a short time.  

As far as solar power is concerned, I am unable to justify the costs, as they do not stack up

I have no need to justify my actions to you and as has been suggested if you cannot put a constructive posting then do not bother.  Perhaps your need to indulge in G&Ts so early in the day sends another message


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## cipro (Aug 29, 2008)

***** said:


> Also.
> At the Cromford meet, a few vans (most)(I cant remember if yours was one of them had battery problems and ran their engines to charge up
> No need for me to do the same as if I did have a problem, I could just run the geny for a few minutes on the next day
> A good reason to have a geny as back up
> And the Honda suitcase inverter geny is a damn sight quieter and less smelly than a diesel engine in the M/H and better for the environment


 
ME ME it was me I had to start my van.
It was dark at 4.00 and put on blow heating on gas gives heat but the fan is run by battery .85 amp battery not very good so no choice but to 
start van not that ***** has a problem with this or he would of said
sorry but not decided what to choose if any of them at all for now
Wild camped for 3 days in France and did not staret the van once
Reason no HEATING no LIGHTS no TV, so if you don't use nowt
you are all right


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## cipro (Aug 29, 2008)

***** said:


> Hi Tim, no problem at all as we live and let live and your engine did not bother us at all
> By the way, I think you were not alone so don't beat yourself up.
> We went for 5 nights without starting the engine, however I must admit that I did run the geny once for less than half of one hour but did not really need to (just did it for something to do as I was a little bored and it needed a run as not run for a couple of months


 
Passably that is why the battery did not last long, first time out in 3 months drove in rain and semi dark so needed lights on and only 60 mls

Didn't see or hear your genny and if i did I would have unplugged your plug and put mine in HeeHee


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## Davesport (Aug 30, 2008)

As I said in my earlier post. Toymakers thread has been hijacked. Looking at this thread in its entirity most of the replies contain little or no relevant information. I generally find this board to be helpfull but this thread has reflected well the attitudes of those who choose to use their generators regardless of those around them. 

If anything the vitriol in some of the replies has merely served to reinforce my own beliefs There are a minority of selfish people who will do exactly as they wish. 

At this point I've read nothing on here that resembles a reasoned argument for the use of a generator whilst in the proximity of other people, campers or otherwise. MH'ers who rely on generators for power are in no position to object to others doing exactly the same, regardless of the level of inconvenience caused. So what do you do....stick together, just as has happened on this thread. 

Every location I've ever camped at where an owners had a generator it's brought out, started up & run until they've fulfilled their own needs. The funny thing is, I've never seen one owner offering another the use of the his hook-up. IE I'm thinking of starting my genny, do you fancy plugging in ? Nope, we'll all start & run our genny's together. 

OK, rant over for now, bring on the flames

Dave. (Strictly Solar)


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## shortcircuit (Aug 30, 2008)

Dave    As well a your other attributes your appear unable, or unwilling to understand the written word.

In Toymakers initial posting he asked " Any thoughts based on experience greatfully recieved"

I responded with  "I had a problem between my leisure battery and the control unit which resulted in me being unable to power the heating. Solar power is not very efficient in the dark and and I fortunately have all small generator which allowed me to use the heater, hot water etc."

Is this not a positive input?  I gave no indication of where and when.

Your response to this was 

"Looks to me like Toymakers thread has been *hijacked by the "I've got a genny & will use it regardless (of the inconvenience & annoyance caused to others) faction. *You can put any amount of spin on this that you like. Used inconsiderately generators are ANNOYING.

I personally would be mortified if my leisure activities caused inconvenience or annoyance to someone else. 

The *attitude of the last three posts *is pretty much at odds with my own views. If we ever meet in one of the quiet & tranquil places that I stop at, please don't start your genny. 

I'm sticking with my recommendation for solar power. 

Anyway, I though only *gypsies* used generators "

Oh how did you come to that assumption?

In the next posting, which was a bit of a ramble, you then say "May I also suggest that you lighten up a little & not be so quick to rise to the bait, no names mentioned  Shortcircuit. With a user name like that you might be better of with solar power"  Whats this all about?

In my folowing posting I give you details of the exact situation where generators are used which is totally factual and is not judgemental.

