Propane charging adaptors

[bullrush]

Just thought if anyone considered charging there own bottles there is an adaptor that costs £45 that lets you refill your own bottles. It is easy to use and the cost of a refill is about half price, 12kg refill for £13.
I know people will throw their hands in the air in horror but it is just the same as refilling a car with gas. The reason it is "not allowed" is because the gas companies would loose a fortune

 

[maingate]

Good info Bullrush.

It would soon pay for itself. I am lucky to have an energas depot near me. Its only two thirds of the price of Calor for a 6 kg bottle.

 

[shortcircuit]

Been debated on many forums with the main objection being you cannot accurately measure if your bottle is 80% full. Recommended method to reduce down to 80% is simply to vent?? BOOM

 

[Kontiki]

I use one I got of eBay for about £35, I can weigh the bottle to see how much gas has been used, but I prefer to use it until it is empty then you know how much to refill it with. I agree that it could be potentionally dangerous if you just fill it the try to vent it off (something I have seen them do at filling stations in Portugal).
I only use my ligthweight calor bottle for the cadac bbq & as a backup for my Alugas refillable bottle.

 

[Deleted member 207]

The small bottles have a tube that sits at the 80% mark and when the screw at the top of the tube is opened it allows vapour to escape. When the bottle hits 80% liquid escapes. So its possible to fill small re-usable bottles fairly safely, wear gloves and glasses.

Big problem is that most service stations take a dim view of letting people fill small bottles from the autogas pumps as the escaping gas is a real problem with so many sources of ignition being present - cars, pumps, etc.

The other problem is that autogas is not pure propane, its a mix of propane, butane and a few other unwanted gases in very small % (like Butadienne). So appliances have to be suitable for use on the autogas mix (jet size and pressure), in Germany they run the autogas appliances at 50mBar not the 30mBar of the propane or butane specific appliances. I'm not sure why 50mBar is critical but I have tried a 30mBar pressure regulator on my gas tank and the gas stove produced a very sooty and smelly flame - back to the 50mBar.

 

[derekfaeberwick]

Been debated on many forums with the main objection being you cannot accurately measure if your bottle is 80% full. Recommended method to reduce down to 80% is simply to vent?? BOOM

Recommended by who may I ask?

 

[shortcircuit]

Sorry Derick

Delete "recommended" and insert "actual" As observed by Kontiki

 

[AndyC]

The small bottles have a tube that sits at the 80% mark and when the screw at the top of the tube is opened it allows vapour to escape. When the bottle hits 80% liquid escapes. So its possible to fill small re-usable bottles fairly safely, wear gloves and glasses.

I don't know of any UK bottles with that sort of arrangement.

Big problem is that most service stations take a dim view of letting people fill small bottles from the autogas pumps as the escaping gas is a real problem with so many sources of ignition being present - cars, pumps, etc.

Quite so, and if it were to become a regular occurrence I can see filling stations refusing autogas fillups to all motorhomes, including those with proper refillable LPG installations.

The other problem is that autogas is not pure propane, its a mix of propane, butane and a few other unwanted gases in very small % (like Butadienne). So appliances have to be suitable for use on the autogas mix (jet size and pressure), in Germany they run the autogas appliances at 50mBar not the 30mBar of the propane or butane specific appliances. I'm not sure why 50mBar is critical but I have tried a 30mBar pressure regulator on my gas tank and the gas stove produced a very sooty and smelly flame - back to the 50mBar.

That was most likely because your appliances are jetted and adjusted to run at 50mB, they may not have run properly even on pure propane at 30mB.

AndyC

 

[jogguk]

You are prohibited to refill Calor, EasyGas, Flow Gas, Shell or whatever cylinders yourself. Basically you only rent the cylinders on an exchange basis. They are not yours to do what you like with, even if you did "buy" if from a man in a pub

You may feel safe in your ability to refill your cylinder to the correct volume. Would you feel so safe when a couple of the local gypsy kids turn up on their quad bike with cylinders strapped on them and attempt to fill up when your on the garage forecourt?

Or how about the old buffer down the road who takes his bottle out of his calor gas mobile heater and down to the local garage to try and fill up because he saw you doing it last week He doesn't know you had a special adaptor

john

 

[derekfaeberwick]

I feel safe and happy.

 

[Deleted member 967]

The other problem is that autogas is not pure propane, its a mix of propane, butane and a few other unwanted gases in very small % (like Butadienne). .

I wrote to Calor Gas on this issue and they replied that the gas they sell as "AUTOGAS" in the UK is exactly the same as supplied in the red propane bottles.
I have used other LPG (Flo Gas) and finished up having a major sooting problem and having to have new burners fitted.

