Wildcamping in Wales are we welcome?

[Austin J2]

My apologies to Hallmut for not responding to your request for the source of my quote, its been a busy day! The site was indeed thebmc.co.uk website, as tracked down by Austin J2. I do have some up to date news though, I called in to the carpark near Morrison’s in Brecon yesterday to see if they were permitting overnight stays by motorhomes as had been the case in Powys before the lockdown. I can report that the official signage clearly permits motorhomes to stay overnight for no more than one night in seven.

Thank you for the update. I'm guess this is on POI map?

 

[Andyzot]

Be aware Pembrokeshire council are launching a big initiative to patrol remote car parks over the coming months in a bid to curb overnight camper vans.

 

[kangooroo]

The police are moving on campers throughout Pembrokeshire National Park...

 

[runnach]

The police are moving on campers throughout Pembrokeshire National Park...

Camper vans and motorhomes?

 

[mickymost]

Campers meaning tents?

 

[GMB]

We have travelled, still here! to the west coast and found no problems. Stumble head, New Quay carpark for a tenner, Aberystwyth, several nice laybys just outside ceibwr bay, have also been to a couple of CL sites so we can empty toilet and fill with water. No issues at all apart from sunburnt knees.

 

[suneye]

I don't understand on what basis fines might be issued for overnight parking in remote places.

There are no travel restrictions in place in Wales at present.

I would take social media reports with a pinch of salt.

I am intending to head to North Wales and Anglesey tomorrow.

I will report back ...

Any updates?

 

[Austin J2]

We have travelled, still here! to the west coast and found no problems. Stumble head, New Quay carpark for a tenner, Aberystwyth, several nice laybys just outside ceibwr bay, have also been to a couple of CL sites so we can empty toilet and fill with water. No issues at all apart from sunburnt knees.

Thats great to read your not having any problems hope it stays that way. If we do go I hope the weather is kind to us too, but I'm not sure I want sunburnt knees eakk lol

 

[Austin J2]

I don't understand on what basis fines might be issued for overnight parking in remote places.

There are no travel restrictions in place in Wales at present.

I would take social media reports with a pinch of salt.

I am intending to head to North Wales and Anglesey tomorrow.

I will report back ...

How is the trip going? Is it busy in North Wales and Anglesey ?

 

[mandd]

Just returned from 14 day 850 mile round Pembrokeshire ,up the west coast ,Anglesy and the north Wales coast Did not experience any hostility from the locals in fact quite the opposite. Stayed mostly on farm sites with no power and free camped one night near the toll bridge to Barmouth.

 

[Canalsman]

How is the trip going? Is it busy in North Wales and Anglesey ?

So far so good. The natives are friendly.

Quite a lot of motorhomes on the road. Tonight I'm parked up in Caernarfon looking across the Menai Strait and out the windscreen at the castle.

Two others appear to be staying the night.

 

[Val54]

So far so good. The natives are friendly.

Quite a lot of motorhomes on the road. Tonight I'm parked up in Caernarfon looking across the Menai Strait and out the windscreen at the castle.

Two others appear to be staying the night.

That's a nice spot

 

[Canalsman]

Certainly is, my first visit

 

[Deleted member 64209]

Happy-ish memories... I bought a diesel 1965 ex GPO J2 when it was about 8 years old with hardly any miles on it... Went to Scotland [from London] and back in it. Although it's a real treat to see one still on the road I have to admit when I think about that journey, - although it never missed a beat it makes me want to go outside in the rain and kiss my 16 year old Sprinter and beg forgiveness for lightly cursing when she's a tad sluggish going up hills as I recall being overtaken by more than one cyclist on that jaunt... All the very best to you and Bubbles... Respect, genuine major respect Sir!

 

[Deleted member 47550]

I just found because I've always known unless you have permission of landowner in England and Wales it is illegal to Wild Camp (and in any case Wild Camping means no motorised access). Scotland is starting to get like this in many areas as well with the islands such as Mull handing out leaflets telling you to use sites.

Wild Camping Laws for England and Wales
Almost all of the land you can walk across in England and Wales is owned by somebody. It may be an individual, a company/commercial organisation (including The Crown Estate), a charity (National Trust etc) or even the government or similar authority. These are almost always referred to as the ‘landowner’ and I will do the same throughout this post.

In England and Wales you do not have the right to pitch a tent, tarp, hammock or bivvy bag on the land belonging to somebody else without the permission of that landowner. To do so without the permission of that landowner means that you are committing trespass – which is a civil offence (i.e. non-arrestable). However, if you do not immediately leave when directed to do so by the landowner or somebody acting on their behalf (such as a gamekeeper or land agent, or security guard) then you may be committing a criminal offence (Aggravated Trespass) – something that a Police officer can arrest you for. There are also a few places where you will be immediately committing criminal trespass as soon as you cross onto that land – such as railway lines, some education establishments and of course sites vital for national defence and security.

