Educate not legislate

Sheila jolly

Guest
Here in France, the unwritten etiquette rule is that wherever you stop, in a public space, you do not "set up camp". That means no outdoor cooking, no tables and chairs, no hanging out the washing, no awnings etc. If you are discreet and quiet, you do not upset the locals. It is probably one of the reason why freedom camping is still tolerated in a lot of places. Unfortunately though, the number of vans is rocketing, and these courtesy rules are being ignored more and more Another bad mannered practice is emptying the grey water tank whilst parked up. As a result, more and more towns are now banning freedom camping. The amount of 2 meter high barriers at parking areas is also on the increase. As these only allow smaller vans in (many of which do not have onboard toilets), £$%^ and paper in the bushes is a nasty problem getting worse. Whilst freedom camping in Finistère, we picked up a leaflet in the tourist office, listing places for camper vans to stopover. The leaflet included a reminder of the etiquette rules; do not take over the space around your vehicle, no tables and chairs, BBQs etc., avoid parking where it will block the view or access for local inhabitants, and other visitors, do not stopover more than 24 hours, leave no litter or waste. etc. etc. If we want to continue enjoying freedom camping, we must educate everyone to respect the locals and their "space". Educate not legislate.......
 
I totally agree educating the uneducated is they key. Most places we get banned is because motorhomes take over a car park.
 
I keep saying this but it just has to be said.
Plenty of no overnight parking signs and barriers have been erected in the UK with no justification whatsoever. Because a few idiots don’t behave properly is no reason to ban completely everyone else. Doing this simply reduces the amount of spaces available and leads to possible over use of those carparks that are left.
why is it that some on here wish to justify such unfair indiscriminate action.
Why is it that we alone are dealt with, could you imagine the outcry if dogs were banned, or god forbid cars due the the vandalism misuse, and litter they create. Does anyone think that a dog walkers forum somewhere would be full of posts supporting such a ban, I very much doubt it. They would be complaining that due to a few selfish dog walkers they have all been banned.

Banning Motorhomes because some put out tables and chairs is an over reaction for something I have on more than one occasion witnesed car drivers doing. As for barriers, well as the post highlighted camper vans with no toilets can still park up, I will leave you to determine the consequences of that.

Ultimately what’s going on right now in the uk simply is not practical, justifiable or sustainable. If we continue to keep losing spaces at this rate combined with a year on year increase in vans then things will only get a lot worse.

Yes education is important for Motorhome users, but it’s also required for those who take decisions based on ignorance by those in authority. To many times even up here I have seen barriers and signs erected on a whim, with no thought whatsoever of the consequences for the vast majority of decent Motorhome owners who have done nothing wrong. Whilst the perpetrators of vandalism, breech of the peace, and inconsiderate selfish behaviour are still free to return.

We have to stop beating ourselves up about our supposed lack of support for local communities, that is not our concern. Many on here bend over backwards to try to support local communities, I know we do. But that is my and our choice. It’s not a condition of ownership. And if you decide not to, you are no more a freeloader than the many car owners who overfill our scenic spots each and every summer.

I am not in favour of this fight for aires. All I want is to be treated the same as car drivers, cyclists, dog walkers, and everyone else who use carparks. None of them have barriers erected or signs saying your not wanted here.

Educate not legislate, I could not agree more.
 
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I agree with the education ambition, if only motorhome and campervan users would use sites if they wish to congregate, spread out or light fires or run generators there would not be many of the difficulties faced by those just using their vehicles to park and rest overnight.
A system like that in New Zealand with vehicles being certified as self sufficient would help too.
 
2cv said:
I agree with the education ambition, if only motorhome and campervan users would use sites if they wish to spread out or light fires or run generators there would not be many of the difficulties faced by those just using their vehicles to park and rest overnight.
A system like that in New Zealand with vehicles being certified as self sufficient would help too.
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Yes Bill I am all for this.
For no matter how hard we try there will always be idiots needing too be sorted out.
And they alone should be sorted out not you and I, and every other decent person on here and out-with this forum.
 
Fisherman said:
I keep saying this but it just has to be said.
Plenty of no overnight parking signs and barriers have been erected in the UK with no justification whatsoever. Because a few idiots don’t behave properly is no reason to ban completely everyone else. Doing this simply reduces the amount of spaces available and leads to possible over use of those carparks that are left.
why is it that some on here wish to justify such unfair indiscriminate action.
Why is it that we alone are dealt with, could you imagine the outcry if dogs were banned, or god forbid cars due the the vandalism misuse, and litter they create. Does anyone think that a dog walkers forum somewhere would be full of posts supporting such a ban, I very much doubt it. They would be complaining that due to a few selfish dog walkers they have all been banned.

