E scooter with a seat

[barryd]

This is what ChatGPT says about France at least. No idea about other countries. For sure you can ride a stand up one here in France. Not seen any sit down ones though.

are e scooters with seats legal in france for anyone to ride

ChatGPT said:​

No — electric scooters with seats are not legal under France’s standard rules for EDPMs (Engins de Déplacement Personnel Motorisés), unless they meet a different classification. Here’s what current French law says and how a seated scooter might or might not fit:

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What French law says about “normal” electric scooters / EDPMs​

EDPMs are defined as personal motorized mobility devices designed for one person, without a seat. HFW+2Ministère de l'Économie+2
Here are key rules:

• The device must have a maximum speed by construction of ≤ 25 km/h. Ministères de l'Écologie+1
• No riding with a passenger; i.e. single-user only. Automotistique+3Weebot+3blog.green220.com+3
• Age minimum: since Sept 2023, you must be at least 14 years old to use an EDPM. blog.green220.com+2Trottinette Élec+2
• They must be non-thermal motorized, must have lights, retro-reflectors, brakes etc. Ministères de l'Écologie+2Ministère de l'Économie+2

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What about scooters with seats?​

Because EDPMs are explicitly “without a seat,” a scooter with a seat does not fit that category. HFW+1
There is this other proposed / new category called “cyclomobile léger” (light cyclomobile) which was introduced in a decree in January 2022. LEVA-EU This category was intended to include devices such as:

• Electric scooters or self-balancing vehicles with saddles
• Electric bikes without pedals
• But: they must meet certain constraints: max speed 25 km/h, max motor power 350 W, weight under a certain limit (~30 kg), etc. LEVA-EU

However, despite this category existing in the law, in practical terms there are very few, if any, such vehicles that are fully homologated or legally usable under “cyclomobile léger” rules for public roads. So many of the seated scooters sold as “with seats” are not legal for public use. They may breach EDPM rules or require approval under other rules (moped / light moped regulations) which include registration, license, insurance etc.

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Practical implications​

• If you ride (or buy) a scooter with a seat, you’re likely outside the standard EDPM rules. That means you might need to deal with licensing, registration, insurance, possibly wearing a helmet, etc., as you would for mopeds.
• Also, you could be fined for using a vehicle that doesn’t comply. For example, carrying a passenger or using a device outside the allowed construction-speed is punishable. Ministères de l'Écologie+1

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Conclusion​

So in short: no, most electric scooters with seats are not legal under the standard EDPM rules unless they are specifically homologated under a different category (like “cyclomobile léger”) and meet all associated requirements. Many are not.

 

[gypo]

I see quite a few people riding them including in the towns and cities, I wonder if the law (if they are illegal) is actually enforced?
I’m going to try and get to a shop this week whilst I’m in France and ask what the situation is.
Thanks

 

[barryd]

I see quite a few people riding them including in the towns and cities, I wonder if the law (if they are illegal) is actually enforced?
I’m going to try and get to a shop this week whilst I’m in France and ask what the situation is.
Thanks

Given the amount of coppers there are in France this year I guess you will soon find out. I was sure I was going to get pulled on the bike today at a road side check point but they never bothered us.

 

[gypo]

I’ve been doing a bit of reading since your above post Barry, I can’t find anything definitive so I’ll try get to a scooter shop tomorrow, there’s one near Saintes where we are atm and reported back also
I seen a lad in the middle of Saintes today on one with a seat and no helmet which I read are mandatory?

 

[barryd]

I’ve been doing a bit of reading since your above post Barry, I can’t find anything definitive so I’ll try get to a scooter shop tomorrow, there’s one near Saintes where we are atm and reported back also
I seen a lad in the middle of Saintes today on one with a seat and no helmet which I read are mandatory?

Nobody I have seen riding the stand up ones around towns etc in France have had helmets on. I think you can ride them on the road from over 12 if you believe ChatGPT. The grey area seems to be if it has a seat / saddle. I would have thought one with a seat and larger wheels would be safer but maybe the argument is its more like a motor scooter. You could of course get one and just stand up on it if you see Plod.

Would be interesting to know as if they are easy enough to chuck in a garage it would be a great addition for a lot of motorhomers.

 

[mark61]

More info, can't see any mention of seat though.

https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F308?lang=en

 

[Robmac]

More info, can't see any mention of seat though.

https://www.service-public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F308?lang=en

Yeah there is Mark;

Lightweight Cyclomobile (electric draiser, electric scooter with seat)​

The lightweight bicycle is an electric vehicle with two wheels and a seat. This machine has no rear seat or luggage rack. It weighs a maximum of 30 kg when unladen.
The rules of circulation are the same as for motorized personal transport equipment (electric scooter, hoverboard, etc.).

