Petition: Amend PCSC Bill to withdraw power to seize vehicles used as mobile homes

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Ellendale said:
Exactly the same happened on the sea front at Aberystwyth. When we travelled the west coastline of Wales we often stopped over night in Aber - can't anymore after inconsiderate people decided to stay for months at a time! At one point I counted 27 all in a line and most of them had gas bottles on the pavement and grey water taps dripping into the road. Quite a few had their dogs tied up to the van and unscooped poop on the pavement. At this particular time I counted 12 with the big green W - a nice advert I don't think! Oh and now? Not only is the parking area patrolled but the signs are very clear indeed since new legislation passed by the Council. Another lovely stopover ruined!
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As usual, the majority get affected by the inconsiderate actions of the few.
 
Wotascandal said:
This is going to adversely affect many people who live in their vans because they cannot afford to buy or rent a house or flat with the current property prices and rents, A case in point: my step daughter, she has two degrees and is a key worker in the NHS as a psychiatric nurse in Bristol. This new law is draconian and is par for the course from the likes of Priti Patel. It is a shameful attack on the vast majority of currently law abiding van dwellers.
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Why is it. You don't have a 'right' to park on other people's property or land?
If you have sought permission to park and it's been granted, you won't be asked to leave - unless you have disrespected the area by dumping rubbish, been ant-social, or been the cause of damage to the property or surroundings.
If you are a 'law-abiding' van dweller, you won't be parked illegally, or carrying out anti-social activities, so how is this a 'shameful attack' - can't see the issue here.
 
maureenandtom said:
But, as far as I can see, this will apply also to land in public ownership. If so, then the Bill will be in conflict with other laws. You might remember the Court of Appeal ruling supporting the right of Travellers not to have their nomadic lifestyle obstructed. The ruling was about council injunctions but it's not too imaginative to include height barriers and such in the spirit of the ruling. I think Bill is an effort to get around the ruling.
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TBH, the "unauthorised encampment" bit seems almost an afterthought as the Bill does much, much more than turn the previously civil matter of setting up camp and refusing to move into a criminal one. I've posted a link to the Bill below for those who want the info 'from the horses mouth'.
maureenandtom said:
Organisations such as "Liberty" equally concerned about things like the right to protest being taken away as part of the Bill.
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AFAICT, it doesn't take away the right to protest. However, it does explicitly ban the disruption of lawful activity usually carried out at a place of protest. So, for example, the group of protesters who chained themselves to concrete blocks to blockade McDonalds distribution centres would have committed a criminal offence under the new legislation.

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/58-02/0133/210133.pdf
 
witzend said:
I'd rather the Police didn't get this power as what ever is quoted they'd translate it to suit themselves. As for travellers in Europe places are provided for them Gens du Voyage in France why don't our councils do the same here which would remove their parking problems. They'd not seize one of their vehicles as that would make a family Homeless and require rehousing.
But They'd have one of ours in a minute
Petition signed
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Yes, if the police get this power they will use it whether justified or not. As we have seen countless times they now dish out fines and arrest people just because they like to exert power over people and punish rather than protect them.
 
The Bill is partly an attempt to counter the failings of Section 61 of the Criminal Justice Act. Under that Act, the police have powers to move on unauthorised encampments of 6 or more vehicles. However most forces will not use that power unless there is a legal traveller site within that local authority area to which the "offenders" can moved. If there is and the "offenders" refuse to go to that site, then the police have the power to escort them out of that local authority area. These "transit sites" for travellers are as rare as hen's teeth, why, when the local authority is required to provide them as well as permanent sites? Simple, cash and politics, cash strapped authorities don't have such provision high on their priorities and no local councillor is going to vote for a transit site to be established in their area. This historic merry-go-round has no quick fix and no solution that will please everyone. The best traveller sites are run by the travellers themselves, but they have very strict codes as to which "groups" they will allow on. Unfortunately there is a minority of the travelling community that will never fit in either to the travellers' own traditions or the public generally.
 
witzend said:
I'd rather the Police didn't get this power as what ever is quoted they'd translate it to suit themselves. As for travellers in Europe places are provided for them Gens du Voyage in France why don't our councils do the same here which would remove their parking problems. They'd not seize one of their vehicles as that would make a family Homeless and require rehousing.
But They'd have one of ours in a minute
Petition signed
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If a van-dweller, how would that not make them homeless too?

