Banned from standby Scottish ferries

[myvanwy]

I certainly think they have achieved alienating motorhomers.

 

[terry111]

I was thinking of going to the Outer Hebrides in a couple of weeks time. Perhaps I'll not bother, seems more like hassle rather than a holiday!

 

[Fisherman]

Reply from CalMac.

Good Morning

To further address your email, we are not singling out people with larger vehicles and motorhomes like you suggest. We are giving priority to people who turn up on standby who have no alternative means of accommodation if stranded. Camper/motor home drivers, have accommodation in their vehicle should they need it, whereas people in cars do not.
Following discussions with Transport Scotland and listening to feedback from Stakeholder Groups, this change has been introduced to prioritise customers without alternative accommodation and to help optimise use of the limited deck space that remains once all booked customers and their vehicles are loaded onto a vessel.
An unbooked vehicle of any size without on board accommodation may need priority. Also, where there’s very little deck space left over, we can optimise its use by shipping car type vehicles from standby lanes since they can park at angles and fit into the remaining tight spaces. Unfortunately, larger vehicles like motorhomes, campervans and vehicles towing caravans are less able to do so.
If we use our standby lanes for cars, we’ll be better placed to make efficient use of remaining space. This approach also avoids motorhome / campervan and caravan customers sitting in stand-by queues when there’s less possibility of being able to fit within the space that’s left.
Also to address your point regarding the size of vehicle even if you have a smaller campervan, which is the same size as a car, you would not be able to join the standby queue either in your campervan regardless of the size. If there is available space left on the next sailing, we would ask you to buy a ticket from the port office for that sailing and join the booked traffic for that timetabled sailing.

Islanders are exempt from this policy when travelling with a caravan/campervan/motorhome and they will continue to be able to use standby options. Island residency will be confirmed at the point of booking or point of application to join the standby queue and can be evidenced with a proof of address from a utility bill or similar identifier. This is the same where an island resident uses a motorhome/campervan as their regular means of travel, they will continue to be able to use standby options.

There is nothing further we can advise you on this matter.
To avoid disappointment should you travel with Calmac in the future, please ensure you book in advance. You can do so online at https://ticketing.calmac.co.uk/booking/asp/web100.asp
Kind Regards,

Gemma Fraser
Customer Advisor
CalMac Ferries Ltd

 

[colinm]

I was thinking of going to the Outer Hebrides in a couple of weeks time. Perhaps I'll not bother, seems more like hassle rather than a holiday!

Not sure on the current situation, but last time we used CalMac it was simple to book a place just a day or so before boarding.

 

[linkshouse]

Not sure on the current situation, but last time we used CalMac it was simple to book a place just a day or so before boarding.

We don't have the same standby restrictions on Orkney Ferries but depending on your desired sailing time you'd be lucky to get on without advance booking.

My wife received a hospital appointment yesterday for the 4th of October. Rang straight away to book a day return from Westray to Kirkwall and we would have been 4th standby going out and 5th standby coming back. There would have been little hope of getting onto either of those so opted for going out the previous night and coming back the following morning.

So, a mini holiday! Just as well we have a campervan.

 

[caledonia]

Reply from CalMac.

Good Morning

To further address your email, we are not singling out people with larger vehicles and motorhomes like you suggest. We are giving priority to people who turn up on standby who have no alternative means of accommodation if stranded. Camper/motor home drivers, have accommodation in their vehicle should they need it, whereas people in cars do not.
Following discussions with Transport Scotland and listening to feedback from Stakeholder Groups, this change has been introduced to prioritise customers without alternative accommodation and to help optimise use of the limited deck space that remains once all booked customers and their vehicles are loaded onto a vessel.
An unbooked vehicle of any size without on board accommodation may need priority. Also, where there’s very little deck space left over, we can optimise its use by shipping car type vehicles from standby lanes since they can park at angles and fit into the remaining tight spaces. Unfortunately, larger vehicles like motorhomes, campervans and vehicles towing caravans are less able to do so.
If we use our standby lanes for cars, we’ll be better placed to make efficient use of remaining space. This approach also avoids motorhome / campervan and caravan customers sitting in stand-by queues when there’s less possibility of being able to fit within the space that’s left.
Also to address your point regarding the size of vehicle even if you have a smaller campervan, which is the same size as a car, you would not be able to join the standby queue either in your campervan regardless of the size. If there is available space left on the next sailing, we would ask you to buy a ticket from the port office for that sailing and join the booked traffic for that timetabled sailing.

