Thinking about a Scooter

[davecasafundada]

Hi all

We moved over from tourers to our Hymer B544 in May last year and had a wonderful time getting used to our new toy and the benefits verses the drawbacks of a motorhome over a tourer. The motorhome won in every respect except for one; when towing, the car does come in handy when you want to nip out! Yes, we used buses, walked, took our bikes etc; but still felt we were at a bit of a disadvantage from time to time.

The good news is that when we aquired our vehicle it already had a scooter rack fitted; it's a galvanised type, fits into the towbar bracket, fitted by Armitages in West Yorks when the vehicle first hit our shores in 2002.

So were 60, 'fairy fit' and fancy the idea of getting a scooter! Being old, our current licence covers us up to 50cc. I know we need to go out and look at a few try them for size etc. There seems to be so many different types of scooter out there; all a bit daunting, we have looked at a few on line, lots of dealers local to us in Nottingham with what appears to be good second hand bargains, (yes second hand is best for our pocket), we don't like those with a 'high' rear pillion particularly (to blooming difficult to get on!).

So is this a good or bad idea? We don't want to go miles on it, just be a little more mobile when on our travels. Any thoughts, ideas, suggestions and what scooters may fit the bill please. Cheers Dave and Ginny

 

[DTDog]

We bought a BRAND NEW Beeline Voloce 50cc scooter in the summer for just over £1000 and its great.

I considered a second hand 'known brand' one like Honda, Yamaha etc. but my thought was that most scooters are bought by 'yoofs' and would generally be abused. I then looked at these cheap Chinese scooters (which most of these cheap end scooters are Chinese imports, but then again Honda and Yamaha are Japanese).

They have been around long enough know to have proved themselves.
Dont get me wrong, they are what they ...... cheap and basic! They wont have a good re-sale value, but buying new gives you three years without having to MOT it. And you know the history of it.

We bought ours so that we can park up when 'Wilding' on the edge of a town rather than trying to park the van in a town centre, then take the scooter in to town. Parking is usually free for scooters and generally you can get away with parking it anywhere (as long as you dont block a footpath, I have parked mine on wide sections of footpaths if I cant find a parking place).
Most have a large storage section under the seat (well, large enough for a daily shop of bread, milk and a few tins and cans).

We travelled from High Marnham (BrownLow Arms) to Newark, a distance of 12miles with two of us on the scooter! It wasnt the fastest thing on the road, but you're on holiday so time isn't important (we have helmet intercoms so we just chatted and took in the sites as we plodded on).
I even went from Buxworth (Navigation Inn) to Ladybower reservoir, a distance of 15miles on 30 December (yes, it was COLD) taking me via Winnats pass (some people wont take motorhomes up Winnats Pass due to how steep it is).

I would suggest you price up insurance first though. Mine costs £95 for the year for the two of us and I've held a motorbike licence for 15+ years.
Tax is only £16 and fuel is almost free!! Well, I filled mine (coming back from Buxworth) and it cost £2.65 to fill it and it will do about 10000000 miles to the gallon?
The other consideration is security. I have a 'garage' in the rear of our motorhome so the scooter isnt visible. You say yours has a 'Rack' on the back. Scooters are VERY knickable from the same 'yoofs' as above because of the ease in riding them as well as hot wiring them to start them.
Possibly the Japanese brands have better security, but ours hasnt got the best locks in the world. I have a rather large chain round ours even when in the garage.

 

[davecasafundada]

Considering the price of secondhand it seems worthwhile going for new with 3 years MOT and known history. The ease of parking is something we have already considered, especially when you compare it to parking the motorhome! The security is a really good point and one that I have not considered to be honest, yes, how easy would it be to 'knick it' whilst we're tucked up! Looking at some new now at 'Scooter City' starting at £750!

Thanks for all that DTDog...food for thought and lots of good stuff to consider! Dave

 

[GRWXJR]

Scooter - what to get.

