Lithium Battery Installers

[wildebus]

Do you know if the Crafter seat base is the same as the T1N sprinter @wildebus ? I keep looking and thinking my 2x100Ah would fit but have yet to get a tape measure put and my eyes are getting old.

Your sprinter is a T1N, yes? That seat base in the picture IS a T1N Drivers Seat base. (I bought it to use n the passenger side as the passenger bases are virtuallt the same but much more expensive).

I don't think you could fit 2 100Ah batteries side by side, but I reckon you could put them on their side and stack them.

 

[wildebus]

Side by side you have 330mm long x 350mm wide by approx 200mm high

Stacking you are 350mm high and just 200mm wide. Check what height you have base to chair (there is a fair gap between top of base and bottom of chair pad if you have regular seats)

 

[Etuotnom]

Bluefix or Roadpro really good ie experts.

Plenty of reviews/videos/posts around.

I’ve used both.

 

[alcam]

Tidy

One was done by a dodgy company in the Borders. Not sure if I would go back there!
View attachment 128298

Can't see the problem

 

[terry111]

Roadpro said they have done this using Off-Grid 150 Batteries, they are exactly the same size as Off-Grid 100 Batteries - odd but true, apparently!

I've just measured my existing batteries, they are 354x175x190. The Off-Grid 150 is 355x175x188. The 1mm extra length will be ok so should be good for 300Ah - I'm not fitting them though!

 

[Nabsim]

Standard passenger side which is the one that’s empt

Side by side you have 330mm long x 350mm wide by approx 200mm high

Stacking you are 350mm high and just 200mm wide. Check what height you have base to chair (there is a fair gap between top of base and bottom of chair pad if you have regular seats)

Standard seat on passenger side which is the empty side but I have a swivel seat plate that’s flush with the top of the sheet metal part.
Yes mine is T1N chassis cab

 

[1 Cup]

Put 280 cells in the wall

 

[wildebus]

Standard passenger side which is the one that’s empt

Standard seat on passenger side which is the empty side but I have a swivel seat plate that’s flush with the top of the sheet metal part.
Yes mine is T1N chassis cab

My van was a VW LT, but the cab bases and electrics are identical to the Sprinter T1N.

The following is relying on my memory, so some details may not be 100%!
When I did my van seats, I found a whole bunch of general vehicle electrics were under the drivers seat - this is a photo with the seat bases removed:

Trim Back by David, on Flickr
I didn't plan on fitting batteries in this area, but I did want to fit a diesel heater under the drivers seat, so what I did was just move all the electrics to the passenger side instead as I didn't want the electrics in the same area as the heater (not complicated, just needed to move the loom over physically).
Maybe an option for you if you needed more height for batteries as the drivers seat has no swivel as far as I recall, so you can go above the base a bit if you need?

Heater was a tight fit in many ways

Heater setup and wired up by David, on Flickr



I just came across this which may be handy for you?
This foam insert inside a T5 base is the footprint of an Xplorer 100L battery which would probably be 330mm long

T5 Base by David, on Flickr
A 330mm long battery is a perfect fit ona T5 as it drops into place and doesn't move left or right as a tight fit.

This is the same insert on a T1N base

LT Base 2 by David, on Flickr
I think this shows the base is narrower and that same battery is just too long to fit across.

Easy fit running lengthways instead

LT Base by David, on Flickr

 

[1 Cup]

16 amps outside now.

 

[1807truckman]

I think the Ducato/Boxer/Relay probably has one of the largest underseat spaces of a van.
If you take a VW T5 Transporter (which is a smaller vehicle generally), the biggest battery that generally will fit under the seat is a 160Ah one - and to do that involves taking a grinder to the base and 'reprofiling' some interior parts. The shape of that base allows without changes a nominal 110Ah battery (which are generally Group 19 dimensions). maximum length of 330 fitted sizeways. maximum height of 190mm - and that is only at the rear. The front half is generally to low to take a battery. And heights can be limited of swivels are fitted (dependant on the design). I fitted a low-height 110Ah battery to a T5 passenger seat and had to put it on its side even at the back as the swivel interfered otherwise.
Sprinters are not much better. Here is a photo I took showing a T5 Seat (right) and a Sprinter Seat (left).

