Split Charge Relay - Battery to Battery chargers

[Timofei107]

I understand that newer engines, Euro 6 and Euro 5? have smart alternators which don’t work with the split-charge-relay method of charging leisure batteries. So does this mean that vans with these engines have battery to battery chargers?

I’ve looked at the manufacturers specs but they focus on things like colour coded cup holders, leather covered gear knobs, etc., not important things like size of batteries and how they are charged and if B2B what size it is (amps). Probably the smallest possible given that when a solar panel is fitted it tends to be 100W when the roof could accommodate more at very little additional cost!

BTW I have 1000 watts of solar on my Crafter roof. In summer I can get 700 watts going into the Ecoflow. In Winter, rarely above 300 so doesn't really keep up. Also a big down side with those Ecoflow's in the winter is you can't turn them off when solar attached, so Dec/Jan/Feb I unplug the solar as if I don't the Ecoflow's internal systems drain after about a week. And that's with also an Ecoflow extra Delta 2 Max battery attached. Wish I could find a way around this. If anyone knows, let me know.

 

[QFour]

BTW I have 1000 watts of solar on my Crafter roof. In summer I can get 700 watts going into the Ecoflow. In Winter, rarely above 300 so doesn't really keep up. Also a big down side with those Ecoflow's in the winter is you can't turn them off when solar attached, so Dec/Jan/Feb I unplug the solar as if I don't the Ecoflow's internal systems drain after about a week. And that's with also an Ecoflow extra Delta 2 Max battery attached. Wish I could find a way around this. If anyone knows, let me know.

Simpler just to have a lithium battery and an inverter that you can switch on and off. Our Carthago has a Smart Alternator and a Schaudt B2B charger fitted. I also swapped out the 80Ah battery and fitted a KS Energy version. 360w of solar on the roof.

About the only thing you can do with your unit is take it to bits and fit a switch to turn the inverter part of the unit off. All inverters do the same thing. Use power even when not being used. I was playing with an Arduino the other day trying to reduce the power consumption to work off a battery. The small 9v to 3.3v power converter actually uses 900uA just doing nothing. When you only have a 4Ah 9v battery its a lot.

We have a simple 600w 1200w peak inverter. Its enough for what we want. Any bigger and they just consume more power when not being used. Remote switch stops any waste of power.

Cannot understand why people need so much power. We certainly dont

 

[wildebus]

Simpler just to have a lithium battery and an inverter that you can switch on and off. Our Carthago has a Smart Alternator and a Schaudt B2B charger fitted. I also swapped out the 80Ah battery and fitted a KS Energy version. 360w of solar on the roof.

About the only thing you can do with your unit is take it to bits and fit a switch to turn the inverter part of the unit off. All inverters do the same thing. Use power even when not being used. I was playing with an Arduino the other day trying to reduce the power consumption to work off a battery. The small 9v to 3.3v power converter actually uses 900uA just doing nothing. When you only have a 4Ah 9v battery its a lot.

We have a simple 600w 1200w peak inverter. Its enough for what we want. Any bigger and they just consume more power when not being used. Remote switch stops any waste of power.

Cannot understand why people need so much power. We certainly dont

Getting into technicalities now but as you mention Aruinos and Power Saving methods and Inverters, this might be of interest ....
I have a Victron Cerbo setup and I use that to control a relay that sends AC power to the Fridge when it rises to a set temp and remove power when it hits another (lower) temp. I could also use a similar routine to turn the actual inverter off when it is not needed so there is no power used by it. I don't do that because in standby mode it only uses 2W anyway and I want the inverter available for other purposes anyway.

You can do similar things without a Victron Setup by various methods involving external relays and standalone temp sensors if you wanted.

I don't know the details about the Ecoflow mentioned, but don't quite understand the comment about the solar - if we are talking about wintertime, the solar will be 'dead' for most of a full day so would the Ecoflow not go off if no demand and no solar anyway? or is there no sleep mode so if it wakes up it can only be manually turned off? I'd be inclined to carefully read the manual to check all the details.

 

[QFour]

Getting into technicalities now but as you mention Aruinos and Power Saving methods and Inverters, this might be of interest ....
I have a Victron Cerbo setup and I use that to control a relay that sends AC power to the Fridge when it rises to a set temp and remove power when it hits another (lower) temp. I could also use a similar routine to turn the actual inverter off when it is not needed so there is no power used by it. I don't do that because in standby mode it only uses 2W anyway and I want the inverter available for other purposes anyway.

You can do similar things without a Victron Setup by various methods involving external relays and standalone temp sensors if you wanted.

I don't know the details about the Ecoflow mentioned, but don't quite understand the comment about the solar - if we are talking about wintertime, the solar will be 'dead' for most of a full day so would the Ecoflow not go off if no demand and no solar anyway? or is there no sleep mode so if it wakes up it can only be manually turned off? I'd be inclined to carefully read the manual to check all the details.