We all know the issues with so-called travellers / gypsy's / or whatever you wish to call them. If they respected the environment where they pitched, didn't cause havoc in the local area's as many do by theft, fights, dumping rubbish and vehicles, intimidating people etc., then they would be better accepted in all communities. I am not suggesting every one is like this, but we all know that many are, thus making more and more restrictions for everyone in a motorhome (or caravan).

DocMartin said:
Yes, if the police get this power they will use it whether justified or not. As we have seen countless times they now dish out fines and arrest people just because they like to exert power over people and punish rather than protect them.
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I've not found that with the Police. They have a difficult job to do, and yes, there will always be the odd heavy-handed over-the-top policeman, as there are in all walks of life. Maybe previously had to deal with a very awkward customer.... but generally I have found them fair - if you treat them with respect too. They are only human like the rest of us. If a whole group of motorhomer's illegally parked on private or public land without permission, I'm sure they would go in heavy-handed, as they would (rightly or wrongly) assume they would be met by trouble.
 
Val54 said:
These "transit sites" for travellers are as rare as hen's teeth, why, when the local authority is required to provide them as well as permanent sites? Simple, cash and politics, cash strapped authorities don't have such provision high on their priorities and no local councillor is going to vote for a transit site to be established in their area.
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Not surprising really, when you see how some site's are treated.
 
If a law doesnt have any teeth its not much point having it , as it will just be ignored JMHE
 
Thank you TR5. Maybe not dramatising - maybe genuine misgivings. I think that because all of us will agree with at least some part of the Bill then we believe we have to accept ALL of the Bill. And maybe we do. However, there seems to me to be a growing list of respectable organisastions voicing opposition and raising petitions. I've stopped looking but here are three. The one from Liberty is particularly worth a read.

Manifesto Club http://manifestoclub.info/do-we-wan...the-police-bill-must-be-stopped-at-all-costs/

Amnesty International https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/uk-mps-should-vote-down-dystopian-policing-bill

Liberty https://www.libertyhumanrights.org....-Courts-Bill-HoC-2nd-reading-March-2021-1.pdf

These at least will be factual rather then merely intended to heighten emotion.

I'm not in favour of the Bill though there are parts I agree with; and parts I do not. I've signed a couple of petitions and I'm broadly against it - mainly because of the increased restrictions on our recreational motorhoming way of life.
 
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maureenandtom said:
Thank you TR5. Maybe not dramatising - maybe genuine misgivings. I think that because all of us will agree with at least some part of the Bill then we believe we have to accept ALL of the Bill. And maybe we do. However, there seems to me to be a growing list of respectable organisastions voicing opposition and raising petitions. I've stopped looking but here are three. The one from Liberty is particularly worth a read.

Manifesto Club http://manifestoclub.info/do-we-wan...the-police-bill-must-be-stopped-at-all-costs/

Amnesty International https://www.amnesty.org.uk/press-releases/uk-mps-should-vote-down-dystopian-policing-bill

Liberty https://www.libertyhumanrights.org....-Courts-Bill-HoC-2nd-reading-March-2021-1.pdf

These at least will be factual rather then merely intended to heighten emotion.

I'm not in favour of the Bill though there are parts I agree with; and parts I do not. I've signed a couple of petitions and I'm broadly against it - mainly because of the increased restrictions on our recreational motorhoming way of life.
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I agree, the rights to protest (or not) is a worrying concern, my comments have all been based on the effects to the motorhoming community, as a whole.

Any moves towards making the UK a Police State is a bad one.

Any moves to tip the scales to make life better for the innocent Joe Public, to protect their Human Rights against those of transgressors, and for the benefit of those that abide by common sense laws, is a good one.

This new Bill has such a mixture of both, that it is difficult to make any decisions...
 
witzend said:
News report here today
www.cornwalllive.com

Motorhomes parked without permission could be seized

It is one of a series of new measures in the Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill going through Parliament
www.cornwalllive.com www.cornwalllive.com
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Hardly an unbiased report from Cornwall Live, who seem to regularly align with Malcolm Bell of "Visit Cornwall" and the CCCC (Cornwall Council Campsite Cartel) in their apparent hatred of motorhomers.
 
You will only fall foul if as it states don't pack up and move, simple from what I see.
 
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