New bill to stop wild camping in England and Wales

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shaundecorator

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UK Police Bill threatens Van Life Community — VAN MONKEYS

The new Police Bill currently going through parliament in the UK has massive implications on all our basic freedoms, however there is a particular section that threatens anyone residing in, whether permanently or temporarily in a vehicle. Here’s a breakdown of the proposed legislation and possible a
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My daughter has just brought this to our attention- I am gutted please share and sign the partition.
 
barryd said:
Thats what they say Trev but how long before anti motorhomer councils start using it to their advantage though?
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Barry they don’t need this act to do as they see fit, some already do.
We have varying approaches from councils and organisations up here.
On one hand we have highland council who look set to provide facilities, whilst East Lothian put up more barriers and signage each year. Some parts of England are making things difficult for us, with some councils all but banning completely overnight parking.
I am not legally qualified but I did read through the proposals and I seemed that they were targeting travellers. At one point they even stated that this act was not meant to affect individuals using carparks for short stays.
The fact is the benefits we offer in terms of employment, spending, insurance, and other benefits more than outweigh any negative attitudes towards us, most of which are based on ignorance and lazy attitudes.
 
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It all looks fair to me, they are only giving police powers that should have been given to them many many years ago,
I think the only people that won’t like this is the travelling community.
Which they have brought on themselves with their anti social behaviour, and their lack of respect for other people’s property.
I am sure that if they had rolled up to places stayed a week and left without leaving a mess behind, and not taken with them property that they didn’t own, I am sure a lot more people would have been a lot more tolerant towards them.
 
RichardHelen262 said:
It all looks fair to me, they are only giving police powers that should have been given to them many many years ago,
I think the only people that won’t like this is the travelling community.
Which they have brought on themselves with their anti social behaviour, and their lack of respect for other people’s property.
I am sure that if they had rolled up to places stayed a week and left without leaving a mess behind, and not taken with them property that they didn’t own, I am sure a lot more people would have been a lot more tolerant towards them.
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In the interest of fairness, it isn't even ALL the travelling community, same as with motorhomes, the bad ones do tend to get all the publicity!
 
trevskoda said:
There will always be a few in m/homes who dont follow the rules as in dumping waste staying too long and running a jenny outside someones house for days on end, never mind hanging washing out, I think they will get targeted and rightly so.
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I agree Trev, PEOPLE who misbehave should be targeted. But we are not alone with some misbehaving. The vast majority of misbehaviour I have witnessed did not involve us, but it seems we alone need to be dealt with. The author of Fifes report on freedom camping in telephone conversations has stated to myself that he sees us as eyes and ears in carparks at night when much of the damage and anti social behaviour occurs. But like you I reckon these proposals clearly target the travelling community when they mis behave.
 
***** said:
I have had direct experience with the Traveling Community
Years ago. at a boatyard I managed a small group set up camp across the rd, I had a little trouble with the kids and as I frequented the pub across the canal and the Travellers also did, I told the grown ups what had happened. They sorted it out and everything good after that. We even played darts together.
Years later on a wild spot I know on Anglesey, I had settled for the weekend, opened a bottle wine and Kath was cooking our evening meal. There was two other vans at this location, but soon a convoy of Travellers arrived and camped up. The other two vans left, but we had a drink but still under the limit, but the van was all set for the night and Kath cooking so we decided to stay. We had no trouble, but next morning the location was like a bomb site and bikes, prams and stuff all over. We did leave then as didn't feel like leaving our van.
We have also experienced Travellers on aires in France and Germany, some completely taking over an aire, one even moving onto someones pitch while the owner was just dumping water and another blocking the site
On another the Mayor who owned the adjacent camp site got them moved within one hr.
There are good and bad from all communities but it does seem that many Travellers take the piddle and give all a bad name
I just don't understand why they leave such a mess when they leave a spot they are camping at
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Good post *****, you have shown both sides of the travelling community.
Yes some behave terribly and need To be sorted out.
But probably just as many only want to live their lives the way they have for centuries. Live and let live and be thankful that we are different.
 
From what I can see, this has little to do with us. Most of us would, I suspect, move on if instructed to do so by landowners or the police and the worst this seems to have done for us is give the police a power of arrest should we refuse rather than lumbering the landowner with the cost of civil litigation. According to the Independent**, this is more about giving police the power to remove protest camps:
it also contains new rules giving the police powers to remove "unauthorised encampments", which date from the difficulties faced by the authorities in removing protesters permanently...
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(clicky link)

** The quote above came from a DuckDuckGo search as I don't subscribe to the Independent and so haven't seen the more than the first paragraph or two of the actual article.
 
