Lochore Update

[wildebus]

£14 per night basic fee for the current set up is expensive [although the elsan disposal point has been improved since 2021 and does now work properly!]. The planned improvements will make the balance between cost and amenities better, and for us, a wee pootle up the road for a Season's first trip after a Winter of being confined to barracks for a succession of reasons made it a worthwhile jaunt

Steve

speaking of elsan points and improvements, I don't know if I have got this right - and if someone is able to correct me, please so .....

The hose to get fresh water was very short with no fitting and was also the same hose used to wash out the cassettes after emptying? I didn't actually need fresh water so didn't look or ask if there was a different source, but it would not be appropriate to share a single hose for both functions really.

 

[marchie]

speaking of elsan points and improvements, I don't know if I have got this right - and if someone is able to correct me, please so .....

The hose to get fresh water was very short with no fitting and was also the same hose used to wash out the cassettes after emptying? I didn't actually need fresh water so didn't look or ask if there was a different source, but it would not be appropriate to share a single hose for both functions really.

Hose had no fitting for filling [and was left on the floor every time ...], David, but the elsan has a separate hose in the lh elsan bay, a big improvement!

Steve

 

[The laird]

There’s a separate tap to fill your fresh and use your own hose

 

[wildebus]

There’s a separate tap to fill your fresh and use your own hose

Thanks
I didn't really look very long for one as I was just about ok for water, but didn't notice one. I will know for next time

 

[Fisherman]

Lochore is very today quiet just 2 vans on EHU and us non EHU.
I just wonder if this is due to pricing.

 

[wildebus]

I would say weather TBH. We had a pretty good crowd at Kelso this weekend and actually the cost per van at the Kelso meet was more than the general public price at Lochore.

 

[Fisherman]

I would say weather TBH. We had a pretty good crowd at Kelso this weekend and actually the cost per van at the Kelso meet was more than the general public price at Lochore.

weathers fine here David, and good forecast for tommorow. I remember this place with 10-15 vans this time of year, even in poor weather.

 

[wildebus]

weathers fine here David, and good forecast for tommorow. I remember this place with 10-15 vans this time of year, even in poor weather.

dunno. but FWIW, I don't regard £14 as excessive in any way.

 

[Fisherman]

dunno. but FWIW, I don't regard £14 as excessive in any way.

Last year it was £12.50 with EHU, it’s now £20.
If we want a shower it’s £24.
No grey water disposal, limited access to toilets.
We are going to Galashiels CCC site in august David £22 a night for ACR members with hard standing, and EHU. I thought £12.50 was too cheap, possibly £15 would have been ok.
But honestly David for July 3 vans is much quieter than before.
These are campsite prices, and this is a long way from being a campsite.
We will return particularly in winter, we are here with our grandson he likes the water sports.

 

[caledonia]

Got to agree with you Bill. Holiday time and not full? So called Aire charging campsite prices, AGAIN!

 

[runnach]

I had planned to go to Lochore last weekend with my grandson, I couldn’t believe the price increase, which IMO is not worth it, and we GS have been three times before. We went to CCC THS at Scoughall farm, ok just a field @ £7.50 a unit pn. What I did not know was, a marque available with day and evening entertainment, and a various activities available. We are both heading back there soon. Lochore will be a faint memory for me, I won’t be back, which is a shame.

 

[Fisherman]

Another point.
When they charged £12.50 a night with EHU (which I felt should have been £15) you used to get a free night after four stays. This meant five nights with EHU was £50. Now it’s £100. I feel they could have increased to £15 with EHU and done away with the fee night ok. I will still come here particularly in winter, but I don’t agree with the new prices.

 

[marchie]

Fife Council and consistency/logic are never likely to be bedfellows, and the Trusts/similar bodies to keep boorwing costs/debt levels within the limits just complicate matters. Burntisland Leisure Centre Car Park is free and there is no time limit to stays [other than the capacity of the toilet cassette, and if you've no scruples, there's even a public slipway onto the Firth of Forth ...]; Elie has new toilets, fresh water and an Elsan point for £10 per night, but, IIRC, just an overnight stay, yet Lochore charges £20 per night and toilets are subject to café opening hours and a 200m + walk each way, whilst campers at the waterside parking who ignore the 'no camping' signs with impunity, pay nothing! [and there are signs asking people to behave honestly and pay their way for camping]

Better management/consistency across sites/enforcement would enable lower fees to be charged across the locations. I suspect that the £10pn charge is the start of a scheme to introduce charges in all locations, and the pill will be sugar coated with upgraded facilities along the lines of Elie et al, but I am prepared to be disappointed ...