Islanders are exempt from this policy when travelling with a caravan/campervan/motorhome and they will continue to be able to use standby options. Island residency will be confirmed at the point of booking or point of application to join the standby queue and can be evidenced with a proof of address from a utility bill or similar identifier. This is the same where an island resident uses a motorhome/campervan as their regular means of travel, they will continue to be able to use standby options.

There is nothing further we can advise you on this matter.
To avoid disappointment should you travel with Calmac in the future, please ensure you book in advance. You can do so online at https://ticketing.calmac.co.uk/booking/asp/web100.asp
Kind Regards,

Gemma Fraser
Customer Advisor
CalMac Ferries Ltd

Sounds fair enough.

 

[Robmac]

Sounds fair enough.

To be honest, it sounds reasonable to me too.

 

[Annsman]

Having recently been all up the Outer Hebrides and visited much of the Highlands all I can say is I never encountered any personal ill felling. In the Hebrides all the comments I got were about being glad to see us back. The FB pages "The Land Weeps" and "The dirty truth" are run by white setters who in no way represent the indigenous people. For these who are wondering what a "white settler" is they are the people who move to a lovely peaceful area and then either try to pickle it in aspic or change it to their views. They do not and never will represent the people who have been born and brought up in these areas. If people move to a place and fit in without problems they are not "white settlers". This happens all over the UK, not just the Highlands and Islands.

This is certainly the case too in Spain and Portugal. From speaking to police and local authority employees there, it’s usually complaints from Brits who have moved in to towns and villages that do the complaining. In one town on the Spanish East Coast it was a British immigrant, who had previously holidayed there in his motorhome, who having then bought a property there, then led a local media campaign to get motorhomes banned from the area!

 

[barryd]

Not sure on the current situation, but last time we used CalMac it was simple to book a place just a day or so before boarding.

That is normally the case I think. However we just left Arran and it was nearly a week before I could get a booking to get off the island apart from the very late 10pm ferry (or thereabouts) which often never runs anyway). Never known that before. Maybe people were just booking slots I dont know but its been ferry chaos there all the time we were on the island. The two ferries are about knackered and always having problems and it was made worse this summer by several ferry shutdowns because of covid outbreaks in the crew. On at least two occasions they were sending passengers up to the little Ferry at Lochranza which is a massive detour once you get on the mainland and the place got gridlocked as its only desiged for a few cars.

 

[2cv]

Here’s the story of the ferry that should have been serving Arran. Link

 

[Essa]

Reply from CalMac.

Good Morning

To further address your email, we are not singling out people with larger vehicles and motorhomes like you suggest. We are giving priority to people who turn up on standby who have no alternative means of accommodation if stranded. Camper/motor home drivers, have accommodation in their vehicle should they need it, whereas people in cars do not.
Following discussions with Transport Scotland and listening to feedback from Stakeholder Groups, this change has been introduced to prioritise customers without alternative accommodation and to help optimise use of the limited deck space that remains once all booked customers and their vehicles are loaded onto a vessel.
An unbooked vehicle of any size without on board accommodation may need priority. Also, where there’s very little deck space left over, we can optimise its use by shipping car type vehicles from standby lanes since they can park at angles and fit into the remaining tight spaces. Unfortunately, larger vehicles like motorhomes, campervans and vehicles towing caravans are less able to do so.
If we use our standby lanes for cars, we’ll be better placed to make efficient use of remaining space. This approach also avoids motorhome / campervan and caravan customers sitting in stand-by queues when there’s less possibility of being able to fit within the space that’s left.
Also to address your point regarding the size of vehicle even if you have a smaller campervan, which is the same size as a car, you would not be able to join the standby queue either in your campervan regardless of the size. If there is available space left on the next sailing, we would ask you to buy a ticket from the port office for that sailing and join the booked traffic for that timetabled sailing.

Islanders are exempt from this policy when travelling with a caravan/campervan/motorhome and they will continue to be able to use standby options. Island residency will be confirmed at the point of booking or point of application to join the standby queue and can be evidenced with a proof of address from a utility bill or similar identifier. This is the same where an island resident uses a motorhome/campervan as their regular means of travel, they will continue to be able to use standby options.