This all still applies if you are in the middle of nowhere, stood on top of a mountain in Snowdonia or the Lake District, and cannot see another human or even a road. In the vast majority of cases it still belongs to a landowner, and legally speaking you would still need the permission of the landowner.

The Countryside Rights of Way Act (CROW Act 2000)
This was a landmark piece of legislation that opened up huge swathes of the English and Welsh countryside to the general public, creating what is often referred to as the Right to Roam. This means that within certain, designated areas (often upland and large areas of forest or heathland) the general public can walk over the land, away from Public Rights of Way. This opens up most of the mountainous and remote areas of England and Wales for recreation and exploration on foot and effectively ended disputed access over certain areas, such as Chrome Hill in the Peak District.
One thing that wasn’t included in the Right to Roam was the ‘Right to Camp’ – it did not change the fact that camping on land without permission of the landowner is civil trespass, and in fact says quite clearly that camping is not permitted under the CROW Act:

1. Section 2(1) does not entitle a person to be on any land if, in or on that
land, he:
…
(s) engages in any organised games, or in camping, hang-gliding or paragliding,

That’s pretty clear – the CROW Act changed a lot about where we could walk, but not about where we were legally allowed to camp.

Hang on, what about Dartmoor?
Right Dartmoor. That is a different case.
16th Century English poet John Leland said that “Dartmore is muche a wilde Morish and forest Ground“. He wasn’t wrong, although there is a bit less forest now than there was in his day.
This fairly wild and expanse tract of moor in the South West of England abounds with myths and literary associations (watch out for The Hound of the Baskervilles), and is also home to various Ministry of Defence (MOD) training sites and a few other places of interest. It’s also pretty much the only place where you can legally wild camp in England without first checking with the landowner.

There are local byelaws that permit camping within certain areas of the Dartmoor National Park (see interactive map below) as long as you do so within the following rules:

1. No person shall knowingly use any vehicle, including a caravan or any structure other than a tent for the purpose of camping on the access land or land set out for the use or parking of vehicles except on any area which may be set apart and indicated by notice as a place where such camping is permitted.

2. No person shall knowingly erect a tent on the access land for the purpose of campinga) in any area listed in Schedule 2 to these byelaws;(b)within 100 metres of any public road or in any enclosure.

3. No person shall camp in a tent on the same site on the access land for more than two consecutive nights, except on any area which may be set apart and indicated by notice as a place where such camping is permitted.

 

[TJBi]

I just found because I've always known unless you have permission of landowner in England and Wales it is illegal to Wild Camp (and in any case Wild Camping means no motorised access). Scotland is starting to get like this in many areas as well with the islands such as Mull handing out leaflets telling you to use sites.

Wild Camping Laws for England and Wales
Almost all of the land you can walk across in England and Wales is owned by somebody. It may be an individual, a company/commercial organisation (including The Crown Estate), a charity (National Trust etc) or even the government or similar authority. These are almost always referred to as the ‘landowner’ and I will do the same throughout this post.

In England and Wales you do not have the right to pitch a tent, tarp, hammock or bivvy bag on the land belonging to somebody else without the permission of that landowner. To do so without the permission of that landowner means that you are committing trespass – which is a civil offence (i.e. non-arrestable). However, if you do not immediately leave when directed to do so by the landowner or somebody acting on their behalf (such as a gamekeeper or land agent, or security guard) then you may be committing a criminal offence (Aggravated Trespass) – something that a Police officer can arrest you for. There are also a few places where you will be immediately committing criminal trespass as soon as you cross onto that land – such as railway lines, some education establishments and of course sites vital for national defence and security.

This all still applies if you are in the middle of nowhere, stood on top of a mountain in Snowdonia or the Lake District, and cannot see another human or even a road. In the vast majority of cases it still belongs to a landowner, and legally speaking you would still need the permission of the landowner.

The Countryside Rights of Way Act (CROW Act 2000)
This was a landmark piece of legislation that opened up huge swathes of the English and Welsh countryside to the general public, creating what is often referred to as the Right to Roam. This means that within certain, designated areas (often upland and large areas of forest or heathland) the general public can walk over the land, away from Public Rights of Way. This opens up most of the mountainous and remote areas of England and Wales for recreation and exploration on foot and effectively ended disputed access over certain areas, such as Chrome Hill in the Peak District.
One thing that wasn’t included in the Right to Roam was the ‘Right to Camp’ – it did not change the fact that camping on land without permission of the landowner is civil trespass, and in fact says quite clearly that camping is not permitted under the CROW Act:


That’s pretty clear – the CROW Act changed a lot about where we could walk, but not about where we were legally allowed to camp.

Hang on, what about Dartmoor?
Right Dartmoor. That is a different case.
16th Century English poet John Leland said that “Dartmore is muche a wilde Morish and forest Ground“. He wasn’t wrong, although there is a bit less forest now than there was in his day.
This fairly wild and expanse tract of moor in the South West of England abounds with myths and literary associations (watch out for The Hound of the Baskervilles), and is also home to various Ministry of Defence (MOD) training sites and a few other places of interest. It’s also pretty much the only place where you can legally wild camp in England without first checking with the landowner.