In the early hours of this morning, when solar power dont work, you come back with

"As I said in my earlier post. Toymakers thread has been hijacked. Looking at this thread in its entirity most of the replies contain little or no relevant information. I generally find this board to be helpfull but this thread has reflected well the attitudes of those who choose to use their generators regardless of those around them. 

If anything the vitriol in some of the replies has merely served to reinforce my own beliefs There are a minority of selfish people who will do exactly as they wish"

You really need to open your mind away from "the solar power will cover all situations" and try and not be insulting to posters who make a positive contribution


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## Pioneer (Aug 31, 2008)

Hi toymaker,
solar panel for me! I use a roof mounted 55watt panel, connected to 2 x 85 amp/hr aux batteries and never had any problems, even in the winter months. Fit the largest panel you can afford and have space for on the roof.

Happy Camping.


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 1, 2008)

I don't think that this general post is aimed at people who go motor-racing or whatever: They do need 12vDC, 24vDC, 115vAC and 230vAC and Heaven knows what else besides  Why, even the 1/5th scale Racers use them 

What a lot of people find stressful is a genny being run on a "normal" campsite. A lot of Sites have now had to issue a notice that gennys should not be run before 10.00am and after 8.00pm.

They do tend to advertise your presence when you're "wilding" it as well but not to the same extent that my 100ft wind genny mast does


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## tresrikay (Sep 1, 2008)

*Looking from both sides.*

Well, well, well,  Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. I nip off to the feast of lanterns and return to find WW3 has broken out and on 2 fronts, the other I havn't a clue about (and no desire to find out) but this one is important.
I owned and used Genny's for 14 years as a narrow boat owner and it was a very important tool in my business as a mobile boatfitter. I have no objections to there use in many differing and divergent environs.
However as a part of the kit in a modern motorhome , I believe things have moved on, and I for one have moved on and gladly so.
A Solar panel on its own will not solve all your power needs especially if you want to replicate how you live at home, If your Ironing, hair drying, watching videos or running a washing machine then forget them.
A moderate solar panal has one use only, to re-charge the battery. However if you take sympathetic steps as I have done, by changing all bulbs to L.E.D. fitting a gaslow refillable gas system, so you can run your fridge on its most efficient source gas, then you are helping those batteries to eke out their energy.

What does occasionally really P**s me off about this site is when the accusations and general treehugger nonsense starts to demean an otherwise friendly but differing argument. I will not give word room to some of the ill informed and meaningless drivel that somehow dismisses the fate of our planet were it to be left to the inconsidered oppinions of the (lets squander the planet now and sod the generations to come lobby) as they are being proved wrong by global climate events as I write.
I use a Solar panal and stand by my original arguments.
I have never had to ask for the use of a genny as I also carry a rechargeable battery emergency starter and 12v source on the van (just in case).
I think it is a little blinkered to dismiss solar or any renewable or energy for free source.
I feel its just me doing me little inconcievable little bit, to taking an infinitely bit less.
In the great scheme of things it probably is laughable to some but I will carry on and I will embrace any new technology that will allow my Grandson Louis to have a little more than a cinder of a planet to pass on to his Grand Children.

It is at times like this that I have an empathy with Graham Hadfield, and I sometimes feel like going off to pastures new.


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## tresrikay (Sep 2, 2008)

Well Graham, I for one hear what you are saying.
Its just that when I was using the Genny , starting 20 years ago, it was the right tool for my cicumstances then.
However I do not now need that sort of overkill, and surely the fact that you have only used yours for 10 hours in 2 years, and alot of that by other people, surely that is a testament to the fact that a genny is now pretty superflous to todays motorhoming.
If you were to factor in a solar panel, low draw lighting and refillable gas. You would probably have never used your genny, therefore you would be carrying around all that extra weight , volatile fuel, for nothing.
I have a power battery pak that gives me emergency 12v power and has started my last van when it was needed and has been used to aid other stranded campers on 4 occasions. 
This is another clean and renewable power source, which is the way I think we should be heading and when someone with a modern M/H asks the question that toymaker did then I offer my answer having been reliant on both sources of power I feel I come to this particular table with sound and unbiased advice.
However if toymaker was off to five day carting meets where noise and burning petrol fumes were the breakfast, dinner and tea I would say get a Genny!

p.s. It was interesting  at the N.F.O.L. that I saw at least 4 traders selling solar panels but none selling genny's.


