Carry a scooter or M/bike in your garage?

[barryd]

It would appear that the main reason why this has hit the fan is for the single reason that VOSA (they used to be known as the DVSA) have lost their public funding.

As this is the case, bless them, the VOSA bods have been rifling through all the grey area laws so that they can start making money to cover their costs.

Over on Motorhome Builder one of our super star members has been in contact with not only VOSA but also the DVLA and the technical departments of both the large clubs, namely the C&MC and the C&CC. Neither of them had any knowledge for and about what is happening and following Squiffy's approach they are all working together in an attempt to sort it all out.

But, as of now Squiffy has received an email from a senior person within VOSA which clearly states:-

These are the definitions in The Road Vehicles(Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 as amended.

motor caravan

a motor vehicle which is constructed or adapted for the carriage of passengers and their effects and which contains, as permanently installed equipment, the facilities which are reasonably necessary for enabling the vehicle to provide mobile living accommodation for its users.

Living Van,

a vehicle used primarily as living accommodation by one or more persons, and which is also used for the carriage of goods or burden which are not needed by such one or more persons for the purpose of their residence in the vehicle.


A motorbike is not needed for the purpose of their residence in the vehicle it is an optional extra so therefore the vehicle carrying a motorbike is a living van and not motorhome.
Those lockers are for carrying items such as an awning and furniture to use in that awning for example. Or a disabled scooter if one of the occupants is disabled.

If you do not like this, and it would appear that you do not, you will need to take it up with your MP to see if you can get that regulation changed.
__________________________________________

​

So there you have it as far as it is now, a total bloody mess and one that clearly needs clearing up.

Phil

But it describes a living van as "a vehicle used primarily as living accommodation by one or more persons" What does primarily mean? Does it mean as in your main home? Who determines what is essential to be carried in a locker anyway? Why is an awning or a table essential and a scooter not?

I would argue for a disabled person that saying a disability scooter is essential but a two wheeled scooter is not is discriminatory. Im officially disabled now and my scooter is definitely essential but Im buggered if ill be swapping it for one of those four wheeled electric jobs. I would look a right pillock trying to go up the Col de Tourmalet on one of them.

 

[vwalan]

mind a living van can be a caravan as well .
living vans dont have to be a self powered vehicle.
in uk there is no mot for caravans but if its a living van trailer over 3,500kg there is .
i lowered my trailers gvw from 5 ton to 3.5 ton so it didnt need mot.
luckily being an ally chassis ,floor,and wall construction it is very light.

 

[shaunr68]

In the list of vehicle types in the link above, "Motor Caravan" is absent. I suspect that the definition of "Living Van" as noted there was used for the official definition of "Motor Caravan" (maybe to tie up with some Europe-Wide vehicle class?) and the "Living Van" was changed to a revised definition.

That's the problem with the internet ... in the search for information it is all to easy to find old superceeded rules which are not noted as being changed or recinded.

Interesting, an advanced search on Legislation.gov.uk using title "Road Vehicles (Construction and Use)" and keywords "living vehicle" identifies no amendments containing this term. Searching instead for the term "motor caravan" does identify several amendments to the original regulations but none of which relate to part 1 of the document, so as far as I can tell, the legal definition of a living van is:

a vehicle used primarily as living accommodation by one or more persons, and which is not also used for the carriage of goods or burden which are not needed by such one or more persons for the purpose of their residence in the vehicle.

So a living van cannot be used to carry goods, whatever "goods" are supposed to be. Surely this means commercial goods, rather than personal possessions, but it must be defined somewhere.

Who determines what is essential to be carried in a locker anyway? Why is an awning or a table essential and a scooter not?

Indeed, or a laptop even. You could easily argue that a scooter is necessary for the purpose of residence in the vehicle as you use it to do all your shopping. Where is it defined that a scooter is classed as goods and an awning is not?

 

[shaunr68]

Further thought. If they're saying that a motorcycle is classed as goods but a bicycle is not, that's very specific and VDOZA or whatever they're called this week should be able to explain the distinction.

 

[big tom]

You can carry whatever you like in it,if it is not for Hire or Reward,and conforms with construction and use.

 

[vwalan]

the word goods is also not the goods for sale etc .
but is burden . burden can be anything .
but so long as the gvw isnt over 3,500kg your ok.
if its over then really you cant have a class 4 mot.
its getting a bit mixed up on here really with construction and use and the mot rules .
they sort of fit together but have different dates and changes of rules .
comes back to the wording of goods or burden not required for actual living in the vehicle .
m,bikes are a requirement .
mind lots of us do carry them , many like me as i,m disabled . i do carry a push bike as well and a zimmer frame on wheels .