Steve

 

[wildebus]

Just a couple of points...,
The £20 is actually £14 if you want to do your comparison (I am guessing you don't get EHU in the car parks?)
The toilets in the cafe are indeed only available when the cafe is open, but the toilets in the Watersports building (or whatever it is called) are a) much closer anyway and b) available when that is open, which is 8AM to 8PM in the summer I think?

I am not defending or criticising Lochore, just setting some info right. (TBH, I don't really know or particularly care about toilet availability hours anyway as I have my own and actually never use a sites facility by choice, but that is not really relevant).


The cost of electricity is massively more now than it was a couple of years ago. I am not sure why people are surprised EHU prices have gone up? At Lochore, I moved to an EHU pitch for one night. it cost me £6 extra - but I used £6 worth of electricity as well (based on domestic tariff. I think commercial rates are higher again?). Should a site subsidise that EHU cost then?

 

[Fisherman]

Just a couple of points...,
The £20 is actually £14 if you want to do your comparison (I am guessing you don't get EHU in the car parks?)
The toilets in the cafe are indeed only available when the cafe is open, but the toilets in the Watersports building (or whatever it is called) are a) much closer anyway and b) available when that is open, which is 8AM to 8PM in the summer I think?

I am not defending or criticising Lochore, just setting some info right. (TBH, I don't really know or particularly care about toilet availability hours anyway as I have my own and actually never use a sites facility by choice, but that is not really relevant).


The cost of electricity is massively more now than it was a couple of years ago. I am not sure why people are surprised EHU prices have gone up? At Lochore, I moved to an EHU pitch for one night. it cost me £6 extra - but I used £6 worth of electricity as well (based on domestic tariff. I think commercial rates are higher again?). Should a site subsidise that EHU cost then?

Lochore is run in isolation, and they have sadly given way to local councillors and some locals who quite frankly have no time for us. What annoys me is whilst we were being criticised by some within the local community for not paying enough, nobody else pays a penny to simply park at Lochore. They turn up in their droves with their kayaks, paddle boards, and swimming gear. Set up camp on the grass verge then when finished head home having contributed nothing whilst we are charged for parking. You can now go to fully equipped campsites for less. Update 6 vans finished up here last night. But this is still well below what came here a year ago.

 

[Fisherman]

Just a couple of points...,
The £20 is actually £14 if you want to do your comparison (I am guessing you don't get EHU in the car parks?)
The toilets in the cafe are indeed only available when the cafe is open, but the toilets in the Watersports building (or whatever it is called) are a) much closer anyway and b) available when that is open, which is 8AM to 8PM in the summer I think?

I am not defending or criticising Lochore, just setting some info right. (TBH, I don't really know or particularly care about toilet availability hours anyway as I have my own and actually never use a sites facility by choice, but that is not really relevant).


The cost of electricity is massively more now than it was a couple of years ago. I am not sure why people are surprised EHU prices have gone up? At Lochore, I moved to an EHU pitch for one night. it cost me £6 extra - but I used £6 worth of electricity as well (based on domestic tariff. I think commercial rates are higher again?). Should a site subsidise that EHU cost then?

David I reckon if I pay £22 for a fully equipped campsite and to come here with far less facilities and pay more is a fair comparison. As a matter of fact if anything it’s being generous towards Lochore when you consider the campsite offers, unrestricted access to showers and toilets, and grey water facilities. Yes EHU prices did need to rise, but as I have pointed out prices have doubled in one year, and some have voted not to come. Surely for a venture whose original primary function was to attract tourists, this is an own goal. Also I have already alluded to the fact that £12.50 with a free night in five was overly generous.

But let’s not forget we are comparing a publicly funded body with private companies who run campsites for profit.

