Have you thought/realised?

st3v3 said:
This is the part that I don't think is right (heard immunity in it's correct sense.) At the moment, with the information we have, it seems like you can be vaccinated and still get CV and pass it on. Even at percentages of that, it's not enough to stop it. Consider one person with CV stood in the middle of a circle of, say, 8 people. If half of those can catch it from him, they eventually will. And it will continue until it has been through the whole population.
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I don't believe we'll ever be rid of this virus and subsequent mutations. The most important thing to bear in mind is that all those who are vaccinated are highly unlikely to have severe disease or die from COVID. Those who aren't vaccinated won't have this 'almost' guarantee but it's their choice. The common cold is a member of the coronavirus family and we all get colds and know we can pass them on but we don't fear them... although some people will go on to get mucus related bacterial infections that can cause them severe illness and even death. Same with 'flu... a different virus family but we all know we can get it and pass it on, so the most vulnerable will be vaccinated each year with a cumulative cocktail of all known strains because it's easily more serious than a cold and can kill. If COVID continues to circulate, a routine updated vaccination will likely be added to everyone's calendar, so that life can carry on in the same way... we'll all still know that we can get it but we won't fear it.

One thought. I always resented it when people insisted on coming into work with streaming colds on the basis 'it's just a cold'. If this pandemic has taught us anything it's that one person's 'sniffles' is another person's stay in ICU. I wonder if we'll be more aware in future of the selfishness of sharing germs and adopt the practice of many other countries of routinely wearing masks as a courtesy when we're ill but still out and about? I hope so - but doubt it.
 
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Maybe the bean counters and policy makers need to re read the NHS Constitution and principles.
Principles that guide the NHS
Seven key principles guide the NHS in all it does. They are underpinned by core NHS values which have been derived from extensive discussions with staff, patients and the public. These values are set out in the next section of this document.
1. The NHS provides a comprehensive service, available to all

That includes the overweight and the smokers. Not just those that manage to get ticks in the right boxes for treatment.
 
I've just been reading an article comparing the attitude to the Spanish Flu epidemic and to Covid. 288,000 dead in two peaks with people going out to do some shopping and falling dead in the street. The first peak came in wartime so safe distancing and working from home was out of the question. There were no memorials to the dead or national mourning. I suppose death was more visible in those days. 1 in 4 babies born dead, and 10% of those not surviving past four years old. Thousands of tuberculosis deaths and average life span of men was 40 and women 50. We really aren't that badly off in my mind.
 
antiquesam said:
I've just been reading an article comparing the attitude to the Spanish Flu epidemic and to Covid. 288,000 dead in two peaks with people going out to do some shopping and falling dead in the street. The first peak came in wartime so safe distancing and working from home was out of the question. There were no memorials to the dead or national mourning. I suppose death was more visible in those days. 1 in 4 babies born dead, and 10% of those not surviving past four years old. Thousands of tuberculosis deaths and average life span of men was 40 and women 50. We really aren't that badly off in my mind.
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Do you think vaccines could have a contribution to the fact we now live a little longer than 40/50. ;)
 
mark61 said:
Not by as much as some may think.
The biggest contributor to the increased average is more children reaching adulthood.
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sparrks said:
I think it's widely accepted that far better sanitation and greatly improved drinking water has had the greatest impact on life expectancy.
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The biggest contributor to the increased average is more children reaching adulthood.
[/QUOTE]

I wasn't and didn't say vaccines were the largest factor but only asked if vaccines could have had a contribution. As the OP is about vaccines. ;)
 
TissyD said:
You are not too far behind then. They may have finished giving them by the time you started school. My OH is 64 and she had them.
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I was an Army brat, I was 16 before i stayed in the same country for more than three years. We had barrages of inoculations every time we moved. When we were posted to Malaya we had to have, what my farther called our Bob Martins, quinine tablets once a day six months before we went, every day we were there and for six months on our return to temperate climes. At sixteen I joined up and continued inoculations when posted to Hong Kong.
Years later, After a break up of my marriage, I was left with a large debt to clear. I was working 90 hours a week but still needed more money, so for about ten years all my holidays were spent doing drug trials in Simbec to keep the wolf from the door.
Times have changed, I'm with a cracking partner now, we both love getting away in Hollie ( motorhome). We both know how precious time is and both love making new memories in new places. Fair play, we have a laugh wherever we go.
 
