Just bought a van today

[Deleted member 32902]

Thanks all, very helpful stuff, seamus will take all into consideration then do whatever the feck he wants:cool1: Confrontation is the name of the game, anything else is boring:wacko:
Its not a new van mind you, its done 6,000 miles so not looking for any problems. The days of the big stuff are gone, was fed up having to sneak/reverse out of aires because the big Apapaho wouldn't fit anywhere.:sad:
seamus

 

[witzend]

What about a passenger who goes to the toilet while mh is moving ? Theres toilets on buses that get used while bus is in motion

 

[wildebus]

It's the pc brigade all trying to make you feel guilty saying it's reckless to carry passengers in a motorhome without seat belts.
2007 is the year I believe the law says you must have designated travel seats .
To be honest any passengers in the rear of a motorhome want a check up from the neck up as your going to get dead in a good smash.
The chances of anyone actually deciding to prosecute under some possible chance of succeeding for unsafe load etc is mainly in the minds of those that worry about everything and really shouldn't be allowed out alone.

Is this specifically for Motor Caravans ref 2007?
Rear Seatbelts in cars came in long before that as an obligatory fixture and if not fitted would be an MOT failure. I - or rather a GF I had at the time - experienced this first hand as she bought an old-stock (1985 I think) unregistered Ford Escort in 1991 - so became a 'J' plate - and when it went for its first MOT in 1994 failed the MOT as a car registered in 1991 had to have all seats fitted with belts (which wasn't the case at the time the car was built).

 

[trevskoda]

What about a passenger who goes to the toilet while mh is moving ? Theres toilets on buses that get used while bus is in motion

Your talking total cr-p.:lol-049::lol-049::lol-049::wave:

 

[trevskoda]

What ever you do seamus think safe and have many happy days away in the new van,health to wear.:goodluck:

 

[Fazerloz]

Contradictory regs do make it a grey area but I know you can carry with side seats it’s only the potential unsecured loads bit but unlikely to be applied unless someone is very lipped with a plod.

It was easily solved for me when I got insurance, they asked how many seats had belts and that was end of the story. It’s insurance that will have the over ruling say.

Since April 2012 it has been against the law to travel in any sideways facing seat due to safety – no matter what the age of the vehicle.
The exemptions are military and police vehicles.

 

[Nabsim]

Since April 2012 it has been against the law to travel in any sideways facing seat due to safety – no matter what the age of the vehicle.
The exemptions are military and police vehicles.

Can you give me the reference for that legislation please? All I have read says about seat belts for side facing seat are not recommended not seen anything that says they can’t be used legally, not that I intend using them in any case.

 

[Fazerloz]

In the 2012 regs it’s were I got the exemptions from as well. Feel free to wade through them. It’s also on here
The Legal Aspects of Driving a Motorhome | Motorhome Insurance and Campervan Insurance Quotes

 

[campervanannie]

Seamus I sometimes well a lot of the time drive through the night and if Bill is with me he will be in bed asleep at the back of the MH no seatbelts there, so don’t worry be happy.

 

[trevskoda]

Seamus I sometimes well a lot of the time drive through the night and if Bill is with me he will be in bed asleep at the back of the MH no seatbelts there, so don’t worry be happy.

Annie you just love to flout the law,naughty girl.:hammer:

 

[Nabsim]

In the 2012 regs it’s were I got the exemptions from as well. Feel free to wade through them. It’s also on here
The Legal Aspects of Driving a Motorhome | Motorhome Insurance and Campervan Insurance Quotes

That’s why I said it is what insurance say that will decide but that is not the law. If you want to check it is contradictory but includes:

Although side facing seats, with or without seat belts, are not illegal, we would not advise that they are used. This is because seat belts are not designed to be used with such seats. In the event of an accident, seat belts on these side facing seats may help to prevent the wearer being thrown around the vehicle or from being ejected, but in a frontal crash they can increase injury risk by subjecting vulnerable parts of the body to higher loads than seat belts used on forward facing seats.

Driving campervans with passengers - GOV.UK

 

[Nabsim]

Seamus I sometimes well a lot of the time drive through the night and if Bill is with me he will be in bed asleep at the back of the MH no seatbelts there, so don’t worry be happy.

That’s how I try to live Annie, don’t worry, be happy

 

[witzend]

Your talking total cr-p.:lol-049::lol-049::lol-049::wave:

Theres many other reasons you could be traveling while not being able to wear a seat belt making cup of tea or sandwiches etcl

 

[trevskoda]

Theres many other reasons you could be traveling while not being able to wear a seat belt making cup of tea or sandwiches etcl

Yes of coarse you can do that esp if one has a automatic.