 

[wildebus]

Bill, like I said, I am not defending the prices or critising them. I am just saying that for ME, £14 is ok at Lochore as the main reason I would go there is to use the actual Loch.
The fact the lake is free to use anyway is not relevant to me as I am not in a day-day trip proximity to it, driving in and out from another cheaper (or free) location would be possible but the faff of doing that makes it totally unattractive and £14 is ok. If I were much more local, than I may well think "hmmm. Is £14 to much to stay over or should I just go home and come back in the morning?". But I am not.

For me, an alternative location could be to go to St Marys Loch, between Selkirk and Moffat. I have never camped there, just stopped off en-route occasionally thus far, but there is a campsite called Tibbie Shiels Inn.
Prices there per night are £8 per person, £4 for Children and £5 for EHU. So family of 4 say on an overnight stay would be £29 per night. Just a couple on their own is £21 with EHU, £16 without. And facilities as I understand it are toilets, communal washing facilities, and ... well, that is it.

Coming back to Fife ....
The fact that if you can flout the policy of not overnighting in the car park and can save the £14 (irrespective if you decide £14 is to high or not) is not something I would be happy or willing to do. You can't say "well, £14 is too high, so I will just ignore that and go anyway". You can't go to a shop and decide their baked beans are 20p a can too much and just pay less, or just take them and not pay at all.
Overnighting in a car park where overnighting is specifically prohibited, or parking in a motorhome area and not paying is basically theft. I don't really care if some do, it doesn't make it any more acceptable if you are part of the crowd. (PS. I am not suggesting in any way you do, to make that clear). Either pay or don't stay.
The fact that you DO pay the £14 even though you think it is too high means there must be something at the site that makes it worthwhile compared to staying elsewhere for either less (or free), or with better facilities. That is, at least for your current/last trip, the loch for your grandchildren to use the water. (you could always go to Tibbie Shiels say, and pay more and use St. Marys Loch?)
So when factoring in the list of amenities for comparison, you need to include that.

The comparison earlier of parking in the Burntisland Leisure Centre Carpark for free or Elie Car Park for a tenner ... I have no idea where Elie is (except in Fife I am guessing?) but what is in the Elie carpark except for new toilets? is there a Loch you can use your Kayak or Paddleboard on? or cycle and walking areas? I don't know, but I suspect not, and if I had the choice of stopping in a country park for £14 or a Car Park for £10, I think I would spend the extra 4 quid. (that the Country Park is free to park in is irrelevent - it is NOT free to overnight in any more than the Car Park is free to overnight in). The Leisure Centre sounds good. Is it free to get in as well as park outside it? probably not.


Talking about prices and amenities, I went down to visit my family "down south" in 2021 and I stayed for a couple of nights at a nice campsite in Henley-on-Thames. Not a cheap area by any means as you would be aware. I had a fairly nice pitch ... 8M x 7.5M hard standing plus grassed space between next pitches, Fully serviced with private fresh water, private grey waste disposal, 16A EHU, TV point, 24/7 Toilets and Showers (still used my own!), on site resturants, cafe, shop, tennis courts, swimming pool, laundry etc.
Paid £26/night for that. Lochore in comparision is a rip-off probably, but if I wanted to launch my Kayak in a lake, I wouldn't have been able to (although of course, I could have used the Thames instead - but that was a mile away and getting the kayak to and from the site would have cost more than the Lochore site fee in taxi fares)

 

[caledonia]

Yo

Bill, like I said, I am not defending the prices or critising them. I am just saying that for ME, £14 is ok at Lochore as the main reason I would go there is to use the actual Loch.
The fact the lake is free to use anyway is not relevant to me as I am not in a day-day trip proximity to it, driving in and out from another cheaper (or free) location would be possible but the faff of doing that makes it totally unattractive and £14 is ok. If I were much more local, than I may well think "hmmm. Is £14 to much to stay over or should I just go home and come back in the morning?". But I am not.

For me, an alternative location could be to go to St Marys Loch, between Selkirk and Moffat. I have never camped there, just stopped off en-route occasionally thus far, but there is a campsite called Tibbie Shiels Inn.
Prices there per night are £8 per person, £4 for Children and £5 for EHU. So family of 4 say on an overnight stay would be £29 per night. Just a couple on their own is £21 with EHU, £16 without. And facilities as I understand it are toilets, communal washing facilities, and ... well, that is it.