IMO, I'd definitely rather have an older Japanese-made scooter (plus there's some nice enough kit made by Piaggio group i.e. Aprilia, Vespa that you could consider over any of the Chinese brands.

The Chinese stuff is getting better slowly, and the quality of the importers and spares back-up, support etc. is improving. But right now, when there is hugely variable reliability and build quality on Chinese stuff, (meaning higher chance it'll break-down, with less chance of being able to fix it easily) - personally I'd rather avoid.

My daughter picked up a cheap chinese scoot and it was truly appalling - very poor quality alloy meant that it basically shook itself apart and was frankly unsafe in a mileage and time period [it was only 14-mths old when she got it] that a Jap machine would have brushed off without issue.

Condition is everything as has been said, if its been a 'yoof' model then they get mullahed. Having said that, then just like some cars are a yoof magnet while others aren't (Citroen Saxo anyone? No, thought not) so are scoots.

Most mfrs have 'sporty' funky yoof models, and also more staid commuter models. Often these commuter are bought by people with the best intentions of using them instead of the car, but then find they hate putting the wet gear on for the ride to work, or get scared by the traffic and end up not using them much and flogging them on. So they can be found.

A Honda / Yamaha / Suzuki / Vespa / Piaggio commuter model without too many miles (this is relative too - remember these are dinky engines so 10k is quite a lot, so the lower the better) and in good clean and un-crashed condition should see you right. Condition is far more important than the age.

Have a good look underneath (as the plastic can look good on top, but hide a rusty exhaust and chassis underneath) as well. Most won't rust badly, but its a good indicator of if the miles are genuine and the bodywork original.

Oh yes - probably worth having a look on Gumtree or similar for something private and local. As scoots are often not a lot of money, then there's a good chance they'll be advertised like this. Also, forgot there's a (I think Korean) manufactrer called Kymco who seem to be rated a good by many, and they are widely available and sold. I just had a quick look, and someone is selling an '03 Kymco in London for £445 as an example.

Hope this helps!

 

[GRWXJR]

Forgot - Peugeots

just to add... Peugeots! I forgot about them!

My daughter ran a (from new) 2001 Peugeot Trekker 50cc 2-stroke for several years and about 15k and practically zero maintenance and it was great - reliable and nippy (derestricted so it'd do about 45mph - far safer on country lanes than 30mph being tailgated by everyone).

It was her only motorised transport and she used to trust it to carry her over some journeys far longer than scoots are typically used for and it never let her down.

A lot of folks don't like 2-strokes, but I love em for scoots and small bikes - generally a bit more poke than a 4-stroke, and about as complicated as a deck chair. No oil to change (just keep the 2T tank filled) & they have a variator belt FD so no gearbox oil to worry about either.

A new plug now n then and look after the brakes and that's about it (variators go eventually, but not major - and daughters never needed anything except a rear tyre & some pads). Motorised transport couldn't be simpler!

Couldn't fault the thing - should've mentioned it first time. It may be best to avoid the 'Speedfight' models though (think Citroen Saxo!)

 

[Tow Itch]

