# Fridge Driving Me Mad



## Tanya123 (Oct 1, 2010)

Hi, I have posted a message before regarding my fridge I got lots of replies, thankyou, hawever the saga continues for those who didnt see my first posting I'll try to make it short, my fridge didnt work on 12 volt it worked perfectly on 240 and gas, I took it to a reputable company who fixed the 12 volt, I asked them if they would also service the fridge and fit a new jet as I had been told it was good practise, I then went on holiday to France as I dont go on campsites I use the fridge on gas, I noticed that the fridge vents had blackened up and there was an awfull smell coming inside the motorhome, I have a carbon monoxide tester and the alarm went off so I had 3 weeks away with no fridge, when I got home I went back to the company who said they would take out the fridge and test it, they had it for nearly 3 weeks and no phone call, when I phoned them they said it was ready, it cost more money again they said they had to replace the fridge gas valve and the gas thermostat the cost of this and the initiall jet and service came to over £300 inc labour, I didnt mind paying if it fixed the problem, however when I got home I put the fridge on gas to test it, Icould't believe it whithin a short space of time the vents had blackened up again, I got back on the phone and was told I could have contaminated gas or the gas pipes have sludged up, it isn't my gas Iv'e tried a different bottle as for the pipes I don't know, he is saying because it works fine in his workshop the fault must be with the motorhome, is this possible or is he trying to fob me off, he says he will sort it but I will have to pay, Im going mad all this money and its still not fixed, please help, many thanks.


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## Byronic (Oct 1, 2010)

If it was going OK on gas before it was "repaired" then it's most likely to be something they've done, possibly fitted the wrong size jet causing incomplete combustion. Flexible gas pipes do break down in time due to reaction with gas constituents. If you take the fridge back to them insist that they let you see it operating in the workshop, then you can be certain where the problem lies.£300 seems an exorbitant charge to me,  a new standard model Dometic fridge can't be much more.


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## AndyC (Oct 1, 2010)

Personally I can't see how a fault with the  gas valve and the gas thermostat could cause sooting up.

Sooting is virtually always caused by a burner fault, when gas burns without enough air you get a yellow flame and it's the yellow flame that produces the soot due to incomplete combustion. It also produces carbon monoxide, it's lucky you had a CO detector...

If your other gas appliances are burning with the correct blue flame then you don't have a problem with your gas being contaminated or the pipes sludged up.

It seems to me that you have paid more than enough to get your fridge serviced and have a right to insist that it is put right without further charge.

AndyC


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## Byronic (Oct 1, 2010)

AndyC said:


> Personally I can't see how a fault with the  gas valve and the gas thermostat could cause sooting up.
> 
> Sooting is virtually always caused by a burner fault, when gas burns without enough air you get a yellow flame and it's the yellow flame that produces the soot due to incomplete combustion. It also produces carbon monoxide, it's lucky you had a CO detector...
> 
> ...



As the OP states, the fridge was working perfectly on gas before it was "repaired" and the only thing that could logically have caused incomplete combustion would be wrong jet fitted, unless of course another unmentioned incorrect part or parts were fitted.
 £300 suggests a fair bit of work should have been carried out.


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## caspar (Oct 1, 2010)

Byronic said:


> As the OP states, the fridge was working perfectly on gas before it was "repaired" and the only thing that could logically have caused incomplete combustion would be wrong jet fitted, unless of course another unmentioned incorrect part or parts were fitted.
> £300 suggests a fair bit of work should have been carried out.


 
Methinks some straight talking is called for. They have a duty to return it at least to the condition it was in when you first handed it over to them. Don't part with any more cash. I'd take it back and insist they repair it free of charge or you will take the matter further.


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## Tanya123 (Oct 2, 2010)

*Thanks to all*

Hi, thanks for the replies I also thought they may have fitted the wrong jet but according to the engineer he gives electrolux the model number and they send the right jet, to my knowledge he hasn't double checked this, he just keeps coming up with different faults, he is never wrong by the way, not a nice man, my other appliences on the van are working perfect, I did tell him in my last phone call I was going to take it further his reply was go ahead, unless we pay again he will not look at the fridge again, perhaps my only option is to take it else where and get a report made to see if some of the parts we have paid for where un necessary, unfortunately it will cost more money again or I could name and shame him but is that legal?


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## vwalan (Oct 2, 2010)

course you could have some friends break his legs .its been done before ,usually stops them messing other folk about. ask around for the price of fixing the fridge i,m sure it can be done. have a word with the right people . sometimes just a big mate and a base ball bat is enough just to go with you and look menacing. 
have fun cheers alan.


