Securing the Scooter to the rear rack

[Siimplyloco]

It appears I missed your pic of the bowed bar you are in the process of manufacturing but I meant well

Good luck

Ian

No problem: we are of the same mind!
John

 

[Siimplyloco]

John, you have let me down, I would have thought a man of your caliber would have sussed out the easy, alternative engineering route to the conundrum. No machining, no added weight.

Have Mrs John sit on scooter, one hand holding onto rear ladder to secure. The other benefit is, you don't get earache with Mrs John secured to rear of motorhome!!

Hmmmmmmmm, I should look at getting a scooter ....:raofl:

Mrs John wouldn't like me to tell you about the added weight on the back if we adopted your solution! And who would argue with the TomTom?
John

 

[Tezza33]

Have Mrs John sit on scooter, one hand holding onto rear ladder to secure. The other benefit is, you don't get earache with Mrs John secured to rear of motorhome!!

Hmmmmmmmm, I should look at getting a scooter ....:raofl:

If Maggy was sat on the back I would still hear her, far better to sit her on the scooter then leave the scooter at home

I think it is looking good John and like most alterations to somebody else's original fabrication it will be a work in practice, it is far better to be over engineered at home than fail in the middle of nowhere so I think your choice of materials is spot on

 

[Siimplyloco]

A Trial Run with a bendy scooter on the back

Full load dummy run to Hamble Point, had a picnic of 7up and a KitKat! I was looking at the scooter through the camera and it was moving about a bit. When we got there I found a Vespa version of the Leaning Tower of Pisa on the back!



The rack flexes more than I expected, and you can see the deflection here: not acceptable so a fix is required!



Quick fix with two solid alloy blocks bolted inside the end pieces, nicely nudged under the frame. It doesn't flexx any more and I can breath easier.....



Roll on Tuesday!
John

 

[Siimplyloco]

I would look at fabbing up a "U" which then slides under A-frame device bolted to MH, alloy will wear in no time, unfortunately.

When I had my moto-x bike, I knocked up my own trailer, I used angle iron, with exhaust clamps, which then clamped to handlebars, don't know if you will have room for similar?

Cheers........

Thanks, I might just look at the strut approach for the handlebars. The alloy blocks are not in a wearing mode, they are just anti-deflection blocks so hopefully will not wear - much....
John

 

[barryd]

I am suprised the bike moved around when travelling as it is pretty much what we have. As long as that bar is tight down over the seat and you have the front wheel ratchet strapped into the end of the rack it should not move. Are you sure it wasnt the rack that was moving? The big difference between mine and yours is how the rack is secured. Ours goes into the chassis at a much wider entry point than yours which makes it very stable.

I am sure with your incredible technical skills though that you wll fettle it!

 

[Siimplyloco]

I am suprised the bike moved around when travelling as it is pretty much what we have. As long as that bar is tight down over the seat and you have the front wheel ratchet strapped into the end of the rack it should not move. Are you sure it wasnt the rack that was moving? The big difference between mine and yours is how the rack is secured. Ours goes into the chassis at a much wider entry point than yours which makes it very stable.

I am sure with your incredible technical skills though that you will fettle it!

You are quite right: it was the rack that was moving, not the scooter. The 40mm square bar is strong enough to take the weight, but it flexes torsionally, so I've just put some anti-deflection blocks in to stop that. It will be OK!
John

 

[barryd]

Thought so. Its well strapped down. A work of art. When your happy with it you should start flogging them! Ill be your agent.

 

[Siimplyloco]

All packed up ready for the off tomorrow. 11.00 BF from Portsmouth. As you can see, it's all horizontal now! Signing off shortly as we have to return the wifi kit to Virgin....

 

[Tezza33]

It is looking a lot better, have a good trip and try not to worry about us lot :wave:

 

[Covey]

I assume you have taken the precaution of putting your MH over a weighbridge with the scooter on board and all the other bits you will be travelling with.

My Hymer S700 has a payload of 2000kgs which sounds great! But then I have to deduct the weight of all the Big Boys Toys on the roof (Sat TV, aircon, solar panels, fill up the tanks, add two bodies, luggage and a bottle or two of Bombay Sapphire!!!

My Hymer, being based on a Merc Sprinter Twin Wheel has a long overhang behind the twin rear wheels. Add the extra length added by the scooter rack and your scooter weight multiplies because of the leverage effect.

