Charging cab / engine battery from Solar panel.

[barryd]

ONE cable they are both already earthed so about 5 meters I'd guess, costs £20 tops if you get gold plated fuse holders, it is dead simple and Barry proof.

why isolate it, when you can charge it? and it will still go flat anyway.

I get it now. Should have read Clives description properly. That wont distinguish between which battery gets the charge though presumably. It sounds like your essentially charging the cab battery off the leisure battery. I disconnect the solar during winter as its been known to bring the battery down as there is absolutely no solar at all half the time where its parked. Why would the battery go flat when isolated? It generally doesn't.

Either way it would be way more than 5 metres of cable. Ive looked at it before. There is no easy way to run a cable from the back lounge rear passenger side seat around the van all the way somehow out of sight into the cab area.

Sorry wildebus but it maybe straightforward to you but it certainly dont sound it to me if for no other reason than it requires cables running properly through the van out of sight.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Ok, all you have to do is lift the seat to get to the LB, undo the positive terminal and fasten a wire to it and fit a 10amp blade fuse and holder, but leave the fuse out at first, there will be a hole under there somewhere so you poke the wire under the van run it along the chassis and secure with tie wraps about every foot or so on top if possible, then bring it up under the bonnet, and using one of the dozens of holes in the bulkhead take it to another fuse holder, then from that to the Positive on the VB, pop the fuses in I would also put a fuse holder as near to each battery as possible and of course use grommets when going through metal.

 

[barryd]

Ok, all you have to do is lift the seat to get to the LB, undo the positive terminal and fasten a wire to it and fit a 10amp blade fuse and holder, but leave the fuse out at first, there will be a hole under there somewhere so you poke the wire under the van run it along the chassis and secure with tie wraps about every foot or so on top if possible, then bring it up under the bonnet, and using one of the dozens of holes in the bulkhead take it to another fuse holder, then from that to the Positive on the VB, pop the fuses in I would also put a fuse holder as near to each battery as possible and of course use grommets when going through metal.

Thanks Kev. I think there may well be an old breather hole under there for a vented battery should you use one. I assumed you wouldnt run cables under the van though. Wont they get fooked in double quick time?

So going back to some of the split chargers others have talked about would this be the same method for wiring one of them? If you can go outside of the van this might make it a lot easier.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

How do you think they get power to the back lights.

 

[barryd]

How do you think they get power to the back lights.

Dunno, Im not a feckin mechanic!! Inside the skirting or the Alko Chassis frames? Maybe they use a Flux Capacitor Relay wifi unit? Thats got you stumped eh?

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Silly bugger

 

[merl]

Silly bugger

Both batteries are already wired back to the main control panel.
No need to run additional cables, just pick the 2 positives there.
What controller do you have Barry.?

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Possibly a Zig Merl it's a 96 swift.

 

[TJBi]

Thanks Kev. I think there may well be an old breather hole under there for a vented battery should you use one. I assumed you wouldnt run cables under the van though. Wont they get fooked in double quick time?

So going back to some of the split chargers others have talked about would this be the same method for wiring one of them? If you can go outside of the van this might make it a lot easier.

Do you have a split charge relay? What type of leisure batteries do you have? How soon do you need the solution?
I have a Battery Master going spare, but not yet uninstalled, so it's going to France tomorrow for a couple of months. Wildebus does not regard them as ideal if you have lithium leisure batteries, but left it in place when he installed lithium for me, just in case a bit of new kit didn't do the job of topping up the engine battery. In fact, the new kit does the job fine, so I'm just waiting for a suitable opportunity to remove a cab seat in order to uninstall the Battery Master.

 

[merl]

If so it may have a row of screw terminals all labeled up ready to go?
Some older units DON'T actually have the cab battery taken back to the main controller ( sorry) but in that case both batteries are wired back to the split charge relay so connections can easily be made there. Often under the bonnet.