We have just had a traveler group 12 vans invade the Romsey Rapids our local leisure centre, they parked up on the car park, the Police etc were soon on the scene and after 5 nights they were ready with the Bailifs to shift them off, threatened with an injunction they moved of hours before the Bailifs arrived, but left the usual rubbish and filth we have come to expect of these folk. Test Valley has a standing injunction to move Travellers on, but this only covers the North of the area, so now we are getting another permanent injunction to cover the South of the the area too. If this impacts on Wild Camping which I doubt, as we are as different as chalk and cheese to the travelers in our behaviour and most only stay a night or two, leaving no trace of our stays, so I consider a new bill aimed at moving groups like the travelers on, is a small price to pay against the anti social groups who think they have the god given right to just turn up and disrupt people's lives who have paid taxes etc to keep their local environment as they / we want it to be.
 
Just as we are not all the same well behaved people, the same can be said for any group including travellers.
You don't hear anything when travellers behave themselves, you only hear of them when they don't.
And sometimes people pre judge not only travellers, as we suffer from this also.
There is much ignorance about us out there, and it's important that we don't fall into the same trap when discussing travellers.
Most people want the same, to live freely, raise their children in a safe healthy environment, and to attain as much happiness and contentment in their lives as possible.
With regards to our issues, our largest enemy are the self indulgent, il informed NIMBYS who don't even know that most of us are self sufficient when we travel.
 
***** said:
I have had direct experience with the Traveling Community
Years ago. at a boatyard I managed a small group set up camp across the rd, I had a little trouble with the kids and as I frequented the pub across the canal and the Travellers also did, I told the grown ups what had happened. They sorted it out and everything good after that. We even played darts together.
Years later on a wild spot I know on Anglesey, I had settled for the weekend, opened a bottle wine and Kath was cooking our evening meal. There was two other vans at this location, but soon a convoy of Travellers arrived and camped up. The other two vans left, but we had a drink but still under the limit, but the van was all set for the night and Kath cooking so we decided to stay. We had no trouble, but next morning the location was like a bomb site and bikes, prams and stuff all over. We did leave then as didn't feel like leaving our van.
We have also experienced Travellers on aires in France and Germany, some completely taking over an aire, one even moving onto someones pitch while the owner was just dumping water and another blocking the site
On another the Mayor who owned the adjacent camp site got them moved within one hr.
There are good and bad from all communities but it does seem that many Travellers take the piddle and give all a bad name
I just don't understand why they leave such a mess when they leave a spot they are camping at
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Fisherman said:
Just as we are not all the same well behaved people, the same can be said for any group including travellers.
You don't hear anything when travellers behave themselves, you only hear of them when they don't.
And sometimes people pre judge not only travellers, as we suffer from this also.
There is much ignorance about us out there, and it's important that we don't fall into the same trap when discussing travellers.
Most people want the same, to live freely, raise their children in a safe healthy environment, and to attain as much happiness and contentment in their lives as possible.
With regards to our issues, our largest enemy are the self indulgent, il informed NIMBYS who don't even know that most of us are self sufficient when we travel.
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Ridiculous statement , of course you hear of travelers when they behave themselves , they disrupt normal life for residents in the area they decide to invade, live freely is a good point in your post , travelers DO NOT want to pay any money towards their lifestyle just plonk themselves down where they desire , often heard is there should be places for us [ the travelers ] to stay, of course there should be and would be if they would pay a fee to the local area for water , sewage disposal, rubbish collection etc but they are not interested in this just want it all for free, all Ok for them, let others pay for their idyllic lifestyles , and do not want to live as the rest of the population do , by the rules of society.
I may be a hypocrite as I love to wild camp when I can but would never leave rubbish , sewage ect , or tear around on quad bikes etc annoying others, I would never block peoples access to their property or break down their fences etc to gain access to the spot I wanted to park on.
NIMBIES you say, well maybe, why should unwanted travelers destroy the quality of life we strive for and have worked hard to obtain? , A few years ago the travelers invaded our local playing fields , there were dozens of vans, local football teams could not play their games local dog walkers could not use the area as the travelers dogs were running wild and attacking other dogs , rubbish every where, the fences removed to allow the vans to get in , the grounds churned up by quad bikes and transit vans driving all over the fields builders rubbish dumped all over the site and human waste too , You have all seen this done in your areas , so why should we put up with it , the more powers the Police etc have the better I say but must be regulated and used correctly.
We have to have rules as if not anarchy will prevail and looking at recent developments as seen on TV news recently, we are not far away from it ?
We have stayed on French Aires where travellers were dug in, they were well behaved , kept the area clean and tidy and were pleasant folks to speak to, so not all travelers are the same , as the ones we seem to get stuck with here in the UK.
 
