The camping and caravan clubs anti wild camping letter.

I have to say I fully agree with Meg (Biggarmac). Although I do a heck of a lot of “wildcamping” in Scotland I am fully aware that it is not covered by the so called “right to roam“ act and I make absolutely sure that I do nothing to p**s anybody off and behave as responsibly as I can at all times. I know that what I am doing is capable of challenge at any time and want to avoid giving motorhomers a bad reputation.
I think the main problem lies with a lot of folk believing that wild camping in a motorhome / campervan is allowed under the “right to roam”, whereas it is specifically excluded.
i also think that a Rob Ganley‘s response is correct, given his position as editor of a magazine, whether we like it or not.
By all means feel free to wildcamp up here but please behave responsibly in the knowledge that what you are doing is not necessarily 100% legal, so the less reason you give folks to complain the more likely you are not to be challenged.
 
People use the Words Right to roam and Wildcamping but it’s Reasonable Access we have over the countryside in Scotland.
 
The Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 (which came into force in 2005) gives everyone rights of access over land and inland water throughout Scotland, subject to specific exclusions set out in the Act and as long as they behave responsibly. These rights are sometimes referred to as 'freedom to roam’.
Specific exclusions include, among other things, “the use of a motorised vehicle”
 
Tonybvi said:
The Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003 (which came into force in 2005) gives everyone rights of access over land and inland water throughout Scotland, subject to specific exclusions set out in the Act and as long as they behave responsibly. These rights are sometimes referred to as 'freedom to roam’.
Specific exclusions include, among other things, “the use of a motorised vehicle”
Click to expand...

Toni with all due respect, this has already been brought up.
But Scott Currie and the CCC want you to use campsites, not doing what you are doing now. The vast majority of us are aware of the legal situation, and do exactly what you do yourself. That’s exactly why this letter made me angry. They are having a go at all of us, including your considerate self.
 
Last edited:
By staying in our vans overnight we are doing nothing illegal. The confusion arises when the right to roam legislation is mistakenly applied to motorhome use, motor vehicles being specifically excluded from that. If parking up for the night roadside in a layby or in a car park were illegal much of the haulage industry would struggle to operate. CCC like to give the impression that not using a campsite is illegal, which to my mind they should not.
 
The letter from Mr Currie was critizing an article in a previous magazine that he felt was praising "wildcamping". The response from the editor was with that in mind. It might be an idea to send in letters suggesting that we should be asking for more "aires" like the Harris trust ones. The more letters to the CCC the more likely we are to get our point of view accross. The CCC do encourage off grid camping with its Temporary holiday sites. (THSs).
 
Biggarmac said:
The letter from Mr Currie was critizing an article in a previous magazine that he felt was praising "wildcamping". The response from the editor was with that in mind. It might be an idea to send in letters suggesting that we should be asking for more "aires" like the Harris trust ones. The more letters to the CCC the more likely we are to get our point of view accross. The CCC do encourage off grid camping with its Temporary holiday sites. (THSs).
Click to expand...

Well hopefully I won’t be alone then.
These organisations have to wake up to the fact that thousands of their own members are wild campers. It’s not in their best interests to publish totally biased letters like this one. As I said before this is all about perceptions, and that letter creates the perception that we don’t care about where we visit, or the people who live there. Yes there will be a minority like that, but the vast majority of us are not as described in that letter.
 
As bill (2cv) rightly states there is confusion on here and within the CCC about the land reform act of 2003. This act was primarily designed for the benefit of those who use tents and wished to spend time on private land. An example of this would be the the west highland way from Bearsden to fort William. Many who do this walk carry their tents, or pay Travelite to transport their gear between stops.
The exemption within the act regarding motorised vehicles merely underlines this point. But there is confusion when those pitching tents have used cars to reach their destination.
But nowhere in the land reform act does it state that you cannot park overnight in any place where it is legal to do so. And that would include many places such as roadside parking in streets which could be an annoyance to locals, and should be avoided. Unless there is signage stating that you are not allowed to park at certain times you are free to park anywhere where it is legally permissible.
With regards to parking in Forestry Commission car parks, I can confirm from the horses mouth, that the same applies. Unless they have signage stating otherwise parking overnight on commission land is perfectly legal.

