Air suspension.

[Fisherman]

I am looking at a van conversion that has reinforced rear suspension.
Theres an option to add fiats air suspension for £830.
I am thinking that the reinforced rear suspension would be fine.
But I have read posts on here that swear by air suspension.
The van only has a 400kg payload, so it will be running to the max.
I have never experienced air suspension.
All opinions welcome.

Thanks in advsnce,

 

[wildebus]

I am looking at a van conversion that has reinforced rear suspension.
Theres an option to add fiats air suspension for £830.
I am thinking that the reinforced rear suspension would be fine.
But I have read posts on here that swear by air suspension.
The van only has a 400kg payload, so it will be running to the max.
I have never experienced air suspension.
All opinions welcome.

Thanks in advsnce,

Have you any more info on the reinforced rear suspension?
I may have more input depending on what it is

 

[Fisherman]

Have you any more info on the reinforced rear suspension?
I may have more input depending on what it is

Sorry David they simply state reinforced rear suspension.

 

[mark61]

Doesn't give much info on Fiat Camper sites either.

https://www.fiatcamper.com/en/product/perfect-layout

https://www.fiatcamper.com/site/documents/2018/ducatocamper2018_36p_inguk.pdf

Can't be too much too it though, thicker/stiffer anti roll bar, possibly extra leaf and stiffer shocks?
All worth having I reckon, especially when you'll be close to max GVW most of the time, but then I prefer a stiffer ride.

I doubt it will match air for comfort though, but then I know nothing of Fiats air system.

 

[wildebus]

Sorry David they simply state reinforced rear suspension.

If this is the current Ducato on the normal Fiat Chassis, there is the 'standard' suspension, which is a single leaf spring and basically not up to the job, although some converters do use that,
There is also the 'Heavy Duty' chassis, which is a two leaf "HD" spring set. This is a standard spec for a lot of manufacturers, but I could imagine it being referred to as "reinforced" and promoted as a extra feature.
My understanding is the air suspension kits are generally suitable for either of those and certainly have lots of fans.

There is a "proper" reinforced suspension - a three leaf "VHD" spring set (buy I don't think Fiat themselves do that one). I have this on my Motorhome and because of how this works, I found adding Air Suspension did very little.

 

[wildebus]

Doesn't give much info on Fiat Camper sites either.

https://www.fiatcamper.com/en/product/perfect-layout

https://www.fiatcamper.com/site/documents/2018/ducatocamper2018_36p_inguk.pdf

Can't be too much too it though, thicker/stiffer anti roll bar, possibly extra leaf and stiffer shocks?
All worth having I reckon, especially when you'll be close to max GVW most of the time, but then I prefer a stiffer ride.

I doubt it will match air for comfort though, but then I know nothing of Fiats air system.

Of course, a key question is is it on the new or the old Ducato?
Old Ducato (e.g. what is likely to have been built right now) has leaf springs at rear.
New Ducato, going by links above, has coil springs at rear. The rear suspension sounds so different from current, looking at PDF, anyones experience of Air Assist on old Ductato I don't think will be that relevant?

 

[Fisherman]

If this is the current Ducato on the normal Fiat Chassis, there is the 'standard' suspension, which is a single leaf spring and basically not up to the job, although some converters do use that,
There is also the 'Heavy Duty' chassis, which is a two leaf "HD" spring set. This is a standard spec for a lot of manufacturers, but I could imagine it being referred to as "reinforced" and promoted as a extra feature.
My understanding is the air suspension kits are generally suitable for either of those and certainly have lots of fans.

There is a "proper" reinforced suspension - a three leaf "VHD" spring set (buy I don't think Fiat themselves do that one). I have this on my Motorhome and because of how this works, I found adding Air Suspension did very little.

Hi David it would be on the new series 8 ducato.
Thanks David, much appreciated.

 

[Fisherman]

Doesn't give much info on Fiat Camper sites either.

https://www.fiatcamper.com/en/product/perfect-layout

https://www.fiatcamper.com/site/documents/2018/ducatocamper2018_36p_inguk.pdf

Can't be too much too it though, thicker/stiffer anti roll bar, possibly extra leaf and stiffer shocks?
All worth having I reckon, especially when you'll be close to max GVW most of the time, but then I prefer a stiffer ride.

I doubt it will match air for comfort though, but then I know nothing of Fiats air system.

Many thanks for that Mark, much appreciated mate.

 

[wildebus]

Hi David it would be on the new series 8 ducato.

Well, as per my last post would be my thought.

Another thought I have is that £830 for a fully-fitted Air Assist system from Fiat is not a bad price

 

[Fisherman]

Well, as per my last post would be my thought.

Another thought I have is that £830 for a fully-fitted Air Assist system from Fiat is not a bad price

You just cost me £830

 

[Robmac]

Just a thought Bill (and I haven't got any idea about air suspension), but does the kit add any weight to the van thus reducing the payload.

Please excuse me if that is a dumb question!

 

[Fisherman]

Just a thought Bill (and I haven't got any idea about air suspension), but does the kit add any weight to the van thus reducing the payload.

Please excuse me if that is a dumb question!

Thanks Rob.
The kit supports the suspension system helping the springs. There are two gauges in the cab by the side of the passenger seat. I believe it will maintain the height regardless of load, but I am not 100% on that Rob. But from what I have read and comments on this site I am minded towards it. This will be my last van, and I want to make sure I don’t scrimp on anything then regret it.

