Chinese night heaters.

[1 Cup]

So been down to blue ankor for a night away to see if vans ok. After the house move, so all back together = bed and water tank and electric stuff.
Got chilly put heater on, fired up, all good. Displayed had the pump pulse displayed = 1.6 . Not room temperature, it never turned off like my old propex did. ! Evan when van temp got to 25degrees pump just kept pumping.
Is this right ??

I have a old propex room stat and if necessary can fit but how?
Tia.

 

[wildebus]

So been down to blue ankor for a night away to see if vans ok. After the house move, so all back together = bed and water tank and electric stuff.
Got chilly put heater on, fired up, all good. Displayed had the pump pulse displayed = 1.6 . Not room temperature, it never turned off like my old propex did. ! Evan when van temp got to 25degrees pump just kept pumping.
Is this right ??

I have a old propex room stat and if necessary can fit but how?
Tia.

The Chinese Heaters have no temperature control. People think they do as you can set a temperature with a lot of the controllers, but that doesn't actually set a temp at all, it just changes the frequency of the fuel pump pulses (but shows the changes as a nominal temp instead).

How to fix?
couple of possibilities ...
1) if you have a basic rotary control for the heater, it can be possible to add an external power control to send a start and stop command to the heater - and if you have that external control driven by a temperature sensor ... voilá, temp controlled heater (I did make change on a friends Chinese Heater I fitted for him and his heater will come on and off on his set temps - and he can also text the heater to come on and off as well ).
This is only possible with the most basic controller though. the ones with the LED or LCD displays (which you will have I think) cannot be controlled externally.

2) there is an aftermarker replacement controller called an "afterburner" which replaces the original controller and gives a LOT more option. see this site for more info - http://www.mrjones.id.au/afterburner/
Very important note ... this is only compatible with certain heaters and it will not be obvious is yours is or not I would think. There is info on the website I linked to to help you work out if it is compatible.

If 1 is not suitable and your heater is wrong for 2, then you have to manage the heater on & off manually. It is not recommended to interrupt power to the heater externally (some people try that with a temp controller) to add extra control as it stops the proper shutdown of the heater and will at the very least damage it.

FWIW, if I were getting a Chinese Heater, I would very seriously consider the Afterburner kit as it gives some very neat extra features

 

[FULL TIMER]

I don't think that afterburner kit is available in the UK anymore was mention of it over on the chinese diesel heater forum, pretty sure mine has temperature control, well it has a sensor in the controller, you get the choice to run in hertz or by degrees, but the heaters only slow down and speed up etc they do not turn off and on which is why it helps to get the right size heater for the vehicle

 

[wildebus]

I don't think that afterburner kit is available in the UK anymore was mention of it over on the chinese diesel heater forum, pretty sure mine has temperature control, well it has a sensor in the controller, you get the choice to run in hertz or by degrees, but the heaters only slow down and speed up etc they do not turn off and on which is why it helps to get the right size heater for the vehicle

you can select between temp and hertz in the display but they have the same identical function and do exactly the same thing. If you change the display, make a change and then change the display again you see the identical result as if you kept it on the same display all the time. The sensor in the heater has a seperate purpose.

Afterburner is available directly from the guy in Australia (I've had conversations about it with him).

 

[BigAldo]

Chinese diesel heaters with the coloured LCD control panel can be programmed. They have a very crude high and low setting, each of which can be programmed independently. When you set your preferred temperature and the van temperature is lower, then the controller sends a signal to the heater to use the high setting (Fast fan speed and higher frequency fuel pump pulses). So lots of hot air!
Once your preferred temperature is reached the controller switches the heater to the low setting (slower fan speed and lower frequency fuel pump speed).
On both high and low settings, you can progarm the fan speed and the fuel pump frequency to control the volume and temperature of the air.
The idea is that when the van is cold, the high speed setting brings the van up to temperature as quickly as possible. The heater then falls back to the low setting to maintain the temperature, and since the fan speed is reduced, its quieter inside.
All very well in theory but there are a few VERY important caveats.
If you get the fuelling (pump frequency) wrong, you can damage the heater either by it sooting up (too much fuel) or allowing it to run lean (too little fuel) which can cause overheating and the production of carbon monoxide.
Even if you get the air/fuel mix correct on the low speed, the heater's ability to maintain an even temperature will depend a lot on how quickly the van loses heat, so is heavily influenced by the outside weather. Its not one size fits all.
It is not good for the heater to be switched on and off frequently, forcing it to go through the startup and cool down cycles, both of which draw around 8-10 amps.
Hope this helps.

