Old v New

[redhand]

Have owned a W reg hymer for ten years it's been faultless but recently have toyed with the idea of getting a modern van.
Went to see a 5 year old autotrail recently and was astounded at the difference in quality.
Fixtures and fittings flimsy seating soft and not ergonomic. Totally unimpressed, is this the norm or the difference in german/brit standards.

 

[Nesting Zombie]

Hi ya,
Yeah have to say, I’ve only ever had older vehicles, Mainly because I can’t afford newer ones.
But the advantage of getting a van for converting is that you can choose the fixtures & fittings to complement your budget.
Mainstream suppliers of Vans & Motorhomes obviously buy in bulk & reel them out often allowing quality to suffer over return profit margins

 

[rugbyken]

i have a 2013 hymer i’m afraid you will still see a build quality difference even within brand our own fault i’m afraid if we want all singing all dancing interiors the weight has to be saved somewhere & im afraid it is in the strength of fittings , ie my cupboard catches went as a temporary measure i fitted a small bolt from the drawer to the valance above which is hoew i fount that aforesaid valance instead of being the ply i expected is only curved cardboard with a wood veneer !?

 

[Canalsman]

Because there are fewer and fewer drivers with licences to drive 'vans over 3500Kg the manufacturers are having to achieve drastic weight reductions. Hence everything is less substantial be it fixtures and fittings or the materials to which they are attached.

It's not good news.

 

[wildebus]

Have owned a W reg hymer for ten years it's been faultless but recently have toyed with the idea of getting a modern van.
Went to see a 5 year old autotrail recently and was astounded at the difference in quality.
Fixtures and fittings flimsy seating soft and not ergonomic. Totally unimpressed, is this the norm or the difference in german/brit standards.

I don't think it is anything to do with being an Autotrail rather than a Hymer, but all to do with being a much newer motorhome.
My own Autotrail will be 17 years old in February and the motorhome side of it is very solid indeed. While updating the electrics to add sockets and that kind of thing, sometimes I have had to drill through over 50mm worth of plywood boards!
I have modified lots of other vans from many manufacturers and of a wide range of ages and it is very apparent how the newer vans have notably different materials used, the most obvious change being the use of polystyrene within two very thin sheets of ply rather than a traditional plywood sheet on internal fittings on many vans. This will be a great weight-saver but not the best to mount fittings to. From my own experience as a installer as opposed to an owner, the older the van, the more solid it seems to be regardless of make and model.

 

[barryd]

My friend in our village had one of those older Hymers for years. Never went anywhere in it but it was built like a tank. I remember over the years of searching for our new van about ten years ago looking at new Bailey and a New Hymer side by side and to my eye and feel the Bailey seemed better quality and half the price so Im not so sure there is much in it now. Our 2015 new to us Swift Esprit seems leagues better quality wise than our old Kontiki was from the last century but its also on a 4250kg chassis. The old one was sub 3500kg and the internal doors etc and hab door for example looked like they were made out of cardboard in comparison. So maybe Brit vans got better and German quality went the other way or they maybe are not as far apart as they once were.

Hab stuff is just hab stuff though. The main considerations to me have always been payload and keeping out the damp. Anything else can easily be replaced or fixed.

 

[Glynno]

I had a 2005 Peugeot Autosleeper. Sold as I wanted more space. I now have a 2019 Peugeot Autosleeper. Quality build, Quality equipment, Quality design. Same engine but turbo addition feels like its twice the size. The wife and I are very pleased although.her specification was “ it must have a microwave and fit into a supermarket parking space. Well at 6 meters I do need to be a bit choosy with the parking space.

 

[JQB]

I don't think it is anything to do with being an Autotrail rather than a Hymer, but all to do with being a much newer motorhome.
My own Autotrail will be 17 years old in February and the motorhome side of it is very solid indeed. While updating the electrics to add sockets and that kind of thing, sometimes I have had to drill through over 50mm worth of plywood boards!
I have modified lots of other vans from many manufacturers and of a wide range of ages and it is very apparent how the newer vans have notably different materials used, the most obvious change being the use of polystyrene within two very thin sheets of ply rather than a traditional plywood sheet on internal fittings on many vans. This will be a great weight-saver but not the best to mount fittings to. From my own experience as a installer as opposed to an owner, the older the van, the more solid it seems to be regardless of make and model.