vindiboy said:
Ridiculous statement , of course you hear of travelers when they behave themselves , they disrupt normal life for residents in the area they decide to invade, live freely is a good point in your post , travelers DO NOT want to pay any money towards their lifestyle just plonk themselves down where they desire , often heard is there should be places for us [ the travelers ] to stay, of course there should be and would be if they would pay a fee to the local area for water , sewage disposal, rubbish collection etc but they are not interested in this just want it all for free, all Ok for them, let others pay for their idyllic lifestyles , and do not want to live as the rest of the population do , by the rules of society.
I may be a hypocrite as I love to wild camp when I can but would never leave rubbish , sewage ect , or tear around on quad bikes etc annoying others, I would never block peoples access to their property or break down their fences etc to gain access to the spot I wanted to park on.
NIMBIES you say, well maybe, why should unwanted travelers destroy the quality of life we strive for and have worked hard to obtain? , A few years ago the travelers invaded our local playing fields , there were dozens of vans, local football teams could not play their games local dog walkers could not use the area as the travelers dogs were running wild and attacking other dogs , rubbish every where, the fences removed to allow the vans to get in , the grounds churned up by quad bikes and transit vans driving all over the fields builders rubbish dumped all over the site and human waste too , You have all seen this done in your areas , so why should we put up with it , the more powers the Police etc have the better I say but must be regulated and used correctly.
We have to have rules as if not anarchy will prevail and looking at recent developments as seen on TV news recently, we are not far away from it ?
We have stayed on French Aires where travellers were dug in, they were well behaved , kept the area clean and tidy and were pleasant folks to speak to, so not all travelers are the same , as the ones we seem to get stuck with here in the UK.
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So you hate all travellers, regardless of how they behave. Well there are some who hate us no matter how we behave. And you say we hear when travellers behave, I would have thought nothing to report there. It’s the same old story tar everyone with the same brush because of what you have personally witnessed, and no doubt read. So please tell us what your solution is towards all travellers regardless of who they are and how they behave. Just remember that there are some who regard you as one of them, and would wish what you wish for them on us .

Also perhaps you could show me were I favoured anarchy, were I stated there should be one rule for travellers and one rule for us. I support fully the proposals being put forward, so long as they don’t apply to well behaved wild campers. But what I have no time for is treating a whole group of people as if they are all the same.
 
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vindiboy said:
Ridiculous statement , of course you hear of travelers when they behave themselves , they disrupt normal life for residents in the area they decide to invade, [...]

We have stayed on French Aires where travellers were dug in, they were well behaved , kept the area clean and tidy and were pleasant folks to speak to, so not all travelers are the same , as the ones we seem to get stuck with here in the UK.
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The point that @Fisherman makes is very true. You can know nothing of travellers who behave themselves to the extent that they are invisible to all intents and purposes.

FWIW, there are at least two traveller encampments within a five mile radius of my home. They have been there for decades but hardly anyone knows about them. Both are very much out of sight on land that (AFAICT) the travellers either own or use with the landowners permission (albeit in contravention of the dreaded 1960 planning act). AIUI, both camps are wary of visitors, which is understandable given the prejudice often expressed. However, they keep themselves to themselves and disrupt nobody even though one camp is only 50 yards from a housing estate on the other side of a small woods.
 
The argument against this law around not all travellers are the same is null and void.

If they turn up, pay parking, don't cause mess/fuss then the new law has no power to evict them.
 
GeoffL said:
The point that @Fisherman makes is very true. You can know nothing of travellers who behave themselves to the extent that they are invisible to all intents and purposes.

FWIW, there are at least two traveller encampments within a five mile radius of my home. They have been there for decades but hardly anyone knows about them. Both are very much out of sight on land that (AFAICT) the travellers either own or use with the landowners permission (albeit in contravention of the dreaded 1960 planning act). AIUI, both camps are wary of visitors, which is understandable given the prejudice often expressed. However, they keep themselves to themselves and disrupt nobody even though one camp is only 50 yards from a housing estate on the other side of a small woods.
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There are plenty on the Isle of Arran who collect shellfish of varying types.
They have been on the island for years, and as far as I am aware they don’t bother with anyone, and the locals have had no problems with them. On the north Sannox poi they have been there for years. When we stay there the generator is turned on from 6 at around 10 it’s turned off, but to be honest we hardly hear it, as they position as far away as possible from were we and others park.
 
I am closing this thread as it seems to be more about peoples opinions on the travelling community rather than how this bill could possibly be used to prevent wild camping.

BTW.

If the police come and ask you to move on, then move as you are not welcome, if you do move no other action will be taken.
 
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