I had a scooter rack on the Beast when I bought it, but got rid of it because I was concerned that there was a hell of a lot of weight outboard of the hitch plate and the scooter and rack were supported by just two bolts. A towing hitch supports downward force, whereas your scooter rack has a much greater and possibly dangerous force line.

 

[Tezza33]

I assume you have taken the precaution of putting your MH over a weighbridge with the scooter on board and all the other bits you will be travelling with.

My Hymer S700 has a payload of 2000kgs which sounds great! But then I have to deduct the weight of all the Big Boys Toys on the roof (Sat TV, aircon, solar panels, fill up the tanks, add two bodies, luggage and a bottle or two of Bombay Sapphire!!!

My Hymer, being based on a Merc Sprinter Twin Wheel has a long overhang behind the twin rear wheels. Add the extra length added by the scooter rack and your scooter weight multiplies because of the leverage effect.

I had a scooter rack on the Beast when I bought it, but got rid of it because I was concerned that there was a hell of a lot of weight outboard of the hitch plate and the scooter and rack were supported by just two bolts. A towing hitch supports downward force, whereas your scooter rack has a much greater and possibly dangerous force line.

And yet there are so many who do it without problems, I have a bike rack that fits on the rear wall that will safely carry 75kg, if it is rated at 75kg it would have been tested at more than double that to receive that rating, I cannot see a scooter rack on the back of that MH being any where near the limit

 

[Tow Itch]

I'm not too bothered about the weight and the rear axle that can be measured and I'd hope you knew what you had spare.
I know I over engineer everything I build but I don't like a H bracket bolted through the centre crossbar where the centre of mass acts through a point 9" to 12" further on and the uprights that have that torque applied through them are only 2" or 3" long. I can see how the blocks are acting but I'd cut the sliding bars as short as possible. to reduce the moment that the mass acts through then I'd get the ends into u under the steel extension.
I've got a real downer about this. The 2 fore and aft bolts that mount the frame. Are they as per normal separation on tow bars? I can see quite large forces in the left/right plain too. Forces I don't see with a trailer. The bike is lighter than a trailer but the centre of mass is 9" to 12" behind the bolts and (as a scooter) 12" above and 18" to the side of those bolts. Go over pot holes on one side and I don't like the twist in this plane.

I hope I'm mythering pointlessly and some proper engineer can set your mind at rest.

I only came on here to be really anal and suggest you remove the triangles from the trailer board (you're not towing) I don't have the correct distances from the edge of the vehicle for the lights but the trailer figures are here. Trailer Maintenance - Trailer Lights & Regulations a wider board required if the vehicle lights can't be seen.

After all that. Have a cracking time.

 

[Covey]

I'm not too bothered about the weight and the rear axle that can be measured and I'd hope you knew what you had spare.
.

Weight is something which can catch you out very easily and if you get caught with a vehicle exceeding the plated weights, it can prove very expensive.

I saw a couple with a brand new MH on a UK site. They were very pleased with their purchase but when I asked what the payload was, they did not know cos they did not really understand the "weight business". They were somewhat surprised to discover that their vehicle had a payload of 460kgs which had to cover the weight of the two people, fuel, the dog, water, the microwave they had installed, the chairs and picnic table, food, drink etc etc etc.

The problem I had with my scooter rack was that although The Beast had a full Merc tow bar fitted, the actual scooter rack, and whatever it is carrying, was secured to a plate attached to the tow bar by two bolts. They were the same bolts that would attach a towing ball if the scooter rack was removed. A towing ball/hitch is designed to work with the downward force of the hitch weight and the pulling force of the weight you are pulling. The scooter rack was bolted to the plate by two bolts BUT the forces acting on those bolts were up to a metre from the bolts and again the distance from the plate leverages the forces working on the bolts.

I bought a Thule bike rack that just clamps on to the towing ball. God knows how it does it, but it works!!! For the first few days I was out on the road with it I kept the rear view camera on all the time "just in case".

 

[Tow Itch]

Covey I agree with everything you say but as regards weight assumed that John has more going on upstairs.

How somebody buys a vehicle that is intended as habitation for 4 or more with barely 1/2 tonne of spare loading is beyond me.

That bracket work does give me the willies.