Refillable gas cylinders

[messenger 2.5td]

Noticed at work this week a large lpg tank had been installed a day or two later employees in gas powered forklifts were turning up to fill up their bottles just wondered if the same rules applied as the gaslow systems ie only refilling to 80 per cent full.Had alook at the new bottles on the forklift it looks as if they have a type of relief valve on this may be to stop over filling anyone seen similar systems for plant vehicles,Andy.

 

[Deleted member 2636]

Please let us know how you get on. There are places that scrap fork lift trucks...

 

[Deleted member 3057]

I have just taken a fork lift truck driving licence and I had to know how to refill the lpg tank on the rear of the truck.
It has a bleed valve fitted to stop over filling which is opened before filling, then closed when liquid gas escapes from it as the tank is then full.

Seemed a messy and smelly job and you need leather gloves to stop being 'burned' by the escaping gas.

Also the gas bottle has to be horizontal not vertical.

Think you need Calor or Gaslow really.

 

[messenger 2.5td]

I don't get to drive the gas powered forklifts nowadays although i do have a licence,wouldn't want to be in the vicinity when one goes pop.As you say ***** why are they stored horizontally got to be a danger,constantly getting shaken aboutThe firm i work for are very good about health and safety issues but may well query this one,Andy.

 

[Deleted member 2636]

I really like the idea of filling a cylinder until gas comes out of the relief valve. Sounds like a recipe for a disaster

 

[Deleted member 207]

I have fixed horizontal LPG tanks fitted to the Westfalias, its just a case of connecting the fill hose and filling with Autogas, there is a rotary contents guage, but the filling pumps take care of the 80% rule by cutting out at a pre determined pressure for LPG.

The position of the vapour pipe inside the tank is specific to the design, a horizontal tank has to be positioned so that only vapour will exit - not liquid. Vertical bottles have the same problem, lay it on its side and it will let liquid LPG out - the regulator (if fitted) should stop the liquid going any further.

The days of opening a bleed valve (I thought) had ended in the late 1980s for anything other than those little gas bottles and that was more about proving a bottle was full to the customers than filling the bottle safely by using pumps.

 

[Deleted member 2636]

From what "Roger" has justed posted it is eveident that "jeffscarborough" is being encouraged to engage in a very unsafe working practise: One does wonder if a) The Unions are fully aware and b) if the H&SE are

 

[Deleted member 3057]

I thought it was a bit dodgy at the time. So have had a look on't web and it seems that is how its done.

http://www.propane101.com/propanecylinderfilling.htm

Cylinders Filled By Bleeder Valve
Cylinders filled by fixed liquid level gauge, such as forklift cylinders are not required to be filled by weight. They are subject to visual inspections and recertification requirements like all cylinders but are not filled using a scale. Some companies may use a scale but the standard practice is to use the fixed liquid level gauge (bleeder valve). Once the hose end nozzle is hooked up to the cylinder and the pump is turned on, the bottle filler will wait for liquid to spew out and turn off the pump. The bleeder valve will be closed and the hose will be disconnected. The bleeder valve is the indicator letting the attendant know when the cylinder is full. He's not inadvertently letting propane out of your cylinder but rather following the rules and abiding by the law governing cylinder filling.

By the way, I am not a FLT operator. It was offered to me at work and seemed like a 'change' for a week.

 

[Deleted member 3057]

From what "Roger" has justed posted it is eveident that "jeffscarborough" is being encouraged to engage in a very unsafe working practise: One does wonder if a) The Unions are fully aware and b) if the H&SE are

Oh and,

I think that these comments should be aimed at yourselves for considering to save a few quid by using scrap FLT cylinders on your motorhome.

Gaslow make refillable tanks for M/H's if you cannot afford Calor.

 

[carthago]

fork truck bottles

[fork truck bottles have a stack pipe inside,this allows them to pick up liquid gas which goes into a vaporiser then into a mixer unit.not really suitable for campers.i have continental bottles which i have made an adaptor so i can refill them(with care)at my local gas station,hes a mate of mine but hes not keen of it.they are 11kgs so when empty i put 22lts of gas in them,been doing this for about 6yrs with no probs

 

[Baggins]

Dual Use LPG

Some years ago when I had LPG conversion on a Kon-Tiki I was offered the possibility - at extra cost - of having a vapour take of point to use for cooking/heating as opposed to the liquid gas used by the engine. I didn't take up the option at the time but would consider same for my current Duetto if I could hear from anyone with experience of the matter.

Turned out nice in Whitby - I don't think I've seen as many people about in September anywhere down South.

BW

 

[Deleted member 2636]

Oh and,

I think that these comments should be aimed at yourselves for considering to save a few quid by using scrap FLT cylinders on your motorhome.

Gaslow make refillable tanks for M/H's if you cannot afford Calor.

I already have a bulk LPG tank...

 

[Airecraft]

I really like the idea of filling a cylinder until gas comes out of the relief valve. Sounds like a recipe for a disaster

Doesn't a similar thing happen when you fill your car with petrol - petrol vapour comes out of the filler and liquid drips off the filler nozzle?

Andy

 

[Deleted member 207]

Doesn't a similar thing happen when you fill your car with petrol - petrol vapour comes out of the filler and liquid drips off the filler nozzle?

Yes its similar, the difference is the volume of gas vapour that liquid LPG produces when it is released, my dim memory says about 1 litre of liquid "gas" produces about 500 litres of vapour, mix that with air for the right flammable mix and you get a potential 15,000 litre pancake shaped flammable area. LPG also produces a lot of static electricity when being pumped or passed through hoses, so there is always the risk of a static spark igniting the gas at the wrong time. Whereas the petrol vapour being released from the fill nozzle is usually too lean to burn - but it does happen when the wire inside the pump hose fails and you get a static spark jump across as the nozzle is removed from the fuel filler.

The risk with all flammable fuels is basically humans - they get complacent, they put speed ahead of their safety, something breaks and they cobble together half a dozen leaky adaptors, they dont bother turning off the forklift....etc etc.