 

[1 Cup]

Room themostate
Could I wire it to the fule pump befor it go's out of van= but that would report a error. =no fule So no. Or would it restart???

On or off is not a constant temperature just hot ir cold . Wheres goldie locks.
Whats propexs solution.

 

[1 Cup]

The Chinese Heaters have no temperature control. People think they do as you can set a temperature with a lot of the controllers, but that doesn't actually set a temp at all, it just changes the frequency of the fuel pump pulses (but shows the changes as a nominal temp instead).

How to fix?
couple of possibilities ...
1) if you have a basic rotary control for the heater, it can be possible to add an external power control to send a start and stop command to the heater - and if you have that external control driven by a temperature sensor ... voilá, temp controlled heater (I did make change on a friends Chinese Heater I fitted for him and his heater will come on and off on his set temps - and he can also text the heater to come on and off as well ).
This is only possible with the most basic controller though. the ones with the LED or LCD displays (which you will have I think) cannot be controlled externally.

2) there is an aftermarker replacement controller called an "afterburner" which replaces the original controller and gives a LOT more option. see this site for more info - http://www.mrjones.id.au/afterburner/
Very important note ... this is only compatible with certain heaters and it will not be obvious is yours is or not I would think. There is info on the website I linked to to help you work out if it is compatible.

If 1 is not suitable and your heater is wrong for 2, then you have to manage the heater on & off manually. It is not recommended to interrupt power to the heater externally (some people try that with a temp controller) to add extra control as it stops the proper shutdown of the heater and will at the very least damage it.

FWIW, if I were getting a Chinese Heater, I would very seriously consider the Afterburner kit as it gives some very neat extra features

Thats complicated that one is the room stat.
I have the 5k one with the triangle plug and 3x2 display screen. 2buttons left side 3 button rightside

 

[BigAldo]

I have the 5k one with the triangle plug and 3x2 display screen. 2buttons left side 3 button rightside

That's the one I described above. High an low settings, but no goldielocks setting. it's a limitation of the design.

The afterburner controller is effectively a computer which controls the main heater.
Its much more sophisticated and programmable (it can work out fan speed and fuel pump frequency on the fly) to maintain room temperature, but also costs more than the cost of the original heater.

 

[wildebus]

Room themostate
Could I wire it to the fule pump befor it go's out of van= but that would report a error. =no fule So no. Or would it restart???

On or off is not a constant temperature just hot ir cold . Wheres goldie locks.
Whats propexs solution.

Propex probably send an "off" signal when the temp hits the selected value.
The Eberspacher does the same with either the external optional temp sensor or the one built into some of their controllers, such as a 801.
The Chinese Heaters do the basics ok, and their controller looks nice and the animation is very pretty, but they have forgotten about what is really a pretty basic function.
I never missed it that much TBH as I like it nice and warm in the van so would often leave the heater on but lower until I got into bed (at which time I had the electric blanket on all night ) and then use the remote to start the heater in the morning without having to vacate the nice warm bed

 

[1 Cup]

The remote was a good idea as it will come into its own in the colder months ahead but now can't stay at the bed head as intended. By the night light switch. This is a pain and I think it will now get, lost so will buy a scond one for the front of van, mite open it up to add temp to that. ?..

What a pain defently a negative no room stat.

 

[linkshouse]

Hmm! First, let me say I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the technical discussions above but...