Coming back to Fife ....
The fact that if you can flout the policy of not overnighting in the car park and can save the £14 (irrespective if you decide £14 is to high or not) is not something I would be happy or willing to do. You can't say "well, £14 is too high, so I will just ignore that and go anyway". You can't go to a shop and decide their baked beans are 20p a can too much and just pay less, or just take them and not pay at all.
Overnighting in a car park where overnighting is specifically prohibited, or parking in a motorhome area and not paying is basically theft. I don't really care if some do, it doesn't make it any more acceptable if you are part of the crowd. (PS. I am not suggesting in any way you do, to make that clear). Either pay or don't stay.
The fact that you DO pay the £14 even though you think it is too high means there must be something at the site that makes it worthwhile compared to staying elsewhere for either less (or free), or with better facilities. That is, at least for your current/last trip, the loch for your grandchildren to use the water. (you could always go to Tibbie Shiels say, and pay more and use St. Marys Loch?)
So when factoring in the list of amenities for comparison, you need to include that.

The comparison earlier of parking in the Burntisland Leisure Centre Carpark for free or Elie Car Park for a tenner ... I have no idea where Elie is (except in Fife I am guessing?) but what is in the Elie carpark except for new toilets? is there a Loch you can use your Kayak or Paddleboard on? or cycle and walking areas? I don't know, but I suspect not, and if I had the choice of stopping in a country park for £14 or a Car Park for £10, I think I would spend the extra 4 quid. (that the Country Park is free to park in is irrelevent - it is NOT free to overnight in any more than the Car Park is free to overnight in). The Leisure Centre sounds good. Is it free to get in as well as park outside it? probably not.


Talking about prices and amenities, I went down to visit my family "down south" in 2021 and I stayed for a couple of nights at a nice campsite in Henley-on-Thames. Not a cheap area by any means as you would be aware. I had a fairly nice pitch ... 8M x 7.5M hard standing plus grassed space between next pitches, Fully serviced with private fresh water, private grey waste disposal, 16A EHU, TV point, 24/7 Toilets and Showers (still used my own!), on site resturants, cafe, shop, tennis courts, swimming pool, laundry etc.
Paid £26/night for that. Lochore in comparision is a rip-off probably, but if I wanted to launch my Kayak in a lake, I wouldn't have been able to (although of course, I could have used the Thames instead - but that was a mile away and getting the kayak to and from the site would have cost more than the Lochore site fee in taxi fares)

You could go to Meggat reservoir and park for free then have a wee paddle in your boat. St Mary’s and Tibbie have people there. Meggat is quieter. It’s not the price it’s the peace for me

 

[wildebus]

Yo

You could go to Meggat reservoir and park for free then have a wee paddle in your boat. St Mary’s and Tibbie have people there. Meggat is quieter. It’s not the price it’s the peace for me

of course I could. It is all about choice. I don't actually want to paddle my boat on a deserted reservoir though. I am risk averse and death averse. have a unexpected problem, no one around to help.
different folks, different strokes.

 

[marchie]

Lochore is run in isolation, and they have sadly given way to local councillors and some locals who quite frankly have no time for us. What annoys me is whilst we were being criticised by some within the local community for not paying enough, nobody else pays a penny to simply park at Lochore. They turn up in their droves with their kayaks, paddle boards, and swimming gear. Set up camp on the grass verge then when finished head home having contributed nothing whilst we are charged for parking. You can now go to fully equipped campsites for less. Update 6 vans finished up here last night. But this is still well below what came here a year ago.

Lochore is not run in isolation, Bill. It is part of Fife Coast & Countryside Trust, and is registered as a charity. The transfer of assets to these Trusts was a method for Councils to avoid restrictions such as loan/borrowing limits that applied to the original local authority [where the local authority was needing every £ of borrowing ability during the Council Tax freeze years], although, in the case of Lochore, it still appears on Fife Council websites!

I still believe that there will be a uniform charging structure for the 'camping facilities', for want of a label, that will eventually iron out the charging inconsistencies

Steve