Michelin Camper Tyres

There must be some difference with Michelin CP tyres but whether it's limited to a different mould with the CP and Camping who knows.
Personally I don't think even Michelin are that cynical and that there probably structural and compound differences.
Certainly the CP tyres have a higher max pressure allowance than basic C tyres.
 
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Would love to know exactly why the Cross Climates aren’t recommended for MH’s. When you consider they a recommended as an all season tyre for the same base vehicles, in any configuration from ambulance to courier van, from mini buses loaded with kids to trade persons vehicles loaded with tool, what makes a MH special? barring they don’t go far and are usually pampered.
No, I’m not buying “they run close to max GVW continuously” reason, so do ambulances, so do many trade vans, so do builders merchants delivery vans, etc.
I am as mystified as you, I contacted Michelin direct and that was the answer I received. If you search on the UK website you wont find a selection for Motorhome/Cross Climate tyre.🤔
 
I am as mystified as you, I contacted Michelin direct and that was the answer I received. If you search on the UK website you wont find a selection for Motorhome/Cross Climate tyre.🤔

I'm assuming you did ask them about the Agilis Cross Climate, and not just the Cross Climate or Cross Climate +?
 
I'm assuming you did ask them about the Agilis Cross Climate, and not just the Cross Climate or Cross Climate +?
It’s the Agilis Cross Climate that I am looking at.
I would note that numerous European countries require ‘winter tyres’, unless a tyre carries the 3P symbol it is not certified as a ‘winter tyre’. If it just has M+S it is a summer tyre with a tread designed to give more grip on soft surfaces, but it does not have a compound designed for grip in low temperatures...sadly as it would be a lot less hassle to keep the original tyres. If you have driven both in winter you would appreciate the difference.
 
It’s the Agilis Cross Climate that I am looking at.
I would note that numerous European countries require ‘winter tyres’, unless a tyre carries the 3P symbol it is not certified as a ‘winter tyre’. If it just has M+S it is a summer tyre with a tread designed to give more grip on soft surfaces, but it does not have a compound designed for grip in low temperatures...sadly as it would be a lot less hassle to keep the original tyres. If you have driven both in winter you would appreciate the difference.

I'm not aware of any European country apart from Germany that has the 3PMSF rule. Most countries include M+S as a suitable tyre for winter use. Countries will have a minimum depth of thread for a M+S tyre to be suitable in winter, usually 3, 4 or 5mm, different countries different rules.
Also, 3PMSF no longer means a winter tyre. All season can be 3PMSF (such as the Cross Climate) they are not a soft compound like a full winter tyre, which in Michelins van range, would be the Agilis Alpin.
 
Out of interest one of my Norwegian relatives uses Nokia Hakkepelita tyres on his motorhome for winter use, maybe worth a bit of research.
 
I'm not aware of any European country apart from Germany that has the 3PMSF rule. Most countries include M+S as a suitable tyre for winter use. Countries will have a minimum depth of thread for a M+S tyre to be suitable in winter, usually 3, 4 or 5mm, different countries different rules.
Also, 3PMSF no longer means a winter tyre. All season can be 3PMSF (such as the Cross Climate) they are not a soft compound like a full winter tyre, which in Michelins van range, would be the Agilis Alpin.
The point I am making is that a non 3PMS mud and snow tyre is not strictly a winter tyre. It may have improved performance on snow, but on roads with mixed tarmac, ice, frost and snow it does not grip as well as a 3PMS certified 4 season or winter tyre.
However after further review of the various sources of information I must admit Germany is the only one completely unambiguous in the need for 3PMS for new tyres after 2018. Some sources include Austria. Some counties seem to accept just M+S, others simply don’t seem to clearly define ‘winter’ tyres. Pity, we go to Germany a lot, and are planning a Black Forest drive through in April, perhaps all will be clear by then.
 
Tricky, especially as Germany don't give a time period, just "winter conditions".
My van came with Vanco Winter 2's on. I didn't want them, and neither did anyone else 😂. Replaced them with the tyre I wanted, Vanco's are still in the yard. Might use them to grow spuds in this year lol.

The Nokia Hakkepelita are a studded tyre I think, for proper ice conditions.
 
There must be some difference with Michelin CP tyres but whether it's limited to a different mould with the CP and Camping who knows.
Personally I don't think even Michelin are that cynical and that there probably structural and compound differences.
Certainly the CP tyres have a higher max pressure allowance than basic C tyres.

It is a mystery to me also. There are other details beyond just the rating numbers, such as the the number and types of the radial reinforcement. Say four sets of steel, one of nylon. When I went through it with the ATS man these were also identical between the Michelin and the Tigar, you'll find them marked on the side, but who knows how they are actually laid up, what the materials and gauges used are, what the rubber compounding is, they appeared to be identical, from the same mould, but could be completely different inside. One built to a price point, the other with the finest stuff. Or they could be identical, supplied to different markets, under different brand names to avoid competing within the same business ownership and expanding their market.

Actually Michelin invented radial construction in 1946, using steel belts, which was revolutionary, we all drove on crossply tyres before that and still did long after, until presumably the patents expired. A Michelin X was then a premium product, unquestionably superior, and priced accordingly.

I'm sure that Michelin still know their stuff, and if they have said that a specific tyre is not recommended on a camper they may have their reasons, either marketing, or actual engineering. But if they won't say why, and they won't, I remain skeptical. I truly see no difference between a camper and a commercial vehicle, except that the commercial vehicle may see far more arduous service than a camper. Sure, many just run around doing e.g. parcel deliveries, but others do run fully loaded, even over-loaded, doing vast mileages. And don't require some sort of specialist tyre.