The heater we have (Chinese from eBay) has a rotary control and whilst I'm not saying it is definitely temperature controlled it sure seems that way. That is, when we turn it on it goes through its start-up procedure then runs on high for a while until it gets warm (I'm avoiding saying that is a specific temperature) and then gradually starts to slow down (and this is over several minutes) until it is just a fairly slow fan and slow tick from the pump.

And again, whilst maybe not be precisely temp controlled we do seem to be able to set the temperature of the van with the rotary controller, as we have in the past turned it up or down a bit depending on how we feel.

That said I'm not saying that the temperature setting is a specific number of degrees. It is more akin to a volume control.

As I say, no definitive knowledge here, just my experience of using ours.

 

[mistericeman]

Hmm! First, let me say I'm not necessarily disagreeing with the technical discussions above but...

The heater we have (Chinese from eBay) has a rotary control and whilst I'm not saying it is definitely temperature controlled it sure seems that way. That is, when we turn it on it goes through its start-up procedure then runs on high for a while until it gets warm (I'm avoiding saying that is a specific temperature) and then gradually starts to slow down (and this is over several minutes) until it is just a fairly slow fan and slow tick from the pump.

And again, whilst maybe not be precisely temp controlled we do seem to be able to set the temperature of the van with the rotary controller, as we have in the past turned it up or down a bit depending on how we feel.

That said I'm not saying that the temperature setting is a specific number of degrees. It is more akin to a volume control.

As I say, no definitive knowledge here, just my experience of using ours.

It will 'seem' to alter the temp (reducing the rotary OR the up and down buttons on the lcd panel/controller reduces the pump frequency)
BUT the heater can't respond to the temperature of the space its in as it lacks a temp sensing ability (at least that's the case with any of the ones I've dealt with)

And whilst genuine eberspachers just require a 12v supply to run through start up/stop runs....
The chinglese ones operate their own protocol to initialise/shut down that's more complicated than a power on/off sadly.

 

[wildebus]

It will 'seem' to alter the temp (reducing the rotary OR the up and down buttons on the lcd panel/controller reduces the pump frequency)
BUT the heater can't respond to the temperature of the space its in as it lacks a temp sensing ability (at least that's the case with any of the ones I've dealt with)

And whilst genuine eberspachers just require a 12v supply to run through start up/stop runs....
The chinglese ones operate their own protocol to initialise/shut down that's more complicated than a power on/off sadly.

Interestingly, the units with the more basic controller have more wires from controller to heater.
The LCD/LED display controllers are 3 wire - so +12V, GND and a control wire which the controller will send 'stuff' down ( I say 'stuff' as I don't know how precisely it is used).
What I think is the more common of the rotary controllers (there are 2 or 3 different versions of those as well) has a 4 or 5 wire cable between Controller and Heater, and one of those wires is specifically a signal level that is used to tell the heater to turn on and run (if +12V present) or shut down (if open circuit). How that differs from the LCD controllers is it this dedicated wire does actually initiate a command to do an orderly shut down, it does not just cut power.

So .... it would imply there is a program within the heater electronics for this routine? And it *could* potentially be possible to have a control signal (controlled by a temp controller say ) coming in externally on that connection which is probably unused on the 3-wire controllers?
When you look at the adverts and listings for these, some have the ability for the buyer to chose the controller that comes with the heater, which also implies (to me, anyway) that the heaters are the same and it is just a loom difference, so anyone so minded could investigate futher. I've not fiddled with these for over 3 years and not got any of these heaters any more so not something that really interests me to do.
The lack of temperature control really is surprising given these have now been around for years and no one has added as a factory option (bit surprised the 'afterburner' kit has not been ripped off and incorporated into a controller option from China).

 

[linkshouse]

Okey dokey, not wishing to disagree you understand! And purely based on my own heater/controller which could be different...

I've been out to the van to do a little experiment.

It's blowing a hoolie here at the mo and the habitation temperature in the van was 11deg (rocking side to side like a good'un too!).

