Accumulator tank.

[Robmac]

I'm in the process of installing the water system on my van. This consists of a Fiamma 70 litre tank coupled with a Shurflo 30 PSI pump to supply the kitchen and bathroom.

On my previous van, I was always annoyed by the spluttering taps, which often meant that I ended up wearing the water rather than it's intended use!

So, I have decided to fit an accumulator/expansion tank. This is the model I have gone for;

Fiamma A20 Universal Expansion Tank

This is charged at 13 PSI but I am going to top it up to 15 PSI as the optimum charge is 50% of that of the pump. This can be done on any compressor.

I am also adding a filter/strainer;

Shurflo Caravan Motorhome Water Strainer Filter

Apparently, this combined system should save water, save wear and tear on the pump and boiler and save electricity as well as getting rid of the problem of the taps spluttering and pulsing and should give a nice even flow of water.

The accumulator tank arrived yesterday and is only about the size of the pump, so shouldn't take up too much room.

Anybody else tried this approach?

 

[Deleted member 5816]

In every van we have had I always fitted a accumulator present van only has a cold tap and limited space as of yet I have had no reason to fit it, I have always moved,It on from van to van so it's been a cheap accessory, they do work very well. I think a Pozzani water filter with dedicated drinking tap a good idea these are cheap to buy and replacement filters reasonably priced.

 

[Robmac]

In every van we have had I always fitted a accumulator present van only has a cold tap and limited space as of yet I have had no reason to fit it, I have always moved,It on from van to van so it's been a cheap accessory, they do work very well. I think a Pozzani water filter with dedicated drinking tap a good idea these are cheap to buy and replacement filters reasonably priced.

Thanks Alf.

I'm quite interested in the Pozzani, I will look into it.

 

[Byronic]

I have the Fiamma expansion tank in my wasser system, in theory it should of course make a difference, but in practice and in my case it didn't. I just left it in place (looks nice!) and let it run flat.
When you pressurise the Fiamma tank make certain you don't accidently exceed the recommended max. for any appliance in your system most obvious being the water heater, as this may well have a max. of less than 15psi. A bike pump is better than using a compressor IMO.
Some water pumps exceed the maximum pressure recommended by w/heater manufacturers.

 

[Deleted member 5816]

We have always used the water in all our vans for drinking water we tried nature pure but the filters are so expensive the Pozzani included a dedicated tap so we fitted this and just filtered the drinking water so the filters last far longer. When we bought ours their were a range of 20 or so taps to choose from. I may have a spare tap you could have I will look this weekend.

Alf

Thanks Alf.

I'm quite interested in the Pozzani, I will look into it.

 

[Robmac]

I have the Fiamma expansion tank in my wasser system, in theory it should of course make a difference, but in practice and in my case it didn't. I just left it in place (looks nice!) and let it run flat.
When you pressurise the Fiamma tank make certain you don't accidently exceed the recommended max. for any appliance in your system most obvious being the water heater, as this may well have a max. of less than 15psi. A bike pump is better than using a compressor IMO.
Some water pumps exceed the maximum pressure recommended by w/heater manufacturers.

Good point.

I have the Propex Malaga boiler which is rated to 1.9 bar which equates to 27.5 PSI.

Maybe I should have gone for the 20 PSI pump!

 

[edina]

Same system I've used on boats; stops the short-cycling and, supposedly, is good for the pump.

 

[Robmac]

Same system I've used on boats; stops the short-cycling and, supposedly, is good for the pump.

I'm a bit worried about the pump pressure now Chris.

As my boiler is rated to 27.5 PSI and the pump at 30 PSI, will the accumulator reduce this?

 

[edina]

I'm a bit worried about the pump pressure now Chris.

As my boiler is rated to 27.5 PSI and the pump at 30 PSI, will the accumulator reduce this?

There is a pressure cut off switch on the end of the pump, you should be able to reduce the pressure with this. Probably have to google or youtube the model for the exact way to do it.

ps, I've got a surflow pump in my shed if you want it as a spare.

 

[Robmac]

There is a pressure cut off switch on the end of the pump, you should be able to reduce the pressure with this. Probably have to google or youtube the model for the exact way to do it.

ps, I've got a surflow pump in my shed if you want it as a spare.

Thanks Chris.

The adjuster says 'Adjusts shut off only, does not change flow or operating pressure'. - most confusing.

I think I will just send it back and exchange for the 20 PSI which Propex say is ok in their manual.

 

[Robmac]

The pump I have is actually rated at 7L per minute, so I wasn't worried about emptying the tank (13.5L), I tend to not run the water flat out anyway.

Yours is a submersible as opposed to a pressurised system, so I presume you have microswitches on the taps? I didn't want to go that way, so my system relies on the tap opening and reducing the pressure and operating a microswitch on the pump.

