A sneaky speeding crackdown.
- Thread starter tiderus
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Deleted member 43466
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you are safe you haye to get the letter within two weeks asking the drivers name if you dont they cant enforce it
but they will send a second letter later giving you a second chance to tell them the driver you will have to send this one in
and enclose a letter saying you did not get the first one in 14 days so the ticket should be cancelled.
they will probably not cancel it so wait for the summons for court which has to be issued in 6 months or it is not enforcible
due to the statue of limitations. When you go to court tell the magistrates you did not get it within 14 days. show them copies
of the second letter and the date you wrote in explaining the situation. the letters are not sent out with recorded post so can not
prove you got it. they have to let you off.
campervanannie
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lowering the tone and going off topic naughty izzywizzy.
Winker
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izwozral
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That's me all over CamperFanny, I have the attention span of a gnat & the mind of a sewer rat but to get back on topic, I never used to speed, I preferred Red Lebanese.
John H
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Don't judge all speeders by the actions of an irresponsible minority! :rolleyes2::lol-049::fun:
:wave:GRWXJR
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I think they won't do this as they know that
a) it'd dry up a VERY lucrative revenue stream - they don't want to eliminate speeding even though they could - but its a great excuse to emply the technology to rake in the cash instead
b) there's the very real problem that (despite the NEVER speed etc.) nonsense, that such a level of removal of control and responsibility from the driver is to invite litigation for the makers and indeed the Government when a device either fails and results in an incident, or simply limits and restricts the ability of the driver to avoid an incident through having the ability to do so taken from him/her by the technology itself.
Most 'switched on' (no pun intended) drivers will have seen potential crash scenario situations evolving around them that would only be aggravated by hard braking (the default fallback action in EVERY situation for EVERY poor Driver btw - box themselves into a bad situation and then make it worse by automatically stamping on the middle pedal) and require evasive action which often involves accelerating OUT of the danger zone being created by someone else's error.
Speed-limiting technology would create chaos as all those rubbish drivers who don't look, use mirrors and plan ahead properly drove right up behind slow lorries on m-ways and then threw themselves in front of overtaking drivers, or who went to make an overtake and the limiter cut in and left them without space and time to return to their side of the road etc etc.
I know they limit lorries, but lorries require a whole different driving technique (much better observation & planning for a start) so auto-limiting cars is nightmare scenario that only the dumbest bureaucrat would ever sanction.
Robmac
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I'm not sure that I completely agree there. We already have speed limiting on all vehicles, based on the size/power of the engine, it would just mean that drivers would have to get used to a different power band. It would be easy for some sort of GPS based system telling a vehicle what speed limit it is in and restricting the limit accordingly. Obviously drivers would then know that overtaking would be foolish unless the power of the car allowed it. The scenarios you state already exist but at faster speeds, which are relative to speeds of the rest of the traffic.
Don't get me wrong, I would never advocate such a scheme. I am just saying that the government don't give a stuff about whether we live or die, it is just about revenue, if they were serious, they could stamp out speeding fairly easily.
maxi77
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I remember those days when policemen directed traffic instead of traffic lights and a road was busy if you saw another car. Even if we had as many plods on traffic as we had then there is no way they could cope with the volume of traffic today. Lets face it if you get caught speeding it is your fault not the policeeor the cameras fault and if you were not aware you were speeding you were driving without care and attention, and if you were aware then you knew the risks and should thus accept the penalty gracefully.
I would suggest that it would be much morr appropriate to push for a review of limits which would hopefully see some go up and some go down, I know many country roads where 40 is too fast never mind the current 60. Equally I know places where an extra 10 mph would be quite safe. I would also suggest that variable speed limits should be used more, there are plenty of places where the current low limits are only really needed for a few hours every weekday yet are applied 24/7.