The land reform act did not in any way have any affect on our rights.
It did give more rights to those pitching tents on private land.
The right to park your vehicle where and when legally permissible to do so remained exactly the same after the act.
 
Last edited:
I’ve never understood the “ parking in front of somebody house” complaint. If you live on a road you have no rights whatsoever to stop anybody parking anywhere on it ( as long as it’s legally allowed) even if it spoils you view.
 
Snapster said:
I’ve never understood the “ parking in front of somebody house” complaint. If you live on a road you have no rights whatsoever to stop anybody parking anywhere on it ( as long as it’s legally allowed) even if it spoils you view.
Click to expand...

Snapster if we start parking in front of people’s homes guess what would happen. Signs would go up stopping us from doing so. But primarily it’s simply not on, and puts us in a bad light. Also in some new housing estates the owners cannot legally park Motorhomes or caravans, this is stated within their missives. Best that we try not to upset locals, it’s better for us all if we are not perceived as inconsiderate.
 
We have parked on the Sea Front on the South Coast where it's permitted. If the Council want to put barriers up to stop MHs parking then where do they expect us to park. Have a look at Hunstanton on a busy day in the summer. Lots of MHs parked along the road overlooking the sea with chairs out ( Its a bit like the Germans though you need to be there early ). Council has a massive car park that you have to pay for BUT height barriers. Houses all along the road. We have also parked in Sandbanks ( That POSH place ) gone for a meal at Rick Steins and stayed the night. We usually find the most expensive house and park outside. Pay the meter and leave in the morning.
 
This is a discussion that comes up regularly, and will continue to do so.

We are members of both clubs and like most use a mix of club campsites, private campsites and wild camping.

We don't wild camp to save money, we do so for the peace and quiet and isolation that it provides as we typically wild camp in remote/rural locations. We would never choose to set up camp under the direct view of any housing - why would either of us want to be looking at each other? Also if we arrive at an otherwise suitable location and see other vans there we pass straight by and look for somewhere else (miserable beggars, I know).

Now I know this next bit may be contentious but, doing pretty much all of our travelling in the Scottish Highlands we have noticed a huge rise, like really huge, in the presence of hired motorhomes. Whilst I know that some regular motor-homers may also be guilty, I do wonder if it is these hirers that form the main proportion of people parking inconsiderately, either because they know no better or because they just don't care "this holiday being a one off".

Finally, and off at something of a tangent. Being an island resident myself (Westray) I rather suspect that, in this respect, things got worse for Skye when they put in the bridge. The bother and cost of having to use a ferry to access an island weeds out the more casual visitor. I know that this has been the subject of much discussion here when there have been proposals to link the Orkney Isles to each other.
 
linkshouse said:
This is a discussion that comes up regularly, and will continue to do so.

We are members of both clubs and like most use a mix of club campsites, private campsites and wild camping.

We don't wild camp to save money, we do so for the peace and quiet and isolation that it provides as we typically wild camp in remote/rural locations. We would never choose to set up camp under the direct view of any housing - why would either of us want to be looking at each other? Also if we arrive at an otherwise suitable location and see other vans there we pass straight by and look for somewhere else (miserable beggars, I know).

Now I know this next bit may be contentious but, doing pretty much all of our travelling in the Scottish Highlands we have noticed a huge rise, like really huge, in the presence of hired motorhomes. Whilst I know that some regular motor-homers may also be guilty, I do wonder if it is these hirers that form the main proportion of people parking inconsiderately, either because they know no better or because they just don't care "this holiday being a one off".

Finally, and off at something of a tangent. Being an island resident myself (Westray) I rather suspect that, in this respect, things got worse for Skye when they put in the bridge. The bother and cost of having to use a ferry to access an island weeds out the more casual visitor. I know that this has been the subject of much discussion here when there have been proposals to link the Orkney Isles to each other.
Click to expand...

Not just putting in the bridge, but removing the tariffs.
But I applaud the snp for doing this.
But it has helped fuel the situation.
 
Just chatting to my other half about tis and she added that TV shows like the "Gordon, Gino and Fred Roadtrip", and "5 Celebrities go Motorhoming" which show them generally misbehaving and having a grand old time at everyone else's expense don't help.
 