I got the impression from @Timofei107 that the Ecoflow unit when connected to solar panels runs itself down. So is it the solar connection that keeps it thinking it should be on. Personally I wouldnt bother with anything like that. Its simple enough to have Lithium Battery, Solar, Charger, Panels and an Inverter. Anything goes wrong you just fix the bit thats faulty.

 

[wildebus]

I got the impression from @Timofei107 that the Ecoflow unit when connected to solar panels runs itself down. So is it the solar connection that keeps it thinking it should be on. Personally I wouldnt bother with anything like that. Its simple enough to have Lithium Battery, Solar, Charger, Panels and an Inverter. Anything goes wrong you just fix the bit thats faulty.

that is how I read it - but in winter the solar will be dead for well over half the day, so should have no impact? sounds to me like a bug that needs fixing.

 

[QFour]

that is how I read it - but in winter the solar will be dead for well over half the day, so should have no impact? sounds to me like a bug that needs fixing.

Well that didnt take long its a known fault with the solar plugged in. The solar is fed straight into the Ecoflow unit and that acts as the solar controller. Perhaps the answer is a seperate solar controller and feed the Ecoflow with 12v to charger it up. The solar controller won't let the Ecoflow discharge. As I said in previous post Lithium Battery, Solar Controller, Solar Panels and an Inverter. Sorted and not much difference in price.

 

[Nabsim]

Well that didnt take long its a known fault with the solar plugged in. The solar is fed straight into the Ecoflow unit and that acts as the solar controller. Perhaps the answer is a seperate solar controller and feed the Ecoflow with 12v to charger it up. The solar controller won't let the Ecoflow discharge. As I said in previous post Lithium Battery, Solar Controller, Solar Panels and an Inverter. Sorted and not much difference in price.

The prices aren’t even close, the cheapest Delta 2 is £899

Buying separate:
400W solar panel, Victron 100/30 mppt, 100Ah Lifepo4 battery and 1500W pure sine wave inverter for £699.20. Yes you need cables connectors and gland but that’s nowhere near £200 and you have a better fixed system

 

[Okta]

that is how I read it - but in winter the solar will be dead for well over half the day, so should have no impact? sounds to me like a bug that needs fixing.

Is it any different from a solar panel, battery and separate controller. I have a 100W portable panel which I leave connected to my engine battery to keep up with the tracker, alarm and ecu demands when the van is in storage. As soon as I connect the controller to the battery 2 lights come on which suggests there is electronic activity in the controller whether or not the panel is producing any power.

 

[wildebus]

Is it any different from a solar panel, battery and separate controller. I have a 100W portable panel which I leave connected to my engine battery to keep up with the tracker, alarm and ecu demands when the van is in storage. As soon as I connect the controller to the battery 2 lights come on which suggests there is electronic activity in the controller whether or not the panel is producing any power.

Is it different? Course it is
In your case, you are powering the controller from the battery obviously. That is why there is electronic activity.
In your case the controller does what it does despite a panel being connected or not I think you would find.

If the panel was not connected to the eco flow, it does not drain. If the panel is connected to the eco flow and its built in controller but is providing no power, it drains despite the panel doing nothing.

 

[Okta]

Is it different? Course it is
In your case, you are powering the controller from the battery obviously. That is why there is electronic activity.
In your case the controller does what it does despite a panel being connected or not I think you would find.

If the panel was not connected to the eco flow, it does not drain. If the panel is connected to the eco flow and its built in controller but is providing no power, it drains despite the panel doing nothing.

That is what I meant by questioning if there was a difference. If you have a solar controller connected to a fixed battery or a panel to an Ecoflow there will be a small net drain when there is no solar power coming from the panel.

 

[Woodology]

I understand that newer engines, Euro 6 and Euro 5? have smart alternators which don’t work with the split-charge-relay method of charging leisure batteries. So does this mean that vans with these engines have battery to battery chargers?

I’ve looked at the manufacturers specs but they focus on things like colour coded cup holders, leather covered gear knobs, etc., not important things like size of batteries and how they are charged and if B2B what size it is (amps). Probably the smallest possible given that when a solar panel is fitted it tends to be 100W when the roof could accommodate more at very little additional cost!

I used a CTEK 250SE smart charger (about £250-£300) which works with smart alternator. Has a terminal to connect solar/turbine charging too - works fine

I understand that newer engines, Euro 6 and Euro 5? have smart alternators which don’t work with the split-charge-relay method of charging leisure batteries. So does this mean that vans with these engines have battery to battery chargers?

I’ve looked at the manufacturers specs but they focus on things like colour coded cup holders, leather covered gear knobs, etc., not important things like size of batteries and how they are charged and if B2B what size it is (amps). Probably the smallest possible given that when a solar panel is fitted it tends to be 100W when the roof could accommodate more at very little additional cost!

I used a CTEK 250SE smart charger (about £250-£300) which works with smart alternators. Has a terminals to connect solar/turbine charging as well as leisure battery too - works fine

 

[Nabsim]

These Chinese aren’t always as clever as folks think lol