Electronic rearview mirror not turning on

[GeoffL]

But.


If a vehicle does not have a rear window, Regulation 33 of the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986 removes the requirement for an internal mirror, but strictly mandates having two functional exterior mirrors.

For standard passenger cars and dual-purpose vehicles, the specific legal requirements include:

• Interior Mirror Exemption: You do not legally need an internal rear-view mirror if it would provide no view to the rear of the vehicle (e.g., in a van with a solid bulkhead or a car with a blocked rear window).

Sorry, my bad. I originally wrote a long, complicated post that contained much of the gumph in Reg 33 but trimmed it down to make it readable and managed to trim the bit about the mirror actually needing to give a view out of the back window -- which means it's not legally required where the van either doesn't have a rear window or the internal fittings block the line of sight from the centre of the windscreen to the rear.
However, I can't remember seeing any coachbuilt that doesn't have either a mirror or a camera system. Yesterday, I checked Autotrader and looked at the first ten coachbuilts listed and all had either a mirror or a camera system. Today, I checked Autotrader again, this time for coachbuilts between £30k and £40k with rear washrooms (so they definitely aren't legally required to have mirrors) and looked at the first four listed -- they all had camera systems.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Likely like ours, for reversing cameras, we do have a rear window though, but having a camera and using it is a horse of a different flavour.

 

[TJBi]

Sorry, my bad. I originally wrote a long, complicated post that contained much of the gumph in Reg 33 but trimmed it down to make it readable and managed to trim the bit about the mirror actually needing to give a view out of the back window -- which means it's not legally required where the van either doesn't have a rear window or the internal fittings block the line of sight from the centre of the windscreen to the rear.
However, I can't remember seeing any coachbuilt that doesn't have either a mirror or a camera system. Yesterday, I checked Autotrader and looked at the first ten coachbuilts listed and all had either a mirror or a camera system. Today, I checked Autotrader again, this time for coachbuilts between £30k and £40k with rear washrooms (so they definitely aren't legally required to have mirrors) and looked at the first four listed -- they all had camera systems.

Neither of my coachbuilts had a rear view camera system fitted when I purchased them. They did have a fish-eye reversing camera that was as much use as a chocolate teapot. They also had an internal rear view mirror - but no rear window for it to see through. It did occasionally come in handy for checking that we hadn't forgotten to close a rooflight - until a rear view camera system was fitted, with a screen that fitted over said mirror.

 

[Geek]

As far as I know, there is no requirement to have a rear view mirror or camera, as long as you have two door mirrors.
Motorhomes have them to appeal to people who are used to driving cars. I'm pretty sure there is no legal requirement. Trucks and coaches don't always have them. Nor do cars towing caravans.

 

[Geek]

As far as I know, there is no requirement to have a rear view mirror or camera, as long as you have two door mirrors.
Motorhomes have them to appeal to people who are used to driving cars. I'm pretty sure there is no legal requirement. Trucks and coaches don't always have them. Nor do cars towing caravans.

Thinking about it, my motorhome doesn't have a rear view camera: the camera is a reversing camera, and I can see the back of the motorhome and the towball, but not any vehicles behind me, unless they are far too close.
I could add an extra camera with a higher view, but there's no need. The mirrors work just fine.

 

[GeoffL]

As far as I know, there is no requirement to have a rear view mirror or camera, as long as you have two door mirrors.
Motorhomes have them to appeal to people who are used to driving cars. I'm pretty sure there is no legal requirement. Trucks and coaches don't always have them. Nor do cars towing caravans.

Not so. The Road Vehicle (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, Regulation 33 says in the included table, that vehicles first registered from 1978 onward and not in items 1 to 7, must be fitted with at least one interior mirror, unless a mirror so fitted would give the driver no view to the rear of the vehicle. That includes cars and other four-wheel vehicles up to 3.5 tonnes. Post 2010 motorhomes in category M1 have the same requirement. Brave AI suggests that coaches also have the same requirement but HGVs do not unless the nearside outside mirror doesn't provide an adequate view.

 

[Geek]

I have never been in a motorhome where a rear view mirror would give a view of the road behind, but feel free to believe you are correct.