Dave and Ginny

I want to try and help you and believe you may both have a wonderful time but I'm wondering how to arrange certain ideas without sounding like it's all a bad idea because nothing is further from the truth.
Bikes I'm torn between saying get a scooter and saying leave it till you pass your CBT. https://www.gov.uk/cbt-compulsory-basic-training/what-cbt-involves
Most people start to ride motorcycles at a relatively young age when there is a goodly amount of perceived immortality about them. This might be negative from a safety point of view but helps the learning process no end and removes initial concern. I had sort of learnt how to ride a bike but was in my mid thirties before taking my CBT. Confidence wasn't high perhaps not helped by buying a bike within two weeks and having to ride it almost exactly 100 miles home. Confident motorist to Mr vertical on a bike (unable to lean) who couldn't even process direction signs on roundabouts. Having to turn right at all roundabouts and then having to select an exit on the second circuit. Some malign things conspired to make that a less than wonderful day it was only poverty that stopped me walking away from the bike permanently that day. If I had I would have missed the desperate joy that the coming months brought. The growing ability to ride and confidence is a wonderful time. So having bought a bike might force you into stepping over a hard start line, but while you will have little knowledge of what you want after your CBT you will have none before it so I'm against getting a bike first.
Motorcycling is desperately subjective so what I think you want or need you may well not. There is an exception to this a moped or 50. You do not want a moped. Just enough power to engage with traffic but not enough power to get out of the gutter. Bad at 30MPH hellish on any other speed of road. As an I.A.M. driver and rider I still say shove the law if a child of mine needed transport at 16 they would have accidentally bought a de-restricted or even bored out (80cc) bike. I don't hate anyone enough to wish a moped on them.
About you. Are you fairly petite or trim or not? 125s (largest size of bike or scooter for learning) are not particularly over powered or too large of physical size. One or two exceptions the 11KW (15BHP) limit on 125s is quite adequate but many scooters and bikes will not attain this output. I'm presuming you want 1 bike not 2 but the more comfortable and powerful end will be harder to get on the carrier.
You have picked a great time to learn. There has just been a new restrictive license system brought out that encourages 17 year old's not to take a test as they can't ride anything more powerful and has resulted in a similar rush for tests for 21 to 24 year old's so the riding schools should be empty at the moment and many will be desperate for business. Yes you could just ride on your CBT for 2 years then do another but passing your test is never a bad idea. How can being a vulnerable road user and avoiding a test of your competence be a good idea. You may not want to ride anything bigger than a 125 but I would always encourage a full licence.
The missus is going to have a go too? Not being sexist I don't want you to be a prisoner but be aware. I may spot faults in a driving style but I'm generally a relaxed car passenger. Not so on a bike. The process engages you more fully and the definitions of what you would want to do where are sharper. I've not pillioned many riders and felt half way comfortable. It might be very difficult for you to passenger each other.
So the advice you wanted what scooter. Here I am the least use of all. The motorcycle world is majorly one of toys, the practical commuter or traveller is not something column inches are wasted on by journalists. Except scooters but unfortunately the scooters taken seriously (sic) are the super scooters The Honda Silverwing 2012 Silver Wing ABS Overview - Honda Powersports the Yamaha TMAX TMAX 2013 - Scooters - Yamaha Motor UK and the Suzuki Burgman Suzuki GB Motorcycles/ATVs: On Road Scooter Range None of these are what you want. I can contrast the 125 Super scooters like the 125 Burgman. Look at lighter 125 scooters like the Peugeot Vivacity 118Kg instead of 156Kg but still with useful underseat space then finally offer up the large wheel scooters the spiritual sucessors to the Honda C50-90. Large wheel scooters have a lot going for them I'm just not particularly au fait with the whole scooter world you need to do a bit of reading. Motorcycle Sport and Leisure used to do a few scooter reviews the main man behind odd bikes or scooters on the magazine was Peter Henshaw you may try any recent publications by him. Twist and Go and Scootering are the two main scotter monthlies. How much bikes how much fashion and tat? I could persuade you to a classic 2 stroke scooter but it might not be your thing. I'd agree with GRWXJR though for small capacity single cylinder bikes 2 strokes are so much easier to ride but alas they are a dying breed with the air quality Nazis sending them to....... (No I'll not use that metaphor) Kevin Ash does some scooter reviews on line
Scooters | Ash On Bikes. If you read any distance into the forum you will discover Kevin died last week. Kevin Ash - Telegraph Not what you asked but lets cover that one. Motorcycling or scootering isn't necessarily a short cut to the mortuary or a chance to be an organ donor if you have already been a cyclist you were more vulnerable then.

I think for commuting scooters are more practical than motorcycles but keep your options open and look at a few small bikes.

When you get to more direct questions then it's easier to help.