Please sign this petition

[sasquatch]

Have a look at this:

38 Degrees | Put voters in charge of MPs

I'm supporting a campaign for a new recall law to give us the power to call a fresh vote if our local MP has let us down.

So far our campaign has pushed recall right up the political agenda. Now's the time to make sure these warm words are turned into urgent action.

At the moment, no matter what MPs have done, we have to put up with them until the next general election. Can you think of another job where once you've been hired, the people who've hired you can't touch you for up to five years, no matter what you've done? A recall law would give local voters the power to call a fresh vote and sack disgraced MPs.

38 Degrees | Put voters in charge of MPs

 

[Boxerman]

Have a look at this:

At the moment, no matter what MPs have done, we have to put up with them until the next general election. Can you think of another job where once you've been hired, the people who've hired you can't touch you for up to five years, no matter what you've done? A recall law would give local voters the power to call a fresh vote and sack disgraced MPs.
]

So who decides if an MP has overstepped the mark? the Sun? the Mirror? seeing as how the general public only get to hear one sided "facts" from the media about any goings on, how could you make a fair judgement?

Frank

 

[biggirafe]

So who decides if an MP has overstepped the mark? the Sun? the Mirror? seeing as how the general public only get to hear one sided "facts" from the media about any goings on, how could you make a fair judgement?

Frank

Sounds like Football to me (I hate the game) everytime a manager looses a game they sack him. No-one is prepared to wait these days.

Can you imagine what a state the country would be in if the plebs were allowed to sack an MP everytime something did not go right or more likley some idiot shouts the loudest.

Sometimes things take 5 years to come right.

How much will it cost?
Who's going to pay for it. We are!

Sorry this won't get my vote....

 

[Firefox]

Well dream on... most local MP's don't have the support of their constituency anyway, typically being elected on 30 or 40 % of the vote.

So how would you decide whether "to trigger a fresh vote to test whether the MP still has local support" as per the petition.

What percentage would they need to "have local support", Since they don't have a majority anyway. And following on from this "test," the only way to change the MP is a new by-election so what support they would then get depends on the quality of the other candidates and how many parties put up etc.

I think we would end up with hundreds of by elections and tests of support every year. How much will all this cost the country? Its you and me who ultimately has to pay from our taxes at the expense of say health and education.

This is a half baked idea which is going nowhere. Even if it got a million sigs no gov could contemplate introducing it due to the cost. The deal is they get elected for 5 years and we kick them out if we don't like it. To have continual official reviews is unworkable.

 

[s1n86d]

I believe that M p's are in it for themselves, not me. and that being the case I refuse to vote for any of them in the first place, so I won't be voting for any replacement.

One set of thieves and perverts is no better than the others, oh yes they will throw you the odd crumb to keep you happy, whilst saving the best for themselves.

It does not matter who is in power, you will be no better off except by your own efforts.


regards

Bill

 

[Boxerman]

I believe that M p's are in it for themselves, not me. and that being the case I refuse to vote for any of them in the first place

Bill

People in the past gave their lives so that ordinary people could have a vote, you whinge about what you suppose MPs are like now - think about what it must have been like then.
People who cannot be bothered to vote get exactly the government they ask for.

Frank

 

[s1n86d]

People in the past gave their lives so that ordinary people could have a vote, you whinge about what you suppose MPs are like now - think about what it must have been like then.
People who cannot be bothered to vote get exactly the government they ask for.

Frank

Who was talking of the past, not me nor Sasquatch.!

It's a pity some of our present day "honourable members" haven't got the morals or principles of some past members (not so recent).

I am not whinging, they do what they do without my approval.

By the way your not one of them are you ?

regards

Bill

 

[maingate]

A much better idea would be to start a different type of campaign.

If the public refused to cast a vote for the present MP then we would start with a clean slate after the next election. This would also send a clear message to all MP`s, both present and future.

There is little difference to the big political parties so whichever one you vote for is not a huge change in your personal beliefs.

 

[Kontiki]

Sorry but I see it as a bit of a non starter, all the people who didn't vote for the sitting MP would obviously want them out. People who don't vote have no opinion & can't be counted. As somebody said people died so that you can vote. I can't stand people who whinge about whats going on in politics but then find out they didn't even bother to vote. Whoever you vote for you are never going to be in complete agreement with what they do. Anybody who feels strongly can put themselves up for election & form their own party, I personally would hate being an MP. I've met our local MP & AM, they were both helpful in getting me answers & sorting out a problem. It is wrong to condemn all MP's out of hand they are a group of people doing a job without which the country couldn't run. My personal view is that most go into politics with good intent but find that idealism isn't workable. People complain about taxes, rates etc. but the bills have to be paid it is just a mater of who pays them.

Politicians are something we have to live with, stand up make your choice & if they aren't doing their job complain to them.

 

[Randonneur]

We could always go down the Australian route. Voting in national elections is compulsory for all people of voting age and it's a jailable offence if you don't.

 

[Firefox]

We could always go down the Australian route. Voting in national elections is compulsory for all people of voting age and it's a jailable offence if you don't.

I'm in favour of compulsory attendance at the polling station or by post. But you should have the right to abstain or spoil the ballot paper. At least it asks you to think about the election which affects your future. Even if your thought is "no comment" that's better than not taking part at all.

 

[s1n86d]

We could always go down the Australian route. Voting in national elections is compulsory for all people of voting age and it's a jailable offence if you don't.

When mp's commit jailable offences, what do you suggest we do with them, unfortunately the only sanction I have is to withold my vote


regards

Bill

 

[Channa]

We could always go down the Australian route. Voting in national elections is compulsory for all people of voting age and it's a jailable offence if you don't.