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 3, 2008)

... wish I could afford one of these...
or...this...

...OAP...State pension...15 children...9 ex wives...dog...


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## cipro (Sep 3, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> ... wish I could afford one of these...
> or...this...
> 
> ...OAP...State pension...15 children...9 ex wives...dog...


 
http://www.leisurepowerdirect.co.uk...id=35&osCsid=989385cea11081d887e569b31614cd4a

These are'nt much cheaper


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## cipro (Sep 3, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> ... wish I could afford one of these...
> or...this...
> 
> ...OAP...State pension...15 children...9 ex wives...dog...


 


How do you change the web site name too your own wording like
wish I could afford one of these


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## tresrikay (Sep 3, 2008)

***** said:


> Rick, You still have not read properly.
> I have it for back up and IT WAS USED for back up when my fridge needed  a boost as previously stated.
> My fridge would not start on gas unless it had been on 240 volt for about 5 mins.
> I know that it was a fault and it was mended when I returned to the UK, but without the Geny, I would not have been able to use the fridge for quite a few days.
> ...



Solar panel + battery + inverter = 230v = same problem solved!


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## cipro (Sep 3, 2008)

***** verses Tresikay and the debate goes on all great friendly opinions Ithink this debate will go on longer than BIG BROTHER


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## tresrikay (Sep 3, 2008)

***** said:


> Do you think that I am made of money
> I would need 2 new big leisure batteries as both need to be the same make, size and age.
> A large inverter big enough to power anything up to a microwave or hair dryer.
> A large solar panel
> ...



Don't think you would need all that to start a fridge.


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## tresrikay (Sep 3, 2008)

***** said:


> ha Ha Ha lol
> What about all the non renewable fossil fuel used at smokey old BBQs
> I was at Hayfield the other week and I have never seen so much smoke in my life even in the Potteries Bottle kiln days it was not as smokey.
> Now all those BBQs what a waste  and all that pollution.
> ...



I don,t posses a B.B.Q, I use a gas party grill, one little cylinder (camping gas) has lasted 2 years.............  whats that got to do with starting a fridge. I agree B.B.q's are an absolute stinking nightmare. prefer a salad myself.
Or even better off to the pub.


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## tresrikay (Sep 3, 2008)

***** said:


> Nothing, just like your comment about GH and WW3 had nothing to do with it
> I do my bit in my own way and you do your bit in our own way.
> I think it is time that we put this to bed and agree to disagree as it is now getting very boring



I agree, now you have had the last word......oops : sorry


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 3, 2008)

> ... wish I could afford one of these...
> or...this...
> 
> ...OAP...State pension...15 children...9 ex wives...dog...





cipro said:


> How do you change the web site name too your own wording like
> wish I could afford one of these



OKey dokey

Write the words down that you wish use ie  GATS

Open another browser window and find the address at the top which in this case is http://www.guntrader.co.uk/ - usual nonsense R/H mouse click & copy

Now come back to your original post and highlight the words GATS - then go to the little pic of the world and L/H click it - then paste in the guntrader bit - - tell it OK and its Job done


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## flashingblade (Sep 3, 2008)

*hot under the collar*

hi there toymaker. i'm inclined to advise solar power, if it, and a bank of batteries, can cover the power consumption you might need. trouble is the extra weight of big batts and expense of panel. gennies have a time and place, AS EVERYONE AGREES. i have had a large panel and 3x 110ah batts and still had to run a genny ( greedy, i know ).
have you, or anyone else, considered a sterling battery to battery charging system ? i have just read up on them and i'm very impressed. yet again, there is a large price for the technology but it's a route i'm going to invest in. 
by the way daviesport (did i spell that right ?) the idea of letting someone else hook into my genny is brilliant and i feel ashamed i haven't thought of it before although whenever i have used the demon machine, i never seem to have neighbours but i will always bear it in mind from now on. cheers...geoff


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 4, 2008)

flashingblade said:


