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maureenandtom
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Really John?
Are you sure this has any relevance?
Section 6: Powers to stop or direct traffic
29.Section 6 provides for traffic officers to have similar powers to those held by the police under the Road Traffic Act 1988 (“RTA”) to require vehicles, cyclists and pedestrians to stop and to require vehicles and cyclists to proceed in a particular direction.
Or did you think I wouldn't be bothered to look?
maureenandtom
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Ah right. Attack the poster. Means you can't attack the post? You are able to provide proof that a fellow poster is a hypocritical, double standards, thieving lawbreaker, are you? Please provide it.
Tbear
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Are we taking this a bit far. It seems to be a mad moment of rebellion against what could well have been a bit of totally unfair bureaucracy. No ******. No vadalism(Bracket left in place).No pain or suffering, just a small theft for no personal gain except a bit of personal satisfaction. MichaelU said that he was "Shocked at his action". Therefore he was in no way saying it wto take as the corrrect action to take or encourageing others to take similar action. He also had the courage to own up to it and take the flack.
JohnH
Yes I do complain about about local Gangmasters Keep ILLEGAL ******, 8 to a room and more that 30 to a terrraced house. Paying them less than minimum wages. This happened locally and was reported in the nation press. I fail to see the comparrison.
Richard
JohnH
Yes I do complain about about local Gangmasters Keep ILLEGAL ******, 8 to a room and more that 30 to a terrraced house. Paying them less than minimum wages. This happened locally and was reported in the nation press. I fail to see the comparrison.
Richard
Higgy
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Loose Lips Sinks Ships comes to mind.
I am not in favour of all these new "No Overnight" parking signs
cropping up everywhere neither do I like the height barriers.
It seems that more and more places are becoming no go areas for
the Camper Van fraternity - Car Parks: Supermarkets; Towns and Cities
and a host of others.
We were out by the coast at the weekend and could not park where the
rest of the cars were due to a Height Barrier. We had to trundle down a bit
and park on a muddy bit where there was a burnt out motor and two piles
of windsceen glass. from the aftermath of a motor vehicle crime (possibly)
Had our original poster been from a specific Ethnic Group that likes Wild Camping
the said "No Overnight" parking sign would have been totally ignored by the
driver and family.
Should any Law Enforcer be it council or Police come upon or be sent to
the illegal parking it would quickly be put into the 'Too Hard To Do Box'.
Court Orders - not worth it
Fixed Penalty Tickets - would not get paid
But if the same Law Enforcers came upon the sole MH user then get ready
for a FP Ticket unless you agree to move on.
Things might have changed in the 10 years I have been finished with the
Police but I doubt it.
I think in retrospect if anyone else feels they must remove these signs then
do so without the need to tell the Forum.
In essence it is illegal and may get the Forum some unwanted attention and
people looking in from the outside see us cheering on the poster.
The more people that know about a crime the easier it is to detect.
Why not take pictures of these signs and somehow check to see
if they are legit. Then we complain to the authorities.
I hope you do not think I am on my Soap Box - Fairness should be
for all vehicle users, Motorhomes included.
Higgy, soon to move to NZ, fingers crossed.
I am not in favour of all these new "No Overnight" parking signs
cropping up everywhere neither do I like the height barriers.
It seems that more and more places are becoming no go areas for
the Camper Van fraternity - Car Parks: Supermarkets; Towns and Cities
and a host of others.
We were out by the coast at the weekend and could not park where the
rest of the cars were due to a Height Barrier. We had to trundle down a bit
and park on a muddy bit where there was a burnt out motor and two piles
of windsceen glass. from the aftermath of a motor vehicle crime (possibly)
Had our original poster been from a specific Ethnic Group that likes Wild Camping
the said "No Overnight" parking sign would have been totally ignored by the
driver and family.
Should any Law Enforcer be it council or Police come upon or be sent to
the illegal parking it would quickly be put into the 'Too Hard To Do Box'.
Court Orders - not worth it
Fixed Penalty Tickets - would not get paid
But if the same Law Enforcers came upon the sole MH user then get ready
for a FP Ticket unless you agree to move on.
Things might have changed in the 10 years I have been finished with the
Police but I doubt it.
I think in retrospect if anyone else feels they must remove these signs then
do so without the need to tell the Forum.
In essence it is illegal and may get the Forum some unwanted attention and
people looking in from the outside see us cheering on the poster.
The more people that know about a crime the easier it is to detect.
Why not take pictures of these signs and somehow check to see
if they are legit. Then we complain to the authorities.
I hope you do not think I am on my Soap Box - Fairness should be
for all vehicle users, Motorhomes included.
Higgy, soon to move to NZ, fingers crossed.
AndyC
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John, you are right that a land owner needs a site licence and planning permission in order to permit a caravan/motorhome to be occupied for the purpose of human habitation on his land. However it seems to me that the offence would only be committed by the land owner if he permitted an overnight stay. No offence under the 1960 Act would be committed by the person staying with their caravan or motorhome, or by the land owner if he hadn't permitted the overnight stay.
The caravan/motorhome owner might be guilty of trespass, but that is a civil matter and the only option the land owner has in that case would be to sue for any damage caused.
There is the Criminal Justice & Public Order Act which does give the police powers to act if sufficient number of people and vehicles are involved.
There may also be local by-laws in place prohibiting, for example, sleeping in vehicles at a certain location. In that case a penalty notice for the contravention could be issued.
AndyC
bigpieeater
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When did you say you were leaving the country??