 

[maingate]

I have never been in a motorhome where a rear view mirror would give a view of the road behind, but feel free to believe you are correct.

It was quite common at one time to design motorhomes with a rear lounge, my first one was like that. The rear view mirror served a useful purpose when driving.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

I think ALL vehicles would come with an interior mirror for conversion, as Fiat, etc., wouldn't know what configuration it would be built into. I think all our vans had one fitted.

 

[GeoffL]

I have never been in a motorhome where a rear view mirror would give a view of the road behind, but feel free to believe you are correct.

It's not my personal opinion, it's actually the law. The law says that any motorhome up to 3,500 kg first registered after 1978 must be fitted with an internal rear view mirror unless that would not give a view of the road behind. Later legislation allows a camera system as an alternative. Many motorhomes have internal structure blocking that view and hence are not required to have a mirror. However, where there is line of sight between the centre of the windscreen to the rear window either a mirror or rear-view camera is required by law.

It was quite common at one time to design motorhomes with a rear lounge, my first one was like that. The rear view mirror served a useful purpose when driving.

My van has a rear lounge, as do the vans of most of my friends. But even then, it's common for vans to have the alternative to a rear view mirror -- i.e. a rear view camera. In my case, the camera itself is motorised, so I can use it for both reversing and rear-view. At least two of my friends have twin cameras; one for reversing and one for rear-view and one has the screen at dashboard level to supplement the mirror. However, even in rear lounge layouts, it's common for the central passageway to be offset and the washroom bulkhead to block the view rearward.

In the meantime, I searched Autotrader for coachbuilt motorhomes again, and photos of the interior of the first four listed are below. Note that all have either a mirror or a rear-view camera...

 

[Pudsey Bear]

I posted this last week, I missed where it said you needed a camera though, must be an addition to the rules, after 78.

 

[TJBi]

Not so. The Road Vehicle (Construction and Use) Regulations 1986, Regulation 33 says in the included table, that vehicles first registered from 1978 onward and not in items 1 to 7, must be fitted with at least one interior mirror, unless a mirror so fitted would give the driver no view to the rear of the vehicle. That includes cars and other four-wheel vehicles up to 3.5 tonnes. Post 2010 motorhomes in category M1 have the same requirement. Brave AI suggests that coaches also have the same requirement but HGVs do not unless the nearside outside mirror doesn't provide an adequate view.

I'm struggling to grasp it all, but in the case of a Ford Transit motor car (sic) first used before 10/07/1978: "At least one exterior mirror fitted on the offside of the vehicle and either one interior mirror or one exterior mirror fitted on the near-side of the vehicle." So if you go back far enough, you don't have to have an interior mirror even if it would provide a view to the rear of the vehicle!

Interestingly, the initial text refers to driver's side and passenger's side, but the table refers to offside and nearside. This can be of significance in the case of a LHD vehicle. When I suffered a mirror clash in my LHD motorhome last year, the insurers would not have considered it roadworthy if RHD, as there would have been no exterior mirror on the driver's side. As the nearside mirror was intact, they were perfectly happy for me to continue driving it. I was less happy and unable to obtain a suitable replacement during the remainder of my UK trip as replacement mirrors are different for LHD and RHD (particularly in respect of the orientation of the small wide-angle mirror at the bottom of the unit). A replacement had to be sourced in the EU on my return home.

 

[maingate]

It must be remembered that none of the base vehicles are manufactured in the UK. It is possible that the Cabs are assembled in accordance with the Law in their country of origin. ie Turkey (Ford) and the EU for others. Every unit built will have its own paperwork with details that can vary from unit to unit but this may not apply to internal mirrors.

 

[GeoffL]

It must be remembered that none of the base vehicles are manufactured in the UK. It is possible that the Cabs are assembled in accordance with the Law in their country of origin. ie Turkey (Ford) and the EU for others. Every unit built will have its own paperwork with details that can vary from unit to unit but this may not apply to internal mirrors.

Also to be considered is that the Construction and Use Regulations don't apply until the vehicle is declared 'to be used on the road': i.e. when it's registered. At that point, but not before, it must comply with the regulations.

 

[Pudsey Bear]

As the great Mr Wogan used to often say.

°is it me?°