> hi there toymaker. i'm inclined to advise solar power, if it, and a bank of batteries, can cover the power consumption you might need. trouble is the extra weight of big batts and expense of panel. gennies have a time and place, AS EVERYONE AGREES. i have had a large panel and 3x 110ah batts and still had to run a genny ( greedy, i know ).
> *have you, or anyone else, considered a sterling battery to battery charging system ?* i have just read up on them and i'm very impressed. yet again, there is a large price for the technology but it's a route i'm going to invest in.
> by the way daviesport (did i spell that right ?) the idea of letting someone else hook into my genny is brilliant and i feel ashamed i haven't thought of it before although whenever i have used the demon machine, i never seem to have neighbours but i will always bear it in mind from now on. cheers...geoff



*My bold*
I'm assuming that you mean these Sterling Battery to Battery things? They seem to cost about £130 plus
There is also Antares , Victron and you can even make your own if you are a bit switched on (sorry, what a terrible pun).
I do use this type of equipment and it works very well because you don't have to do anything. It is completely automatic in operation.


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## cipro (Sep 4, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> OKey dokey
> 
> Write the words down that you wish use ie GATS
> 
> ...


 
trying lets see


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## cipro (Sep 4, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> OKey dokey
> 
> Write the words down that you wish use ie GATS
> 
> ...


 
Learning something new every day TY Baloo


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 4, 2008)

cipro said:


> trying lets see



For shame! Couldn't you find something a bit more fun than This 'un
We could have had dribble or lust (bet that's got your attention!)


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## cipro (Sep 5, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> For shame! Couldn't you find something a bit more fun than This 'un
> We could have had dribble or lust (bet that's got your attention!)


 
Yes I now but thought was appropriate when learning something new. I could have linked this  it is clean thanks again or this  enjoy


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 5, 2008)

cipro said:


> Yes I now but thought was appropriate when learning something new. I could have linked this  it is clean thanks again or this  enjoy




Thanks for that M8 - I'd just had my breakfast when I opened your link to that bunch of alkys, poseurs, sex pests and no hopers 
Who do I send the bill to for a new keyboard  

Now the 2nd link is of such stature and maturity that it should be in a post of its own


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## cipro (Sep 5, 2008)

baloothebear said:


> Thanks for that M8 - I'd just had my breakfast when I opened your link to that bunch of alkys, poseurs, sex pests and no hopers
> Who do I send the bill to for a new keyboard
> 
> Now the 2nd link is of such stature and maturity that it should be in a post of its own


 
Well you are  now have a good day although it P***** down everywhere


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## Deleted member 2636 (Sep 5, 2008)

cipro said:


> Well you are  now have a good day *although it P***** down everywhere*



*my bold*
And I expect that you want to know the reason why, don't you?
It's nothing to do with Global warming, the El Ninio effect or even Mr Broon's latest speech. It's because











Mrs BtB bought me a rain gauge for my birthday and she wanted to see if it works


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## jimmnlizz (Sep 6, 2008)

Hi Baloo, I just bought, and fitted, an "Intelligent Self Switching Split Charge Relay Kit 12V / 30Ampa battery to battery charger" from Brocott Electronics. It costs £21.45. It worked great for us for the last fortnight!! JIM


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## scooter (Sep 8, 2008)

I have one 30 watt panal on my van and it makes a big difference even as its a smallish one,i invested in new batteries ,which i fully charge at home via hook up before leaving.
we can be camped for about 4 days watching tv/dvd's etc before i need to start the van.
Having kept to 12volt low cosumption devices sat rec etc i can make the power last much longer and never ever use the hungry inverter.
I have a generator which i hate and i was able to leave it at home this year.
I just want to arrive and enjoy myself without the hastle of a generator.
for my next van i will be fitting bigger panels like my friend who is fully  power sufficiant which is the best situation to be in.


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## barnybg (Aug 19, 2009)

Having amused myself reading this arguement,thought i would comment too...
Solar is definately the way to go,maybe a little expensive £300 = 100 watt panel + 2 100 amp batteries at another £160 and a regulator,maybe a small invertor £20 (for emergency) BUT from then on totally FREE and self su
fficient.

