Reversed polarity

[r4dent]

I asked chatgpt.

Is it really possible for two normal adults in a European motorhome to be gassed as they sleep, and be robbed of their possessions, and not have any knowledge of it happening until morning?

ChatGPT said:​

This is a common and persistent urban myth, especially in Europe, but the short answer is:

---

What the stories usually claim:​

People in campervans or motorhomes wake up to find:

• They've been robbed overnight.
• They felt drowsy, groggy, or had headaches.
• They believe they were gassed through vents or windows to knock them out.

---

What experts and authorities say:​

1. Anesthesiologists and toxicologists:​

• There is no known gasthat can be safely and effectively used to knock people out in an open or poorly sealed space (like a campervan) without:
  • Risking death,
  • Needing precise dosing,
  • And working fast and quietly.
• Gases like chloroform or ether don’t work like in the movies—they take minutes to work and require soaked cloths.
• Medical gases like halothane or sevoflurane require precise equipment, are expensive, and would be extremely risky to use outside of clinical settings.

2. Police and forensic authorities (especially in France, Germany, UK):​

• Have found no forensic evidence of gassing in any reported cases.
• Many cases turn out to be simple break-ins while people were asleep and unaware.
• Others involve alcohol, fatigue, or pre-existing illness that may explain grogginess.

3. Camper and motorhome associations:​

• Acknowledge that robberies happen, especially at rest stops or unsecured areas.
• But do not support the gassing theory due to lack of evidence.

---

So why do people believe it?​

• Victims wake up confused, groggy, and missing valuables—shock + embarrassment can make the gas story more comforting ("We were helpless victims").
• The theory spreads easily online, in forums, or by word-of-mouth.
• It can feel like the only explanation if someone thinks, “I would have woken up otherwise.”

---

So what really happens?​

Most likely scenarios:

• Silent break-ins while the victims are in deep sleep (especially after alcohol or exhaustion).
• Doors left unlocked or windows left cracked.
• Thieves using stealth and targeting only what's accessible without waking people.

---

Practical safety tips:​

• Always lock doors and windows.
• Avoid isolated or unsecured overnight spots.
• Use alarm systems, steering wheel locks, or motion detectors.
• Store valuables out of sight or in hidden safes.

---

Bottom line:​

Item 3 on my list of options for disproving gassing was
"3) Google says it is impossible"

this is clearly wrong and should be replaced by
"3) Google / ChatGPT says it is impossible"

 

[Pudsey Bear]

You sound like an educated man. Thankyou for that wise comment.

He fooled you Jim.

 

[merl]

He fooled you Jim.

Bah.....rumbled again.

 

[mark61]

Item 3 on my list of options for disproving gassing was
"3) Google says it is impossible"

this is clearly wrong and should be replaced by
"3) Google / ChatGPT says it is impossible"

To be fair to Google and ChatGPT, the question was massively flawed to start with, the word "normal" was used in relation to MH'ers.

 

[r4dent]

To be fair to Google and ChatGPT, the question was massively flawed to start with, the word "normal" was used in relation to MH'ers.

Good point

I have added "Normal Motor Homers" to the list of my favourite oxymorons !
accurate estimate
awfully good
climb down
grow smaller
military intelligence
only option
original copy
same difference
seriously funny
small crowd

 

[YeoBlade]

Now that we've (hopefully) heard the last about Barry's ring, I thought I'd resurrect an old favourite.
While on our first foray over the pyranees and into Spain, the fridge wasnt coping well on gas so we used a few sites paying for electricity. I was surprised to find 3 newly installed sites using the round euro style sockets, which meant that for the first time I used the adapter I bought over 10 years ago!
The point of all this is that for those who worry about these things, there's no need for an adapter to deal with reversed polarity. If it shows as reversed on your tester, just pull the plug out, rotate 180 degrees and assuming they've managed to connect the earth, all should be fine.
Now, was there a gassing thread arising from Barry's ring?

Apologies to get back on track to the thread ,but which 2 pin sockets are they fitting on new installs in EU now? Picture please

 

[bartman]

Apologies to get back on track to the thread ,but which 2 pin sockets are they fitting on new installs in EU now? Picture please

I found them in a few newly installed sites in Spain - the euro style sockets the same as you find in houses. They used to be around in some older sites in France when we first started touring over 10 years ago, but haven't seen one there since. That's why I was surprised to see them being installed. As you probably know, the European plugs have an earth strip on both sides, so that will connect whichever way the plug is inserted

 

[YeoBlade]

I found them in a few newly installed sites in Spain - the euro style sockets the same as you find in houses. They used to be around in some older sites in France when we first started touring over 10 years ago, but haven't seen one there since. That's why I was surprised to see them being installed. As you probably know, the European plugs have an earth strip on both sides, so that will connect whichever way the plug is inserted

Oh, sounds a downgrade! the 16A blue commando socket generally has an IP67 rating and EU compatible, but those 2 pin household plugs?? are they inside a IP rated supply box on a new install? .There are so many version of the FR. SP. DE. similar plugs that some do and some don't fit each other, right PTA

 

[bartman]

Oh, sounds a downgrade! the 16A blue commando socket generally has an IP67 rating and EU compatible, but those 2 pin household plugs?? are they inside a IP rated supply box on a new install? .There are so many version of the FR. SP. DE. similar plugs that some do and some don't fit each other, right PTA

I wouldn't say that they're likely to be IP rated, quite exposed. I've also noticed that a lot of French motorhomers use a cable terminating in the euro style plug and have to use a short adapter cable to use the 3 pin sockets! The connection between the two didn't look anything like waterproof!