There is nothing further we can advise you on this matter.
To avoid disappointment should you travel with Calmac in the future, please ensure you book in advance. You can do so online at https://ticketing.calmac.co.uk/booking/asp/web100.asp
Kind Regards,

Gemma Fraser
Customer Advisor
CalMac Ferries Ltd

None of this explains why, having been refused standby status on a Craignure to Oban sailing recently, the ship sailed without us despite having capacity left. I don't know who is supposed to be benefitting from such unfilled spaces but it surely isn't the taxpayer who subsidises CalMac nor any of the fare payers onto whom any such losses will ultimately be passed on in the long term. I would think such an occurrence will not be uncommon in the Winter months. Nobody asked if we were resident on the island of departure either.

Incidentally, when I complained at the time, CalMac advised me that they do not like and did not want this policy either and encouraged us to complain to Transport Scotland about it. Address below for anyone else who would also like to do so:

Transport Scotland
Buchanan House
58 Port Dundas Road
Glasgow G4 0HF

 

[Fisherman]

None of this explains why, having been refused standby status on a Craignure to Oban sailing recently, the ship sailed without us despite having capacity left. I don't know who is supposed to be benefitting from such unfilled spaces but it surely isn't the taxpayer who subsidises CalMac nor any of the fare payers onto whom any such losses will ultimately be passed on in the long term. I would think such an occurrence will not be uncommon in the Winter months. Nobody asked if we were resident on the island of departure either.

Incidentally, when I complained at the time, CalMac advised me that they do not like and did not want this policy either and encouraged us to complain to Transport Scotland about it. Address below for anyone else who would also like to do so:

Transport Scotland
Buchanan House
58 Port Dundas Road
Glasgow G4 0HF

Hi Essa this is what they stated in the reply in such circumstances.

If there is available space left on the next sailing, we would ask you to buy a ticket from the port office for that sailing and join the booked traffic for that timetabled sailing.

Seems pedantic, why not simply alow you to enter the ferry after paying like everyone else who has queued. I have exhausted my means of complaint. Why not do as they say and complain to transport scotland. Sadly this is just another example of special treatment for us, and now once you arrive at your island destination they are considering taxing you and you alone for the privilege. It’s irrelevant if this actually ever happens, the fact that it’s even being considered speaks multitudes.

 

[Fisherman]

To be honest, it sounds reasonable to me too.

Sorry Rob, but this has been cobbled up after receiving many complaints from us. Cal Mac made no such points when announcing this. They have obviously drummed up this reply after much forethought, this was never taken into consideration when the announcement was made.
The same argument could be made for anyone. Their are plenty of B&Bs and hotels up here, or if they live up here they could go home, and if you planned a tent camping holiday you can pitch just about anywhere up here. Sadly this and the proposal to tax us solely for staying on the islands has all the hallmarks of special treatment. And in some ways even more important, the way it has been put forward only adds to the negativity from some towards us.

 

[CWH]

Ferries:
This explanation from CalMac was available from the start if you looked in the right places.
It's not anti-moho at all; it just requires us to BOOK which is not a difficult thing to do.
Tax:
The islands have put in masses of infrastructure to try to manage the influx of motorhomes - don't you think it's FAIR for them to recoup some of the cost of that?
Any response about "what we spend" is flawed. It's minimal in comparison.

 

[linkshouse]

Ferries:
This explanation from CalMac was available from the start if you looked in the right places.
It's not anti-moho at all; it just requires us to BOOK which is not a difficult thing to do.
Tax:
The islands have put in masses of infrastructure to try to manage the influx of motorhomes - don't you think it's FAIR for them to recoup some of the cost of that?
Any response about "what we spend" is flawed. It's minimal in comparison.

Ferries: yes it is, it REQUIRES motorhomes and campervans to book, they are explicitly denied even the opportunity to queue up for a possible late space.

Tax: Possibly a fair point if it was not just the OH. Other places up and down the country are putting in services. If the provision of these services throughout the country could be directly linked to an increase in motorhome/campervan road tax then this might appear more fair. As a little side thought. I bet if this were the case it would be a lot easier to get vehicles reclassified as motor-caravans.

 

[colinm]

Tax:
The islands have put in masses of infrastructure to try to manage the influx of motorhomes - don't you think it's FAIR for them to recoup some of the cost of that?
Any response about "what we spend" is flawed. It's minimal in comparison.

We first toured the Outer Hebrides with a car and tent, at that time some places offering camping had no toilets, some people used toilet tents, we chose to use public toilets, AFAIK these public toilets are still in use and are mainly for tourists, so why is the proposed tax just on motohomes?