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## vwalan (Oct 2, 2010)

hi ***** ,its a 20ft lynton trailer .originally a 5ton gvw .altogether its 10mtr. you can drive it on c1+e . i lower the train weight voluntarily to 8.25 to allow this . it could be 9,600kg . i also voluntarily lower the gvw of trailer as living vans under 3,500kg dont need mot. the unit is mot exempt as i only use it to pull a living van and it forms part of an articulated combination. 
it as to be a proper artic to get this . meaning at least 20 percent of the laden trailer is super imposed on the towing unit. if you need more call 07971962361. i built the unit from a local grave diggers tipper truck and converted the trailer myself. done a few now. have a good laugh with our local vosa and dvla as i drive it on disabled tax as well. cheap motoring. cheers alan.
its smaller than a car towing a caravan. its only 9 inches longer than my bongo towing a 10ft caravan. fits in two carparkspaces easily. 7ft 6inch wide


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## caspar (Oct 3, 2010)

Tanya123 said:


> Hi, thanks for the replies I also thought they may have fitted the wrong jet but according to the engineer he gives electrolux the model number and they send the right jet, to my knowledge he hasn't double checked this, he just keeps coming up with different faults, he is never wrong by the way, not a nice man, my other appliences on the van are working perfect, I did tell him in my last phone call I was going to take it further his reply was go ahead, unless we pay again he will not look at the fridge again, perhaps my only option is to take it else where and get a report made to see if some of the parts we have paid for where un necessary, unfortunately it will cost more money again or I could name and shame him but is that legal?


 
Just a thought. If he was working on a gas appliance he has to be gas safe registered (used to be Corgi). Get his name, ask to see his gas safe license, if he reufuses, phone gas safe and tell them your saga and where this person works. They take ALL complaints very seriously and he could end up losing his license if he doesn't put things right.

This would certainly be the case if it was domestic gas, only thing I'm not sure of is that it is the same for motorhomes / caravans etc.... I suspect it is as gas is a very dangerous thing to be messing about with.

May be a new tack for you to pursue?


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## Tbear (Oct 3, 2010)

caspar said:


> Just a thought. If he was working on a gas appliance he has to be gas safe registered (used to be Corgi). Get his name, ask to see his gas safe license, if he reufuses, phone gas safe and tell them your saga and where this person works. They take ALL complaints very seriously and he could end up losing his license if he doesn't put things right.
> 
> This would certainly be the case if it was domestic gas, only thing I'm not sure of is that it is the same for motorhomes / caravans etc.... I suspect it is as gas is a very dangerous thing to be messing about with.
> 
> May be a new tack for you to pursue?



You are spot on Casper. Check out engineers.gassaferegister.co.uk/About.aspx. You have to register to work on lpg in this country


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## vwalan (Oct 3, 2010)

corgi or now gassafe as it is doesnt cover m,homes .they do cover houses and caravans but if you look on their webb site it very plainly says not cover m,homes.corgi never covered m,homes either . there is some courses but there is no regulation to be certified only a compedant person . so no go there i think. but you could try anyway.
cheersalan.


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## Tbear (Oct 3, 2010)

vwalan said:


> corgi or now gassafe as it is doesnt cover m,homes .they do cover houses and caravans but if you look on their webb site it very plainly says not cover m,homes.corgi never covered m,homes either . there is some courses but there is no regulation to be certified only a compedant person . so no go there i think. but you could try anyway.
> cheersalan.


 
It does cover LPG so well worth a try and I have asked Gassafe to make it clearer as I could not find the Motorhome exemption.


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## vwalan (Oct 3, 2010)

i think you ill find they only cover m,homes that are for hire . its a bit daft really there is a course set up to cover m,homes but i f i remember right its not a legal requirement to have the qualification to work on a privately used m,home . but i could be out of date on it so look forward to your answer . cheers alan.


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## AndyC (Oct 4, 2010)

That's right, you do not need to be Gas Safe registered to work on caravans or motorhomes that are not hired out.

The bit relating to motorhomes is the 'self-propelled vehicles' section of The Gas Safety Installation and Use Regulations section 2 (5) here: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1998/2451/regulation/2/made

The same applies to boats, Gas Safe registration is not required to work on boats that are not hired out, unless they are residential boats.

AndyC


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## Tbear (Oct 4, 2010)

Gassafe have not replied to my email yet but if you don't need to register it will be a big sigh of relief from the self builders


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## Tbear (Oct 4, 2010)

Gassafe came back with you have to be registered to work on a caravan. Have asked for more info on the Privately owned Motorhome front.