Banning Motorhomes because some put out tables and chairs is an over reaction for something I have on more than one occasion witnesed car drivers doing. As for barriers, well as the post highlighted camper vans with no toilets can still park up, I will leave you to determine the consequences of that.

Ultimately what’s going on right now in the uk simply is not practical, justifiable or sustainable. If we continue to keep losing spaces at this rate combined with a year on year increase in vans then things will only get a lot worse.

Yes education is important for Motorhome users, but it’s also required for those who take decisions based on ignorance by those in authority. To many times even up here I have seen barriers and signs erected on a whim, with no thought whatsoever of the consequences for the vast majority of decent Motorhome owners who have done nothing wrong. Whilst the perpetrators of vandalism, breech of the peace, and inconsiderate selfish behaviour are still free to return.

We have to stop beating ourselves up about our supposed lack of support for local communities, that is not our concern. Many on here bend over backwards to try to support local communities, I know we do. But that is my and our choice. It’s not a condition of ownership. And if you decide not to, you are no more a freeloader than the many car owners who overfill our scenic spots each and every summer.

I am not in favour of this fight for aires. All I want is to be treated the same as car drivers, cyclists, dog walkers, and everyone else who use carparks. None of them have barriers erected or signs saying your not wanted here.

Educate not legislate, I could not agree more.
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Exactly Fisherman and straight to the point.
 
Maybe the only way forward is some sort of 'licence' scheme...

Requiring some sort of test of competence before obtaining a displayable licence number to show you've passed a test of not being a bell end.

Registration number should be enough to trace folks seen to be acting in a poor manner.

Membership and competence test would allow you access to stop over in designated in areas like national parks etc.
 
mistericeman said:
Maybe the only way forward is some sort of 'licence' scheme...

Requiring some sort of test of competence before obtaining a displayable licence number to show you've passed a test of not being a bell end.

Registration number should be enough to trace folks seen to be acting in a poor manner.

Membership and competence test would allow you access to stop over in designated in areas like national parks etc.
Click to expand...

spot on
 
Sheila jolly said:
Here in France, the unwritten etiquette rule is that wherever you stop, in a public space, you do not "set up camp". That means no outdoor cooking, no tables and chairs, no hanging out the washing, no awnings etc. If you are discreet and quiet, you do not upset the locals. It is probably one of the reason why freedom camping is still tolerated in a lot of places. Unfortunately though, the number of vans is rocketing, and these courtesy rules are being ignored more and more Another bad mannered practice is emptying the grey water tank whilst parked up. As a result, more and more towns are now banning freedom camping. The amount of 2 meter high barriers at parking areas is also on the increase. As these only allow smaller vans in (many of which do not have onboard toilets), £$%^ and paper in the bushes is a nasty problem getting worse. Whilst freedom camping in Finistère, we picked up a leaflet in the tourist office, listing places for camper vans to stopover. The leaflet included a reminder of the etiquette rules; do not take over the space around your vehicle, no tables and chairs, BBQs etc., avoid parking where it will block the view or access for local inhabitants, and other visitors, do not stopover more than 24 hours, leave no litter or waste. etc. etc. If we want to continue enjoying freedom camping, we must educate everyone to respect the locals and their "space". Educate not legislate.......
Click to expand...
like the words phrase...........freedom camping..........
 
mistericeman said:
Maybe the only way forward is some sort of 'licence' scheme...
Click to expand...

What ever is done You'll never stop it happening some people just can't be educated and any form of licence scheme will only lead to cost which will affect the least able to pay most and their not always the one's responsible.
 
If the doe made it manditory for a loo in a motorcaravan to get the cert things may change,or two bands as A for day van no loo and B for motorcaravan with a loo plated on the van then parking zones could have a notice as say B vans only,this may or may stop the sh-ting in hedges.
To me the silly things like rails and two windows on one side is daft to get a cert for camper,the above would be better.
 
And it will be getting worse ...... talking to my friendly MH dealer today, they sold 70 vans in a 5 week period ...... against a normal good year selling a total of 250/300 vans 🤔😱
 
Lucky sods,many dealers have the same vans on sale for years here,folk hold here to they are desperate and drop the price way down. :)
 
trustmetours said:
You could introduce any form of competency testing, licensing, vehicle categorisation etc etc and it will still not deter those motorhome owners who believe it is their god given right to do what they want, where they want, when they want.
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Then when they lose their motorhome license/ certificate they won’t be allowed anywhere. If they do use the van with none of the above it would be treated the same as driving a vehicle without a licence, or under a driving ban. This is what is required, I am sick to the back teeth of watching good people being treated badly, due to these idiots.
 
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