whitby gazette motorhome parking

Whitby - is the 'no overnight sleeping' fine enforceable?

I have just returned from Whitby and wish I had read this thread before going!
We spent two days at a paid site at Robin Hood's Bay and then moved to Whitby in the morning. There were several motorhomes parked in the long stay car park just along from the Co-op. Most were clearly overnighting - screens up, etc.. There was a sign in the car park stating 'No overnight sleeping or cooking - fine £100'. We asked two motorhomers what they felt the risk was. One said he stayed there regularly and never had any problem, another said they were not taking the risk of a fine and were moving on later. We paid £6 for a 24-hour parking ticket and spent the day in town, planning to decide later on whether to stay. We would have liked to have stayed in town overnight, but also didn't want to risk a fine so I elected not to drink on our evening out and we moved on to Blue Bank for the night.
Having read the various contributions here, am I to assume that the 'no overnight sleeping' fine is not enforceable? Certainly several people seemed to be completely ignoring it. We noticed the similar signs near the on-street parking areas, but these did not mention a fine. None of the signs were at the pay machines, which I would have though they should be, along with any other conditions of use.

Can anyone advise what the legal position is, please?

Sandie
 
Sandie said:
I have just returned from Whitby and wish I had read this thread before going!
We spent two days at a paid site at Robin Hood's Bay and then moved to Whitby in the morning. There were several motorhomes parked in the long stay car park just along from the Co-op. Most were clearly overnighting - screens up, etc.. There was a sign in the car park stating 'No overnight sleeping or cooking - fine £100'. We asked two motorhomers what they felt the risk was. One said he stayed there regularly and never had any problem, another said they were not taking the risk of a fine and were moving on later. We paid £6 for a 24-hour parking ticket and spent the day in town, planning to decide later on whether to stay. We would have liked to have stayed in town overnight, but also didn't want to risk a fine so I elected not to drink on our evening out and we moved on to Blue Bank for the night.
Having read the various contributions here, am I to assume that the 'no overnight sleeping' fine is not enforceable? Certainly several people seemed to be completely ignoring it. We noticed the similar signs near the on-street parking areas, but these did not mention a fine. None of the signs were at the pay machines, which I would have though they should be, along with any other conditions of use.

Can anyone advise what the legal position is, please?

Sandie
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As the article in the WG suggests, there is no legal position, its not enforcable, so basically its there to deter people but obviously its not

Jen
 
As the article in the WG suggests, there is no legal position, its not enforcable, so basically its there to deter people but obviously its not
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...so basically, the local authority is knowing propagating false information, aka lying. Who would like to sponsor a court action to hold our servants to account?

I don't know about anyone else, but that is not what I pay my taxes for. I was going to add something about the ethical issues, but then remembered that the media and government politicians get away with untruths all the time.

And yet we continue to teach our children that lying is wrong, when our leaders show that it is perfectly acceptable.

Funny old world.




Cynical Polly (who has forgotten to take her medicine, this morning)
 
Car park / on street - do the same rules apply?

kimbowbill said:
As the article in the WG suggests, there is no legal position, its not enforcable, so basically its there to deter people but obviously its not

Jen
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Thanks Jen,
I have read the article, but it seems to refer to the on-street parking, not the car parks. I was wondering whether different rules apply, especially as in the car park a specific sum of money is quoted as a fine, which is not the case with the on-street signs.
Either way, I shall be checking back here carefully before I go again!

Sandie
 
Pollik said:
...so basically, the local authority is knowing propagating false information, aka lying. Who would like to sponsor a court action to hold our servants to account?

I don't know about anyone else, but that is not what I pay my taxes for. I was going to add something about the ethical issues, but then remembered that the media and government politicians get away with untruths all the time.

And yet we continue to teach our children that lying is wrong, when our leaders show that it is perfectly acceptable.

Funny old world.




Cynical Polly (who has forgotten to take her medicine, this morning)
Click to expand...

Yes.

We should be able to look at a local authority notice and know it is truthful but because we know some are lies, all are suspect.

Polly, don't start taking that medicine yet a while.
 
Sandie said:
I have just returned from Whitby and wish I had read this thread before going!
We spent two days at a paid site at Robin Hood's Bay and then moved to Whitby in the morning. There were several motorhomes parked in the long stay car park just along from the Co-op. Most were clearly overnighting - screens up, etc.. There was a sign in the car park stating 'No overnight sleeping or cooking - fine £100'. We asked two motorhomers what they felt the risk was. One said he stayed there regularly and never had any problem, another said they were not taking the risk of a fine and were moving on later. We paid £6 for a 24-hour parking ticket and spent the day in town, planning to decide later on whether to stay. We would have liked to have stayed in town overnight, but also didn't want to risk a fine so I elected not to drink on our evening out and we moved on to Blue Bank for the night.
Having read the various contributions here, am I to assume that the 'no overnight sleeping' fine is not enforceable? Certainly several people seemed to be completely ignoring it. We noticed the similar signs near the on-street parking areas, but these did not mention a fine. None of the signs were at the pay machines, which I would have though they should be, along with any other conditions of use.

