Wildcamping in Scotland-An existential threat

[Fisherman]

Bill yes they are right, when as mentioned in the whitby thread people are abusing with chairs,tables and in essence camping unless you are condoning such behaviour.?

There was no mention of any of this Andrew.
The original post which you stated was sometimes correct.
Stated only that by not using campsites some would think we were freeloaders.
No mention whatsoever about chairs and tables was made.
You have now introduced that into the debate.

In certain very remote locations when alone I see nothing wrong with putting out chairs and a table.
I have seen cars turning up doing likewise.
Do you have a problem with a car doing likewise.
I don't condone such actions in town or village carparks, such as Whitby.
But in a forestry or remote carpark in the middle of nowhere I have absolutely no issue with it whatsover.
Its all about common sense, and being considerate of others.

But its my choice when I do or don't use a campsite, not some local nimby, who reckons that by not doing so makes me a freeloader.

 

[Ron Sutton]

There will always be the "spoilers" Terry, whether in tents, cars or motorhomes. One approach might be to promote specific groups such as WC or MH whose members are signed up to adhere to the "leave no trace" approach. We would need to adopt the wider use of windscreen stickers to identify us and make it clear that we would adopt a "name and shame" approach if locals reported seeing a member causing a nuisance. A bit of self policing might promote a better image, at least for some of us. Just a thought .........

I think this is right - we need all M/h Campervan membership organisations who subscribe to the "leave no trace" approach to band together and approach local councils/ NT/ EH/ WT and the like to promote the idea that their responsible members who show a current membership badge CAN park at their various sites. Possibly, in some places, it may be neccessary to have a time limit or a fee for staying during busy hours.

 

[runnach]

There was no mention of any of this Andrew.
The original post which you stated was sometimes correct.
Stated only that by not using campsites some would think we were freeloaders.
No mention whatsoever about chairs and tables was made.
You have now introduced that into the debate.

In certain very remote locations when alone I see nothing wrong with putting out chairs and a table.
I have seen cars turning up doing likewise.
Do you have a problem with a car doing likewise.
I don't condone such actions in town or village carparks, such as Whitby.
But in a forestry or remote carpark in the middle of nowhere I have absolutely no issue with it whatsover.
Its all about common sense, and being considerate of others.

But its my choice when I do or don't use a campsite, not some local nimby, who reckons that by not doing so makes me a freeloader.

Technically it wasn’t you I was replying too, it was Caledonia,

 

[antiquesam]

I would be inclined to write to farming groups and to game and conservation groups like the CLA or NFU, the Forestry Commission and Natural Trust and English / Dcottish heritage nd explain the need
Farmers and landowners have been overwhelmed by increased use of the land by people during covid. Gates and blocked, carparks are filled and carparks are inadequate. There is a recognition that the infrastructure can't cope with massively increased usage. Due to parking, litter, fire and human excrement.
This would be a good time to present an argument for Aires, for increased serviced car parks and for access to the countryside to be possible without causing conflict with those making a living from it.
I am yet to have my first van trip (hired my first on the 17th) so I dont have the experience but I do know the issues felt by the farming world.
So, definitely try and strike up dialogue, provide practical ideas and solutions may follow. Farmers are entrepreneurial and that tenner a night pitch fee for a quiet Aire can make a difference.

I'm afraid farm fields are already available at a tenner a night in the club's cl's and cs's, but what people want is the ability to stay within walking distance of civilization. Farm sites are useful but usually in the middle of nowhere. There are 1,000's of wildcamping spots in remote places, but just occasionally it's nice to be near a pub.

 

[Fisherman]

Technically it wasn’t you I was replying too, it was Caledonia,

Are you OK Andrew.
Are you stating that only Caledonia can reply to your post.
Was your post only for Caledonias consumption.
If so may I respectfully request you use the PM system on here.
That way you won't have to be bothered by simple folk like myself.

If winning debates on here means that much to you that you first go of on a tangent,
then take it upon yourself to decide who has right of reply.

Then so be it.

 

[maingate]

You are correct Andrew, there are plenty of freeloaders about. They are a small minority of a very large group, which makes them a sizeable amount of people. They will never change their habits, if their favourite places come under some form of payment or control, they will just find somewhere else.

I have seen them in action and also had the backwash from locals assuming I will act the same.

 

[Fisherman]

Bill yes they are right, when as mentioned in the whitby thread people are abusing with chairs,tables and in essence camping unless you are condoning such behaviour.?

There was no mention of any of this Andrew.
merely that by not using campsites we are free loaders.

 

[Fisherman]

You are correct Andrew, there are plenty of freeloaders about. They are a small minority of a very large group, which makes them a sizeable amount of people. They will never change their habits, if their favourite places come under some form of payment or control, they will just find somewhere else.

I have seen them in action and also had the backwash from locals assuming I will act the same.

I would reply, but I am not allowed to owing to the fact it was directed towards Andrew.

 

[Picket]

Here she is on twitter encouraging people to come to Glencoe.
Strange I thought she stated that there were to many tourists there.

https://twitter.com/vikisutherland

Not exactly a prolific twitterer at that though.