After that experience I now look for SHELL or CALOR outlets as Shell is Calor Autogas. (It says so on the pump)(The bulk tank also states propane on it)

You can download a POI file from the Calor Autogas website or use their site locator.

Flo Gas have not replied to my letter about what is in the LPG they supply on garage forecourts.

 

[lebesset]

all propane sold in the uk is exactly the same as all lpg sold , ie industrial grade propane from the big oil companies
it is in fact roughly 90% propane and 10% other gases ...methane , butane , napthane etc ; to expect every fill to be exactly the same is like expecting every bottle of wine to be exactly the same

europe has now standardised on 30Mb regulators , but the gas has not changed , you can use butane or propane

the soot from the gas often depends on how well it has been filtered ...try some moroccan butane !

if you wish to fill your own bottles do what the bottle filling plants do ....take an empty bottle and put in the design weight of gas .... the 80 % is not critical in european temperatures but an excellent very safe guide ...if you are in the middle of the sahara at 50C best to be more precise ...years of running on lpg taught me that you will get between 75 and 85% when you fill ....depends on ambient and the lpg pump

 

[Deleted member 967]

all propane sold in the uk is exactly the same as all lpg sold , ie industrial grade propane from the big oil companies
it is in fact roughly 90% propane and 10% other gases ...methane , butane , napthane etc ; to expect every fill to be exactly the same is like expecting every bottle of wine to be exactly the same

the soot from the gas often depends on how well it has been filtered ...try some moroccan butane !

With 34 years of running on bottle gas mostly Calor Propane and no problems with sooting up in any of the Caravans or MH I have had. I find it peculiar that in less than 18 months of running LPG from a forecourt mainly FloGas that I have encountered a sooting up problem so bad that I was recommended to change the Truma heater at a cost in excess of £1500 and have encountered problems with the fridge burners as well from the time of going onto forecourt LPG.

I have had burners burn out in the old Carver SB1800 heaters but they didn’t soot the fire up as has happened to the Truma heater in my current van. I lived full time in a caravan on a storage site, so the heater were running continuously from October to April and the fridge only went out when I had to swap bottles. Water heater going all year 24/7 I used Calor 47Kg Propane except when I went on holiday in the van. Then I used the Calor Butane (Blue) bottles.

Using just two tank refills (140 litres) of Autogas (Calor/Shell) the fire is now almost soot free and the fridge is working better but not yet up to the way it was using the gas from the dealers swap stock.

 

[lebesset]

sounds rather like calor filter the gas rather better than flogas

perhaps a lesson for us all

having said that I have used lpg for cooking and heating all over europe and never had sooting up once ..... also for 35 years !

 

[ajs]

having said that I have used lpg for cooking and heating all over europe and never had sooting up once ..... also for 35 years !

i wana see the size of that cylinder lesbepet

bet JT has 1 too

regards
aj

 

[LDV Camper]

Gaslow

Interested in reading this thread. We took the route two or three years ago to buy Gaslow. Not only is it VERY dangerous to refil bottles but it is also illegal to refil ANY bottle (even Gaslow) unless it is a FITTED part of the vehicle.

Yes, I am free-spirited but in this case the law makes good sense.

However, the Gaslow has proven great value (though the guage is about as much use a a chocolate tea pot) and has saved us more that its cost over the past couple of years. The greatest advantage is being able to carry just one smallish bottle with no need for a spare because you can always fill up. In addition, you can fill up anywhere in Europe with one of two simple adaptors - though we never did find one that works in Hungary.

 

[Telstar]

For the safety of myself, my family and all those around me whether that be at the filling station itself or on the road, not forgetting the insurance implications, I for one will not be trying to save what amounts to a few quid over a year going down this route.

Jon

 

[waggi]

I invested in a gaslow bottle about 5 years ago then added a second one to it about 3 years ago,its one of the best investments i've made with the van its paid for itself time and time again,the main advantage I find is you see an autogas site and can call and top it up.The most I've paid is on first fill but average about £6-£7 the least I've paid was 57p(I forgot when we last topped up)I use two 6kg size bottles and camp all year round.We topped up in Holland 3 weeks ago at a shell station at approx 45c a litre and didn't need an adaptor. P.S there are other systems available(better put that in).

 

[Deleted member 775]

as for the refilling of gas bottles, we have a freind who refills propane ones with a home made adaptor and has been doing so fo a long time. he has no problems and swears by it, but i think in the intrest of saftey unless you equip the van with an aproved gaslow or other system then one day mabey something may go wrong and there will be no going back .after all these gaslow systems dont cost the earth and they will pay for themselves in a short time .