Battery supply..... Leisure + Vehicle Battery

zen navigator

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I have a Benimar Europe 6000 ST. My previous MH was a 1990 Autoquest van.



The Autoquest had a switch to select Leisure or Vehicle, nice and simple.



My Benimar does not seem to have any such switch. But a panel where it displays the separate Leisure and Vehicle voltage / charge reading(as %). Thats straightforward enough.



When I am on battery only the current seems to come from both batteries. Virtually both batteries discharge equally. Which is great, as I get twice the AHC.



But last month, I ran the batteries a wee bit too low and had to get a jump from a fellow MH'er. A part of me was testing to see how much usage I would get from the batteries. Clearly I pushed it too far



The question is and it might be a Benimar specifc or not. How do I limit the use on the vehicle battery. Yes I could disconnect it. But clearly I want to maximise my useage without totally draining the vehicle battery.



I thought I could have the Vehicle battery voltage constantly displayed and at certain voltage I go for a drive or down the current hungry things in the MH. Yes I have a solar panel wich gives me 3 - 3.5 amps on a nice sunny spring day with the sun over head. So I assume the panel is 60w - 80w type. Might give more in Summer.



Is there some button, switch which I havent yet found on the MH(only had 2 months) that will resolve this matter. Is there some device I can buy which will do the job?



One finally thing, how low should I let my Vehicle battery go before I have to bump. Clearly the open cct voltage and the voltage on the display are going to be different to I will have reconcile the two voltages.



But have worked out a 50% reading(12v) which is display voltage is ok as it turns over the 2.8 JTD engine.



Dave
 
Do a weblookup on duel battery charging, plenty of schematics and advice.

Cheapest option is to have a 75Amp solenoid fitted between your vehicle battery and the leisure battery - when the engine is turned off the solenoid opens (no power) so that the vehicle battery cannot be used by the equipment in the van.
 
The Benimar should be fitted with an automatic split charging system that links the engine and leisure batteries when the engine is running and separates them when its not.

Sounds like there is a fault with this system or someone has fiddled with the wiring to bypass it.

You could look up wiring diagrams for split charge systems and try to trace the Benimar wiring, but it's possible that it may not be a simple relay-type system. Some motorhomes have a more sophisticated controller that allows a certain amount of power to be taken from the engine battery and then separates it when its voltage has fallen to a pre-set value.

If you can get hold of the wiring diagram for your motorhome it will help greatly with diagnosis. Otherwise you could spend a lot of time trying to work out what's going on!

AndyC
 
Thanks for the reply.

At this juncture, I cant work out if this is a fault or someone has modified the wiring \ bypassed \ removed the battery change over?

For me its not a major issue. The upside is I have in essence two batteries for use, but clearly it is a bit risky to use the vehicle battery for the aforementioned reasons.

Dave




Roger said:
Do a weblookup on duel battery charging, plenty of schematics and advice.

Cheapest option is to have a 75Amp solenoid fitted between your vehicle battery and the leisure battery - when the engine is turned off the solenoid opens (no power) so that the vehicle battery cannot be used by the equipment in the van.
Click to expand...
 
Hi Andy,

Your post has kinda took me on the path that I was thinking.

Firstly the Benimar user manual which is not exactly detailed. Makes no mention of a change over for the batts be it manual or automatic. The absence of a physical switch, leads me to the conclusion it is automatic.

The van is 9 years old and had previous owners. The benimar panel has had work on it be it repaired or breakers replaced as they didnt replace the panel exactly it is no flush on the housing. Minor details but got me thinking there has been some work on it. But you might expect that on a MH of this age. Maybe servicing\repair?

I have not totally accept there is a major problem or its an issue. As you say there should be some kind of limiter on the use of the vehicle. Maybe as you say some over rode it to maximise the DC useage.

Essentially its kinda of cheat of getting dual leisure?

Dave

AndyC said:
The Benimar should be fitted with an automatic split charging system that links the engine and leisure batteries when the engine is running and separates them when its not.

Sounds like there is a fault with this system or someone has fiddled with the wiring to bypass it.