I would suggest that it would be much morr appropriate to push for a review of limits which would hopefully see some go up and some go down, I know many country roads where 40 is too fast never mind the current 60. Equally I know places where an extra 10 mph would be quite safe. I would also suggest that variable speed limits should be used more, there are plenty of places where the current low limits are only really needed for a few hours every weekday yet are applied 24/7.
GRWXJR
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I spend so much of my driving time making space, time and allowances for lousy drivers (who of course never realise that they are bumbling around making a nuisance of themselves while others get out of their way) that its just not funny.
Just driving along the motorway (the EASIEST place there is to drive ****!) you see a steady stream of nuggets who
a) cannot check their mirrors in good time to move out to overtake, so you have to slow down / speed up / check before them and change lane yourself, as you KNOW they'll either slam the anchors on, or just swerve out into your path.
b) are so incompetent that changing lanes is just too fraught with danger for the, so they just drone along in (usually) the centre lane (as it avoids having to compensate for slip road arrivals and lorries so they can switch their brain off and mindlessly drift along)
c) Are too daft to work out that you need to accelerate up to speed on an on-ramp so that you can safely join a fast-moving stream of traffic, so they slow down or even STOP on a ramp, then join a 60mph stream at such a slow speed its inviting a crash up the back from Mr Dozy (see b. above), or they'll pull across as 25mph across the bow of a 42-tonne artic doing 56mph who simply cannot shed 30mph in 50 metres.
These are just 3 basic examples that I see in droves every single day and have to make allowances for so that they don't involve me in their ineptitude - and not a single speeder amongst them.
But so many anti-speeding butter-wouldn't-melt preachers [in my experience often not very good drivers tbh] fail to realise that means "too-slow" just as much as it means "too-fast", together with poor observation, planning and indeed attitude.
half-decent, attentive drivers spend a lot of time unnoticed, saving the bacon of the inept.
Just driving along the motorway (the EASIEST place there is to drive ****!) you see a steady stream of nuggets who
a) cannot check their mirrors in good time to move out to overtake, so you have to slow down / speed up / check before them and change lane yourself, as you KNOW they'll either slam the anchors on, or just swerve out into your path.
b) are so incompetent that changing lanes is just too fraught with danger for the, so they just drone along in (usually) the centre lane (as it avoids having to compensate for slip road arrivals and lorries so they can switch their brain off and mindlessly drift along)
c) Are too daft to work out that you need to accelerate up to speed on an on-ramp so that you can safely join a fast-moving stream of traffic, so they slow down or even STOP on a ramp, then join a 60mph stream at such a slow speed its inviting a crash up the back from Mr Dozy (see b. above), or they'll pull across as 25mph across the bow of a 42-tonne artic doing 56mph who simply cannot shed 30mph in 50 metres.
These are just 3 basic examples that I see in droves every single day and have to make allowances for so that they don't involve me in their ineptitude - and not a single speeder amongst them.
But so many anti-speeding butter-wouldn't-melt preachers [in my experience often not very good drivers tbh] fail to realise that means "too-slow" just as much as it means "too-fast", together with poor observation, planning and indeed attitude.
half-decent, attentive drivers spend a lot of time unnoticed, saving the bacon of the inept.
Robmac
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I agree with all of your points. I've said before, I do 100k per year and have seen most kinds of bad driving and the resulting accidents.
Unfortunately the speed cameras cannot pick up idiotic behaviour! I was playing devils advocate a bit with the speed limiting thing
But who know's, there is research going on into autonomous cars which will take a lot more control from the driver!GRWXJR
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The Highway Code used to (I have to own up here I've not read the latest, though we all really should as they do change) state that it was perfectly acceptable to exceed the limit (briefly) in order to effect a safe overtake and to spend the minimum amount of time on the opposite side of the road.
Imagine accelerating past a vehicle only to find he/she puts her foot down and 'hangs you out to dry' (getting more common as it seems drivers become more stroppy than they used to??) and then hitting a limiter! Lethal.
Its not really relevant to heavy goods as they aren't in a position to accelerate quickly regardless, so limits on HGV's are a whole different kettle of fish in terms of their effect and impact than on cars.