LT vs T5 Bases by David, on Flickr
The Sprinter Base is taller but is narrower, which becomes a real limiting factor for a underseat battery install. In practice, the apparently smaller T5 base is better for that.
Not sure about Renault Masters, but Ducatos and Sprinters, plus VW Transporters make up the significant majority of Motorhome and Camper conversions.
You have the Ford Transits of course, but seeing how Ford fit the Engine Batteries (usually two for some reason?) under the drivers seat, that is out of bounds anyway.

My Sprinter has factory fitted swivel seat bases so has reduced height seat bases so the seats remain the same height as standard so not much room under there.

 

[Nabsim]

An awful lot more electrics under the drivers seat on mine. Two full widths of relays plus a few more across the back, a long the door side are most of the fuses/fuse board. There are some solid state boxes under there that may be ecu’s plus the compressor for the rear air system. That’s just what I can see lol

Will have to have a proper measure up at some point, don’t think I have a tape with me, looking at your pics though it doesn’t look good as I suspect my battery’s will be same dimensions as your cut out. Just one thing (if you remember) most lead acid battery’s I have had are bigger at the bottom, like a moulding in the case for battery clamps at the bottom, my batteries are same all the way down. I suspect they will probably be the largest dimension of your cut out though but maybe…

 

[aross]

420Ah under the seat? and spare space?
Congrats. Apologies if I don't believe it

2 X KS Energy 210ah Lithium, 80 amp B2B, 2000 Watt inverter, MPPT regulator, battery master, original consumer unit and charger, all under the two seats (there's nowhere else to put things in thos van!).

Courtesy of Phil @ RhinoInstalls.

I'd send photos, but that would mean taking the seats out

 

[wildebus]

2 X KS Energy 210ah Lithium, 80 amp B2B, 2000 Watt inverter, MPPT regulator, battery master, original consumer unit and charger, all under the two seats (there's nowhere else to put things in thos van!).

Courtesy of Phil @ RhinoInstalls.

I'd send photos, but that would mean taking the seats out

aha - now lets clarify ... two 210Ah batteries ... are they both under ONE seat, or is one battery under one seat and the other under the second?

 

[wildebus]

An awful lot more electrics under the drivers seat on mine. Two full widths of relays plus a few more across the back, a long the door side are most of the fuses/fuse board. There are some solid state boxes under there that may be ecu’s plus the compressor for the rear air system. That’s just what I can see lol

Will have to have a proper measure up at some point, don’t think I have a tape with me, looking at your pics though it doesn’t look good as I suspect my battery’s will be same dimensions as your cut out. Just one thing (if you remember) most lead acid battery’s I have had are bigger at the bottom, like a moulding in the case for battery clamps at the bottom, my batteries are same all the way down. I suspect they will probably be the largest dimension of your cut out though but maybe…

yup, quite a few batteries (not really most though) have the base 'splayed; for clamping down. even Some earlier Lithiums had those because the makers chose to use cases with those bits. It that bit is an issue, you could just cut it off. In my example, they didn't have those- the footprint was the same all the way up.

Interesting story ... had a chap come over to install a couple of new batteries (that he brought with him). He had made a battery enclosure from steel which he welded to the exact dimensions. very tidy job it was.
But ... the new batteries had these clamp bits at the bottom and it stopped them fitting (the batteries were nominally the same size but the length and width quoted didn't include that bit). He had to remake the enclosures.

 

[colinm]

aha - now lets clarify ... two 210Ah batteries ... are they both under ONE seat, or is one battery under one seat and the other under the second?

I've just had a nosey around and KS claim to have a battery which is about twice the energy density per volume of most other batteries!

 

[wildebus]

I've just had a nosey around and KS claim to have a battery which is about twice the energy density per volume of most other batteries!

I just saw this on their website - https://www.ksenergy.co.uk/store/ba...ry-super-series-with-bluetooth-high-power-bms. Very compact indeed.
size is L335 x W175 x H230. You could actually squeeze two of those under a seat side by side I think. The height would be very tight but could be doable as well. Makes their special "underseat battery" a bit pointless as that is the same capacity but larger case at 330 x 270 x 190 and also more expensive?