 

[mark61]

Thanks Rob.
The kit supports the suspension system helping the springs. There are two gauges in the cab by the side of the passenger seat. I believe it will maintain the height regardless of load, but I am not 100% on that Rob. But from what I have read and comments on this site I am minded towards it. This will be my last van, and I want to make sure I don’t scrimp on anything then regret it.

That explains the good value. That sounds like an air assist rather than full air suspension. Very different.
Full air suspension would replace standard rear suspension.

https://airride.co.uk/air/shop/van-motorhome-pickup/fiat/ducato/x230/full-rear-air/

https://www.vbairsuspension.co.uk/en/page/downloads/fiat.html

 

[Nabsim]

I don’t have a Fiat but do have rear air bags (assist) on my sprinter and can praise them enough. When I contacted AS about correct settings a year or so back they checked their records and told me the system had been in 12 years so longevity is good if my setup is representative

 

[Val54]

Thanks Rob.
The kit supports the suspension system helping the springs. There are two gauges in the cab by the side of the passenger seat. I believe it will maintain the height regardless of load, but I am not 100% on that Rob. But from what I have read and comments on this site I am minded towards it. This will be my last van, and I want to make sure I don’t scrimp on anything then regret it.

Our AS system will lift the rear of the van by 50 - 75 mm depending on load. As stated it has two airlines so that the airbags can be adjusted independently for minor levelling or load issues. We've used it a couple of times to lift the back end so that we didn't ground on steep ferry ramps. Apart from the comfort ride factor which will vary from van to van and personal preferences, we've had it fitted to the last 3 vans and would recommend it. Not necessarily AS although they are motorhomers themselves and provide a great service.

 

[colinm]

I'm not sure on the new Ducato, but on current model the Maxi chassis is more than enough for just about any 3.5t PVC conversion. Even if we load our XLWB Maxi (x250) PVC up to 3.5t it's nowhere near limit on rear axle, even with it's single spring. If the new van has similar axle limits it should be something like the same.
p.s. just edited clarifying this is for PVC's, huge overhangs on chassis van conversions will be more of a challenge.

 

[John D]

I have a Peugeot Boxer 435 panel van that I converted and you get 2 models the 335 and 435 the 435 is still 3.5t but has uprated suspension compared to the 335 and factory-build motorhomes are normally on a 335 as it's cheaper for them to buy and I had an Elddis 175 before and I fitted air suspension to it as it takes away 90% sway when being overtaken by larger vehicles but you won't feel the comfort of air suspension in the normal day to day unless the front is also changed but just for the comfort of not having the sway when overtaking or being overtaken its worth the money, the height can only be adjusted about 40mm from normal run height as a motorhome without air suspension is already sitting lower on the rear so it will give you approx 40mm above and 40mm below normal run height.
If you fit air suspension make sure you get an independent system with 2 gauges because if there is only 1 it moves the air from 1 side to the opposite side and it can be dangerous going around bends as such.

Timpro is a good quality make and can be gotten on eBay

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/163711136326

Above is a link to it and I have fitted these on 3 conversions I have done and never had any problems or faults

 

[Fisherman]

I have a Peugeot Boxer 435 panel van that I converted and you get 2 models the 335 and 435 the 435 is still 3.5t but has uprated suspension compared to the 335 and factory-build motorhomes are normally on a 335 as it's cheaper for them to buy and I had an Elddis 175 before and I fitted air suspension to it as it takes away 90% sway when being overtaken by larger vehicles but you won't feel the comfort of air suspension in the normal day to day unless the front is also changed but just for the comfort of not having the sway when overtaking or being overtaken its worth the money, the height can only be adjusted about 40mm from normal run height as a motorhome without air suspension is already sitting lower on the rear so it will give you approx 40mm above and 40mm below normal run height.
If you fit air suspension make sure you get an independent system with 2 gauges because if there is only 1 it moves the air from 1 side to the opposite side and it can be dangerous going around bends as such.

Timpro is a good quality make and can be gotten on eBay

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/163711136326

Above is a link to it and I have fitted these on 3 conversions I have done and never had any problems or faultsView attachment 102242View attachment 102243

John many thanks for all your help very much appreciated. The Fiat system does have two gauges, they are positioned on the side of the passenger seat base. Thanks again John.

 

[Old Git Ray]

I was overweight on my 3500kg Ducato based Motorhome (Autotrail Apache). I put 'EUROAIR' air suspension on it and went from 215 to 225 rear tyres. I was then able, with a certificate from SvTech (for £260) to uprate it to 3850kg.
The tyres increased the individual load on each wheel from 1000kg to 1120 kg. Along with the suspension, this increased the permissible load on the rear axle from 2000kg to 2240kg
The conversion was easy, the only difficult part was routing the air cables throught to the cab.
My MH is mow classed as a 'PRIVATE HGV' instead of a 'PLG'. The plus side is that my tax dropped to £160 a year from £260 (ish ?).
I now have 2 VIN/Weight plates on my MH and if I sell it to a person without a C1 licence, I can revert back to 3500kg without any changes.
Of course the conversion can be done without any uprating or paperwork just for the price of the air suspension units.