I can state hand-on-heart with certainty that I would have been injured or killed several times over the years when riding my motorcycle - without having the facility to accelerate out of a dangerous situation. You are of course very vulnerable on a bike, and what dents a wing in a small shunt can be fatal for a motorcyclist, and its often a bikes agility & acceleration that are your best friends.
GRWXJR
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I agree with all of your points. I've said before, I do 100k per year and have seen most kinds of bad driving and the resulting accidents.
Unfortunately the speed cameras cannot pick up idiotic behaviour! I was playing devils advocate a bit with the speed limiting thing
I tend to think that they'd be far better off getting people onto a decent public transport infrastructure before putting us all into automated individual delivery crates.
But they won't - as the right to private independent transport is now seen as a right, and any move to change that is a known vote-killer. Plus of course the motorist contributes a vastly disproportionate amount of tax revenue that will never be relinquished.
The biggie I'm with you on is the fact that Camera's are "one-trick-ponies" where someone can be a god-awful driver and a total menace and risk to themselves and everyone around them - but they'll never be apprehended by a Scamera.
As has been much repeated on this thread and is abundantly clear - Road Safety may be a great excuse and validation, but is NOT the primary function nor indeed an achievement of Speed Scamera's.
GRWXJR
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A classic example yes.
At Stormy Down about Pyle, Mid-Glamorgan they replaced 2 Scamera's (one for each carriageway) that cover one junction off a back lane that I have NEVER seen anyone come out of, and the other which heads out to the old airfield where there's a concrete works and a few other bits that do see lorries coming and going in daytime. This part is at the beginning / end of a national speed limit / 50mph change (of course).
They took down the Hi-Viz ones and replaced them with the matt yellow 'stealth' ones that vanish in low light and sodium lighting - so that (unless you KNOW they are there) you'll find next to impossible to pick out at night. So despite the fact that those (allegedly) dangerous junctions are still there at night - there's a deliberate step been taken to camouflage the Scamera's - so instead of warning motorists with a Hi-Viz Scamera and thus making the section 'safer' there's a cynical step to risk the public so they can punish them AFTER the "dangerous" speed offence has been committed.
Road safety my arse :raofl: !
At Stormy Down about Pyle, Mid-Glamorgan they replaced 2 Scamera's (one for each carriageway) that cover one junction off a back lane that I have NEVER seen anyone come out of, and the other which heads out to the old airfield where there's a concrete works and a few other bits that do see lorries coming and going in daytime. This part is at the beginning / end of a national speed limit / 50mph change (of course).
They took down the Hi-Viz ones and replaced them with the matt yellow 'stealth' ones that vanish in low light and sodium lighting - so that (unless you KNOW they are there) you'll find next to impossible to pick out at night. So despite the fact that those (allegedly) dangerous junctions are still there at night - there's a deliberate step been taken to camouflage the Scamera's - so instead of warning motorists with a Hi-Viz Scamera and thus making the section 'safer' there's a cynical step to risk the public so they can punish them AFTER the "dangerous" speed offence has been committed.
Road safety my arse :raofl: !
st3v3
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W anker, I'm fully aware of circumference, and how it's a product of diameter. What's your point?
Let's take extremes to prove i'm correct.
A very small wheel is 5mm in diameter moving at a fixed speed along the road. The axle will be rotating. Now add 5mm of tread to the wheel. It's diameter is now 15mm. What will happen to the speed of the axle? If you guessed it will be significantly slower give yourself a gold star.
Now, repeat with a 5 metre diameter wheel, and add the same 5mm of tread. How much will the axle speed change? Very little.
So, wheel diameter has an effect on the speed error.
Like I said earlier
GRWXJR
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On this we can certainly agree 100%.