 

[barryd]

Do you have a split charge relay? What type of leisure batteries do you have? How soon do you need the solution?
I have a Battery Master going spare, but not yet uninstalled, so it's going to France tomorrow for a couple of months. Wildebus does not regard them as ideal if you have lithium leisure batteries, but left it in place when he installed lithium for me, just in case a bit of new kit didn't do the job of topping up the engine battery. In fact, the new kit does the job fine, so I'm just waiting for a suitable opportunity to remove a cab seat in order to uninstall the Battery Master.

Thanks very much. Just one AGM 120ah battery, 100w solar. MPPT Controller. Leisure battery gets charged off the engine and the solar so there will be a split charge relay under the bonnet I guess if thats what you mean. Nothing else in the wardrobe apart from the main 12v and 240v board that I know of. No rush, its been like that for the last ten years.

 

[TJBi]

If so it may have a row of screw terminals all labeled up ready to go?
Some older units DON'T actually have the cab battery taken back to the main controller ( sorry) but in that case both batteries are wired back to the split charge relay so connections can easily be made there. Often under the bonnet.

All of my batteries are under the cab seats, which is also the location of the Battery Master. Wiring instructions are pretty straightforward (attached).

 

[barryd]

Both batteries are already wired back to the main control panel.
No need to run additional cables, just pick the 2 positives there.
What controller do you have Barry.?

I put the link on page one and some photos. Its this one https://www.mppsolar.com/v3/pcm20123012-series/

Yes there are various threads .outlets at the bottom of the MPPT Controller and I think there may be a spare two. Also a load socket which I run various 12v adaptors off.

Might be easier if I go and take some photos tomorrow or a video.

 

[TJBi]

Thanks very much. Just one AGM 120ah battery, 100w solar. MPPT Controller. Leisure battery gets charged off the engine and the solar so there will be a split charge relay under the bonnet I guess if thats what you mean. Nothing else in the wardrobe apart from the main 12v and 240v board that I know of. No rush, its been like that for the last ten years.

If you would like the Battery Master, perhaps we can sort something out when I get back. Have a look at the instructions attached to my previous post and see what you think.

 

[barryd]

If you would like the Battery Master, perhaps we can sort something out when I get back. Have a look at the instructions attached to my previous post and see what you think.

That sounds ideal. If I can make it work, thanks. Perhaps by the time you get back ill have figured it out!

Its as frustrating for you lot as it is for me I imagine but Ive just never seen one set up so I am trying to get my head around how it will all fit in with what I have in my van and more importantly how and who will fill fit it all.

Ill take some pics and maybe a video tomorrow.

Much appreciate all the help from everyone, thanks. If you need help unhacking your computers or in learning the solo on Ace of Spades, Im yer man! This stuff however.

 

[Deleted member 94473]

I have a Sterling version of a battery master https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/27290005...QKRVHlqZ9SsEzpan95bsJ0-sUCJNxChxoCZKUQAvD_BwE It was £69 when I bought (with an ebay code) and pretty expensive even then, for a trickle charger from Habitation to Cab battery. Because it uses FET's there's negligible parasitic drain compared to the relay versions. It also cuts out to protect the habitation battery going too low which was a godsend for me when I had a fault with one of my daytime running lights. (My habitation battery was way more expensive than the cab battery) If you want really simple wiring just put a cheapy 40 watt solar panel on your dash and use it like a trickle charger with one of these super simple solar charge regulators from CPC. https://cpc.farnell.com/kemo-electr...1748&s_kwcid=AL!5616!3!605262956794!!!network}!1871612868872!&gclid=CjwKCAjw_MqgBhAGEiwAnYOAehtxSCfWW3n0PrbNGt90U3Mmg3MeOC5kTUw0TFR13QBGRlosatWWCxoCLRMQAvD_BwE They're basically glorified MOSFET switches with upper and lower voltage limits but in conjunction with a 40w solar panel work so much better than those cheapy solar trickle chargers you see on Amazon and ebay. You don't need a seperate blocking diode and the controller draws less than 2.5ma when it's dark which is about the same as a little red LED indicator like you see on flashing car alarms. I wired mine using the OBD2 diagnostic plug as my 12 volt cigarette lighter is ignition controlled. Not sure about that with your older van but if you have a car radio that saves it's presets you could tap in there with a fusable link or just find an unused fuse which is permanently 12v in your fuse box and tap in using one of these. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Circuit-Pi...81&hvtargid=pla-716971018489&psc=1&th=1&psc=1