09:55 - I turned the heater on with the controller (simple knob type) set to around 30%, and it went through its normal start-up process then continued with the fan at high speed.

10:13 - the fan started to slow down.

10:16 - the fan is running very slow and there is hardly any air coming out of the vents. The habitation thermometer is reading 15deg.

10:17 - opened the side door and one of the windows, and turned on the MaxAir fan at 100%

Couple of things to mention here is that the thermometer is heavily damped and the heater controller is at the back of the van so it took a while for the temperature drop to show. Anyway...

10:24 - the temp on the habitation thermometer had dropped to 14deg and the heater had cranked back up to a high fan speed.

10:25 - closed the door and windows and turned off the MaxAir fan. It was at this point that I noticed the room temp display on the MaxAir remote which would have been a better temp indicator to monitor as it is situated next to the heater controller. This was indicating 17deg

10:29 - habitation thermometer indication 16deg, MaxAir remote indication 19deg and fan slowed back down to a tick over on the heater.

This tends to indicate that on my controller at least there must be some form of temperature sensing.

 

[wildebus]

well, looks like you got yourself a Chinese unicorn heater result.

 

[linkshouse]

well, looks like you got yourself a Chinese unicorn heater result.

It did originally come with an LCD controller and I set it up with that (this was when I had it in the Hymer). Over time the display went dim on the controller so I bought another controller. That went the same way which apparently is quite common, so I bought a simple twiddly knob controller and that’s been fine.

 

[Fazerloz]

Others it would seem have them.

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[linkshouse]

Others it would seem have them.

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Aah, reading that it seems as though the mode is selectable. Mine has just always been red i.e. thermostatic (according to the Facebook post).

 

[Fazerloz]

I have quite a early one and all there was at that time were rotary controllers. Mine is only red and modes can't be altered on it but that's fine for me. The date on that link is June 2018 so it would seem they have been about quite a while now.

Aah, reading that it seems as though the mode is selectable. Mine has just always been red i.e. thermostatic (according to the Facebook post).

 

[FULL TIMER]

you can select between temp and hertz in the display but they have the same identical function and do exactly the same thing. If you change the display, make a change and then change the display again you see the identical result as if you kept it on the same display all the time. The sensor in the heater has a seperate purpose.

Afterburner is available directly from the guy in Australia (I've had conversations about it with him).

Interestingly, the units with the more basic controller have more wires from controller to heater.
The LCD/LED display controllers are 3 wire - so +12V, GND and a control wire which the controller will send 'stuff' down ( I say 'stuff' as I don't know how precisely it is used).
What I think is the more common of the rotary controllers (there are 2 or 3 different versions of those as well) has a 4 or 5 wire cable between Controller and Heater, and one of those wires is specifically a signal level that is used to tell the heater to turn on and run (if +12V present) or shut down (if open circuit). How that differs from the LCD controllers is it this dedicated wire does actually initiate a command to do an orderly shut down, it does not just cut power.

So .... it would imply there is a program within the heater electronics for this routine? And it *could* potentially be possible to have a control signal (controlled by a temp controller say ) coming in externally on that connection which is probably unused on the 3-wire controllers?
When you look at the adverts and listings for these, some have the ability for the buyer to chose the controller that comes with the heater, which also implies (to me, anyway) that the heaters are the same and it is just a loom difference, so anyone so minded could investigate futher. I've not fiddled with these for over 3 years and not got any of these heaters any more so not something that really interests me to do.
The lack of temperature control really is surprising given these have now been around for years and no one has added as a factory option (bit surprised the 'afterburner' kit has not been ripped off and incorporated into a controller option from China).

there was a rip off version of the afterburner made by some one in Scotland I believe, which was something to do with the bloke in Aus stating that he would no longer export the afterburner units to the UK, I will say as regards temperature control my controller does have a temperature sensor built into it it must serve some purpose the heater certainly slows down and lowers output when the set temperature is reached and winds up again when the temperature drops back.