The news, or lack of it

yorkslass

Full Member
Posts
11,052
Likes
9,482
I'm still not sure about this thing about over 70's being in mortal danger. Are the statistics being warped by the unnatural number of deaths in care homes? If care home deaths were taken out of the formula would over 70's deaths be substantially different from that of others, taking normal percentage deaths of the elderly?
I read Matthew Parris this weekend spouting that the old should give up their triple lock because the country locked down to save them. Not that the extreme number of deaths was caused by over enthusiastic removals of patients to the care homes.
I was Listening to Dr Sarah Jarvis,and she explained about T cells.......they fight infections. Apparently as you age, the number and quality of t-cells declines.....leaving you more vulnerable to any infections. The older you are the more likely you are to catch anything that's around....I guess that's why they are keen for oldies and those at risk to have a flu jab.

Regarding getting back to normal, i think we are all going to have to decide how at risk we are and adjust our behaviour. I think some will have to stay isolated for a long time unless a vaccine becomes available. This infection isn't going to disappear and we can't expect those who have little risk of being really ill putting their lives on hold any longer.
 

Fazerloz

Full Member
Posts
5,084
Likes
7,477
Looking at statistics makes me wonder if the destruction of the economy and disruption to everyone is actually in proportion to the threat posed.

View attachment 83655
This figure is only because most of the world responded to it quite rapidly and harshly, Imagine if it had just been left to run its course, and this figure is highly unlikely to be anywhere near the true figure for Cor related deaths, nor is it anywhere near done with yet.
Source: Office for National Statistics – Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales
From the 27 March - 5 June there has been more than 60,000 deaths above the last 5 year average for the same period. Whilst not all died of Cov the chances are if Cov had never arrived these people would more than likely still be alive. Global numbers may well never be known .
How many Govs are actually telling the truth at this time.
 

2cv

Full Member
Posts
4,679
Likes
7,458
This figure is only because most of the world responded to it quite rapidly and harshly, Imagine if it had just been left to run its course, and this figure is highly unlikely to be anywhere near the true figure for Cor related deaths, nor is it anywhere near done with yet.
Source: Office for National Statistics – Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales
From the 27 March - 5 June there has been more than 60,000 deaths above the last 5 year average for the same period. Whilst not all died of Cov the chances are if Cov had never arrived these people would more than likely still be alive. Global numbers may well never be known .
How many Govs are actually telling the truth at this time.
I’m not saying that government actions are necessarily wrong, merely pointing out how a relatively small number of deaths have changed everything for everyone.
 

Fazerloz

Full Member
Posts
5,084
Likes
7,477
I’m not saying that government actions are necessarily wrong, merely pointing out how a relatively small number of deaths have changed everything for everyone.
But it's because everything has changed that the number is small. Cause and effect. ;)
 

2cv

Full Member
Posts
4,679
Likes
7,458
But it's because everything has changed that the number is small. Cause and effect. ;)
The chart merely shows that covid as is is a relatively small cause of death. I think it is unlikely that left alone it would have got anywhere near the levels of the major contributors, but who knows?
 

wildebus

Full Member
Posts
3,268
Likes
3,559
The chart merely shows that covid as is is a relatively small cause of death. I think it is unlikely that left alone it would have got anywhere near the levels of the major contributors, but who knows?
As I posted, the Spanish Flu could be used as a good corollary to the Coronavirus and that was left pretty much unchecked - and what did that do?

"The Spanish flu, also known as the 1918 flu pandemic, was an unusually deadly influenza pandemic caused by the H1N1 influenza A virus. Lasting about 15 months from spring 1918 (northern hemisphere) to early summer 1919, it infected 500 million people – about a third of the world's population at the time. The death toll may have been anything from 17 million to 50 million, and possibly as high as 100 million, making it one of the deadliest pandemics in human history."
 

jagmanx

Full Member
Posts
4,159
Likes
3,751
Not a huge fan of medical "facts on facebook" but one reports traces 3 infection mini-explosions
1 in an office block where the workers were simply too close for too long and too many shared items
Also the aircon recirculated "bad air"
2 IN a restaurant with tables resonably spaced..Two tables close to the aircon unit resulted in many infections
Other nearby tables not as bad
3 on a coach recyclng the air and 1 infected person (unknowingly) travelling

In all 3 studies lack of fresh air was a common factor

NOT rocket science but confirms what I am sure many of us think already 1
1 Very helpful for individuals aiming to avoid the virus
2 Should be used to assist with safer "Unlocking" in public spaces.

So it seems outdoor spaces such as parks, beaches and the like should be reasonably safe
For me the golden rule is to stay away from crowds....But most us plan that anyway with our liking for isolated camping spots
The latest daily figure from here
is 15 deaths on Monday as I have posted before single day figures are no real guide.
We just have to hope everyone keeps sensible so this figure can be repeated...and bettered !
 
Last edited:

jagmanx

Full Member
Posts
4,159
Likes
3,751
Yes
Be careful when SORNING.
You cannot sorn indefinitely
Worth getting a months road tax maybe once a year.
Eg if your vehicle was sorned over the winter and remains sorned...Even if you plan NOT to use it this summer/autumn check and maybe get 1 months road tax
In these circumstances DD may work well ?
 

Nabsim

Full Member
Posts
2,934
Likes
2,530
I think the initial steps taken by the government were very good, the lockdown was exactly what was needed. There should be laws for locking up the media if we get this again though as they caused more problems rather than supplying facts and useful info.
I think we started going wrong when they closed the first nightingale hospital. They should have been used for all real and suspected Covid cases and all hospitals and the bulk of the NHS allowed to get back to near normal.
Police chiefs and councils should also be subjected to a judicial review as many were giving different advice and interpretation of rules and guidance. Even now it seems police May fine you if you stop out overnight in the wrong spot but get a couple hundred of your mates together and you can do whatever you like up to the point one of you gets killed. Makes you glad you aren’t really 21 again huh 😂😂😂
 

2cv

Full Member
Posts
4,679
Likes
7,458
As I posted, the Spanish Flu could be used as a good corollary to the Coronavirus and that was left pretty much unchecked - and what did that do?

