Comments,Idea's Welcome

Smaug said:
I was interested to note recently that a family had some members die recently after taking a Barbie into a tent for warmth. Now, I would expect a tent, even with a built-in ground sheet to have adequate ventilation, however I suspect that closing the Barbie lid (to reduce risk of fire) would create the conditions for low oxygen burn & CO production. I don't know if that is what happened, just trying to think about situations where CO could have been produced.
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Lid or not, if they were using charcoal the centre of a lump is not getting the correct amount of oxygen to combust properly so Co will be produced in quite copious quantity.

800 ppm of co = 50 % saturation in the blood stream and fatality is possible within 2-3 hours.

Remember also that with flueless lpg appliances strict regulations are based upon correct use of an appliance, I cant see many people using a hob cooking for 2 to 3 hours. Unlike an LPG/ Ethanol fire.

I worked for someone last year who had lost a colleague from CO poisioning in a caravan with a carver room sealed appliance with extraction to the underneath of the caravan.

As you would expect, HSE were involved, and didnt find any fault with the appliance there was snow on the ground, and the possible conclusion was the flue had become blocked possibly by an animal snuggling up for warmth.

Channa
 
channa said:
(snip)
As you would expect, HSE were involved, and didnt find any fault with the appliance there was snow on the ground, and the possible conclusion was the flue had become blocked possibly by an animal snuggling up for warmth.

Channa
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Hhhmm, that's interesting, I wouldn't have thought of that.

Mind you, I know they say externally flued heaters are "safe", but I have never had the temerity to leave one on all night while sleeping (uses too much gas anyway!). I love a heater last thing for undressing & to go to bed warm & first thing for getting up, but I simply wouldn't leave one on all night. Now I have another reason to persuade Mrs Smaug that it may not be a good idea.
 
Had a check through the thread and don't THINK this has been questioned (forgive poor attention span if it has) but will this setup emit heat as efficiently as the gas canister version you showed us before? I.E. Is half the heat going inside the cubicle and could it damage the wood surround in time?
Only asking this because setup looks too GOOD to be true. If its a goer, then bring it on.
 
Smaug said:
I was interested to note recently that a family had some members die recently after taking a Barbie into a tent for warmth. Now, I would expect a tent, even with a built-in ground sheet to have adequate ventilation, however I suspect that closing the Barbie lid (to reduce risk of fire) would create the conditions for low oxygen burn & CO production. I don't know if that is what happened, just trying to think about situations where CO could have been produced.
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Modern lightweight tents with sewn in groundsheets are pretty airtight when zipped up for the night, that's why they suffer so much from condensation.
 
Smaug said:
Hhhmm, that's interesting, I wouldn't have thought of that.

Mind you, I know they say externally flued heaters are "safe", but I have never had the temerity to leave one on all night while sleeping (uses too much gas anyway!). I love a heater last thing for undressing & to go to bed warm & first thing for getting up, but I simply wouldn't leave one on all night. Now I have another reason to persuade Mrs Smaug that it may not be a good idea.
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I must admit I wouldnt either, On trumatics, the seal from the fire to the flue should be replaced everytime the fire is removed, to form a seal it melts with residual heat, The reason of course is to prevent unburnt combustants into the habitation area.I.e CO

I have refrained on the potential safety issue regarding Flyboys invention, on the basis we are all self accountable and like crossing the road there is an evaluation of risk.

However to make an accurate evaluation of risk requires knowledge.

I suspect, that if I were to do an elf and safety check on a lot of the self builds, and sorry a gap in the door is not ventilation, Nor leaving a window open, in the regulation sense and thats before adequate securing of piping, correct sizing for the appliances etc very few would get a "clean" ticket. Not everyone , but a lot of people seem to go a bit gung ho and dont know good practise to start with .

2010 I took delivery of 5 statics built by Trigano brand new ( big player) all 5 I condemned on gas testing, In windy conditions, the flue design from the water heater allowed fumes to back draught in the habitation area, visually you couldnt see the extraction process adequately and the design allowed leaves and other detrius to block the upper ventilation.

Has it happened a 25 minute modification on each van cured the "risk "

I could be seen as a Jobsworth or stringent in ensuring the vans were compliant with the current regulations, I actually dont care.

What I did and do care about, is I couldnt forgive myself if I had passed a van , missed something and someone died.

That said, risk evaluation and the consequences are in our world surely like re filling gas bottles down to personal accountibility and acceptance of the risk.

Channa
 
Kainene said:
Modern lightweight tents with sewn in groundsheets are pretty airtight when zipped up for the night, that's why they suffer so much from condensation.
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Yes, it's also why they have built in vents & there are gaps left unsewn around the ends of the zips.
 
NeilyG said:
Had a check through the thread and don't THINK this has been questioned (forgive poor attention span if it has) but will this setup emit heat as efficiently as the gas canister version you showed us before? I.E. Is half the heat going inside the cubicle and could it damage the wood surround in time?
Only asking this because setup looks too GOOD to be true. If its a goer, then bring it on.
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Hi this is the post i started with.
The photos are just to show you the fire i have just rebuilt the panel where the fire will be placed. The panel is 3ins thick with fire board at the back then the cavity is filled with fire board the the front piece is fire board that will be covered with ceramic tiles the idea of the half bottle is to reduce the amount of heat taken to heat the bottle up and the wider / higher opening is to allow more heat into the van.
Hope this Helps.
 
Star Trekker said:
Hi flyby, what is the heat output 1or2kw?
Cheers
David
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Hi Depends on the amount of bio fuel you use really using a wick will reduce the output but save fuel, its more than enough to heat my long wheel base Citroen would like to say nearer the 2 kw output but only guessing
 
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