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## Tbear (Oct 4, 2010)

Well this is word for word what the tech guys at gassafe said.

Privately owned motor homes would only come under the scope of the Gas Safety (Installation and Use) Regulations and under the remit of Gas Safe, if they were rented out for hire to members of the public. 

A non-registered Gas Safe engineer working on a privately owed motor homes would still have to be competent under other ‘Health and Safety’ regulations.

Hope this helps.


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## vwalan (Oct 4, 2010)

as gassafe dont have a qualification to work on motorhomes not for hire or reward . they are no more competant than me or you.as long as you are competent. right load of crap it is, you need cops to be qualified .on m,homes . and gas safe dont have to have them .neither did corgi. like i say there are very few that have a qualification to work on them thats valid.cheers alan.


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## Tbear (Oct 4, 2010)

vwalan said:


> as gassafe dont have a qualification to work on motorhomes not for hire or reward . they are no more competant than me or you.as long as you are competent. right load of crap it is, you need cops to be qualified .on m,homes . and gas safe dont have to have them .neither did corgi. like i say there are very few that have a qualification to work on them thats valid.cheers alan.



Alan 
Apart from the two nice gents that sorted out the drunk driver that banged into my daughters parked car the other night, what's cops?


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## maingate (Oct 4, 2010)

Thats good news for me then.

I have just stripped out the burner on my Alde boiler to fit a new spark plug and flame sensor.

Just as well I did as the flue liner was knackered at the boiler end and the wall vent end. Bleeding expensive for 1 metre of 50 mm dia flue liner. Nearly £30 with postage and VAT. I trawled the tinternet but could not find any 50 mm diameter liner anywhere.

Graham Cutmore Engineering is very good to deal with if you have problems or need spares for an Alde heating system.

www.grahamcutmoreengineering.co.uk


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## Mickt (Oct 4, 2010)

I to have got problems with my fridge, keeps refusing to work on mains . Any body recommend an engineer , i live on the Essex Suffolk border. Just telephoned a repair man in Colchester and he said leave the MH with him for at least a week for test, no way will i do that . Surely there are people who can do these repairs without needing that sort of time,  ?? how much will that cost


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## vwalan (Oct 4, 2010)

hi its a qualification that allows an lpg engineer to work on a motor home not for hire. cant remember the exact wordind .in fact i hope i have it right. i used to build campers and althow my mate was a corgi gas lpg fitter he still could not under the corgi banner work on m,homes .he now is a gassafe engineer .but it still doesnt give him a real qualification. he will have to go on a further course. just for m,homes not for hire. yet he can and i do work on m,homes as we are competent. but no corgi or gassafe have a category to work on said vehicles and certify the job. getrs really insane dont you think.


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## Tbear (Oct 4, 2010)

vwalan said:


> hi its a qualification that allows an lpg engineer to work on a motor home not for hire. cant remember the exact wordind .in fact i hope i have it right. i used to build campers and althow my mate was a corgi gas lpg fitter he still could not under the corgi banner work on m,homes .he now is a gassafe engineer .but it still doesnt give him a real qualification. he will have to go on a further course. just for m,homes not for hire. yet he can and i do work on m,homes as we are competent. but no corgi or gassafe have a category to work on said vehicles and certify the job. getrs really insane dont you think.



Alan 
So under the rules I can get cookers, fridges and heaters from scrap caravans which may be twenty years old. Clean them up a bit and coble them together in a van and sell it as long as I have basic DIY skills and have read manuals for the kit. Yet I cannot connect a brand new gas cooker to the manifold in my kitchen even if I get a Gassafe engineer to sign it off. Thats worse than insane thats bureaucracy.


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## misty (Oct 4, 2010)

vwalan said:


> as gassafe dont have a qualification to work on motorhomes not for hire or reward . they are no more competant than me or you.as long as you are competent. right load of crap it is, you need cops to be qualified .on m,homes . and gas safe dont have to have them .neither did corgi. like i say there are very few that have a qualification to work on them thats valid.cheers alan.


 
i think alan has missed the A off from acop's (approved codes of practice) which now have changed to nacs (National Accredited Certification Scheme) so i believe,
misty


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## vwalan (Oct 4, 2010)

hi misty ,you could be right .i spoke to gas safe a while ago and they put me in touch with a college or something possibly liecester . i decided not to do it. as i only work on a few now and again. but it does make a mockery when insurance companies request you go to gas safe for a check etc . but anyway hope op. gets their fridge sorted asc its getting a bit expensive . there are alot of rogues out there . cheers alan.
tbear ,yes thats quite correct. my mate is covered to do your house and caravan ,but not your m,home .we laugh because it makes us equal. we have both been fitting lpg to cars for years . i let him work on my house just to cover any problems if anything happens. but its a joke .