There are local byelaws that permit camping within certain areas of the Dartmoor National Park (see interactive map below) as long as you do so within the following rules:

1. 
   
2. 
   

OK, so camping can be an issue, but I don't camp - I park.

 

[barge1914]

We have travelled, still here! to the west coast and found no problems. Stumble head, New Quay carpark for a tenner, Aberystwyth, several nice laybys just outside ceibwr bay, have also been to a couple of CL sites so we can empty toilet and fill with water. No issues at all apart from sunburnt knees.

Were the CLs booked up/ Or did they let you use their services?

 

[mickymost]

I just found because I've always known unless you have permission of landowner in England and Wales it is illegal to Wild Camp (and in any case Wild Camping means no motorised access). Scotland is starting to get like this in many areas as well with the islands such as Mull handing out leaflets telling you to use sites.

Wild Camping Laws for England and Wales
Almost all of the land you can walk across in England and Wales is owned by somebody. It may be an individual, a company/commercial organisation (including The Crown Estate), a charity (National Trust etc) or even the government or similar authority. These are almost always referred to as the ‘landowner’ and I will do the same throughout this post.

In England and Wales you do not have the right to pitch a tent, tarp, hammock or bivvy bag on the land belonging to somebody else without the permission of that landowner. To do so without the permission of that landowner means that you are committing trespass – which is a civil offence (i.e. non-arrestable). However, if you do not immediately leave when directed to do so by the landowner or somebody acting on their behalf (such as a gamekeeper or land agent, or security guard) then you may be committing a criminal offence (Aggravated Trespass) – something that a Police officer can arrest you for. There are also a few places where you will be immediately committing criminal trespass as soon as you cross onto that land – such as railway lines, some education establishments and of course sites vital for national defence and security.

This all still applies if you are in the middle of nowhere, stood on top of a mountain in Snowdonia or the Lake District, and cannot see another human or even a road. In the vast majority of cases it still belongs to a landowner, and legally speaking you would still need the permission of the landowner.

The Countryside Rights of Way Act (CROW Act 2000)
This was a landmark piece of legislation that opened up huge swathes of the English and Welsh countryside to the general public, creating what is often referred to as the Right to Roam. This means that within certain, designated areas (often upland and large areas of forest or heathland) the general public can walk over the land, away from Public Rights of Way. This opens up most of the mountainous and remote areas of England and Wales for recreation and exploration on foot and effectively ended disputed access over certain areas, such as Chrome Hill in the Peak District.
One thing that wasn’t included in the Right to Roam was the ‘Right to Camp’ – it did not change the fact that camping on land without permission of the landowner is civil trespass, and in fact says quite clearly that camping is not permitted under the CROW Act:


That’s pretty clear – the CROW Act changed a lot about where we could walk, but not about where we were legally allowed to camp.

Hang on, what about Dartmoor?
Right Dartmoor. That is a different case.
16th Century English poet John Leland said that “Dartmore is muche a wilde Morish and forest Ground“. He wasn’t wrong, although there is a bit less forest now than there was in his day.
This fairly wild and expanse tract of moor in the South West of England abounds with myths and literary associations (watch out for The Hound of the Baskervilles), and is also home to various Ministry of Defence (MOD) training sites and a few other places of interest. It’s also pretty much the only place where you can legally wild camp in England without first checking with the landowner.

There are local byelaws that permit camping within certain areas of the Dartmoor National Park (see interactive map below) as long as you do so within the following rules:

1. 
   
2. 
   

This all relates to someone in a Tent wouldnt it be better to put it on a Tenting Forum?This Forum all Members drive Motorhomes and Campervans.

 

[Deleted member 47550]

This all relates to someone in a Tent wouldnt it be better to put it on a Tenting Forum?This Forum all Members drive Motorhomes and Campervans.

That may be; but too many people buy a camper/motorhome and think they can drive to Scotland and stop anywhere overnight or for longer. Also a vast majority of these folk don't realise 'Wild Camping' refers to non motorised transport. What's happened now is those same people think it's ok to do it in England and Wales! We should all be fine as long as we stick to what we know and do the one night only and leave early no trace mantra rather than what I often see - arrive early to bag a place and stay till later the next day!

 

[mickymost]

That may be; but too many people buy a camper/motorhome and think they can drive to Scotland and stop anywhere overnight or for longer. Also a vast majority of these folk don't realise 'Wild Camping' refers to non motorised transport. What's happened now is those same people think it's ok to do it in England and Wales! We should all be fine as long as we stick to what we know and do the one night only and leave early no trace mantra rather than what I often see - arrive early to bag a place and stay till later the next day!

These wild camping laws apply to Scotland too one has the right to roam and camp in Scotland but it only applies to tents.