 

[Deleted member 94473]

BTW took a punt on one if these in 2021 when it was £14 on Amazon

Had intermittent issues with cold and warm cranking. Defo worth what I paid (can get on Alixpress and TOMTOP ,Amazon OOS) I was definitely able to exclude a bad battery with it (after charging and desulphating). With a bit of reading around, excluded issues with the Alternator Regulator too, with this gizmo.

As it turned out I narrowed the issue down to either bad wiring or a faulty starter. Did lots of checks for bad earths (Fiat's are known for it) and stripped the starter motor down. Turned out it was actually the Durite battery isolator (sounds like you have one from your post) that was causing all the issues!

 

[barryd]

I have a Sterling version of a battery master https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/27290005...QKRVHlqZ9SsEzpan95bsJ0-sUCJNxChxoCZKUQAvD_BwE It was £69 when I bought (with an ebay code) and pretty expensive even then, for a trickle charger from Habitation to Cab battery. Because it uses FET's there's negligible parasitic drain compared to the relay versions. It also cuts out to protect the habitation battery going too low which was a godsend for me when I had a fault with one of my daytime running lights. (My habitation battery was way more expensive than the cab battery) If you want really simple wiring just put a cheapy 40 watt solar panel on your dash and use it like a trickle charger with one of these super simple solar charge regulators from CPC. https://cpc.farnell.com/kemo-electr...1748&s_kwcid=AL!5616!3!605262956794!!!network}!1871612868872!&gclid=CjwKCAjw_MqgBhAGEiwAnYOAehtxSCfWW3n0PrbNGt90U3Mmg3MeOC5kTUw0TFR13QBGRlosatWWCxoCLRMQAvD_BwE They're basically glorified MOSFET switches with upper and lower voltage limits but in conjunction with a 40w solar panel work so much better than those cheapy solar trickle chargers you see on Amazon and ebay. You don't need a seperate blocking diode and the controller draws less than 2.5ma when it's dark which is about the same as a little red LED indicator like you see on flashing car alarms. I wired mine using the OBD2 diagnostic plug as my 12 volt cigarette lighter is ignition controlled. Not sure about that with your older van but if you have a car radio that saves it's presets you could tap in there with a fusable link or just find an unused fuse which is permanently 12v in your fuse box and tap in using one of these. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Circuit-Pi...81&hvtargid=pla-716971018489&psc=1&th=1&psc=1

Actually I think the cig charger in the cab works with the ignition off. Will check later today. I did think about putting something on the dash and keeping it separate. The set up we have we have had for years and it works perfectly. I am dubious about introducing something new to that without fully understanding what the implications are. I like the idea of keeping the cab and leisure systems separate.

 

[Deleted member 94473]

Actually I think the cig charger in the cab works with the ignition off. Will check later today. I did think about putting something on the dash and keeping it separate. The set up we have we have had for years and it works perfectly. I am dubious about introducing something new to that without fully understanding what the implications are. I like the idea of keeping the cab and leisure systems separate.

If you can charge via a dashboard solar panel through the cigarette lighter with ignition off, can't get much simpler than that. I don't like cigarette lighter sockets themselves (connection wise) so I'd probably wire into the back of it with an inline fuse and maybe a switch. Advantage of the cigarette lighter plug is it will likely have it's own glass cartridge fuse inside which you might wanna down rate to 5 amp.

Reading your initial post 2 weeks is not a long time to flatten the cab battery (even by modern car standards). If you're getting the battery and alternator checked out I'd also ask them to check for a parasitic drain because to me it sounds like something is pulling that battery down way faster than normal.

 

[witzend]

Im having cab battery woes at the moment In the summer we have loads of solar charge though and the MPPT controller often shuts down by mid morning so what would be a simple method of putting in a splitter to top up the cab battery

This is a easy answer to your problem

Clive`s