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## AndyC (Oct 5, 2010)

Gas Safe, like CORGI before it, is just a registration scheme. You need the correct qualification before you can register with Gas Safe at all, then there are further training and update modules you can do to increase the range of work that you are legally qualified to do.

Ga Safe itself doesn't do anything apart from maintain the register, and deal with complaints about registered gas engineers, and anyone who is not registered found working on a system which can only legally be worked on by a registered engineer.

Gas Safe, and the HSE, would dearly like all LPG systems to be covered by the regulations, I suspect that it will happen in the future, but it will require a revision of The Gas Safety Installation and Use Regulations.

AndyC


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## caspar (Oct 5, 2010)

Would he consent to an independent inspection. If he's right, you pay, if you're right, he pays?


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## ubuntu1 (Oct 24, 2010)

*Fridge*

Please be careful when quoting so called law on gas - Gas Safe isn't necessary to work on motorhomes and neither is ACOPS (Gas Certified). However if you want to be sure that the engineer has received specific training to work on motorhomes or caravans then you need to check that they have the ACOPS (gas) registration It is complicated but please don't confuse the domestic Gas Safe registration with what's required for motorhomes.  

There are lots of ACOPS (gas) engineers out there. Try the MCEA.Mobile Caravan Engineers - Mobile Repairs Service for Touring Caravans Campervans and Motorhome Caravans


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## AndyC (Oct 24, 2010)

ubuntu1 said:


> Please be careful when quoting so called law on gas - Gas Safe isn't necessary to work on motorhomes and neither is ACOPS (Gas Certified). However if you want to be sure that the engineer has received specific training to work on motorhomes or caravans then you need to check that they have the ACOPS (gas) registration It is complicated but please don't confuse the domestic Gas Safe registration with what's required for motorhomes.
> 
> There are lots of ACOPS (gas) engineers out there. Try the MCEA.Mobile Caravan Engineers - Mobile Repairs Service for Touring Caravans Campervans and Motorhome Caravans


That's pretty much correct, Gas Safe registration is not 'required' to work on motorhomes unless they are hired out.

This page gives a bit on info on ACOPS and has links through to details of the training that's required to gain the qualifications: Gas Competence Training for Caravan Engineers - CITO

AndyC


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## rommel (Oct 25, 2010)

*Fridge*

Its quite easy to see what your fridge gas  burner is doing , remove the lower plastic cover from the side of the van this will reveal the burner protection box , this is made up of three seperate galvanized panels held together with self tappers, loosen the screws and the box will dismantle enough to get it out around the gas pipe and thermo couple .
Remove the screw that holds the burner cup in place and pull the burner down . There should now be enough flexibility in the pipe to pull the burner out through the lower vent aparture clear of the van .While holding the burner pipe get someone to ignite the fridge burner  and turn the temperature control up and down ,you should see the flame rise and fall and be able to ascertain if it is smoking or not , the colour of it and if it is too fierse.If this is OK then there is something burning in the flue .


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## alanval (Nov 2, 2010)

Just reading this thread and wondering did you get your fridge fixed?
We had problems with ours running on gas for over a year.First it was sooting up and red ignition light kept coming on.We had the Dometic engineer from out nearest town here 4 times .He did stop the sooting up problem but it still was intermitinlay going off.Finally phoned Delamere and they gave us another number for a place at Carstairs .So up we went there not holding out much hope.However the Guy there was brilliant Took the fridge out and replaces various parts (its 12 yrs old) he also renewed the ignighter only took him about 2 hrs, and the fridge has run perfect since .
Pity he is so far north I would highly recommend this firm..Even a phone call to him lovely chap to deal with..

...
motorhomes caravans servicing repairs gas safety damp repairs workshop - MB&G Warranty


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## Forester (Nov 2, 2010)

*I had this problem on my nearly new Dometic fridge*

The pipes in my fridge were all black and the CO smell was worrying.  I called Dometic who sent one of their agents to my house to fix it.  He cleaned it all out and strongly suggested I change the rubber tails to metal mesh type.  I did this nearly two years ago and the problem has never returned.  There is often mentions of the rubber tails causing "sooting" in the pipes.  The Gaslow people make a big deal about how preferable the metal mesh tails are.  If you want the details of my repairer let me know. my email address is on  my profile.


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