That I dont agree with, Has things stand at the moment I am far from impressed with our current government, even more worrying is I dont see a credible alternative.Part of democracy is abstention.?

Abstention is I believe to a lot of the electorate not necessarily apathy, but their vote is a lost cause under the present system.Therefore is the system due for a shake up ?

Where I grew up a donkey waving a red flag if it was a labour candidate would get the vote.

In the grand scale, a government can be formed with 40 percent of the total vote which tells me 60 % dont want them.

That cant be right ???

I think there is a lot of merit in proportional representation at least that way each member of the electorate knows their vote counts.

If it means BNP left wingers so be it at least parliament reflects public opinion.
at the time.

I am favour of regional assemblies, afterall since when has London given a four x about what happens north of Watford.

The anti PR always point towards Italy, but I see no reason why it couldnt work and if we go the route Randonneur suggests voting is a legal requirement, at least there is the comfort a vote counts..IMHO that cant be said of the current system

Channa

 

[biggirafe]

That I dont agree with, Has things stand at the moment I am far from impressed with our current government, even more worrying is I dont see a credible alternative.Part of democracy is abstention.?

Abstention is I believe to a lot of the electorate not necessarily apathy, but their vote is a lost cause under the present system.Therefore is the system due for a shake up ?

Where I grew up a donkey waving a red flag if it was a labour candidate would get the vote.

In the grand scale, a government can be formed with 40 percent of the total vote which tells me 60 % dont want them.

That cant be right ???

I think there is a lot of merit in proportional representation at least that way each member of the electorate knows their vote counts.

If it means BNP left wingers so be it at least parliament reflects public opinion.
at the time.

I am favour of regional assemblies, afterall since when has London given a four x about what happens north of Watford.

The anti PR always point towards Italy, but I see no reason why it couldnt work and if we go the route Randonneur suggests voting is a legal requirement, at least there is the comfort a vote counts..IMHO that cant be said of the current system

Channa

The Australians do allow 'none of the above' but you must turn up unless you have a good reason

 

[Firefox]

In the grand scale, a government can be formed with 40 percent of the total vote which tells me 60 % dont want them.

That cant be right ???

I think there is a lot of merit in proportional representation at least that way each member of the electorate knows their vote counts.

Channa

40% ?

The proportions last election (2005) were 35.3% Labour, 32.3% Conservative, 22.1% Liberal Democrat.

The boundaries have been adjusted so Labour can win an overall majority on just 33% of the vote. Conservatives need about 42% and the Lib dems 48% to 50%.

Even if the Labour vote goes down to 22% comparable with the Lib Dems in 2005 they would still retain about 200 seats as opposed to the 60 seats the Lib Dems won in 2005 with 22%.

That's "democracy" in action for you

 

[Channa]

40% ?

The proportions last election (2005) were 35.3% Labour, 32.3% Conservative, 22.1% Liberal Democrat.

The boundaries have been adjusted so Labour can win an overall majority on just 33% of the vote. Conservatives need about 42% and the Lib dems 48% to 50%.

Even if the Labour vote goes down to 22% comparable with the Lib Dems in 2005 they would still retain about 200 seats as opposed to the 60 seats the Lib Dems won in 2005 with 22%.

That's "democracy" in action for you

More reason for a reform and PR then ??

Channa

 

[Firefox]

Agreed 100%.

But it probably has about as much chance as the proposition put forward by OP. Although we have it for Euro elections, and I believe Labour were tending to be favour of PR when lost in the political wilderness of the 80's and 90's Tory majorities, now Labour have got their hands on the system and turned it in their favour they soon changed their tune.

I think it's going to be tougher than people think for the Conservatives to win back power under present conditions. If Labour can hold 30% and Lib Dems around 20%. The Tories will fall short even on 40%. They are going to have to time it just right, and if it's bad weather on polling day, their generally older vote wont turn out fully, so it could come down to the weather.

 

[John H]

Democracy by referendum/recall is unworkable; democracy when most people are apathetic because there is no genuine passion in politics anymore results in minority governments; forcing people to have an opinion doesn't make them express a sensible one - so what other alternative is there to a dictatorship headed by me?

By the way, Channa, did you really mean to call the BNP left wing????

 

[urbtaf]

Its my understanding that our Gov system is based on the Greek system of old. Except for one vital missing element.
The Greeks had a rule that every year the ordinary people could put foward the name of any member of the Gov, who they felt were bent or useless.
If a member got more than a certain % of the public against them, then they were stripped of office, their assets and just for good measure they were kicked out of the country!!!

SOUND GOOD TO ME


Dont know if they got to take there stolen floating duck houses with them

 

[Channa]

Democracy by referendum/recall is unworkable; democracy when most people are apathetic because there is no genuine passion in politics anymore results in minority governments; forcing people to have an opinion doesn't make them express a sensible one - so what other alternative is there to a dictatorship headed by me?

By the way, Channa, did you really mean to call the BNP left wing????

It should have read BNP, left wingers.

How much difference a comma makes

I would agree recall is flawed and I would agree there is apathy.

But I often wonder if that apathy is a result of the current system, re my donkey analogy.

My personal conclusion is that we will only have an increase in footfall at election time as and when people genuinely feel their vote counts which keeps me returning to the idea of a workable PR system.

Of course the question that raises back to extremist parties, is that they could well hold seats in parliament.

If they reflect part of the population, Does it follow that intervention is necessary, on the grounds they dont share the same beliefs?

All interesting stuff.

Channa