 

[Fazerloz]

That’s why I said it is what insurance say that will decide but that is not the law. If you want to check it is contradictory but includes:

Although side facing seats, with or without seat belts, are not illegal, we would not advise that they are used. This is because seat belts are not designed to be used with such seats. In the event of an accident, seat belts on these side facing seats may help to prevent the wearer being thrown around the vehicle or from being ejected, but in a frontal crash they can increase injury risk by subjecting vulnerable parts of the body to higher loads than seat belts used on forward facing seats.

Driving campervans with passengers - GOV.UK[/QUOTE

I suggest you read the actual regs. The first paragraph on your link says

This document provides general guidance and advice on the legislative requirements in Great Britain relating to the carriage of people in campervans. Every effort has been made to ensure that it is factually correct but recipients should check with the producers of this document if they are unsure about the validity of a particular regulation after the date of publication or if they have reason to believe any part is not correct or is now out of date.
Have you ever known a government publish something that was wrong. Or contact them saying you believe it may possibly be wrong.
I read the regs like Trev did because it effected me.
What people choose to do is up to them and of no concern to me. The question is of the legality.

 

[wildebus]

That’s why I said it is what insurance say that will decide but that is not the law. If you want to check it is contradictory but includes:

Although side facing seats, with or without seat belts, are not illegal, we would not advise that they are used. This is because seat belts are not designed to be used with such seats. In the event of an accident, seat belts on these side facing seats may help to prevent the wearer being thrown around the vehicle or from being ejected, but in a frontal crash they can increase injury risk by subjecting vulnerable parts of the body to higher loads than seat belts used on forward facing seats.

Driving campervans with passengers - GOV.UK

I suggest you read the actual regs. The first paragraph on your link says

This document provides general guidance and advice on the legislative requirements in Great Britain relating to the carriage of people in campervans. Every effort has been made to ensure that it is factually correct but recipients should check with the producers of this document if they are unsure about the validity of a particular regulation after the date of publication or if they have reason to believe any part is not correct or is now out of date.
Have you ever known a government publish something that was wrong. Or contact them saying you believe it may possibly be wrong.
I read the regs like Trev did because it effected me.
What people choose to do is up to them and of no concern to me. The question is of the legality.

Not sure if the bit I emboldened in red was written with irony or in serious?
There is so much ambiguity when it comes to UK motoring legislation it is very hard to know what to actually believe is current/valid/enforced! They say that when it comes to winning an argument it is always possible to find "proof" to support your POV on the Internet. The same seems to be true of UK Motoring Legislation from .GOV.UK official publications on the Internet.

I replied to this thread about seat belts in cars and if it were different. and after that reply, I looked into this further out of curiosity.
From what I have read (on .GOV.UK publications, not random websites), it looks like there is NO legal requirement to have rear seat belts on any seats that have been added into a vehicle post original manufacture and from any date either it would seem. So any MOT fails due to no seat belts being fitted on after-market seats - say a Rock and Roll Bed - are incorrect. An MOT inspector can only fail Seat Belts IF they are actually fitted and not secure, and NOT if they are not present at all unless the seats were originally fitted. So any camper conversion would be exempt and many 'official' Motorhomes would also be exempt as well from this requirement as well (I would guess any which have a category of "N1" or "N2" would be in this category as that would mean they were originally registered as Commercials and converted post original registration so any rear seats added later).


Now USING seats for travelling if they are not installed with seat belts is another question entirely and is down to the individuals concerned and I guess their Insurance Companies? Personally, I feel uncomfortable WITHOUT a seatbelt on as I have always worn one so it is just natural to have one on, and I would not* transport people without their seatbelt on front or REAR except in specific circumstances.


*having said that, yesterday the OH moved from front seat to rear to secure the kettle that I left on the hob earlier that day while we were driving as it was safer to do that then stop on the road, but that was very much a one-off!
I also recall when I, being the youngest, used to be confined to the rear luggage space of the Vauxhall Viva Estate on trips out. How times have changed!


All the above is my own opinion, with 'proof' from some .GOV.UK publications available for anyone to see when doing a basic search on the internet.

 

[Deleted member 32902]

Seamus I sometimes well a lot of the time drive through the night and if Bill is with me he will be in bed asleep at the back of the MH no seatbelts there, so don’t worry be happy.

Yes I used to do that too Annie, when we had the Cheyenne 840, the one with the bedroom at the rear, twin beds, I would insist mrs seamus drove in the UK, just to even things up as she would not drive abroad, I would take a walkie talkie to bed with me ( jaysas I've had some quare yokes to bed with me) so that I would have her attention at all times and could order coffee, or breakfast even whenever I wanted, you don't keep a dog and bark yerself sweetcheeks:lol-053:
seamus.