BecksP
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Tbear
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So John Thompson and AndyC
1/ What if my brother parks his motorhome on my land and sleeps in it. Am I breaking the law
2/ What if my friend parks his motorhome on my land and sleeps in it. Am I breaking the law
3/ If I pull over and have a sleep in a layby because I'm tired. Is there an offence.
4/ If you spend a night in a pub carpark with the permission of the landlord is there an offence.
Richard
1/ What if my brother parks his motorhome on my land and sleeps in it. Am I breaking the law
2/ What if my friend parks his motorhome on my land and sleeps in it. Am I breaking the law
3/ If I pull over and have a sleep in a layby because I'm tired. Is there an offence.
4/ If you spend a night in a pub carpark with the permission of the landlord is there an offence.
Richard
Deleted member 775
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i have no probs with the removal of the sighn ,if that is what you want to do then that is wat you must do .but i would prefer to ignore the sighn as i normaly do anyway.the thing is if we belive that the sighn has been put there with no real standing in law then wouldent it be easier to defend our rights in court for parking than have to start and defend a theft and criminal dammage case then hope to win a lesser charge of ilegal parking ,if that parking can be proven to be ilegal in the first place
AndyC
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Coolasluck
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I have just fleshed out the PM's "Big Society" concept and made my first positive contribution.
I ignored the unnecessary bureaucratic contribution to the posting of a "No overnight parking" sign in favour of a more uplifting and reinvigorating future for us all. I parked overnight and ignored it.
The following morning I took out an adjustable spanner and removed the sign from the post, it only took 30 seconds, if I had taken my tin snips I could have cut the belt tie in 3 seconds.
Shocked at my action (I am 62 by the way), I took the large aluminium sign and recycled it at a nearby car park in the aluminium recycling bin.
This way I have helped myself and others like myself as well as contributing much needed materials to the far more important need of the planet to recycle scarce resources and save earth.
I feel great
I suggest you try it too.
Good on you my freind i wonder if we got enough of these signs what the recycled material would make us,with todays scrap value.
You know what i am going to join you,power to the people i say from now on im taking my tin snips and spanners with me,no signs no problems.Up the revolution
We spend to much time worrying about the law and the police but what we forget is that there is no law and order in this country ask the many thousands of filth who have brocken the law and been to court 20 or 30 times it dont seem to bother them in their endless conveyor belt criminal ways.
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Deleted member 3011
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Gosh Tony,
You're a bit of a **** on the QT aren't you.
Not sure if I am or not without you coming out and interpreting what you had in mind by ****.
Someone else claimed -
Certainly some very interesting moral gymnastics by some trying to justify an illegal act. Where is the line drawn? Shoplifting up to a hundred quid becomes OK does it? How about a slashed tyre or two, or maybe a couple of wing mirrors ripped off.
I guess in this case the cost of the sign plus labour to replace it would be considerably higher than what would cause most people to call the police if they suffered an equivalent loss.
If the OP had any guts at all, he/she would have marched into the local council office with the sign in hand and told them what had been done and why.
The old "If you can't beat them, join them" argument
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Deleted member 967
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Hi Andy
I was replying to Dave's post that said that these signs were taking away his right to overnight where he wanted. I was simply pointing out that he did not have a right to park anyway, without permission.
John
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Deleted member 967
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Hi Richard
1. 2. Not necessarily.
WHERE A SITE LICENCE IS NOT REQUIRED
Use within curtilage of a dwellinghouse
1. A site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a
caravan site if the use is incidental to the enjoyment as such of a
dwellinghouse within the curtilage of which the land is situated.
4 could be OK provided that only one Motorhome caravan is involved and it is for no more than two nights and the total number of nights in a year does not exceed 28.
Use by a person travelling with a caravan for one or two nights
2. Subject to the provisions of paragraph 13 of this Schedule, a
site licence shall not be required for the use of land as a caravan
site by a person travelling with a caravan who brings the caravan
on to the land for a period which includes not more than two nights—
(a) during that period no other caravan is stationed for the
purposes of human habitation on that land or any adjoining
land in the same occupation,and
(b) if, in the period of twelve months ending with the day on
which the caravan is brought on to the land, the number
of days on which a caravan was stationed anywhere on that
land or the said adjoining land for the purposes of human
habitation did not exceed twenty-eight.
In all of the above it would not be the person in the caravan/Motorhome that is breaking the law. It would be the owner of the land.
3.
There is no problem in taking a rest in a lay by. No one would suggest that a driver should proceed if they feel that their driving is impaired by tiredness.
The question must be asked, is there not somewhere that would be more suitable near by? We all use laybys for a quick break including having a snack or having a short rest break. Where problems arise are prolonged stays.
Parking in a lay by is controlled by other regulations. If the road has a speed limit of more than 30mph, then the vehicle lights must be displayed after dark.
If the parking causes an obstruction then the police can take action.
John
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Tbear
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Hi Tony Lee
Just me trying to get thing into perspective when the tempers where getting, in my opinion a bit over heated. If you read the post you will see that neither myself nor the OP made any attempt to Justify the theft but to classify it as a minor crime.
When you cannot be bothered to look to see who you are quoting, to accuse the OP of being gutless for not marching into council office with said sign, which could have taken up many hours of his time is a bit rich.
May I ask what you have done to improve the parking for motorhomes
Someone else AKA Richard
Tbear
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bigpieeater
Guest
OH Higgy.
Watch out, you voiced an opinion about our ethnic neighbours, a subject that will open the flood gates to those on here with their head stuck in the sand, they don't agree that we have any problems with them.
However, I am with you on that.
carsan
Guest
Well done Michael all the more reason for having an adjustable and a pair of snips as part of the tool kit. I feel that the aluminium recycle industry is going to improve.
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