Minisorella said:
I don't believe we'll ever be rid of this virus and subsequent mutations. The most important thing to bear in mind is that all those who are vaccinated are highly unlikely to have severe disease or die from COVID. Those who aren't vaccinated won't have this 'almost' guarantee but it's their choice. The common cold is a member of the coronavirus family and we all get colds and know we can pass them on but we don't fear them... although some people will go on to get mucus related bacterial infections that can cause them severe illness and even death. Same with 'flu... a different virus family but we all know we can get it and pass it on, so the most vulnerable will be vaccinated each year with a cumulative cocktail of all known strains because it's easily more serious than a cold and can kill. If COVID continues to circulate, a routine updated vaccination will likely be added to everyone's calendar, so that life can carry on in the same way... we'll all still know that we can get it but we won't fear it.

One thought. I always resented it when people insisted on coming into work with streaming colds on the basis 'it's just a cold'. If this pandemic has taught us anything it's that one person's 'sniffles' is another person's stay in ICU. I wonder if we'll be more aware in future of the selfishness of sharing germs and adopt the practice of many other countries of routinely wearing masks as a courtesy when we're ill but still out and about? I hope so - but doubt it.
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What a great post. I too don’t think we will ever be rid of C-19, it will just be another virus we will have to learn to live with, but hopefully the vaccines can keep up with any mutations.
I know personally we will now be much more conscious of close contact with others, when -if- we ever get get back to some form of normality, and I think we will see mask wearing continue by some, I know we probably will.
I’ve just finished a book on women and childbirth from 1900-1950, made quite harrowing reading, some babes starving to death as parents couldn’t afford to feed them, mothers dying in childbirth as they couldn’t afford a doctor, life expectancy very low, we are so fortunate today even with this pandemic that our temporary loss of freedoms pales into insignificance.
 
yorkieowl said:
What a great post. I too don’t think we will ever be rid of C-19, it will just be another virus we will have to learn to live with, but hopefully the vaccines can keep up with any mutations.
I know personally we will now be much more conscious of close contact with others, when -if- we ever get get back to some form of normality, and I think we will see mask wearing continue by some, I know we probably will.
I’ve just finished a book on women and childbirth from 1900-1950, made quite harrowing reading, some babes starving to death as parents couldn’t afford to feed them, mothers dying in childbirth as they couldn’t afford a doctor, life expectancy very low, we are so fortunate today even with this pandemic that our temporary loss of freedoms pales into insignificance.
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One of the antique programmes was fiming in Saltaire and talking about about the building of the town. They said when building started, around 1850 i think they said, the life expectancy in Bradford was 18 and a half years and 50% of children never made it beyond 15 years.
 
argoose said:
Absolutely gobsmacked. No one should be forced to have something injected into their bodies against their will.
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It ought to be made clear to them that If they don't have the vaccine when offered they shouldn't be allowed a bed in intensive care if theres someone there who has tried to help them selves by having the Vaccine that needs it
 
witzend said:
It ought to be made clear to them that If they don't have the vaccine when offered they shouldn't be allowed a bed in intensive care if theres someone there who has tried to help them selves by having the Vaccine that needs it
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I'm a great believer that everyone should have the vaccine, but once you start on descrimetry treatment you are on a slippery slope. After all take those bikers who crash, we all know motorcycling is more dangerous than being in a car, should we leave them on the side of the road? And lets not forget 100 y.o.'s who go on international holidays and contract respitory diseases, should they be excluded?
 
colinm said:
I'm a great believer that everyone should have the vaccine, but once you start on descrimetry treatment you are on a slippery slope. After all take those bikers who crash, we all know motorcycling is more dangerous than being in a car, should we leave them on the side of the road? And lets not forget 100 y.o.'s who go on international holidays and contract respitory diseases, should they be excluded?
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Surely those you have used as an example in your post will have adequate insurance that covers medical expenses unfortunately the people who may get discriminated against are the obese and smokers to name a couple and I’m not sure you can get fat insurance but I do believe the Tobacco/cigarette and companies that advertised them maybe should be putting money into the NHS to cover costs.
 
campervanannie said:
Surely those you have used as an example in your post will have adequate insurance that covers medical expenses unfortunately the people who may get discriminated against are the obese and smokers to name a couple and I’m not sure you can get fat insurance but I do believe the Tobacco/cigarette and companies that advertised them maybe should be putting money into the NHS to cover costs.
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Careful... heading into "p" territory, and I don't mean the stuff you put in sample bottles... ;):ROFLMAO:

Mind you, by the same token McDonald's should have to do the same as tobacco companies :)
 
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