In the 70's we had a small caravan, a Eurocamper, the table was a layer of very very thin decorative ply on each side with a layer of either polystyrene or maybe it was eggbox cardboard inside, the framework a balsa-like lightweight no grain timber, very light but plenty strong enough. The interior locker lids in quarter in plain ply. It all worked just fine.

 

[Pauljenny]

Our first van was an Autosleeper Amethyst 1993.
The monocoque body was a selling point.
After 8 years, mainly full-timing. It was looking and acting tired and things were starting to fail

We went back to A/S but were most unhappy with their range. Cheap, and scrimping.

We had to buy whatever was available, before we set off in 4 weeks for our winter trip.

It was a Homecar. We had so many build problems, that the dealer sent us to campervans.uk . They had it for 4 days and it looked shipshape.
We set off for Portugal.

Pretty soon after, delivery vans were parading up our country lane, bringing replacements for just about every moving part in the hab area.... Anything that moved, dropped off.

We sued the dealer, through the small claims court. When they finally settled, We traded it in for a wonderful Bentley, watched it being built, while using our old van to live in, while parked outside. They couldn't do enough for us.

They went under, some years later.
After both of us getting serious long covid, we had to give up driving.
Just didn't make 20. Years on the road.
But we've got some wonderful memories.

 

[2cv]

Our first van was an Autosleeper Amethyst 1993.
The monocoque body was a selling point.
After 8 years, mainly full-timing. It was looking and acting tired and things were starting to fail

We went back to A/S but were most unhappy with their range. Cheap, and scrimping.

We had to buy whatever was available, before we set off in 4 weeks for our winter trip.

It was a Homecar. We had so many build problems, that the dealer sent us to campervans.uk . They had it for 4 days and it looked shipshape.
We set off for Portugal.

Pretty soon after, delivery vans were parading up our country lane, bringing replacements for just about every moving part in the hab area.... Anything that moved, dropped off.

We sued the dealer, through the small claims court. When they finally settled, We traded it in for a wonderful Bentley, watched it being built, while using our old van to live in, while parked outside. They couldn't do enough for us.

They went under, some years later.
After both of us getting serious long covid, we had to give up driving.
Just didn't make 20. Years on the road.
But we've got some wonderful memories.

After tenting for decades we were lucky that our Bentley was our first van. It will be our last too, we’ll keep it till we can no longer manage.

 

[marchie]

i have a 2013 hymer i’m afraid you will still see a build quality difference even within brand our own fault i’m afraid if we want all singing all dancing interiors the weight has to be saved somewhere & im afraid it is in the strength of fittings , ie my cupboard catches went as a temporary measure i fitted a small bolt from the drawer to the valance above which is hoew i fount that aforesaid valance instead of being the ply i expected is only curved cardboard with a wood veneer !?

True. Whilst waiting to collect our 2016 Burstner from the floor delamination repair, I looked at a new Burstner 5.99m M/Home. £84,995 and the Ski Cupboard shelves are thinner, the supports are thin plastic instead of 50mm deep veneered chipboard, the toilet cassette is extracted via the bottom shelf of the Ski cupboard so that area is effectively off limits, and the drop down bed underside is only 2/3 covered in veneered board. I would need to stump up around £50,000 in a P/Ex to get a shinier new vehicle that would be even flimsier than what we already have.

The salesmen said, with our having paid the £1700 'Warranty Contribution' towards the repair, and with a M/Home that had covered only just over 30,000 miles in 8.5 years, he would keep Brunhilde, get more use out of her, and spend the money on trips away ...

Steve

 

[Pauljenny]

I'm told that the average UK Motorhome mileage is about 4000 miles per year.. because most use it for short trips to campsites, as they did in their tugging days. Never explore in it, but have a tow car or scooter.
A van with a towcar, IMHO, is surely wrong .
The little one is supposed to pull the big one ?
We averaged about 8k miles, pa, in our full-time years.

 

[rugbyken]

i’m with you paul our hymer had 1100 miles when we bought it 8 almost 9 years ago now done 82000 well used is the reason to have them