You could look up wiring diagrams for split charge systems and try to trace the Benimar wiring, but it's possible that it may not be a simple relay-type system. Some motorhomes have a more sophisticated controller that allows a certain amount of power to be taken from the engine battery and then separates it when its voltage has fallen to a pre-set value.

If you can get hold of the wiring diagram for your motorhome it will help greatly with diagnosis. Otherwise you could spend a lot of time trying to work out what's going on!

AndyC
Click to expand...
 
zen navigator said:
Hi Andy,

Your post has kinda took me on the path that I was thinking.

Firstly the Benimar user manual which is not exactly detailed. Makes no mention of a change over for the batts be it manual or automatic. The absence of a physical switch, leads me to the conclusion it is automatic.

The van is 9 years old and had previous owners. The benimar panel has had work on it be it repaired or breakers replaced as they didnt replace the panel exactly it is no flush on the housing. Minor details but got me thinking there has been some work on it. But you might expect that on a MH of this age. Maybe servicing\repair?

I have not totally accept there is a major problem or its an issue. As you say there should be some kind of limiter on the use of the vehicle. Maybe as you say some over rode it to maximise the DC useage.

Essentially its kinda of cheat of getting dual leisure?

Dave
Click to expand...

Hi Dave
Trust these good folk Dave, Your vehicle will not have been designed to use both batteries at the same time, the vehicle battery or 'cranking' battery should never be used when parked. If you have a manual switch over to vehicle battery as I did in my Kontki its for emergencies only.

1 exception to this might be your fridge, the 12v element in the fridge might be wired to the vehicle battery as you should only run the fridge on 12v when you are driving. If you are leaving the fridge on 12v when you are parked it might be draining your battery.
 
The last 2 vans I've had don't have the option of using the engine battery for the habitation area. Theres no switch & it doesn't take any power from the engine battery but it is wired up to charge both batteries from the engine or hook up. I also wired mine up so I could top up the engine battery from the solar panel as well if needed.

I would have thought that it shouldn't take any power from the engine battery unless there is a switch to allow you to do this as said for emergencies only. The batteries should be different & a proper leisure battery is more capable of being discharged lower than an engine battery, also the engine battery is more able to take a heavy load under starting than the leisure battery.

I would be concerned with what you said as it could be that the batteries are somehow connected directly, this would mean power could flow from the leisure battery to the engine battery. When starting the engine the current
drawn down any wiring connecting the batteries would be enough to melt the wiring. You could easily check by disconnection the terminals to the engine battery & see if there is any power in the cables & do the same on the leisure battery to check if the power is coming from the engine battery.
 
Hi Guys,

Thanks for all the advice.

I accept that it is not standard or acceptable to use the Vehicle battery for habitation...although I can see the perk :rolleyes:

re the comment the batteries are connected? I have had a noisy around the wiring on both batteries and theres no smoldering wiring or melted cable. So all I can assume that it is a fault relay or diode or controller in the charging system.

I going take it in to a MH automotive electrician and he can investigate and advise.

Thanks

Dave
 
TO Zen Navigator,

Dave, Hi

I have a Benimar Perseo 710 CCX, 2005 with the same problems!
I would be very interested to hear if you solved your problems ref charging.

Regards Jeremy
 
No automatic set up should ever use the vehicle battery as part of the power when parked up.

This is very risky vis a vis starting because van diesel engines are big with very high compression and it needs a good charge to crank them. Even a partial discharge may be enough to disable cranking.

There are some zig panels made with a manual selector switch, so you can use the vehicle battery at your own risk, if you guess the voltage is high enough, but any automatic system is inviting accidents.
 
Hi to Benimar owners! Used to sell Benimar some time ago and they do indeed have "Voltage Sense" Split charge relays. Now the Down Side!! Their location is normally underneath the vehicle, screwed to the floor in front of the diesel tank, meaning it's a crawling affair if you have no access to a pit or ramps. It sounds as it has indeed failed, meaning that you need to find a local auto electrician to replace it, or have a go yourself if you are confident enough in tackling it.
My advice is to source another voltage sensing relay, or you will have to find the trigger wire from the alternator if you plan to use a regular split Charge relay.
Voltage sensing relays can be found at that well known internet auction site!
Rgs
Nick
 
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