 

[CWH]

Ferries: yes it is, it REQUIRES motorhomes and campervans to book, they are explicitly denied even the opportunity to queue up for a possible late space.

Why queue? If you've left it a bit late, then arrive, book! As soon as you decide to travel, book! How often would you be driving through eg Oban and THEN decide to go across to Barra?

Tax: Possibly a fair point if it was not just the OH. Other places up and down the country are putting in services. If the provision of these services throughout the country could be directly linked to an increase in motorhome/campervan road tax then this might appear more fair. As a little side thought. I bet if this were the case it would be a lot easier to get vehicles reclassified as motor-caravans.

The Scottish government has introduced legislation to permit local areas to bring in tourist taxes ("transient visitor levy"). The Comhairle is to consult islanders as to whether or not they want to use these new powers.

We first toured the Outer Hebrides with a car and tent, at that time some places offering camping had no toilets, some people used toilet tents, we chose to use public toilets, AFAIK these public toilets are still in use and are mainly for tourists, so why is the proposed tax just on motohomes?

Nationally, it's not. And it's not just the Outer Isles. Don't believe headlines. It's the press who are stirring things up by half-reporting.
However, motorhome stopover points cost the community money to set up and to manage. People staying in eg B&B are paying for the equivalent services via their host's bills.

 

[MikeBBB]

To be honest, it sounds reasonable to me too.

Why queue? If you've left it a bit late, then arrive, book! As soon as you decide to travel, book! How often would you be driving through eg Oban and THEN decide to go across to Barra?

The Scottish government has introduced legislation to permit local areas to bring in tourist taxes ("transient visitor levy"). The Comhairle is to consult islanders as to whether or not they want to use these new powers.

Nationally, it's not. And it's not just the Outer Isles. Don't believe headlines. It's the press who are stirring things up by half-reporting.
However, motorhome stopover points cost the community money to set up and to manage. People staying in eg B&B are paying for the equivalent services via their host's bills.

Quite. We're heading off to the islands as per usual next month - all the key crossings have been booked for quite a while! We've even got two bookings on the same crossing, different dates and will cancel one as necessary as our plans firm up, depending on what the weather and our mood is at the time. I don't think we've ever "gone standby", certainly not with the van. Whether it's discriminatory or otherwise is another debate. It probably is. However, there would appear to be considerable support for it out on the islands at grassroot and political level. And at the end of the day, CalMac can impose whatever terms they like.

As regards the smaller inter-island (non bookable) crossings, I seem to recall only once - in 40 years of visiting OH - not being able to get onto a ferry and having to wait for the next sailing.

As to the TVL, as you note, this isn't just M/homes or OH. This is national. That said, I have real issues with being expected to pay an additional tax within my own country, when I choose to visit another part of it. On the other hand, given that huge swathes of housing is being turned into Airbnb, second homes or holiday lets, maybe some good will come from this proposed new tax. But I am amused when our local council changes the bin collection frequency, to save money in the face of ongoing budget cuts - while the local community rages against any possibility of an increase to Council Tax let alone income tax! And as I live close to a Tourist Hotspot, I also experience the downsides and frustrations this often brings.

 

[Tookey]

Ferries:
This explanation from CalMac was available from the start if you looked in the right places.
It's not anti-moho at all; it just requires us to BOOK which is not a difficult thing to do.
Tax:
The islands have put in masses of infrastructure to try to manage the influx of motorhomes - don't you think it's FAIR for them to recoup some of the cost of that?
Any response about "what we spend" is flawed. It's minimal in comparison.

I am not familiar with the Islands, what are the 'masses of infrastructure' please?

 

[linkshouse]

Okay, here‘s how it works on the Orkney Ferries For us.

You could just turn up and hope to get on but you would have to be very lucky as you would only get on once all “standby bookings” are boarded.

I say “standby bookings” as, when ringing to book a ferry, if the ferry is fully booked they will offer the option of being added to the standby list e.g 1st standby, 2nd standby etc. They usually stop at 4th to 5th standby.

Now depending on circumstances one may or may not take these odds, e.g. when we were in a car we would accept standby for Westray to Kirkwall as we could just go back home if we didn’t get on the ferry, but we would not accept any standby for the return journey as it would mean stopping over in a hotel.

Contrary to Calmac’s philosophy of not allowing motorhomes/campervans on standby, our position now that we have our campervan is far more relaxed when it comes to standby as we can always stop in the van if we don’t get on the ferry.