Lowering speed limits is seen as improving safety. There's a long rural section near me that has had many nasty accidents over the years. so they put double-whites down the whole section (despite no junctions or bad bits etc) and dropped the limit to a blanket 40mph (from 60mph). The road has no layby's or any places really where a Scamera van can park so all the locals know the chances of a speed check are very small.
The problem is, is that all the crashes were historically from people doing between 80 & 100mph and then failing to make the curves. At 60mph the road would not challenge even a below-average drivers ability (at least I fervently hope this is true for everyone's sakes!).
Now - if you've a mind to break a limit by these kind of margins, then you aren't going to drive this section differently just because they've dropped the limit to 40mph.
Guess what - I drove it recently and there was a fresh bunch of flowers tied to a telegraph pole (and its far from the first time since this road has been 'made safer'). All the lowered limit has done, is to make everyone EXCEPT those crashing on it creep along up this road.
Winker
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Try keeping it civil pease.W anker, I'm fully aware of circumference, and how it's a product of diameter. What's your point?
Let's take extremes to prove i'm correct.
A very small wheel is 5mm in diameter moving at a fixed speed along the road. The axle will be rotating. Now add 5mm of tread to the wheel. It's diameter is now 15mm. What will happen to the speed of the axle? If you guessed it will be significantly slower give yourself a gold star.
Now, repeat with a 5 metre diameter wheel, and add the same 5mm of tread. How much will the axle speed change? Very little.
So, wheel diameter has an effect on the speed error.
Like I said earlier
I also know these things, so a motorbike gains 5mph with a tyre change, so a Mini on 10" wheels by your abysmal reckoning would gain in the region of 10mph?
Also the bikey fella did not state at what speed the 5mph gain was attained.
As it happens, I am running my car on 15" rims for the winter, the tyres when new also had a 7mm tread, and now that they're down to 4mm the gain in speed is less. Than 1mph at 70, so!
Think about it, wind your head back in, and keep the insults to yourself dumb lad.
st3v3
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Winker said:
Lets's review:
(Random 'up yours' reply that made no sense)
And I need to keep it civil. Hmmmm.
Anywho...
Winker said:
Yea, I'm not sure you do, as your comments on this thread prove.
Winker said:
I'm not sure how you've done your maths (finger in the air perhaps?) but I'll give you - and you go ahead and tell me exactly why not - that 10" wheels will have a greater speed error than a 15" wheel. We proved that with your gold star remember? I'm not sure on the actual amount without knowing the tyre sidewall dimensions.
I'm not sure what your point is? We proved the bike will have a greater increase that the truck with your gold star remember? It would be fair to assume that he's talking around the maximum permissible speed in the UK, but instead of effectively calling him a liar it might have been useful to ask him...
Again, you don't understand the importance of the variables. What's the sidewall compared to 'bikey fella' and how have you measured speed?
GRWXJR
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The difference in speed / rpms? It was a while ago when I did the last back to back old tyre v new tyre and paid it much attention, but itd have been at a typical cruising speed of between a bit naughty and less than instant ban on a motorway.
The really noticeable effect is when you stay at a constant throttle and speed and go from a straight to a big lean through a corner and back upright. As of course the diameter on the edge of the tyre is far less than on the crown, you can distinctly hear the revs rise and fall significantly at the same speed. 125cc racers used to exploit this effective lower gearing phenomena by momentarily flicking the bike on its side when accelerating up the gears on a straight to assist acceleration with limited hp.
I admit I havent looked at the speedo to note the indicated speed variance - its generally a good idea to look where youre headed when doing this!
The really noticeable effect is when you stay at a constant throttle and speed and go from a straight to a big lean through a corner and back upright. As of course the diameter on the edge of the tyre is far less than on the crown, you can distinctly hear the revs rise and fall significantly at the same speed. 125cc racers used to exploit this effective lower gearing phenomena by momentarily flicking the bike on its side when accelerating up the gears on a straight to assist acceleration with limited hp.
I admit I havent looked at the speedo to note the indicated speed variance - its generally a good idea to look where youre headed when doing this!