A gennie is a cheap alternative to buy,but to use ?(when you can start it,lol)lugging and using PETROL,highly combustable,smelly and EXPENSIVE ,going up all the time,also the rate of use,will you need to top up somewhere?Of course i'm talking long term and 'wild camping' not going down to your local campsite 40 miles away for the weekend.
Once purchased you will realise how good,modern,clean,quiet and USABLE ,SOLAR POWER is,in fact forgeting about wether you'll have power for this or that,over the week,month or even year....camping wild.
There's many advantages,you can just drive off(if needed too) using solar,the gennie is outside on a hook up(in the cold and wet,or does it work in the wet?)
If your 'WILDING' somewhere and you dont want to cause attention or be a pain.
Breakthroughs are happening every year,new technology,solar just needs light these days not sunshine,and to use your power (at night) it's stored in your batteries !!(just stating a fact,that some would not realize)panels are smaller,most 'vans' have 1 or 2 100 amp batteries anyhow,most equipment is 12 volt and better using LED lighting,also gas for fridge/cooking ??!
So the only point i can see in favour of a genie is,it's cheap to buy machine or you already have one !
For you disbelievers of SOLAR out there,please research 12 volt solar on the net.


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## niblue (Aug 19, 2009)

I bought one of the 2Kw Honda generators for our western isles trip. It's pretty quiet - so much so that we could barely hear it inside the motorhome. Most of the time we used it there wasn't anyone nearby, but even when we did they didn't appear to notice. I walked out the distance our neighbours were and the generator didn't seem to be audible over the wind noise anyway. We also only ran the gennie for a few hours at a time and never overnight. 

We used it more than we'd expected though as at the start of the holiday we found out that our lesuire battery was completely knackered. From our overall experience though I reckon we'd be able to go 3 days if we had 2 x 90AH, although I expect that'd be reduced if we'd wanted to recharge laptops etc.


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## coolasluck (Aug 19, 2009)

Just thought i would put my two pennith in,i have been reading this thread with interest as we will be full timing on selling our house.We are selling the house to try to escape the ratrace.For us as we are giving up our house and we can afford to make our lives as comfortable as possible,which i fully intend on doing,i plan on using solar panels for topping up our batteries and to also spend some money and get the best possible generator that we can.For me i would rather be with than without and have as many solutions to any given problem that i may have.
Alas you will always have the odd scumbag who doesnt give a toss about anyone else,they will always be there no matter what,which is why i want to try and avoid camp sites as much as possible.
For me full timing is about living a differant way of life,and this means not watching the tv every 5 minuites,as has been said if you dont use too much power you aint gonna have a problem.




And please....put your handbags away!!!!


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## Deleted member 967 (Aug 19, 2009)

coolasluck said:


> Just thought i would put my two pennith in,i have been reading this thread with interest as we will be full timing on selling our house.We are selling the house to try to escape the ratrace.For us as we are giving up our house and we can afford to make our lives as comfortable as possible,which i fully intend on doing,i plan on using solar panels for topping up our batteries and to also spend some money and get the best possible generator that we can.For me i would rather be with than without and have as many solutions to any given problem that i may have.
> Alas you will always have the odd scumbag who doesnt give a toss about anyone else,they will always be there no matter what,which is why i want to try and avoid camp sites as much as possible.
> For me full timing is about living a differant way of life,and this means not watching the tv every 5 minuites,as has been said if you dont use too much power you aint gonna have a problem.
> 
> ...



We have a Gasparini Self Energy 20 LPG generator slung under the van.  12v 20 Amp output to leisure battery.  Auto detects voltage and starts and stops as required without intervention.  Silent in operation.  Works in the dark as well keeping up my two 110Ah batteries..

I had this fitted by Conrad Anderson and would recommend it to anyone wilding.

On a site in the dunes near Millom at present and living normally for the last 2 days and it hasn't needed to cut in yet.  TV and Laptop in use no problem.  Although a site it has no facilities and is just like wilding.


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## coolasluck (Aug 19, 2009)

That sounds interesting does he have a website and how much for purchasing and fitting?


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## Deleted member 967 (Aug 19, 2009)

coolasluck said:


> That sounds interesting does he have a website and how much for purchasing and fitting?



Self Energy EG-20 12V Automatic Generator | Conrad Anderson UK


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## Boxerman (Aug 19, 2009)

5% Price Reduction. Save £146!
If 5% = £146 that means 100% = £2920, minus 5% =£2774
Way beyond my league I'm afraid 

Frank


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