Looking again at the manual online, and I will probably go for a 16 PSI pump as 20 is right on the limit.

EDIT; I see what you mean about the Whale pressure switch now, rather than the tap m/switches!

 

[Robmac]

I can't check that as I no longer have that van, but I have had the problem previously on boats.

I just went for the accumulator as it was fairly cheap (I paid £20) and an easy fit. If I get no spluttering from the taps, I guess I will never know whether it was down to the accumulator or not!

However, my next question is, if I run the pipework from the water tank to pump, then to the accumulator (instead of to the accumulator first) , will this change the output to 15PSI to the boiler?

 

[Robmac]

I can't check that as I no longer have that van, but I have had the problem previously on boats.

I just went for the accumulator as it was fairly cheap (I paid £20) and an easy fit. If I get no spluttering from the taps, I guess I will never know whether it was down to the accumulator or not!

However, my next question is, if I run the pipework from the water tank to pump, then to the accumulator (instead of to the accumulator first) , will this change the output to 15PSI to the boiler?

........i'm guessing that would make the pump run permanently!!

 

[Deleted member 5816]

The tank to the pump and then on to the taps water heater etc, have a tee on the cold after the pump and feed the accumulator from there.

Alf

........i'm guessing that would make the pump run permanently!!

 

[Byronic]

Good point.

I have the Propex Malaga boiler which is rated to 1.9 bar which equates to 27.5 PSI.

Maybe I should have gone for the 20 PSI pump!

You obviously have their latest model, the 5E?. Because previous models were rated @ only 13 PSI, less than 1bar! It was difficult to find a pump at this rating but I managed to get a 16 PSI Shureflow which I believe is no longer manufactured. Minimum is now 20 PSI which is why I suspect Propex have had to raise their specs.
It's a good idea to check the flue, in the past the steel sheet metal was folded at corners, and no solder or sealant to stop rainwater gradually seeping past and trickling down the interior face of the van wall! I could relate a sorry tale when I pointed this out to Propex.

 

[Robmac]

You obviously have their latest model, the 5E?. Because previous models were rated @ only 13 PSI, less than 1bar! It was difficult to find a pump at this rating but I managed to get a 16 PSI Shureflow which I believe is no longer manufactured. Minimum is now 20 PSI which is why I suspect Propex have had to raise their specs.
It's a good idea to check the flue, in the past the steel sheet metal was folded at corners, and no solder or sealant to stop rainwater gradually seeping past and trickling down the interior face of the van wall! I could relate a sorry tale when I pointed this out to Propex.

Yes it's the 5E.

I will check the plate, thanks.

 

[Byronic]

One downside of submersibles is that eventually water will get past the seal and into the motor. Cheap enough to carry a spare I suppose and as long as the thing is readily accessible.

 

[Robmac]

............................ for any appliance in your system most obvious being the water heater, as this may well have a max. of less than 15psi. A bike pump is better than using a compressor IMO.
Some water pumps exceed the maximum pressure recommended by w/heater manufacturers.

Thanks for the tip by the way. I hadn't waded through the manual yet, and could well have missed this. (I had a 32 PSI pump on my last van so thought surely a 30 would be ok!)

I owe you one!

 

[Byronic]

Thanks for the tip by the way. I hadn't waded through the manual yet, and could well have missed this. (I had a 32 PSI pump on my last van so thought surely a 30 would be ok!)

I owe you one!

I don't want this to sound as if this was from a harbinger of doom, and it may only ever have applied to the older superceded models, but the Malaga w/heater was/is made from 2 thin wall aluminium castings. These can be porous as I unfortunately found out! Give the casing a good check with dry paper tissue, best of course if you could fill it, pressurise and test it before installing.
It's a weird heater, the burner only heats the water via the vertical lightly finned end wall and this is where the porosity occurred in my heater.

 

[Robmac]

I don't want this to sound as if this was from a harbinger of doom, and it may only apply to the older superceded models, but the Malaga heater was/is made from 2 thin wall aluminium castings. These can be porous as I unfortunately found out! Give the casing a good check with dry paper tissue, best of course if you could fill it, pressurise and test it before installing.
It's a weird heater, the burner only heats the water via the end vertical lightly finned end wall and this is where the porosity occurred in my heater

It's half installed now, just waiting for the gas fitter to connect it.

It will get some hammer this year, so I will keep an eye on it. I've installed all of the main systems, (water tank/pump/boiler/heating) in the 'boot' under the double bed at the back of the van and all are easily accessible and keepaneyeonable, I've also lined the back with rubber matting, so any seepage shouldn't get to far before it is spotted. If it does fail, I will see how good the warranty is. Otherwise, I will just put it down to experience and buy something else.

Shame really, I went for the Malaga for it's larger capacity, but we live and learn!