 

[wildebus]

Yeah there is Mark;

Lightweight Cyclomobile (electric draiser, electric scooter with seat)​

The lightweight bicycle is an electric vehicle with two wheels and a seat. This machine has no rear seat or luggage rack. It weighs a maximum of 30 kg when unladen.
The rules of circulation are the same as for motorized personal transport equipment (electric scooter, hoverboard, etc.).

There is a potential significant issue with an e-scooter though as far as I understand it, at least in the UK.
If it needs to adhere to the current rules of an electric bike, to get electric power you need to provide pedal assistance, and of course that is not possible with a scooter.
I would guess this scooter has a twist throttle to control the power/speed? The twist throttle and power without pedalling was only legal on an electric bike until some years back.

 

[Robmac]

There is a potential significant issue with an e-scooter though as far as I understand it, at least in the UK.
If it needs to adhere to the current rules of an electric bike, to get electric power you need to provide pedal assistance, and of course that is not possible with a scooter.
I would guess this scooter has a twist throttle to control the power/speed? The twist throttle and power without pedalling was only legal on an electric bike until some years back.

Correct or so I believe David, but I think we're talking about France?

 

[gypo]

Yes France as per my original post.
I’ve been doing some research and this one look like it could be a good contender.
They have them in France cheaper than the UK
Here it is in France

OOLACTIVE | Discover Best E Bikes E Scooters & Kids Motorcycles

Discover the best selling and affordable Electric Bikes and Electric Scooters or kids Electric Motorcycles at OOLACTIVE.com. From stylish design to powerful performance, our e-bikes, e-scooters are your ticket to a greener, more efficient way to get around. Get it now and enjoy freedom city...

www.oolactive.com

 

[mark61]

Yeah there is Mark;

Lightweight Cyclomobile (electric draiser, electric scooter with seat)​

The lightweight bicycle is an electric vehicle with two wheels and a seat. This machine has no rear seat or luggage rack. It weighs a maximum of 30 kg when unladen.
The rules of circulation are the same as for motorized personal transport equipment (electric scooter, hoverboard, etc.).

Is that on the link I posted?

 

[Robmac]

Is that on the link I posted?

Yeah if you click on the last but one Bullet Point Mark.

 

[barryd]

Yes France as per my original post.
I’ve been doing some research and this one look like it could be a good contender.
They have them in France cheaper than the UK
Here it is in France

OOLACTIVE | Discover Best E Bikes E Scooters & Kids Motorcycles

Discover the best selling and affordable Electric Bikes and Electric Scooters or kids Electric Motorcycles at OOLACTIVE.com. From stylish design to powerful performance, our e-bikes, e-scooters are your ticket to a greener, more efficient way to get around. Get it now and enjoy freedom city...

www.oolactive.com

View attachment 146113

That looks exactly like the scooters I have seen all over France apart from the seat. I suspect you would be fine on one of them. However, the wheels are tiny. Ok on smooth surfaces I would think. Might be a bit dodgy on a rough surface. I Wonder if there is anywhere to try one.

 

[gypo]

Yes it would be good to try one but I doubt that would be possible.
Here’s a YouTube link to their capabilities( not that I’d be doing this mind

 

[gypo]

Just been to the Dardy outlet, a bit like currys back in the uk. They didn’t have that model there but other stand up ones like Segway etc, they are dandy looking things but it’s one with a seat I want so keep looking

 

[barryd]

Yes it would be good to try one but I doubt that would be possible.
Here’s a YouTube link to their capabilities( not that I’d be doing this mind

Lol! Yeah you have to get one and do a better video than that one.

 

[gypo]

Update.
Just been in a little independent scooter repair shop and the chap in there confirms that scooters with seats are illegal to use on the road in France unless you have insurance etc

 

[barryd]

Update.
Just been in a little independent scooter repair shop and the chap in there confirms that scooters with seats are illegal to use on the road in France unless you have insurance etc

Well that makes no sense. You can zoom around at high speed on one stood up just about anywhere it seems but if you sit down its illegal. That one in your vid was just the same as the ones you see here on a daily basis just with a seat.

 

[mark61]

According to the link I posted, standing ones should be insurance too, and both should be limited to 25 kmh.

 

[gypo]

Yes it is all a bit confusing, the guy wasn’t trying to sell me a scooter as he only repaired them, I asked him about the one I posted and at that point he told me the above, then to cap that I seen a lad on a sit down one with no helmet and no license plate?