 

[trevskoda]

Just remember the dangers or polarity the wrong way round, many dont understand this.

 

[YeoBlade]

Just remember the dangers or polarity the wrong way round, many dont understand this.

If on single pole MCB not good. As most UK vans have.

I wouldn't say that they're likely to be IP rated, quite exposed. I've also noticed that a lot of French motorhomers use a cable terminating in the euro style plug and have to use a short adapter cable to use the 3 pin sockets! The connection between the two didn't look anything like waterproof!

Converter cable often wrapped up in a IP67 plastic bag though

 

[mistericeman]

Item 3 on my list of options for disproving gassing was
"3) Google says it is impossible"

this is clearly wrong and should be replaced by
"3) Google / ChatGPT says it is impossible"

Even the Royal College of Anaesthetists reckon it's a myth....

HGV gas attacks are a myth, says Royal College of Anaesthetists​

Chris Tindall
March 26, 2018

Respiratory experts have cast doubt on claims that there have been a spate of gas attacks on HGV drivers in the UK, saying they are “a myth”.
The Royal College of Anaesthetists (RCA) told CM it stood by its statement released in 2014 that it is not possible to render someone unconscious by blowing an anaesthetic agent into their cab, even if they are sleeping at the time.
The college spoke out after the RHA said it was concerned about reports that criminals are gassing lorry drivers before stealing goods from their trucks, an issue.
It referred to a recent incident in the West Midlands in which a driver woke up the next morning to discover thieves had slashed his vehicle’s curtain and stolen thousands of pounds worth of cargo.
The RHA said he had been gassed in his sleep and was taken to hospital for tests. It also said there had been similar incidents in South Yorkshire.
But an RCA spokesman said its position on gassings remained unchanged.
“Even the more powerful modern volatile agents would need to be delivered in tankerloads of carrier gas by a large compressor.
“If there was a totally safe, odourless, potent, cheap anaesthetic agent available to thieves for this purpose it is likely the medical profession would know about it and be investigating its use in anaesthetic practice,” he said.
West Midlands Police confirmed it was investigating a report of theft from an HGV parked in Longmore Avenue in the Bentley area of Walsall.
A spokeswoman said: “Although the victim reported feeling unwell and the company feared he may have been gassed, paramedics sent to the scene did not identify any respiratory problems.

 

[trevskoda]

When you get old gas may kill.

 

[r4dent]

Even the Royal College of Anaesthetists reckon it's a myth....

Do you have a link to the RCOA paper?
https://www.rcoa.ac.uk/research does not locate the article.

I think this is covered by "Rule 1", with the expert being a 2018 magazine article quoting a 2014 paper.

1) An expert says that the amount of gas required would require a fleet of articulated tanker trucks.

 

[maingate]

If you take a gas such as Carbon Monoxide, an amount of 1.28% and (therefore) 98.72% Air is enough to cause unconsciousness after just 2 to 3 breaths, followed by death within 3 minutes.

So can someone tell me how many HGV Tanker loads it is equivalent to? Remember this sort of thing normally happens in a domestic dwelling and consequently a much bigger volume than a Lorry Cab.

I believe the statement dismissing the possibility and mentioning tanker loads of gas is a deliberate spoiler to end the discussion.

 

[mistericeman]

Was Button gassed?

Editor—The robbery of Jenson Button in the South of France while under the influence of an alleged externally administered sedative anaesthetic inhalation

academic.oup.com

 

[Pudsey Bear]

Button mentioned this in his book, but I forget what he said, Merlin has it now.

 

[TJBi]

If you take a gas such as Carbon Monoxide, an amount of 1.28% and (therefore) 98.72% Air is enough to cause unconsciousness after just 2 to 3 breaths, followed by death within 3 minutes.

<snip>

How many motorhomers have been found dead in their motorhomes after being gassed during the night by thieves? If none, the gassing thieves have been extremely fortunate or extremely skilled.

 

[merl]

Button mentioned this in his book, but I forget what he said, Merlin has it now.

Four adults woke up feeling groggy and dieing for a fry up. A night on the piss does that though.

 

[merl]

How many motorhomers have been found dead in their motorhomes after being gassed during the night by thieves? If none, the gassing thieves have been extremely fortunate or extremely skilled.

Or they are using a gas that specialists in the field are not aware of?
It all sounds a bit like the spontaneous human combustion stories or being ill because you "had a bad pint".
Somehow things don't stack up.