 

[Debroos]

I think this is right - we need all M/h Campervan membership organisations who subscribe to the "leave no trace" approach to band together and approach local councils/ NT/ EH/ WT and the like to promote the idea that their responsible members who show a current membership badge CAN park at their various sites. Possibly, in some places, it may be neccessary to have a time limit or a fee for staying during busy hours.

I guess a case could be made that if 'leave no trace' campers were in an area then they could help look after it by prompt reporting of antisocial behaviour...

 

[Fisherman]

Not exactly a prolific twitterer at that though.

No but she clearly is inviting folk to come to Glencoe.
Unless you do so in a Motorhome apparently

 

[Val54]

I would reply, but I am not allowed to owing to the fact it was directed towards Andrew.

I would reply as well but its all getting a bit pedantic even if tongue in cheek and I'm certainly not starting to pm people, it was clear tha Andrew was referring ti Caledonia's post, it was quoted .....

 

[Picket]

Given the current situation, it might be best to also target the local Chamber of Commerce. They should be actively looking for ways to improve tourism ... and in the short term motorhomes hold a unique position (as Scarborough Council has demonstrated).

I would hate to think I would not be allowed to visit Scotland by motorhome, defiantly the best way to see the country.
The economy would certainly suffer, as would our mental state.

 

[Fisherman]

I would reply as well but its all getting a bit pedantic even if tongue in cheek and I'm certainly not starting to pm people, it was clear tha Andrew was referring ti Caledonia's post, it was quoted .....

Are you seriously saying that if I post something right now regarding your post that only you can reply. That no other poster on here should do so.
Seriously.

when you post on a public forum for everyone to read something.
everyone has a right of reply.

 

[Picket]

Do I detect a hint of racism there Marie.

I only have one thing to say

Scottish lives matter

Motorhomer's lives matter

 

[Picket]

I've had an email exchange with Vicki as one Community Councillor to another and she has calmed down a bit now, having received 500 hate mails (as she calls them!)

I explained the concept of Aires to her and how well they worked in Europe and she was receptive to the idea.

I also pointed out that people were suggesting she has a vested interest, but she replied that she was no longer involved in the businesses mentioned. In any case, Community Councils have a fairly robust procedure for declaring interest in any decisions they make.

As others have said, getting anyone to join a Community Council (which *is* an elected body - at least it is if there are enough candidates!) is a challenge, much like any other voluntary body these days, so we have to take who we can get (myself included!!) It's also true that Community Councils in Scotland have less power than English Parish Councils, but they do (sometimes) have a reasonably powerful voice in "directing" the thoughts of the County Councils who do make the decisions.

The experiment to regularise "wild camping" around Loch Lomond was widely agreed to have been an expensive disaster that didn't achieve its objections.

Graham

Aires are definitely the way to go, not just in Scotland but for the whole of the British Isles. The major supermarkets & the ferry companies could collaborate with the various tourist boards & business organisations. I have approached several in the past but being just "a man in a van" was dismissed out of hand. Maybe if someone with clout was to get involved it might be a different matter. After all the economy is in need of all the help it can get, judging from reports of motorhome sales the business is there.

 

[Val54]

Are you seriously saying that if I post something right now regarding your post that only you can reply. That no other poster on here should do so.
Seriously.

when you post on a public forum for everyone to read something.
everyone has a right of reply.

Exactly, no further comment ............

 

[Fisherman]

Exactly, no further comment ............

Exactly what exactly

So you have never replied to a post not directed at you.
If we all did that, there would be no forum, no discussion.

Oh and bye the way you just did

 

[Val54]

Ok I'm hooked, Andrew's post was quite clear, he quoted Caledonia's post so that's what he was referring to. He was also quite clear that the stuff about "putting out tables and chairs etc" came from the Whitby thread. You then proceeded to ask if he was ok, as if he was "confused". If he was, then I'm in the same boat as I understood what he meant

 

[Fisherman]

Ok I'm hooked, Andrew's post was quite clear, he quoted Caledonia's post so that's what he was referring to. He was also quite clear that the stuff about "putting out tables and chairs etc" came from the Whitby thread. You then proceeded to ask if he was ok, as if he was "confused". If he was, then I'm in the same boat as I understood what he meant

Val with the greatest of respect the fact that Andrew quoted someones post is completely irrelevant.
Andrew posted something that I simply don't agree within this forum.
Now that gives me, you, and anyone else the right of reply.
I posted stating my views.
At that point anyone else on here had the right of reply.
Just as they do regarding this very post.

You yourself replied to a post clearly directed at myself, and why not.
I cannot believe we are actually having this conversation.

Lets get back on topic.

The fact is I don't think folk who only wild camp never paying for parking are freeloaders, thats their right to do so.
Go to any beach in summer and you will find hundreds of cars full of folk who pay for nothing.
Are they also freeloaders.
And when I bought my van I was not aware that I was agreeing to support local communities.
The fact that I do try to support local communities, and do pay for campsites and other locations is entirely my choice.