I run mine at the pressures that Dethleffs specify and have placed on a clear label inside the door, along with a reminder of the plated and individual axle weights, 60 psi front, 65 (max) at the rear, and that is in accordance with what I understand about how things work, and the load rating, which is close to what my loaded van runs at, from my actual weighbridge measurements. AFAIK the load rating is only valid at max. pressure and should be de-rated below that. Makes sense to me.

Certainly on our cars the specified load rating for the tyres is far in excess of what could possibly be achieved under any circumstance, and they run at pressures far below the maximum for the tyre. Whereas my camper weighs nearly as much as a modest car at each corner, and has physically smaller tyres than ours.

Though I've seen other discussions where people suggest far lower pressures, but I'm not sure why they would want to do that, and I wouldn't want to have to argue with the insurer if say an accident investigation determined that they were way under-inflated.

You must also be careful about the tyre valves, you need the proper ones which are solidly reinforced throughout, not the rubbery ones used on cars which can blow out at these pressures. Disaster. Fortunately I spotted that error when mine were fitted, and I think the young fitter probably received some re-education from the manager after that had been corrected. He'd just picked the standard ones from the box, rather than the proper ones, which they did have, along with a heavy duty tool to fit them, they can be a pig to change. I do hope that was the first and last time he made that mistake.

There can be real disasters when they get it wrong, ISTR that Ford in the USA were nearly bankrupted by a class action and recall over a popular vehicle that had been fitted with incorrect tyres (Firestone ?) as OEM resulting in several fatalities and many other accidents. So even the really big companies can still get it badly wrong.

Look at new motorhomes at shows and see what tyres are fitted as new. How many of them are some secret-sauce specialist camping tyre ? No, they are probably just what the base vehicle manufacturer's buying department chose after negotiations, and entirely adequate. Or not, certainly my Pirellis were not, but perhaps they were simply the lowest bidder. Perhaps the big industry groups of motorhome manufacturers do get to specify what they want for their base vehicles, I don't know.
 
Certainly the CP tyres have a higher max pressure allowance than basic C tyres.
Crossclimate tyres can be inflated to 80psi, I run mine at 60psi on the front and 70psi on the rear, previously I had Hankook full winter tyres on all year for six years, no problems in the summer and great in Germany in the winter, Saga recommend that if you cannot change tyres for different seasons it is better to fit winter tyres all year
 
I think I heard that motorhome specific tyres were better suited to being parked up fir long periods. That was probably on a forum or the net though rather than a tyre manufacturer.

if you make sure axle leadings are okay and they are a proper fitment and designed for vehicles with high side loading s (commercial probably) you should be fine.

I would be very unlikely to fit anything where a manufacturer states it’s unsuitable for my use without a lot more investigation
 
Sorry for second post but as a lifelong motorcyclist I just want to add that just because a tyre looks identical doesn’t mean it is.
Speed rating is definitely important, I have had tyres delaminates on outfits by prolonged high speed use of tyres.
Likewise grip, braking distance and cornering can be completely different on identical looking tyres.
I had to deal with manufacturers tech deiartments to sort my van tyres as I couldn’t find a solution.
If you wants facts or have doubts contact them, tyres along with brakes and steering are probably the most important bits keeping you alive each trip
 
I think I heard that motorhome specific tyres were better suited to being parked up fir long periods. That was probably on a forum or the net though rather than a tyre manufacturer.

if you make sure axle leadings are okay and they are a proper fitment and designed for vehicles with high side loading s (commercial probably) you should be fine.

I would be very unlikely to fit anything where a manufacturer states it’s unsuitable for my use without a lot more investigation

Yes, have heard that many times over the years too. No idea how true it is though.
Still, Michelin need to up their game. According to them, they don't have a tyre, suitable for a Motorhome that meets the legal requirements for winter driving in Germany.
 
Yes, have heard that many times over the years too. No idea how true it is though.
Still, Michelin need to up their game. According to them, they don't have a tyre, suitable for a Motorhome that meets the legal requirements for winter driving in Germany.
They do suitable tyres don’t they, isn’t the Michelin Agile Alpine one such? I thought it was one flavour Eric posted they didn’t recommend?
 
Saxonborg is right.
Just used the online tech assistance on the Michelin website.
They only recommend the Agilis Camping tyre for Motorhomes. I pointed out I need a 3PMSF tyre for Germany. I was told they don't have a Camper tyre legal for winter use in Germany, but will have soon.
 
What I have noticed when looking at Tigar van tyre specs is that both the fuel economy and wet grip ratings are a couple of graf6es lower than the Michelin equivalents.
To me this suggests both different tread compounds and carcass construction.
For me the one rating I really pay attention to is wet braking - that's when we need a tyre to perform.
I like to save money as much as the next person but when it comes to tyres - especially when running close to the maximum load I'm afraid that whilst I shop round I won't go budget.
 
Saxonborg is right.
Just used the online tech assistance on the Michelin website.
They only recommend the Agilis Camping tyre for Motorhomes. I pointed out I need a 3PMSF tyre for Germany. I was told they don't have a Camper tyre legal for winter use in Germany, but will have soon.

It's 'worse' than that, I've also just had a online chat, they don't make a suitable campervan tyre as fitted to my van, in fact nobody does as the CP specs don't allow the tyres to be made strong enough in 215/75-16 to take the 2400kg axle loads. I knew this before going online, but thought I'd try, they ended up offering the Cross Climates for all season use, but claimed they where not suitable for motorhome use.
 

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