I don't know if the website prices get discounted, but nowadays 210Ah of Lithium for over £1,000 from a non-premium brand is little bit OTT! (I'm shortly to be ordering 270Ah of Lithium at £200 less, using published prices - and these don't just have low temp protection, but integral heaters)


UPDATE: their range is very confusing? the 210Ah Compact battery is 335 long. their 200Ah Compact battery is 485mm long - nearly 50% longer.

 

[marchie]

this could be an option purpose designed for under the seat

I bought the Roamer 230v Seatbase version in the January Sale, Ken, and had it fitted [but not under the seat because the Elektroblok has claimed that space] about 10 days ago. It'll be road tested on our return trip to Spain in early March, but it's doing quite nicely outside the flat, cooking soup for lunch via the Inverter, charging the ebike batteries, and coping with the water pump filling/flushing/flushing again/flushing again the fresh water tank and water heater descaling whilst also keeping the vehicle Battery fed during a period of very limited solar harvesting [1W input yesterday at 15:30 ...]

Steve

 

[suncroft25]

Hi
I'm looking to replace the 2 x 95Ah AGM batteries in my 2018 Globecar Campscout.
The batteries fit (tightly!) under the driver's seat and from what I saw yesterday at NEC Motorhome show I can get 200 to 300Ah of Lithium battery / batteries in the space.
Obviously there's the B2B charger and associated wiring and I'm not going to do it myself.
I saw people from Roadpro, Offgrid Power, Van Bitz and Alpha Batteries, all of which said they could do the job.
Does anyone have experiences of these suppliers - Good or bad. Or recommend someone else, I'm near Derby so location could be an issue (Van Bitz insn't ideal!).
Thanks

Do you know if the Crafter seat base is the same as the T1N sprinter @wildebus ? I keep looking and thinking my 2x100Ah would fit but have yet to get a tape measure put and my eyes are getting old.

S&G near Luton. We are there now for 2x150amp Lithium, 3000 inverter & charger. They have done everything for us and really are excellent. You can stay over ready for work on the following day with hook up.
Always have time for you on the phone when you have struggle with issues such as connectivity etc. Can’t recommend them enough

 

[merl]

I just saw this on their website - https://www.ksenergy.co.uk/store/ba...ry-super-series-with-bluetooth-high-power-bms. Very compact indeed.
size is L335 x W175 x H230. You could actually squeeze two of those under a seat side by side I think. The height would be very tight but could be doable as well. Makes their special "underseat battery" a bit pointless as that is the same capacity but larger case at 330 x 270 x 190 and also more expensive?

I don't know if the website prices get discounted, but nowadays 210Ah of Lithium for over £1,000 from a non-premium brand is little bit OTT! (I'm shortly to be ordering 270Ah of Lithium at £200 less, using published prices - and these don't just have low temp protection, but integral heaters)


UPDATE: their range is very confusing? the 210Ah Compact battery is 335 long. their 200Ah Compact battery is 485mm long - nearly 50% longer.

Seems to be a bit of a contradiction re the charge/discharge current too. Info on the battery its self says maximum continuous current 200A with 300A permissible (short term) surge.
Web page data says maximum 100A discharge current recommended.
Web page data says :-

"Max continuous charge current: 200A
Max charge voltage: 15.00V
Recommended charge current <100A"

Now, I guess if questioned about this KS would probably say "Well you CAN charge/discharge at 200A continuously but we recommend you keep it below 100A" but to me that's contradictory .

On a different point I think KS use multiple small tubular cells in a series/parallel combination rather than the typical series connected 4 Prismatic cells used by most manufacturers, this must be how they get the higher energy density for their batteries. The sizes seem very compact.

 

[wildebus]

That is not that uncommon to have quoted surge, maximum continuous and recommended.

Difference between the two is kind of "best to do THIS, but if you HAVE to, you can do THAT".


Whatever, I would not get one of those batteries as 1) it is overpriced for sure compared to the opposition and 2) don't really like KS Energy.
From what I can see, the is one reason to get this - the size. Unless you REALLY need a battery of this compactness, there are better AND cheaper (simultaneously) ones out there.