Can anyone advise what the legal position is, please?

Sandie
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I'm wondering why they would offer a 24 hour parking ticket & not allow overnight camping? I'd like to see the council defend that one in court!
 
jurasik said:
I'm wondering why they would offer a 24 hour parking ticket & not allow overnight camping? I'd like to see the council defend that one in court!
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this is true, but, they also state no sleeping or cooking, who know's you are asleep or, if anyone knocks on your door after 12, dont answer it, and if you get a ticket you could say that you were in a tent on the cliffs, they have to proove you were in the van

Jen
 
Old_Arthur said:
if you go on line there are 2 more letters in this week slagging motorhomers, one is from a static van owner from the area and the other seems like a tourer caravan owner
Letters - Whitby Gazette
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why is nobody happy to live and let live, provided your not been a nuisance in any way, as i said earlier i think a lot is sour grapes. some people need to get a life.
 
yorkslass said:
why is nobody happy to live and let live, provided your not been a nuisance in any way, as i said earlier i think a lot is sour grapes. some people need to get a life.
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My wife also thinks that the world would be a better place if we were all nice to each other. The irony is that she made a (very good) living out of people being nasty to each other! But, seriously, I agree with you - although it would require major surgery to that thing called human nature.
 
In the past after various newsworthy unpleasantries, I've often thought if only people behaved like me the world would be a happier place. But then if there were lots of me around, I dare say they wouldn't all get along anyway - remember Rimmerworld on Red Dwarf?:lol-049:
 
groyne said:
Scarborough Borough Council have a lot to answer for in Whitby, it soon won't be worth visiting ( so motorhome parking won't be an issue).

Whitby Town Is Falling Down - Real Whitby | Whitby News | Real Whitby | Whitby News

After letting the East Pier fall into disrepair, they've now announced the closure of the West Pier due to it's poor condition. Funny how they found out about it's state "just" after the main holiday season. :confused:
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Thank you for sharing this information, all the more reason for SBC to encourage MH, its a disgrace that they've let this happen, the locals must be up in arms, but sadly this is happening everywhere, makes youwonder where all the money we contribute is going, well got a good idea hey ho

Jen xx
 
I think it is all a conspiracy between the local campsites and the local councils, its happening all over the place, the local council erects these illeage sings with no law to back them up, just to scare people into camping at the local campsites.

The council wins twice as they have less rubish to clear from these areas and benifit from the taxes the local campsites has to pay the council and the campsites get more business, a win win situation for all involved apart from us.

We get illeagaly moved from parking areas we leagaly are entitled to stop at over night.

I say we should boycot the areas that missuse there powers, then see how they like it, when they can't make a proffit at the end of the fiscal year.

Squibby.
 
How are they going to prove someone is sleeping in the vehicle? That evidence is impossible to collect. Just have the curtains closed and don't answer the door. You could be up reading, or on your laptop, or not even in the vehicle, they can't prove anything.

So long as you have paid your £6 24 hour ticket, I'm going to stick my neck out and say the no overnight sleeping part is impossible to prove and therefore unenforceable on those grounds alone, regardless of any other legal niceties ;)
 
Hi All

Good Thread enjoying so far.

two points

1) The Canterbury Park & Rides doesn't allow overnight parking, which makes it a bit questionable to it's worth:

http://www.canterbury.gov.uk/authority/assets/parking/parkandride leaflet 2010.pdf

2) The Counci / Land Owner has to have a Traffic Regulation Order (TRO) in place to issue a fixed penalty - It's a complicated legal area - but you can ring the Highways dept lof any Council and ask them if there is a TRO in place for a particular space / Area and what it is.

Most supermarkets will have signs up saying max 3hrs parking and may even try to fine some some people but without the TRO there is no legal basis.

Also the argument about a view - I have been told several times, you cannot buy the right to a view, you have to buy the land.
 
Firefox said:
How are they going to prove someone is sleeping in the vehicle? That evidence is impossible to collect. Just have the curtains closed and don't answer the door. You could be up reading, or on your laptop, or not even in the vehicle, they can't prove anything.

So long as you have paid your £6 24 hour ticket, I'm going to stick my neck out and say the no overnight sleeping part is impossible to prove and therefore unenforceable on those grounds alone, regardless of any other legal niceties ;)
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If someone knocks and you answer the door how can you be asleep?
 
kenjones said:
If someone knocks and you answer the door how can you be asleep?
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If you do answer it, obviously you aren't asleep, but they may collect evidence eg You are in your night clothes or the beds are made up in the van. They could also take a photograph. This is not beyond the bounds of possibility as they take photos of cars illegally parked to use as evidence, should it come to a dispute in court.
 
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