Fisherman said:
Snapster if we start parking in front of people’s homes guess what would happen. Signs would go up stopping us from doing so. But primarily it’s simply not on, and puts us in a bad light. Also in some new housing estates the owners cannot legally park Motorhomes or caravans, this is stated within their missives. Best that we try not to upset locals, it’s better for us all if we are not perceived as inconsiderate.
Click to expand...

I agree and wouldn’t usually park in front if any bodies house deliberately if there was an alternative.
But, this and the emptying of waste / toilets etc, are excuses ( whether they are factual or not) used by people to try and enforce their will on others, usually by complaining to councils and newspapers which ends up with parking bans.
It’s this busybody attitude that causes restriction to be put in place, usually more than any problems caused the the people they are allegedly complaining about, and it’s this attitude that I am against.
If councils provided suitable alternative parking instead of just banning people, there would be few problems for these busybodies to complain about.
 
I think it is important to remember any letter of reply may be published to editorial scrutiny, by the same token Mr Curries letter will have gone through the same process so was the tone and content editorially manipulated prior to publication.

When letters start with not representing us, A phrase used often in this thread , I don’t remember appointing anyone to speak on my behalf , nor have I been consulted or had influence on the content ....

Readers may mistake my comments as negative but really aren’t .. John Thompson one of our own formed an organisation that was structured , purposeful knowing of the law .least of all stupid and it failed mainly down to people saying they would support but when it came to invest time / put money where the mouth is fell flat on its face.

Re the hire market , the one trip ponies who visit Scotland and unwittinhgly let the perception of wildcamping down , it was suggested a “ touring pack” distributed to hire dealers giving guidelines to those that wanted to experience life away from the sites....it was a great idea until it came to paying for it and became just another idea.

Until we have representation that is cohesive including financially little will change and explains perhaps my cynicism writing individual letters in the hope may be published but then what ? The two big clubs in essence are businesses and our proposition does little to enhance income streams.
 
Never understood the argument that if I park my bus in a carpark space, it stops the council making money. If I pay to park my bus in a space, WTF difference does it make to their coffers? Most times I'm charged a premium for being a commercial vehicle or some other excuse, so the actual revenue to them is more than the car I'm " stealing" the space from....
 
channa said:
I think it is important to remember any letter of reply may be published to editorial scrutiny, by the same token Mr Curries letter will have gone through the same process so was the tone and content editorially manipulated prior to publication.

When letters start with not representing us, A phrase used often in this thread , I don’t remember appointing anyone to speak on my behalf , nor have I been consulted or had influence on the content ....

Readers may mistake my comments as negative but really aren’t .. John Thompson one of our own formed an organisation that was structured , purposeful knowing of the law .least of all stupid and it failed mainly down to people saying they would support but when it came to invest time / put money where the mouth is fell flat on its face.

Re the hire market , the one trip ponies who visit Scotland and unwittinhgly let the perception of wildcamping down , it was suggested a “ touring pack” distributed to hire dealers giving guidelines to those that wanted to experience life away from the sites....it was a great idea until it came to paying for it and became just another idea.

Until we have representation that is cohesive including financially little will change and explains perhaps my cynicism writing individual letters in the hope may be published but then what ? The two big clubs in essence are businesses and our proposition does little to enhance income streams.
Click to expand...

My letter if it is published Andrew will merely be my views, I am not wishing to represent anyones opinions.
But I hope that I am not alone with my anger and frustration, and I hope others will do likewise.

Yes I agree the CCCC is a business, and many of its members are us.
Publishing a letter that is so biased does nothing for their business, other than to alienate part of their membership.
And that is never good business strategy.

Yes Andrew I would love to see a body who took care of our interests, I would even be willing to assist anyone with the knowledge and skills required to run such a body. But when some of our own side with councils, I wonder what's the point.

Most of us know that we are easy targets for councils, and that we are treated poorly, but I don't see that changing anytime soon.

When if ever we stop being treated like a problem, it seems the only problem, things will change.

So please anyone who wants to write to the CCC please do so, here's the email address I have been using.

The more letters the better.

Mailbag@campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:0)

Back
Top