Gas cabinet design

[noarlunga]

Hi Folks,

After having had a spirit hob (nicked from my boat as a temporary cooking facility) in my first van design I'm now installing refillable gas bottles and a Smev hob.

It's a MWB Transit van and due to extreme clutter under the van I've sadly had to rule out an underslung tank, partly because of room and partly because of weight distribution, the only possible space being behind the back axle.

So, the two small gas bottles are going into a purpose built cupboard within the kitchen unit itself. This is framed out in 2" x 1" wood and the initial thought is to clad it in 3mm oak faced ply for cosmetic purposes.

I need to provide a firebreak around the cylinders in order for the installation to meet regs and I'm not sure what might be acceptable. One solution would be to clad the inside of the frame with plasterboard, after all that's the firebreak on the ceilings of my house.

Another slightly more costly solution might be to fill the framed spaces behind the ply with fireproof board such as Skamotec 225 - Insulating fireboard heat proof 1000*C lightweight fire board fireplace lining | eBay

Any thoughts or alternative ideas would be welcome.

Johnny A

 

[n brown]

What regs? I keep hearing about them,but I never saw any !
There's good practice based on common sense if you like ?

 

[delicagirl]

don't forget to put a vent to the outside of the van in the bottom of your cupboard to allow escape of gas if a leak ever occurs...

 

[Steve121]

No reason to use metal; plywood is perfectly OK.

 

[trevskoda]

would not be to fussed other than drop out holes as if one went up there would be no van.

 

[andy63]

hi, I have a similar van, ie mwb high top transit which I have converted.. I made my gas locker out of thin sheet steel around a box section frame. the whole unit houses the cylinders and cooker above. its self contained and can be remover quite easily if necessary as I only use the gas for cooking..some photos if I can load them lol.


a view of inside with regulator and leak detector, a view of whole thing with cooker, and the drop out through the floof.

ta andy

 

[Rob H]

Gas cabinet design.

Hi noarlunga,

Alternate, not cheap, steel Gas Lockers for 4.5kg Calor cylinder, or 3.9 Propane.
Uberbus.

Rgrds,

Rob H

 

[noarlunga]

What regs? I keep hearing about them,but I never saw any !
There's good practice based on common sense if you like ?

When I say regs I mean recommendations associated with the gas certificate needed for hire vans and commercial use. As a boat owner who's witnessed a couple of disastrous marine gas explosions I just want to be as safe as possible in my van, especially with the grandchild on board.

I guess common sense is only as accurate as the knowledge you have available to inform its application. As a starting point I'm using a post from elsewhere from somebody at Flogas which seems to make sense.

Originally Posted by Flogas

Q1 - LPG sticker on the back of the vehicle
A1 - Not required in the UK unless the vehicle is going to be hired out or used for commercial use, but I would advise a small sign on the outside of the gas compartment door.

Q2 - LPG cylinder/s in a sealed locker
A2 - The cylinders/s should be in a compartment that is sealed from the inside of the vehicle.

Q3 - Gas locker to be lined with metal
A3 - The gas compartment should have a degree of fire resistance, other fire resistant materials can be used, however most have low mechanical strength or are difficult to seal

Q4 - Drop out vents
A4 - The cylinder compartment must be provided with ventilation communicating with the outside air – as LPG is heavier than air this should be of a larger area at the bottom.

Q5 - Replacement of rubber hose every 5 years
A5 - Hoses have a recommended 5 year life – will need to be changed every 5 years if the vehicle is going to be hired out or used for commercial use, not changing the hoses every 5 years may invalidate vehicle insurance.

Q6 - Is there a maximum quantity of LPG permitted to be carried in camper van
A6 - There is no set maximum, however consideration should be given to not carrying more than necessary and the weight of the cylinders (which will almost certainly be to one side of the vehicle).

Q7 - Annual Gas Safe certificate required
A7 - This will not be required unless the vehicle is going to be hired out or used for commercial use – the insurance company may require an initial inspection by a ‘Gas Safe’ engineer.

I would advise consideration be given to the installation of a vapour supply fixed tank (like an Autogas tank), this can be installed under the vehicle and can have a remote filling point and contents gauge.

Kind regards
John
Senior Technical Compliance Manager
Flogas UK Ltd

Thanks for the useful suggestions so far.

J

 

[maxi77]

I suspect that like boats the need is to ensure that the gas cannot leak from the compartment into the habitable area, and that any leaked gas should be able to drain to the outside. My current commercially built van has a plywood gas compartment.

 

[noarlunga]

I suspect that like boats the need is to ensure that the gas cannot leak from the compartment into the habitable area, and that any leaked gas should be able to drain to the outside. My current commercially built van has a plywood gas compartment.

Any idea what the thickness of ply is? What would be the recommended thickness for say, a 30 minute firebreak?

 

[n brown]

For the dropout holes I drill a 40mm hole and cover it with a bit of mosquito net to stop insects. I also ensure that the bottom of the cupboard,if not totally sealed from the interior of the van,has a 50mm upstand to form a well to capture any leaked gas ,from where it can escape through the dropout hole
Concerning fireproofing.if you mean to protect the bottle from a fire in the van,I'm not sure there's any point,and if vice versa then I suppose plasterboard is ok,though you can get proper fire resistant board.
Marine explosions are usually gas or fuel fumes in the bilge not being vented,as I understand,and obviously vans don't have that problem,and bottles don't usually explode ,the heat from fire cause the vent plug to melt and the gas to vent.if it reaches this stage it's all too late!

 

[Steve121]

Any idea what the thickness of ply is? What would be the recommended thickness for say, a 30 minute firebreak?

I think you'll find any vehicle would be pretty much burnt out in that time, regardless of the gas locker construction.

 

[hextal]

So is an underslung tank rear of the back axle still a possibility?

In terms of weight distribution, you'd be hard pushed to overload a rear axle in a mwb van conversion.

 

[noarlunga]

So is an underslung tank rear of the back axle still a possibility?

In terms of weight distribution, you'd be hard pushed to overload a rear axle in a mwb van conversion.

It depends how much wine you want to carry in the back.

 

[noarlunga]

Thanks for the comments folks. It's been helpful in getting my ideas combed into shape.

 

[noarlunga]

I think you'll find any vehicle would be pretty much burnt out in that time, regardless of the gas locker construction.

Indeed, and I and my loved ones would be half a mile away by then.

Being the sort of chap to dot all the I's and cross all the T's I'm going to get a piece of paper to say it checks out. Probably unnecessary effort in some folk's eyes but there you go.

 

[hextal]

Indeed, and I and my loved ones would be half a mile away by then.

Being the sort of chap to dot all the I's and cross all the T's I'm going to get a piece of paper to say it checks out. Probably unnecessary effort in some folk's eyes but there you go.

I did the same thing, just additional peace of mind.