Fragle
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Either you’re fully trained in the filling of non refillable bottles in a controlled environment or you are part of the problem
Gas explosion??
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Fisherman
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Its the usual thought process I have done this many times, nothing has ever went wrong, and probably it never will.
I have read comments on here regarding the use of gas including its disposal, refilling, maintenance, and installation that I find alarming.
It’s not until you actually see what this stuff can do that you realise just how dangerous it is if not handled with extreme care.
Newbies come on here read this stuff and think these guys have been doing this for years they know their stuff, and follow suit.
And what is all this in aid of, saving a few quid.
If you want to refill gas cylinders use only cylinders designed for you to do so, and do so in the appropriate manner with the appropriate equipment, in the appropriate place. And when it comes time to replace underslung fitted tanks, or portable cylinders do so.
I have read comments on here regarding the use of gas including its disposal, refilling, maintenance, and installation that I find alarming.
It’s not until you actually see what this stuff can do that you realise just how dangerous it is if not handled with extreme care.
Newbies come on here read this stuff and think these guys have been doing this for years they know their stuff, and follow suit.
And what is all this in aid of, saving a few quid.
If you want to refill gas cylinders use only cylinders designed for you to do so, and do so in the appropriate manner with the appropriate equipment, in the appropriate place. And when it comes time to replace underslung fitted tanks, or portable cylinders do so.
Fisherman
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Remember the one were the guy stabbed himself to death after trying out his stab proof vest.
rugbyken
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sorry forgot the 1 in 180 my maths isn’t really that rubbish
rugbyken
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after you have established a base line ie weight of bottle you can then refill safely but if your just putting it in ad hoc to a bottle without the 80% cut off that i would regard as unsafe ,venting a bottle must of course be done in a safe manner but personally i would only ever fill a bottle without the cut off from empty, the main reason for refillable bottles is of course cost but ease of refill when abroad is also important
runnach
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My first safefill purchase is due for testing next year, I'll call then nearer the time to find out how I go about returning to them, cost to return, cost of test, cost to return back to me. Maybe cheaper buying a new one?
Over the years I have delivered a few Oxy-Acetylene safety courses, companies normally organise course due to an employee getting hurt, normally burnt to a degree. I handle lpg same as I did when using acetylene, I also carry a propitiatory spray tin of leak detector spray, when removing reg to top/fill up tank, reg back in place, I check for leaks around the reg and manifold in MH gas locker, I put this down to my OCD.
Over the years I have delivered a few Oxy-Acetylene safety courses, companies normally organise course due to an employee getting hurt, normally burnt to a degree. I handle lpg same as I did when using acetylene, I also carry a propitiatory spray tin of leak detector spray, when removing reg to top/fill up tank, reg back in place, I check for leaks around the reg and manifold in MH gas locker, I put this down to my OCD.
Fisherman
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180KG of gas is approx 360L at the current price of £0.79 a litre thats £284 not the £140 quoted unless you get your gas elsewhere for £0.39 a litre.
Or are you actually using 180 L a year not 180KG
Norfolk NewBoy
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I don't think that I'm either of those BUT I guess you may disagree.
My bottles were sold as "refillable" (can't recall the retailer but they were very popular; made from Kevlar and translucent so that you can see the liquid level. HOWEVER, NO 80% CUT OFF DEVICE!). Yes, I know the tare weight and I usually fill to 9l level, to allow a margin on the 10l "full" (12l capacity). I invariably fill up at my local HGV-capable garage, which fits underslung tanks and the pump is operated by a member of staff.
To my mind this is not significantly different to refilling Calor bottles, which I would never do (although my dad used to suspend a big bottle upside down from a tree and "pour" through rubber pipes into his smaller containers: NOT RECOMMENDING THIS IDEA!
)So far I have not needed to refill whilst abroad.
Gordon
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Just a thought, would it be required to earth the bottle being filled?
rugbyken
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yes apologies gordon i forgot about safefill bottles i used them once very handy having the window not just for filling but save quessing how much you have left , another great benefit of refillable is you can top up before starting a trip though my local gas dealer has introduced a minimum charge because of people only having 5-6 ltrs his tank is in a compound at the back takes min 20 mins for someone to stop work go unlock serve the gas etc
chas142
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Oh, I see that, I see they also had electricity licence revoked. All 2007/2010. Don't know why any of that happened. They say they only fill their cylinders, perhaps they filled other company owned cylinders. If Calor can fill bottles no reason why other companies can't fill their own bottles, as long as safe and only 80% fill.They have had their gas licenses revoked in the past. Perhaps they are heading for another revocation.
chas142
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I also have refillable Gaslow bottles. I point out that I was saying other gas companies should / can fill bottles other than the big few companies. Yes they should only fill to 80%, so not sure how Calor would do that, drain bottle or fill to correct weight or fluid amount. I have considered if it is safe for me to use a diy fill kit as I have propane at home. I am an engineer and have worked on fuel tankers, petrol & diesel. I decided diy fill wouldn't be suitable for me, mainly because of safety to me / others and possible none insurance cover incase of accident. Midland gas is a safer and midway cost between Gaslow and Calor.And this here my friends is the problem.
I don’t know midland gas but I’m assuming they are an accredited gas company and will have the specialist equipment required to fill a gas bottle to the correct amount no matter how much is in it to start.
Assuming they will use a diy fitting and it should be ok if they follow the rules. Really.
Unfamiliar with the correct filling is not an option.
I’ve spent over 20 years gas safe registered. I now have an ADR license as well and deliver LPG in an 18 t lorry to domestic and commercial for a major company.
Some people just don’t get it.
I think they think it’s all down to luck. It isn’t.
Due to the high levels of training. We are looking at situations you’ve never even thought about
In any day we can safely deliver 15000 litres to numerous locations. Efficiently and Safely all because of training following the procedure and the correct equipment. We also know what to do in the event of an emergency.
I have refillable bottles in my motorhome. And have never had a problem unfortunately I don’t think we will be using them for much longer because of people who think it should be ok if they follow the rules they have never seen with a diy bit of kit.
Think about it!
Any person filling a non refillable bottle needs to be hit with a minimum £5k fine for each regulation they have broken. I can assure you that you can never just break 1 regulation
Sorry for the rant but it needs to be said. Don’t mess with LPG it’s not just your life at risk.
As for gas safe engineer, just had one of them fit a Air Source Heat Pump, tried telling me I didn't need a radiator / system drain down valve downstairs as I had one upstairs. He wanted to get off to another, (private), job rather than finish the job he had been on all week, cutting corners.
chas142
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Very true, I have answered more of this elsewhere.