"The Spanish flu, also known as the 1918 flu pandemic, was an unusually deadly influenza pandemic caused by the H1N1 influenza A virus. Lasting about 15 months from spring 1918 (northern hemisphere) to early summer 1919, it infected 500 million people – about a third of the world's population at the time. The death toll may have been anything from 17 million to 50 million, and possibly as high as 100 million, making it one of the deadliest pandemics in human history."Here.
Spanish Flu is regularly used as a comparison when discussing Covid 19, but it was different in several ways as discussed Here. It is very unlikely that the current pandemic will follow a similar path, firstly because the virus itself is different in many ways but secondly because the environment in which it is operating is so different.
Let‘S hope the differences prevent it following such a path, or we’re only at the very beginning with far more deadly outcomes ahead.
 

Debroos

Full Member
Posts
595
Likes
672
Spanish Flu is regularly used as a comparison when discussing Covid 19, but it was different in several ways as discussed Here. It is very unlikely that the current pandemic will follow a similar path, firstly because the virus itself is different in many ways but secondly because the environment in which it is operating is so different.
Let‘S hope the differences prevent it following such a path, or we’re only at the very beginning with far more deadly outcomes ahead.
I would have thought that with a higher global population we travel more, mix in large crowds more and go to indoor places with air con etc etc.
 

mark61

Full Member
Posts
4,280
Likes
3,978
Also many inner city areas were much more densely populated.

My local borough's population currently is approx 240000, and has the highest density in Wales and England.

In 1921 there were over 400000 in the borough.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2cv

colinmd

Full Member
Posts
2,267
Likes
1,837
Yes
Be careful when SORNING.
You cannot sorn indefinitely
Worth getting a months road tax maybe once a year.
Eg if your vehicle was sorned over the winter and remains sorned...Even if you plan NOT to use it this summer/autumn check and maybe get 1 months road tax
In these circumstances DD may work well ?
I'm puzzled, first why this post is on this thread, but more so, why do you think SORN cannot be continuous?
 

mariesnowgoose

Full Member
Posts
14,359
Likes
16,488
I think the initial steps taken by the government were very good, the lockdown was exactly what was needed. There should be laws for locking up the media if we get this again though as they caused more problems rather than supplying facts and useful info.
I think we started going wrong when they closed the first nightingale hospital. They should have been used for all real and suspected Covid cases and all hospitals and the bulk of the NHS allowed to get back to near normal.
Police chiefs and councils should also be subjected to a judicial review as many were giving different advice and interpretation of rules and guidance. Even now it seems police May fine you if you stop out overnight in the wrong spot but get a couple hundred of your mates together and you can do whatever you like up to the point one of you gets killed. Makes you glad you aren’t really 21 again huh 😂😂😂
I think it might have been a logistics thing? As far as possible medical staff were drafted in from other departments within their own hospital to work on Covid patients. I suggest it was maybe easier for everyone to deal with the Covid cases in the existing hospitals in the first instance - familiarity of the workplace for existing staff etc. etc. The Nightingales (and don't forget all the extra private hospital beds that were commissioned) were only ever intended to be used if the regular hospitals started to be overwhelmed with C-19 cases.

Whichever way you look at it we didn't have enough nursing staff to deal with a pandemic in the first place. More importantly, we don't have enough medical staff to deal with so-called 'normal' times, let alone C-19 arriving on top!

We were 40k nurses short before this pandemic hit. Any medical volunteers called up from the retired groups etc can't be expected to carry on working when the threat of being overwhelmed has receded, so where do you find all the extra staff needed to man all these Nightingale hospitals? They simply don't exist! You can't magic them up overnight.

Interestingly, one of the nurses at the hospital I attend tells me that during the lockdown a whole new tranch of 'middle managers' have suddenly been employed, no one knows from where or why. At the same time there has been no increase in the numbers of nursing staff at the sharp end. I would argue that's the most important bit. Paper shufflers are 10 a penny, skilled medical staff more like gold dust.

Forget C-19, the unnecessary deaths going forward as a result of lockdown will potentially be much bigger than all the C-19 deaths so far. And the strain on the NHS dealing with the backlog of other health issues is going to be enormous.

Time will tell the bigger story down the road...
 

jagmanx

Full Member
Posts
4,159
Likes
3,751
I'm puzzled, first why this post is on this thread, but more so, why do you think SORN cannot be continuous?
Hi Colin on this thread as the virus is causing many to SORN their motorhomes

I (wrongly) remembered that there was a time limit but NO !
Copied from RAC
Do I need to renew my SORN?
A SORN declaration does not need to be renewed. It remains in place indefinitely or until the vehicle is sold, scrapped or permanently exported outside the UK.
 

wildebus

Full Member
Posts
3,268
Likes
3,559
Spanish Flu is regularly used as a comparison when discussing Covid 19, but it was different in several ways as discussed Here. It is very unlikely that the current pandemic will follow a similar path, firstly because the virus itself is different in many ways but secondly because the environment in which it is operating is so different.
Let‘S hope the differences prevent it following such a path, or we’re only at the very beginning with far more deadly outcomes ahead.
we will never need to compare the outcome of the two if they were allowed to follow the same path - as they were not, thankfully.
 

Users who viewed this discussion (Total:153)

Top